Re: [GENERAL] Do we need more emphasis on backup?
New FAQ added: H4A name=3.113.11/A) What computer hardware should I use?/H4 PBecause PC hardware is mostly compatible, people tend to believe that all PC hardware is of equal quality. It is not. ECC RAM, SCSI, and quality motherboards are more reliable and have better performance than less expensive hardware. PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware, but if you are building a server where reliability and performance are concerns, it is wise to research your hardware options thoroughly. Our email lists can be used to discuss hardware options and tradeoffs./P Adjustments? --- Jim Seymour wrote: Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: pgman wrote: Jim Seymour wrote: [snip] My position is that your data is only as reliable as your hardware, period. [snip] There is a basic misconception that all PC hardware is created equal --- that hard drives, mother boards, and RAM are all the same because they are all PC-compatible. Compatible != Similar Quality. [snip] Should I add an FAQ discussing hardware selection and the importance of reliable hardware? Scary to think that people who don't know enough about running a proper server, and thus have to be *told* this, are admin'ing databases. Start with: Gotta have ECC, or at least parity-checking, RAM. Mention the (some kinds of?) IDE drives issue. Mention that hardware RAID systems must have battery-backed write cache. (I actually had a RAID vendor, whose products no longer had batter-backed write cache, tell me Just use a UPS.) Jim ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 8: explain analyze is your friend -- Bruce Momjian| http://candle.pha.pa.us [EMAIL PROTECTED] | (610) 359-1001 + If your life is a hard drive, | 13 Roberts Road + Christ can be your backup.| Newtown Square, Pennsylvania 19073 ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 2: you can get off all lists at once with the unregister command (send unregister YourEmailAddressHere to [EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: [GENERAL] Do we need more emphasis on backup?
Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: New FAQ added: H4A name=3.113.11/A) What computer hardware should I use?/H4 PBecause PC hardware is mostly compatible, people tend to believe that all PC hardware is of equal quality. It is not. ECC RAM, SCSI, and quality motherboards are more reliable and have better performance than less expensive hardware. PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware, but if you are building a server where reliability and performance are concerns, it is wise to research your hardware options thoroughly. Our email lists can be used to discuss hardware options and tradeoffs./P Adjustments? Looks good to me. Succinct and non-judgemental. Well done! Oh, if you're accepting punctuation nits ;), in most cases, the comma should come after but, not before it. So your sentence should read PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware but, if you are... If you wanted to mention other issues to consider, you might include: --- Jim Seymour wrote: [snip] Mention that hardware RAID systems must have battery-backed write cache. (I actually had a RAID vendor, whose products no longer had batter-backed write cache, tell me Just use a UPS.) Also desirable are a quality UPS, with monitoring on the server for graceful shutdown of the server on battery exhaustion, and redundant power supplies. Jim ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 7: don't forget to increase your free space map settings
Re: [GENERAL] Do we need more emphasis on backup?
OK, comma moved. I didn't add those other items because I didn't want the list to be anything near a complete list. --- Jim Seymour wrote: Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: New FAQ added: H4A name=3.113.11/A) What computer hardware should I use?/H4 PBecause PC hardware is mostly compatible, people tend to believe that all PC hardware is of equal quality. It is not. ECC RAM, SCSI, and quality motherboards are more reliable and have better performance than less expensive hardware. PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware, but if you are building a server where reliability and performance are concerns, it is wise to research your hardware options thoroughly. Our email lists can be used to discuss hardware options and tradeoffs./P Adjustments? Looks good to me. Succinct and non-judgemental. Well done! Oh, if you're accepting punctuation nits ;), in most cases, the comma should come after but, not before it. So your sentence should read PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware but, if you are... If you wanted to mention other issues to consider, you might include: --- Jim Seymour wrote: [snip] Mention that hardware RAID systems must have battery-backed write cache. (I actually had a RAID vendor, whose products no longer had batter-backed write cache, tell me Just use a UPS.) Also desirable are a quality UPS, with monitoring on the server for graceful shutdown of the server on battery exhaustion, and redundant power supplies. Jim ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 7: don't forget to increase your free space map settings -- Bruce Momjian| http://candle.pha.pa.us [EMAIL PROTECTED] | (610) 359-1001 + If your life is a hard drive, | 13 Roberts Road + Christ can be your backup.| Newtown Square, Pennsylvania 19073 ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 1: subscribe and unsubscribe commands go to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [GENERAL] Do we need more emphasis on backup?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jim Seymour) writes: Oh, if you're accepting punctuation nits ;), in most cases, the comma should come after but, not before it. So your sentence should read PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware but, if you are... Wrong. :) You are sentenced to go read Strunk and White again. -Doug ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 8: explain analyze is your friend
Re: [GENERAL] Do we need more emphasis on backup?
Doug McNaught wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jim Seymour) writes: Oh, if you're accepting punctuation nits ;), in most cases, the comma should come after but, not before it. So your sentence should read PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware but, if you are... Wrong. :) You are sentenced to go read Strunk and White again. Text adjusted: PBecause PC hardware is mostly compatible, people tend to believe that all PC hardware is of equal quality. It is not. ECC RAM, SCSI, and quality motherboards are more reliable and have better performance than less expensive hardware. PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware, but if you are building a server where you are concerned about reliability and performance it is wise to research your hardware options thoroughly. Our email lists can be used to discuss hardware options and tradeoffs./P -- Bruce Momjian| http://candle.pha.pa.us [EMAIL PROTECTED] | (610) 359-1001 + If your life is a hard drive, | 13 Roberts Road + Christ can be your backup.| Newtown Square, Pennsylvania 19073 ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster
Re: [GENERAL] Do we need more emphasis on backup?
On Sun, 2004-07-11 at 19:37, Bruce Momjian wrote: Doug McNaught wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jim Seymour) writes: Oh, if you're accepting punctuation nits ;), in most cases, the comma should come after but, not before it. So your sentence should read PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware but, if you are... Wrong. :) You are sentenced to go read Strunk and White again. Text adjusted: PBecause PC hardware is mostly compatible, people tend to believe that all PC hardware is of equal quality. It is not. ECC RAM, SCSI, and quality motherboards are more reliable and have better performance than less expensive hardware. PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware, but if you are building a server where you are concerned about reliability and performance it is wise to research your hardware options thoroughly. Our email lists can be used to discuss hardware options and tradeoffs./P Further, a system should be burned in and have all the components thoroughly tested. Brand new computers can, and often do, have broken or misbehaving hardware. While relatively simple tasks like installing an operating system or browsing the web only use a small portion of a computer's resources, running a database relies on all of it working properly. Basically, it all boils down to to this, if you're not sure of your hardware, you shouldn't be building a database server with it, and you can't be sure of your hardware without testing it. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 5: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faqs/FAQ.html
Re: [GENERAL] Do we need more emphasis on backup?
... PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware, but if you are building a server where you are concerned about reliability and performance it is wise to research your hardware options thoroughly. ... That's okay, of course. But I'll suggest the following as food for thought PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware, but, if you are building a server where you are concerned about reliability and performance, it is wise to research your hardware options thoroughly. or PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware, but, especially where reliability and performance are required, it is wise to research your hardware options thoroughly. (where/when) -- Joel [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match
Re: [GENERAL] Do we need more emphasis on backup?
Joel wrote: ... PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware, but if you are building a server where you are concerned about reliability and performance it is wise to research your hardware options thoroughly. ... That's okay, of course. But I'll suggest the following as food for thought PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware, but, if you are building a server where you are concerned about reliability and performance, it is wise to research your hardware options thoroughly. or PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware, but, especially where reliability and performance are required, it is wise to research your hardware options thoroughly. New text: PBecause PC hardware is mostly compatible, people tend to believe that all PC hardware is of equal quality. It is not. ECC RAM, SCSI, and quality motherboards are more reliable and have better performance than less expensive hardware. PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware, but if reliability and performance are important it is wise to research your hardware options thoroughly. Our email lists can be used to discuss hardware options and tradeoffs./P -- Bruce Momjian| http://candle.pha.pa.us [EMAIL PROTECTED] | (610) 359-1001 + If your life is a hard drive, | 13 Roberts Road + Christ can be your backup.| Newtown Square, Pennsylvania 19073 ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match
Re: [GENERAL] Do we need more emphasis on backup?
New text: PBecause PC hardware is mostly compatible, people tend to believe that all PC hardware is of equal quality. It is not. ECC RAM, SCSI, and quality motherboards are more reliable and have better performance than less expensive hardware. PostgreSQL will run on almost any hardware, but if reliability and performance are important it is wise to research your hardware options thoroughly. Our email lists can be used to discuss hardware options and tradeoffs./P I like that, too. (And now, after a break with real-world grammars, back to the cold, cruel world of mechanical parsers. ;) -- Joel [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 6: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org
