Re: [Openstack] Hardware HA
On 11/10/2011 02:38 PM, Viacheslav Biriukov wrote: Hi all. What are the best practices for HA of the hardware compute-node, and virtual machines. After googling I found matahari, pacemaker-cloud, but nothing about build-in fiches openstack. 1) How do you create such environments? 2) Does it is right way to use pacemaker-cloud with openstack? Is it stable? About pacemaker-cloud, one can currently use it with openstack to some extent: http://ahsalkeld.wordpress.com/a-mash-up-of-openstack-and-pacemaker-cloud/ However there are lots of manual steps and it's still in development. It would be cool if you wanted to give that a shot and reported any issues or thoughts. cheers, Pádraig. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Openstack] Hardware HA
2011/11/10 Viacheslav Biriukov v.v.biriu...@gmail.com: Hi all. What are the best practices for HA of the hardware compute-node, and virtual machines. After googling I found matahari, pacemaker-cloud, but nothing about build-in fiches openstack. 1) How do you create such environments? 2) Does it is right way to use pacemaker-cloud with openstack? Is it stable? I'd avoid depending on anything like that altogether. Try to design your application so that it doesn't depend on any one instance being up. It'll work out better in the long run. -- Soren Hansen | http://linux2go.dk/ Ubuntu Developer | http://www.ubuntu.com/ OpenStack Developer | http://www.openstack.org/ ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Openstack] Hardware HA
There is a blueprint that touches these aspects: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/guest-ha This is tailored at use cases where you cannot redesign an existing app. The work is at the early stages, but you are more than welcome to join the effort! Cheers, Armando -Original Message- From: openstack-bounces+armando.migliaccio=eu.citrix@lists.launchpad.net [mailto:openstack- bounces+armando.migliaccio=eu.citrix@lists.launchpad.net] On Behalf Of Soren Hansen Sent: 10 November 2011 15:51 To: Viacheslav Biriukov Cc: openstack@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Openstack] Hardware HA 2011/11/10 Viacheslav Biriukov v.v.biriu...@gmail.com: Hi all. What are the best practices for HA of the hardware compute-node, and virtual machines. After googling I found matahari, pacemaker-cloud, but nothing about build-in fiches openstack. 1) How do you create such environments? 2) Does it is right way to use pacemaker-cloud with openstack? Is it stable? I'd avoid depending on anything like that altogether. Try to design your application so that it doesn't depend on any one instance being up. It'll work out better in the long run. -- Soren Hansen | http://linux2go.dk/ Ubuntu Developer | http://www.ubuntu.com/ OpenStack Developer | http://www.openstack.org/ ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Openstack] Hardware HA
Hm If we planning vm hosting we work on the other level. So if hw node fails we need fast automatic migration to other node. 2011/11/10 Soren Hansen so...@linux2go.dk 2011/11/10 Viacheslav Biriukov v.v.biriu...@gmail.com: Hi all. What are the best practices for HA of the hardware compute-node, and virtual machines. After googling I found matahari, pacemaker-cloud, but nothing about build-in fiches openstack. 1) How do you create such environments? 2) Does it is right way to use pacemaker-cloud with openstack? Is it stable? I'd avoid depending on anything like that altogether. Try to design your application so that it doesn't depend on any one instance being up. It'll work out better in the long run. -- Soren Hansen| http://linux2go.dk/ Ubuntu Developer| http://www.ubuntu.com/ OpenStack Developer | http://www.openstack.org/ -- Viacheslav Biriukov BR http://biriukov.com ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Openstack] Hardware HA
Funny you bring that up today;I spent the day working on that. I've implemented Gluster FS on my openstack running installation and written a script along that.Here is the implementationnode1- 1 instance runningthe node 1 crashes (could be anything atm)the script detect the node is gone (to be defined : heartbeat, monitoring, etc...) and relaunch the instance in the specified node.I've tested it and successfully works. Just need to write the final touchesRegards Razique Mahrouarazique.mahr...@gmail.com Le 10 nov. 2011 à 17:15, Viacheslav Biriukov a écrit :HmIf we planning vm hosting we work on the other level. So if hw node fails we need fast automatic migration to other node.2011/11/10 Soren Hansen so...@linux2go.dk 2011/11/10 Viacheslav Biriukov v.v.biriu...@gmail.com: Hi all. What are the bestpractices for HA of the hardware compute-node, and virtual machines. After googling I found matahari, pacemaker-cloud, but nothing about build-infiches openstack. 1) How do you create suchenvironments? 2) Does it is right way to use pacemaker-cloud with openstack? Is it stable? I'd avoid depending on anything like that altogether. Try to design your application so that it doesn't depend on any one instance being up. It'll work out better in the long run. -- Soren Hansen| http://linux2go.dk/ Ubuntu Developer | http://www.ubuntu.com/ OpenStack Developer | http://www.openstack.org/ -- Viacheslav BiriukovBRhttp://biriukov.com ___Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstackPost to : openstack@lists.launchpad.netUnsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstackMore help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Openstack] Hardware HA
Hi Armando! It is very interesting feature. Are you already have specs for this blueprints or may be etherpad? Regards, Ilya 10 ноября 2011 г. 20:16 пользователь Armando Migliaccio armando.migliac...@eu.citrix.com написал: There is a blueprint that touches these aspects: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/guest-ha This is tailored at use cases where you cannot redesign an existing app. The work is at the early stages, but you are more than welcome to join the effort! Cheers, Armando -Original Message- From: openstack-bounces+armando.migliaccio= eu.citrix@lists.launchpad.net [mailto:openstack- bounces+armando.migliaccio=eu.citrix@lists.launchpad.net] On Behalf Of Soren Hansen Sent: 10 November 2011 15:51 To: Viacheslav Biriukov Cc: openstack@lists.launchpad.net Subject: Re: [Openstack] Hardware HA 2011/11/10 Viacheslav Biriukov v.v.biriu...@gmail.com: Hi all. What are the best practices for HA of the hardware compute-node, and virtual machines. After googling I found matahari, pacemaker-cloud, but nothing about build-in fiches openstack. 1) How do you create such environments? 2) Does it is right way to use pacemaker-cloud with openstack? Is it stable? I'd avoid depending on anything like that altogether. Try to design your application so that it doesn't depend on any one instance being up. It'll work out better in the long run. -- Soren Hansen| http://linux2go.dk/ Ubuntu Developer| http://www.ubuntu.com/ OpenStack Developer | http://www.openstack.org/ ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Openstack] Hardware HA
2011/11/10 Viacheslav Biriukov v.v.biriu...@gmail.com: Hm If we planning vm hosting we work on the other level. So if hw node fails we need fast automatic migration to other node. That's the whole point. For most interesting applications, fast automatic migration isn't anywhere near fast enough. Don't try to avoid failure. Expect it and design around it. -- Soren Hansen | http://linux2go.dk/ Ubuntu Developer | http://www.ubuntu.com/ OpenStack Developer | http://www.openstack.org/ ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Openstack] Hardware HA
2011/11/10 Ryan Lane rl...@wikimedia.org: That's the whole point. For most interesting applications, fast automatic migration isn't anywhere near fast enough. Don't try to avoid failure. Expect it and design around it. This assumes all application designers are doing this. Most web applications do this fairly well, but most enterprise applications do this very poorly. I know. That's what makes them a poor fit for the cloud. Hardware HA is useful for more than just poorly designed applications though. I have a cloud instance that runs my personal website. I don't want to pay for two (or more, realistically) instances just to ensure that if my host dies that my site will continue to run. My provider should automatically detect the hardware failure and re-launch my instance on another piece of hardware; it should also notify me that it happened, but that's a different story ;). I'm not sure I count that as High Availability. It's more like Eventual Availability. :) -- Soren Hansen | http://linux2go.dk/ Ubuntu Developer | http://www.ubuntu.com/ OpenStack Developer | http://www.openstack.org/ ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Openstack] Hardware HA
That's the whole point. For most interesting applications, fast automatic migration isn't anywhere near fast enough. Don't try to avoid failure. Expect it and design around it. This assumes all application designers are doing this. Most web applications do this fairly well, but most enterprise applications do this very poorly. Hardware HA is useful for more than just poorly designed applications though. I have a cloud instance that runs my personal website. I don't want to pay for two (or more, realistically) instances just to ensure that if my host dies that my site will continue to run. My provider should automatically detect the hardware failure and re-launch my instance on another piece of hardware; it should also notify me that it happened, but that's a different story ;). - Ryan Lane ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Openstack] Hardware HA
I know. That's what makes them a poor fit for the cloud. Meh. Private clouds will still use applications like this. I think the cloud is great for cloud providers, but why limit nova's usefulness to just cloud providers? The cloud way of doing things pushes the responsibility of keeping applications alive to the client. There's a lot of clients that don't have this level of sophistication. Hardware HA is useful for more than just poorly designed applications though. I have a cloud instance that runs my personal website. I don't want to pay for two (or more, realistically) instances just to ensure that if my host dies that my site will continue to run. My provider should automatically detect the hardware failure and re-launch my instance on another piece of hardware; it should also notify me that it happened, but that's a different story ;). I'm not sure I count that as High Availability. It's more like Eventual Availability. :) So, this is one HA mode for VMware. There is also a newer HA mode that is much more expensive (from the resources perspective) that keeps a shadow copy of a virtual machine on another piece of hardware, and if the primary instance's hardware dies, it automatically switches over to the shadow copy. Both modes are really useful. There's a huge level of automation needed for doing things the cloud way that is completely unnecessary. I don't want to have to monitor my instances to see if one died due to a hardware failure, then start new ones, then pool them, then depool the dead ones. I want my provider to handle hardware deaths for me. If I have 200 web servers instances, and 40 of them die because they are on nodes that die, I want them to restart somewhere else. It removes all the bullshit automation I'd need to do otherwise. - Ryan Lane ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~openstack Post to : openstack@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~openstack More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
