Re: [PD] pd-extended crashes sending data to SSR with tcpclient

2013-07-01 Thread IOhannes m zmoelnig
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On 2013-06-29 20:19, Iain Mott wrote:
 Hi list,
 
 Pd-extended (Pd-0.43.1 extended-20120430 compiled 00:31:34 Apr 30
 2012) is crashing when I send data to the SoundScape Renderer on 
 Ubuntu 12.04 using tcpclient.

hmm, since Pd and SSR are only communicating via a network socket, i
only have 2 possible explanations:

- - either the network code is broken
- - or SSR sends data in a format that exposes/triggers a bug (e.g. a
memory leak) in Pd

since there are several network implementations, which one are you
using? mrpeach? iemnet??

do SSR and Pd agree on the actual protocol? e.g. OSC over TCP/IP (if
it is that) used to be badly defined in the olde days, and you still
see the deprecated non-SLIP implementation. afaik liblo only recently
changed their TCP/IP code to use SLIP.

could you get a backtrace of the crash? [1]

do you notice anything weird?
like when running htop besides Pd, do you see an excess of memory usage?


try running Pd with -verbose -verbose -stderr; sometimes their is a
printout when Pd is crashing, which get's lost once the Pd-GUI closes
(that is: quite immediately)

fgamsdr
IOhannes


[1] http://wiki.debian.org/HowToGetABacktrace
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Re: [PD] pd-extended crashes sending data to SSR with tcpclient

2013-07-01 Thread Iain Mott
Thanks very much IOhannes! 

The mrpeach version was being loaded by default. When I use
iemnet/tcpclient it doesn't crash. That's great.

There's a difference however in the way mrpeach/tcpclient and
iemnet/tcpclient sends received data to its output. 

Messages from SSR received by mrpeach/tcpclient are sent to its output
as a list (if that's the right word), for example as:

60 117 112 100 97 116 101 62 60 115 111 117 114 99 101 32 105 100 61 39
49 39 32 108 101 118 101 108 61 39 45 57 56 46 56 53 51 49 39 47 62 60
115 111 117 114 99 101 32 105 100 61 39 50 39 32 108 101 118 101 108 61
39 45 49 48 48 46 49 55 55 39 47 62 60 115 111 117 114 99 101 32 105 100
61 39 51 39 32 108 101 118 101 108 61 39 45 49 48 48 46 53 53 54 39 47
62 60 115 111 117 114 99 101 32 105 100 61 39 52 39 32 108 101 118 101
108 61 39 45 57 56 46 51 50 51 57 39 47 62 60 47 117 112 100 97 116 101
62 0

This is easily converted to a readable XML string with string2any 0 0
to get:

updatesource id='1' level='-98.8531'/source id='2'
level='-100.177'/source id='3' level='-100.556'/source id='4'
level='-98.3239'//update

iemnet/tcpclient on the other hand sends individual numbers to its
output as a stream rather than a list. 

eg

60
117
112
100
97
... etc. 

And there are various messages of various lengths. I guess if I use
iemnet/tcpclient I'll need to find a different way of parsing these
numbers Not my strong point with Pd!

I'll try the backtrace and other things you suggest and report back on
mrpeach/tcpclient in another email.

Cheers and thanks again,

Iain




Em Mon, 2013-07-01 às 09:23 +0200, IOhannes m zmoelnig escreveu:
 On 2013-06-29 20:19, Iain Mott wrote:
  Hi list,
  
  Pd-extended (Pd-0.43.1 extended-20120430 compiled 00:31:34 Apr 30
  2012) is crashing when I send data to the SoundScape Renderer on 
  Ubuntu 12.04 using tcpclient.
 
 hmm, since Pd and SSR are only communicating via a network socket, i
 only have 2 possible explanations:
 
 - either the network code is broken
 - or SSR sends data in a format that exposes/triggers a bug (e.g. a
 memory leak) in Pd
 
 since there are several network implementations, which one are you
 using? mrpeach? iemnet??
 
 do SSR and Pd agree on the actual protocol? e.g. OSC over TCP/IP (if
 it is that) used to be badly defined in the olde days, and you still
 see the deprecated non-SLIP implementation. afaik liblo only recently
 changed their TCP/IP code to use SLIP.
 
 could you get a backtrace of the crash? [1]
 
 do you notice anything weird?
 like when running htop besides Pd, do you see an excess of memory usage?
 
 
 try running Pd with -verbose -verbose -stderr; sometimes their is a
 printout when Pd is crashing, which get's lost once the Pd-GUI closes
 (that is: quite immediately)
 
 fgamsdr
 IOhannes
 
 
 [1] http://wiki.debian.org/HowToGetABacktrace
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Re: [PD] pd-extended crashes sending data to SSR with tcpclient

2013-07-01 Thread IOhannes m zmoelnig
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On 2013-07-01 16:40, Iain Mott wrote:
 Thanks very much IOhannes!
 
 The mrpeach version was being loaded by default. When I use 
 iemnet/tcpclient it doesn't crash. That's great.

it is, though i'm sometimes under the impression that mrpeach is a bit
more stable than iemnet (rather than the other way around)

 
 There's a difference however in the way mrpeach/tcpclient and 
 iemnet/tcpclient sends received data to its output.
 
 Messages from SSR received by mrpeach/tcpclient are sent to its
 output as a list (if that's the right word), for example as:
 
[...]
 This is easily converted to a readable XML string with string2any
 0 0 to get:
 
 updatesource id='1' level='-98.8531'/source id='2' 
 level='-100.177'/source id='3' level='-100.556'/source id='4' 
 level='-98.3239'//update
 
 iemnet/tcpclient on the other hand sends individual numbers to its 
 output as a stream rather than a list.
 
[...]
 ... etc.
 
 And there are various messages of various lengths. I guess if I
 use iemnet/tcpclient I'll need to find a different way of parsing
 these numbers Not my strong point with Pd!


well the point is, that TCP/IP as an underlying protocol doesn't know
anything about packets - it is stream-based, like a serial connection.
if you are relying on the packets coming out of the [tcpclient] object
as strings of the correct length, then your code is broken.
you *must* have a way to determine the end of an atomic junk of data
without relying on the list length.
[iemnet/tcpclient] makes this obvious from the beginning, as it will
never lure you into security of correct length lists (though there
is a hidden flag that gives you the same behaviour as
[mrpeach/tcpclient]).
outputting the bytes one-by-one should actually make it easier to
re-packetize the data.

e.g. your example string looks like '0' was a delimiting character (at
least it appears at the end of the [mrpeach/tcpclient] example output).
if this is indeed the case, you only have to [list append] the
incoming bytes until you encounter 0, and then flush the buffer to
the output - this way your packages will always be of the correct length.

 
 I'll try the backtrace and other things you suggest and report back
 on mrpeach/tcpclient in another email.

it could well be, that it only does not crash with [iemnet/tcpclient]
because you haven't parsed the output yet...


fgmads
IOhannes
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Re: [PD] pd-extended crashes sending data to SSR with tcpclient

2013-07-01 Thread Iain Mott

  I'll try the backtrace and other things you suggest and report back
  on mrpeach/tcpclient in another email.
 
 it could well be, that it only does not crash with [iemnet/tcpclient]
 because you haven't parsed the output yet...
 

Don't think so - to crash Pd, I wasn't doing any parsing of incoming
messages - just sending messages out.

Did a backtrace using mrpeach/tcpclient - on a freeze as it didn't
actually crash. Got this response:

#0  0x00442623 in clock_unset (x=0x8c5c80) at m_sched.c:70
#1  clock_unset (x=0x8c5c80) at m_sched.c:62
#2  0x0044266e in clock_set (x=0x8c5c80, setticks=optimised
out)
at m_sched.c:81
#3  0x7fffd21cfec1 in tcpclient_child_send (w=0xdec548)

at /home/kiilo/Documents/dev/pd-svn/externals/mrpeach/net/tcpclient.c:380
#4  0x77bc4e9a in start_thread ()
   from /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libpthread.so.0
#5  0x76ec0ccd in clone () from /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libc.so.6
#6  0x in ?? ()


Will do some more tests later.

Thanks,


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Re: [PD] pd-extended crashes sending data to SSR with tcpclient

2013-07-01 Thread Martin Peach
It could be that you are overloading Pd with too many messages. If you 
are wildly moving the slider and [tcpclient] is sending one TCP packet 
per value you can add messages to the queue faster than they will be 
sent out and Pd will eventually run out of resources.


Maybe put a [speedlim] after your slider, or pack several values into 
one message?


Martin



On 2013-07-01 11:53, Iain Mott wrote:



I'll try the backtrace and other things you suggest and report back
on mrpeach/tcpclient in another email.


it could well be, that it only does not crash with [iemnet/tcpclient]
because you haven't parsed the output yet...



Don't think so - to crash Pd, I wasn't doing any parsing of incoming
messages - just sending messages out.

Did a backtrace using mrpeach/tcpclient - on a freeze as it didn't
actually crash. Got this response:

#0  0x00442623 in clock_unset (x=0x8c5c80) at m_sched.c:70
#1  clock_unset (x=0x8c5c80) at m_sched.c:62
#2  0x0044266e in clock_set (x=0x8c5c80, setticks=optimised
out)
 at m_sched.c:81
#3  0x7fffd21cfec1 in tcpclient_child_send (w=0xdec548)

at /home/kiilo/Documents/dev/pd-svn/externals/mrpeach/net/tcpclient.c:380
#4  0x77bc4e9a in start_thread ()
from /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libpthread.so.0
#5  0x76ec0ccd in clone () from /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libc.so.6
#6  0x in ?? ()


Will do some more tests later.

Thanks,


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Re: [PD] pd-extended crashes sending data to SSR with tcpclient

2013-07-01 Thread Ivica Bukvic
In my experience, this may bog down pd but it should never crash it. If it
does, something else is the problem.
On Jul 1, 2013 1:24 PM, Martin Peach martin.pe...@sympatico.ca wrote:

 It could be that you are overloading Pd with too many messages. If you are
 wildly moving the slider and [tcpclient] is sending one TCP packet per
 value you can add messages to the queue faster than they will be sent out
 and Pd will eventually run out of resources.

 Maybe put a [speedlim] after your slider, or pack several values into one
 message?

 Martin



 On 2013-07-01 11:53, Iain Mott wrote:


  I'll try the backtrace and other things you suggest and report back
 on mrpeach/tcpclient in another email.


 it could well be, that it only does not crash with [iemnet/tcpclient]
 because you haven't parsed the output yet...


 Don't think so - to crash Pd, I wasn't doing any parsing of incoming
 messages - just sending messages out.

 Did a backtrace using mrpeach/tcpclient - on a freeze as it didn't
 actually crash. Got this response:

 #0  0x00442623 in clock_unset (x=0x8c5c80) at m_sched.c:70
 #1  clock_unset (x=0x8c5c80) at m_sched.c:62
 #2  0x0044266e in clock_set (x=0x8c5c80, setticks=optimised
 out)
  at m_sched.c:81
 #3  0x7fffd21cfec1 in tcpclient_child_send (w=0xdec548)

 at /home/kiilo/Documents/dev/pd-**svn/externals/mrpeach/net/**
 tcpclient.c:380
 #4  0x77bc4e9a in start_thread ()
 from /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/**libpthread.so.0
 #5  0x76ec0ccd in clone () from /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libc.so.**6
 #6  0x in ?? ()


 Will do some more tests later.

 Thanks,


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Re: [PD] pd-extended crashes sending data to SSR with tcpclient

2013-07-01 Thread Iain Mott
Hi Martin,

The actual patch I'm using is translating MIDI pitch bend data recorded
in Ardour3 (location data encoded as pitchbend for practical purposes),
translating it into XML and sending it through to the SSR. It's already
limiting the rate to 10 messages every second for each moving source and
so far I'm only using 4 sources. This rate, done for testing, is already
less than ideal. Each location message sent SSR for a given source looks
something like the following:

requestsource id=1position x=1.234
y=-0.234//source/request

Does this seem excessive?

Cheers,

Iain



Em Mon, 2013-07-01 às 13:20 -0400, Martin Peach escreveu:
 It could be that you are overloading Pd with too many messages. If you 
 are wildly moving the slider and [tcpclient] is sending one TCP packet 
 per value you can add messages to the queue faster than they will be 
 sent out and Pd will eventually run out of resources.
 
 Maybe put a [speedlim] after your slider, or pack several values into 
 one message?
 
 Martin
 
 
 
 On 2013-07-01 11:53, Iain Mott wrote:
 
  I'll try the backtrace and other things you suggest and report back
  on mrpeach/tcpclient in another email.
 
  it could well be, that it only does not crash with [iemnet/tcpclient]
  because you haven't parsed the output yet...
 
 
  Don't think so - to crash Pd, I wasn't doing any parsing of incoming
  messages - just sending messages out.
 
  Did a backtrace using mrpeach/tcpclient - on a freeze as it didn't
  actually crash. Got this response:
 
  #0  0x00442623 in clock_unset (x=0x8c5c80) at m_sched.c:70
  #1  clock_unset (x=0x8c5c80) at m_sched.c:62
  #2  0x0044266e in clock_set (x=0x8c5c80, setticks=optimised
  out)
   at m_sched.c:81
  #3  0x7fffd21cfec1 in tcpclient_child_send (w=0xdec548)
 
  at /home/kiilo/Documents/dev/pd-svn/externals/mrpeach/net/tcpclient.c:380
  #4  0x77bc4e9a in start_thread ()
  from /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libpthread.so.0
  #5  0x76ec0ccd in clone () from /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libc.so.6
  #6  0x in ?? ()
 
 
  Will do some more tests later.
 
  Thanks,
 
 
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Re: [PD] pd-extended crashes sending data to SSR with tcpclient

2013-07-01 Thread Martin Peach
Forty times a second is relatively slow. Must be something else. I would 
use wireshark to see what packets are actually going over the wire, 
especially to see what the last one is.
These speeds are probably too fast for [print]ing to the console; that 
can cause problems.

Are you sending to the same machine? If not is WiFi involved?
Can you use UDP instead of TCP (for lower overhead and no out-of-order 
packets)?


Martin

On 2013-07-01 13:58, Iain Mott wrote:

Hi Martin,

The actual patch I'm using is translating MIDI pitch bend data recorded
in Ardour3 (location data encoded as pitchbend for practical purposes),
translating it into XML and sending it through to the SSR. It's already
limiting the rate to 10 messages every second for each moving source and
so far I'm only using 4 sources. This rate, done for testing, is already
less than ideal. Each location message sent SSR for a given source looks
something like the following:

requestsource id=1position x=1.234
y=-0.234//source/request

Does this seem excessive?

Cheers,

Iain



Em Mon, 2013-07-01 às 13:20 -0400, Martin Peach escreveu:

It could be that you are overloading Pd with too many messages. If you
are wildly moving the slider and [tcpclient] is sending one TCP packet
per value you can add messages to the queue faster than they will be
sent out and Pd will eventually run out of resources.

Maybe put a [speedlim] after your slider, or pack several values into
one message?

Martin



On 2013-07-01 11:53, Iain Mott wrote:



I'll try the backtrace and other things you suggest and report back
on mrpeach/tcpclient in another email.


it could well be, that it only does not crash with [iemnet/tcpclient]
because you haven't parsed the output yet...



Don't think so - to crash Pd, I wasn't doing any parsing of incoming
messages - just sending messages out.

Did a backtrace using mrpeach/tcpclient - on a freeze as it didn't
actually crash. Got this response:

#0  0x00442623 in clock_unset (x=0x8c5c80) at m_sched.c:70
#1  clock_unset (x=0x8c5c80) at m_sched.c:62
#2  0x0044266e in clock_set (x=0x8c5c80, setticks=optimised
out)
  at m_sched.c:81
#3  0x7fffd21cfec1 in tcpclient_child_send (w=0xdec548)

at /home/kiilo/Documents/dev/pd-svn/externals/mrpeach/net/tcpclient.c:380
#4  0x77bc4e9a in start_thread ()
 from /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libpthread.so.0
#5  0x76ec0ccd in clone () from /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libc.so.6
#6  0x in ?? ()


Will do some more tests later.

Thanks,


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[PD] GOP text field / symbol which is resizeable? (was: GOP text field which sends bang?)

2013-07-01 Thread András Murányi
I'm reformulating my question as the problem is evolving:
do we have an object that
- Displays and holds a text value (like Symbol or Message box),
- is Graph-on-Parent,
- can be resized (like Number2)? (or small enough by default?)

Something like a Number2 for symbols...? Or a settable comment...?

Thanks,

András

On Sun, Jun 23, 2013 at 9:22 PM, András Murányi muran...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hi List,

 I'm trying to switch from oldstyle dropdown combo box (toxy/widget popup)
 to tof/plist which is a nice dropdown menu except it has no placeholder,
 but the menu appears wherever when sent a bang.
 My question is: do we have an object that
 - Displays and holds a text value (like Symbol or Message box),
 - is Graph-on-Parent,
 - emits a bang when clicked?

 It doesn't have to be Vanilla.

 Thanks,

 András

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Re: [PD] pd-extended crashes sending data to SSR with tcpclient

2013-07-01 Thread Roman Haefeli
On Mon, 2013-07-01 at 13:20 -0400, Martin Peach wrote:
 It could be that you are overloading Pd with too many messages. If you 
 are wildly moving the slider and [tcpclient] is sending one TCP packet 
 per value you can add messages to the queue faster than they will be 
 sent out and Pd will eventually run out of resources.

There seem to exist different approaches to address this problem. If I'm
not mistaken, [netsend] uses a fixed buffer and when filled it blocks Pd
until the buffer gets emptied. [iemnet/tcp[client|send]] allocates just
as much RAM as it needs and does not block Pd. If [net/tcpclient] really
is designed to crash Pd when the buffer gets full, then I would think
this is the least desirable behavior of all three.

@Iain
If it really crashes due to network saturation can easily be verified by
testing the same patch with [iemnet/tcpclient]. If you throw more
messages at it than it can actually transmit, you would notice an
increasing lag on the other end.

Roman


 On 2013-07-01 11:53, Iain Mott wrote:
 
  I'll try the backtrace and other things you suggest and report back
  on mrpeach/tcpclient in another email.
 
  it could well be, that it only does not crash with [iemnet/tcpclient]
  because you haven't parsed the output yet...
 
 
  Don't think so - to crash Pd, I wasn't doing any parsing of incoming
  messages - just sending messages out.
 
  Did a backtrace using mrpeach/tcpclient - on a freeze as it didn't
  actually crash. Got this response:
 
  #0  0x00442623 in clock_unset (x=0x8c5c80) at m_sched.c:70
  #1  clock_unset (x=0x8c5c80) at m_sched.c:62
  #2  0x0044266e in clock_set (x=0x8c5c80, setticks=optimised
  out)
   at m_sched.c:81
  #3  0x7fffd21cfec1 in tcpclient_child_send (w=0xdec548)
 
  at /home/kiilo/Documents/dev/pd-svn/externals/mrpeach/net/tcpclient.c:380
  #4  0x77bc4e9a in start_thread ()
  from /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libpthread.so.0
  #5  0x76ec0ccd in clone () from /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libc.so.6
  #6  0x in ?? ()
 
 
  Will do some more tests later.
 
  Thanks,
 
 
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Re: [PD] GOP text field / symbol which is resizeable? (was: GOP text field which sends bang?)

2013-07-01 Thread Roman Haefeli
On Mon, 2013-07-01 at 20:56 +0200, András Murányi wrote:
 I'm reformulating my question as the problem is evolving:
 do we have an object that
 - Displays and holds a text value (like Symbol or Message box),

* symbolbox with width set 0 resizes dynamically
* hsl, vsl, cnv, etc. can adjust size with 'size' message, can change
displayed text with 'label' message

 - is Graph-on-Parent,

applies to all above solutions.

 - can be resized (like Number2)? (or small enough by default?)

see above.

To make something send a bang, you could put some [bng] objects behind
your whatever text displaying objects. Interestingly, hidden GUI objects
have priority over visible objects when clicked. Another way is to use a
construct like the following to make a slider send bangs only when
clicked, but not when dragged:

[hsl]
|
[t a a]
  \/
  /\
[sel 0]


Roman




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Re: [PD] pd-extended crashes sending data to SSR with tcpclient

2013-07-01 Thread Iain Mott
Using iemnet/tcpclient and implementing IOhannes parsing suggestion, my
patch is now communicating with SSR without crashing. There is a
bogging down problem though and testing with just 3 sources, I need to
keep the limit at 10 messages/sec for each. It stops working at higher
rates but doesn't crash. SSR is running on this local machine and there
is no WiFi involved. Unfortunately I don't think UDP is an option with
SSR.

SSR also sends XML level data to tcpclient constantly for each source
in the scene. Perhaps this extra traffic isn't helping. eg.

updatesource id='1' level='-98.5405'/source id='2'
level='-99.8139'/source id='3' level='-99.6628'/source id='4'
level='-101.127'//update

I'll wait to hear back from SSR to see if they have any suggestions.

Cheers and thanks for your help everyone,

Iain







Em Mon, 2013-07-01 às 14:29 -0400, Martin Peach escreveu:
 Forty times a second is relatively slow. Must be something else. I would 
 use wireshark to see what packets are actually going over the wire, 
 especially to see what the last one is.
 These speeds are probably too fast for [print]ing to the console; that 
 can cause problems.
 Are you sending to the same machine? If not is WiFi involved?
 Can you use UDP instead of TCP (for lower overhead and no out-of-order 
 packets)?
 
 Martin
 
 On 2013-07-01 13:58, Iain Mott wrote:
  Hi Martin,
 
  The actual patch I'm using is translating MIDI pitch bend data recorded
  in Ardour3 (location data encoded as pitchbend for practical purposes),
  translating it into XML and sending it through to the SSR. It's already
  limiting the rate to 10 messages every second for each moving source and
  so far I'm only using 4 sources. This rate, done for testing, is already
  less than ideal. Each location message sent SSR for a given source looks
  something like the following:
 
  requestsource id=1position x=1.234
  y=-0.234//source/request
 
  Does this seem excessive?
 
  Cheers,
 
  Iain
 
 
 
  Em Mon, 2013-07-01 às 13:20 -0400, Martin Peach escreveu:
  It could be that you are overloading Pd with too many messages. If you
  are wildly moving the slider and [tcpclient] is sending one TCP packet
  per value you can add messages to the queue faster than they will be
  sent out and Pd will eventually run out of resources.
 
  Maybe put a [speedlim] after your slider, or pack several values into
  one message?
 
  Martin
 
 
 
  On 2013-07-01 11:53, Iain Mott wrote:
 
  I'll try the backtrace and other things you suggest and report back
  on mrpeach/tcpclient in another email.
 
  it could well be, that it only does not crash with [iemnet/tcpclient]
  because you haven't parsed the output yet...
 
 
  Don't think so - to crash Pd, I wasn't doing any parsing of incoming
  messages - just sending messages out.
 
  Did a backtrace using mrpeach/tcpclient - on a freeze as it didn't
  actually crash. Got this response:
 
  #0  0x00442623 in clock_unset (x=0x8c5c80) at m_sched.c:70
  #1  clock_unset (x=0x8c5c80) at m_sched.c:62
  #2  0x0044266e in clock_set (x=0x8c5c80, setticks=optimised
  out)
at m_sched.c:81
  #3  0x7fffd21cfec1 in tcpclient_child_send (w=0xdec548)
 
  at /home/kiilo/Documents/dev/pd-svn/externals/mrpeach/net/tcpclient.c:380
  #4  0x77bc4e9a in start_thread ()
   from /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libpthread.so.0
  #5  0x76ec0ccd in clone () from /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libc.so.6
  #6  0x in ?? ()
 
 
  Will do some more tests later.
 
  Thanks,
 
 
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