Re: [NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[T. Kurt Bond]

Oh, so it does.  That doesn't look good.

On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 2:21 PM Rik Kabel 
wrote:

>
> On 12/2/2020 13:59, T. Kurt Bond wrote:
>
> Interesting.
>
> Here is a an example that sort of works, Variant 1:
>
> \definefontfamily[english] [rm] [ebgaramond] [features={default, dlig=no}]
> \setupbodyfont[english,10pt]
> \starttext
>
> Variant 1:
> Does this look like EBGaramond?
>
> fi fl ffi ffl ct st
> \stoptext
>
>
> However, it turns of *all* the ligatures.
>
> Here is an example that works as expected, Variant 2:
>
> \definefontfeature[english][dlig=no]
> \definefontfamily[ebgaramond] [rm] [EB Garamond]
>  [features={default,english}]
> \setupbodyfont[ebgaramond,10pt]
>
> \starttext
>
> Variant 2:
> Does this look like EBGaramond?
>
> fi fl ffi ffl ct st
> \stoptext
>
>
> It turns off just the ct and st ligatures.
>
> I've attached the generated PDF files for both variants.
>
>
> No, it turns off other ligatures as well, so is not a generally workable
> solution. (Try *fj* and *ſi*, for two examples.)
>
> --
> Rik
>
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Re: [NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[Rik Kabel]

On 12/2/2020 13:34, Hans Hagen wrote:

On 12/2/2020 5:54 PM, Joey McCollum wrote:
If you're using Octavio Pardo's version of EB Garamond 
(https://github.com/octaviopardo/EBGaramond12 
), then these ligatures 
are covered (along with the Th ligature) by the "dlig" (discretionary 
ligatures) feature, so you'll need to disable that. Unfortunately, 
this will also disable the Th ligature. This is a known, open issue 
for the font: https://github.com/octaviopardo/EBGaramond12/issues/20 
.

One of these examples where opensource fails ...

https://github.com/octaviopardo/EBGaramond12
https://github.com/georgd/EB-Garamond

A while ago I replaced AB on my machine in oirdert to test some issue 
so now I have to replace it again? Which one is the real one? Which 
one is the original? Which one are we supposed to support / configure?


\definefontfeature[whatever][default][rlig=yes]
% \definefontfeature[whatever][default][rlig=yes,dlig=yes] % those st 
and ct ligs


\definefontfamily [english] [rm] [EB Garamond] [features=whatever]
\definefontfamily [english] [mm] [Stix Two Math]

\setupbodyfont[english]

\starttext
    fi fl ffi ffl ct st
\stoptext

Using the ones pointed from google fonts.

Hans


Hello all,

I am the one who posted issue #20 for the font back in January 2018. The 
report simply states that there is no way to get dlig without also 
getting hlig, and includes an easily reproducible demonstration (using 
LibreOffice on the assumption that it is more accessible for testing). 
Since then, there has been a PR submitted. Crickets. No action.


As to which version of the font should be used, Georg Duffner 
transferred stewardship of the font to Octavio Pardo in 2017 or so. 
Pardo added support for faces beyond roman and italic (bold, semibold, 
extrabold). Some work was done a couple of years ago to support variable 
fonts, but nothing that can be used has yet come out of that effort. To 
a casual observer, the development and maintenance appears to be 
abandoned. I am sure that many would be happy to see work on this font 
resume, but projects like this are difficult to take over and support is 
thin.


So, if you can find that satisfies your requirements as it is, use it. 
The Duffner versions (pre-Pardo) do not have this particular issue, and 
if you do not need emboldened faces or other updates Pardo may have 
implemented, that should work. Or look elsewhere. Although the range and 
licensing of EB Garamond was certainly attractive, there are plenty of 
Garamonds in the world.


--
Rik

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Re: [NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[Rik Kabel]

On 12/2/2020 13:59, T. Kurt Bond wrote:

Interesting.

Here is a an example that sort of works, Variant 1:

\definefontfamily[english] [rm] [ebgaramond] [features={default,
dlig=no}]
\setupbodyfont[english,10pt]
\starttext

Variant 1:
Does this look like EBGaramond?

fi fl ffi ffl ct st
\stoptext


However, it turns of *all* the ligatures.

Here is an example that works as expected, Variant 2:

\definefontfeature[english][dlig=no]
\definefontfamily[ebgaramond] [rm] [EB Garamond]
 [features={default,english}]
\setupbodyfont[ebgaramond,10pt]

\starttext

Variant 2:
Does this look like EBGaramond?

fi fl ffi ffl ct st
\stoptext


It turns off just the ct and st ligatures.

I've attached the generated PDF files for both variants.


No, it turns off other ligatures as well, so is not a generally workable 
solution. (Try *fj* and *ſi*, for two examples.)


--
Rik

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Re: [NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[T. Kurt Bond]

I agree, this solution does seem cleaner to me.  Thanks!

On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 1:23 PM Pablo Rodriguez  wrote:

> On 12/2/20 6:56 PM, T. Kurt Bond wrote:
> > Ah, ok.
> >
> > Here is a minimal NONWORKING example: the resulting PDF shows the ct and
> > st ligatures.  What commands should I use to turn them off?
>
> Hi Kurt,
>
> here you have the sample that should work:
>
>   %~ \definefontfamily[ebgaramond] [rm] [ebgaramond]
>
> %~ [features={default,dlig=no}]
>
>   \definefontfeature[english][dlig=no]
>
>   \definefontfamily[ebgaramond] [rm] [EB Garamond]
>
> [features={default,english}]
>
>   \setupbodyfont[ebgaramond,10pt]
>
>   \starttext
>
>   ct st
>
>   \stoptext
>
> BTW, on my system the default doesn’t get discretionary ligatures.
>
> Your sample didn’t work because the identifier for \definefontfamily
> (english) was different from the one used in \setupbodyfont. (If they
> don’t match, it cannot work.)
>
> Another cleaner approach is to define font features to invoke them in
> \definefontfamily. This method seems cleaner to me.
>
> I hope it helps,
>
> Pablo
> --
> http://www.ousia.tk
>
> ___
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to
> the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl /
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>
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>


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Re: [NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[T. Kurt Bond]

Interesting.

Here is a an example that sort of works, Variant 1:

\definefontfamily[english] [rm] [ebgaramond] [features={default, dlig=no}]
\setupbodyfont[english,10pt]
\starttext

Variant 1:
Does this look like EBGaramond?

fi fl ffi ffl ct st
\stoptext


However, it turns of *all* the ligatures.

Here is an example that works as expected, Variant 2:

\definefontfeature[english][dlig=no]
\definefontfamily[ebgaramond] [rm] [EB Garamond]
 [features={default,english}]
\setupbodyfont[ebgaramond,10pt]

\starttext

Variant 2:
Does this look like EBGaramond?

fi fl ffi ffl ct st
\stoptext


It turns off just the ct and st ligatures.

I've attached the generated PDF files for both variants.


On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 1:23 PM Pablo Rodriguez  wrote:

> On 12/2/20 6:56 PM, T. Kurt Bond wrote:
> > Ah, ok.
> >
> > Here is a minimal NONWORKING example: the resulting PDF shows the ct and
> > st ligatures.  What commands should I use to turn them off?
>
> Hi Kurt,
>
> here you have the sample that should work:
>
>   %~ \definefontfamily[ebgaramond] [rm] [ebgaramond]
>
> %~ [features={default,dlig=no}]
>
>   \definefontfeature[english][dlig=no]
>
>   \definefontfamily[ebgaramond] [rm] [EB Garamond]
>
> [features={default,english}]
>
>   \setupbodyfont[ebgaramond,10pt]
>
>   \starttext
>
>   ct st
>
>   \stoptext
>
> BTW, on my system the default doesn’t get discretionary ligatures.
>
> Your sample didn’t work because the identifier for \definefontfamily
> (english) was different from the one used in \setupbodyfont. (If they
> don’t match, it cannot work.)
>
> Another cleaner approach is to define font features to invoke them in
> \definefontfamily. This method seems cleaner to me.
>
> I hope it helps,
>
> Pablo
> --
> http://www.ousia.tk
>
> ___
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to
> the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl /
> http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
> webpage  : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net
> archive  : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/
> wiki : http://contextgarden.net
>
> ___
>


-- 
T. Kurt Bond, tkurtb...@gmail.com, https://tkurtbond.github.io


ebgaramond-lig.pdf
Description: Adobe PDF document


ebgaramond-lig-variant-2.pdf
Description: Adobe PDF document
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Re: [NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[Hans Hagen]

On 12/2/2020 5:54 PM, Joey McCollum wrote:
If you're using Octavio Pardo's version of EB Garamond 
(https://github.com/octaviopardo/EBGaramond12 
), then these ligatures 
are covered (along with the Th ligature) by the "dlig" (discretionary 
ligatures) feature, so you'll need to disable that. Unfortunately, this 
will also disable the Th ligature. This is a known, open issue for the 
font: https://github.com/octaviopardo/EBGaramond12/issues/20 
.

One of these examples where opensource fails ...

https://github.com/octaviopardo/EBGaramond12
https://github.com/georgd/EB-Garamond

A while ago I replaced AB on my machine in oirdert to test some issue so 
now I have to replace it again? Which one is the real one? Which one is 
the original? Which one are we supposed to support / configure?


\definefontfeature[whatever][default][rlig=yes]
% \definefontfeature[whatever][default][rlig=yes,dlig=yes] % those st 
and ct ligs


\definefontfamily [english] [rm] [EB Garamond]   [features=whatever]
\definefontfamily [english] [mm] [Stix Two Math]

\setupbodyfont[english]

\starttext
fi fl ffi ffl ct st
\stoptext

Using the ones pointed from google fonts.

Hans

-
  Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
  Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
   tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl
-
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Re: [NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[T. Kurt Bond]

That did the trick, thanks!

Should I put that on the wiki?  Where should it go?

On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 1:07 PM Joey McCollum 
wrote:

> You'll need to use the alias for the font family, as follows:
>
> \definefontfamily[english] [rm] [ebgaramond] [features={default, hlig=no}]
>
> \setupbodyfont[english,10pt]
>
> \starttext
>
> ct st
>
> \stoptext
>
> On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 12:56 PM T. Kurt Bond  wrote:
>
>> Ah, ok.
>>
>> Here is a minimal NONWORKING example: the resulting PDF shows the ct and
>> st ligatures.  What commands should I use to turn them off?
>>
>> \definefontfamily[english] [rm] [ebgaramond] [features={default,dlig=no}]
>> \setupbodyfont[ebgaramond,10pt]
>> \starttext
>> ct st
>> \stoptext
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 12:35 PM Hans Hagen  wrote:
>>
>>> On 12/2/2020 6:14 PM, T. Kurt Bond wrote:
>>> > It does help.  Thanks.
>>> >
>>> > But how do I turn that font feature off in ConTeXt?
>>> You forget to add a MWE ...
>>>
>>> Hans
>>>
>>> -
>>>Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
>>>Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
>>> tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl
>>> -
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> T. Kurt Bond, tkurtb...@gmail.com, https://tkurtbond.github.io
>>
>> ___
>> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to
>> the Wiki!
>>
>> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl /
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>>
>> ___
>>
>
> ___
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to
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>


-- 
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Re: [NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[Pablo Rodriguez]

On 12/2/20 6:56 PM, T. Kurt Bond wrote:
> Ah, ok.
>
> Here is a minimal NONWORKING example: the resulting PDF shows the ct and
> st ligatures.  What commands should I use to turn them off?

Hi Kurt,

here you have the sample that should work:

  %~ \definefontfamily[ebgaramond] [rm] [ebgaramond]

%~ [features={default,dlig=no}]

  \definefontfeature[english][dlig=no]

  \definefontfamily[ebgaramond] [rm] [EB Garamond]

[features={default,english}]

  \setupbodyfont[ebgaramond,10pt]

  \starttext

  ct st

  \stoptext

BTW, on my system the default doesn’t get discretionary ligatures.

Your sample didn’t work because the identifier for \definefontfamily
(english) was different from the one used in \setupbodyfont. (If they
don’t match, it cannot work.)

Another cleaner approach is to define font features to invoke them in
\definefontfamily. This method seems cleaner to me.

I hope it helps,

Pablo
--
http://www.ousia.tk
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Re: [NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[Wolfgang Schuster]

T. Kurt Bond schrieb am 02.12.2020 um 18:56:

Ah, ok.

Here is a minimal NONWORKING example: the resulting PDF shows the ct and 
st ligatures.  What commands should I use to turn them off?


\definefontfamily[english] [rm] [ebgaramond] [features={default,dlig=no}]
\setupbodyfont[ebgaramond,10pt]
\starttext
ct st
\stoptext


\definefontfamily [english] [rm] [EB Garamond]
\definefontfamily [english] [mm] [Stix Two Math]

\setupbodyfont[english]

\starttext
fi fl ffi ffl ct st
\stoptext

Wolfgang
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Re: [NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[Joey McCollum]

Sorry, there was a typo. Use this:

\definefontfamily[english] [rm] [ebgaramond] [features={default, dlig=no}]

\setupbodyfont[english,10pt]

\starttext

ct st

\stoptext

On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 1:05 PM Joey McCollum 
wrote:

> You'll need to use the alias for the font family, as follows:
>
> \definefontfamily[english] [rm] [ebgaramond] [features={default, hlig=no}]
>
> \setupbodyfont[english,10pt]
>
> \starttext
>
> ct st
>
> \stoptext
>
> On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 12:56 PM T. Kurt Bond  wrote:
>
>> Ah, ok.
>>
>> Here is a minimal NONWORKING example: the resulting PDF shows the ct and
>> st ligatures.  What commands should I use to turn them off?
>>
>> \definefontfamily[english] [rm] [ebgaramond] [features={default,dlig=no}]
>> \setupbodyfont[ebgaramond,10pt]
>> \starttext
>> ct st
>> \stoptext
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 12:35 PM Hans Hagen  wrote:
>>
>>> On 12/2/2020 6:14 PM, T. Kurt Bond wrote:
>>> > It does help.  Thanks.
>>> >
>>> > But how do I turn that font feature off in ConTeXt?
>>> You forget to add a MWE ...
>>>
>>> Hans
>>>
>>> -
>>>Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
>>>Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
>>> tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl
>>> -
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> T. Kurt Bond, tkurtb...@gmail.com, https://tkurtbond.github.io
>>
>> ___
>> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to
>> the Wiki!
>>
>> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl /
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>>
>> ___
>>
>
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Re: [NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[Joey McCollum]

You'll need to use the alias for the font family, as follows:

\definefontfamily[english] [rm] [ebgaramond] [features={default, hlig=no}]

\setupbodyfont[english,10pt]

\starttext

ct st

\stoptext

On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 12:56 PM T. Kurt Bond  wrote:

> Ah, ok.
>
> Here is a minimal NONWORKING example: the resulting PDF shows the ct and
> st ligatures.  What commands should I use to turn them off?
>
> \definefontfamily[english] [rm] [ebgaramond] [features={default,dlig=no}]
> \setupbodyfont[ebgaramond,10pt]
> \starttext
> ct st
> \stoptext
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 12:35 PM Hans Hagen  wrote:
>
>> On 12/2/2020 6:14 PM, T. Kurt Bond wrote:
>> > It does help.  Thanks.
>> >
>> > But how do I turn that font feature off in ConTeXt?
>> You forget to add a MWE ...
>>
>> Hans
>>
>> -
>>Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
>>Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
>> tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl
>> -
>>
>
>
> --
> T. Kurt Bond, tkurtb...@gmail.com, https://tkurtbond.github.io
>
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Re: [NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[T. Kurt Bond]

Ah, ok.

Here is a minimal NONWORKING example: the resulting PDF shows the ct and st
ligatures.  What commands should I use to turn them off?

\definefontfamily[english] [rm] [ebgaramond] [features={default,dlig=no}]
\setupbodyfont[ebgaramond,10pt]
\starttext
ct st
\stoptext


On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 12:35 PM Hans Hagen  wrote:

> On 12/2/2020 6:14 PM, T. Kurt Bond wrote:
> > It does help.  Thanks.
> >
> > But how do I turn that font feature off in ConTeXt?
> You forget to add a MWE ...
>
> Hans
>
> -
>Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
>Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
> tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl
> -
>


-- 
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Re: [NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[Hans Hagen]

On 12/2/2020 6:14 PM, T. Kurt Bond wrote:

It does help.  Thanks.

But how do I turn that font feature off in ConTeXt?

You forget to add a MWE ...

Hans

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Re: [NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[Joey McCollum]

The wiki page on featuresets (https://wiki.contextgarden.net/Featuresets)
offers a more comprehensive treatment.

On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 12:29 PM Joey McCollum 
wrote:

> I think it would look something like
>
> \definefontfamily[english] [rm] [EB Garamond] [features={default,dlig=no}]
>
> On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 12:14 PM T. Kurt Bond  wrote:
>
>> It does help.  Thanks.
>>
>> But how do I turn that font feature off in ConTeXt?
>>
>> On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 11:55 AM Joey McCollum <
>> jmccollum20140...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> If you're using Octavio Pardo's version of EB Garamond (
>>> https://github.com/octaviopardo/EBGaramond12), then these ligatures are
>>> covered (along with the Th ligature) by the "dlig" (discretionary
>>> ligatures) feature, so you'll need to disable that. Unfortunately, this
>>> will also disable the Th ligature. This is a known, open issue for the
>>> font: https://github.com/octaviopardo/EBGaramond12/issues/20.
>>>
>>> I hope this helps.
>>>
>>> On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 11:41 AM T. Kurt Bond 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Searches didn't reveal the answer.

 --
 T. Kurt Bond, tkurtb...@gmail.com, https://tkurtbond.github.io

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>>> ___
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>>
>>
>> --
>> T. Kurt Bond, tkurtb...@gmail.com, https://tkurtbond.github.io
>>
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Re: [NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[Joey McCollum]

I think it would look something like

\definefontfamily[english] [rm] [EB Garamond] [features={default,dlig=no}]

On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 12:14 PM T. Kurt Bond  wrote:

> It does help.  Thanks.
>
> But how do I turn that font feature off in ConTeXt?
>
> On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 11:55 AM Joey McCollum 
> wrote:
>
>> If you're using Octavio Pardo's version of EB Garamond (
>> https://github.com/octaviopardo/EBGaramond12), then these ligatures are
>> covered (along with the Th ligature) by the "dlig" (discretionary
>> ligatures) feature, so you'll need to disable that. Unfortunately, this
>> will also disable the Th ligature. This is a known, open issue for the
>> font: https://github.com/octaviopardo/EBGaramond12/issues/20.
>>
>> I hope this helps.
>>
>> On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 11:41 AM T. Kurt Bond  wrote:
>>
>>> Searches didn't reveal the answer.
>>>
>>> --
>>> T. Kurt Bond, tkurtb...@gmail.com, https://tkurtbond.github.io
>>>
>>> ___
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>>> to the Wiki!
>>>
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>>> wiki : http://contextgarden.net
>>>
>>> ___
>>>
>>
>> ___
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>> the Wiki!
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>> ___
>>
>
>
> --
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>
> ___
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> the Wiki!
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Re: [NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[T. Kurt Bond]

It does help.  Thanks.

But how do I turn that font feature off in ConTeXt?

On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 11:55 AM Joey McCollum 
wrote:

> If you're using Octavio Pardo's version of EB Garamond (
> https://github.com/octaviopardo/EBGaramond12), then these ligatures are
> covered (along with the Th ligature) by the "dlig" (discretionary
> ligatures) feature, so you'll need to disable that. Unfortunately, this
> will also disable the Th ligature. This is a known, open issue for the
> font: https://github.com/octaviopardo/EBGaramond12/issues/20.
>
> I hope this helps.
>
> On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 11:41 AM T. Kurt Bond  wrote:
>
>> Searches didn't reveal the answer.
>>
>> --
>> T. Kurt Bond, tkurtb...@gmail.com, https://tkurtbond.github.io
>>
>> ___
>> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to
>> the Wiki!
>>
>> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl /
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>>
>> ___
>>
>
> ___
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>
> ___
>


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Re: [NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[Joey McCollum]

If you're using Octavio Pardo's version of EB Garamond (
https://github.com/octaviopardo/EBGaramond12), then these ligatures are
covered (along with the Th ligature) by the "dlig" (discretionary
ligatures) feature, so you'll need to disable that. Unfortunately, this
will also disable the Th ligature. This is a known, open issue for the
font: https://github.com/octaviopardo/EBGaramond12/issues/20.

I hope this helps.

On Wed, Dec 2, 2020 at 11:41 AM T. Kurt Bond  wrote:

> Searches didn't reveal the answer.
>
> --
> T. Kurt Bond, tkurtb...@gmail.com, https://tkurtbond.github.io
>
> ___
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> the Wiki!
>
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>
> ___
>
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[NTG-context] How do I get rid of the ct and st ligatures in EBGaramond?

[T. Kurt Bond]

Searches didn't reveal the answer.

-- 
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