Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
Am 24.04.2012 14:42, schrieb Hans Hagen: On 20-4-2012 09:50, Peter Rolf wrote: Am 19.04.2012 20:25, schrieb Hans Hagen: On 18-4-2012 13:12, Peter Rolf wrote: I understand that there is no easy or general solution for this. But on the other hand is PNG currently the only way to use transparent bitmaps in TeX. The usage of transparent PNG is quite common, so this is a general problem that should be solved. I like your idea of automatically adding such groups, if the user declares the color space beforehand. Also no answer for the spot color problem, but as long as the user does not limit the used color spaces, things can stay as they are. Just my 2 cents. so first wen need to test with mixed color space documents and such hacks to see what happens (as we don't want invalid documents) ok. i don't expect any formal problems, only more or less ugly color shifts. anyhow, we will see. needs some thinking about proper examples (colored text, vector and pixel based graphics in RGB,CMYK,Spot)... i think 'draw ColorCircle(..)' is a perfect candidate for the complete graphic part. one page with transparency and also one page without any transparency (the page group shouldn't kick in). later on we can add some icc profiles to spice things up. i'll start to make a test document on the weekend then. if i have missed something important, let me know. any additional ideas are also welcome :-) as a prelude, the next beta will have \setupcolors[pagecolormodel=rgb] % gray rgb cmyk auto none and issue a warning when no model is set when using transparencies tested with latest beta (26.04.2012) and no problems so far. an adapted version of the test files can be found at https://www.wuala.com/indiego/public/?key=caiCGLasLFmJ Peter ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On Sat, 2012-04-28 at 17:52 +0200, Peter Rolf wrote: tested with latest beta (26.04.2012) and no problems so far. Well done Peter. -- Kip Warner -- Software Engineer OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred http://www.thevertigo.com signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
Am 24.04.2012 15:37, schrieb Peter Rolf: Am 24.04.2012 14:42, schrieb Hans Hagen: On 20-4-2012 09:50, Peter Rolf wrote: Am 19.04.2012 20:25, schrieb Hans Hagen: On 18-4-2012 13:12, Peter Rolf wrote: I understand that there is no easy or general solution for this. But on the other hand is PNG currently the only way to use transparent bitmaps in TeX. The usage of transparent PNG is quite common, so this is a general problem that should be solved. I like your idea of automatically adding such groups, if the user declares the color space beforehand. Also no answer for the spot color problem, but as long as the user does not limit the used color spaces, things can stay as they are. Just my 2 cents. so first wen need to test with mixed color space documents and such hacks to see what happens (as we don't want invalid documents) ok. i don't expect any formal problems, only more or less ugly color shifts. anyhow, we will see. needs some thinking about proper examples (colored text, vector and pixel based graphics in RGB,CMYK,Spot)... i think 'draw ColorCircle(..)' is a perfect candidate for the complete graphic part. one page with transparency and also one page without any transparency (the page group shouldn't kick in). later on we can add some icc profiles to spice things up. i'll start to make a test document on the weekend then. if i have missed something important, let me know. any additional ideas are also welcome :-) as a prelude, the next beta will have \setupcolors[pagecolormodel=rgb] % gray rgb cmyk auto none and issue a warning when no model is set when using transparencies nice. a test document with mixed color spaces is also in work and should be ready in a few days. a first version of the test files can be found here (7z, LZMA2 compression) https://www.wuala.com/indiego/public/?key=caiCGLasLFmJ i have tested four versions so far. 1. cmyk (default) page group 2. rgb page group 3. cmyk page group + pdf/x 4. rgb page group + pdf/x no general problems so far (only spot color related) Peter ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On 20-4-2012 09:50, Peter Rolf wrote: Am 19.04.2012 20:25, schrieb Hans Hagen: On 18-4-2012 13:12, Peter Rolf wrote: I understand that there is no easy or general solution for this. But on the other hand is PNG currently the only way to use transparent bitmaps in TeX. The usage of transparent PNG is quite common, so this is a general problem that should be solved. I like your idea of automatically adding such groups, if the user declares the color space beforehand. Also no answer for the spot color problem, but as long as the user does not limit the used color spaces, things can stay as they are. Just my 2 cents. so first wen need to test with mixed color space documents and such hacks to see what happens (as we don't want invalid documents) ok. i don't expect any formal problems, only more or less ugly color shifts. anyhow, we will see. needs some thinking about proper examples (colored text, vector and pixel based graphics in RGB,CMYK,Spot)... i think 'draw ColorCircle(..)' is a perfect candidate for the complete graphic part. one page with transparency and also one page without any transparency (the page group shouldn't kick in). later on we can add some icc profiles to spice things up. i'll start to make a test document on the weekend then. if i have missed something important, let me know. any additional ideas are also welcome :-) as a prelude, the next beta will have \setupcolors[pagecolormodel=rgb] % gray rgb cmyk auto none and issue a warning when no model is set when using transparencies Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | voip: 087 875 68 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
Am 24.04.2012 14:42, schrieb Hans Hagen: On 20-4-2012 09:50, Peter Rolf wrote: Am 19.04.2012 20:25, schrieb Hans Hagen: On 18-4-2012 13:12, Peter Rolf wrote: I understand that there is no easy or general solution for this. But on the other hand is PNG currently the only way to use transparent bitmaps in TeX. The usage of transparent PNG is quite common, so this is a general problem that should be solved. I like your idea of automatically adding such groups, if the user declares the color space beforehand. Also no answer for the spot color problem, but as long as the user does not limit the used color spaces, things can stay as they are. Just my 2 cents. so first wen need to test with mixed color space documents and such hacks to see what happens (as we don't want invalid documents) ok. i don't expect any formal problems, only more or less ugly color shifts. anyhow, we will see. needs some thinking about proper examples (colored text, vector and pixel based graphics in RGB,CMYK,Spot)... i think 'draw ColorCircle(..)' is a perfect candidate for the complete graphic part. one page with transparency and also one page without any transparency (the page group shouldn't kick in). later on we can add some icc profiles to spice things up. i'll start to make a test document on the weekend then. if i have missed something important, let me know. any additional ideas are also welcome :-) as a prelude, the next beta will have \setupcolors[pagecolormodel=rgb] % gray rgb cmyk auto none and issue a warning when no model is set when using transparencies nice. a test document with mixed color spaces is also in work and should be ready in a few days. Peter ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On Tue, 2012-04-24 at 14:42 +0200, Hans Hagen wrote:
as a prelude, the next beta will have
\setupcolors[pagecolormodel=rgb] % gray rgb cmyk auto none
and issue a warning when no model is set when using transparencies
Thanks Hans. I'll add that to my environment. When using the
aforementioned beta, I take it I can remove the inline lua?
\startluacode
backends= backendsor { }
backends.codeinjections = backends.codeinjections or { }
function backends.codeinjections.rgbtransparencygroup()
local d = lpdf.dictionary {
S = lpdf.constant(Transparency),
CS = lpdf.constant(DeviceRGB),
I = true }
lpdf.registerpagefinalizer(function()
lpdf.addtopageattributes(Group,d) end)
end
backends.codeinjections.rgbtransparencygroup()
\stopluacode
--
Kip Warner -- Software Engineer
OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred
http://www.thevertigo.com
signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part
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Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
Am 19.04.2012 20:25, schrieb Hans Hagen: On 18-4-2012 13:12, Peter Rolf wrote: I understand that there is no easy or general solution for this. But on the other hand is PNG currently the only way to use transparent bitmaps in TeX. The usage of transparent PNG is quite common, so this is a general problem that should be solved. I like your idea of automatically adding such groups, if the user declares the color space beforehand. Also no answer for the spot color problem, but as long as the user does not limit the used color spaces, things can stay as they are. Just my 2 cents. so first wen need to test with mixed color space documents and such hacks to see what happens (as we don't want invalid documents) ok. i don't expect any formal problems, only more or less ugly color shifts. anyhow, we will see. needs some thinking about proper examples (colored text, vector and pixel based graphics in RGB,CMYK,Spot)... i think 'draw ColorCircle(..)' is a perfect candidate for the complete graphic part. one page with transparency and also one page without any transparency (the page group shouldn't kick in). later on we can add some icc profiles to spice things up. i'll start to make a test document on the weekend then. if i have missed something important, let me know. any additional ideas are also welcome :-) Peter ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On 18-4-2012 13:12, Peter Rolf wrote: I understand that there is no easy or general solution for this. But on the other hand is PNG currently the only way to use transparent bitmaps in TeX. The usage of transparent PNG is quite common, so this is a general problem that should be solved. I like your idea of automatically adding such groups, if the user declares the color space beforehand. Also no answer for the spot color problem, but as long as the user does not limit the used color spaces, things can stay as they are. Just my 2 cents. so first wen need to test with mixed color space documents and such hacks to see what happens (as we don't want invalid documents) Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | voip: 087 875 68 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On 18-4-2012 12:58, Martin Schröder wrote: 2012/4/18 luigi scarsoluigi.sca...@gmail.com: On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 8:47 AM, Martin Schrödermar...@oneiros.de wrote: Adobe Reader needs a special object in the page for it to handle included pdfs or pngs with transparency correctly on the first page (search for pdftex and page groups.) AdobeReader or the specification(s) ? It's known that Adobe needs it. It's not really in the specs as per ISO3200:2008. Maybe the next version will be clearer there. My impression with such features is that they relate to pdf as container format for e.g. illustrator where such info about grouping is important, but I might be wrong. - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | voip: 087 875 68 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
2012/4/18 Kip Warner k...@thevertigo.com: I stuck it in my environment file. I wonder if there is a safer way of doing this than via inline asm, so to speak. Also, maybe for my benefit, and anybody else having the same problem, you might be able to explain what was happening? Adobe Reader needs a special object in the page for it to handle included pdfs or pngs with transparency correctly on the first page (search for pdftex and page groups.) pdfTeX tries to fix this automagically for years (1.40.6, I think) by synthesizing this object, but Hans rejects any automagic solution for LuaTeX (since it may conflict with mechanisms of ConTeXt) and ConTeXt instead tries to do the right thing. Here it obviously fails. Best Martin ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 8:47 AM, Martin Schröder mar...@oneiros.de wrote: 2012/4/18 Kip Warner k...@thevertigo.com: I stuck it in my environment file. I wonder if there is a safer way of doing this than via inline asm, so to speak. Also, maybe for my benefit, and anybody else having the same problem, you might be able to explain what was happening? Adobe Reader needs a special object in the page for it to handle included pdfs or pngs with transparency correctly on the first page (search for pdftex and page groups.) AdobeReader or the specification(s) ? -- luigi ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On 18-4-2012 02:49, Kip Warner wrote:
On Tue, 2012-04-17 at 12:48 +0200, Peter Rolf wrote:
Hi Kip,
give it a try and add this to you document...
\startluacode
backends= backendsor { }
backends.codeinjections = backends.codeinjections or { }
function backends.codeinjections.rgbtransparencygroup()
local d = lpdf.dictionary {
S = lpdf.constant(Transparency),
CS = lpdf.constant(DeviceRGB),
I = true }
lpdf.registerpagefinalizer(function()
lpdf.addtopageattributes(Group,d) end)
end
backends.codeinjections.rgbtransparencygroup()
\stopluacode
This does not work, if you also use CMYK based graphics/pictures in your
document (as this is done document wide).
You know Peter, I must admit. ConTeXt has made me rather cynical at
times. I don't know how many times I've tried a snippet of this or that,
only to have it do exactly what I hadn't intended. Having said that,
every now and then I am blown away when something I never expected to
actually get working, gets working. Thank you so much, that worked
beautifully. Both Evince (poppler based) and AR look identical now.
I stuck it in my environment file. I wonder if there is a safer way of
doing this than via inline asm, so to speak. Also, maybe for my
benefit, and anybody else having the same problem, you might be able to
explain what was happening?
At some point it can become an option (or semi automatic) but the
problem is that we don't know in advance if we operate in rgb or cmyk. I
can imagine that when we have enabled cmyk and disabled rgb or reverse,
it can be added automatically but even then users must make sure that
all images are in the right colorspace as well. And what with spotcolors?
Hans
-
Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
tel: 038 477 53 69 | voip: 087 875 68 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
| www.pragma-pod.nl
-
___
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maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
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Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
2012/4/18 luigi scarso luigi.sca...@gmail.com: On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 8:47 AM, Martin Schröder mar...@oneiros.de wrote: Adobe Reader needs a special object in the page for it to handle included pdfs or pngs with transparency correctly on the first page (search for pdftex and page groups.) AdobeReader or the specification(s) ? It's known that Adobe needs it. It's not really in the specs as per ISO3200:2008. Maybe the next version will be clearer there. Best Martin ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
Am 18.04.2012 09:38, schrieb Hans Hagen:
On 18-4-2012 02:49, Kip Warner wrote:
On Tue, 2012-04-17 at 12:48 +0200, Peter Rolf wrote:
Hi Kip,
give it a try and add this to you document...
\startluacode
backends= backendsor { }
backends.codeinjections = backends.codeinjections or { }
function backends.codeinjections.rgbtransparencygroup()
local d = lpdf.dictionary {
S = lpdf.constant(Transparency),
CS = lpdf.constant(DeviceRGB),
I = true }
lpdf.registerpagefinalizer(function()
lpdf.addtopageattributes(Group,d) end)
end
backends.codeinjections.rgbtransparencygroup()
\stopluacode
This does not work, if you also use CMYK based graphics/pictures in your
document (as this is done document wide).
You know Peter, I must admit. ConTeXt has made me rather cynical at
times. I don't know how many times I've tried a snippet of this or that,
only to have it do exactly what I hadn't intended. Having said that,
every now and then I am blown away when something I never expected to
actually get working, gets working. Thank you so much, that worked
beautifully. Both Evince (poppler based) and AR look identical now.
I stuck it in my environment file. I wonder if there is a safer way of
doing this than via inline asm, so to speak. Also, maybe for my
benefit, and anybody else having the same problem, you might be able to
explain what was happening?
At some point it can become an option (or semi automatic) but the
problem is that we don't know in advance if we operate in rgb or cmyk. I
can imagine that when we have enabled cmyk and disabled rgb or reverse,
it can be added automatically but even then users must make sure that
all images are in the right colorspace as well. And what with spotcolors?
Hans
I understand that there is no easy or general solution for this.
But on the other hand is PNG currently the only way to use transparent
bitmaps in TeX. The usage of transparent PNG is quite common, so this is
a general problem that should be solved.
I like your idea of automatically adding such groups, if the user
declares the color space beforehand. Also no answer for the spot color
problem, but as long as the user does not limit the used color spaces,
things can stay as they are. Just my 2 cents.
Peter
___
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the
Wiki!
maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net
archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/
wiki : http://contextgarden.net
___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On Wed, 2012-04-18 at 08:47 +0200, Martin Schröder wrote: Adobe Reader needs a special object in the page for it to handle included pdfs or pngs with transparency correctly on the first page (search for pdftex and page groups.) pdfTeX tries to fix this automagically for years (1.40.6, I think) by synthesizing this object, but Hans rejects any automagic solution for LuaTeX (since it may conflict with mechanisms of ConTeXt) and ConTeXt instead tries to do the right thing. Here it obviously fails. Thanks Martin. -- Kip Warner -- Software Engineer OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred http://www.thevertigo.com signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On Wed, 2012-04-18 at 09:38 +0200, Hans Hagen wrote: At some point it can become an option (or semi automatic) but the problem is that we don't know in advance if we operate in rgb or cmyk. I can imagine that when we have enabled cmyk and disabled rgb or reverse, it can be added automatically but even then users must make sure that all images are in the right colorspace as well. And what with spotcolors? Thanks Hans. -- Kip Warner -- Software Engineer OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred http://www.thevertigo.com signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On 17-4-2012 01:44, Kip Warner wrote: On Sun, 2012-04-15 at 18:00 +0200, Hans Hagen wrote: keep in mind that acrobat has monitor profiles, simulates paper and has different rendering code when transparencies are used I've crawled all over Adobe's proprietary Reader's settings and I can't find anything for adjusting monitor profiles. This is very disappointing because many of the readers of my book will probably be using that shitty renderer. (AR might have flaws but so do all other viewers I've seen.) Is there a small example file? Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | voip: 087 875 68 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On Tue, 2012-04-17 at 08:54 +0200, Hans Hagen wrote: (AR might have flaws but so do all other viewers I've seen.) I don't doubt it, but something that salient is pretty bad though. The whole document looks just awful. Is there a small example file? Sure. https://www.avaneya.com/temp/Viking_Lander_Remastered.pdf -- Kip Warner -- Software Engineer OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred http://www.thevertigo.com signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On Tue, 17 Apr 2012 08:54:03 +0200 Hans Hagen pra...@wxs.nl wrote: (AR might have flaws but so do all other viewers I've seen.) With one MAJOR difference: for Acrobat reader, one is dependent on the whims and desires of Adobe (and its paying market); the other pdf viewers are open source. Alan ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On Tue, Apr 17, 2012 at 9:12 AM, Alan BRASLAU alan.bras...@cea.fr wrote: On Tue, 17 Apr 2012 08:54:03 +0200 Hans Hagen pra...@wxs.nl wrote: (AR might have flaws but so do all other viewers I've seen.) With one MAJOR difference: for Acrobat reader, one is dependent on the whims and desires of Adobe (and its paying market); the other pdf viewers are open source. AdobeReader *is* the reference pdf-viewer. Every pdf for general use should be checked at least with the latest AdobeReader under windows, which is currently one of the best pdf viewer. For the (pdf/lua)TeX community, all the viewer based on xpdf/poppler are also important, because (pdf/lua)TeX have a consistent part of code from them, so a bug in xpdf/poppler can be also a bug in (pdf/lua)Tex. Other viewers are useful (mupdf which is now 1.0rc1 , sumatra pdf for windows, just to list a fews) but not as the previous ones. -- luigi ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On 17-4-2012 09:31, luigi scarso wrote: On Tue, Apr 17, 2012 at 9:12 AM, Alan BRASLAUalan.bras...@cea.fr wrote: On Tue, 17 Apr 2012 08:54:03 +0200 Hans Hagenpra...@wxs.nl wrote: (AR might have flaws but so do all other viewers I've seen.) With one MAJOR difference: for Acrobat reader, one is dependent on the whims and desires of Adobe (and its paying market); the other pdf viewers are open source. AdobeReader *is* the reference pdf-viewer. Every pdf for general use should be checked at least with the latest AdobeReader under windows, which is currently one of the best pdf viewer. For the (pdf/lua)TeX community, all the viewer based on xpdf/poppler are also important, because (pdf/lua)TeX have a consistent part of code from them, so a bug in xpdf/poppler can be also a bug in (pdf/lua)Tex. Other viewers are useful (mupdf which is now 1.0rc1 , sumatra pdf for windows, just to list a fews) but not as the previous ones. I use acrobat (prof) as reference viewer from the editor and okular (kde windows version) on a second screen as handy constantly open one; I tried a few more but stuck to these two. Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | voip: 087 875 68 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On Tue, Apr 17, 2012 at 9:42 AM, Hans Hagen pra...@wxs.nl wrote: I use acrobat (prof) as reference viewer from the editor and okular (kde windows version) on a second screen as handy constantly open one; I tried a few more but stuck to these two. For MFLua I need to show 2 pages with thousand of MP points and look on how the curves of the glyph join together. With ctrl-r and magnification of 6400% AdobeReader is the only one that is able to show the pdf without need to take an italian coffe at every refresh. When I need to typeset blackwhite or not-critical-colors document, emacs+xpdf+ two_rows_of_workspace_in_gnome is ok --- no need another monitor: the bottom row has the editor, the top rows has the viewer. Maybe a wide 16:9 screen and the latest Emacs (which can render a pdf into a buffer) are also ok: just split an emacs windows vertically in two, left side is the editor, right side the viewer. I use the shell buffer, so another split is needed. Moving between buffers is not agile but the advantage is to minimize the use of the mouse. Anyway with a laptop it's not a problem to have another monitor, and I use this configuration if I'm under Windows,especially with the sumatra pdf or the ReaderX. For all the rest (critical colors, interactive features, flash into pdf..) the latest AcrobatProfessional is a must. -- luigi ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
Am 17.04.2012 08:57, schrieb Kip Warner: On Tue, 2012-04-17 at 08:54 +0200, Hans Hagen wrote: (AR might have flaws but so do all other viewers I've seen.) I don't doubt it, but something that salient is pretty bad though. The whole document looks just awful. Is there a small example file? Sure. https://www.avaneya.com/temp/Viking_Lander_Remastered.pdf I might be wrong, but is this color shift not just a 'page group' problem, caused by the transparent PNG? Peter ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On 17-4-2012 11:53, Peter Rolf wrote: Am 17.04.2012 08:57, schrieb Kip Warner: On Tue, 2012-04-17 at 08:54 +0200, Hans Hagen wrote: (AR might have flaws but so do all other viewers I've seen.) I don't doubt it, but something that salient is pretty bad though. The whole document looks just awful. Is there a small example file? Sure.https://www.avaneya.com/temp/Viking_Lander_Remastered.pdf I might be wrong, but is this color shift not just a 'page group' problem, caused by the transparent PNG? I think so. Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | voip: 087 875 68 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
Am 17.04.2012 12:12, schrieb Hans Hagen:
On 17-4-2012 11:53, Peter Rolf wrote:
Am 17.04.2012 08:57, schrieb Kip Warner:
On Tue, 2012-04-17 at 08:54 +0200, Hans Hagen wrote:
(AR might have flaws but so do all other viewers I've seen.)
I don't doubt it, but something that salient is pretty bad though. The
whole document looks just awful.
Is there a small example file?
Sure.https://www.avaneya.com/temp/Viking_Lander_Remastered.pdf
I might be wrong, but is this color shift not just a 'page group'
problem, caused by the transparent PNG?
I think so.
Hans
Hi Kip,
give it a try and add this to you document...
\startluacode
backends= backendsor { }
backends.codeinjections = backends.codeinjections or { }
function backends.codeinjections.rgbtransparencygroup()
local d = lpdf.dictionary {
S = lpdf.constant(Transparency),
CS = lpdf.constant(DeviceRGB),
I = true }
lpdf.registerpagefinalizer(function()
lpdf.addtopageattributes(Group,d) end)
end
backends.codeinjections.rgbtransparencygroup()
\stopluacode
This does not work, if you also use CMYK based graphics/pictures in your
document (as this is done document wide).
Peter
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Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On Tue, 2012-04-17 at 09:12 +0200, Alan BRASLAU wrote: With one MAJOR difference: for Acrobat reader, one is dependent on the whims and desires of Adobe (and its paying market); the other pdf viewers are open source. Exactly. -- Kip Warner -- Software Engineer OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred http://www.thevertigo.com signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On Tue, 2012-04-17 at 10:54 +0200, Henning Hraban Ramm wrote: Hi Kip, the attached screenshot is from Acrobat Pro 10.1.3 on OSX 10.7. Looks good to me. I guess your color management setup is wrong. Greetlings, Hraban Hey Hrabab. Your looks much better than AR's, but it still doesn't look the same as on my end. It looks much brighter. I wonder if there is some additional information renderer's need, such as a value for gamma correction or a colour profile that I need to stuff in my environment file to make it work? -- Kip Warner -- Software Engineer OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred http://www.thevertigo.com signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On Tue, 2012-04-17 at 09:31 +0200, luigi scarso wrote: Every pdf for general use should be checked at least with the latest AdobeReader under windows, which is currently one of the best pdf viewer. I think a better approach would be to consider Adobe's PDF specification as reference material, but not implementations of it that we cannot audit that may or may not have done so correctly. -- Kip Warner -- Software Engineer OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred http://www.thevertigo.com signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On Tue, 2012-04-17 at 11:53 +0200, Peter Rolf wrote: I might be wrong, but is this color shift not just a 'page group' problem, caused by the transparent PNG? I don't know, but even the image on the upper right aside, the rest of the page's colours are off as well. -- Kip Warner -- Software Engineer OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred http://www.thevertigo.com signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On Tue, 2012-04-17 at 12:48 +0200, Peter Rolf wrote:
Hi Kip,
give it a try and add this to you document...
\startluacode
backends= backendsor { }
backends.codeinjections = backends.codeinjections or { }
function backends.codeinjections.rgbtransparencygroup()
local d = lpdf.dictionary {
S = lpdf.constant(Transparency),
CS = lpdf.constant(DeviceRGB),
I = true }
lpdf.registerpagefinalizer(function()
lpdf.addtopageattributes(Group,d) end)
end
backends.codeinjections.rgbtransparencygroup()
\stopluacode
This does not work, if you also use CMYK based graphics/pictures in your
document (as this is done document wide).
You know Peter, I must admit. ConTeXt has made me rather cynical at
times. I don't know how many times I've tried a snippet of this or that,
only to have it do exactly what I hadn't intended. Having said that,
every now and then I am blown away when something I never expected to
actually get working, gets working. Thank you so much, that worked
beautifully. Both Evince (poppler based) and AR look identical now.
I stuck it in my environment file. I wonder if there is a safer way of
doing this than via inline asm, so to speak. Also, maybe for my
benefit, and anybody else having the same problem, you might be able to
explain what was happening?
--
Kip Warner -- Software Engineer
OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred
http://www.thevertigo.com
signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part
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Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On Sun, 2012-04-15 at 11:07 +0200, Mojca Miklavec wrote: Bug in AR. =( Convince Adobe to fix it or find a way to render that page without prerequisites for the bug to show up. That's probably not going to happen any time soon, I would think. I'm not sure about your particular case, but I have seen the problem multiple times, most often when combined with transparency on the same page. Damn. I sent a bug report to Adobe, but I doubt they'll do anything. -- Kip Warner -- Software Engineer OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred http://www.thevertigo.com signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On Sun, 2012-04-15 at 18:00 +0200, Hans Hagen wrote: keep in mind that acrobat has monitor profiles, simulates paper and has different rendering code when transparencies are used I've crawled all over Adobe's proprietary Reader's settings and I can't find anything for adjusting monitor profiles. This is very disappointing because many of the readers of my book will probably be using that shitty renderer. -- Kip Warner -- Software Engineer OpenPGP encrypted/signed mail preferred http://www.thevertigo.com signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On Sun, Apr 15, 2012 at 08:00, Kip Warner wrote: Hey list, I've noticed an unfortunate visual difference in my document's colours when rendered with Evince 2.32.0 where they come out as expected (or even with Zathura) against Adobe Reader 9.5.7. Rendered with Evince 2.32.0: https://www.avaneya.com/temp/evince.png Rendered with Adobe Reader 9.5.7: https://www.avaneya.com/temp/reader.png Note how the latter is overly saturated in the red. Does anyone have any clues as to why this might happen Bug in AR. and what I might do to make it appear as intended in Adobe Reader? Convince Adobe to fix it or find a way to render that page without prerequisites for the bug to show up. I'm not sure about your particular case, but I have seen the problem multiple times, most often when combined with transparency on the same page. Mojca ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] Rendering differences between PDF viewers
On 15-4-2012 08:00, Kip Warner wrote: Hey list, I've noticed an unfortunate visual difference in my document's colours when rendered with Evince 2.32.0 where they come out as expected (or even with Zathura) against Adobe Reader 9.5.7. Rendered with Evince 2.32.0: https://www.avaneya.com/temp/evince.png Rendered with Adobe Reader 9.5.7: https://www.avaneya.com/temp/reader.png Note how the latter is overly saturated in the red. Does anyone have any clues as to why this might happen and what I might do to make it appear as intended in Adobe Reader? I wonder if this might have something to do with different renderer's different gamma correction? It's kind of funny that this could happen because I thought the whole point of PDFs was that they were truly portable. keep in mind that acrobat has monitor profiles, simulates paper and has different rendering code when transparencies are used Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | voip: 087 875 68 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
