Re: [openstack-dev] [all] who is the ptl of trove?

2015-05-13 Thread Nikhil Manchanda
Comments inline.

Monty Taylor writes:

 [...]
 Might I suggest that if this is how people regularly deploy, that such a
 class be included in trove proper, and that a config option be provided
 like use_tenant='name_of_tenant_to_use' that would trigger the use of
 the overridden novaclient class?

 I think asking an operator as a standard practice to override code in
 remote.py is a bad pattern.

I concur with this 100%. I've spent a lot of time over the past months
answering questions to do with how folks can deploy Trove inside a
single tenant. Since 'use_tenant' is one of the top recommended models
for deployment, it makes sense that the code for it should reside in Trove
proper. This would also be a good first step of documenting this as a
recommended deployment option. I've opened a blueprint to look into
this [1].

[1] https://blueprints.launchpad.net/trove/+spec/trove-single-tenant


 [...]
 Most deployments of Trove that I am familiar with set up a separate
 RabbitMQ server in cloud that is used by Trove. It is not recommended to
 use the same infrastructure RabbitMQ server for Trove for security
 reasons. Also most deployments of Trove set up a private (neutron)
 network that the RabbitMQ server and guests are connected to, and all
 RPC messages are sent over this network.

 This sounds like a great chunk of information to potentially go into
 deployer docs.

Agree wholeheartedly. IMO right now, Trove has fairly decent developer
docs, but it's deployment docs are somewhat on the sparse side. We're
planning on tackling this during one of the Work sessions at the
upcoming Liberty summit in Vancouver.

 [...]

Thanks,
Nikhil

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Re: [openstack-dev] [all] who is the ptl of trove?

2015-05-11 Thread Li Tianqing






--

Best
Li Tianqing



At 2015-05-11 16:50:05, Flavio Percoco fla...@redhat.com wrote:
On 11/05/15 16:32 +0800, Li Tianqing wrote:





--
Best
Li Tianqing



At 2015-05-11 16:04:07, Mark Kirkwood mark.kirkw...@catalyst.net.nz wrote:
On 09/05/15 02:28, Monty Taylor wrote:
 On 05/08/2015 03:45 AM, Nikhil Manchanda wrote:

 Comments and answers inline.

 Li Tianqing writes:

 [...]

 1) why we put the trove vm into user's tenant, not the trove's
 tenant? User can login on that vm, and that vm must connect to
 rabbitmq. It is quite insecure.
 what's about put the tenant into trove tenant?

 While the default configuration of Trove in devstack puts Trove guest
 VMs into the users' respective tenants, it's possible to configure Trove
 to create VMs in a single Trove tenant. You would do this by
 overriding the default novaclient class in Trove's remote.py with one
 that creates all Trove VMs in a particular tenant whose user credentials
 you will need to supply. In fact, most production instances of Trove do
 something like this.

 Might I suggest that if this is how people regularly deploy, that such a
 class be included in trove proper, and that a config option be provided
 like use_tenant='name_of_tenant_to_use' that would trigger the use of
 the overridden novaclient class?

 I think asking an operator as a standard practice to override code in
 remote.py is a bad pattern.

 2) Why there is no trove mgmt cli, but mgmt api is in the code?
 Does it disappear forever ?

 The reason for this is because the old legacy Trove client was rewritten
 to be in line with the rest of the openstack clients. The new client
 has bindings for the management API, but we didn't complete the work on
 writing the shell pieces for it. There is currently an effort to
 support Trove calls in the openstackclient, and we're looking to
 support the management client calls as part of this as well. If this is
 something that you're passionate about, we sure could use help landing
 this in Liberty.

 3)  The trove-guest-agent is in vm. it is connected by taskmanager
 by rabbitmq. We designed it. But is there some prectise to do this?
  how to make the vm be connected in vm-network and management
  network?

 Most deployments of Trove that I am familiar with set up a separate
 RabbitMQ server in cloud that is used by Trove. It is not recommended to
 use the same infrastructure RabbitMQ server for Trove for security
 reasons. Also most deployments of Trove set up a private (neutron)
 network that the RabbitMQ server and guests are connected to, and all
 RPC messages are sent over this network.

 This sounds like a great chunk of information to potentially go into
 deployer docs.



I'd like to +1 this.

It is misleading that the standard documentation (and the devstack
setup) describes a configuration that is unsafe/unwise to use in
production. This is surely unusual to say the least! Normally when test
or dev setups use unsafe configurations the relevant docs clearly state
this - and describe how it should actually be done.

In addition the fact that several extended question threads were
required to extract this vital information is ...disappointing, and does
not display the right spirit for an open source project in my opinion!

While I agree with this last paragraph

i really want to vote to put trove back into stackforge for it can not give 
an clear deployment,

... I must point out this is *NOT* the way this community (OpenStack)
works.

This mailing list exists to discuss things in the open, make sure we
can have wide and constructive discussions to make things like the ones
discussed in this thread come out so that they can be improved,
documented and made public for the sake of usability, operation and
adoption.

 and it is always avoiding problem, not to face it. The service vm need get 
 connect through the management should
talk about a lot.

It's now on Trove team's - or other people's - hands to help
find/implement a better solution for the problem pointed out in this
thread and make the product better.


Let's collaborate,


Fine.


Flavio




Regards

Mark




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@flaper87
Flavio Percoco
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Re: [openstack-dev] [all] who is the ptl of trove?

2015-05-11 Thread Li Tianqing






--

Best
Li Tianqing



At 2015-05-11 16:04:07, Mark Kirkwood mark.kirkw...@catalyst.net.nz wrote:
On 09/05/15 02:28, Monty Taylor wrote:
 On 05/08/2015 03:45 AM, Nikhil Manchanda wrote:

 Comments and answers inline.

 Li Tianqing writes:

 [...]

 1) why we put the trove vm into user's tenant, not the trove's
 tenant? User can login on that vm, and that vm must connect to
 rabbitmq. It is quite insecure.
 what's about put the tenant into trove tenant?

 While the default configuration of Trove in devstack puts Trove guest
 VMs into the users' respective tenants, it's possible to configure Trove
 to create VMs in a single Trove tenant. You would do this by
 overriding the default novaclient class in Trove's remote.py with one
 that creates all Trove VMs in a particular tenant whose user credentials
 you will need to supply. In fact, most production instances of Trove do
 something like this.

 Might I suggest that if this is how people regularly deploy, that such a
 class be included in trove proper, and that a config option be provided
 like use_tenant='name_of_tenant_to_use' that would trigger the use of
 the overridden novaclient class?

 I think asking an operator as a standard practice to override code in
 remote.py is a bad pattern.

 2) Why there is no trove mgmt cli, but mgmt api is in the code?
 Does it disappear forever ?

 The reason for this is because the old legacy Trove client was rewritten
 to be in line with the rest of the openstack clients. The new client
 has bindings for the management API, but we didn't complete the work on
 writing the shell pieces for it. There is currently an effort to
 support Trove calls in the openstackclient, and we're looking to
 support the management client calls as part of this as well. If this is
 something that you're passionate about, we sure could use help landing
 this in Liberty.

 3)  The trove-guest-agent is in vm. it is connected by taskmanager
 by rabbitmq. We designed it. But is there some prectise to do this?
  how to make the vm be connected in vm-network and management
  network?

 Most deployments of Trove that I am familiar with set up a separate
 RabbitMQ server in cloud that is used by Trove. It is not recommended to
 use the same infrastructure RabbitMQ server for Trove for security
 reasons. Also most deployments of Trove set up a private (neutron)
 network that the RabbitMQ server and guests are connected to, and all
 RPC messages are sent over this network.

 This sounds like a great chunk of information to potentially go into
 deployer docs.



I'd like to +1 this.

It is misleading that the standard documentation (and the devstack 
setup) describes a configuration that is unsafe/unwise to use in 
production. This is surely unusual to say the least! Normally when test 
or dev setups use unsafe configurations the relevant docs clearly state 
this - and describe how it should actually be done.

In addition the fact that several extended question threads were 
required to extract this vital information is ...disappointing, and does 

not display the right spirit for an open source project in my opinion!


i really want to vote to put trove back into stackforge for it can not give an 
clear deployment,
 and it is always avoiding problem, not to face it. The service vm need get 
connect through the management should 
talk about a lot. 





Regards

Mark




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Re: [openstack-dev] [all] who is the ptl of trove?

2015-05-11 Thread Mark Kirkwood

On 09/05/15 02:28, Monty Taylor wrote:

On 05/08/2015 03:45 AM, Nikhil Manchanda wrote:


Comments and answers inline.

Li Tianqing writes:


[...]



1) why we put the trove vm into user's tenant, not the trove's
tenant? User can login on that vm, and that vm must connect to
rabbitmq. It is quite insecure.
what's about put the tenant into trove tenant?


While the default configuration of Trove in devstack puts Trove guest
VMs into the users' respective tenants, it's possible to configure Trove
to create VMs in a single Trove tenant. You would do this by
overriding the default novaclient class in Trove's remote.py with one
that creates all Trove VMs in a particular tenant whose user credentials
you will need to supply. In fact, most production instances of Trove do
something like this.


Might I suggest that if this is how people regularly deploy, that such a
class be included in trove proper, and that a config option be provided
like use_tenant='name_of_tenant_to_use' that would trigger the use of
the overridden novaclient class?

I think asking an operator as a standard practice to override code in
remote.py is a bad pattern.


2) Why there is no trove mgmt cli, but mgmt api is in the code?
Does it disappear forever ?


The reason for this is because the old legacy Trove client was rewritten
to be in line with the rest of the openstack clients. The new client
has bindings for the management API, but we didn't complete the work on
writing the shell pieces for it. There is currently an effort to
support Trove calls in the openstackclient, and we're looking to
support the management client calls as part of this as well. If this is
something that you're passionate about, we sure could use help landing
this in Liberty.


3)  The trove-guest-agent is in vm. it is connected by taskmanager
by rabbitmq. We designed it. But is there some prectise to do this?
 how to make the vm be connected in vm-network and management
 network?


Most deployments of Trove that I am familiar with set up a separate
RabbitMQ server in cloud that is used by Trove. It is not recommended to
use the same infrastructure RabbitMQ server for Trove for security
reasons. Also most deployments of Trove set up a private (neutron)
network that the RabbitMQ server and guests are connected to, and all
RPC messages are sent over this network.


This sounds like a great chunk of information to potentially go into
deployer docs.




I'd like to +1 this.

It is misleading that the standard documentation (and the devstack 
setup) describes a configuration that is unsafe/unwise to use in 
production. This is surely unusual to say the least! Normally when test 
or dev setups use unsafe configurations the relevant docs clearly state 
this - and describe how it should actually be done.


In addition the fact that several extended question threads were 
required to extract this vital information is ...disappointing, and does 
not display the right spirit for an open source project in my opinion!


Regards

Mark




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Re: [openstack-dev] [all] who is the ptl of trove?

2015-05-11 Thread Flavio Percoco

On 11/05/15 16:32 +0800, Li Tianqing wrote:






--
Best
   Li Tianqing



At 2015-05-11 16:04:07, Mark Kirkwood mark.kirkw...@catalyst.net.nz wrote:

On 09/05/15 02:28, Monty Taylor wrote:

On 05/08/2015 03:45 AM, Nikhil Manchanda wrote:


Comments and answers inline.

Li Tianqing writes:


[...]



1) why we put the trove vm into user's tenant, not the trove's
tenant? User can login on that vm, and that vm must connect to
rabbitmq. It is quite insecure.
what's about put the tenant into trove tenant?


While the default configuration of Trove in devstack puts Trove guest
VMs into the users' respective tenants, it's possible to configure Trove
to create VMs in a single Trove tenant. You would do this by
overriding the default novaclient class in Trove's remote.py with one
that creates all Trove VMs in a particular tenant whose user credentials
you will need to supply. In fact, most production instances of Trove do
something like this.


Might I suggest that if this is how people regularly deploy, that such a
class be included in trove proper, and that a config option be provided
like use_tenant='name_of_tenant_to_use' that would trigger the use of
the overridden novaclient class?

I think asking an operator as a standard practice to override code in
remote.py is a bad pattern.


2) Why there is no trove mgmt cli, but mgmt api is in the code?
Does it disappear forever ?


The reason for this is because the old legacy Trove client was rewritten
to be in line with the rest of the openstack clients. The new client
has bindings for the management API, but we didn't complete the work on
writing the shell pieces for it. There is currently an effort to
support Trove calls in the openstackclient, and we're looking to
support the management client calls as part of this as well. If this is
something that you're passionate about, we sure could use help landing
this in Liberty.


3)  The trove-guest-agent is in vm. it is connected by taskmanager
by rabbitmq. We designed it. But is there some prectise to do this?
 how to make the vm be connected in vm-network and management
 network?


Most deployments of Trove that I am familiar with set up a separate
RabbitMQ server in cloud that is used by Trove. It is not recommended to
use the same infrastructure RabbitMQ server for Trove for security
reasons. Also most deployments of Trove set up a private (neutron)
network that the RabbitMQ server and guests are connected to, and all
RPC messages are sent over this network.


This sounds like a great chunk of information to potentially go into
deployer docs.




I'd like to +1 this.

It is misleading that the standard documentation (and the devstack
setup) describes a configuration that is unsafe/unwise to use in
production. This is surely unusual to say the least! Normally when test
or dev setups use unsafe configurations the relevant docs clearly state
this - and describe how it should actually be done.

In addition the fact that several extended question threads were
required to extract this vital information is ...disappointing, and does
not display the right spirit for an open source project in my opinion!


While I agree with this last paragraph


i really want to vote to put trove back into stackforge for it can not give an 
clear deployment,


... I must point out this is *NOT* the way this community (OpenStack)
works.

This mailing list exists to discuss things in the open, make sure we
can have wide and constructive discussions to make things like the ones
discussed in this thread come out so that they can be improved,
documented and made public for the sake of usability, operation and
adoption.


and it is always avoiding problem, not to face it. The service vm need get 
connect through the management should
talk about a lot.


It's now on Trove team's - or other people's - hands to help
find/implement a better solution for the problem pointed out in this
thread and make the product better.

Let's collaborate,
Flavio






Regards

Mark




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Flavio Percoco


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Re: [openstack-dev] [all] who is the ptl of trove?

2015-05-08 Thread Nikhil Manchanda

Comments and answers inline.

Li Tianqing writes:

 [...]

1) why we put the trove vm into user's tenant, not the trove's
tenant? User can login on that vm, and that vm must connect to
rabbitmq. It is quite insecure.
what's about put the tenant into trove tenant?

While the default configuration of Trove in devstack puts Trove guest
VMs into the users' respective tenants, it's possible to configure Trove
to create VMs in a single Trove tenant. You would do this by
overriding the default novaclient class in Trove's remote.py with one
that creates all Trove VMs in a particular tenant whose user credentials
you will need to supply. In fact, most production instances of Trove do
something like this.

2) Why there is no trove mgmt cli, but mgmt api is in the code?
Does it disappear forever ?

The reason for this is because the old legacy Trove client was rewritten
to be in line with the rest of the openstack clients. The new client
has bindings for the management API, but we didn't complete the work on
writing the shell pieces for it. There is currently an effort to
support Trove calls in the openstackclient, and we're looking to
support the management client calls as part of this as well. If this is
something that you're passionate about, we sure could use help landing
this in Liberty.

3)  The trove-guest-agent is in vm. it is connected by taskmanager
by rabbitmq. We designed it. But is there some prectise to do this?
 how to make the vm be connected in vm-network and management
 network?

Most deployments of Trove that I am familiar with set up a separate
RabbitMQ server in cloud that is used by Trove. It is not recommended to
use the same infrastructure RabbitMQ server for Trove for security
reasons. Also most deployments of Trove set up a private (neutron)
network that the RabbitMQ server and guests are connected to, and all
RPC messages are sent over this network.

Hope this helps,

Thanks,
Nikhil

 [...]

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Re: [openstack-dev] [all] who is the ptl of trove?

2015-05-08 Thread Li Tianqing






--

Best
Li Tianqing



At 2015-05-08 15:45:27, Nikhil Manchanda nik...@manchanda.me wrote:

Comments and answers inline.

Li Tianqing writes:

 [...]

1) why we put the trove vm into user's tenant, not the trove's
tenant? User can login on that vm, and that vm must connect to
rabbitmq. It is quite insecure.
what's about put the tenant into trove tenant?

While the default configuration of Trove in devstack puts Trove guest
VMs into the users' respective tenants, it's possible to configure Trove
to create VMs in a single Trove tenant. You would do this by
overriding the default novaclient class in Trove's remote.py with one
that creates all Trove VMs in a particular tenant whose user credentials
you will need to supply. In fact, most production instances of Trove do

something like this.


I argue that why we do not do this in upstream.  For that most production do 
this. And if you do this
you will find that there are many work need do. The community applies the 
laziest implementation.



2) Why there is no trove mgmt cli, but mgmt api is in the code?
Does it disappear forever ?

The reason for this is because the old legacy Trove client was rewritten
to be in line with the rest of the openstack clients. The new client
has bindings for the management API, but we didn't complete the work on
writing the shell pieces for it. There is currently an effort to
support Trove calls in the openstackclient, and we're looking to
support the management client calls as part of this as well. If this is
something that you're passionate about, we sure could use help landing

this in Liberty.


i do not see any bp about this.



3)  The trove-guest-agent is in vm. it is connected by taskmanager
by rabbitmq. We designed it. But is there some prectise to do this?
 how to make the vm be connected in vm-network and management
 network?

Most deployments of Trove that I am familiar with set up a separate
RabbitMQ server in cloud that is used by Trove. It is not recommended to
use the same infrastructure RabbitMQ server for Trove for security
reasons. Also most deployments of Trove set up a private (neutron)
network that the RabbitMQ server and guests are connected to, and all

RPC messages are sent over this network.


But how the billing notifications of trove send to billing server? the billing 
server is definitely in management network.
The root of this problem is that you should make one service vm that can 
service user and can be connected in you management network.
This deployment can not be used in production. 
This deployment is not proper, it just an lazy implementation too.



Hope this helps,

Thanks,
Nikhil

 [...]

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Re: [openstack-dev] [all] who is the ptl of trove?

2015-05-08 Thread Monty Taylor
On 05/08/2015 03:45 AM, Nikhil Manchanda wrote:
 
 Comments and answers inline.
 
 Li Tianqing writes:
 
 [...]
 
1) why we put the trove vm into user's tenant, not the trove's
tenant? User can login on that vm, and that vm must connect to
rabbitmq. It is quite insecure.
what's about put the tenant into trove tenant?
 
 While the default configuration of Trove in devstack puts Trove guest
 VMs into the users' respective tenants, it's possible to configure Trove
 to create VMs in a single Trove tenant. You would do this by
 overriding the default novaclient class in Trove's remote.py with one
 that creates all Trove VMs in a particular tenant whose user credentials
 you will need to supply. In fact, most production instances of Trove do
 something like this.

Might I suggest that if this is how people regularly deploy, that such a
class be included in trove proper, and that a config option be provided
like use_tenant='name_of_tenant_to_use' that would trigger the use of
the overridden novaclient class?

I think asking an operator as a standard practice to override code in
remote.py is a bad pattern.

2) Why there is no trove mgmt cli, but mgmt api is in the code?
Does it disappear forever ?
 
 The reason for this is because the old legacy Trove client was rewritten
 to be in line with the rest of the openstack clients. The new client
 has bindings for the management API, but we didn't complete the work on
 writing the shell pieces for it. There is currently an effort to
 support Trove calls in the openstackclient, and we're looking to
 support the management client calls as part of this as well. If this is
 something that you're passionate about, we sure could use help landing
 this in Liberty.
 
3)  The trove-guest-agent is in vm. it is connected by taskmanager
by rabbitmq. We designed it. But is there some prectise to do this?
 how to make the vm be connected in vm-network and management
 network?
 
 Most deployments of Trove that I am familiar with set up a separate
 RabbitMQ server in cloud that is used by Trove. It is not recommended to
 use the same infrastructure RabbitMQ server for Trove for security
 reasons. Also most deployments of Trove set up a private (neutron)
 network that the RabbitMQ server and guests are connected to, and all
 RPC messages are sent over this network.

This sounds like a great chunk of information to potentially go into
deployer docs.


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Re: [openstack-dev] [all] who is the ptl of trove?

2015-05-08 Thread Jeremy Stanley
On 2015-05-08 18:54:25 +0800 (+0800), Li Tianqing wrote:
[...]
 I argue that why we do not do this in upstream. For that most
 production do this.

Where? Do you mean recording these recommendations in deployment
documentation? Or setting it up that way in our integration tests?

 And if you do this you will find that there are many work need do.
 The community applies the laziest implementation.
[...]

It sounds like the community (in this case the operators deploying
and running Trove in production on large scales at various OpenStack
Foundation member companies) have this working. Or by the
community do you mean something else entirely? Perhaps DevStack?
That's not _meant_ to be a production deployment, just a means of
getting the service started as simply as possible so as to be able
to test patches for it.
-- 
Jeremy Stanley

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Re: [openstack-dev] [all] who is the ptl of trove?

2015-05-07 Thread Li Tianqing
sorry, I thought he was not.
i can not connect on him though those three emails. PTL can be long time be not 
connected?
Email: slick...@gmail.com 
 nikhil.mancha...@hp.com 
 nik...@manchanda.me





 



--

Best
Li Tianqing

At 2015-05-08 10:34:36, James Polley j...@jamezpolley.com wrote:

A quick google for Openstack projects pointed me at 
https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Project_Teams, which has a link to the 
complete, up-to-date list of projects at 
http://governance.openstack.org/reference/projects/index.html, which pointed me 
to http://governance.openstack.org/reference/projects/trove.html, which tells 
me that the PTL is Nikhil Manchanda (SlickNik)


On Fri, May 8, 2015 at 12:26 PM, Li Tianqing jaze...@163.com wrote:

Hello,
 Who is the ptl of trove? 





--

Best
Li Tianqing



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Re: [openstack-dev] [all] who is the ptl of trove?

2015-05-07 Thread Nikhil Manchanda
Hi Li:

Thanks for contacting me about Trove. I'm still the PTL for Trove for
the Liberty cycle.

Looking at my inbox. I see that I have an email from you from late May
5th. Because of the volume of emails I get in my inbox, please
understand that it might sometimes take me 2-3 days to respond to all
non-urgent questions about trove. In fact, I'd recommend that you send
any Trove related questions out to the OpenStack development mailing
list (this one). There are more Trove related folks on this list, and
there is a better chance of getting a quicker reply for queries
sent out to the mailing list.

Hope this helps,

Thanks,
Nikhil


On Thu, May 7, 2015 at 7:47 PM, Li Tianqing jaze...@163.com wrote:

 Thanks a lot


 --
 Best
 Li Tianqing

 At 2015-05-08 10:33:52, Steve Martinelli steve...@ca.ibm.com wrote:

 That information can be found here:
 http://governance.openstack.org/reference/projects/trove.html
 And a full list here:
 http://governance.openstack.org/reference/projects/index.html


 Thanks,

 Steve Martinelli
 OpenStack Keystone Core



 From:Li Tianqing jaze...@163.com
 To:openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org 
 openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org
 Date:05/07/2015 10:31 PM
 Subject:[openstack-dev] [all] who is the ptl of trove?
 --



 Hello,
  Who is the ptl of trove?




 --
 Best
 Li Tianqing

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 Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe
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On Thu, May 7, 2015 at 7:47 PM, Li Tianqing jaze...@163.com wrote:

 Thanks a lot


 --
 Best
 Li Tianqing

 At 2015-05-08 10:33:52, Steve Martinelli steve...@ca.ibm.com wrote:

 That information can be found here:
 http://governance.openstack.org/reference/projects/trove.html
 And a full list here:
 http://governance.openstack.org/reference/projects/index.html


 Thanks,

 Steve Martinelli
 OpenStack Keystone Core



 From:Li Tianqing jaze...@163.com
 To:openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org 
 openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org
 Date:05/07/2015 10:31 PM
 Subject:[openstack-dev] [all] who is the ptl of trove?
 --



 Hello,
  Who is the ptl of trove?




 --
 Best
 Li Tianqing

 __
 OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)
 Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe
 http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev




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 Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe
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