php-general Digest 29 Aug 2008 07:53:34 -0000 Issue 5651

[php-general-digest-help]

php-general Digest 29 Aug 2008 07:53:34 - Issue 5651

Topics (messages 278915 through 278939):

Re: Regex for email validation
278915 by: tedd

www.yfrindia.com
278916 by: YFR India

Re: concatenating with . or ,
278917 by: tedd

Re: Manual Coding vs. CMS Systems OT
278918 by: Jochem Maas

Re: grab the complete commandline used ...
278919 by: Jochem Maas
278920 by: Jochem Maas
278928 by: Micah Gersten
278933 by: Jochem Maas
278935 by: Robert Cummings

A better XSS trap (Feedback wanted)
278921 by: Christopher Vogt

Problems sending $_POST vairable to an ASP page
278922 by: shaun thornburgh
278923 by: Jay Blanchard
278924 by: Ólafur Waage
278925 by: shaun thornburgh
278926 by: Jay Blanchard
278930 by: shaun thornburgh
278937 by: Stut

ASCII Captcha
278927 by: Ólafur Waage
278932 by: tedd

Re: Manual Coding vs. CMS Systems
278929 by: Lester Caine
278931 by: Larry Garfield
278934 by: Jochem Maas

Re: Variable name as a string
278936 by: ioannes
278939 by: Bren Norris

Is this a bug?
278938 by: Catalin Zamfir Alexandru, DATAGRAM SRL

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--
---BeginMessage---

At 9:34 AM +0200 8/28/08, Per Jessen wrote:

Yeti wrote:


 That Rx.com domain name is really great stuff, but how do you expect
 the average user to type it in?



Sorry, I don't understand the problem.  The average user will obviously
have a suitable keyboard, such as this for instance:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:KB_Swiss.svg

/Per Jessen, Zürich



I hope you're right.

However, it's one thing to have a keyboard 
designed for a specific language and another to 
be able to enter code-points that aren't 
associated with any specific language (i.e., 
Dingbats and Math Symbols).


For example, note that Rx,com is not associated 
with any language, which is the same as many of 
my other domains, as you can see some here:


http://symboldomains.com/symbol-domains-for-sale.html

I bought most of these eight years ago hoping 
that someone would see things the way I do. But 
despite all my time, effort, and cost -- the only 
thing I have received is being called a goofy 
nitwit -- which I probably am -- but I would like 
to think of myself as an entertaining nitwit.  :-)


I have grandiose plans, but unfortunately I'm the only one who see's them.

Cheers,

tedd

--
---
http://sperling.com  http://ancientstones.com  http://earthstones.com
---End Message---
---BeginMessage---

http://www.yfrindia.com/
Take FREE online TEST, read FREE articles, download FREE presentation, use
FREE source code, useful links, competition updates, free ONLINE TEST TESTS,
http://www.yfrindia.com/resources/Tests
free APTITUDE TEST, English Test, Computer Test, Mechanical Test,
Electronics Test, Electrical Test, GATE preparation, CAT preparation, Job
preparation, resume.
http://www.yfrindia.com
-- 
View this message in context: 
http://www.nabble.com/www.yfrindia.com-tp19208138p19208138.html
Sent from the PHP - General mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

---End Message---
---BeginMessage---

At 5:44 PM +0100 8/28/08, Ford, Mike wrote:

Santa Monica, CA.


I moved from Missouri to California when I was 12 just after the Feds 
paid my father a visit and my father took-off for parts unknown -- 
apparently they frown on embezzling. I didn't see my father again 
until I turned 30.


I lived in the San Fernando Valley until after graduating from CSUN 
in 1975. Then I went to Michigan where I met my wife and received my 
MSc from MSU.


Michigan is like  big minnow trap -- once you swim in, you're caught. 
But, I don't miss California -- nice weather, but too much crime and 
too many people. At least Michigan is green and if you stay away from 
Detroit, there's not much crime either.


Cheers,

tedd

--
---
http://sperling.com  http://ancientstones.com  http://earthstones.com
---End Message---
---BeginMessage---

Carlos Medina schreef:
Watch him go... there is Carloos, the man infront of all the 
others. He
is WAY ahead, and he is gaining more and more speed. He is an adult, 
and he

is sooo adult that he can't even take a laugh... see him run from the
humor! Faster and faster he runs... and there it is: the goal: an open
casket for the people going through life without having a good laugh 
every

now and then :o

Aaanyhow... *grabs his coffee and keeps working while shaking his 
head

because of the stupid comment posted by Carlos*

Cheers :o



:-) Kids


yes I have one, so? did he build your website per chance? :-P

btw:

I have two handcoded cmses that I use to build sites with,
a bunch 

Re: [PHP] Problems sending $_POST vairable to an ASP page

[Stut]

On 28 Aug 2008, at 22:17, shaun thornburgh wrote:

Hi guys,
I need to send post variables to an ASP page. I have the following  
code which isn't producing any errors but isn't working either:


foreach($_POST['newsletter-group'] as $key = $value) 
{ $_POST['addressbookid'] = $value; $out = POST /signup.ashx;  $fp  
= fsockopen(dmtrk.net, 80, $errno, $errstr, 30); if (!$fp) {  echo  
$errstr ($errno)br /\n; } else {   fputs($fp, $out . \r 
\n);  }  fclose($fp); }


Can anyone tell me what I am doing wrong please?



?php
$result = false;

// I can't see in your example where you're building the POST data,  
but here's an example

$postdata = 'var='.urlencode($value);

$fp = fsockopen('dmtrk.net', 80, $errno, $errstr, 30);
if (!$fp)
{
$result = 'Connection failed: ['.$errno.'] '.$errstr;
}
else
{
fwrite($fp, POST /signup.ashx HTTP/1.1\n);
fwrite($fp, Connection: close\n);
fwrite($fp, Host: dmtrk.net\n);
fwrite($fp, Content-Length: .strlen($postdata).\n);
fwrite($fp, Content-Type: application/x-www-form-urlencoded\n);
fwrite($fp, \n.$postdata.\n);

// Get the status
$response = fgets($fp);
$result = (strpos($response, ' 200 ') !== false);

// Read the rest of the response
while (!feof($fp))
{
$response .= fgets($fp);
}
@fclose($fp);

if (!$result) $result = $response;
}

// At this point $result will either be === true or it will contain an  
error message


// Please don't ask a question again without doing a reasonable amount  
of research first. In this case that would be the HTTP spec and the  
PHP socket function documentation. This was not difficult!

?

-Stut

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[PHP] Is this a bug?

[Catalin Zamfir Alexandru, DATAGRAM SRL]

Hello guys,

I've been stalking on the list for some time. Didn't have
anything to report/talk, until now. I have a code like this, maybe you guys
can reproduce it, with output buffering started:

Echo 'something';

Echo 'another thing';

Echo 'something br /'\;

 

What happens is that ANYTHING that was echo'ed until that \,
will not reach the buffer. Although, this should actually be a Parse Error,
it isn't, it just echoes what was echoed after the god damned \. It took me
two hours to find this typo in the code .

 

Can you guys reproduce the error? I can actually give you a
link to the server where this code runs.

RE: [PHP] Re: Variable name as a string

[Bren Norris]

That solution would probably work just nicely.

That being said however, If you want to be sophisticated about this you
would make good use of JSON and php's corresponding functions
json_decode/encode which is common way to transport arrays as strings - and
much more.



-Original Message-
From: ioannes [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Friday, 29 August 2008 1:22 PM
To: php-general@lists.php.net
Subject: Re: [PHP] Re: Variable name as a string

In writing the script, though, there are two points.  I don't always use 
checkboxes, sometimes I just want to update all the records on the 
form.  Eg I have a series of images and related text each with their ID 
in the database table, on clicking update all the form elements get 
submitted and I need to relate the relevant image, text, etc with the 
table ID.  So I can't rely on checkboxes which only get posted if 
ticked.  So again I have to iterate through all possible IDs.  Which 
normally can be done but it is longer, eg because the images on the page 
in the first place may not be the result of a simple select query.  So I 
suppose the solution there is to have a hidden field with all the IDs as 
a string, explode that and then iterate through that.  Eg

input type=hidden value=1_2_3 name=all_IDs

$IDs=explode(_,$_POST['all_IDs']);

and that gives me the table IDs to do update queries on etc.

John

ioannes wrote:
 Actually, you are right, as you just put the checkbox index in the 
 POST and get the value from there.  So you just need the number of 
 checkboxes...sorry.

 ioannes wrote:
 Yes, Tedd, this does however incur the overhead of find out what i 
 is, because it could be a range of IDs from the database, not 
 necessarily a count of the checkboxes on the page:

 
 for ($i = 1; $i = 4; $i++)
{
$a = 'a' . $i;
$b = 'whatever' . $i;
if($_POST[$a] == 'on')
   {
my_array[] = $_POST[$b]
   }
}
 

 John



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Re: [PHP] Is this a bug?

[Robert Cummings]

On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 10:40 +0300, Catalin Zamfir Alexandru, DATAGRAM
SRL wrote:
 Echo 'something';
 
 Echo 'another thing';
 
 Echo 'something br /'\;

I got the following output in both php5 and php4:

Warning: Unexpected character in input:  '\' (ASCII=92) state=1
in /home/rob/bleh.php on line 7
somethinganother thingsomething br /

You might want to crank up your error reporting.

Cheers,
Rob.
-- 
http://www.interjinn.com
Application and Templating Framework for PHP


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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Richard Heyes]

 Has anyone tried a ASCII Captcha method. To use a similar method like
 this ASCII generator (http://www.network-science.de/ascii/)

 Or even gone the next level and have an ASCII based simple math question?

My advice is to stick with what works. Though if you really wanted to
you could investigate using Figlet to generate some ASCII and use that
in a basic CAPTCHA.

-- 
Richard Heyes

HTML5 Graphing:
http://www.phpguru.org/RGraph

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Re: [PHP] Problems sending $_POST vairable to an ASP page

[Stut]

On 28 Aug 2008, at 23:01, shaun thornburgh wrote:
Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2008 16:24:58 -0500 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; php-general@lists.php.net  
Subject: RE: [PHP] Problems sending $_POST vairable to an ASP page  
 [snip] Unfortunately I don't have curl installed on my server.  
[/snip]  Unless you can open a socket or a curl session you will  
not be able to post values to a remote page. Curl is your best  
bet, can it be installed?  --  PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/ 
) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php

It appears I was wrong, I do have cURL installed!


In that case I'll amend my earlier answer to the following...

?php
// I can't see in your example where you're building the POST data,  
but here's an example

$postdata = 'var='.urlencode($value);

if (function_exists('curl_init'))
{
  // Do it with CURL
  $curl_handle = curl_init();
  curl_setopt($curl_handle, CURLOPT_URL, 'http://dmtrk.net/signup.ashx') 
;

  curl_setopt($curl_handle, CURLOPT_CONNECTTIMEOUT, 30);
  curl_setopt($curl_handle, CURLOPT_RETURNTRANSFER, 1);
  curl_setopt($curl_handle, CURLOPT_POST, 1);
  curl_setopt($curl_handle, CURLOPT_POSTFIELDS, $postdata);
  $result = curl_exec($curl_handle);
  curl_close($curl_handle);
}
elseif (function_exists('fsockopen'))
{
  $fp = fsockopen('dmtrk.net', 80, $errno, $errstr, 30);
  if (!$fp)
  {
$result = 'Connection failed: ['.$errno.'] '.$errstr;
  }
  else
  {
fwrite($fp, POST /signup.ashx HTTP/1.1\n);
fwrite($fp, Connection: close\n);
fwrite($fp, Host: dmtrk.net\n);
fwrite($fp, Content-Length: .strlen($postdata).\n);
fwrite($fp, Content-Type: application/x-www-form-urlencoded\n);
fwrite($fp, \n.$postdata.\n);

// Get the status
$response = fgets($fp);
$result = (strpos($response, ' 200 ') !== false);

// Read the rest of the response
while (!feof($fp))
{
  $response .= fgets($fp);
}
@fclose($fp);

if (!$result) $result = $response;
  }
}
else
{
  die('No suitable mechanism for POSTing available.');
}
?

Note that I've not tested this at all, but it should work. Also it  
would be better wrapped up in a function, but unfortunately I have  
real work to do today.


-Stut

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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Stut]

On 29 Aug 2008, at 03:45, tedd wrote:

These are what I've come up with:

http://webbytedd.com/aa/assorted-captcha/


Just curious tedd, but what do you mean by CAPTCHA's show the world  
that you really haven't thought this out. If you have a better  
alternative I'd love to hear about it.


-Stut

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Re: [PHP] Is this a bug?

[T Lensselink]

Catalin Zamfir Alexandru, DATAGRAM SRL wrote:
 Hello guys,

 I've been stalking on the list for some time. Didn't have
 anything to report/talk, until now. I have a code like this, maybe you guys
 can reproduce it, with output buffering started:

 Echo 'something';

 Echo 'another thing';

 Echo 'something br /'\;

  

 What happens is that ANYTHING that was echo'ed until that \,
 will not reach the buffer. Although, this should actually be a Parse Error,
 it isn't, it just echoes what was echoed after the god damned \. It took me
 two hours to find this typo in the code .

  

 Can you guys reproduce the error? I can actually give you a
 link to the server where this code runs.


   
The script doesn't cause a parse error Instead it throws a warning.

'PHP Warning:  Unexpected character in input:  '\' (ASCII=92) state=1 in'

Don't think it's a bug. And the reason there's no syntax error is
because the \ is a PHP
escape character.



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RE: [PHP] Is this a bug?

[Catalin Zamfir Alexandru, DATAGRAM SRL]

I'm using a custom ob_handler (it's a MVC framework, we need this handler).
The ironic thing is that, executed once, the error doesn't show. Executed
twice, the error you're talking about shows. Executed 3rd ... the same as
the first execution. And I have my error_reporting to E_ALL. This happens
ONLY on this kind of error, any other type of error gets reported every
time.

Do you have any ideea what this error type is? E_WARNING? Maybe I
missed something ... And, shouldn't this be a parse error? Rather than a
warning?

-Original Message-
From: Robert Cummings [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 10:56 AM
To: Catalin Zamfir Alexandru, DATAGRAM SRL
Cc: php-general@lists.php.net
Subject: Re: [PHP] Is this a bug?

On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 10:40 +0300, Catalin Zamfir Alexandru, DATAGRAM
SRL wrote:
 Echo 'something';
 
 Echo 'another thing';
 
 Echo 'something br /'\;

I got the following output in both php5 and php4:

Warning: Unexpected character in input:  '\' (ASCII=92) state=1
in /home/rob/bleh.php on line 7
somethinganother thingsomething br /

You might want to crank up your error reporting.

Cheers,
Rob.
-- 
http://www.interjinn.com
Application and Templating Framework for PHP


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[PHP] Braindead

[Chris Haensel]

Hi guys,

maybe I am too stupid, but I can not see a solution for this. Have been
cracking up my brain for the last hours, so I finally dare to ask.

I have a database table with some columns


text1  |  text2  |  text3  |  text4
--


Now, for some stats thingy, I am trying to get the COUNT of distinct entries
So, i would like to get the count of entries where text2 is foo OR text3 is
foo

I have 20.863 entries at the moment, and it takes quite a lot of time
reading through that stuff.
I have tried

SELECT COUNT(*) as mycount FROM mytable WHERE text2 = 'foo' and text3 =
'foo'

but I neither get an error nor any output. It just loads and loads without
any output...

I am out of ideas :o( Help, anybody? :o))

Chris



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Re: [PHP] Braindead

[Thijs Lensselink]

Chris Haensel wrote:
 Hi guys,

 maybe I am too stupid, but I can not see a solution for this. Have been
 cracking up my brain for the last hours, so I finally dare to ask.

 I have a database table with some columns


 text1  |  text2  |  text3  |  text4
 --


 Now, for some stats thingy, I am trying to get the COUNT of distinct entries
 So, i would like to get the count of entries where text2 is foo OR text3 is
 foo

 I have 20.863 entries at the moment, and it takes quite a lot of time
 reading through that stuff.
 I have tried

 SELECT COUNT(*) as mycount FROM mytable WHERE text2 = 'foo' and text3 =
 'foo'

 but I neither get an error nor any output. It just loads and loads without
 any output...

 I am out of ideas :o( Help, anybody? :o))

 Chris



   
The amount of records is not that big to slow things down. Did you use
indexes on your database? And did you try running the query through
commandline or phpMyAdmin?


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RE: [PHP] Braindead

[Chris Haensel]

-:-  -Original Message-
-:-  From: Thijs Lensselink [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
-:-  Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 10:31 AM
-:-  Cc: php-general@lists.php.net
-:-  Subject: Re: [PHP] Braindead
-:-
-:-  Chris Haensel wrote:
-:-   Hi guys,
-:-  
-:-   maybe I am too stupid, but I can not see a solution for
-:-  this. Have been
-:-   cracking up my brain for the last hours, so I finally
-:-  dare to ask.
-:-  
-:-   I have a database table with some columns
-:-  
-:-  
-:-   text1  |  text2  |  text3  |  text4
-:-   --
-:-  
-:-  
-:-   Now, for some stats thingy, I am trying to get the COUNT
-:-  of distinct entries
-:-   So, i would like to get the count of entries where text2
-:-  is foo OR text3 is
-:-   foo
-:-  
-:-   I have 20.863 entries at the moment, and it takes quite
-:-  a lot of time
-:-   reading through that stuff.
-:-   I have tried
-:-  
-:-   SELECT COUNT(*) as mycount FROM mytable WHERE text2 =
-:-  'foo' and text3 =
-:-   'foo'
-:-  
-:-   but I neither get an error nor any output. It just loads
-:-  and loads without
-:-   any output...
-:-  
-:-   I am out of ideas :o( Help, anybody? :o))
-:-  
-:-   Chris
-:-  
-:-  
-:-  
-:-  
-:-  The amount of records is not that big to slow things down.
-:-  Did you use
-:-  indexes on your database? And did you try running the query through
-:-  commandline or phpMyAdmin?
-:-
-:-
-:-  --
-:-  PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/)
-:-  To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
-:-
-:-

Hi Thijs,

thanks for the reply. I got mixed up with my tables :o) It's got 178.456
entries :o))

Anyhow, I tried it in a PHP script.

$gq =   SELECT planned_dep_ap, COUNT(*) as apcount FROM flightdb
GROUP BY planned_dep_ap;
$gd =   mysql_query($gq) or die(mysql_error());
while($ga   =   mysql_fetch_assoc($gd)) {
$icao   =   $ga['planned_dep_ap'];
$apcount=   $ga['apcount'];
if($apcount = 100) {
echo $icao. - .$apcount.br;
}
}

this should get me the count of all entries and output it. It looks like it
does it now, as I do get an output. It just takes like 25+ seconds to show
me the output :o( Any idea how I can get it faster?

Cheers for your help!

Chris

P.S.: Is there a way to order the output by the apcount value? So I can get
highest numbers first?



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[PHP] _SERVER['DOCUMENT_ROOT'] not set?

[Saurabh Agrawal]

Hello group,

I am new to php. I have just bought a good book by Welling and Thomson and
was following the example codes.

In one of the examples, I am supposed to access _SERVER['DOCUMENT_ROOT'].
However, when I am seeing its value in the debug stack, I am getting it to
be null! Even phpinfo() is showing that this particular variable does not
even exist, though there are other _SERVER[''] declarations.

I installed everything on my local computer using xampp and I am using Zend
IDE.

And I have searched through archives as well as google and not found any
useful advice.

Thanks!

Saurabh.

Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Richard Heyes]

 CAPTCHA's don't work. Don't depend upon them for any of your projects.

Sure they do. My blog comments were getting spammed to death. Now I've
put a captcha on I rarely have to deal with spam. I'd say that's
working.

 CAPTCHA's present accessibility problems for people with disabilities.

These can be alleviated by, for example, adding a sound option like
Recapture has. Not perhaps a 100% solution, but it does help
tremendously.

 CAPTCHA's show the world that you really haven't thought this out.

Actually my captchas show the world some funky coloured text... :-)

-- 
Richard Heyes

HTML5 Graphing:
http://www.phpguru.org/RGraph

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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Sancar Saran]

Hello there,
 Actually my captchas show the world some funky coloured text... :-)

I just wondering. What if we show captcha using ASCII ART format.

like
pre
 |||
 |||
   `|||  |||`|||`````|||||` ` ||
 |||||  ||`   |.   |`...   |
 ||`   .||  | |  .|||||``|.|.```|.||
 |. `|||||  | |||.. ..`|
 ||| |||``  |. ```||`||.|`   `||.. |
 ```.  . .|`.  ```.|
 |||. S ..... I ... R . I .|||.. K .
 |||
 BUCES BBS||
 |||

/pre
(I'm not sure it was showed correct)

 Even coloured one.

What is your opinions ?

Regards

Sancar

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Re: [PHP] grab the complete commandline used ...

[David Otton]

2008/8/28 Jochem Maas [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

 I have a feeling I'm out of luck - probably security issues that keep
 you from doing such a thing as well.

 I did have the idea of grabbing the PID and then grepping the output of
 ps via exec() ... that would do it, but I reckon it smells. :-)

That won't work.

Quote the entire command as a string. Pass it to a shell script that
sets an environment variable to that string, then executes the string.

-- 

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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Richard Heyes]

 pre
  |||
  |||
    `|||  |||`|||`````|||||` ` ||
  |||||  ||`   |.   |`...   |
  ||`   .||  | |  .|||||``|.|.```|.||
  |. `|||||  | |||.. ..`|
  ||| |||``  |. ```||`||.|`   `||.. |
  ```.  . .|`.  ```.|
  |||. S ..... I ... R . I .|||.. K .
  |||
  BUCES BBS||
  |||

 /pre
 (I'm not sure it was showed correct)

It didn't, but pasting it into notepad made everything OK... Even
after that though, it wasn't particularly readable.

-- 
Richard Heyes

HTML5 Graphing:
http://www.phpguru.org/RGraph

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Re: [PHP] _SERVER['DOCUMENT_ROOT'] not set?

[David Otton]

2008/8/29 Saurabh Agrawal [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

 In one of the examples, I am supposed to access _SERVER['DOCUMENT_ROOT'].
 However, when I am seeing its value in the debug stack, I am getting it to
 be null! Even phpinfo() is showing that this particular variable does not
 even exist, though there are other _SERVER[''] declarations.

What's DocumentRoot set to in your Apache config? (httpd.conf) Check
any VirtualHost blocks you might have, too.

What's the result of print_r($_SERVER); ?

-- 

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[PHP] Re: Is this a bug?

[Carlos Medina]

Catalin Zamfir Alexandru, DATAGRAM SRL schrieb:

Hello guys,

I've been stalking on the list for some time. Didn't have
anything to report/talk, until now. I have a code like this, maybe you guys
can reproduce it, with output buffering started:

Echo 'something';

Echo 'another thing';

Echo 'something br /'\;

 


What happens is that ANYTHING that was echo'ed until that \,
will not reach the buffer. Although, this should actually be a Parse Error,
it isn't, it just echoes what was echoed after the god damned \. It took me
two hours to find this typo in the code .

 


Can you guys reproduce the error? I can actually give you a
link to the server where this code runs.



Hi,
yes this is a Bug in your code ;-)

-- Unexpected character in input: '\' (ASCII=92) state=1 in ...
This is the Error Output you will see.

Regards

Carlos

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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Ólafur Waage]

Thats exactly what i am talking about Richard.

Ólafur Waage
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

2008/8/29 Richard Heyes [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 pre
  |||
  |||
    `|||  |||`|||`````|||||` ` ||
  |||||  ||`   |.   |`...   |
  ||`   .||  | |  .|||||``|.|.```|.||
  |. `|||||  | |||.. ..`|
  ||| |||``  |. ```||`||.|`   `||.. |
  ```.  . .|`.  ```.|
  |||. S ..... I ... R . I .|||.. K .
  |||
  BUCES BBS||
  |||

 /pre
 (I'm not sure it was showed correct)

 It didn't, but pasting it into notepad made everything OK... Even
 after that though, it wasn't particularly readable.

 --
 Richard Heyes

 HTML5 Graphing:
 http://www.phpguru.org/RGraph

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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Ólafur Waage]

I just realized that i should have said ASCII Art but not just ASCII,
it was so clear in my head but i notice now how it could have been
misunderstood.

Ólafur Waage
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

2008/8/29 Ólafur Waage [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 Thats exactly what i am talking about Richard.

 Ólafur Waage
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 2008/8/29 Richard Heyes [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 pre
  |||
  |||
    `|||  |||`|||`````|||||` ` ||
  |||||  ||`   |.   |`...   |
  ||`   .||  | |  .|||||``|.|.```|.||
  |. `|||||  | |||.. ..`|
  ||| |||``  |. ```||`||.|`   `||.. |
  ```.  . .|`.  ```.|
  |||. S ..... I ... R . I .|||.. K .
  |||
  BUCES BBS||
  |||

 /pre
 (I'm not sure it was showed correct)

 It didn't, but pasting it into notepad made everything OK... Even
 after that though, it wasn't particularly readable.

 --
 Richard Heyes

 HTML5 Graphing:
 http://www.phpguru.org/RGraph

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Re: [PHP] _SERVER['DOCUMENT_ROOT'] not set?

[Saurabh Agrawal]

  In one of the examples, I am supposed to access _SERVER['DOCUMENT_ROOT'].
  However, when I am seeing its value in the debug stack, I am getting it
 to
  be null! Even phpinfo() is showing that this particular variable does not
  even exist, though there are other _SERVER[''] declarations.

 What's DocumentRoot set to in your Apache config? (httpd.conf) Check
 any VirtualHost blocks you might have, too.

 What's the result of print_r($_SERVER); ?



In httpd.conf,

DocumentRoot D:/xampp/htdocs

No VirtualHost blocks.

David, I just found a thing. I had been running this script within the Zend
IDE, looking at output in the IDE itself. Now that I see the output in
Firefox, I can see the variable in phpinfo(), as well as in the output of
print_r($_SERVER).

It must be something to do with Zend, then. Is that it?

Even the output of print_r contains the line
[DOCUMENT_ROOT]=D:/xampp/htdocs in Firefox, but no such line in Zend!

Thanks for the help!

Saurabh.

Re: [PHP] _SERVER['DOCUMENT_ROOT'] not set?

[metastable]

Does Zend use a separate instance of Apache or some other webserver ?

Stijn


Saurabh Agrawal wrote:


In one of the examples, I am supposed to access _SERVER['DOCUMENT_ROOT'].
However, when I am seeing its value in the debug stack, I am getting it
  

to


be null! Even phpinfo() is showing that this particular variable does not
even exist, though there are other _SERVER[''] declarations.
  

What's DocumentRoot set to in your Apache config? (httpd.conf) Check
any VirtualHost blocks you might have, too.

What's the result of print_r($_SERVER); ?





In httpd.conf,

DocumentRoot D:/xampp/htdocs

No VirtualHost blocks.

David, I just found a thing. I had been running this script within the Zend
IDE, looking at output in the IDE itself. Now that I see the output in
Firefox, I can see the variable in phpinfo(), as well as in the output of
print_r($_SERVER).

It must be something to do with Zend, then. Is that it?

Even the output of print_r contains the line
[DOCUMENT_ROOT]=D:/xampp/htdocs in Firefox, but no such line in Zend!

Thanks for the help!

Saurabh.

  



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Re: [PHP] _SERVER['DOCUMENT_ROOT'] not set?

[Saurabh Agrawal]

On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 5:06 PM, metastable [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:

 Does Zend use a separate instance of Apache or some other webserver ?

 Stijn


Actually I don't know the answer to this. How can I find that out?

AFAIK, while custom installation, it didn't ask for any such option.

Thanks!

Saurabh.

Re: [PHP] _SERVER['DOCUMENT_ROOT'] not set?

[Stut]

On 29 Aug 2008, at 12:47, Saurabh Agrawal wrote:

On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 5:06 PM, metastable [EMAIL PROTECTED]

wrote:



Does Zend use a separate instance of Apache or some other webserver ?

Stijn



Actually I don't know the answer to this. How can I find that out?

AFAIK, while custom installation, it didn't ask for any such option.


Zend Studio does not install Apache at all. By default, when you run a  
file from within the IDE it does so as a CLI script. This means there  
will be no DOCUMENT_ROOT defined which is what you're seeing.


-Stut

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Re: [PHP] Braindead

[Andrew Ballard]

On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 4:38 AM, Chris Haensel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 -:-  -Original Message-
 -:-  From: Thijs Lensselink [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 -:-  Sent: Friday, August 29, 2008 10:31 AM
 -:-  Cc: php-general@lists.php.net
 -:-  Subject: Re: [PHP] Braindead
 -:-
 -:-  Chris Haensel wrote:
 -:-   Hi guys,
 -:-  
 -:-   maybe I am too stupid, but I can not see a solution for
 -:-  this. Have been
 -:-   cracking up my brain for the last hours, so I finally
 -:-  dare to ask.
 -:-  
 -:-   I have a database table with some columns
 -:-  
 -:-  
 -:-   text1  |  text2  |  text3  |  text4
 -:-   --
 -:-  
 -:-  
 -:-   Now, for some stats thingy, I am trying to get the COUNT
 -:-  of distinct entries
 -:-   So, i would like to get the count of entries where text2
 -:-  is foo OR text3 is
 -:-   foo
 -:-  
 -:-   I have 20.863 entries at the moment, and it takes quite
 -:-  a lot of time
 -:-   reading through that stuff.
 -:-   I have tried
 -:-  
 -:-   SELECT COUNT(*) as mycount FROM mytable WHERE text2 =
 -:-  'foo' and text3 =
 -:-   'foo'
 -:-  
 -:-   but I neither get an error nor any output. It just loads
 -:-  and loads without
 -:-   any output...
 -:-  
 -:-   I am out of ideas :o( Help, anybody? :o))
 -:-  
 -:-   Chris
 -:-  
 -:-  
 -:-  
 -:-  
 -:-  The amount of records is not that big to slow things down.
 -:-  Did you use
 -:-  indexes on your database? And did you try running the query through
 -:-  commandline or phpMyAdmin?
 -:-
 -:-
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 -:-  To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
 -:-
 -:-

 Hi Thijs,

 thanks for the reply. I got mixed up with my tables :o) It's got 178.456
 entries :o))

 Anyhow, I tried it in a PHP script.

 $gq =   SELECT planned_dep_ap, COUNT(*) as apcount FROM flightdb
 GROUP BY planned_dep_ap;
 $gd =   mysql_query($gq) or die(mysql_error());
 while($ga   =   mysql_fetch_assoc($gd)) {
$icao   =   $ga['planned_dep_ap'];
$apcount=   $ga['apcount'];
if($apcount = 100) {
echo $icao. - .$apcount.br;
}
 }

 this should get me the count of all entries and output it. It looks like it
 does it now, as I do get an output. It just takes like 25+ seconds to show
 me the output :o( Any idea how I can get it faster?

This isn't really the same thing you asked in your original post. The
original included a WHERE clause and this version does not. (Granted,
your original post seemed slightly confused as well, since you first
said you wanted results where text2 is foo OR text3 is
foo, but then your example said WHERE text2 = 'foo' and text3 =
'foo' , so I'm not sure if you wanted a union (OR) or an intersection
(AND) of the two matching sets.)

I see in your script that you are only echoing rows where the value of
$apcount is = 100. Why not limit your query to that? Then you aren't
waiting for a bunch of records to get passed from MySQL to PHP that
you aren't even interested in seeing, and PHP doesn't have to waste
the cycles to filter them out?


 Cheers for your help!

 Chris

 P.S.: Is there a way to order the output by the apcount value? So I can get
 highest numbers first?


Absolutely.

SELECT planned_dep_ap, COUNT(*) as apcount
FROM flightdb
GROUP BY planned_dep_ap
HAVING apcount = 100
ORDER BY apcount DESC

That should do it.

Andrew

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[PHP] [SOLVED]RE: [PHP] restricted file access

[Angelo Zanetti]

-Original Message-
From: tedd [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: 28 August 2008 21:19
To: php-general@lists.php.net
Subject: RE: [PHP] restricted file access

At 10:50 AM +0200 8/28/08, Angelo Zanetti wrote:
Thanks for your reply.

But what happens if the file is situated here:

www.site.com/include/documents/file.doc


and someone knows that path file somehow or they get a program to crawl the
site. Then they would be able to get that file. How do we prevent that?

You don't!

But file.doc doesn't have to be anything either.

Try this:

http://sperling.com/file.doc -- you won't find anything there.

However, if I wanted something to be there for someone, I could put it
there.

Understand?


//

Hi guys

I put the documents outside the webroot. And just redirect to it using the
Headers and then the readfile() function.

Thanks
Angelo
http://www.elemental.co.za

Cheers,

tedd
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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[tedd]

At 9:07 AM +0100 8/29/08, Stut wrote:

On 29 Aug 2008, at 03:45, tedd wrote:

These are what I've come up with:

http://webbytedd.com/aa/assorted-captcha/


Just curious tedd, but what do you mean by CAPTCHA's show the world 
that you really haven't thought this out. If you have a better 
alternative I'd love to hear about it.


-Stut


-Stut :

I claim that for most web sites, they don't need a CAPTCHA -- so why 
use one? CAPTCHA's carry a lot of accessibility baggage.


There are many of high profile sites that don't use CAPTCHA (i.e., 
Eric Meyers, Chris Shiflett). Instead they have developed other 
methods, such as attending to their sites and monitoring post.


I concede that if an evil-doer wants to make things hard on you by 
automated posting, then it's an uphill battle that can be effectively 
fought by using a CAPTCHA. But I claim there has to be a better way.


While I've been working on the problem (on/off) for several years, I 
haven't found an acceptable solution. Of course, better minds than 
mine have tried and failed, but I always think that I might do better 
-- a flaw in my personality, I just don't know any better.


In any event, I've approached on the problem from two sides:

1. To create a CAPTCHA that would be difficult for automated systems 
to break but easy for the user to navigate -- my Arrow CAPTCHA is the 
best I could create. However, I'm sure with a little effort from 
someone like you or Rob, it can be broken.


In addition, my arrow CAPTCHA is for the sighted and that leaves out 
a lot of people. My Audio CAPTCHA works well for the blind, but that 
too can be broken.


2. To create a server-side method that monitors who's making the 
post, frequency of the posts, and content of the post before allowing 
the post. While I'm not finished, this is something that I continue 
to work on. I think that direction shows the most opportunity for 
success.


So, when I say CAPTCHA's show the world that you really haven't 
thought this out, that's what I mean. I still haven't thought this 
out either. But I think there'a better solution and I'll keep working 
trying to find one.


Cheers,

tedd

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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[tedd]

At 10:00 AM +0100 8/29/08, Richard Heyes wrote:

  CAPTCHA's don't work. Don't depend upon them for any of your projects.

Sure they do. My blog comments were getting spammed to death. Now I've
put a captcha on I rarely have to deal with spam. I'd say that's
working.


Yes, it's working for you -- but what about the people who can't 
navigate your CAPTCHA? They can't even tell you they are having 
problems.


In addition, all CAPTCHA's can be broken. If someone really wants to 
spam your site, they will. You're not flying below the radar, you're 
just not a big enough target to waste a missile on.



  CAPTCHA's present accessibility problems for people with disabilities.

These can be alleviated by, for example, adding a sound option like
Recapture has. Not perhaps a 100% solution, but it does help

tremendously.

If you will notice, I do include an audio CAPTCHA in my assorted CAPTCHA's:

http://webbytedd.com/aa/assorted-captcha/

But, that doesn't solve the problem of accessibility, it just reduces 
the problem, and actually increases the possibility of your site 
getting spammed by providing two doors for entry.



  CAPTCHA's show the world that you really haven't thought this out.

Actually my captchas show the world some funky coloured text... :-)


Now you throw possible contrast problems into the mix. Will your 
colors pass this test:


http://webbytedd.com/c/access-color/

No matter how many times you cut this rope, it's still too short.

Cheers,

tedd

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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Stut]

On 29 Aug 2008, at 15:15, tedd wrote:

At 9:07 AM +0100 8/29/08, Stut wrote:

On 29 Aug 2008, at 03:45, tedd wrote:

These are what I've come up with:

http://webbytedd.com/aa/assorted-captcha/


Just curious tedd, but what do you mean by CAPTCHA's show the  
world that you really haven't thought this out. If you have a  
better alternative I'd love to hear about it.


-Stut


-Stut :

I claim that for most web sites, they don't need a CAPTCHA -- so why  
use one? CAPTCHA's carry a lot of accessibility baggage.


There are many of high profile sites that don't use CAPTCHA (i.e.,  
Eric Meyers, Chris Shiflett). Instead they have developed other  
methods, such as attending to their sites and monitoring post.


I concede that if an evil-doer wants to make things hard on you by  
automated posting, then it's an uphill battle that can be  
effectively fought by using a CAPTCHA. But I claim there has to be a  
better way.


While I've been working on the problem (on/off) for several years, I  
haven't found an acceptable solution. Of course, better minds than  
mine have tried and failed, but I always think that I might do  
better -- a flaw in my personality, I just don't know any better.


In any event, I've approached on the problem from two sides:

1. To create a CAPTCHA that would be difficult for automated systems  
to break but easy for the user to navigate -- my Arrow CAPTCHA is  
the best I could create. However, I'm sure with a little effort from  
someone like you or Rob, it can be broken.


In addition, my arrow CAPTCHA is for the sighted and that leaves out  
a lot of people. My Audio CAPTCHA works well for the blind, but that  
too can be broken.


2. To create a server-side method that monitors who's making the  
post, frequency of the posts, and content of the post before  
allowing the post. While I'm not finished, this is something that I  
continue to work on. I think that direction shows the most  
opportunity for success.


So, when I say CAPTCHA's show the world that you really haven't  
thought this out, that's what I mean. I still haven't thought this  
out either. But I think there'a better solution and I'll keep  
working trying to find one.


I agree with some of what you're saying here, but only to a certain  
extent. CAPTCHA's are a tool that can be applied to any number of  
different situations, so a blanket statement like that cannot possibly  
apply. For some situations they are absolutely required (example  
coming up), for others they're certainly not the best answer.


The main project I work on at the moment is a classified ad site and  
it has CAPTCHA's in three places. The first is when you place an ad.  
If this wasn't there we'd have a much more difficult job dealing with  
scam and spam ads, something we can't currently afford to throw more  
effort at. This is an example of making it a little bit harder for  
automated posting to happen, but we know it's not 100% effective and  
we have other mechanisms in place to catch stuff that gets past it,  
but it's a good first step and knocks out the really stupid attempts.


The other two places are when a user contacts us for support, and when  
someone sends a message to another user about one of their ads.  
Without the CAPTCHA both of these suffer from a huge amount of aimless  
automated postings. This is the main thing a CAPTCHA does for any site.


Out there in the wide wide world there are numerous scripts that  
simply crawl the web looking for forms to post to on the off-chance  
it's going to turn out to be unprotected. Depending on the form  
handler this can result in anything from them posting content on a  
website with a view to getting SEO juice to being able to use the form  
as a mail proxy. These scripts don't care if each post works, they  
just try because it's nearly free to do so. In the above scenarios not  
having the CAPTCHA there to stop them would result in spam in our  
support system and even worse than that, spam in users mailboxes.


So I agree that CAPTCHA's do not and cannot solve the problem of  
unwanted form submissions, but they're a damn good start. Whatever we  
do, the simple fact that we want users to be able to do something  
means that anyone can do it whether they have good intentions or bad,  
but we can put up as many obstacles to automation as normal users can  
live with. CAPTCHA's are only a defence against automation, not bad  
people and that's a very important thing to understand.


As for attending to sites and monitoring posts, that's all very well  
until you end up dealing with 10k posts a day. Our CAPTCHA's stop  
over 70% of form submissions on my site and I thank $DEITY they're  
there because otherwise I'd never sleep (not that I do that much  
anyway).


The reason I asked the question is that your comments on that page  
imply that only lazy developers use them when this is far from the  
truth. They are a valuable tool and until something better comes along  

Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Eric Gorr]

On Aug 29, 2008, at 10:30 AM, tedd wrote:


No matter how many times you cut this rope, it's still too short.


So, I'm curious, what do you suggest?

As near as I can tell, even with all of the problems (many of which  
can be mitigated with enough effort) associated with the use of  
Captcha's, a good implementation is currently the best solution to the  
problem.




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[PHP] Checking for http://

[Ron Piggott]

How do I check if http:// is at the beginning of $web_site and if it
isn't add it?  Ron


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[PHP] Debugging PHP scripts

[Edward Diener]

I am fairly new to PHP. What is the best way of debugging PHP scripts ?

I have put in echo statements to tell me what is happening, but perhaps 
there are better methods.


I have a PHP script on a server, which I access from a client side 
program ( written in C++ ) and the script is not returning the correct 
data. I am looking for some easy way to determine what is wrong.


Thanks !

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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[tedd]

At 3:41 PM +0100 8/29/08, Stut wrote:

-Stut:

I agree with some of what you're saying here, but only to a certain 
extent. CAPTCHA's are a tool that can be applied to any number of 
different situations, so a blanket statement like that cannot 
possibly apply.


Of course blanket statements can't apply to everything, but they can 
generate debate and thus the reason why I wrote it that way -- to 
generate discussion.


---
The main project I work on at the moment is a classified ad site and 
it has CAPTCHA's in three places.


-snip-

I understand there are different reasons behind the use of CAPTCHA's, 
but in the end they still present accessibility problems. And their 
use is a trade-off that you accept.


In essence you are saying I understand the problems and this is my 
best solution. You are cutting out a segment of the population due to 
the fact that you cannot create a better solution.


Don't get me wrong -- I fully understand the problems involved and 
there may not be a better solution. But to employ CAPTCHA's, means 
that there isn't.


---
So I agree that CAPTCHA's do not and cannot solve the problem of 
unwanted form submissions, but they're a damn good start.


I agree with most of that, but I think the they're a damn good 
start is really this works and that's that.


It's like the saying Why are the things I'm looking for always in 
the last place I find them? They are because once you find them, you 
stop looking. Likewise, the CAPTCHA is a good place to stop.


---
Whatever we do, the simple fact that we want users to be able to do 
something means that anyone can do it whether they have good 
intentions or bad, but we can put up as many obstacles to automation 
as normal users can live with. CAPTCHA's are only a defence against 
automation, not bad people and that's a very important thing to 
understand.



That's a very good point. I often think that people who employ these 
tactics (spam automation) actually know what they are doing when in 
fact they may not. They may be ignorant of the harm they cause.


---
The reason I asked the question is that your comments on that page 
imply that only lazy developers use them when this is far from the 
truth. They are a valuable tool and until something better comes 
along I'm gonna use them as part of my sites defences, unless you're 
volunteering to moderate 7k messages for me for free? Didn't think 
so ;)


I didn't mean to imply laziness, but now that you mentioned it -- on 
one hand we say that CAPTCHA is good enough until something else 
comes along, but on the other hand, because we are using CAPTCHA, 
there's no need to develop something else.


I realize that this problem is difficult and may be one of those 
thing that can't be solved with current technology -- I may be Don 
Quixote looking at windmills differently than others.


Thanks for your comments,

tedd

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Re: [PHP] Checking for http://

[Dan Joseph]

On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 11:25 AM, Ron Piggott [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote:

 How do I check if http:// is at the beginning of $web_site and if it
 isn't add it?  Ron


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You could use substr() (www.php.net/substr)

if ( substr( $web_site, 0, 7 ) != http://; )
{
$web_site = http://; . $web_site;
}

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-Dan Joseph

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Build a man a fire, and he will be warm for the rest of the day.
Light a man on fire, and will be warm for the rest of his life.

Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[tedd]

At 10:45 AM -0400 8/29/08, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 10:30 AM, tedd wrote:


No matter how many times you cut this rope, it's still too short.


So, I'm curious, what do you suggest?

As near as I can tell, even with all of the problems (many of which 
can be mitigated with enough effort) associated with the use of 
Captcha's, a good implementation is currently the best solution to 
the problem.


Read my other replies.

Cheers,

tedd

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Re: [PHP] Debugging PHP scripts

[Dan Joseph]

On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 11:33 AM, Edward Diener [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote:

 I am fairly new to PHP. What is the best way of debugging PHP scripts ?

 I have put in echo statements to tell me what is happening, but perhaps
 there are better methods.

 I have a PHP script on a server, which I access from a client side program
 ( written in C++ ) and the script is not returning the correct data. I am
 looking for some easy way to determine what is wrong.

 Thanks !

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Echo's throughout the code isn't a bad way.  You can also utilize print_r()
and exit() and other things.  Really the idea is to set break points, and
return data to you that is useful for killing the bug.  Its not something
that you can simply so Do it like this, as there is really rules to how
you should debug really.  Just basic deductive reasoning, and some helpful
information along the way.

Do you use an IDE at all?  You may want to check some out with debuggers
built in.  That would help you out.

-- 
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www.canishosting.com - Plans start @ $1.99/month.

Build a man a fire, and he will be warm for the rest of the day.
Light a man on fire, and will be warm for the rest of his life.

Re: [PHP] Checking for http://

[Eric Butera]

On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 11:33 AM, Dan Joseph [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 You could use substr() (www.php.net/substr)

 if ( substr( $web_site, 0, 7 ) != http://; )
 {
 $web_site = http://; . $web_site;
 }

 --
 -Dan Joseph

Or parse_url()

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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Robert Cummings]

On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 10:38 +, Ólafur Waage wrote:
 I just realized that i should have said ASCII Art but not just ASCII,
 it was so clear in my head but i notice now how it could have been
 misunderstood.

You do realize that the ascii rendering below is just a bitmap. Most
captcha crackers can handle bitmaps. The cracker would just need a
little tweaking to first convert to a real bitmap.

Cheers,
Rob.




 
 Ólafur Waage
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
 2008/8/29 Ólafur Waage [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
  Thats exactly what i am talking about Richard.
 
  Ólafur Waage
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
  2008/8/29 Richard Heyes [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
  pre
   
  |||
   
  |||
     `|||  |||`|||`````|||||` ` 
  ||
   |||||  ||`   |.   |`...   
  |
   ||`   .||  | |  .|||||``|.|.
  ```|.||
   |. `|||||  | |||.. ..
  `|
   ||| |||``  |. ```||`||.|`   `||.. 
  |
   ```.  . .|`.  ```
  .|
   |||. S ..... I ... R . I .|||.. K 
  .
   
  |||
   BUCES BBS
  ||
   
  |||
 
  /pre
  (I'm not sure it was showed correct)
 
  It didn't, but pasting it into notepad made everything OK... Even
  after that though, it wasn't particularly readable.
 
  --
  Richard Heyes
 
  HTML5 Graphing:
  http://www.phpguru.org/RGraph
 
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Re: [PHP] Debugging PHP scripts

[Edward Diener]

Dan Joseph wrote:

On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 11:33 AM, Edward Diener [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote:


I am fairly new to PHP. What is the best way of debugging PHP scripts ?

I have put in echo statements to tell me what is happening, but perhaps
there are better methods.

I have a PHP script on a server, which I access from a client side program
( written in C++ ) and the script is not returning the correct data. I am
looking for some easy way to determine what is wrong.

Thanks !

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Echo's throughout the code isn't a bad way.  You can also utilize print_r()
and exit() and other things.  Really the idea is to set break points, and
return data to you that is useful for killing the bug.  Its not something
that you can simply so Do it like this, as there is really rules to how
you should debug really.  Just basic deductive reasoning, and some helpful
information along the way.


Understood.



Do you use an IDE at all?  You may want to check some out with debuggers
built in.  That would help you out.


I am running on the client, and the PHP script is on a server on another 
machine. Is there a PHP IDE running from the client which can help me in 
that sort of situation ? It would really be nice if I could debug in an 
IDE from the client side, but I suspect I would need to be running on 
the server machine in order to do so. Of course I can try out the script 
locally on my client machine and then I would probably be fine. I would 
have to duplicate the server directory setup in order to do so.


I have not looked into PHP IDEs at all so far. Any recommendations ? 
Thanks !


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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Stut]

On 29 Aug 2008, at 16:33, tedd wrote:

At 3:41 PM +0100 8/29/08, Stut wrote:
The main project I work on at the moment is a classified ad site  
and it has CAPTCHA's in three places.


-snip-

I understand there are different reasons behind the use of  
CAPTCHA's, but in the end they still present accessibility problems.  
And their use is a trade-off that you accept.


In essence you are saying I understand the problems and this is my  
best solution. You are cutting out a segment of the population due  
to the fact that you cannot create a better solution.


Don't get me wrong -- I fully understand the problems involved and  
there may not be a better solution. But to employ CAPTCHA's, means  
that there isn't.


That's putting words in other people's mouths. Use of CAPTCHA's isn't  
the same as stating the Earth is flat and refusing to entertain  
alternative theories. CAPTCHA's are a first line of defence and as  
such I'll use them until I ro someone else comes up with something  
better. I don't see that as defeat, but in the real world I can't say  
I don't have a 100% effective defence so I'm not going to use the 70%  
defence I do have. Seem to me to be a very odd position to take.


So I agree that CAPTCHA's do not and cannot solve the problem of  
unwanted form submissions, but they're a damn good start.


I agree with most of that, but I think the they're a damn good  
start is really this works and that's that.


It's like the saying Why are the things I'm looking for always in  
the last place I find them? They are because once you find them,  
you stop looking. Likewise, the CAPTCHA is a good place to stop.


Who ever said we've stopped? Again, it's one tool in a toolbox, but  
certainly not one that should be ignored.


Whatever we do, the simple fact that we want users to be able to do  
something means that anyone can do it whether they have good  
intentions or bad, but we can put up as many obstacles to  
automation as normal users can live with. CAPTCHA's are only a  
defence against automation, not bad people and that's a very  
important thing to understand.


That's a very good point. I often think that people who employ these  
tactics (spam automation) actually know what they are doing when in  
fact they may not. They may be ignorant of the harm they cause.


I highly doubt that. There may be a few who use off-the-shelf scripts  
without really knowing what they're doing, but I would bet the  
majority fully understand what they're doing and most of them don't  
care. I *know* some of them thing they're adding value.


The reason I asked the question is that your comments on that page  
imply that only lazy developers use them when this is far from the  
truth. They are a valuable tool and until something better comes  
along I'm gonna use them as part of my sites defences, unless  
you're volunteering to moderate 7k messages for me for free?  
Didn't think so ;)


I didn't mean to imply laziness, but now that you mentioned it -- on  
one hand we say that CAPTCHA is good enough until something else  
comes along, but on the other hand, because we are using CAPTCHA,  
there's no need to develop something else.


I think this is very naive and coming from you tedd it surprises me.  
Very few developers have time to put everything on hold because the  
tools they have are not 100% effective - I certainly don't. I really  
wish I did, but this is the real world where the almighty pound is  
king. I'd love to see the faces at the next board meeting when I say  
no progress this month because we've been trying to come up with  
something better than CAPTCHA's.


The community as a whole is trying to come up with something better  
but these things take time, money and a good dose of unpredictable  
inspiration. Something better will arrive, until then I'm using the  
tools I have to do the best job I can.


I realize that this problem is difficult and may be one of those  
thing that can't be solved with current technology -- I may be Don  
Quixote looking at windmills differently than others.


Most of the problems CAPTCHA's are intended to protect against are  
social rather than technological. This is also important to  
understand. As I mentioned earlier, if you want your normal users to  
be able to do something, the evil ones will also be able to do it.


The best defence against dodgy inputs I've seen so far has been having  
a good community on the site who pro-actively look for and take action  
against it. Best example I can think of this late in the day is  
Wikipedia.


-Stut

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Re: [PHP] Debugging PHP scripts

[Dan Joseph]

On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 11:51 AM, Edward Diener [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote:

 Dan Joseph wrote:

 On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 11:33 AM, Edward Diener [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:


 I have not looked into PHP IDEs at all so far. Any recommendations ? Thanks
 !


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I'm a little bias towards PhpED (www.nusphere.com),b ut that's because I use
it.  There is also PHP Eclipse, and Zend among others.

Do a google search for php dbg.  Its the same debugger that PhpED uses,
that might get you started before you start into IDEs.

-- 
-Dan Joseph

www.canishosting.com - Plans start @ $1.99/month.

Build a man a fire, and he will be warm for the rest of the day.
Light a man on fire, and will be warm for the rest of his life.

Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Eric Gorr]

On Aug 29, 2008, at 11:33 AM, tedd wrote:

I understand there are different reasons behind the use of  
CAPTCHA's, but in the end they still present accessibility problems.  
And their use is a trade-off that you accept.


Nonsense. There is no reason why the usage of Captcha's would need to  
present accessibility problems.


I didn't mean to imply laziness, but now that you mentioned it -- on  
one hand we say that CAPTCHA is good enough until something else  
comes along, but on the other hand, because we are using CAPTCHA,  
there's no need to develop something else.


Nonsense. There are people constantly working on better systems to  
fight spam, etc. Need proof? Just lift your head up and look around a  
little.


At a minimum, a better system that everyone uses could mean billions  
to the inventor that patent's the system...that is reason enough to  
keep working to the next best thing.





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Re: [PHP] Debugging PHP scripts

[Brady Mitchell]

On Aug 29, 2008, at 851AM, Edward Diener wrote:
I have not looked into PHP IDEs at all so far. Any recommendations ?  
Thanks !


Please don't start this up again. Check the PHP IDE Needed thread  
that has been active for the past several days or search the list  
archives.


http://marc.info/?l=php-general

Brady

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RE: [PHP] Re: concatenating with . or ,

[Boyd, Todd M.]

 -Original Message-
 From: tedd [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2008 3:15 PM
 To: php-general@lists.php.net
 Subject: RE: [PHP] Re: concatenating with . or ,
 
 At 5:44 PM +0100 8/28/08, Ford, Mike wrote:
 Santa Monica, CA.
 
 I moved from Missouri to California when I was 12 just after the Feds
 paid my father a visit and my father took-off for parts unknown --
 apparently they frown on embezzling. I didn't see my father again
 until I turned 30.
 
 I lived in the San Fernando Valley until after graduating from CSUN
 in 1975. Then I went to Michigan where I met my wife and received my
 MSc from MSU.
 
 Michigan is like  big minnow trap -- once you swim in, you're caught.
 But, I don't miss California -- nice weather, but too much crime and
 too many people. At least Michigan is green and if you stay away from
 Detroit, there's not much crime either.

I hail from Missouri, myself. Glad to see another native in the list
(even if you deserted us for greener pastures). ;)


Todd Boyd
Web Programmer



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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Robert Cummings]

On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 11:33 -0400, tedd wrote:

 I understand there are different reasons behind the use of CAPTCHA's, 
 but in the end they still present accessibility problems. And their 
 use is a trade-off that you accept.

Not using CAPTCHAs and allowing the amount of spam posted to a site to
exist presents an accessibility problem for all.

Cheers,
Rob.
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Application and Templating Framework for PHP


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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[tedd]

At 1:15 PM -0400 8/29/08, Robert Cummings wrote:

On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 11:33 -0400, tedd wrote:


 I understand there are different reasons behind the use of CAPTCHA's,
 but in the end they still present accessibility problems. And their
 use is a trade-off that you accept.


Not using CAPTCHAs and allowing the amount of spam posted to a site to
exist presents an accessibility problem for all.

Cheers,
Rob.



That's another side of the coin -- the problem is complex.

Cheers,

tedd

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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[tedd]

At 12:17 PM -0400 8/29/08, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 11:33 AM, tedd wrote:

I understand there are different reasons behind the use of 
CAPTCHA's, but in the end they still present accessibility 
problems. And their use is a trade-off that you accept.


Nonsense. There is no reason why the usage of Captcha's would need 
to present accessibility problems.



No offense, but please look into it.

Cheers,

tedd

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Re: [PHP] Serving pages based on user input

[Thodoris]

O/H Jochem Maas έγραψε:

Robert Cummings schreef:

On Sun, 2008-08-24 at 13:35 +0100, Ashley Sheridan wrote:

On Sat, 2008-08-23 at 22:17 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote:

On Sun, 2008-08-24 at 01:32 +0200, Jochem Maas wrote:

Ólafur Waage schreef:

You can read about the header function.

http://is2.php.net/manual/en/function.header.php

hi Ólafur,

his situation doesn't require a redirect (he only thinks it does),
and redirects suck when used unecessarily. (plenty of info on the web
about why this is so ... hunt for a 'rant' by the formidable 
Richard Lynch

in the archives of this list for instance)

Oh dear, not this BS again. If the content is different then perform a
redirect. Do you really want your login page to be indexed as your
homepage? Lynch's arguments on this were weak.

Cheers,
Rob.
--
http://www.interjinn.com
Application and Templating Framework for PHP


I thought the arguments were very valid, but can be take to the 
point of

extreme. Keep similar pages grouped into one PHP file. After all, this
is what PHP is for. Don't try to replicate your HTML pages as PHP 
pages,

thats a silly idea and takes more time to manage.


You're confusing using a front page loader with redirection. The
distinction being that I would suggest that you redirect to the URL that
your front loader would use to load a given page rather than just
presenting said page within another page's context to save a redirect.


you wouldn't have to frakkin' redirect if the links used by said front
controller were generated correctly to start with ... it's the whole 
using a
select box to choose a page (unless it's to set window.location to the 
value of the

selected option in the select box) ... that sucks.

Late reply but I kind of enjoy when Battlestar Gallactica dirty speech 
is making it's presence to this list (frak). Perhaps I could make a 
table in mysql with all the known phrases for me to search when I am in 
a lame mood.  I believe that I have run into a list somewhere in the web.

there is no need to use redirection in this case, it's just f'ing lazy.
(to be clear ... I'm lazy now and again ;-) but at least I know it)

redirection should be used sparingly, and fudging SE friendly urls 
back into

your own application IS NOT such as case.

no idea wtf you meant with the login page reference - way too obtuse 
an argument

for me to follow.



Cheers,
Rob.


yeah mine an ice cold one thanks.



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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[tedd]

At 5:06 PM +0100 8/29/08, Stut wrote:

On 29 Aug 2008, at 16:33, tedd wrote:
I didn't mean to imply laziness, but now that you mentioned it -- 
on one hand we say that CAPTCHA is good enough until something else 
comes along, but on the other hand, because we are using CAPTCHA, 
there's no need to develop something else.


I think this is very naive and coming from you tedd it surprises me.


From my perspective, I think it naive to look at this in any other way.

For example, how much time have you invested in finding a better way? 
I'm not pointing a finger at you and saying You need to drop 
everything and come up with a solution before moving on. But I am 
saying that you are using a CAPTCHA until someone else comes up with 
a better way. Is that not true?


So, in essence my statement above is not naive but rather factual. 
Factual is not naive.



Very few developers have time to put everything on hold because the 
tools they have are not 100% effective - I certainly don't. I really 
wish I did, but this is the real world where the almighty pound is 
king. I'd love to see the faces at the next board meeting when I say 
no progress this month because we've been trying to come up with 
something better than CAPTCHA's.


You are missing the point. I'm not telling you to stop anything.

I am saying -- however -- that we continue (myself included) to use 
technology that hurts others. That does not justify our actions -- it 
only provides an excuse.



The best defence against dodgy inputs I've seen so far has been 
having a good community on the site who pro-actively look for and 
take action against it. Best example I can think of this late in the 
day is Wikipedia.


As I see it, I could be wrong, but that's just an example of 
developers who are not taking the easy way out, but rather trying 
to solve the problem by using something other than CAPTCHA, like the 
ones I posted earlier.


Look, we are not in disagreement -- I understand that you have 
deadlines and projects that can't be put on hold and all the other 
excuses you cite -- actually, so do I. But in the end, we are doing 
this at the cost of accessibility for others. We shouldn't lose sight 
of that.


Cheers,

tedd

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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Richard Heyes]

 I understand there are different reasons behind the use of CAPTCHA's, but
 in the end they still present accessibility problems. And their use is a
 trade-off that you accept.

 Nonsense. There is no reason why the usage of Captcha's would need to
 present accessibility problems.

CAPTCHAs are intentionally not the easiest thing to read. If they
were, there wouldn't be a great deal of point having them.

-- 
Richard Heyes

HTML5 Graphing:
http://www.phpguru.org/RGraph

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Re: [PHP] grab the complete commandline used ...

[Jochem Maas]

Robert Cummings schreef:

On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 04:48 +0200, Jochem Maas wrote:

Micah Gersten schreef:

I suggest creating a shell wrapper for PHP that will write the command
to a file for you and then call PHP with the appropriate arguments.  PHP
won't even see most of the command that you originally posted.

which wouldn't catch the pipe to grep now would it. nevermind, I don't think
you ge what I was looking for, not worry I can hack together a 'solution'
using exec() ... by grepping the output of ps.


I doubt it. The ps command sees what the script sees. If I do mplayer
*.avi, ps shows me the expanded file list that was given to mplayer.


output after shell expansion is fine, I'm interested in knowing what
arguments we're given to the php interpreter, for example
(other than the scriptname and *it's* args which are readily available
via $argv) and where ever the output is being piped or redirected to.


Remember, shell gets first dibs before anything happens. BTW your
subject line does not imply that you wanted the EXACT command line
used :)


lol



Cheers,
Rob.



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Re: [PHP] grab the complete commandline used ...

[Jochem Maas]

David Otton schreef:

2008/8/28 Jochem Maas [EMAIL PROTECTED]:


I have a feeling I'm out of luck - probably security issues that keep
you from doing such a thing as well.

I did have the idea of grabbing the PID and then grepping the output of
ps via exec() ... that would do it, but I reckon it smells. :-)


That won't work.


in what sense won't it work? the complete line is in the output of ps somewhere
albeit after wildcard/shell expansion.



Quote the entire command as a string. Pass it to a shell script that
sets an environment variable to that string, then executes the string.


if life were that simple. it's user X running the php script from the
commandline ... I wanna know exactly what he is doing (which is not
necessarily the same as what he should be doing). I only really control
the php script in question not the context it is run in.






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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Eric Gorr]

On Aug 29, 2008, at 2:42 PM, Richard Heyes wrote:

I understand there are different reasons behind the use of  
CAPTCHA's, but
in the end they still present accessibility problems. And their  
use is a

trade-off that you accept.


Nonsense. There is no reason why the usage of Captcha's would need to
present accessibility problems.


CAPTCHAs are intentionally not the easiest thing to read. If they
were, there wouldn't be a great deal of point having them.


There are many forms of captcha's. The concept can easily be extended  
beyond the need to read something. You may want to read:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captcha

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Re: [PHP] grab the complete commandline used ...

[Stut]

On 29 Aug 2008, at 19:46, Jochem Maas wrote:

David Otton schreef:

2008/8/28 Jochem Maas [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
I have a feeling I'm out of luck - probably security issues that  
keep

you from doing such a thing as well.

I did have the idea of grabbing the PID and then grepping the  
output of

ps via exec() ... that would do it, but I reckon it smells. :-)

That won't work.


in what sense won't it work? the complete line is in the output of  
ps somewhere

albeit after wildcard/shell expansion.


Quote the entire command as a string. Pass it to a shell script that
sets an environment variable to that string, then executes the  
string.


if life were that simple. it's user X running the php script from the
commandline ... I wanna know exactly what he is doing (which is not
necessarily the same as what he should be doing). I only really  
control

the php script in question not the context it is run in.


I think the only way to do what you want is to parse the output from  
ps with appropriate arguments. You'll probably need to find the parent  
process of your PHP script. Don't think you're going to find a  
portable way to do it.


-Stut

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[PHP] Testing for Current pointer position in array during iteration

[Mark Weaver]

Hi All,

Go figure... I sat down today to get some more work on my current 
project; I got to a certain point where I need to step through an array 
with a foreach loop. I found that I need to test for the current pointer 
position of the array, but I haven't a clue as to how this might be 
accomplished. I've been all over google and php.net, but I'm not finding 
anything that will help me do this.


Basically all I want to do is something like this:

if( current_arrayPointer_postition == n ){
  ... do this
}else{
  ...do this
}

Anyone know of a built-in PHP function that can assist with this, or can 
you point me to a resource that could help me code a solution?


thanks,

--

Mark

It was good to be the fire... 
Better by far than to crawl and mew and suck and $h1t and die!

'Arthur C. Clarke'


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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Eric Gorr]

On Aug 29, 2008, at 1:56 PM, tedd wrote:


At 12:17 PM -0400 8/29/08, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 11:33 AM, tedd wrote:

I understand there are different reasons behind the use of  
CAPTCHA's, but in the end they still present accessibility  
problems. And their use is a trade-off that you accept.


Nonsense. There is no reason why the usage of Captcha's would need  
to present accessibility problems.



No offense, but please look into it.



You are welcome to explain, rather then just assert, what is inherent  
about the concept of a Captcha that would force accessibility problems  
upon a website.




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Re: [PHP] Testing for Current pointer position in array during iteration

[Jochem Maas]

Mark Weaver schreef:

Hi All,

Go figure... I sat down today to get some more work on my current 
project; I got to a certain point where I need to step through an array 
with a foreach loop. I found that I need to test for the current pointer 
position of the array, but I haven't a clue as to how this might be 
accomplished. I've been all over google and php.net, but I'm not finding 
anything that will help me do this.


Basically all I want to do is something like this:

if( current_arrayPointer_postition == n ){
  ... do this
}else{
  ...do this
}


foreach isn't really like that. it uses (IIRC) an internal pointer of
it's own leaving the userland pointer where ever it is.

but:

$n = 5;
// make a new array with numeric keys starting at 0
$array = array_values(array);
// loop it
foreach ($array as $key = $val) {
if ($key == $n) {
echo I got five on it;
} else {
echo usual suspect;
}
}



Anyone know of a built-in PHP function that can assist with this, or can 
you point me to a resource that could help me code a solution?


thanks,




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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[tedd]

At 2:48 PM -0400 8/29/08, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 2:42 PM, Richard Heyes wrote:


I understand there are different reasons behind the use of CAPTCHA's, but
in the end they still present accessibility problems. And their use is a
trade-off that you accept.


Nonsense. There is no reason why the usage of Captcha's would need to
present accessibility problems.


CAPTCHAs are intentionally not the easiest thing to read. If they
were, there wouldn't be a great deal of point having them.


There are many forms of captcha's. The concept can easily be 
extended beyond the need to read something. You may want to read:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captcha



While you're at it, why don't you read it yourself.

The reference clearly says why your statement --

Nonsense. There is no reason why the usage of Captcha's would need to
present accessibility problems.

-- is nonsense.

Cheers,

tedd

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Re: [PHP] grab the complete commandline used ...

[Jochem Maas]

Stut schreef:

On 29 Aug 2008, at 19:46, Jochem Maas wrote:

David Otton schreef:

2008/8/28 Jochem Maas [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

I have a feeling I'm out of luck - probably security issues that keep
you from doing such a thing as well.

I did have the idea of grabbing the PID and then grepping the output of
ps via exec() ... that would do it, but I reckon it smells. :-)

That won't work.


in what sense won't it work? the complete line is in the output of ps 
somewhere

albeit after wildcard/shell expansion.


Quote the entire command as a string. Pass it to a shell script that
sets an environment variable to that string, then executes the string.


if life were that simple. it's user X running the php script from the
commandline ... I wanna know exactly what he is doing (which is not
necessarily the same as what he should be doing). I only really control
the php script in question not the context it is run in.


I think the only way to do what you want is to parse the output from ps 
with appropriate arguments. You'll probably need to find the parent 
process of your PHP script. 


yeah, the 'grab the PID' explaination was too simplistic, actually I should
be able to grep on the scriptname - it will only run if no other instances are
already running (race conditions aside ;-))

Don't think you're going to find a portable 
way to do it.


portability not needed beyond linux and MacOS. thank goodness :-)
at least it's doable ... and the smell will be running on someone else's
hardware :-P



-Stut




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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[tedd]

At 2:51 PM -0400 8/29/08, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 1:56 PM, tedd wrote:


At 12:17 PM -0400 8/29/08, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 11:33 AM, tedd wrote:

I understand there are different reasons behind the use of 
CAPTCHA's, but in the end they still present accessibility 
problems. And their use is a trade-off that you accept.


Nonsense. There is no reason why the usage of Captcha's would need 
to present accessibility problems.



No offense, but please look into it.



You are welcome to explain, rather then just assert, what is 
inherent about the concept of a Captcha that would force 
accessibility problems upon a website.



Read your own reference:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captcha

That says:

Accessibility
See also: Web accessibility
Because CAPTCHAs rely on visual perception, users unable to view a 
CAPTCHA (for example, due to a disability or because it is difficult 
to read) will be unable to perform the task protected by a CAPTCHA. 
As such, sites implementing CAPTCHAs may provide an audio version of 
the CAPTCHA in addition to the visual method. The official CAPTCHA 
site recommends providing an audio CAPTCHA for accessibility reasons.


Why should I have to explain something that is widely known and easy to find?

Please do the reading before telling people such things are nonsense.

Cheers,

tedd
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Re: [PHP] Testing for Current pointer position in array during iteration

[Dan Joseph]

On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 2:40 PM, Mark Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Hi All,

 Go figure... I sat down today to get some more work on my current project;
 I got to a certain point where I need to step through an array with a
 foreach loop. I found that I need to test for the current pointer position
 of the array, but I haven't a clue as to how this might be accomplished.
 I've been all over google and php.net, but I'm not finding anything that
 will help me do this.

 Basically all I want to do is something like this:

 if( current_arrayPointer_postition == n ){
  ... do this
 }else{
  ...do this
 }

 Anyone know of a built-in PHP function that can assist with this, or can
 you point me to a resource that could help me code a solution?

 thanks,

 --

 Mark
 
 It was good to be the fire... Better by far than to crawl and mew and suck
 and $h1t and die!
 'Arthur C. Clarke'


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This may also help as well as Jochem's suggestion:  http://us2.php.net/key

-- 
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www.canishosting.com - Plans start @ $1.99/month.

Build a man a fire, and he will be warm for the rest of the day.
Light a man on fire, and will be warm for the rest of his life.

Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Eric Gorr]

On Aug 29, 2008, at 3:11 PM, tedd wrote:


At 2:48 PM -0400 8/29/08, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 2:42 PM, Richard Heyes wrote:

I understand there are different reasons behind the use of  
CAPTCHA's, but
in the end they still present accessibility problems. And their  
use is a

trade-off that you accept.


Nonsense. There is no reason why the usage of Captcha's would  
need to

present accessibility problems.


CAPTCHAs are intentionally not the easiest thing to read. If they
were, there wouldn't be a great deal of point having them.


There are many forms of captcha's. The concept can easily be  
extended beyond the need to read something. You may want to read:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captcha



While you're at it, why don't you read it yourself.

The reference clearly says why your statement --

Nonsense. There is no reason why the usage of Captcha's would need to
present accessibility problems.

-- is nonsense.


Where?


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Re: [PHP] grab the complete commandline used ...

[David Otton]

2008/8/29 Jochem Maas [EMAIL PROTECTED]:

 in what sense won't it work? the complete line is in the output of ps
 somewhere
 albeit after wildcard/shell expansion.

With the pipe? I'd really like to see an example, beacuse I couldn't
coax it out of ps, and it might be handy someday.

 if life were that simple. it's user X running the php script from the
 commandline ... I wanna know exactly what he is doing (which is not
 necessarily the same as what he should be doing). I only really control
 the php script in question not the context it is run in.

You should have said... you are the admin of the machine, right? Patch
bash to log user input. Google variations on bash, patch and syslog.

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Re: [PHP] Testing for Current pointer position in array during iteration

[tedd]

At 2:40 PM -0400 8/29/08, Mark Weaver wrote:

Hi All,

Go figure... I sat down today to get some more work on my current 
project; I got to a certain point where I need to step through an 
array with a foreach loop. I found that I need to test for the 
current pointer position of the array, but I haven't a clue as to 
how this might be accomplished. I've been all over google and 
php.net, but I'm not finding anything that will help me do this.


Basically all I want to do is something like this:

if( current_arrayPointer_postition == n ){
  ... do this
}else{
  ...do this
}

Anyone know of a built-in PHP function that can assist with this, or 
can you point me to a resource that could help me code a solution?


Try looking at current

http://www.php.net/current

Maybe that will help.

Cheers,

tedd



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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Eric Gorr]

On Aug 29, 2008, at 3:15 PM, tedd wrote:


At 2:51 PM -0400 8/29/08, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 1:56 PM, tedd wrote:


At 12:17 PM -0400 8/29/08, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 11:33 AM, tedd wrote:

I understand there are different reasons behind the use of  
CAPTCHA's, but in the end they still present accessibility  
problems. And their use is a trade-off that you accept.


Nonsense. There is no reason why the usage of Captcha's would  
need to present accessibility problems.



No offense, but please look into it.



You are welcome to explain, rather then just assert, what is  
inherent about the concept of a Captcha that would force  
accessibility problems upon a website.



Read your own reference:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captcha

That says:

Accessibility
See also: Web accessibility
Because CAPTCHAs rely on visual perception, users unable to view a  
CAPTCHA (for example, due to a disability or because it is difficult  
to read) will be unable to perform the task protected by a CAPTCHA.  
As such, sites implementing CAPTCHAs may provide an audio version of  
the CAPTCHA in addition to the visual method. The official CAPTCHA  
site recommends providing an audio CAPTCHA for accessibility reasons.


Why should I have to explain something that is widely known and easy  
to find?




So, I'm curious, what prevents a website from providing a good  
implementation of both an audio and visual captcha to prevent  
accessibility problems which you claim are impossible to avoid with  
every use of a captcha?


Personally, my favorite implementation to date is:

  http://recaptcha.net/learnmore.html

and not only is it well designed, but all that brain power which goes  
into solving captcha's goes into helping out with a very worthwhile  
project.


Remember, the concept of a captcha is this:

  A test to prove one is human in order perform some action.

There is no reason why a blind or deaf person absolutely cannot be  
presented with such a test.


Now, if you wish to continue to argue to the contrary, you are more  
then welcome to do so.









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Re: [PHP] Testing for Current pointer position in array during iteration

[Jochem Maas]

Dan Joseph schreef:

On Fri, Aug 29, 2008 at 2:40 PM, Mark Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:



...




This may also help as well as Jochem's suggestion:  http://us2.php.net/key


not unless you wan't a headache (re-read the bit about foreach's internal 
pointer):

php -r '$r = array(a,b,c); next($r); $K = key($r); foreach ($r as $k = $v) { echo $K 
, key($r),  $k\n; }'

outputs:

1 1 0
1 1 1
1 1 2






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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[tedd]

At 3:17 PM -0400 8/29/08, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 3:11 PM, tedd wrote:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captcha



While you're at it, why don't you read it yourself.

The reference clearly says why your statement --

Nonsense. There is no reason why the usage of Captcha's would need to
present accessibility problems.

-- is nonsense.


Where?


Is this a joke? Are we doing one of those Who's on first skits?

Read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captcha

and look for what it says about accessibility.

And while you're at it, try reading this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_accessibility

Maybe then you'll start understanding the problems people with 
certain disabilities have in navigating and using web sites.


Instead of calling all this nonsense, try to understand what's being discussed.

This ain't rocket science. It's not all that hard to understand.

Cheers,

tedd


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[PHP] Re: Debugging PHP scripts

[Al]

Edward Diener wrote:

I am fairly new to PHP. What is the best way of debugging PHP scripts ?

I have put in echo statements to tell me what is happening, but perhaps 
there are better methods.


I have a PHP script on a server, which I access from a client side 
program ( written in C++ ) and the script is not returning the correct 
data. I am looking for some easy way to determine what is wrong.


Thanks !


debug_backtrace() is pretty handy

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Re: [PHP] grab the complete commandline used ...

[Micah Gersten]

You can rename the php executable and replace it with a shell script
that logs what is run.

Thank you,
Micah Gersten
onShore Networks
Internal Developer
http://www.onshore.com



Jochem Maas wrote:
 David Otton schreef:

 Quote the entire command as a string. Pass it to a shell script that
 sets an environment variable to that string, then executes the string.

 if life were that simple. it's user X running the php script from the
 commandline ... I wanna know exactly what he is doing (which is not
 necessarily the same as what he should be doing). I only really control
 the php script in question not the context it is run in.





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Re: [PHP] grab the complete commandline used ...

[Robert Cummings]

On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 20:42 +0200, Jochem Maas wrote:
 Robert Cummings schreef:
  On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 04:48 +0200, Jochem Maas wrote:
  Micah Gersten schreef:
  I suggest creating a shell wrapper for PHP that will write the command
  to a file for you and then call PHP with the appropriate arguments.  PHP
  won't even see most of the command that you originally posted.
  which wouldn't catch the pipe to grep now would it. nevermind, I don't 
  think
  you ge what I was looking for, not worry I can hack together a 'solution'
  using exec() ... by grepping the output of ps.
  
  I doubt it. The ps command sees what the script sees. If I do mplayer
  *.avi, ps shows me the expanded file list that was given to mplayer.
 
 output after shell expansion is fine, I'm interested in knowing what
 arguments we're given to the php interpreter, for example
 (other than the scriptname and *it's* args which are readily available
 via $argv) and where ever the output is being piped or redirected to.

You won't get redirection or piping from the following but it will give
you the command line info you wanted:

?php

$info = implode( '', file( '/proc/'.posix_getpid().'/cmdline' ) );
$info = explode( \x0, $info );
print_r( $info );

?

Probably doesn't run on windows, and I don't care enough to even think
about checking :)

Cheers,
Rob.
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Re: [PHP] Testing for Current pointer position in array during iteration

[Mark Weaver]

Jochem Maas wrote:

Mark Weaver schreef:

Hi All,

Go figure... I sat down today to get some more work on my current 
project; I got to a certain point where I need to step through an 
array with a foreach loop. I found that I need to test for the 
current pointer position of the array, but I haven't a clue as to how 
this might be accomplished. I've been all over google and php.net, 
but I'm not finding anything that will help me do this.


Basically all I want to do is something like this:

if( current_arrayPointer_postition == n ){
  ... do this
}else{
  ...do this
}


foreach isn't really like that. it uses (IIRC) an internal pointer of
it's own leaving the userland pointer where ever it is.

but:

$n = 5;
// make a new array with numeric keys starting at 0
$array = array_values(array);
// loop it
foreach ($array as $key = $val) {
if ($key == $n) {
echo I got five on it;
} else {
echo usual suspect;
}
}


very nice... Thank you Jochem. That did the trick.

--

Mark

It was good to be the fire... 
Better by far than to crawl and mew and suck and shit and die!

'Arthur C. Clarke'


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Re: [PHP] grab the complete commandline used ...

[Robert Cummings]

On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 15:36 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote:
 On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 20:42 +0200, Jochem Maas wrote:
  Robert Cummings schreef:
   On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 04:48 +0200, Jochem Maas wrote:
   Micah Gersten schreef:
   I suggest creating a shell wrapper for PHP that will write the command
   to a file for you and then call PHP with the appropriate arguments.  PHP
   won't even see most of the command that you originally posted.
   which wouldn't catch the pipe to grep now would it. nevermind, I don't 
   think
   you ge what I was looking for, not worry I can hack together a 'solution'
   using exec() ... by grepping the output of ps.
   
   I doubt it. The ps command sees what the script sees. If I do mplayer
   *.avi, ps shows me the expanded file list that was given to mplayer.
  
  output after shell expansion is fine, I'm interested in knowing what
  arguments we're given to the php interpreter, for example
  (other than the scriptname and *it's* args which are readily available
  via $argv) and where ever the output is being piped or redirected to.
 
 You won't get redirection or piping from the following but it will give
 you the command line info you wanted:
 
 ?php
 
 $info = implode( '', file( '/proc/'.posix_getpid().'/cmdline' ) );
 $info = explode( \x0, $info );
 print_r( $info );
 
 ?
 
 Probably doesn't run on windows, and I don't care enough to even think
 about checking :)

BTW, you can also look into hacking the bash binary. Several years ago I
wanted to log the command-line to a database table and I hacked the bash
binary to trap history and send to database log.

Isn't open source a beautiful thing :)

Cheers,
Rob.
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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Stut]

On 29 Aug 2008, at 19:03, tedd wrote:

At 5:06 PM +0100 8/29/08, Stut wrote:

On 29 Aug 2008, at 16:33, tedd wrote:
I didn't mean to imply laziness, but now that you mentioned it --  
on one hand we say that CAPTCHA is good enough until something  
else comes along, but on the other hand, because we are using  
CAPTCHA, there's no need to develop something else.


I think this is very naive and coming from you tedd it surprises me.


From my perspective, I think it naive to look at this in any other  
way.


For example, how much time have you invested in finding a better  
way? I'm not pointing a finger at you and saying You need to drop  
everything and come up with a solution before moving on. But I am  
saying that you are using a CAPTCHA until someone else comes up with  
a better way. Is that not true?


So, in essence my statement above is not naive but rather factual.  
Factual is not naive.


Not at all. I spend a fair amount of time thinking about ways to make  
my work more secure. I would hope that goes for most developers,  
especially if they realise that a CAPTCHA is not 100% effective.  
However, this is the way research works. Most people (i.e. the work-a- 
day folk) spend most of their time making stuff. The few people who  
are lucky enough to either work for a company that gives them time to  
do research or actually does it for a living are the ones more likely  
to hit upon a new solution.


I don't think this makes us lazy, or wrong, for continuing to use the  
current tool - it makes us practical. If I have a eureka moment at any  
point rest assured I will put some personal time aside to look into it  
(as I have in other areas) and if something comes of it I'd publish it  
on my blog.


So, in essence your statement is assumptive, judgemental and sweeping.  
That's not factual.


Very few developers have time to put everything on hold because the  
tools they have are not 100% effective - I certainly don't. I  
really wish I did, but this is the real world where the almighty  
pound is king. I'd love to see the faces at the next board meeting  
when I say no progress this month because we've been trying to  
come up with something better than CAPTCHA's.


You are missing the point. I'm not telling you to stop anything.

I am saying -- however -- that we continue (myself included) to use  
technology that hurts others. That does not justify our actions --  
it only provides an excuse.


When you say it hurts others I assume you mean excludes users who, for  
whatever reason, cannot pass the CAPTCHA test. I completely agree, but  
as far as I know it's only (and I use that word carefully) people with  
both visual and audio impairments that you cannot cater for. If you  
could you'd render all CAPTCHA implementations I'm aware of pointless.


I completely agree that this is less than ideal, and I really don't  
like preventing legitimate potential users from using my sites, but  
I'd rather have a usable and clean (yes, most automated posts are  
dirty in some way) site than one that nobody wants to use. This is a  
choice we have to make otherwise there's no point creating the site at  
all.


Holding my hand up now as a lazy developer, the CAPTCHA I have on my  
sites is not accessible what with it being simply an image with no  
audio alternative. We have plans to switch it to using recaptcha or  
implement our own but in terms of priorities it's pretty low for my 2- 
man team (myself included).


The best defence against dodgy inputs I've seen so far has been  
having a good community on the site who pro-actively look for and  
take action against it. Best example I can think of this late in  
the day is Wikipedia.


As I see it, I could be wrong, but that's just an example of  
developers who are not taking the easy way out, but rather trying  
to solve the problem by using something other than CAPTCHA, like the  
ones I posted earlier.


Yes and no. Wikipedia has its share of problems with spammers, but  
they have such a large community of users who are willing and able to  
put time into keeping the site clean it works. The same site with a  
different type of user profile may not be able to work this way.


As far as it being down to the developer I think you're giving credit  
where little is due. It's the user response to the completely open  
nature of the original product that prevented them from having to  
implement CAPTCHA's to prevent automated posting. Had the community of  
users not been so proactive I don't doubt they would have ended up  
using them.


Look, we are not in disagreement -- I understand that you have  
deadlines and projects that can't be put on hold and all the other  
excuses you cite -- actually, so do I. But in the end, we are doing  
this at the cost of accessibility for others. We shouldn't lose  
sight of that.


I think we do disagree on a fundamental level. You think we've all  
given up because we have CAPTCHA's, I believe in the 

Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Eric Gorr]

On Aug 29, 2008, at 3:41 PM, Stut wrote:

I completely agree, but as far as I know it's only (and I use that  
word carefully) people with both visual and audio impairments that  
you cannot cater for.



I cannot see any reason why a person with both visual and audio  
impairments could not be presented with a test to prove they are human.





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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Robert Cummings]

On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 15:52 -0400, Eric Gorr wrote:
 On Aug 29, 2008, at 3:41 PM, Stut wrote:
 
  I completely agree, but as far as I know it's only (and I use that  
  word carefully) people with both visual and audio impairments that  
  you cannot cater for.
 
 
 I cannot see any reason why a person with both visual and audio  
 impairments could not be presented with a test to prove they are human.

Go on, I'm all eyes and ears... describe such a test.

Cheers,
Rob.
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Application and Templating Framework for PHP


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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[tedd]

At 8:41 PM +0100 8/29/08, Stut wrote:

So, in essence your statement is assumptive, judgemental and sweeping.


I certainly did not mean it to be taken assumptive or judgmental.

---
Holding my hand up now as a lazy developer, the CAPTCHA I have on my 
sites is not accessible what with it being simply an image with no 
audio alternative. We have plans to switch it to using recaptcha or 
implement our own but in terms of priorities it's pretty low for my 
2-man team (myself included).


If you ever want to add an audio CAPTCHA, I will provide mine. I have 
done significant blind testing to get it approved by blind testers.


But, I say this from one developer to another and not to the general 
public. When dealing with another developer, it's much less 
problematic to share code because we speak a common language.


You see, I provide free things on my site, such as my drop-down menu, 
and I have people daily failing to implement those correctly because 
they cannot follow simple directions. I don't want to complicate my 
life further without good reason.


---
As I see it, I could be wrong, but that's just an example of 
developers who are not taking the easy way out, but rather trying 
to solve the problem by using something other than CAPTCHA, like 
the ones I posted earlier.


Yes and no. Wikipedia has its share of problems with spammers, but 
they have such a large community of users who are willing and able 
to put time into keeping the site clean it works. The same site with 
a different type of user profile may not be able to work this way.


As far as it being down to the developer I think you're giving 
credit where little is due.


That's the reason why I quoted developer -- the developer in this 
case IS the user.


---

I think we do disagree on a fundamental level. You think we've all 
given up because we haveCAPTCHA's, I believe in the innovative 
potential of most developers. We're using CAPTCHA's a lot, and we're 
doing it because none of us have come up with anything better yet, 
but that certainly doesn't mean we've given up trying.


If your site is free to use I would modify your statement to say...

CAPTCHA's show the world that you care about the quality of the 
content on your site without needing to charge for its use, but 
remember that we haven't given up trying to find a better way


Not quite as catchy as yours, but more accurate. If people need to 
pay to use your site then the need for CAPTCHA's is reduced but I'd 
argue that in some cases they're still needed.


You bring up good points and I'm not so head-strong that I can't 
listen and learn.


Is this better?

http://webbytedd.com/aa/assorted-captcha/

Cheers,

tedd
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[PHP] PHP Namespace issues

[Bob Novak]

Please bear with me if this is not the correct forum to post this issue.

I am experiencing xml namespace errors while trying to use zillow.api with
Apache 2.2.8 (Fedora), PHP 5.2.5.  Dreamweaver 8 with MM-XSLTransform.class
version 0.6.3 is acting as the intermediary to process the zillow.php and
zillow.xsl files located at www.bancroftandassociates/xml/.  I have a
support request open with Adobe, but so far, they are NO help!  I figured
someone here might have some insight as to just where the problem lies! 

Bob Novak


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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Eric Gorr]

On Aug 29, 2008, at 4:09 PM, Robert Cummings wrote:


On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 15:52 -0400, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 3:41 PM, Stut wrote:


I completely agree, but as far as I know it's only (and I use that
word carefully) people with both visual and audio impairments that
you cannot cater for.



I cannot see any reason why a person with both visual and audio
impairments could not be presented with a test to prove they are  
human.


Go on, I'm all eyes and ears... describe such a test.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captcha#Attempts_at_more_accessible_CAPTCHAs 
 discusses this.


And, I look forward to see what those doing research in this area come  
up with in the future. It does seem obvious that since they are human,  
that a good test can be designed which does not rely on security  
through obscurity.




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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[tedd]

At 3:27 PM -0400 8/29/08, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 3:15 PM, tedd wrote:

Why should I have to explain something that is widely known and easy to find?


So, I'm curious, what prevents a website from providing a good 
implementation of both an audio and visual captcha to prevent 
accessibility problems which you claim are impossible to avoid with 
every use of a captcha?



If you are curious, then please research it. There is plenty of documentation.


Personally, my favorite implementation to date is:

  http://recaptcha.net/learnmore.html


Arrggg.  I can't even pass it.


and not only is it well designed,


It's designed well enough to keep me out and I'm neither deaf, blind, 
nor whatever.




Remember, the concept of a captcha is this:

  A test to prove one is human in order perform some action.


My memory is just fine, thank you.

At some point, you should do some reading on the subject.

Cheers,

tedd
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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Stut]

On 29 Aug 2008, at 20:52, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 3:41 PM, Stut wrote:

I completely agree, but as far as I know it's only (and I use that  
word carefully) people with both visual and audio impairments that  
you cannot cater for.



I cannot see any reason why a person with both visual and audio  
impairments could not be presented with a test to prove they are  
human.


Show me a test that you can read with a braille reader, that doesn't  
assume more than minimal intelligence on the part of the user and that  
cannot be easily parsed and answered programatically.


-Stut

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Re: [PHP] Testing for Current pointer position in array during iteration

[Mark Weaver]

tedd wrote:

At 2:40 PM -0400 8/29/08, Mark Weaver wrote:

Hi All,

Go figure... I sat down today to get some more work on my current 
project; I got to a certain point where I need to step through an 
array with a foreach loop. I found that I need to test for the 
current pointer position of the array, but I haven't a clue as to how 
this might be accomplished. I've been all over google and php.net, 
but I'm not finding anything that will help me do this.


Basically all I want to do is something like this:

if( current_arrayPointer_postition == n ){
  ... do this
}else{
  ...do this
}

Anyone know of a built-in PHP function that can assist with this, or 
can you point me to a resource that could help me code a solution?


Try looking at current

http://www.php.net/current

Maybe that will help.

Cheers,

tedd



Thanks all for the helpful suggestions. Actually Jochem's suggestion was 
just what I needed. I was stuck at just how to test where the pointer 
was and couldn't see a way out. I knew there had to be a simple, elegant 
solution, but apparently was over-thinking it. Jochem put things back 
into perspective for me.


--

Mark

It was good to be the fire... 
Better by far than to crawl and mew and suck and shit and die!

'Arthur C. Clarke'


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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[tedd]

At 4:21 PM -0400 8/29/08, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 4:09 PM, Robert Cummings wrote:

I cannot see any reason why a person with both visual and audio
impairments could not be presented with a test to prove they are human.


Go on, I'm all eyes and ears... describe such a test.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captcha#Attempts_at_more_accessible_CAPTCHAs 
discusses this.


And, I look forward to see what those doing research in this area 
come up with in the future. It does seem obvious that since they are 
human, that a good test can be designed which does not rely on 
security through obscurity.


Maybe a blood test? Nope, that could be faked.

Back to thinking (ponder, ponder, ponder...)

Cheers,

tedd

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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Stut]

On 29 Aug 2008, at 21:21, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 4:09 PM, Robert Cummings wrote:


On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 15:52 -0400, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 3:41 PM, Stut wrote:


I completely agree, but as far as I know it's only (and I use that
word carefully) people with both visual and audio impairments that
you cannot cater for.



I cannot see any reason why a person with both visual and audio
impairments could not be presented with a test to prove they are  
human.


Go on, I'm all eyes and ears... describe such a test.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captcha#Attempts_at_more_accessible_CAPTCHAs 
 discusses this.


And, I look forward to see what those doing research in this area  
come up with in the future. It does seem obvious that since they are  
human, that a good test can be designed which does not rely on  
security through obscurity.


CAPTCHA's are *not* a security mechanism, no matter what Wikipedia  
says. They do nothing more than protect from automated form  
submissions. That's it.


Anyway, as that article states...

Often, email or telephone support is used to manually provide access  
to users who are unable to solve a CAPTCHA


That's ultimate accessibility, assuming it supports all types of  
telephone, but it's also a major expense needing 24/7 coverage. Not  
something my company of 5 people could hope to support on a free-to- 
use site.


-Stut

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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Eric Gorr]

On Aug 29, 2008, at 4:21 PM, tedd wrote:


At 3:27 PM -0400 8/29/08, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 3:15 PM, tedd wrote:
Why should I have to explain something that is widely known and  
easy to find?


So, I'm curious, what prevents a website from providing a good  
implementation of both an audio and visual captcha to prevent  
accessibility problems which you claim are impossible to avoid with  
every use of a captcha?


If you are curious, then please research it. There is plenty of  
documentation.


I am curious as to what your answer would be as I cannot find what  
does not exist.



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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Robert Cummings]

On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 16:21 -0400, Eric Gorr wrote:
 On Aug 29, 2008, at 4:09 PM, Robert Cummings wrote:
 
  On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 15:52 -0400, Eric Gorr wrote:
  On Aug 29, 2008, at 3:41 PM, Stut wrote:
 
  I completely agree, but as far as I know it's only (and I use that
  word carefully) people with both visual and audio impairments that
  you cannot cater for.
 
 
  I cannot see any reason why a person with both visual and audio
  impairments could not be presented with a test to prove they are  
  human.
 
  Go on, I'm all eyes and ears... describe such a test.
 
 
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Captcha#Attempts_at_more_accessible_CAPTCHAs 
   discusses this.
 
 And, I look forward to see what those doing research in this area come  
 up with in the future. It does seem obvious that since they are human,  
 that a good test can be designed which does not rely on security  
 through obscurity.

I said describe such a test... I didn't say describe current thoughts
about such a test that have no practical implementation.

Pay special attention to the word practical used above before shooting
something back off the top of your head.

Cheers,
Rob.
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Application and Templating Framework for PHP


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Re: [PHP] grab the complete commandline used ...

[Jochem Maas]

Robert Cummings schreef:

On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 15:36 -0400, Robert Cummings wrote:

On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 20:42 +0200, Jochem Maas wrote:

Robert Cummings schreef:

On Fri, 2008-08-29 at 04:48 +0200, Jochem Maas wrote:

Micah Gersten schreef:

I suggest creating a shell wrapper for PHP that will write the command
to a file for you and then call PHP with the appropriate arguments.  PHP
won't even see most of the command that you originally posted.

which wouldn't catch the pipe to grep now would it. nevermind, I don't think
you ge what I was looking for, not worry I can hack together a 'solution'
using exec() ... by grepping the output of ps.

I doubt it. The ps command sees what the script sees. If I do mplayer
*.avi, ps shows me the expanded file list that was given to mplayer.

output after shell expansion is fine, I'm interested in knowing what
arguments we're given to the php interpreter, for example
(other than the scriptname and *it's* args which are readily available
via $argv) and where ever the output is being piped or redirected to.

You won't get redirection or piping from the following but it will give
you the command line info you wanted:

?php

$info = implode( '', file( '/proc/'.posix_getpid().'/cmdline' ) );
$info = explode( \x0, $info );
print_r( $info );

?

Probably doesn't run on windows, and I don't care enough to even think
about checking :)


BTW, you can also look into hacking the bash binary. Several years ago I
wanted to log the command-line to a database table and I hacked the bash
binary to trap history and send to database log.


didn't know about that bit of /proc, thanks :-)



Isn't open source a beautiful thing :)


rather like frankenastein's bride :-P


Cheers,
Rob.



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Re: [PHP] grab the complete commandline used ...

[Jochem Maas]

David Otton schreef:

2008/8/29 Jochem Maas [EMAIL PROTECTED]:


in what sense won't it work? the complete line is in the output of ps
somewhere
albeit after wildcard/shell expansion.


With the pipe? I'd really like to see an example, beacuse I couldn't
coax it out of ps, and it might be handy someday.


ah okay, wasn't sure about the pipe, figured it might not show up in ps.




if life were that simple. it's user X running the php script from the
commandline ... I wanna know exactly what he is doing (which is not
necessarily the same as what he should be doing). I only really control
the php script in question not the context it is run in.


You should have said... you are the admin of the machine, right? Patch
bash to log user input. Google variations on bash, patch and syslog.


I'll take a gander, although I doubt I'll get permission to actually patch
something like that ... client is pretty adament about having a std box.

anyway, Im much the wiser, thanks for the info everyone.






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Re: [PHP] grab the complete commandline used ...

[Jochem Maas]

Micah Gersten schreef:

You can rename the php executable and replace it with a shell script
that logs what is run.


true, but that still wouldn't get me the pipe, besides which one day
someone will figure out that it's not the actual executable and either:

1. recompile and install php (shell script overwritten)
2. start using the actual binary instead

in both cases they'd probably think they're doing something smart :-)
which is why it would be nice to do it from with in my own script without
tweaking/hacking anything on the system. it's then self contained and
because I deliver the script I control it's functionality

of course the script could be edited, but if a 3rd party or the client
does *that* then I'm no longer responsible ... currently I'm not responsible
for the system/server itself (although I have full access) and I'd like to keep
it that way ... sysadmin is a special kind of beast, I'm of another genus :)


Thank you,
Micah Gersten
onShore Networks
Internal Developer
http://www.onshore.com



Jochem Maas wrote:

David Otton schreef:

Quote the entire command as a string. Pass it to a shell script that
sets an environment variable to that string, then executes the string.

if life were that simple. it's user X running the php script from the
commandline ... I wanna know exactly what he is doing (which is not
necessarily the same as what he should be doing). I only really control
the php script in question not the context it is run in.







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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[tedd]

At 9:32 PM +0100 8/29/08, Stut wrote:
That's ultimate accessibility, assuming it supports all types of 
telephone, but it's also a major expense needing 24/7 coverage. Not 
something my company of 5 people could hope to support on a 
free-to-use site.


-Stut


-Stut:

I hesitated before writing this because I don't want to get into 
another debate with you, but accessibility means that all people 
(disabled or not) can access the data they want in a similar fashion.


Accessibility does NOT mean If you have a problem with our web site, 
please call


This is no different than any other accessibility issue. People in 
wheelchairs should not have to call someone to get them over an 
unaccessible curb or to be able to make their way to a product or 
service, or anything else that could be made accessible to them by 
some accommodating manner.


Do you not agree?

Cheers,

tedd
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Re: [PHP] Testing for Current pointer position in array during iteration

[Jochem Maas]

Mark Weaver schreef:

tedd wrote:


...



Try looking at current

http://www.php.net/current

Maybe that will help.


not in the context of foreach() (I'll repeat the oneliner here
because tedd's old and has a crap email client ;-):

php -r '$r = array(a,b,c); next($r); $K = key($r); foreach ($r as $k = $v) { echo $K 
, key($r),  $k\n; }'

current() is akin to key() in that they both work on where the array pointer
currently is. not that current() returns a key ;-)







Jochem put things back 
into perspective for me.


I'm having that printed on a T-Shirt :-P






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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[tedd]

At 4:37 PM -0400 8/29/08, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 4:21 PM, tedd wrote:


At 3:27 PM -0400 8/29/08, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 3:15 PM, tedd wrote:
Why should I have to explain something that is widely known and 
easy to find?


So, I'm curious, what prevents a website from providing a good 
implementation of both an audio and visual captcha to prevent 
accessibility problems which you claim are impossible to avoid 
with every use of a captcha?


If you are curious, then please research it. There is plenty of 
documentation.


I am curious as to what your answer would be as I cannot find what 
does not exist.


There is more than enough documentation regarding accessibility issue 
for you to find your answer. All you need to do is read.


Just because you had a run-in with me off-list where I apologized for 
my comment does not mean that I won't repeat it publicly for everyone 
to decide if what I said was appropriate or not -- your call.


As I see it, you're just being argumentative and playing word games 
and I'm not going to play.


So either read-up on the subject and ask a honest question or I'll 
stop answering your questions all together.


tedd

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Re: [PHP] Testing for Current pointer position in array during iteration

[tedd]

At 11:10 PM +0200 8/29/08, Jochem Maas wrote:

Mark Weaver schreef:

Jochem put things back into perspective for me.


I'm having that printed on a T-Shirt :-P


Damn!

You get more  T-Shirts than me. :-)

Cheers,

tedd
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Re: [PHP] Is this a bug?

[Jochem Maas]

T Lensselink schreef:

Catalin Zamfir Alexandru, DATAGRAM SRL wrote:

Hello guys,

I've been stalking on the list for some time. Didn't have
anything to report/talk, until now. I have a code like this, maybe you guys
can reproduce it, with output buffering started:

Echo 'something';

Echo 'another thing';

Echo 'something br /'\;

 


What happens is that ANYTHING that was echo'ed until that \,
will not reach the buffer. Although, this should actually be a Parse Error,
it isn't, it just echoes what was echoed after the god damned \. It took me
two hours to find this typo in the code .



ouch.
don't forget you can do:

$ php - l yourscript.php

to test for syntax errors (the warning does show up with this).

additionally a good syntax highlighting editor can help you to spot
stuff like this ... anything to stop the eyes from bleeding :/




Can you guys reproduce the error? I can actually give you a
link to the server where this code runs.


  

The script doesn't cause a parse error Instead it throws a warning.

'PHP Warning:  Unexpected character in input:  '\' (ASCII=92) state=1 in'

Don't think it's a bug. And the reason there's no syntax error is
because the \ is a PHP
escape character.


is this character ever valid as an escape character outside of a string?
if it is that's news to me and if it isn't then really it is a bug ...
it should be a straight up parse error ... chances are that it's down
to limitations in the lexer?

the output buffer handler that seems to be swallowing the warning every
second request  now that is weird.








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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Eric Gorr]

On Aug 29, 2008, at 5:19 PM, tedd wrote:


At 4:37 PM -0400 8/29/08, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 4:21 PM, tedd wrote:


At 3:27 PM -0400 8/29/08, Eric Gorr wrote:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 3:15 PM, tedd wrote:
Why should I have to explain something that is widely known and  
easy to find?


So, I'm curious, what prevents a website from providing a good  
implementation of both an audio and visual captcha to prevent  
accessibility problems which you claim are impossible to avoid  
with every use of a captcha?


If you are curious, then please research it. There is plenty of  
documentation.


I am curious as to what your answer would be as I cannot find what  
does not exist.


There is more than enough documentation regarding accessibility  
issue for you to find your answer. All you need to do is read.


There is no documentation anywhere which claims, as you do, that it is  
impossible to design a captcha which deals with accessibility issues.  
It has been done and the research into doing it better continues -  
even with those who are both blind and deaf.



So, again, remember, the concept of a captcha is this:

A test to prove one is human in order perform some action.

There is no reason why a blind or deaf person absolutely cannot be  
presented with such a test. Now, if you wish to continue to argue to  
the contrary, you are more then welcome to do so.



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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Jochem Maas]

tedd schreef:

At 9:32 PM +0100 8/29/08, Stut wrote:
That's ultimate accessibility, assuming it supports all types of 
telephone, but it's also a major expense needing 24/7 coverage. Not 
something my company of 5 people could hope to support on a 
free-to-use site.


-Stut


-Stut:

I hesitated before writing this because I don't want to get into another 
debate with you, but accessibility means that all people (disabled or 
not) can access the data they want in a similar fashion.


Accessibility does NOT mean If you have a problem with our web site, 
please call


This is no different than any other accessibility issue. People in 
wheelchairs should not have to call someone to get them over an 
unaccessible curb or to be able to make their way to a product or 
service, or anything else that could be made accessible to them by some 
accommodating manner.


Do you not agree?


yes and no. in the wild a lion with hip atrophy will be forced to
crawl away and die ... no more eating gazelles for him, more to the point
there are millions (billions?) of people without the right to free speech
, or say clean water let alone have the money for a PC or an internet
connection.

my point being we have a long long long way to go before we can say
much positive about accessibility for everyone.

I think both tedd and Stut make good points, I guess we'll all be
hacking away at such issues for a long time to come.

in the mean time, here's wishing more clean water and internet access
for everyone (and less bombs).



Cheers,

tedd



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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Jochem Maas]

Eric Gorr schreef:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 5:19 PM, tedd wrote:



...

There is no documentation anywhere which claims, as you do, that it is 
impossible to design a captcha which deals with accessibility issues.


a lack of evidence proving the impossible ... there is a logic flaw
there somewhere.

It 
has been done and the research into doing it better continues - even 
with those who are both blind and deaf.



So, again, remember, the concept of a captcha is this:

A test to prove one is human in order perform some action.


so orthogonal to the turing test ... I'd wager that research in
turing test passing technology is moving faster that captcha tech.

so in the long run captcha is plain dead in the water.

really the basic concept of captcha is this:

A test to prove that the interacting agent is legitimate,
whether it be Bot, Cat, Human or otherwise.

oh, and nobody's yet mentioned that anyone can bust any captcha
on an automated scale without any programming intelligence, it
takes nothing more than a setting up a pr0n affliate site with
a redirector form that sneakily grabs captcha images from whatever
the target of the day is ... and in such a case you'd be quite happy
if someone's bot came along a repeated cracked your captcha



There is no reason why a blind or deaf person absolutely cannot be 
presented with such a test. Now, if you wish to continue to argue to the 
contrary, you are more then welcome to do so.


on behalf of the list, please accept our Crayon of the Week award.






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Re: [PHP] Problem with HTML special characters

[Jochem Maas]

Michelle Konzack schreef:


*   Do not Cc: me, because I READ THIS LIST, if I write here   *
*Keine Cc: am mich, ich LESE DIESE LISTE wenn ich hier schreibe*



LIKE I CARE. hack your mail server / mail client / whatever if it bother's
you so much.

BTW it's the list that's being CC'ed


Hello *,

On my Website I have a NEWS section which I can  edit  On-Line  over  my
Web-Interface but I have a problem with umlauts.

I can enter the ü as uulm; and it is saved as  such  and  it  works
properly but, if I now want to re-edit the NEWS, it is schown as ü  in
the input field of the TEXTAREA.  grmpf

Is there a command/function which can convert a whole text  that  it  is
shown correctly with all ...; sequences?


your going about it all wrong. you should enter ü, ü should be in the
database and if your output encoding requires it ü should be entized
(including in the textarea) to uulm; when you output the content.

you can hack your way roung it by double entitizing so that uulm; becomes
amp;uulm; in the source (between textarea and /textarea when the
editor page is output. you'll probably have to use a nasty little regexp for
that in order to avoid double entizing amp; into amp;amp;
(hint: negative lookahead assertion)


Thanks, Greetings and nice Day/Evening
Michelle Konzack
Systemadministrator
24V Electronic Engineer
Tamay Dogan Network
Debian GNU/Linux Consultant





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Re: [PHP] ASCII Captcha

[Jochem Maas]

Eric Gorr schreef:


On Aug 29, 2008, at 5:51 PM, Jochem Maas wrote:


Eric Gorr schreef:

On Aug 29, 2008, at 5:19 PM, tedd wrote:


...

There is no documentation anywhere which claims, as you do, that it 
is impossible to design a captcha which deals with accessibility issues.


a lack of evidence proving the impossible ... there is a logic flaw
there somewhere.


Considering that it has been done, why do you assert anyone would claim 
(such as tedd), who wants to remain credible, that it hasn't? Do you 
wish to make such a claim?




... huh? I really can't even be bothered to try and grok this nonsense of yours.

real trolls use less pronouns.

PS. I a lot less kind than tedd, I bounce everything straight back to the
list if you try to tackle me offlist ... If I wanna pick a fight I'll do it
in public, I have no shame ... I'm dutch.


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