Re: [PD] [PD-dev] Rewriting a unified phasor / metro object for reading tables
On Thu, 2014-03-06 at 19:22 -0500, Brian Fay wrote: On Tue, Mar 4, 2014 at 8:53 PM, Chris McCormick ch...@mccormick.cx wrote: Not sure if this is relevant or already common knowledge but newer versions of Pd allow you to specify metro and delay tempo units, including in samples. e.g. [metro 500 1 samp]. Does anybody know if sample-accurate [metros] are available in libpd? Assuming, that libpd uses the same code for [metro], I'd say yes. I'm making an application that allows for fairly arbitrary divisions of a tempo. Originally I was going to make clocks out of metros, but I wasn't aware that you could set a [metro] faster than one bang per ms. [metro] used to have an artificial lower limit of 1ms. I assume this was implemented in order to save Pd from freezing if a [metro] accidentally received a '0' as interval. It seems that is not the case anymore in 0.45. The current behavior is that it allows any non-zero input, but falls back to one unit as defined in the 'tempo' method when set to 0. If I wanted a bunch of different rhythms, not just eigths and sixteenths, but triplets and divisions of fives or sevens or whatever, I would need to make a bunch of [metro] objects (or maybe one running at the least common multiple of the various divisions). In the end, I settled on handling this logic in the Java side of my application by counting samples and doing some math. This is still only sample precise, while you could make it sub-sample precise in Pd. This isn't addressed to you specifically, but it is a common misconception to think of the audio domain as being precise and the message domain as being rounded to vectors. This might apply to many softwares, especially those that have two configured rates, one audio sampling rate and one fixed control rate. However, there is no such thing as a control rate in Pd. It is true, though, that many classes with message inlets and signal outlets only evaluate the incoming message only at block boundaries ([tabplay~], [line~] and more). However, [vline~] is the __one__ class that connects the two worlds (message and signal) without losing precision. But I'm getting off-topic now, as your topic is about precision in the message domain only. Anyway, the precision of [metro], [delay], [timer] and co is only limited by the float type used in Pd. I can schedule bangs at arbitrary divisions of a base amount of time (so I can make seven-tuplets or fiftythree-uplets or whatever strange rhythm I want to). In theory my solution should be sample-accurate, and it sounds like it's working fine. But is there a straightforward way to do this in pd that I completely overlooked? It depends on what you consider straight-forward. It is certainly possible to have many [metro]s with arbitrary divisions running in sync. I still think the whole topic is very complex. I implemented something like that in some of the netpd instruments. However, I figured the tick rate of the master metro would be way too high, if I'd make it dividable by all the possible divisions I can think of. I went for a different strategy. The master metro ticks at 16th of the given BPM. I made an [metro] replacement abstraction that takes divisor and dividend as arguments. [polymetro 7 5] plays 7 ticks within the period of 5 ticks of the master metro. [polymetro] is designed so that it runs on its own and plays 7 ticks and then waits for every 5th master tick to start again. The difficult part was to allow tempo changes without losing sync. Pd's [metro] applies the new tempo only at the next tick. In order to be able to run many [polymetro]s concurrently without them losing sync on tempo changes, I had to create a [metro] replacement that allows for in-interval tempo changes. By using that [metro] replacement in the master metro and the [polymetro]s, it is possible to change tempo at any time without losing sync. One issue, that I haven't solved yet is a clean start at an arbitrary tick. [polymetro] doesn't immediately start when master metro is started at a non-zero tick, but it waits for the next sync tick of the master (any 5th master metro tick in the case of [polymetro 7 5]). Roman ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] RjDj/ScenePlayer for iOS?
Dan, FWIW I very much appreciate the work you've done on PdParty, and though as you know my testing was very brief and limited primarily to MIDI-related support, it worked well in the simple test case I programmed. Perhaps more importantly, and as has been discussed a bit in here in recent weeks, as a purely Max-based person till now, I began to explore Pd for the sole reason that it offered more iOS and Android support than what's currently available for Max. Things like PdParty are what brought me this way... -- Dan Nigrin / Defective Records / http://defectiverecords.com CycliC, M185 Klee Sequencers / MC-4 MC-202 Hack / Audio Plugin Player / General MIDI Player / Major Malfunction Jack OS X / http://jackosx.com From: Dan Wilcox danomat...@gmail.com Date: Thursday, March 6, 2014 at 12:28 PM To: PD List pd-list@iem.at Subject: Re: [PD] RjDj/ScenePlayer for iOS? Yes, Iohannes, RjDj scenes work in PdParty. I have tested all of the scenes I have from years ago, including interactive ones which use the accelerometer like the bouncy scene. I do not support scenes generated by the now defunct rjc1000 elper app nor do I support the scene paging feature used in the rjdj intro scene, but AFAIK that's the only scene that used it. I would hope that other libpd based apps would adopt the same rjdj messaging standard so patches would work, at least, between PdParty PdDroidParty. -- The following is not aimed at you, IOhannes, but at noone in particular begin rant PdParty has been in beta since September 2013 and I've been talking loudly about it since spring of last year. Back then I said it would support RjDj scenes and even posted about my intentions when RjDj was removed from the app store in 2011. With the beta, I wrote a very detailed user guide that clearly states that it not only support RjDj scenes but also has all of the same rj objects and events ([#touch], [#accelerate], etc). At this point, it is clearly beyond a port of PdDroidParty as I have reimplemented *all* of the Pd-vanilla/iem guis in Obj-C CoreGraphics. In fact, you can animate and change their color, etc on the fly like in the regular pd gui. My long term dream would be to add patch creation/editing but that's really contingent on getting some sort of gui helper layer into libpd as I have no desire to reverse engineer parts of the existing gui framework. I have put out beta calls more than once and have only had perhaps middling interest, with a few people saying they installed it, but far less people have signed up than I would have thought. (A thank you to those that have and bigger thank you to those that have provided feedback.) I recently was told that having to sign up for a beta testing service was far too difficult and I should just put it on the app store. I imagine those same people would complain on the app store when something that could have been tested in beta didn't work. The whole point of a beta is to get help finding bugs in a private manner from people who would know what to look for, not the general public or students trying to use it in a class. It's supposed to be a community effort to HELP ME put out a new platform app for FREE. Once on the app store, it should basically *just work* otherwise it will be uninstalled more quickly than the time it took to install it. Also, I was hoping that people would also help me make cool demo scenes patches, but that hasn't happened either. All of this is after I've spent probably 2 months of full time unpaid solo work on PdParty in 2013. I could expect that people would in the very least show interest in this project and help me work on it for when I will basically put it out for free on the App Store. end rant -- Forwarded message -- From: Joe White white.j...@gmail.com To: Chris McCormick ch...@mccormick.cx Cc: pd-list pd-list@iem.at, IOhannes m zmölnig zmoel...@iem.at Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2014 10:02:26 + Subject: Re: [PD] RjDj/ScenePlayer for iOS? Hi IOhannes, Sorry I can't link directly to the right place but the user guide I linked to previously mentions there is support for what you're looking for. Search for #touch on this page https://github.com/danomatika/PdParty/blob/master/doc/PdParty_User_Guide.md Cheers, Joe On 3 March 2014 02:16, Chris McCormick ch...@mccormick.cx wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hi IOhannes, On 03/03/14 02:20, IOhannes m zmölnig wrote: On 02/28/2014 02:41 PM, Chris McCormick wrote: PdDroidParty supports multitouch thanks to Muddu Kishan. i think i was unclear here: i know that PdDroidParty has multi-touch support (as shown in the demo). but what i really meant was: raw access to (multiple) pointer(s), like the #touch message in RdDj, No, PdDroidParty does not do that. Would be minimal to implement. If someone submitted a patch to add that I would definitely merge it. Cheers, Chris. -- Dan Wilcox danomatika.com
[PD] [PD-announce] Visceral resonances from New York, Amsterdam and Karlsruhe
(sorry for x-posts) Dears, here's my 6-monthly newsletter, hope you enjoy the reading. http://marcodonnarumma.com/next/march2014/ What's up: - Watch Ominous, an incarnated sound sculpture - Xth Sense biophysical music workshop in New York - Next performances in New York, Amsterdam and Karlsruhe - The Xth Sense: Phase #2 launch at LISA Salon, New York - On the press: Molding sound with flesh on Create Digital Music best wishes, -- Marco Donnarumma Performer, body tinkerer, teacher and writer. #soundandmusic #biotech #freeculture EAVI - Goldsmiths, University of London ~ Portfolio: http://marcodonnarumma.com Research: http://res.marcodonnarumma.com ___ Pd-announce mailing list pd-annou...@iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] libpd and Unity
Are you using the libpd master branch? Can you use the pd_045-4 branch as that will become the new master soon. The change is that I added hook setter functions and updated all of the wrappers. I wasn't able to test the csharp wrapper, so if that's what you're using on Windows it would be nice to double check that it's working. On Mar 5, 2014, at 10:35 PM, pd-list-requ...@iem.at wrote: From: Varun Nair nothingtok...@gmail.com Subject: [PD] libpd and Unity Date: March 5, 2014 at 6:16:05 PM EST To: pd-list@iem.at Hi all, I extended Patrick Sebastien's work in libpd-4-unity on Windows and now have it working on OSX and Android. iOS is pending but will happen soon. The whole API hasn't been tested, but basic functionality is in place and works. More info here. Feedback and bug reports are welcome! Best, Varun Dan Wilcox @danomatika danomatika.com robotcowboy.com ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] RjDj/ScenePlayer for iOS?
Thanks Dan, Chris, and a few others who sent something. Yesterday was one of those bad days + I was sick :( I guess I've just been a bit disappointed with what I perceived as a lack of interest, but then again that would probably change once it's out on the App Store. I started with a need that transformed into an open tool for everyone so I've probably spent alot more effort to get it to that quality then if I only needed it for a few personal projects. I will be happy when I get video and patches back from people using it in performance ... not to mention myself getting away from coding and doing the same! Again, if anyone wants to join the beta, let me know. I'm going to probably have 1 or two more releases as I add some things I think are needed for an app store release. On Mar 7, 2014, at 9:37 AM, pd-list-requ...@iem.at wrote: From: Dan Nigrin d...@defectiverecords.com Subject: Re: [PD] RjDj/ScenePlayer for iOS? Date: March 7, 2014 at 7:00:07 AM EST To: PD List pd-list@iem.at Dan, FWIW I very much appreciate the work you've done on PdParty, and though as you know my testing was very brief and limited primarily to MIDI-related support, it worked well in the simple test case I programmed. Perhaps more importantly, and as has been discussed a bit in here in recent weeks, as a purely Max-based person till now, I began to explore Pd for the sole reason that it offered more iOS and Android support than what's currently available for Max. Things like PdParty are what brought me this way... Dan Wilcox @danomatika danomatika.com robotcowboy.com ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
[PD] KMI SoftStep foot controller?
Hi list, I think the SoftStep with Pd for live performance. Has anyone experienced the SoftStep with Pure Data? It can be a good solution for live situation with Pd? I think SoftStep one, not a 2nd edition. First edition is cheaper than 2nd. http://www.keithmcmillen.com/softstep Thanks, Jong ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] libpd and Unity
Yes, it was built from the master branch. The C# wrappers are used across OSX, Android and Windows in Unity. Will test pd_045-4 next when I get the time. Cheers Varun -- @ntkeep http://twitter.com/ntkeep re-sounding.com http://re-sounding.com designingsound.org http://designingsound.org Dan Wilcox mailto:danomat...@gmail.com 7 March 2014 14:53 Are you using the libpd master branch? Can you use the pd_045-4 branch as that will become the new master soon. The change is that I added hook setter functions and updated all of the wrappers. I wasn't able to test the csharp wrapper, so if that's what you're using on Windows it would be nice to double check that it's working. Dan Wilcox @danomatika danomatika.com http://danomatika.com robotcowboy.com http://robotcowboy.com ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] Data structures and click event
On 03/05/2014 05:24 AM, Pierre Massat wrote: Dear list, First of all i'd like to say that i'm very impressed by the potential of data structures in Pd. I've always kind of ignored this feature and it's a pity because it's really worth diving into it. That being said I think that help and example patches are far from sufficient for beginners, and if it wasn't for Chris McCormick's s-abstractions I would have been able to really figure out how to use them (stuff like how to make an entire polygon draggable, how to use GOP with proper scaling, etc.). It's not just the documentation, it's the interface. Having to walk linked-lists of graphically unlinked objects is bad. Having to use boilerplate to find the head of a glist just to create a scalar is bad. I think Pd-l2ork is getting close to a release with my new data structure stuff in it. It's a first step at addressing some of these issues.and any prospects of that stuff making it into vanilla or pd-ext, for the non-unix users out there?___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] Data structures and click event
I'll have to have a look and see what the ideas are... I don't know anything yet. Anyhow I think there are a couple of things that are higher priority: getting editing to be more user-friendly, and getting the IEM GUIs to behave better. And I'm afraid I can only write code at a fraction of the speed others can - so PD vanilla will always seem years behind everything else. cheers Miller On Sat, Mar 08, 2014 at 12:45:33AM +0100, João Pais wrote: On 03/05/2014 05:24 AM, Pierre Massat wrote: Dear list, First of all i'd like to say that i'm very impressed by the potential of data structures in Pd. I've always kind of ignored this feature and it's a pity because it's really worth diving into it.That being said I think that help and example patches are far from sufficient for beginners, and if it wasn't for Chris McCormick's s-abstractions I would have been able to really figure out how to use them (stuff like how to make an entire polygon draggable, how to use GOP with proper scaling, etc.). It's not just the documentation, it's the interface. Having to walk linked-lists of graphically unlinked objects is bad. Having to use boilerplate to find the head of a glist just to create a scalar is bad. I think Pd-l2ork is getting close to a release with my new data structure stuff in it. It's a first step at addressing some of these issues. and any prospects of that stuff making it into vanilla or pd-ext, for the non-unix users out there? ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] KMI SoftStep foot controller?
On 08/03/14 06:24, Jonghyun Kim wrote: Thanks Chris for the answer! I was worried about compatibility with Pd. How about OSC function with Pd? It's OSC works with [netsend] or [udpsend]? [your OSC message( | [packOSC] | [udpsend] pd-osc: /usr/lib/pd/extra/osc/packOSC.pd_linux pd-iemnet: /usr/lib/pd/extra/iemnet/udpsend.pd_linux Simon ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] libpd and Unity
Can you guys be clear about what is working? Pd audio in Unity? :-) crossing fingers Sent from my iPhone On Mar 7, 2014, at 1:45 PM, Varun Nair nothingtok...@gmail.commailto:nothingtok...@gmail.com wrote: Yes, it was built from the master branch. The C# wrappers are used across OSX, Android and Windows in Unity. Will test pd_045-4 next when I get the time. Cheers Varun -- @ntkeephttp://twitter.com/ntkeep re-sounding.comhttp://re-sounding.com designingsound.orghttp://designingsound.org Dan Wilcoxmailto:danomat...@gmail.com 7 March 2014 14:53 Are you using the libpd master branch? Can you use the pd_045-4 branch as that will become the new master soon. The change is that I added hook setter functions and updated all of the wrappers. I wasn't able to test the csharp wrapper, so if that's what you're using on Windows it would be nice to double check that it's working. Dan Wilcox @danomatika danomatika.comhttp://danomatika.com robotcowboy.comhttp://robotcowboy.com ___ Pd-list@iem.atmailto:Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] Data structures and click event
On 03/07/2014 06:45 PM, João Pais wrote: On 03/05/2014 05:24 AM, Pierre Massat wrote: Dear list, First of all i'd like to say that i'm very impressed by the potential of data structures in Pd. I've always kind of ignored this feature and it's a pity because it's really worth diving into it. That being said I think that help and example patches are far from sufficient for beginners, and if it wasn't for Chris McCormick's s-abstractions I would have been able to really figure out how to use them (stuff like how to make an entire polygon draggable, how to use GOP with proper scaling, etc.). It's not just the documentation, it's the interface. Having to walk linked-lists of graphically unlinked objects is bad. Having to use boilerplate to find the head of a glist just to create a scalar is bad. I think Pd-l2ork is getting close to a release with my new data structure stuff in it. It's a first step at addressing some of these issues. and any prospects of that stuff making it into vanilla or pd-ext, No. It requires a toolkit that has modern 2d features like affine transformations and opacity, etc. Pd-l2ork leverages Tkpath, a tcl/tk library. Other modern toolkits like Qt have their own 2d interfaces with the same features and could be used, but tcl/tk on its own does not. for the non-unix users out there? For OSX, one of the tcl/tk libraries-- Tkpath needs to be ported from Carbon to Cocoa. I haven't investigated a Windows port yet but it's probably mostly a matter of setting up the proper compile environment more than anything else. Granted one would probably need to tweak pd.tk and L2ork's build script, but getting set up in Windows seems to be where most of the work is. (At least in my experience so far.) -Jonathan ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
