Re: [ozmidwifery] fear

[Gloria Lemay]

I think it's so important for midwives to study hypnosis and get an
understanding of how the human brain works.  In fact, I think we all
need to be in intensive therapy all the time so that we don't put our
own insanity on to the births of others (and, yes, I'm including myself
in that comment).  Yes, saying your fears out loud does diminish them. 
Having fears racing around in your head with no place to say or write
them out makes the mind a very unsafe playground.  When I was going
through a very stressful court case, I read an article that said you
should get up every a.m. and write across the top of a page  "Today my
biggest fears are__ " and then just empty your mind onto the
page.  It was amazing to me what came pouring out  when I did this and
it would mean that I didn't need to keep obsessing all day long.  It
really helped a lot.  

With regard to the women who say they won't or don't want to push. 
Agree with them! "Yes, I know how you feel.  I don't want you to push. 
If you feel an overwhelming urge to push, just pant and get above it. 
Do not push.  It's really okay.  Your baby can come out without you
doing anything."   Get the thinking brain out of the way.  Pushing a
baby out is a no brainer.  It happens in the old brain at the base of
the skull, not in the neocortex where the will is located.   It's the
same as if you woke up in the a.m. and said "I really don't want to
have a b.m. today".  So what, if your body wants to go, it will.  You
can trust that with birthing women, too.  I'll paste in below an
article on these matters that I wrote for Midwifery Today Magazine.
Gloria

Courage
by Gloria Lemay
According to the Merriam-Webster dictionary, courage is a noun meaning
“ability to overcome fear or despair.” Notice that fear has to be
present in order for courage to exist. The English word “courage” is
derived from the French word for the heart, coeur. Finding the heart to
continue doing the right thing in the face of great fear inspires
others to become nobler human beings. In midwifery, we see women and
men facing their fears in birth; we ask them to have faith in the face
of no evidence. We demand that they be bigger than the circumstances
and, when they conquer, we get a renewed vision of how life can look
when our fears don’t stop us.  This is the source and inspiration for
our own courage.

The paths of parenting and midwifery push me up against my fears and
despairing attitude on a daily basis. Luckily, I have found teachers
and teachings that have inspired me to keep going despite my rapidly
beating hummingbird heart. When my daughters were very young and I was
juggling my heart’s desire to be a good parent and make a difference in
childbirth, one of my friends told me to use the affirmation, “My
vulnerability is my strength.” I thought she was insane and argued that
if I lived by that slogan my children would surely perish. I was sure
that my strength was my strength—and by strength, I meant my ability to
force and push life to suit my will. I now know that true strength is
the elusive quality of being able to strengthen others. At that time, I
trusted my friend and, on faith in her alone, began toying with sharing
my vulnerability. I tiptoed into revealing my fears and apprehensions
to a few “safe” people and slowly began to realize that what my friend
had given me as an affirmation worked a lot better than my stoic,
stubborn, brave warrior act. 

After a few harsh lessons, I began to realize that it wasn’t up to me
to conceal worrisome information from the parents at a birth. In fact,
if I am afraid at a birth, the best thing I can do is name the fear
boldly and ask everyone else present to say what fears they have. One
of my dear clients released her membranes at 36 weeks in her second
pregnancy. Her first birth had been a beautiful, straightforward
homebirth and I was deeply invested in her second birth being just as
great. After four days of leaking amniotic fluid, she began having
regular, intense birthing sensations, and we decided to go to the
hospital for the birth. I drove and the parents were in the back seat
of my car. As we approached the hospital, I had white knuckles as my
hands clutched the wheel, and a ball of fear formed in my gut. I
started picturing the cord being whacked off immediately and the baby
being taken away from mom. I looked in the rear view mirror and saw the
father with his eyes looking terrified. I said, “What’s your biggest
fear right now, Brian?” He replied, “I am afraid we’re going to have a
cesarean.” I never imagined this would be his fear. A cesarean section
was not even a possibility. I explained, “Your wife is having strong
birth sensations. . . . she has already had one vaginal birth and the
baby is small—for sure, it will be born vaginally.” 
He asked me, “Then, what are you afraid of?” I told him honestly. “I’m
afraid that the baby’s cord will be cut too quickly and the baby will
be taken away from Karen.” This had not occur

RE: [ozmidwifery] fear

[Lieve Huybrechts]

Hoi Katrina,

 

A few weeks ago, I had a
mother in labour at home. It was a nomal labor, even short for a first child.
But the last part went very slowly. I felt she had push urge, but she couldn’t
give in and something stopped her. She was in bath and I was just sitting near
her, not giving instuctions, just waiting until good pushing was irresistable. But
it didn’t come. She already sent her husband and my colleague out. At one
moment I went to the husband and asked if there was a moment in her life that
she was forced to do something she didn’t want. He knew of nothing. So I
went back to her and sat quiet near the bath. Than she started to talk. She
said that she felt she stopped the process herself, but she didn’t know
what to do about it. I asked her the same question: was there some moment in
her life she was forced to do something? She was not aware of it. Then I asked
how she was born: a ventouse extraction. I said, ok, you didn’t finish
your own birth. She was wondering if that was so. I asked if that was a theme
in her life: doing things, but difficulty to reach the finish. She thought it
over and she said yes, it was. Ok, I said this thing you can do, you are born
as a woman to give birth, you can do it. Than it became quiet again. She was in
bath on her knees with her head in my lap and my hands in hers. After fifteen
min she raised her head and said: the head is out. A minute later the baby was
born in the water, she really did it on her own. The baby Jef had a birthweight
of 4980gr. She fully opened for him, she didn’t have a tear.

http://homepage.mac.com/pvandamme/Jef/Menu15.html

 

 

I think that birth can be
a moment that women can finish things they conquered for years. Birth can be
healing, but that takes time and is not often written in tekstbooks.

 

Greetings from Belgium in
winter

Lieve

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 



Lieve Huybrechts

vroedvrouw

0477740853



 

-Oorspronkelijk
bericht-
Van: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
[mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] Namens Ceri & Katrina
Verzonden: maandag 6 februari 2006
6:44
Aan: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
Onderwerp: Re: [ozmidwifery] fear

 

On
05/02/2006, at 12:36 AM, Susan Cudlipp wrote:

"What is
your biggest fear right now?"  She didn't answer for a couple of
contractions then suddenly burst out " My biggest fear is that I won't be
able to birth the baby"  What do you know - lip went and baby started
to appear!








This fascinates me too. 
Is is just a matter of verbalising that fear??? I know it sounds dumb, but most
women when questioned say that they fear the pain.no denying that it is
going to hurt, so is it a matter of just verbalising it??

On a similar matter 
the last couple of weks, I have had 2 women simply stump me. One with an
epidural, one without. Both reached 9 then 10 cms dilation, and decided they
did not want to push. They were adament they did not want to push, that they
wanted "the baby pulled out"!!! Despite reasurrance that they could
do it, and that unless they were unwell or the baby distressed, they baby would
NOT be pulled out and they certainly would not be taken for a LSCS, they
continued to say "No I dont want to push", "I'm not going to
push" "it is going to hurt too much!"

They eventually had the baby when the next shift took over, but I was wondering
if anyone else had encountered this before?? 

[ozmidwifery] Re: Post cs support

[Graham & Helen]

I don't know if this message got to the list - apologies if it has already
but it didn't show up on my email list.

I am after some practical advice on obtaining counselling for women post a
traumatic birth.  I have had discussions with our social worker who states
that we should be getting them independent debriefing within 72 hours of the
event.  I must admit that I haven't done this as I have felt too much was
going on in that first 72 hours e.g. physical recovery, breastfeeding issues
and sleep deprivation.  What are your thoughts as consumers would this have
helped?  I talk to the women in those first few days and ask how they are
feeling etc.  Suggest that at some point they may like to write their
experience down and try and prepare them for the probability that it may
"hit" them further down the track.  I give them the option of PTS
counselling further down the track.  It is more complicated if, as a
midwife, you know the trauma could have been avoided and your suggestions
were ignored by the doctor at the time of the event.  I feel I need
debriefing after those ones but of course I don't get it due to the
circumstances.

As I have only just started back in midwifery setting, I can't assess
whether these actions are having an impact.  I am in a perfect position to
improve the situation because I am working in a caseload setting and get to
know the women reasonably well. I realise it is part of the midwife's role
but also recognize there are experts in counselling who also qualify as
independent which makes them more suitable to get involved.

Looking for your thoughts

Helen Cahill

<>

Re: [ozmidwifery] fear

[Honey Acharya]

Ina May Gaskin talks about it in Ina May's Guide to 
Childbirth! I'd have to look through the book to tell you exactlyl what she 
says.

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Ceri 
  & Katrina 
  To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au 
  
  Sent: Monday, February 06, 2006 4:44 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] fear
  On 05/02/2006, at 12:36 AM, Susan Cudlipp wrote:
  "What is your biggest fear right now?"  She 
didn't answer for a couple of contractions then suddenly burst out " My 
biggest fear is that I won't be able to birth the baby"  What do you 
know - lip went and baby started to 
  appear!This fascinates me too. Is 
  is just a matter of verbalising that fear??? I know it sounds dumb, but most 
  women when questioned say that they fear the pain.no denying that it is 
  going to hurt, so is it a matter of just verbalising it??On a similar 
  matter the last couple of weks, I have had 2 women simply stump me. 
  One with an epidural, one without. Both reached 9 then 10 cms dilation, and 
  decided they did not want to push. They were adament they did not want to 
  push, that they wanted "the baby pulled out"!!! Despite reasurrance that they 
  could do it, and that unless they were unwell or the baby distressed, they 
  baby would NOT be pulled out and they certainly would not be taken for a LSCS, 
  they continued to say "No I dont want to push", "I'm not going to push" "it is 
  going to hurt too much!"They eventually had the baby when the next 
  shift took over, but I was wondering if anyone else had encountered this 
  before?? 

Re: [ozmidwifery] fear

[Ceri & Katrina]

On 05/02/2006, at 12:36 AM, Susan Cudlipp wrote:

"What is your biggest fear right now?"  She didn't answer for a couple of contractions then suddenly burst out " My biggest fear is that I won't be able to birth the baby"  What do you know - lip went and baby started to appear!



This fascinates me too. 
Is is just a matter of verbalising that fear???  I know it sounds dumb, but most women when questioned say that they fear the pain.no denying that it is going to hurt, so is it a matter of just verbalising it??

On a similar matter 
the last couple of weks, I have had 2 women simply stump me. One with an epidural, one without. Both reached 9 then 10 cms dilation, and decided they did not want to push. They were adament they did not want to push, that they wanted "the baby pulled out"!!!  Despite reasurrance that they could do it, and that unless they were unwell or the baby distressed, they baby would NOT be pulled out and they certainly would not be taken for a LSCS, they continued to say "No I dont want to push", "I'm not going to push" "it is going to hurt too much!"

They eventually had the baby when the next shift took over, but I was wondering if anyone else had encountered this before??  

Re: [ozmidwifery] bounty packs

[Ceri & Katrina]

we don't give out the bounty packs at all where I work.
mainly due I think to all the propaganda and also the fact they had 
formula samples for newborns...(i think)


Katrina

On 05/02/2006, at 12:04 PM, Ken WArd wrote:


You can request material not be included in the packs, and this I would
certainly have a problem with, also. Bounty really should notify when
additions are to be included, and give people a chance to comment. 
Maureen


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Janet Fraser
Sent: Sunday, 5 February 2006 7:42 AM
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] bounty packs


That's utterly shocking, Rachel. There's enough crap from 
multinationals and
no real information about bf or birth but to add that rubbish in 
merely adds

insult to injury.
J
- Original Message -
From: "wump fish" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Sunday, February 05, 2006 7:27 AM
Subject: [ozmidwifery] bounty packs



I have a problem with giving out bounty packs as it is but...

Opened one yesterday and noticed an addition hidden inside. 
Castlemaine



have produced a 'dad's pack'. It includes: earplugs (so you can ignore

your
crying baby); a face mask and gloves for nappy changing; stickers 
saying

'I

changed my first nappy' etc; and BEER VOUCHERS

I cannot believe that queensland health (committed to 'community 
health')

is
handing this message out to parents. This seems so wrong on many 
levels:
first, not all women have a male partner - should they get a 'dad 
pack',
could cause upset. What message are we giving fathers about their 
role?

How
many problems are caused by irresponsible alcohol consumption - 
health,

social etc. Is it just me? Or do others think this is totally

inappropriate?


Rachel

_
Are you using the latest version of MSN Messenger? Download MSN 
Messenger

7.5 today! http://messenger.msn.co.uk

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[ozmidwifery] Margaret Ahearn

[Anne Clarke]

Does anyone know Margaret Ahearn's email address in Queensland?

Regards
Anne Clarke
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RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support

[B & G]

Thanks Judy,
Its OK. I have moved on although the body keeps the score. I have a
great family. There is also a PTSD newsgroup that is also very safe for
PTSD sufferers.
Post Forster and Davies review (Qld) I am smiling more these days
although it isn't easy. One day I hope all midwives can work in an
environment that is safe and fulfilling that meets our women's needs. We
must maintain the fire to make it safer for these women, that is what a
midwife must do.
Barb

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy Chapman
Sent: Sunday, 5 February 2006 6:24 PM
To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support


Barb, 
So sorry to hear you have had such a shocking time. I can offer no tips,
not having been there myself but I pray that there will come a time that
you can settle into more normal pre-trauma type of life. 
Cheers
Judy

--- B & G <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> There is no 'cure' for PTSD!! You just learn to manage the triggers 
> but even then the physiological responses sometimes get away from
> you. Some
> people wonder why you are so serious- so would you if you had
> this
> constant mind battle to control triggers.
> Barb- chronic PTSD sufferer, 8 years after an assault and
> prolonged
> torture by an unsupervised prisoner in an Intensive Care Unit.
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jo Bourne
> Sent: Saturday, 4 February 2006 11:34 AM
> To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
> Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support
> 
> 
> Talking therapies may be the only "cure", that certainly sounds right 
> to me. However I can't imagine having been raped, assaulted OR
> traumatised
> by my birth experience and then wanting to do that talking in
> the place
> or with the people where it happened. Perhaps in the last
> stages of
> healing, as a final letting go/closure thing, but certainly
> not in the
> very first days of the shock. I did not have a remotely
> traumatic birth
> experience but have had other traumas in my life and have had
> a lot of
> talking to do about them, I can't think of one occasion I
> wanted to go
> back to the person/place that was the source of the trauma.
> 
> At 11:19 AM +1100 4/2/06, Janet Fraser wrote:
> >I remember it but I disagree with it entirely. It struck me
> as no more
> >logical and useful than the obstetric refusal to offer OFP
> because a
> >study showing a crude, almost silly form of it didn't have
> the desired
> >effect. (10mins a day on hands and knees rather than the
> lifestyle
> >operation that is true OFP) Talking therapies are pretty much
> the only
> >"cure" for PTSD and that's been well demonstrated over and
> over. The
> >one study showing otherwise holds no weight. J
> >
> >- Original Message -
> >From: Mary Murphy
> >To:
>
>ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
> >Sent: Saturday, February 04, 2006 10:58 AM
> >Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support
> >
> >I believe there is some research out there that looked at
> de-briefing
> >women after birth, particularly traumatic births.  As I
> remember it,
> the research did not show that this debriefing had particularly 
> helpful outcomes.  Of course it is all in the Who, the When and the
> How.  Does
> anyone remember it?  Mary Murphy
> > 
> >
> >Andrea wrote:
> >Any suggestions. Should all women have a follow up
> appointment with the
> 
> >midwife who was at her birth, is this appropriate as they may
> have been
> part of the problem, should all women have a follow up appointment but
> the woman be allowed to choose who she wants the appointment
> with, at
> what stage would this be appropriate, 2 weeks, 8 weeks 3
> months? How
> does this fit with the M&CH nurses who are now involved in the
> woman's
> on going care? How does her doctor, be it her own GP, obst or
> the one
> who attended (or not) her birth  be involved in this?
> > 
> 
> 
> --
> Jo Bourne
> Virtual Artists Pty Ltd
> --
> This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics.
> Visit  to subscribe or
> unsubscribe.
> 
> --
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> 




 
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RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support

[Judy Chapman]

Barb, 
So sorry to hear you have had such a shocking time. I can offer
no tips, not having been there myself but I pray that there will
come a time that you can settle into more normal pre-trauma type
of life. 
Cheers
Judy

--- B & G <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> There is no 'cure' for PTSD!! You just learn to manage the
> triggers but
> even then the physiological responses sometimes get away from
> you. Some
> people wonder why you are so serious- so would you if you had
> this
> constant mind battle to control triggers.
> Barb- chronic PTSD sufferer, 8 years after an assault and
> prolonged
> torture by an unsupervised prisoner in an Intensive Care Unit.
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jo
> Bourne
> Sent: Saturday, 4 February 2006 11:34 AM
> To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
> Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support
> 
> 
> Talking therapies may be the only "cure", that certainly
> sounds right to
> me. However I can't imagine having been raped, assaulted OR
> traumatised
> by my birth experience and then wanting to do that talking in
> the place
> or with the people where it happened. Perhaps in the last
> stages of
> healing, as a final letting go/closure thing, but certainly
> not in the
> very first days of the shock. I did not have a remotely
> traumatic birth
> experience but have had other traumas in my life and have had
> a lot of
> talking to do about them, I can't think of one occasion I
> wanted to go
> back to the person/place that was the source of the trauma.
> 
> At 11:19 AM +1100 4/2/06, Janet Fraser wrote:
> >I remember it but I disagree with it entirely. It struck me
> as no more 
> >logical and useful than the obstetric refusal to offer OFP
> because a 
> >study showing a crude, almost silly form of it didn't have
> the desired 
> >effect. (10mins a day on hands and knees rather than the
> lifestyle 
> >operation that is true OFP) Talking therapies are pretty much
> the only 
> >"cure" for PTSD and that's been well demonstrated over and
> over. The 
> >one study showing otherwise holds no weight. J
> >
> >- Original Message -
> >From: Mary Murphy
> >To: 
>
>ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au
> >Sent: Saturday, February 04, 2006 10:58 AM
> >Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Post cs support
> >
> >I believe there is some research out there that looked at
> de-briefing 
> >women after birth, particularly traumatic births.  As I
> remember it,
> the research did not show that this debriefing had
> particularly helpful
> outcomes.  Of course it is all in the Who, the When and the
> How.  Does
> anyone remember it?  Mary Murphy
> > 
> >
> >Andrea wrote:
> >Any suggestions. Should all women have a follow up
> appointment with the
> 
> >midwife who was at her birth, is this appropriate as they may
> have been
> part of the problem, should all women have a follow up
> appointment but
> the woman be allowed to choose who she wants the appointment
> with, at
> what stage would this be appropriate, 2 weeks, 8 weeks 3
> months? How
> does this fit with the M&CH nurses who are now involved in the
> woman's
> on going care? How does her doctor, be it her own GP, obst or
> the one
> who attended (or not) her birth  be involved in this?
> > 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Jo Bourne
> Virtual Artists Pty Ltd
> --
> This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics.
> Visit  to subscribe or
> unsubscribe.
> 
> --
> This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics.
> Visit  to subscribe or
> unsubscribe.
> 




 
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