RE: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
[snip] snip Jay Blanchard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote in message news:[EMAIL PROTECTED] com... There are several large complex projects using PHP as the language, jsut as there are several large projects out there using C++, JAVA, Fortran, Cobol etc.etc.etc. /snip I'm cringeing! Did you just compare C++, Java, PHP, Fortran and ... COBOL? If he would have thrown in PASCAL, I would feel that my education at LSU in the 80's wasn't a total waste. ;) [/snip] OMG ... ROFLLMFAO! Totally forgot PASCAL, who'd you take it with? -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
http://www.zend.com/customers.php Do all these companies think that PHP is just a kiddie language? just my 0.02$ -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
[PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
What do you say to someone who says: PHP is just a kiddie language? (Source: http://www.dhtmlcentral.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=19373) PHP is currently my strongest development language and it annoys me that it is a much less bankable skillset than .NET and Java. How long do you think it's going to take to get respect? Will it ever happen? -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
I could understand a programmer saying something like that, since PHP is after all a scripting language. As is Perl, Python, Ruby, etc. A programming purist may even consider any language without direct memory management a kiddie language. Of course, I think Java falls under this kiddie category then. But to get this from a DHTML list? Egads! .NET can't even be considered a kiddie language because it's a framework, not a language. C# is the language of choice for .NET. On Dec 4, 2003, at 10:16 AM, Daniel Pupius wrote: What do you say to someone who says: PHP is just a kiddie language? -- Brent Baisley Systems Architect Landover Associates, Inc. Search Advisory Services for Advanced Technology Environments p: 212.759.6400/800.759.0577 -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
[snip] What do you say to someone who says: PHP is just a kiddie language? (Source: http://www.dhtmlcentral.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=19373) [/snip] Lack of knowledge begets statements like that. (On a DHTML board at that *snicker*) The only thing that you can say to them is this...when they know PHP as well as they do [your language here] then, and only then, will they be able to make this kind of statement truthfully. As far as PHP getting respect and becoming bankableit is. -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
On Thu, 4 Dec 2003 15:16:06 -, you wrote: What do you say to someone who says: PHP is just a kiddie language? (Source: http://www.dhtmlcentral.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=19373) PHP is currently my strongest development language and it annoys me that it is a much less bankable skillset than .NET and Java. How long do you think it's going to take to get respect? Will it ever happen? PHP is a language designed for a limited problem domain (HTML processing), with a gentle learning curve and missing a lot of modern syntax. These can be strengths as well as weaknesses, of course - it all depends on the problem you're trying to solve. However, these attributes do make it a kiddie language (and I'm not using that in an especially pejorative sense) when compared to languages with other design goals. We're just fortunate that most web problems are kiddie problems, too. (It's foolish to get into blind religious wars over languages, so I won't take this any further, but it's also foolish to be wilfully ignorant of the strengths and weaknesses of the tools you use.) -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
[snip] (It's foolish to get into blind religious wars over languages, so I won't take this any further, but it's also foolish to be wilfully ignorant of the strengths and weaknesses of the tools you use.) [/snip] ...or to make statements based on willfull ignornace of others tools. :) -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
People (and some boots): I'm not against or in favor of all this stuff, but exactly all the opposite... (lmao) Seriously, there is no kiddie nor professional languages out there, what is important is what you do with them. PHP will power yahoo in a couple of months more, that is a company that generates millions of dollars a year. I work on a project 100% made in PHP and MySQL that costs a lot of money (6 figures) a copy. On the other hand, my web site (cesamo.com) has php and costs a little more than 0.02 cents. And actually is not working! So there you go! We are all greek!!! Cesar. -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
On Thu, Dec 04, 2003 at 12:25:25PM -0500, Cesar Cordovez wrote: So there you go! We are all greek!!! Beware of Greeks bearing GIFs (Sorry, couldn't resist ;-) -- Aj. Sys. Admin / Developer -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
Cesar Cordovez mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] on Thursday, December 04, 2003 9:25 AM said: I work on a project 100% made in PHP and MySQL that costs a lot of money (6 figures) a copy. Ok... I can't let this go. Do tell! What is it? Or at the very least, what does it do? Chris. -- Don't like reformatting your Outlook replies? Now there's relief! http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/outlook-quotefix/ -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
I'm byting my tongue off... I have to resist... I've signed a do not tell anybody thingy... It is huge, as in database with a million records, huge... But... I can't tell. Sorry. Anyhow, we chose PHP over Java, C++, C#, coldfusion and asp to do this. The process was very simple: it is cheap, fast, scalable, cheap, reliable, cheap, easy to program and maintain, lots of info source (think this list), cheap, etc. Cesar PD. Did I mention that it is cheap and reliable. Also, secure and cross platform, too. Chris W. Parker wrote: Cesar Cordovez mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] on Thursday, December 04, 2003 9:25 AM said: I work on a project 100% made in PHP and MySQL that costs a lot of money (6 figures) a copy. Ok... I can't let this go. Do tell! What is it? Or at the very least, what does it do? Chris. -- Don't like reformatting your Outlook replies? Now there's relief! http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/outlook-quotefix/ -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
Cesar Cordovez mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] on Thursday, December 04, 2003 10:21 AM said: I'm byting my tongue off... I have to resist... I've signed a do not tell anybody thingy... It is huge, as in database with a million records, huge... But... ARGH! I understand. :( Chris. -- Don't like reformatting your Outlook replies? Now there's relief! http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/outlook-quotefix/ -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
[snip] I'm byting my tongue off... I have to resist... I've signed a do not tell anybody thingy... It is huge, as in database with a million records, huge... But... ARGH! I understand. :( [/snip] We process millions of records each day for a billing system based on PHP and MySQL. Gives us centralized web-based interfaces where an upgrade is rolled out to many many users all at once. There are several large complex projects using PHP as the language, jsut as there are several large projects out there using C++, JAVA, Fortran, Cobol etc.etc.etc. -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
--- Daniel Pupius [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What do you say to someone who says: PHP is just a kiddie language? (Source: http://www.dhtmlcentral.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=19373) I would suggest not even bothering with these types of people. Like everyone else, they all have opinions (not necessarily based on anything). If you're the type of person who enjoys enlightening people, it might be worth your while, but it's much easier to convince an intelligent person who has valid complaints than it is to convince a stupid person with none (in my experience). You can usually tell by the way they pose their argument whether they're worth listening to or not. Take this for example: Why are you in a situation where you can't use a real server-side solution, i.e. JSP or ASP.NET? - Tim Scarfe The reason that this type of statement can attract passionate responses is that there is no logic in it and no statement that can be disputed. What are the criteria of a real solution? Why makes JSP a real solution? There aren't answers to questions like these, and this is probably because Mr. Scarfe has no valid argument underneath his trollish remark. So, my advice would be to ignore it. PHP is currently my strongest development language and it annoys me that it is a much less bankable skillset than .NET and Java. How long do you think it's going to take to get respect? Will it ever happen? It's already beginning to happen. I must admit to having an inside perspective much of the time, but this changed recently. A few months ago, I spoke on a PHP Panel at an NYSIA meeting. This is a group of people who are CEOs and entrepeneurs of software companies. What I learned is that, to these types of people, PHP is considered to be bleeding-edge technology. It's just now on their radar - something that they see as the future of Web development, but not something they're using now. To most of us, PHP is old news is the sense that it's been around for a decade. Our perspectives are completely different. It was enlightening. As far as job postings go, realize that the people who create the postings (and even do the interviewing in some cases) do not know anything about the position. They realize that they need a Web developer, so they throw around some words they've heard in association with Web development. This approach likely won't change, but I think that PHP will begin to become one of these words. The real savvy companies (Yahoo, Amazon, Ticketmaster, etc.) already choose things like PHP and mod_perl over J* (choose your favorite Java acronym) and ASP. I think everyone else will catch up, but it will probably take time. I predict that the next ten years will be very fruitful for PHP. Chris = Chris Shiflett - http://shiflett.org/ PHP Security Handbook Coming mid-2004 HTTP Developer's Handbook http://httphandbook.org/ -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
Hey Who cares what these people think. PHP ASP JSP are just tools to get the job done. If the job calls for ASP, you do it in ASP. They are very similar. Myself I like unix/linux servers, mysql and php are free. Find a cheap hosting company that has JSP. -Blake --- Daniel Pupius [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What do you say to someone who says: PHP is just a kiddie language? (Source: http://www.dhtmlcentral.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=19373) -- +-+-++ | Blake Schroeder | Owner/Developer |lhwd.net| +--(http://www.lhwd.net)+--/3174026352\--+ -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
snip Jay Blanchard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote in message news:[EMAIL PROTECTED] There are several large complex projects using PHP as the language, jsut as there are several large projects out there using C++, JAVA, Fortran, Cobol etc.etc.etc. /snip I'm cringeing! Did you just compare C++, Java, PHP, Fortran and ... COBOL? -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
[snip] There are several large complex projects using PHP as the language, jsut as there are several large projects out there using C++, JAVA, Fortran, Cobol etc.etc.etc. /snip I'm cringeing! Did you just compare C++, Java, PHP, Fortran and ... COBOL? [/snip] Not so much comparison as is lumping in with other 'languages' -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
From: Cesar Cordovez [EMAIL PROTECTED] I work on a project 100% made in PHP and MySQL that costs a lot of money (6 figures) a copy. PD. Did I mention that it is cheap and reliable. Please tell me in what world is 6 figures considered cheap?? ---John Holmes... -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
Please tell me in what world is 6 figures considered cheap?? My $300,000 home compared the $2,000,000 one I'd like to have? :) -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
--- CPT John W. Holmes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: Cesar Cordovez [EMAIL PROTECTED] I work on a project 100% made in PHP and MySQL that costs a lot of money (6 figures) a copy. PS. Did I mention that it is cheap and reliable. Please tell me in what world is 6 figures considered cheap?? I'm not sure if you missed it (I may be missing the joke; it wouldn't surprise me), but the 6 figures comment was regarding software written in PHP while the cheap and reliable comment was regarding PHP itself. Chris = Chris Shiflett - http://shiflett.org/ PHP Security Handbook Coming mid-2004 HTTP Developer's Handbook http://httphandbook.org/ -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re[2]: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
Thursday, December 4, 2003, 8:21:44 PM, you wrote: CJWH Please tell me in what world is 6 figures considered cheap?? A Japanese one? :) Although mind you, that's still not exactly cheap being at least just over $9200. -- Best regards, Richardmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
I was refering that the system we are building will be sold for about a half a mill, plus hardware, consultants, instalation, training, migration, etc, etc will be about one mill per client. Huge. LAMPHP are cheap and reliable. And we love it. Our clients love it. They don't have to pay a fortune for each client or development station (think visual studio) or database hits (think microsoft sql server). Cesar CPT John W. Holmes wrote: From: Cesar Cordovez [EMAIL PROTECTED] I work on a project 100% made in PHP and MySQL that costs a lot of money (6 figures) a copy. PD. Did I mention that it is cheap and reliable. Please tell me in what world is 6 figures considered cheap?? ---John Holmes... -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
Rob Adams wrote: snip Jay Blanchard [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote in message news:[EMAIL PROTECTED] There are several large complex projects using PHP as the language, jsut as there are several large projects out there using C++, JAVA, Fortran, Cobol etc.etc.etc. /snip I'm cringeing! Did you just compare C++, Java, PHP, Fortran and ... COBOL? If he would have thrown in PASCAL, I would feel that my education at LSU in the 80's wasn't a total waste. ;) -- By-Tor.com It's all about the Rush http://www.by-tor.com -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP] What do you say to someone who says...
CPT John W. Holmes wrote: From: Cesar Cordovez [EMAIL PROTECTED] I work on a project 100% made in PHP and MySQL that costs a lot of money (6 figures) a copy. PD. Did I mention that it is cheap and reliable. Please tell me in what world is 6 figures considered cheap?? ---John Holmes... 1) If two of the figures are to the right of the decimal point 2) If you're in the military and buying a toilet seat or hammer. Sorry, couldn't resist. :) -- By-Tor.com It's all about the Rush http://www.by-tor.com -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
