RE: AW: Cannot delete datafile from O/S -- Help !!
My workaround is to offline the tablespace first; seems to work and havent experienced any issues - but then maybe I'm just lucky. ;-) -Original Message- Sent: 07 March 2003 15:54 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Though this is how it works on NT, I was pleasantly surprised the other day when I was able to delete the files from a tablespace that had just been dropped on Win2k. Jared On Friday 07 March 2003 04:53, Stefan Jahnke wrote: Hi Khanna(?) Happens alot. Windows still holds a handle to the file. Just wait 'till next scheduled reboot (shouldn't be too long;). Regards, Stefan Stefan Jahnke Consultant BOV Aktiengesellschaft Voice: +49 201 - 4513-298 Fax: +49 201 - 4513-149 mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please remove nospam to contact me via email. visit our website: http://www.bov.de subscribe to our newsletter: http://www.bov.de/presse/newsletter.asp Sicherheitsluecken mit IT-Security-Konzepten von BOV effizient schliessen! Weitere Informationen unter +49 201/45 13-240 oder E-Mail an mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Wie Sie wissen, koennen ueber das Internet versandte E-Mails leicht unter fremden Namen erstellt oder manipuliert werden. Aus diesem Grunde bitten wir um Verstaendnis dafuer, dass wir zu Ihrem und unserem Schutz die rechtliche Verbindlichkeit der vorstehenden Erklaerungen und Aeusserungen ausschliessen. As you are probably aware, e-mails sent via the Internet can easily be copied or manipulated by third parties. For this reason we would ask for your understanding that, for your own protection and ours, we must decline all legal responsibility for the validity of the statements and comments given above. -Ursprungliche Nachricht- Von: Prem Khanna J [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Gesendet: Freitag, 7. Marz 2003 11:54 An: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Betreff: Cannot delete datafile from O/S -- Help !! Guys, SQL drop tablespace DATA14 including contents; Tablespace dropped. the name of the datafile in DATA14 tablespace is DATA141.DBF SQLselect * from v$tablespace where name = 'DATA14'; no rows selected SQLselect * from v$tdatafile where name = 'DATA14.DBF'; no rows selected when i try to delete the file DATA14.DBF from o/s , it says : Cannot delete DATA14. There has been a sharing violation.The source or destination file may be in use. why is it so ? how can i delete the file from O/S ? can someone help me ? the ENV is 8.1.6 / win2k. TIA. Jp. -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Jared Still INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Turner, Adrian A SITI-ITPSIE INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
Re: nt script
You might want to look at VBScript, it is easy to learn and can be executed
on any Win platform.
- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 2:48 PM
One bump you might encounter is some of the more useful NT shell commands
are only available from the NT resource kit.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/07/03 01:09PM
C:\ HELP
and
C:\ HELP FOR
In there you'll find a note that the context variable should have
'%%' instead of '%' in front of it when running in a bat file.
You were using the bat file syntax from a command linewon't
work. The opposite is also true...ask me how I know =8-)
Jeff Herrick
On Fri, 7 Mar 2003, Jacques Kilchoer wrote:
Can anyone recommend a book / website on the DOS batch file language? I
usually try to install cygwin and write shell scripts but some of our
database servers don't have cygwin.
For example, I have no idea what this statement does:
FOR /F TOKENS=1,2* %%A IN ('DATE/T') DO SET DATE=%%B
and when I tried it I received an error
H:\FOR /F TOKENS=1,2* %%A IN ('DATE/T') DO SET DATE=%%B
%%A was unexpected at this time.
-Original Message-
From: Jose Luis Delgado [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
I'll try to help you between lines...
i.e. I'll write the corresponding CMD line for your
script.
Regards!
JL
in a .CMD file:
echo Sending mail!!!
echo Sending mail!!!
dt=$(date '+%H%M_%m%d%y')
FOR /F TOKENS=1,2* %%A IN ('DATE/T') DO SET DATE=%%B
export ORACLE_SID=FMRPT
SET ORACLE_SID=FMRPT
sqlplus / EOF! sqllog
in a file: say a.sql put the code of your query and
type:
sqlplus user/[EMAIL PROTECTED] a.sql sqllog.log
set heading off
SELECT 'FMRPT PSNTRP02 SCHEDULER DOWN' FROM DUAL
WHERE EXISTS (SELECT 'X' FROM PSSERVERSTAT
...
...
cat sqllog |egrep 'DOWN' errfilelog
type sqllog.log | findstr 'DOWN' errfilelog.log
cat sqllog | egrep -q 'DOWN'
I apologize for the previous line, I could not find a
-q parameter of the egrep command, in my OS.
anyway... 'guessing'
type sqllog | findstr -look the apropiate cmd 'DOWN'
if [ $? -eq 0 ] # found at least one
if errorlevel 1 your_mail_program_here
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RE: Oracle position on hints
Given the attitude of most dba's that you should always use bind variables where possible I can't see how you'd cope with skewed data without them. Most developers should know a databases's data better than the optimiser and certainly when building queries it's always worthwhile seeing where data is being most effectively filtered. There are lots of mature systems out there where the data characteristics are unlikely to change much and for most in-house developers you're never going to have to think about portability but always about performance. Iain Nicoll -Original Message- Sent: 07 March 2003 16:04 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi, Does Oracle have an official position on hints ? Will they go away as the optimiser is becoming bettre or they are there to stay ? TIA Stephane Paquette Administrateur de bases de donnees Database Administrator Standard Life www.standardlife.ca Tél. (514) 925-7187 [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Nicoll, Iain INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Oracle on a SAN.... Good, Bad or Proceed with caution?
-Original Message- Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 4:44 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L NetApp SAN? My understanding of NetApps was that is strictly NAS: Network Attached Storage. Basically, JBOD with NIC. SAN's offer quite a few more management and configuration options than NAS. Jared There is a lot more to NetApp's Filer than JBOD with a NIC. We looked at both - SAN and NAS as done by NetApp one year later we're sold on NetApp. NetApp has all of the management/DR features we'll need, and some of the NetApp specific features have saved our collective tails on a few occasions. YMMV, but for an organization that's our size, SAN was overkill. brian -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Brian Dunbar INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Oracle position on hints
Stephane I don't see how Oracle could ever have an official position on hints. If they say hints are going away, many developers panic. If they say hints are great, then Oracle competitors will claim Oracle has a bad optimizer. A key political issue in some shops is Using hints makes our code Oracle-specific. My reply is that hints are only comments that another database will ignore. Dennis Williams DBA, 40%OCP, 100% DBA Lifetouch, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 12:19 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi, I have to write a SQL and PL/SQL guide for our developpers. Some are good but most of them can use help. I'm not a big fan of hints except for insert append, I used them only if I really need to. In last october I went to a 3 days DB2 UDB course, unless I miss something there are no hint with DB2 UDB. So I was thinking that when the Oracle optimiser would be more mature maybe hints would go away. I just want to know what is Oracle direction with hints. TIA Stephane -Original Message- Robert - IL Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 12:01 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L This is facinating, where does this come from? This is the second time in a week that I've heard this statement being made by someone. Hints will never go away IMHO, and Oracle continues to add more and more of them. I was told by someone at a client site that they were told by an Oracle instructor that they should not use hints in 9i RF -Original Message- To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Sent: 3/7/2003 10:04 AM Hi, Does Oracle have an official position on hints ? Will they go away as the optimiser is becoming bettre or they are there to stay ? TIA Stephane Paquette Administrateur de bases de donnees Database Administrator Standard Life www.standardlife.ca Tél. (514) 925-7187 [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Freeman Robert - IL INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Stephane Paquette INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: DENNIS WILLIAMS INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Who Owns Unix?
I think the underlying issue is Linux. The SCO people are seeing their licensing fees slip away to the free Linux. As far as I've seen, every major vendor has a Linux strategy. This is SCO's effort to strike back, discourage defections. I think it is pretty dumb. We have been on DEC/Compaq/HP Tru64, which started out as OSF (Open Software Foundation) Unix. When we visit vendor booths, we ask if they've ported to Unix. They say sure. We ask about Tru64 and they just shake their heads. I was hoping Linux would help this issue, but I guess the underlying problem is binary incompatibility, and each vendor will still have to offer a separate binary for each hardware platform. Dennis Williams DBA, 40%OCP, 100% DBA Lifetouch, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 2:44 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Per the below link, SCO owns Unix and they're suing IBM for a paltry $1Billion: http://www.infoworld.com/article/03/03/06/HNsco_1.html http://www.infoworld.com/article/03/03/06/HNsco_1.html How can this be? -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: DENNIS WILLIAMS INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Oracle position on hints
It's like the Auto-pilot -Original Message- To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Sent: 3/8/03 2:13 PM Stephane I don't see how Oracle could ever have an official position on hints. If they say hints are going away, many developers panic. If they say hints are great, then Oracle competitors will claim Oracle has a bad optimizer. A key political issue in some shops is Using hints makes our code Oracle-specific. My reply is that hints are only comments that another database will ignore. Dennis Williams DBA, 40%OCP, 100% DBA Lifetouch, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 12:19 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi, I have to write a SQL and PL/SQL guide for our developpers. Some are good but most of them can use help. I'm not a big fan of hints except for insert append, I used them only if I really need to. In last october I went to a 3 days DB2 UDB course, unless I miss something there are no hint with DB2 UDB. So I was thinking that when the Oracle optimiser would be more mature maybe hints would go away. I just want to know what is Oracle direction with hints. TIA Stephane -Original Message- Robert - IL Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 12:01 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L This is facinating, where does this come from? This is the second time in a week that I've heard this statement being made by someone. Hints will never go away IMHO, and Oracle continues to add more and more of them. I was told by someone at a client site that they were told by an Oracle instructor that they should not use hints in 9i RF -Original Message- To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Sent: 3/7/2003 10:04 AM Hi, Does Oracle have an official position on hints ? Will they go away as the optimiser is becoming bettre or they are there to stay ? TIA Stephane Paquette Administrateur de bases de donnees Database Administrator Standard Life www.standardlife.ca Tél. (514) 925-7187 [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Freeman Robert - IL INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Stephane Paquette INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: DENNIS WILLIAMS INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Khedr, Waleed INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
RE: Oracle position on hints
Just to add my meaningless diatribe to the discussion, I think that there are good hints and bad hints. For example, first_rows(n) is a good hint, in that you are giving the optimizer more information as to what your motivations are for this query, without stifling it into a choice that may not be appropriate down the track. Hints such as index(tab,idx) are bad hints, because you are more exposed to grief. If the index is renamed, then its no longer a hint. If the data distribution changes, or the index is rebuilt in reverse or compressed, then it may no longer be a good option, etc. In terms of the vendor speak of hints imply weak optimizer I think thats nonsense. Having worked with DB2 in the past, nothing used to be more irritating then coming up with bizarre convolutions on an otherwise simple SQL to ensure that certain indexes were or were not chosen. Cheers Connor PS - Its probably a little sad that I'm chit-chatting on hints on the morning of my wedding day, but hey, you gotta pass the time somehow whilst the other half is getting the hair and makeup done :-) --- Khedr, Waleed [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's like the Auto-pilot -Original Message- To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Sent: 3/8/03 2:13 PM Stephane I don't see how Oracle could ever have an official position on hints. If they say hints are going away, many developers panic. If they say hints are great, then Oracle competitors will claim Oracle has a bad optimizer. A key political issue in some shops is Using hints makes our code Oracle-specific. My reply is that hints are only comments that another database will ignore. Dennis Williams DBA, 40%OCP, 100% DBA Lifetouch, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 12:19 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi, I have to write a SQL and PL/SQL guide for our developpers. Some are good but most of them can use help. I'm not a big fan of hints except for insert append, I used them only if I really need to. In last october I went to a 3 days DB2 UDB course, unless I miss something there are no hint with DB2 UDB. So I was thinking that when the Oracle optimiser would be more mature maybe hints would go away. I just want to know what is Oracle direction with hints. TIA Stephane -Original Message- Robert - IL Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 12:01 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L This is facinating, where does this come from? This is the second time in a week that I've heard this statement being made by someone. Hints will never go away IMHO, and Oracle continues to add more and more of them. I was told by someone at a client site that they were told by an Oracle instructor that they should not use hints in 9i RF -Original Message- To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Sent: 3/7/2003 10:04 AM Hi, Does Oracle have an official position on hints ? Will they go away as the optimiser is becoming bettre or they are there to stay ? TIA Stephane Paquette Administrateur de bases de donnees Database Administrator Standard Life www.standardlife.ca Tél. (514) 925-7187 [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Freeman Robert - IL INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Stephane Paquette INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: DENNIS WILLIAMS INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services
RE: Oracle position on hints
Connor, what can we say? You have gotta getta life! Well, since you're getting a wife instead, that should take care of that anyway. Best wishes to you and Gillian, hope the day is all you want it to be. Pete Controlling developers is like herding cats. Kevin Loney, Oracle DBA Handbook Oh no, it's not. It's much harder than that! Bruce Pihlamae, long-term Oracle DBA -Original Message- McDonald Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 5:54 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Just to add my meaningless diatribe to the discussion, I think that there are good hints and bad hints. For example, first_rows(n) is a good hint, in that you are giving the optimizer more information as to what your motivations are for this query, without stifling it into a choice that may not be appropriate down the track. Hints such as index(tab,idx) are bad hints, because you are more exposed to grief. If the index is renamed, then its no longer a hint. If the data distribution changes, or the index is rebuilt in reverse or compressed, then it may no longer be a good option, etc. In terms of the vendor speak of hints imply weak optimizer I think thats nonsense. Having worked with DB2 in the past, nothing used to be more irritating then coming up with bizarre convolutions on an otherwise simple SQL to ensure that certain indexes were or were not chosen. Cheers Connor PS - Its probably a little sad that I'm chit-chatting on hints on the morning of my wedding day, but hey, you gotta pass the time somehow whilst the other half is getting the hair and makeup done :-) --- Khedr, Waleed [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's like the Auto-pilot -Original Message- To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Sent: 3/8/03 2:13 PM Stephane I don't see how Oracle could ever have an official position on hints. If they say hints are going away, many developers panic. If they say hints are great, then Oracle competitors will claim Oracle has a bad optimizer. A key political issue in some shops is Using hints makes our code Oracle-specific. My reply is that hints are only comments that another database will ignore. Dennis Williams DBA, 40%OCP, 100% DBA Lifetouch, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 12:19 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi, I have to write a SQL and PL/SQL guide for our developpers. Some are good but most of them can use help. I'm not a big fan of hints except for insert append, I used them only if I really need to. In last october I went to a 3 days DB2 UDB course, unless I miss something there are no hint with DB2 UDB. So I was thinking that when the Oracle optimiser would be more mature maybe hints would go away. I just want to know what is Oracle direction with hints. TIA Stephane -Original Message- Robert - IL Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 12:01 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L This is facinating, where does this come from? This is the second time in a week that I've heard this statement being made by someone. Hints will never go away IMHO, and Oracle continues to add more and more of them. I was told by someone at a client site that they were told by an Oracle instructor that they should not use hints in 9i RF -Original Message- To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Sent: 3/7/2003 10:04 AM Hi, Does Oracle have an official position on hints ? Will they go away as the optimiser is becoming bettre or they are there to stay ? TIA Stephane Paquette Administrateur de bases de donnees Database Administrator Standard Life www.standardlife.ca Tél. (514) 925-7187 [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Freeman Robert - IL INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Stephane Paquette INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a
RE: Oracle position on hints
Congratulations Connor!!! This is a great day in your life, although some guys would not agree... And thanks for sharing your knowledge about Oracle. -Original Message- Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 8:54 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Just to add my meaningless diatribe to the discussion, I think that there are good hints and bad hints. For example, first_rows(n) is a good hint, in that you are giving the optimizer more information as to what your motivations are for this query, without stifling it into a choice that may not be appropriate down the track. Hints such as index(tab,idx) are bad hints, because you are more exposed to grief. If the index is renamed, then its no longer a hint. If the data distribution changes, or the index is rebuilt in reverse or compressed, then it may no longer be a good option, etc. In terms of the vendor speak of hints imply weak optimizer I think thats nonsense. Having worked with DB2 in the past, nothing used to be more irritating then coming up with bizarre convolutions on an otherwise simple SQL to ensure that certain indexes were or were not chosen. Cheers Connor PS - Its probably a little sad that I'm chit-chatting on hints on the morning of my wedding day, but hey, you gotta pass the time somehow whilst the other half is getting the hair and makeup done :-) --- Khedr, Waleed [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's like the Auto-pilot -Original Message- To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Sent: 3/8/03 2:13 PM Stephane I don't see how Oracle could ever have an official position on hints. If they say hints are going away, many developers panic. If they say hints are great, then Oracle competitors will claim Oracle has a bad optimizer. A key political issue in some shops is Using hints makes our code Oracle-specific. My reply is that hints are only comments that another database will ignore. Dennis Williams DBA, 40%OCP, 100% DBA Lifetouch, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 12:19 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi, I have to write a SQL and PL/SQL guide for our developpers. Some are good but most of them can use help. I'm not a big fan of hints except for insert append, I used them only if I really need to. In last october I went to a 3 days DB2 UDB course, unless I miss something there are no hint with DB2 UDB. So I was thinking that when the Oracle optimiser would be more mature maybe hints would go away. I just want to know what is Oracle direction with hints. TIA Stephane -Original Message- Robert - IL Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 12:01 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L This is facinating, where does this come from? This is the second time in a week that I've heard this statement being made by someone. Hints will never go away IMHO, and Oracle continues to add more and more of them. I was told by someone at a client site that they were told by an Oracle instructor that they should not use hints in 9i RF -Original Message- To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Sent: 3/7/2003 10:04 AM Hi, Does Oracle have an official position on hints ? Will they go away as the optimiser is becoming bettre or they are there to stay ? TIA Stephane Paquette Administrateur de bases de donnees Database Administrator Standard Life www.standardlife.ca Tél. (514) 925-7187 [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Freeman Robert - IL INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Stephane Paquette INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:
RE: Oracle position on hints
Congratulations! No hints for you:) Regards, Waleed -Original Message- To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Sent: 3/8/03 8:53 PM Just to add my meaningless diatribe to the discussion, I think that there are good hints and bad hints. For example, first_rows(n) is a good hint, in that you are giving the optimizer more information as to what your motivations are for this query, without stifling it into a choice that may not be appropriate down the track. Hints such as index(tab,idx) are bad hints, because you are more exposed to grief. If the index is renamed, then its no longer a hint. If the data distribution changes, or the index is rebuilt in reverse or compressed, then it may no longer be a good option, etc. In terms of the vendor speak of hints imply weak optimizer I think thats nonsense. Having worked with DB2 in the past, nothing used to be more irritating then coming up with bizarre convolutions on an otherwise simple SQL to ensure that certain indexes were or were not chosen. Cheers Connor PS - Its probably a little sad that I'm chit-chatting on hints on the morning of my wedding day, but hey, you gotta pass the time somehow whilst the other half is getting the hair and makeup done :-) --- Khedr, Waleed [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's like the Auto-pilot -Original Message- To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Sent: 3/8/03 2:13 PM Stephane I don't see how Oracle could ever have an official position on hints. If they say hints are going away, many developers panic. If they say hints are great, then Oracle competitors will claim Oracle has a bad optimizer. A key political issue in some shops is Using hints makes our code Oracle-specific. My reply is that hints are only comments that another database will ignore. Dennis Williams DBA, 40%OCP, 100% DBA Lifetouch, Inc. [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 12:19 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Hi, I have to write a SQL and PL/SQL guide for our developpers. Some are good but most of them can use help. I'm not a big fan of hints except for insert append, I used them only if I really need to. In last october I went to a 3 days DB2 UDB course, unless I miss something there are no hint with DB2 UDB. So I was thinking that when the Oracle optimiser would be more mature maybe hints would go away. I just want to know what is Oracle direction with hints. TIA Stephane -Original Message- Robert - IL Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 12:01 PM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L This is facinating, where does this come from? This is the second time in a week that I've heard this statement being made by someone. Hints will never go away IMHO, and Oracle continues to add more and more of them. I was told by someone at a client site that they were told by an Oracle instructor that they should not use hints in 9i RF -Original Message- To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Sent: 3/7/2003 10:04 AM Hi, Does Oracle have an official position on hints ? Will they go away as the optimiser is becoming bettre or they are there to stay ? TIA Stephane Paquette Administrateur de bases de donnees Database Administrator Standard Life www.standardlife.ca Tél. (514) 925-7187 [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Freeman Robert - IL INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Stephane Paquette INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services - To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: DENNIS WILLIAMS INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services-- 858-538-5051
