Re: [Numpy-discussion] Helping with website improvements

[Dashamir Hoxha]

On Wed, Jul 17, 2019 at 11:45 PM Ralf Gommers 
wrote:

>
> That sounds good to me. I believe SymPy is also pretty happy with their
> interactive terminal embedded in their website.
>
> Could you create a new issue on https://github.com/numpy/numpy.org/issues?
> It would be good to start keeping track of website improvement ideas -
> ideas in mailing list threads tend to get lost eventually.
>

I have created it: https://github.com/numpy/numpy.org/issues/26

As a side note, I think that it would be nice if documentation issues are
kept on this repo as well (or on their on repo), instead of discussing them
on numpy/numpy. This would clearly distinguish them from the rest of the
issues (bugs, features, enhancements, etc.).
For example I am interested on the website and documentation issues, but I
have to subscribe (watch) to numpy/numpy. As a result I get more than 100
notification messages a day, 90% of which I have to delete because I am not
interested in them (actually I don't understand what is being discussed
there). This is like a kind of innocent spam. A better classification of
issues to different repositories may help to reduce this.
Maybe the same should be done for scipy too.

I have created another issue for discussing this:
https://github.com/numpy/numpy.org/issues/27

Regards,
Dashamir
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Re: [Numpy-discussion] Helping with website improvements

[Ralf Gommers]

On Wed, Jul 17, 2019 at 7:29 AM Dashamir Hoxha  wrote:

>
>
> On Wed, Jul 17, 2019 at 6:11 AM Ralf Gommers 
> wrote:
>
>>
>>> Has anybody tried Katacoda before:
>>> https://www.katacoda.com/courses/python/playground ?
>>>
>>
>> I haven't heard of it before. Looks cool. Seems to run on Docker, so
>> would require some infrastructure. If it's something we could get from a
>> static site, then it may be worth considering. Could you summarize what it
>> would require?
>>
>
> The infrastructure is supplied by Katacoda, we don't need to run or
> maintain any server (although I don't think this would be a big problem).
> And it is free. The only limitation is that the duration of the training
> session for a student is 1 hour (and then he can reload the browser and
> start a fresh session). If enterprises or training companies would like to
> lift this limitation, they have to contact them.
>
> Building an interactive tutorial is very easy and everybody can learn it
> in a short time. The code of the tutorial is just a bunch of json and
> markdown files (for the configuration of the environment and for the steps
> of the tutorial). It can be saved on your preferred git repository (GitHub,
> GitLab, Bitbacket, etc.) and katacoda pulls it from there and builds the
> tutorial environment (docker image). Here is a minimal (hello world)
> example:
> https://github.com/dashohoxha/katacoda-scenarios/tree/master/hello-world You
> also need to set a webhook on the repository, so that whenever you make
> some changes (commits) katacoda is notified to refresh the content of the
> tutorial.
>

That sounds good to me. I believe SymPy is also pretty happy with their
interactive terminal embedded in their website.

Could you create a new issue on https://github.com/numpy/numpy.org/issues?
It would be good to start keeping track of website improvement ideas -
ideas in mailing list threads tend to get lost eventually.

Thanks,
Ralf
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Re: [Numpy-discussion] Helping with website improvements

[Dashamir Hoxha]

On Wed, Jul 17, 2019 at 6:11 AM Ralf Gommers  wrote:

>
>> Has anybody tried Katacoda before:
>> https://www.katacoda.com/courses/python/playground ?
>>
>
> I haven't heard of it before. Looks cool. Seems to run on Docker, so would
> require some infrastructure. If it's something we could get from a static
> site, then it may be worth considering. Could you summarize what it would
> require?
>

The infrastructure is supplied by Katacoda, we don't need to run or
maintain any server (although I don't think this would be a big problem).
And it is free. The only limitation is that the duration of the training
session for a student is 1 hour (and then he can reload the browser and
start a fresh session). If enterprises or training companies would like to
lift this limitation, they have to contact them.

Building an interactive tutorial is very easy and everybody can learn it in
a short time. The code of the tutorial is just a bunch of json and markdown
files (for the configuration of the environment and for the steps of the
tutorial). It can be saved on your preferred git repository (GitHub,
GitLab, Bitbacket, etc.) and katacoda pulls it from there and builds the
tutorial environment (docker image). Here is a minimal (hello world)
example:
https://github.com/dashohoxha/katacoda-scenarios/tree/master/hello-world You
also need to set a webhook on the repository, so that whenever you make
some changes (commits) katacoda is notified to refresh the content of the
tutorial.

Regards,
Dashamir
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Re: [Numpy-discussion] Helping with website improvements

[Ralf Gommers]

On Tue, Jul 16, 2019 at 12:23 AM Dashamir Hoxha 
wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 16, 2019 at 12:48 AM Dashamir Hoxha 
> wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> With respect to this call for contributions:
>> https://github.com/numpy/numpy/pull/13988/files
>> I would like to help with improving the website of numpy (and maybe scipy
>> as well).
>> I have also applied for the Google Season of Docs 2019, and if accepted,
>> I will be starting by the beginning of August.
>>
>> The improvements that I would like to make include:
>> - Making the website responsive (so that it looks nice on small screens
>> as well). There are responsive themes for sphinx and I may use one of them.
>> - Improving the main page (or the landing page) so that it looks a bit
>> more modern and attractive.
>> - Reorganizing the structure of the information on the website, so that
>> people from different backgrounds (students, professionals, etc.) can find
>> more easily the relevant information that they are looking for. Including
>> references to the external tutorials or courses about NumPy/SciPy.
>>
>
> Has anybody tried Katacoda before:
> https://www.katacoda.com/courses/python/playground ?
>

I haven't heard of it before. Looks cool. Seems to run on Docker, so would
require some infrastructure. If it's something we could get from a static
site, then it may be worth considering. Could you summarize what it would
require?

Cheers,
Ralf


It can be used to develop interactive tutorials, which can also be embedded
> on a web page.
> I may also write a couple of beginners' tutorials (based on the existing
> tutorials), if this seems to be useful.
>
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Re: [Numpy-discussion] Helping with website improvements

[Ralf Gommers]

On Tue, Jul 16, 2019 at 9:57 AM Sebastian Berg 
wrote:

> On Tue, 2019-07-16 at 07:06 -0600, Charles R Harris wrote:
> > Hi Dashamir,
> >
> > On Mon, Jul 15, 2019 at 4:49 PM Dashamir Hoxha 
> > wrote:
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > With respect to this call for contributions:
> > > https://github.com/numpy/numpy/pull/13988/files
> > > I would like to help with improving the website of numpy (and maybe
> > > scipy as well).
>

Thanks for offering to help Dashamir!

> > I have also applied for the Google Season of Docs 2019, and if
> > > accepted, I will be starting by the beginning of August.
> > >
> > > The improvements that I would like to make include:
> > > - Making the website responsive (so that it looks nice on small
> > > screens as well). There are responsive themes for sphinx and I may
> > > use one of them.
> > > - Improving the main page (or the landing page) so that it looks a
> > > bit more modern and attractive.
> > > - Reorganizing the structure of the information on the website, so
> > > that people from different backgrounds (students, professionals,
> > > etc.) can find more easily the relevant information that they are
> > > looking for. Including references to the external tutorials or
> > > courses about NumPy/SciPy.
>

This all sounds good. I just sent another email about the numpy.org
redesign, please feel free to jump in on the proposal (
https://github.com/numpy/numpy/pull/14032).


> > >
> > > Other tentative improvements may be these:
> > > - Reorganize the docs so that each major release has its own
> > > version of docs. Major releases are those that may introduce new
> > > features, or in general, changes in the API (minor releases are the
> > > maintenance releases, which fix bugs, or make small changes, for
> > > example to improve the efficiency, but do not change the API). For
> > > example major releases may be v1.15, v1.16, v1.17 (however I am not
> > > sure about this).
>

Note that the docs are kept separate from the numpy.org site, and when we
move numpy.org away from Sphinx that separation will be clearer.
Matti is already working on this multi-version reshuffle in
https://github.com/numpy/numpy/pull/13886.


> > > - Reorganize the docs so that the core API functionality is shown
> > > more prominently than the rest, and so that functions that may be
> > > deprecated in the future can be marked so (in order to discourage
> > > users from using them) and alternative solutions are suggested
> > > instead of them, etc.
>

This is a good idea. That sounds more like a GSoD topic - it's quite some
work to do, and to agree on the choices of what's important.

> > - Allow the users to add comments for each function or package.
> > > These may be usage examples for the benefit of other users, or
> > > pitfall alerts, or even bug reports. Reporting bugs on GitHub is
> > > better of course, but this may be a bit easier for the users.
>

This one I'm not so sure about. Could result in a lot more work for us..

> >
> > > Since these are not incremental changes, if may be better if I work
> > > on a fork of the website repository, until they are finished and
> > > the new website is ready.
>

Yes, would be good to start in a clean repo. I'd like to get the NEP
accepted first, and then put together a bit of a plan so multiple people
can work together on this.

Cheers,
Ralf


> >
> > >
> >
> > That sounds interesting and ambitious. I'll let others offer
> > suggestions, we might want to host the site at a different provider
> > which will offer easier access to developers. The repo is at at
> > https://github.com/numpy/numpy.org. There is also a scipy.org website
> > that could also use some work.
> >
>
>
> Indeed, great to see interest, it sounds very nice! I believe you are
> already in contact with Ralf directly (just in case someone wonders if
> there might be little immediate followup on the mailing list).
>
> Best,
>
> Sebastian
>
>
> > Chuck
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Re: [Numpy-discussion] Helping with website improvements

[Sebastian Berg]

On Tue, 2019-07-16 at 07:06 -0600, Charles R Harris wrote:
> Hi Dashamir,
> 
> On Mon, Jul 15, 2019 at 4:49 PM Dashamir Hoxha 
> wrote:
> > Hi,
> > 
> > With respect to this call for contributions: 
> > https://github.com/numpy/numpy/pull/13988/files
> > I would like to help with improving the website of numpy (and maybe
> > scipy as well).
> > I have also applied for the Google Season of Docs 2019, and if
> > accepted, I will be starting by the beginning of August.
> > 
> > The improvements that I would like to make include:
> > - Making the website responsive (so that it looks nice on small
> > screens as well). There are responsive themes for sphinx and I may
> > use one of them.
> > - Improving the main page (or the landing page) so that it looks a
> > bit more modern and attractive.
> > - Reorganizing the structure of the information on the website, so
> > that people from different backgrounds (students, professionals,
> > etc.) can find more easily the relevant information that they are
> > looking for. Including references to the external tutorials or
> > courses about NumPy/SciPy.
> > 
> > Other tentative improvements may be these:
> > - Reorganize the docs so that each major release has its own
> > version of docs. Major releases are those that may introduce new
> > features, or in general, changes in the API (minor releases are the
> > maintenance releases, which fix bugs, or make small changes, for
> > example to improve the efficiency, but do not change the API). For
> > example major releases may be v1.15, v1.16, v1.17 (however I am not
> > sure about this).
> > - Reorganize the docs so that the core API functionality is shown
> > more prominently than the rest, and so that functions that may be
> > deprecated in the future can be marked so (in order to discourage
> > users from using them) and alternative solutions are suggested
> > instead of them, etc.
> > - Allow the users to add comments for each function or package.
> > These may be usage examples for the benefit of other users, or
> > pitfall alerts, or even bug reports. Reporting bugs on GitHub is
> > better of course, but this may be a bit easier for the users.
> > 
> > Since these are not incremental changes, if may be better if I work
> > on a fork of the website repository, until they are finished and
> > the new website is ready.
> > 
> > 
> 
> That sounds interesting and ambitious. I'll let others offer
> suggestions, we might want to host the site at a different provider
> which will offer easier access to developers. The repo is at at  
> https://github.com/numpy/numpy.org. There is also a scipy.org website
> that could also use some work.
> 


Indeed, great to see interest, it sounds very nice! I believe you are
already in contact with Ralf directly (just in case someone wonders if
there might be little immediate followup on the mailing list).

Best,

Sebastian


> Chuck
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Re: [Numpy-discussion] Helping with website improvements

[Charles R Harris]

Hi Dashamir,

On Mon, Jul 15, 2019 at 4:49 PM Dashamir Hoxha  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> With respect to this call for contributions:
> https://github.com/numpy/numpy/pull/13988/files
> I would like to help with improving the website of numpy (and maybe scipy
> as well).
> I have also applied for the Google Season of Docs 2019, and if accepted, I
> will be starting by the beginning of August.
>
> The improvements that I would like to make include:
> - Making the website responsive (so that it looks nice on small screens as
> well). There are responsive themes for sphinx and I may use one of them.
> - Improving the main page (or the landing page) so that it looks a bit
> more modern and attractive.
> - Reorganizing the structure of the information on the website, so that
> people from different backgrounds (students, professionals, etc.) can find
> more easily the relevant information that they are looking for. Including
> references to the external tutorials or courses about NumPy/SciPy.
>
> Other tentative improvements may be these:
> - Reorganize the docs so that each major release has its own version of
> docs. Major releases are those that may introduce new features, or in
> general, changes in the API (minor releases are the maintenance releases,
> which fix bugs, or make small changes, for example to improve the
> efficiency, but do not change the API). For example major releases may be
> v1.15, v1.16, v1.17 (however I am not sure about this).
> - Reorganize the docs so that the core API functionality is shown more
> prominently than the rest, and so that functions that may be deprecated in
> the future can be marked so (in order to discourage users from using them)
> and alternative solutions are suggested instead of them, etc.
> - Allow the users to add comments for each function or package. These may
> be usage examples for the benefit of other users, or pitfall alerts, or
> even bug reports. Reporting bugs on GitHub is better of course, but this
> may be a bit easier for the users.
>
> Since these are not incremental changes, if may be better if I work on a
> fork of the website repository, until they are finished and the new website
> is ready.
>
>
That sounds interesting and ambitious. I'll let others offer suggestions,
we might want to host the site at a different provider which will offer
easier access to developers. The repo is at at
https://github.com/numpy/numpy.org. There is also a scipy.org
 website that could also use some work.

Chuck
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