Comrade Linda
Thanks for this assertion, while the principle of generation mix (the young, middle age and old) applies, above I fully agree with the view you advance. And that amidst generation mix being a crucial principle thus a guide to action, above all every generation is and will be faced with its own historic duty and task of its own! And, to fulfil this role this generation should be cognisant of the related responsibilities and role, including the prevalent social contradictions which commonly tend to manifest themselves in and outside the party. This generation should be willing to cut ties with old habit with had field to yield progress and revolution, thus explore and pursue an alternative revolutionary path to fulfil its historic mission. Since you were able to explain the generations which emerged in the early 1930- 1949 and so forth which played their respective roles. It must be understood, that leadership of the party to lead and advance the African revolution will not be voluntarily be handover to a generation whose time has come, through a silver platter, a generation(s) whose time has passed (relatively 1994-2014), some did attempted and some failed to fulfil its historic mission. While others harbours illusions of grandeur, some still aspire for a political grand finale amidst almost eight to ten years of lost time and life as the party disintegrates-and-operates radarless under their leadership. Secondly, its fundamental that this generation of leadership for current epoch should not also make an error of judgement, which is, an blanket approach that all of their generation uphold the same ideological grounded, conviction and clarity! A generation which finds itself in a highly bourgeoisiefied African nation of this epoch is equally confronted with deep ideological questions in terms of in whose class interests is that generation acting either the African proletariat and their respective downtrodden – propertyless communities or the comprador bourgousie who serves as an extension of capital imperialism and white supremacy! The character and form of the political programme of this generation should answer these ideological questions, and also explain the outlook and attitude of the party moving forward. Lastly, it should be the organisation of this generation around coherently shared and upheld political theory whether its conformist or revolutionary, and determining party and leadership performance and determination on merits which should evolve mainly around the degree of activism and being rooted in the advancement of mass based African proletarian struggles in Azania and Africa as whole. Indeed, we should profusely refuse and resent to become a generation which will fail to fulfil its historic mission, for the its time has already dawn! Shango lashu NKrumah From: payco@googlegroups.com [mailto:payco@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Linda Ndebele Sent: 13 September 2014 08:45 PM To: payco@googlegroups.com; 'Michael Muendane'; 'Mbulelo Raymond' Cc: po...@yahoo.com; tyamza...@yahoo.com; phillipdhlam...@yahoo.com; joseph.maqhek...@sasol.com; ramotw...@maruleng.gov.za; jntab...@gmail.com; paccapeme...@webmail.co.za; celenjabulo...@gmail.com; tumimod...@hotmail.co.za; znyam...@gmail.com; rammymfulw...@gmail.com; i...@bataufc.com; moshemahlom...@gmail.com; bennet_j...@yahoo.com; bulelanim1...@nokiamail.com; digashuma...@gmail.com; phumzilenom...@hotmail.co.za; monyanepin...@gmail.com; ad...@pac.org.za; ndhlo...@pac.org.za; dud...@webmail.co.za; lea...@hotmail.com; malingeplaat...@yahoo.com; vu...@telkomsa.net; richardma...@yahoo.com; ntsiemohl...@gmail.com; mnd...@yahoo.com; mop...@pac.org.za; mvakalijust...@gmail.com; dmalo...@klerksdorp.org; tnta...@webmail.co.za; aplamv...@gmail.com Subject: [PAYCO] Our generation failed by a generation that has made its mark! Comrades, Today had a conversation with my close comrades in my Region (Majuba Region). These are passionate comrades who possess rare talents and skills in terms of mass mobilization, resource mobilization and are hardcore politicians. They live, breath and dream politics. PAC is blessed to have such selfless and fearless cadres. Its unfortunate that their talents are currently not nurtured and nourished to replenish and make PAC a force to be reckoned with. In our conversation we were deliberating on the state of the PAC and the role of our generation in the PAC and in the broader struggle of African emancipation. In our conversation we agreed on the following as challenges facing our challenge: 1. Our generation is waging battles of a generation that has made its mark in history. (All factions are led and formed around elements who can boast about some achievements as activists, exiles or as military people at some point in the struggle) 2. Our generation has not been given space to make its mark or make its blunders. (Leadership of the party is kept away by those of the generation that has made its mark). 3. Our generation stands to go down in history as the most useless generation that never made a mark in the struggle to liberate our people. We concluded that we will not allow this to continue. We want to play our historic duty in the liberation struggle of our people and continent. We will do this within the PAC but if PAC cannot assist us to do so we will go out and make our mark elsewhere. We are driven by a desire to make our mark in history. Izwe lethu! Linda Kwame Ndebele Sent via my BlackBerry from Vodacom - let your email find you! _____ From: "Nkrumah Raymond Kgagudi" <nrkgag...@gmail.com> Sender: payco@googlegroups.com Date: Fri, 12 Sep 2014 08:05:02 +0200 To: 'Michael Muendane'<m...@soultalk.co.za>; 'Mbulelo Raymond'<mrfihl...@gmail.com> ReplyTo: payco@googlegroups.com Cc: <po...@yahoo.com>; <tyamza...@yahoo.com>; <phillipdhlam...@yahoo.com>; <joseph.maqhek...@sasol.com>; <ramotw...@maruleng.gov.za>; <jntab...@gmail.com>; <paccapeme...@webmail.co.za>; <celenjabulo...@gmail.com>; <tumimod...@hotmail.co.za>; <znyam...@gmail.com>; <rammymfulw...@gmail.com>; <i...@bataufc.com>; <moshemahlom...@gmail.com>; <bennet_j...@yahoo.com>; <bulelanim1...@nokiamail.com>; <digashuma...@gmail.com>; <phumzilenom...@hotmail.co.za>; <monyanepin...@gmail.com>; <ad...@pac.org.za>; <ndhlo...@pac.org.za>; <dud...@webmail.co.za>; <lea...@hotmail.com>; <malingeplaat...@yahoo.com>; <vu...@telkomsa.net>; <richardma...@yahoo.com>; <ntsiemohl...@gmail.com>; <mnd...@yahoo.com>; <mop...@pac.org.za>; <mvakalijust...@gmail.com>; <dmalo...@klerksdorp.org>; <tnta...@webmail.co.za>; <aplamv...@gmail.com>; <njabulo.m...@gmail.com>; <river.mla...@telkomsa.net>; <pasmapresid...@gmail.com>; <goqwana.san...@gmail.com>; <billiard.s...@gmail.com>; <linda.ndeb...@newcastle.gov.za>; <kutie.thondl...@gmail.com>; <pacmogalec...@gmail.com>; <isaa...@diplomat-global.com>; <bulanng...@gmail.com>; <vemahla...@gmail.com>; <0825164...@vodamail.co.za>; <nakaphala.ba...@gmail.com>; <lucasmmol...@gmail.com>; <payco@googlegroups.com>; <takalaniligeg...@gmail.com>; <sndam...@pac-cape.org.za>; <pacaza...@webmail.co.za>; <pac.nc...@gmail.com>; <pactshwanereg...@gmail.com>; <hlubi.so...@gmail.com>; <mphothobej...@yahoo.com>; <mbuyigan...@yahoo.com>; <dumisani...@gmail.com>; <p...@vodamail.co.za>; <nnyq...@gmail.com>; <s...@pac.org.za>; <sbusiso.x...@gmail.com>; <wgaj...@gmail.com>; <mapulankoan...@gmail.com>; <mokoen...@workmail.co.za>; <mbind...@gmail.com>; <mphah...@eskom.co.za> Subject: RE: [PAYCO] FW: attack on party annual conference Izwe lethu Thanks Bra Mike, “Anyone can change. Love yourself, love one another, unite and you shall be a strong Party” Izwe lethu Nkrumah Raymond Kgagudi I Choose no-one, however all PAC members as comrades in struggle for the African Emancipation! From: Michael Muendane [mailto:m...@soultalk.co.za] Sent: 11 September 2014 10:13 PM To: 'Mbulelo Raymond'; 'Nkrumah Raymond Kgagudi' Cc: po...@yahoo.com; tyamza...@yahoo.com; phillipdhlam...@yahoo.com; joseph.maqhek...@sasol.com; ramotw...@maruleng.gov.za; jntab...@gmail.com; paccapeme...@webmail.co.za; celenjabulo...@gmail.com; tumimod...@hotmail.co.za; znyam...@gmail.com; rammymfulw...@gmail.com; i...@bataufc.com; moshemahlom...@gmail.com; bennet_j...@yahoo.com; bulelanim1...@nokiamail.com; digashuma...@gmail.com; phumzilenom...@hotmail.co.za; monyanepin...@gmail.com; ad...@pac.org.za; ndhlo...@pac.org.za; dud...@webmail.co.za; lea...@hotmail.com; malingeplaat...@yahoo.com; vu...@telkomsa.net; richardma...@yahoo.com; ntsiemohl...@gmail.com; mnd...@yahoo.com; mop...@pac.org.za; mvakalijust...@gmail.com; dmalo...@klerksdorp.org; tnta...@webmail.co.za; aplamv...@gmail.com; njabulo.m...@gmail.com; river.mla...@telkomsa.net; pasmapresid...@gmail.com; goqwana.san...@gmail.com; billiard.s...@gmail.com; linda.ndeb...@newcastle.gov.za; kutie.thondl...@gmail.com; pacmogalec...@gmail.com; isaa...@diplomat-global.com; bulanng...@gmail.com; vemahla...@gmail.com; 0825164...@vodamail.co.za; nakaphala.ba...@gmail.com; lucasmmol...@gmail.com; payco@googlegroups.com; takalaniligeg...@gmail.com; sndam...@pac-cape.org.za; pacaza...@webmail.co.za; pac.nc...@gmail.com; pactshwanereg...@gmail.com; hlubi.so...@gmail.com; mphothobej...@yahoo.com; mbuyigan...@yahoo.com; dumisani...@gmail.com; p...@vodamail.co.za; nnyq...@gmail.com; s...@pac.org.za; sbusiso.x...@gmail.com; wgaj...@gmail.com; mapulankoan...@gmail.com; mokoen...@workmail.co.za; mbind...@gmail.com; mphah...@eskom.co.za Subject: RE: [PAYCO] FW: attack on party annual conference There is one stubborn truth that most people do not realise and it is this: “You cannot give anybody something that you do not have. You must have it first. If you do not have love, you can never give love to anybody. Likewise, when you give a positive a label ( description or attribute) to someone else, it means you also possess that attribute. When you attribute or ascribe a certain negative trait, attribute, quality or tendency to another person, you do that because you possess that trait, attribute, quality or tendency yourself, otherwise how would you recognise it in others?” Anyone can change. Love yourself, love one another, unite and you shall be a strong Party. Izwe lethu. Ngila Muendane. From: Mbulelo Raymond [mailto:mrfihl...@gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2014 8:15 PM To: Nkrumah Raymond Kgagudi Cc: po...@yahoo.com; tyamza...@yahoo.com; phillipdhlam...@yahoo.com; joseph.maqhek...@sasol.com; ramotw...@maruleng.gov.za; jntab...@gmail.com; m...@soultalk.co.za; paccapeme...@webmail.co.za; celenjabulo...@gmail.com; tumimod...@hotmail.co.za; znyam...@gmail.com; rammymfulw...@gmail.com; i...@bataufc.com; moshemahlom...@gmail.com; bennet_j...@yahoo.com; bulelanim1...@nokiamail.com; digashuma...@gmail.com; phumzilenom...@hotmail.co.za; monyanepin...@gmail.com; ad...@pac.org.za; ndhlo...@pac.org.za; dud...@webmail.co.za; lea...@hotmail.com; malingeplaat...@yahoo.com; vu...@telkomsa.net; richardma...@yahoo.com; ntsiemohl...@gmail.com; mnd...@yahoo.com; mop...@pac.org.za; mvakalijust...@gmail.com; dmalo...@klerksdorp.org; tnta...@webmail.co.za; aplamv...@gmail.com; njabulo.m...@gmail.com; river.mla...@telkomsa.net; pasmapresid...@gmail.com; goqwana.san...@gmail.com; billiard.s...@gmail.com; linda.ndeb...@newcastle.gov.za; kutie.thondl...@gmail.com; pacmogalec...@gmail.com; isaa...@diplomat-global.com; bulanng...@gmail.com; vemahla...@gmail.com; 0825164...@vodamail.co.za; nakaphala.ba...@gmail.com; lucasmmol...@gmail.com; payco@googlegroups.com; takalaniligeg...@gmail.com; sndam...@pac-cape.org.za; pacaza...@webmail.co.za; pac.nc...@gmail.com; pactshwanereg...@gmail.com; hlubi.so...@gmail.com; mphothobej...@yahoo.com; mbuyigan...@yahoo.com; dumisani...@gmail.com; p...@vodamail.co.za; nnyq...@gmail.com; s...@pac.org.za; sbusiso.x...@gmail.com; wgaj...@gmail.com; mapulankoan...@gmail.com; mokoen...@workmail.co.za; mbind...@gmail.com; mphah...@eskom.co.za Subject: RE: [PAYCO] FW: attack on party annual conference M'Afrika Nkrumah please poqo I am begging you, let us leave this matter because it adds no value to the future of the PAC. FIHLA On 11 Sep 2014 6:59 PM, "Nkrumah Raymond KGAGUDI" <nrkgag...@gmail.com> wrote: Conrade Fihla You are deliberately distorting everything I wrote and argued. It is evident you are personalising issues and also driving a character assasination. You have dismally failed to prove your claims that I did nothing and know nothing about imprisoned APLA comrades. We have seen some PAC members putting the crisis and feuding within the PAC on the shoulders of Cde Letlapa, Cde Mpethi and Cde Moloto, I argued that amidst these comrades errors and blunders, it's being disenginious because as PAC members we have cobtributed directly and indirectly to this unfolding crisis and disintegration of the party,thus o salvage the the PAC members and branches should take equal responsibility and move forward and forge unity starting from branch to regional level! It seems you prefer a subjective and personal approach instead of a structured and organisational approach, where there is transparency and accountability. The bitter truths is PAC Branches and members are faced with two parallel and feuding APLAMVA whose division compound factionalism in the PAC. Leaders of both two APLAMVA should swallow their pride and also consider to organise an inclusive and unifying APLAMVA Conference! Lastly, a direct challenge to your APLAMVA NEC is what plan of action does your APLAMVA has for us to support and rally the masses around for the Release of Imprisoned APLA comrades. instead of uncoordinated piecmeal visits! This will help all of to move away from what you call being judgemental and full of rhetoric! Nonetheless, let the people and history judge the correct analysis! Shango lashu NKRUMAH Sent from Samsung tablet Mbulelo Raymond <mrfihl...@gmail.com> wrote: >Comrade Nkrumah, all what you are saying here is just rhetoric. All I am >saying to you is that stop being judgemental. Stop referring to PAC members >as hypocrits because you are not a saint. Stop referring to PAC members as >individuals with no moral ground to contribute to matters of the PAC. You >cannot preach unity and at the same time campaign to isolate other members >because to you they are hypocrits with no moral high ground to add value to >the PAC. > >Whether you served in the leadership of Mogoba or of Pheko etc, that does >not give you the right to call PAC members hypocrits. > >Kindly note also that the comrades in prison are not interested in the >rhetoric of stories of marches of the past. They need support now. I saw >the picture of you marching in the past and I am not sure how many years >ago. That picture adds no value to the lives of the comrades in prison, >hence I say please visit these comrades and avoid this rhetoric. > >Fihla >On 11 Sep 2014 12:06 PM, "Nkrumah Raymond Kgagudi" <nrkgag...@gmail.com> >wrote: > >> Comrade Fihla >> >> >> >> You are reading wrongly and once more fail to grasp the essence of the >> argument advanced, the earlier statement is premised from the following >> argument “*“I strongly believe that in as much as Cde Letlapa, Cde >> Mpethi and Cde Moloto, might have made serious political blunders/errors, >> they cannot be made to be 100% liable for the entire divisions and >> feuding thus factionalism in the PAC”* Secondly, the e-mail argues that >> and points that *“Surely comrades, neither Cde Letlapa nor Cde Mpethi nor >> Cde Moloto is stopping your branches and members to picket and organise >> mass protests demanding the immediate release of all the imprisoned APLA >> comrades (for an example)”*. >> >> >> >> But Cde Fihla, you made claims that I did nothing about the imprisoned >> APLA comrades, I refuted those claims by providing you with a brief account >> of actions I have been part of demanding the release of incarcerated APLA >> comrades. Cde Dumisani Zwane furthermore attached complimentary evidence to >> refute the claims you advanced. Your sweeping conjecture that I know >> nothing and did nothing about the arrested APLA Comrades, I advanced a >> direct challenge to you to prove your claims. >> >> >> >> Kindly note that, it’s not alien in knowledge acquisition process to >> formulate a conjecture or an assumption (hypothesis) which is either >> affirmed or nullified by empirical evidence. And let’s suppose I Nkrumah >> Raymond Kgagudi I did nothing as Cde Fihla claims and insists, *does this >> mean PAC branches and members should not ask questions about imprisoned >> APLA comrades. And surely, we cannot prescribe how questions should be >> asked, as long as assumptions are not personal attacks nor do not >> personalise issues? * >> >> >> >> Secondly, you opted to launch a personal and sought to personalise the >> issue when no one raised a direct reference to Cde Fihla as a >> person/individual. The issue is what has being done by APLAMVA as a >> structure/ component structures in regards to the incarcerated APLA >> Comrades and this goes to an extent of questioning the political role and >> purpose of APLAMVA in the context of PAC’s Aims and Objective. If the two >> parallel existing APLAMVA have organisational plans and strategies, then >> let them be shared with PAC branches and members to dismiss and refute the >> following statement "we have imprisoned former APLA combatants, no >> action is taken to demand the release of incarcerated APLA combatants", >> empirically disapprove this statement you consider as “unfounded sweeping >> statements based on conjecture”. >> >> >> >> Remember, I sat at the NEC led by Cde Mogoba prior Tompi Seleke in 2000 >> and even after Tompi Seleke, I also served in the NEC of under Cde Pheko >> including the 2006 – until the Decree NEC of Cde Letlapa, there has been no >> programme nor report presented by APLAMVA in regards to a campaign >> demanding the release of imprisoned APLA comrades. We know of individual >> PAC Comrades such M’Afrika Sombu and M’Afrika Pheko who had always made >> efforts and rallied various NECs and component structures and members of >> PAC in regard to the plight of imprisoned APLA comrades. Hence the argument >> "None of the two existing APLAMVA NEC s have been seen in action demanding >> the immediate release of these comrades. But today, APLAMVA NEC comrades >> have a moral ground to point finger and identify failures of the PAC NEC >> members. I find the extent of most comrades as being hypocrites". To make >> things worse, APLA is split into two feuding comrades, the questions is >> does this APLAMVA split contribute or impact in the PAC! >> >> >> >> Do not be personal when addressing this issues, let’s try to be objective >> and constructive Comrade Fihla! Personalising issues commonly defeats a >> debate and inquisition to have a better understanding. Lastly, I do accept >> your invite and as long as it’s not a piecemeal approach however a Plan of >> Action that seeks to Demand the Release Imprisoned APLA Fighters! >> >> >> >> Shango lashu >> >> Nkrumah Raymond Kgagudi >> >> >> >> >> >> *From:* mrfihla08 [mailto:mrfihl...@gmail.com] >> *Sent:* 11 September 2014 09:26 AM >> *To:* Nkrumah Raymond Kgagudi; payco@googlegroups.com >> *Cc:* nnyq...@gmail.com; kutie.thondl...@gmail.com; i...@bataufc.com; >> mvakalijust...@gmail.com; wgaj...@gmail.com; malingeplaat...@yahoo.com; >> mphah...@eskom.co.za; tnta...@webmail.co.za; dud...@webmail.co.za; >> tumimod...@hotmail.co.za; nakaphala.ba...@gmail.com; >> takalaniligeg...@gmail.com; ramotw...@maruleng.gov.za; >> mbuyigan...@yahoo.com; znyam...@gmail.com; mnd...@yahoo.com; >> celenjabulo...@gmail.com; p...@vodamail.co.za; bulanng...@gmail.com; >> m...@soultalk.co.za; monyanepin...@gmail.com; ad...@pac.org.za; >> lucasmmol...@gmail.com; lea...@hotmail.com; pacmogalec...@gmail.com; >> po...@yahoo.com; bulelanim1...@nokiamail.com; mbind...@gmail.com; >> pactshwanereg...@gmail.com; dmalo...@klerksdorp.org; >> mapulankoan...@gmail.com; sbusiso.x...@gmail.com; dumisani...@gmail.com; >> goqwana.san...@gmail.com; richardma...@yahoo.com; billiard.s...@gmail.com; >> jntab...@gmail.com; phillipdhlam...@yahoo.com; joseph.maqhek...@sasol.com; >> mop...@pac.org.za; pasmapresid...@gmail.com; s...@pac.org.za; >> moshemahlom...@gmail.com; digashuma...@gmail.com; vu...@telkomsa.net; >> mphothobej...@yahoo.com; sndam...@pac-cape.org.za; >> 0825164...@vodamail.co.za; tyamza...@yahoo.com; rammymfulw...@gmail.com; >> linda.ndeb...@newcastle.gov.za; bennet_j...@yahoo.com; >> paccapeme...@webmail.co.za; pac.nc...@gmail.com; ndhlo...@pac.org.za; >> isaa...@diplomat-global.com; njabulo.m...@gmail.com; >> phumzilenom...@hotmail.co.za; river.mla...@telkomsa.net; >> hlubi.so...@gmail.com; mokoen...@workmail.co.za; pacaza...@webmail.co.za; >> 'APLAMVA WESTERN CAPE'; ntsiemohl...@gmail.com; 'Vusi Mahlangu' >> *Subject:* RE: [PAYCO] FW: attack on party annual conference >> >> >> >> M'Afrika Nkrumah, with due respect son of the soil, I would not like us to >> engage in rhetoric. All I was responding to are your unfounded sweeping >> statements based on conjecture. You know nothing or very little about what >> is happening concerning our comrades in prison. Hence I am inviting you to >> join me at your earliest convince on a visit to Boksburg prison.To quote >> what you wrote, "we have imprisoned former APLA combatants, no action is >> taken to demand the release of incarcerated APLA combatants". You go even >> further to say " None of the two existing APLAMVA NEC s have been seen in >> action demanding the immediate release of these comrades. But today, >> APLAMVA NEC comrades have a moral ground to point finger and identify >> failures of the PAC NEC members. I find the extent of most comrades as >> being hypocrits". >> >> >> >> I am not sure what it is that I am misunderstanding in this sweeping and >> judgemental statement. What you are actually saying here is that you are >> the only one who has a high moral ground to point a finger at the wrongs of >> the NEC members. To you, the rest of us except yourself are hypocrites and >> therefore have no right to participate in debates about PAC issues. You >> unfortunately when you have not visited any of these comrades in prison and >> you instead want to use their plight for political point scoring. My advice >> to you son of the soil is that instead of wright ing about the comrades in >> prison, please visit them, please go there and support them. >> >> >> >> For your information, I will as I am always doing, be visiting the >> comrades in Boksburg prison this weekend. >> >> >> >> Accept my regards >> >> >> >> Fihla >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone. >> >> >> >> -------- Original message -------- >> From: Nkrumah Raymond Kgagudi >> Date:10/09/2014 10:41 (GMT+02:00) >> To: 'Mbulelo Raymond' , payco@googlegroups.com >> Cc: nnyq...@gmail.com, kutie.thondl...@gmail.com, i...@bataufc.com, >> mvakalijust...@gmail.com, wgaj...@gmail.com, malingeplaat...@yahoo.com, >> mphah...@eskom.co.za, tnta...@webmail.co.za, dud...@webmail.co.za, >> tumimod...@hotmail.co.za, nakaphala.ba...@gmail.com, >> takalaniligeg...@gmail.com, ramotw...@maruleng.gov.za, >> mbuyigan...@yahoo.com, znyam...@gmail.com, mnd...@yahoo.com, >> celenjabulo...@gmail.com, payco@googlegroups.com, p...@vodamail.co.za, >> bulanng...@gmail.com, m...@soultalk.co.za, monyanepin...@gmail.com, >> ad...@pac.org.za, lucasmmol...@gmail.com, lea...@hotmail.com, >> pacmogalec...@gmail.com, po...@yahoo.com, bulelanim1...@nokiamail.com, >> mbind...@gmail.com, pactshwanereg...@gmail.com, dmalo...@klerksdorp.org, >> mapulankoan...@gmail.com, sbusiso.x...@gmail.com, dumisani...@gmail.com, >> goqwana.san...@gmail.com, richardma...@yahoo.com, billiard.s...@gmail.com, >> jntab...@gmail.com, phillipdhlam...@yahoo.com, joseph.maqhek...@sasol.com, >> mop...@pac.org.za, pasmapresid...@gmail.com, s...@pac.org.za, >> moshemahlom...@gmail.com, digashuma...@gmail.com, vu...@telkomsa.net, >> mphothobej...@yahoo.com, sndam...@pac-cape.org.za, >> 0825164...@vodamail.co.za, tyamza...@yahoo.com, rammymfulw...@gmail.com, >> linda.ndeb...@newcastle.gov.za, bennet_j...@yahoo.com, >> paccapeme...@webmail.co.za, pac.nc...@gmail.com, ndhlo...@pac.org.za, >> isaa...@diplomat-global.com, njabulo.m...@gmail.com, >> phumzilenom...@hotmail.co.za, river.mla...@telkomsa.net, >> hlubi.so...@gmail.com, mokoen...@workmail.co.za, pacaza...@webmail.co.za, >> 'APLAMVA WESTERN CAPE' , kutie.thondl...@gmail.com, >> sndam...@pac-cape.org.za, mrfihl...@gmail.com, >> linda.ndeb...@newcastle.gov.za, ad...@pac.org.za, wgaj...@gmail.com, >> rammymfulw...@gmail.com, richardma...@yahoo.com, river.mla...@telkomsa.net, >> ramotw...@maruleng.gov.za, takalaniligeg...@gmail.com, >> tumimod...@hotmail.co.za, tyamza...@yahoo.com, tnta...@webmail.co.za, >> isaa...@diplomat-global.com, i...@bataufc.com, lea...@hotmail.com, >> phillipdhlam...@yahoo.com, p...@vodamail.co.za, paccapeme...@webmail.co.za, >> pasmapresid...@gmail.com, pactshwanereg...@gmail.com, >> pacmogalec...@gmail.com, pac.nc...@gmail.com, phumzilenom...@hotmail.co.za, >> pacaza...@webmail.co.za, s...@pac.org.za, sbusiso.x...@gmail.com, >> dud...@webmail.co.za, digashuma...@gmail.com, dmalo...@klerksdorp.org, >> goqwana.san...@gmail.com, hlubi.so...@gmail.com, >> joseph.maqhek...@sasol.com, jntab...@gmail.com, 0825164...@vodamail.co.za, >> lucasmmol...@gmail.com, znyam...@gmail.com, billiard.s...@gmail.com, >> bulanng...@gmail.com, bennet_j...@yahoo.com, bulelanim1...@nokiamail.com, >> ndhlo...@pac.org.za, nakaphala.ba...@gmail.com, nnyq...@gmail.com, >> m...@soultalk.co.za, mapulankoan...@gmail.com, mvakalijust...@gmail.com, >> mbind...@gmail.com, mphah...@eskom.co.za, malingeplaat...@yahoo.com, >> mphothobej...@yahoo.com, mokoen...@workmail.co.za, >> moshemahlom...@gmail.com, monyanepin...@gmail.com, mop...@pac.org.za, >> po...@yahoo.com, celenjabulo...@gmail.com, njabulo.m...@gmail.com, >> vu...@telkomsa.net, dumisani...@gmail.com, ntsiemohl...@gmail.com, 'Vusi >> Mahlangu' , 'Nkrumah Raymond Kgagudi' >> Subject: RE: [PAYCO] FW: attack on party annual conference >> >> Comrade Fihla >> >> >> >> You seem to have erroneously missed the essence of a basic argument >> advanced, which I will humbly repeat without dwelling on a personal attack >> as you did. The earlier e-mail vividly expresses that *“I strongly >> believe that in as much as Cde Letlapa, Cde Mpethi and Cde Moloto, might >> have made serious political blunders/errors, they cannot be made to be >> 100% liable for the entire divisions and feuding thus factionalism in the >> PAC”* Secondly, the e-mail argues that and points that *“Surely comrades, >> neither Cde Letlapa nor Cde Mpethi nor Cde Moloto is stopping your >> branches and members to picket and organise mass protests demanding the >> immediate release of all the imprisoned APLA comrades (for an example)”*. >> There are two parallel existing APLAMVAs further extended to two parallel >> PAYCO NECs , an aspect in your response you do not refute! Hence the >> argument advanced that as PAC we suffer the high extent of hypocrites who >> consistently seeks to defer the feuding and the entire political paralysis >> and organisational stagnation of PAC purely on the shoulders of three >> comrades namely Cde Letlapa, Cde Mpethi and Cde Moloto. >> >> >> >> Furthermore, in the letter issued by Cde Mike Muendane (Deputy President >> appointed and confirmed by the Birchwood Conference 2013 ), point the >> following the crisis facing the PAC “One of the greatest leaders of this >> organisation, Nyathi Pokela, is on record as having said that if we go to a >> conference divided, we shall come out of it even more divided. On top of >> that, *there are schemes being hatched to use this year’s conference to >> put the last nail on the coffin of the PAC,* as we speak Of course.” One >> can further question, as to how does two parallel APLAMVA strengthens or >> weakens the PAC’s fighting and organisational capacity against capitalism >> and white supremacy? And the essence of my argument, is those leading two >> APLAMVA NECs cannot posit three comrades namely Cde Letlapa, Cde Mpethi and >> Cde Moloto to justify the existence of two parallel APLAMVAs, to answer to >> this question. >> >> >> >> In regard to the highly subjective accusation you made about populist >> stance and inaction, with due respect Comrade Fihla note that late 1990’s >> the PASMA NECs I formed part of adopted a plan of Action and further >> encouraged and mobilised PASMA branches not only to visit imprisoned APLA >> Comrades, however also mobilise PAC NEC and drive agitation among the >> students mass about the imprisoned APLA comrades. These we carried >> including PAC NEC organising the release of APLA comrades during 199 – >> 2001, future PASMA NECs have maintained the same positions and plan of >> actions. Around 2004- 2005 Advocate Brown legal services were secured and >> paid for the release of some APLA Comrades, ask Comrade Mphahlele and >> Comrade Pinkie Hlabedi for details! In Johannesburg Regional meeting early >> 2013 the same matters was raised and there has been no APLAMVA NEC >> presenting those plans of action to mobilise PAC branches and members. And >> reply your accusations! >> >> >> >> There are many efforts erratically undertaken by various PAC members and >> branches to support the imprisoned APLA comrades. There has been many calls >> and cries among PAC branches, members including component structures mainly >> PAYCO and PASMA for a single solid programme that aims at the immediate >> release of all incarcerated APLA comrades, we have not seen any thus >> >> >> >> We can go on about several political contributions made by individuals, >> but this does not change the most basic argument that PAC including two >> parallel existing APLAMVA NECs have not carried a vociferous programme >> demanding the release of APLA comrades. And equally, those release may not >> necessarily be as a direct outcomes of interventions you allude. >> >> >> >> You used , Chairman Mao utterance "no investigation, no talk because if >> you speak without investigating you will speak nonsense". And further >> allege that from my language, you can gather that I “have never been to any >> of the prisons to visit the APLA members who are still languishing in >> prison”. Comrade Fihla, then prove this claim to justify that you did made >> investigations and thus have a right and moral ground speak as Chairman Mao >> teaches and insists! Stalin rightly pointed that *“practice gropes in the >> dark if its path is not illumined in revolutionary theory”. *What has >> ensued during this past two weeks in this platform has not been merely >> polemics however a discourse analysis which seeks unravel and explain the >> deep rooted nature and form of prevalent internal party contradictions >> which has manifested themselves in the form of NEC feuding and factionalism >> while some of us have gone further to define these occurrences as conflict >> of two line ideological struggle one being a comprador bourgeoisie line, >> the other being a revolutionary socialist Pan Africanist line not merely as* >> “erroneous political line”. *It follow the same ideological discourse >> analysis, the APLAMVA as component structure whose object should be >> political is supposed to advance the ultimate goal of Pan Africanism as >> elaborated by the former Secretary of Education Peter Raboroko, it can’t >> for it equally suffers a stranglehold of a comprador bourgeoisie leadership >> cartel feuding which has less or no interest to advance revolutionary >> socialist Pan Africanist line. Comrade Fihla, if you permit that one uses >> and extend the same Mao quotation where he alludes *“Unless you have >> investigated a problem, you will be deprived of the right to speak on it. >> Isn’t that too harsh? Not in the least. When you have not probed into a >> problem, into the present facts and its past history, and know nothing of >> its essentials, whatever you say about it will undoubtedly be nonsense. >> Talking nonsense solves no problems, as everyone knows, so why is it unjust >> to deprive you of the right to speak? Quite a few comrades always keep >> their eyes shut and talk nonsense, and for a Communist that is disgraceful. >> How can a Communist keep his eyes shut and talk nonsense**?* The >> political conclusions of a Marxists-Leninist Party such as the PAC >> proceed from theoretical analyses and are constantly checked and regulated >> by them. That is the only way to assure a firm and consistent policy. *As >> Trotsky says, in theoretical matters “we must keep our house clean”.* >> >> >> >> The e-mail you narrowly contest further alludes the following, there are >> and has been so many caucuses ever since 2007/8 to date, but every >> caucuses have yielded no tangible results but the situation has worsened >> because the current crop of some PAC members and those with leadership >> ambitions are highly unprincipled and determined to break any law just to >> secure positions be they at the REC, PEC and NEC. >> >> >> >> PAC Branches and members have abandoned principles and the correct >> political line as enshrined in the 1959 Pan Africanist Manifesto including >> all Basic Documents. A lot in the party is from branch level to members to >> national leadership is totally wrong and rotten! Gone are the principles >> in the PAC, as others argue to justify their conduct they claim that >> "people do eat principles". >> >> First task should be PAC branches and members should resolve their >> differences at a regional level first and unite! Then provincial inclusive >> meetings should be organised to consolidate the unity achieved at >> regional level! >> >> >> >> Lastly, as PAC Branches and members seek to forge principled unity and to >> re-build the PAC, they should equally be cognisant that internally PAC is >> facing a two line ideological struggle one being a *revolutionary >> socialist Pan Africanist line *while the other* is* *comprador >> bourgeoisie line hiding under the cloak of African Nationalism! It then >> becomes of paramount importance, the provoke further inquisition will the >> unity and re-building of PAC be under which political line, the comprador >> bourgeoisie line? Or revolutionary socialist Pan Africanist line?* >> >> >> >> Shango lashu >> >> Nkrumah >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> *From:* Mbulelo Raymond [mailto:mrfihl...@gmail.com <mrfihl...@gmail.com>] >> >> *Sent:* 09 September 2014 11:06 PM >> *To:* Nkrumah Raymond KGAGUDI >> *Cc:* nnyq...@gmail.com; kutie.thondl...@gmail.com; i...@bataufc.com; >> mvakalijust...@gmail.com; wgaj...@gmail.com; malingeplaat...@yahoo.com; >> mphah...@eskom.co.za; tnta...@webmail.co.za; dud...@webmail.co.za; >> tumimod...@hotmail.co.za; nakaphala.ba...@gmail.com; >> takalaniligeg...@gmail.com; ramotw...@maruleng.gov.za; >> mbuyigan...@yahoo.com; znyam...@gmail.com; mnd...@yahoo.com; >> celenjabulo...@gmail.com; payco@googlegroups.com; p...@vodamail.co.za; >> bulanng...@gmail.com; m...@soultalk.co.za; monyanepin...@gmail.com; >> ad...@pac.org.za; lucasmmol...@gmail.com; lea...@hotmail.com; >> pacmogalec...@gmail.com; po...@yahoo.com; bulelanim1...@nokiamail.com; >> mbind...@gmail.com; pactshwanereg...@gmail.com; dmalo...@klerksdorp.org; >> mapulankoan...@gmail.com; sbusiso.x...@gmail.com; dumisani...@gmail.com; >> goqwana.san...@gmail.com; richardma...@yahoo.com; billiard.s...@gmail.com; >> jntab...@gmail.com; phillipdhlam...@yahoo.com; joseph.maqhek...@sasol.com; >> mop...@pac.org.za; pasmapresid...@gmail.com; s...@pac.org.za; >> moshemahlom...@gmail.com; digashuma...@gmail.com; vu...@telkomsa.net; >> mphothobej...@yahoo.com; sndam...@pac-cape.org.za; >> 0825164...@vodamail.co.za; tyamza...@yahoo.com; rammymfulw...@gmail.com; >> linda.ndeb...@newcastle.gov.za; bennet_j...@yahoo.com; >> paccapeme...@webmail.co.za; pac.nc...@gmail.com; ndhlo...@pac.org.za; >> isaa...@diplomat-global.com; njabulo.m...@gmail.com; >> phumzilenom...@hotmail.co.za; river.mla...@telkomsa.net; >> hlubi.so...@gmail.com; mokoen...@workmail.co.za; pacaza...@webmail.co.za; >> APLAMVA WESTERN CAPE >> *Subject:* Re: [PAYCO] FW: attack on party annual conference >> >> >> >> M'Afrika Nkrumah I am really disappointed with you son of the soil. You >> know, Chairman Mao says "no investigation, no talk because if you speak >> without investigating you will speak nonsense". From your language, I can >> gather that you have never been to any of the prisons to visit the APLA >> members who are still languishing in prison. You are here only using them >> and their plight as a campaign tool for purposes only best known to you. >> >> For you to accuse APLAMVA of not caring for members in prison is an >> insult. If you care to know, APLAMVA as led by me, never beats the drums >> for the work it is doing. We are not campaigning for positions in the PAC >> and as such, we try to avoid entering into unnecessary gimmicks. For your >> information, a number of these comrades you are referring to have already >> been released through our efforts. The last one to be released is Thabo >> Makela who was released only last week. Before him just a month ago comrade >> Themba Masemola was released. Whilst you have never been to any of the >> prisons to visit these comrades and buy them soap, some of us are always >> there doing everything possible within our power to get these comrades out >> of prison. That we are not making noise about it is not because we are >> stupid or hypocritical as you put it. It is because some of us are not >> petty, we do not seek popularity or glory over what we consider to be our >> responsibility and duty. If again you cared to know, we are currently busy >> with the social workers from the Department of Correctional Services to try >> and find ways of releasing comrade Kenny Motsamai, not through the populist >> slanders and wild accusations you make, but through honest initiatives >> which we believe are better than slogans and meaningless street noises. >> >> Lastly, I would like to invite you at your earliest convenience, to join >> us on a visit to Boksburg prison to visit the comrades you are theorizing >> about. Kindly note also that such visits, cause money, about R400 plus as >> these comrades need toiletries and other basic necessities >> >> Accept my regards >> -- -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Pan Africanist Youth Congress" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to payco+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Pan Africanist Youth Congress" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to payco+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Pan Africanist Youth Congress" group. 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