Re: [openstack-dev] [nova] Should we add instance action event to live migration?
On 06/11/15 at 06:54pm, Ian Wells wrote: On 11 June 2015 at 12:37, Richard Raseley rich...@raseley.com wrote: Andrew Laski wrote: There are many reasons a deployer may want to live-migrate instances around: capacity planning, security patching, noisy neighbors, host maintenance, etc... and I just don't think the user needs to know or care that it has taken place. They might care, insofar as live migrations will often cause performance degradation from a users perspective. Seconded. If your app manager is warned that you're going to be live migrating it can do something about the capacity drop. I can imagine cases where a migrating VM would be brutally murdered [1] and replaced because it's not delivering sufficient performance. To be clear I see instance-action reporting more as a log of what has previously happened to an instance, not a report of what's currently happening. A live migration still has task_state changes to make it visible to a user. My view is that in a cloud environment it shouldn't matter which host you're on, as long as it meets the scheduling constraints required, so a no-downtime movement between them is not an important event for a user. But that does ignore the performance drop-off that may be noticed by a user, so there are reasons to expose that information. I'm just in favor of making it optional, not hiding it in general. -- Ian. [1] See nova help brutally-murder __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] [nova] Should we add instance action event to live migration?
Le 12/06/2015 15:27, Matt Van Winkle a écrit : On 6/12/15 7:46 AM, Andrew Laski and...@lascii.com wrote: On 06/11/15 at 06:54pm, Ian Wells wrote: On 11 June 2015 at 12:37, Richard Raseley rich...@raseley.com wrote: Andrew Laski wrote: There are many reasons a deployer may want to live-migrate instances around: capacity planning, security patching, noisy neighbors, host maintenance, etc... and I just don't think the user needs to know or care that it has taken place. They might care, insofar as live migrations will often cause performance degradation from a users perspective. Seconded. If your app manager is warned that you're going to be live migrating it can do something about the capacity drop. I can imagine cases where a migrating VM would be brutally murdered [1] and replaced because it's not delivering sufficient performance. To be clear I see instance-action reporting more as a log of what has previously happened to an instance, not a report of what's currently happening. A live migration still has task_state changes to make it visible to a user. My view is that in a cloud environment it shouldn't matter which host you're on, as long as it meets the scheduling constraints required, so a no-downtime movement between them is not an important event for a user. But that does ignore the performance drop-off that may be noticed by a user, so there are reasons to expose that information. I'm just in favor of making it optional, not hiding it in general. Completely agree with all your points, Andrew. As someone who's starting to live migrate more and more tenants, this is exactly the approach that would be useful for me. Well, since live-migrate is having RBAC, why not considering that listing live migrations should also be something RBAC'd ? I mean, if the policy allows the user to live-migrate, then the API should provide the list of live migrations. If that's not the case, then the API should just drop the related lines. -Sylvain Thanks! Matt -- Ian. [1] See nova help brutally-murder _ _ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] [nova] Should we add instance action event to live migration?
On 6/12/15 7:46 AM, Andrew Laski and...@lascii.com wrote: On 06/11/15 at 06:54pm, Ian Wells wrote: On 11 June 2015 at 12:37, Richard Raseley rich...@raseley.com wrote: Andrew Laski wrote: There are many reasons a deployer may want to live-migrate instances around: capacity planning, security patching, noisy neighbors, host maintenance, etc... and I just don't think the user needs to know or care that it has taken place. They might care, insofar as live migrations will often cause performance degradation from a users perspective. Seconded. If your app manager is warned that you're going to be live migrating it can do something about the capacity drop. I can imagine cases where a migrating VM would be brutally murdered [1] and replaced because it's not delivering sufficient performance. To be clear I see instance-action reporting more as a log of what has previously happened to an instance, not a report of what's currently happening. A live migration still has task_state changes to make it visible to a user. My view is that in a cloud environment it shouldn't matter which host you're on, as long as it meets the scheduling constraints required, so a no-downtime movement between them is not an important event for a user. But that does ignore the performance drop-off that may be noticed by a user, so there are reasons to expose that information. I'm just in favor of making it optional, not hiding it in general. Completely agree with all your points, Andrew. As someone who's starting to live migrate more and more tenants, this is exactly the approach that would be useful for me. Thanks! Matt -- Ian. [1] See nova help brutally-murder _ _ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] [nova] Should we add instance action event to live migration?
On 11 June 2015 at 12:37, Richard Raseley rich...@raseley.com wrote: Andrew Laski wrote: There are many reasons a deployer may want to live-migrate instances around: capacity planning, security patching, noisy neighbors, host maintenance, etc... and I just don't think the user needs to know or care that it has taken place. They might care, insofar as live migrations will often cause performance degradation from a users perspective. Seconded. If your app manager is warned that you're going to be live migrating it can do something about the capacity drop. I can imagine cases where a migrating VM would be brutally murdered [1] and replaced because it's not delivering sufficient performance. -- Ian. [1] See nova help brutally-murder __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] [nova] Should we add instance action event to live migration?
On 06/03/2015 04:39 AM, Rui Chen wrote: Hi all: We have the instance action and action event for most of the instance operations, exclude: live-migration. In the current master code, when we do live-migration, the instance action is recorded, but the action event for live-migration is lost. I'm not sure that it's a bug or design behavior, so I want to get more feedback in mail list. Seems like that would be a bug. I found the patch https://review.openstack.org/#/c/95440/ It's add the live migration action, but no event. It looks weird. I think there are two improvement we can do [1]: add the live migration event, keep consistence with other instance operations. ++ [2]: remove the live migration action in order to make the operation transparent to end-users, like Andrew say in the patch comments. I guess I'm confused why we would want to make the operation transparent to end-users? Andrew, what was your thought on that? Best, -jay __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] [nova] Should we add instance action event to live migration?
On 06/11/15 at 02:47pm, Jay Pipes wrote: On 06/03/2015 04:39 AM, Rui Chen wrote: Hi all: We have the instance action and action event for most of the instance operations, exclude: live-migration. In the current master code, when we do live-migration, the instance action is recorded, but the action event for live-migration is lost. I'm not sure that it's a bug or design behavior, so I want to get more feedback in mail list. Seems like that would be a bug. I found the patch https://review.openstack.org/#/c/95440/ It's add the live migration action, but no event. It looks weird. I think there are two improvement we can do [1]: add the live migration event, keep consistence with other instance operations. ++ [2]: remove the live migration action in order to make the operation transparent to end-users, like Andrew say in the patch comments. I guess I'm confused why we would want to make the operation transparent to end-users? Andrew, what was your thought on that? Just that it's something the user shouldn't need to care about. A live-migration is not a user initiated event, though I suppose it could be in some deployments, and the end result is that the instance is running on another host with no other appreciable change. There are many reasons a deployer may want to live-migrate instances around: capacity planning, security patching, noisy neighbors, host maintenance, etc... and I just don't think the user needs to know or care that it has taken place. I'm not against exposing it, but I do think that some operators will want the option to live-migrate without informing their users. Best, -jay __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] [nova] Should we add instance action event to live migration?
Andrew Laski wrote: There are many reasons a deployer may want to live-migrate instances around: capacity planning, security patching, noisy neighbors, host maintenance, etc... and I just don't think the user needs to know or care that it has taken place. They might care, insofar as live migrations will often cause performance degradation from a users perspective. Having this information easily available might reduce the mean time to diagnose a performance issue caused by such a migration. Regards, Richard __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
[openstack-dev] [nova] Should we add instance action event to live migration?
Hi all: We have the instance action and action event for most of the instance operations, exclude: live-migration. In the current master code, when we do live-migration, the instance action is recorded, but the action event for live-migration is lost. I'm not sure that it's a bug or design behavior, so I want to get more feedback in mail list. I found the patch https://review.openstack.org/#/c/95440/ It's add the live migration action, but no event. It looks weird. I think there are two improvement we can do [1]: add the live migration event, keep consistence with other instance operations. [2]: remove the live migration action in order to make the operation transparent to end-users, like Andrew say in the patch comments. Which way you like? please let me know, thanks. __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
Re: [openstack-dev] [nova] Should we add instance action event to live migration?
+1 for the point that the live mirgration should be transparent to *end users* On Wed, Jun 3, 2015 at 4:43 PM Rui Chen chenrui.m...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all: We have the instance action and action event for most of the instance operations, exclude: live-migration. In the current master code, when we do live-migration, the instance action is recorded, but the action event for live-migration is lost. I'm not sure that it's a bug or design behavior, so I want to get more feedback in mail list. I found the patch https://review.openstack.org/#/c/95440/ It's add the live migration action, but no event. It looks weird. I think there are two improvement we can do [1]: add the live migration event, keep consistence with other instance operations. [2]: remove the live migration action in order to make the operation transparent to end-users, like Andrew say in the patch comments. Which way you like? please let me know, thanks. __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev __ OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) Unsubscribe: openstack-dev-requ...@lists.openstack.org?subject:unsubscribe http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev
