Re: [OmniOS-discuss] Status of VAAI
Okay. I'm home (from vacation), and I can answer this a bit more thoroughly. (Why do you guys pile on while I'm on vacation?!? :) ) The best course of action here is to upstream the VAAI bits from illumos-nexenta into illumos-gate. This would involve: 1.) Scoping out ALL of the VAAI changes in illumos-nexenta - making sure you aren't missing any corner-cases and bugfixes. (Trust me, I helped with the initial VAAI work, there are bugfixes you need!) 2.) Moving said changes into illumos-gate (illumos-omnios would suffice for this, as we don't diverge from upstream in this department), and making sure they build both as modules, and as a full-world-build nightly. 3.) Testing the hell out of it. Nexenta tested it, and STILL needed months/years to iron out everything. 4.) Sending it up for review and RTI. I think I could do #1-2 myself without much effort, but I have OmniTI customers and paying OmniOS customers to serve first. A new-to-illumos person would have two learning curves to climb. It's not untenable, but it's much harder. Ideally, Nexenta would be working on upstreaming this themselves (as Delphix has with their numerous ZFS changes). You may wish to ask on illumos community mailing lists about that. #3 is the hard part. I knew very little about iSCSI, COMSTAR, and storage in general when I was showed the initial work on VAAI. After upstreaming UNMAP and WRITE_SAME, Nexenta got a little hamstrung on the other two primitives. Still, during all of that, TESTING was needed, and sometimes internal testing didn't catch everything. Those of you clamoring for VAAI should be offering to test (like Floris did). If you can WRITE TESTS for the usr/src/test directory, that would be good (even if they're scripts for other platforms like Linux). If you have a good hard-and-heavy environment, documenting it, and placing the new code in place would also be good. #4 is not that tough, especially if whomever did #1-#2 clearly documents what he/she did, and works with (or is) a seasoned illumos developer. I hope I haven't come across as too harsh. I think getting this upstreamed is useful and important. I just wanted to spell out what all needs to happen. Dan ___ OmniOS-discuss mailing list OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss
Re: [OmniOS-discuss] Status of VAAI
On Aug 5, 2014, at 8:38 PM, Schweiss, Chip wrote: > I used to do a lot of Linux kernel work, but haven't jumped in on Illumos, > mostly because the information to get started seems sparse and often outdated > on the few wiki pages that exist. The wiki isn't bad. Also look at this old blog post for building small bits: http://kebesays.blogspot.com/2011/03/for-illumos-newbies-on-developing-small.html After our Surge conference this year, we're having an Illumos Day. Would an intro-to-new-developers talk be useful? > One curiosity I have is could a hybrid distribution of OmniOS with a Nexenta > kernel be built and be useable. Nexenta keeps everything out in the open on > Github. How hard would it be to build that kernel and utilize it? You might as well spend the effort to upstream bits of illumos-nexenta that you find interesting. My next mail on this thread will discuss this. Dan ___ OmniOS-discuss mailing list OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss
Re: [OmniOS-discuss] Status of VAAI
On Aug 5, 2014, at 4:43 PM, Günther Alka wrote: > > If Nexenta would give Illumian more love, it might become the leading free > Illumos distribution > but I do not expect that this will happen. Many ex-Sun types who aren't Joyent like IPS. I don't think Illumian, with its Debian-ish-ness, would appeal to them. > The other „big players“ like Delphix, Joyent or > OmniOS seems to have no interest in such storage features REALLY!?!? Delphix has been BIG on improvements to storage, specifically in the ZFS realm. That's an irresponsible use of a broad brush stroke. And Delphix has fixed some iSCSI stuff that Nexenta didn't catch. Yes, Nexenta's done the most outside of ZFS improvements to help storage -- it's their jobs (e.g. SMB/CIFS). Don't blow off the other players, though, please. OmniTI isn't explicitly in the storage business, so its illumos resources (mostly me) are directed to where they can do the most good for OmniTI and OmniOS. > as well as improvements in > encryption (hey we need this) Nobody, and I mean NOBODY with money to spend has asked any of the major players about on-disk encryption. I spent just shy of 3 years at Nexenta, and I asked this question repeatedly both inside and out: no paying customers wanted it. There's also the issue of the ZFS crypto patent - folks are (with good reason) afraid of it. ZFS crypto didn't land in the Oracle Solaris source until AFTER the barn door had been closed. There's no CDDL grounds to protect people. The work-in-progress ZFS crypto I've seen kicked around is not complete enough, either. FYI, Dan ___ OmniOS-discuss mailing list OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss
Re: [OmniOS-discuss] Status of VAAI
I used to do a lot of Linux kernel work, but haven't jumped in on Illumos, mostly because the information to get started seems sparse and often outdated on the few wiki pages that exist. I'd be a regular at dabbling in the Illumos kernel if it didn't require so much time just to get started. One curiosity I have is could a hybrid distribution of OmniOS with a Nexenta kernel be built and be useable. Nexenta keeps everything out in the open on Github. How hard would it be to build that kernel and utilize it? -Chip On Tue, Aug 5, 2014 at 3:52 PM, Scott LeFevre wrote: > So what is the skill set needed to help with the development? If we > have a better understanding of this, it might allow people to understand if > they are capable of helping. > > Cheers, > -- > Scott LeFevre > 317-696-1010 > > On Tue, 2014-08-05 at 22:43 +0200, Günther Alka wrote: > > I am a programmer but not for OS development but in the GUI/ usability > area > > otherwise I would help (can help with testing) > > > > It is really a pity. Ragarding storage and usability, Solaris and > OmniOS is far better than > > Linux that I use as well for my ZFS GUI. With the newest features that > Nexenta integrates > > into NexentaStor (beside VAII this is SMB2 and failure management on slow > disks), Illumos > > has the ability to be the number 1 storage OS - even in the OpenSource or > low-cost area, > > better than BSD or Linux. > > > > If Nexenta would give Illumian more love, it might become the leading > free Illumos distribution > > but I do not expect that this will happen. The other „big players“ like > Delphix, Joyent or > > OmniOS seems to have no interest in such storage features as well as > improvements in > > encryption (hey we need this) > > > > Gea/ napp-it.org > > > > > Am 05.08.2014 um 19:27 schrieb Floris van Essen ..:: House of Ancients > Amstafs ::.. : > > > Hi Dan, > > > > Sometimes i wish was a programmer J > > Infra dude here, with plenty of stuff to test thing, but a programmer I > am not, however if you need testers…. > > > > > > > > > > *Van:* Dan McDonald [mailto:dan...@omniti.com ] > *Verzonden:* dinsdag 5 augustus 2014 18:48 > *Aan:* Floris van Essen ..:: House of Ancients Amstafs ::.. > *CC:* omnios-discuss@lists.omniti.com > *Onderwerp:* Re: [OmniOS-discuss] Status of VAAI > > > > Someone needs to take the time to port the Illumos-nexenta bits > upstream. Nobody has yet stepped up to the plate. Are you volunteering? > ;) > > > > Dan > > Sent from my iPhone (typos, autocorrect, and all) > > > On Aug 5, 2014, at 1:44 AM, "Floris van Essen ..:: House of Ancients > Amstafs ::.." wrote: > > >Hi Guys, > > > >Been waiting now for a long time for VAAI (XCOPY and ATS ) to make it into > COMSTAR > Does anyone know if there’s any progress in that area ? > https://www.mail-archive.com/omnios-discuss@lists.omniti.com/msg02095.html > > best regards, > > > Floris > >___ > OmniOS-discuss mailing list > OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com > http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss > > ___ > OmniOS-discuss mailing list > OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com > http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss > > > > ___ > OmniOS-discuss mailing > listOmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.comhttp://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss > > > ___ > OmniOS-discuss mailing list > OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com > http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss > > ___ OmniOS-discuss mailing list OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss
Re: [OmniOS-discuss] Status of VAAI
So what is the skill set needed to help with the development? If we have a better understanding of this, it might allow people to understand if they are capable of helping. Cheers, -- Scott LeFevre 317-696-1010 On Tue, 2014-08-05 at 22:43 +0200, Günther Alka wrote: > I am a programmer but not for OS development but in the GUI/ usability > area > > otherwise I would help (can help with testing) > > > It is really a pity. Ragarding storage and usability, Solaris and > OmniOS is far better than > Linux that I use as well for my ZFS GUI. With the newest features that > Nexenta integrates > into NexentaStor (beside VAII this is SMB2 and failure management on > slow disks), Illumos > has the ability to be the number 1 storage OS - even in the OpenSource > or low-cost area, > better than BSD or Linux. > > > If Nexenta would give Illumian more love, it might become the leading > free Illumos distribution > but I do not expect that this will happen. The other „big players“ > like Delphix, Joyent or > OmniOS seems to have no interest in such storage features as well as > improvements in > encryption (hey we need this) > > > Gea/ napp-it.org > > > > > Am 05.08.2014 um 19:27 schrieb Floris van Essen ..:: House of Ancients > Amstafs ::.. : > > > > > Hi Dan, > > > > Sometimes i wish was a programmer J > > Infra dude here, with plenty of stuff to test thing, but a > > programmer I am not, however if you need testers…. > > > > > > > > > > Van: Dan McDonald [mailto:dan...@omniti.com] > > Verzonden: dinsdag 5 augustus 2014 18:48 > > Aan: Floris van Essen ..:: House of Ancients Amstafs ::.. > > CC: omnios-discuss@lists.omniti.com > > Onderwerp: Re: [OmniOS-discuss] Status of VAAI > > > > Someone needs to take the time to port the Illumos-nexenta bits > > upstream. Nobody has yet stepped up to the plate. Are you > > volunteering? ;) > > > > Dan > > > > Sent from my iPhone (typos, autocorrect, and all) > > > > On Aug 5, 2014, at 1:44 AM, "Floris van Essen ..:: House of Ancients > > Amstafs ::.." wrote: > > > > > > Hi Guys, > > > > > > Been waiting now for a long time for VAAI (XCOPY and ATS ) to make > > it into COMSTAR > > Does anyone know if there’s any progress in that area ? > > > > > > https://www.mail-archive.com/omnios-discuss@lists.omniti.com/msg02095.html > > > > best regards, > > > > > > Floris > > > > ___ > > OmniOS-discuss mailing list > > OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com > > http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss > > > > ___ > > OmniOS-discuss mailing list > > OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com > > http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss > > > > > ___ > OmniOS-discuss mailing list > OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com > http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss ___ OmniOS-discuss mailing list OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss
Re: [OmniOS-discuss] Status of VAAI
I am a programmer but not for OS development but in the GUI/ usability area otherwise I would help (can help with testing) It is really a pity. Ragarding storage and usability, Solaris and OmniOS is far better than Linux that I use as well for my ZFS GUI. With the newest features that Nexenta integrates into NexentaStor (beside VAII this is SMB2 and failure management on slow disks), Illumos has the ability to be the number 1 storage OS - even in the OpenSource or low-cost area, better than BSD or Linux. If Nexenta would give Illumian more love, it might become the leading free Illumos distribution but I do not expect that this will happen. The other „big players“ like Delphix, Joyent or OmniOS seems to have no interest in such storage features as well as improvements in encryption (hey we need this) Gea/ napp-it.org Am 05.08.2014 um 19:27 schrieb Floris van Essen ..:: House of Ancients Amstafs ::.. : > Hi Dan, > > Sometimes i wish was a programmer J > Infra dude here, with plenty of stuff to test thing, but a programmer I am > not, however if you need testers…. > > > > > Van: Dan McDonald [mailto:dan...@omniti.com] > Verzonden: dinsdag 5 augustus 2014 18:48 > Aan: Floris van Essen ..:: House of Ancients Amstafs ::.. > CC: omnios-discuss@lists.omniti.com > Onderwerp: Re: [OmniOS-discuss] Status of VAAI > > Someone needs to take the time to port the Illumos-nexenta bits upstream. > Nobody has yet stepped up to the plate. Are you volunteering? ;) > > Dan > > Sent from my iPhone (typos, autocorrect, and all) > > On Aug 5, 2014, at 1:44 AM, "Floris van Essen ..:: House of Ancients Amstafs > ::.." wrote: > > Hi Guys, > > Been waiting now for a long time for VAAI (XCOPY and ATS ) to make it into > COMSTAR > Does anyone know if there’s any progress in that area ? > > https://www.mail-archive.com/omnios-discuss@lists.omniti.com/msg02095.html > > best regards, > > > Floris > ___ > OmniOS-discuss mailing list > OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com > http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss > ___ > OmniOS-discuss mailing list > OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com > http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss ___ OmniOS-discuss mailing list OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss
Re: [OmniOS-discuss] Status of VAAI
Pardon the top post. Testers are ALWAYS appreciated for new things. I'll remember this. Thanks, Dan Sent from my iPhone (typos, autocorrect, and all) > On Aug 5, 2014, at 12:27 PM, "Floris van Essen ..:: House of Ancients Amstafs > ::.." wrote: > > Hi Dan, > > Sometimes i wish was a programmer J > Infra dude here, with plenty of stuff to test thing, but a programmer I am > not, however if you need testers…. > > > > > Van: Dan McDonald [mailto:dan...@omniti.com] > Verzonden: dinsdag 5 augustus 2014 18:48 > Aan: Floris van Essen ..:: House of Ancients Amstafs ::.. > CC: omnios-discuss@lists.omniti.com > Onderwerp: Re: [OmniOS-discuss] Status of VAAI > > Someone needs to take the time to port the Illumos-nexenta bits upstream. > Nobody has yet stepped up to the plate. Are you volunteering? ;) > > Dan > > Sent from my iPhone (typos, autocorrect, and all) > > On Aug 5, 2014, at 1:44 AM, "Floris van Essen ..:: House of Ancients Amstafs > ::.." wrote: > > Hi Guys, > > Been waiting now for a long time for VAAI (XCOPY and ATS ) to make it into > COMSTAR > Does anyone know if there’s any progress in that area ? > > https://www.mail-archive.com/omnios-discuss@lists.omniti.com/msg02095.html > > best regards, > > > Floris > ___ > OmniOS-discuss mailing list > OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com > http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss ___ OmniOS-discuss mailing list OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss
Re: [OmniOS-discuss] Status of VAAI
Hi Dan, Sometimes i wish was a programmer ☺ Infra dude here, with plenty of stuff to test thing, but a programmer I am not, however if you need testers…. Van: Dan McDonald [mailto:dan...@omniti.com] Verzonden: dinsdag 5 augustus 2014 18:48 Aan: Floris van Essen ..:: House of Ancients Amstafs ::.. CC: omnios-discuss@lists.omniti.com Onderwerp: Re: [OmniOS-discuss] Status of VAAI Someone needs to take the time to port the Illumos-nexenta bits upstream. Nobody has yet stepped up to the plate. Are you volunteering? ;) Dan Sent from my iPhone (typos, autocorrect, and all) On Aug 5, 2014, at 1:44 AM, "Floris van Essen ..:: House of Ancients Amstafs ::.." mailto:i...@houseofancients.nl>> wrote: Hi Guys, Been waiting now for a long time for VAAI (XCOPY and ATS ) to make it into COMSTAR Does anyone know if there’s any progress in that area ? https://www.mail-archive.com/omnios-discuss@lists.omniti.com/msg02095.html best regards, Floris ___ OmniOS-discuss mailing list OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com<mailto:OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com> http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss ___ OmniOS-discuss mailing list OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss
Re: [OmniOS-discuss] Status of VAAI
Someone needs to take the time to port the Illumos-nexenta bits upstream. Nobody has yet stepped up to the plate. Are you volunteering? ;) Dan Sent from my iPhone (typos, autocorrect, and all) > On Aug 5, 2014, at 1:44 AM, "Floris van Essen ..:: House of Ancients Amstafs > ::.." wrote: > > Hi Guys, > > Been waiting now for a long time for VAAI (XCOPY and ATS ) to make it into > COMSTAR > Does anyone know if there’s any progress in that area ? > > https://www.mail-archive.com/omnios-discuss@lists.omniti.com/msg02095.html > > best regards, > > > Floris > ___ > OmniOS-discuss mailing list > OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com > http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss ___ OmniOS-discuss mailing list OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss
[OmniOS-discuss] Status of VAAI
Hi Guys, Been waiting now for a long time for VAAI (XCOPY and ATS ) to make it into COMSTAR Does anyone know if there's any progress in that area ? https://www.mail-archive.com/omnios-discuss@lists.omniti.com/msg02095.html best regards, Floris ___ OmniOS-discuss mailing list OmniOS-discuss@lists.omniti.com http://lists.omniti.com/mailman/listinfo/omnios-discuss
