php-general Digest 4 Apr 2005 10:25:49 -0000 Issue 3377
Topics (messages 212140 through 212157):
What's the going rate for making websites ?
212140 by: -{ Rene Brehmer }-
212142 by: Robby Russell
212144 by: Leif Gregory
212149 by: Miles Thompson
Re: HUMAN CHECK without url/session cookie/hidden input, etc.
212141 by: Marek Kilimajer
212145 by: andreja.beogradnet.com
212146 by: andreja.beogradnet.com
212147 by: nime
212148 by: nime
A strange problem..
212143 by: JoShQuNe \(TR\)
php - set interval
212150 by: Andrew
212151 by: Rasmus Lerdorf
functions vs classes
212152 by: DuSTiN KRySaK
212154 by: Lars B. Jensen
212155 by: Domas Juknevicius / DEFORM GROUP
How to call a static class and method dynamically
212153 by: Dan Rossi
create word files
212156 by: Roman Duriancik
How to compile PHP5 with VC++ 6.0
212157 by: kioto
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
--- Begin Message ---
Hi gang
Sorry for asking this question here, but I don't know where else to ask.
And Goole'ing didn't help me much.
My father-in-law has a friend in Alaska (and I'm in Canada) that needs a
website done. Not sure what kinda site he wants done yet, or how much he
needs me to do for him (like webspace, domain hosting, domain registration,
and such) but for now I've been asked what it'd cost to get it done.
I'm assuming it's something pretty simple, since it's just for a motorcycle
club, but he wants a price first ...
What do y'all charge when you do sites for people ??? ... In the past I've
only done pro-bono work (because they usually don't require much work, so
it's not a problem getting it done while working on other projects), but
I've never actually done paid work before... It's more that I just recently
moved to Canada (from Denmark) so I have no feeling with what the prices
and rates are overhere ...
TIA
Rene
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Sun, 2005-04-03 at 16:51 -0600, -{ Rene Brehmer }- wrote:
> Hi gang
>
> Sorry for asking this question here, but I don't know where else to ask.
> And Goole'ing didn't help me much.
>
> My father-in-law has a friend in Alaska (and I'm in Canada) that needs a
> website done. Not sure what kinda site he wants done yet, or how much he
> needs me to do for him (like webspace, domain hosting, domain registration,
> and such) but for now I've been asked what it'd cost to get it done.
>
> I'm assuming it's something pretty simple, since it's just for a motorcycle
> club, but he wants a price first ...
>
> What do y'all charge when you do sites for people ??? ... In the past I've
> only done pro-bono work (because they usually don't require much work, so
> it's not a problem getting it done while working on other projects), but
> I've never actually done paid work before... It's more that I just recently
> moved to Canada (from Denmark) so I have no feeling with what the prices
> and rates are overhere ...
>
$x = What is your time worth?
$y = How long will it take you?
$cost = $x * $z
--
/***************************************
* Robby Russell | Owner.Developer.Geek
* PLANET ARGON | www.planetargon.com
* Portland, OR | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
* 503.351.4730 | blog.planetargon.com
* PHP, Ruby, and PostgreSQL Development
* http://www.robbyonrails.com/
****************************************/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello -{,
Sunday, April 3, 2005, 4:51:29 PM, you wrote:
RB> What do y'all charge when you do sites for people ??? ... In the
RB> past I've only done pro-bono work (because they usually don't
RB> require much work, so it's not a problem getting it done while
RB> working on other projects), but I've never actually done paid work
RB> before... It's more that I just recently moved to Canada (from
RB> Denmark) so I have no feeling with what the prices and rates are
RB> overhere ...
You really need to have him lay out a scope of work for you. If you
don't know what he want, there's no way you can give him an estimate.
If he wants ten static pages, then quote him that. If he wants a
dynamic site with a forum and shopping cart, then that's a huge
difference in what I would charge.
I don't know what they normally charge there, but here's what I've
seen here in the US for the following under contract for State gov't.
- Roughly 20 pages (customer provides content)
- Dynamic pulling from a MySQL backend (news, current items etc).
- Admin / Editor pages to add / edit / delete the dynamic content
- Supporting Section 508 and WCAG 1.0
- Considered work for hire (customer owns source afterwards)
Cost: $18,000 (Actual figure I saw on a quote).
They weren't even going to provide the hosting space for the site nor
the MySQL backend. They were going to develop basically the framework
for the group to add their own content and the DB tables.
I was pretty stunned when I saw that. According to the people who
showed me the quote that wasn't even the highest one.
I do a lot of work as a project manager for various application / web
development. One thing I will tell you that you need to really drive
home to your customer is sticking to the scope of work. When you both
sign the dotted line as to what is expected from the project make sure
they fully understand that deviations from that will cost more. It
took me about three or four projects where scope creep *positively*
killed me before I learned my lesson. It always starts small, a change
to a color here, moving an image just a bit this way or that, then
they throw a real wrench in the works by deciding they want to do
something like add a whole new layer of people with certain rights in
the application which blows away your existing authentication /
security model.
This person might be a friend (or father-in-laws friend), but I can't
stress the importance of having a contract in place for both of your
protection.
Also make sure both parties understand what's to be paid for and what
isn't. A deliverables model will help with that. i.e. I get this much
money for adding this functionality to the site. This way if something
goes sour you can be paid for the work already completed.
Also, make sure you keep the customer in the loop. After certain
milestones, show them where you're at to make sure you're still on the
same page. This opens you up a bit more to scope creep, but making a
relatively small change in the beginning is a whole lot better than
nearly starting over at the end.
Cheers,
Leif Gregory
--
TB Lists Moderator (and fellow registered end-user)
PCWize Editor / ICQ 216395 / PGP Key ID 0x7CD4926F
Web Site <http://www.PCWize.com>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Leif,
Amen, amen and amen.
Miles
At 08:52 PM 4/3/2005, Leif Gregory wrote:
Hello -{,
Sunday, April 3, 2005, 4:51:29 PM, you wrote:
RB> What do y'all charge when you do sites for people ??? ... In the
RB> past I've only done pro-bono work (because they usually don't
RB> require much work, so it's not a problem getting it done while
RB> working on other projects), but I've never actually done paid work
RB> before... It's more that I just recently moved to Canada (from
RB> Denmark) so I have no feeling with what the prices and rates are
RB> overhere ...
You really need to have him lay out a scope of work for you. If you
don't know what he want, there's no way you can give him an estimate.
If he wants ten static pages, then quote him that. If he wants a
dynamic site with a forum and shopping cart, then that's a huge
difference in what I would charge.
I don't know what they normally charge there, but here's what I've
seen here in the US for the following under contract for State gov't.
- Roughly 20 pages (customer provides content)
- Dynamic pulling from a MySQL backend (news, current items etc).
- Admin / Editor pages to add / edit / delete the dynamic content
- Supporting Section 508 and WCAG 1.0
- Considered work for hire (customer owns source afterwards)
Cost: $18,000 (Actual figure I saw on a quote).
They weren't even going to provide the hosting space for the site nor
the MySQL backend. They were going to develop basically the framework
for the group to add their own content and the DB tables.
I was pretty stunned when I saw that. According to the people who
showed me the quote that wasn't even the highest one.
I do a lot of work as a project manager for various application / web
development. One thing I will tell you that you need to really drive
home to your customer is sticking to the scope of work. When you both
sign the dotted line as to what is expected from the project make sure
they fully understand that deviations from that will cost more. It
took me about three or four projects where scope creep *positively*
killed me before I learned my lesson. It always starts small, a change
to a color here, moving an image just a bit this way or that, then
they throw a real wrench in the works by deciding they want to do
something like add a whole new layer of people with certain rights in
the application which blows away your existing authentication /
security model.
This person might be a friend (or father-in-laws friend), but I can't
stress the importance of having a contract in place for both of your
protection.
Also make sure both parties understand what's to be paid for and what
isn't. A deliverables model will help with that. i.e. I get this much
money for adding this functionality to the site. This way if something
goes sour you can be paid for the work already completed.
Also, make sure you keep the customer in the loop. After certain
milestones, show them where you're at to make sure you're still on the
same page. This opens you up a bit more to scope creep, but making a
relatively small change in the beginning is a whole lot better than
nearly starting over at the end.
Cheers,
Leif Gregory
--
TB Lists Moderator (and fellow registered end-user)
PCWize Editor / ICQ 216395 / PGP Key ID 0x7CD4926F
Web Site <http://www.PCWize.com>
--
PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/)
To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
nime wrote:
A kind of :-)
https://nokiags.wdsglobal.com/bookmarkmanual?contractId=191&phoneId=408&captchaEnabled=true&step=details.vm&bookmarkManualName=&bookmarkManualURL=&captchaKey=&mobileNumber=&siteLanguageId=118
I mean what sort of data remembers the pass code here?
I see no hidden input value/url value/session cookie/nothing.
It means telepathy!
Maybe the captcha string is stored based on ip address
"Marek Kilimajer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
nime wrote:
Is there any way to do a human check without sending any url/session
cookie/hidden input value
from server to browser?
Do you mean telepathy?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
did anyone tryed to paste this in address
https://nokiags.wdsglobal.com/imageservlet
"Ryan A" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> check up on CAPTCHA on google or your favourite search engine
>
> -Ryan
>
>
> On 4/3/2005 11:35:03 PM, nime ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
>> A kind of :-)
>>
>>
>>
>> https://nokiags.wdsglobal.
>>
> com/bookmarkmanual?contractId=191&phoneId=408&captchaEnabled=true&step=detai
> ls.
>>
> vm&bookmarkManualName=&bookmarkManualURL=&captchaKey=&mobileNumber=&siteLang
> uageId=118
>>
>>
>>
>> I mean what sort of data remembers the pass code here?
>>
>> I see no hidden input value/url value/session cookie/nothing.
>>
>> It means telepathy!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "Marek Kilimajer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message news:42505D1E.
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>
>> > nime wrote:
>>
>> >> Is there any way to do a human check without sending any url/session
>> cookie/hidden input value
>>
>> >> from server to browser?
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >
>>
>> > Do you mean telepathy?
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/)
>>
>> To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.9.1 - Release Date: 4/1/2005
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
i am pretty new in all of this, but i added this sites to restricted web
sites in IE settings, so now it doesnt work at all
"Ryan A" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> check up on CAPTCHA on google or your favourite search engine
>
> -Ryan
>
>
> On 4/3/2005 11:35:03 PM, nime ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
>> A kind of :-)
>>
>>
>>
>> https://nokiags.wdsglobal.
>>
> com/bookmarkmanual?contractId=191&phoneId=408&captchaEnabled=true&step=detai
> ls.
>>
> vm&bookmarkManualName=&bookmarkManualURL=&captchaKey=&mobileNumber=&siteLang
> uageId=118
>>
>>
>>
>> I mean what sort of data remembers the pass code here?
>>
>> I see no hidden input value/url value/session cookie/nothing.
>>
>> It means telepathy!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "Marek Kilimajer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message news:42505D1E.
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>
>> > nime wrote:
>>
>> >> Is there any way to do a human check without sending any url/session
>> cookie/hidden input value
>>
>> >> from server to browser?
>>
>> >>
>>
>> >
>>
>> > Do you mean telepathy?
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/)
>>
>> To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.9.1 - Release Date: 4/1/2005
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
This url is the key. You may insert this <img> into your page at your own server
(event at your local machine) then send related form fields to remote site and
viola!
It accepts the code!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I've checked it. While IE open, I've turned off my modem then on.
With a new IP, I've passed.
"Marek Kilimajer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Maybe the captcha string is stored based on ip address
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi, i have a strange problem. In my site i have to counters for file
downloads. One is general, other is weekly. On the main page i
display a list sorted according to weekly hits. The problem is there:
i give this prompt mysql_query("SELECT * FROM table ORDER BY
weekly_hits DESC LIMIT 15") to display top 15 but if the hit is
greater than 9 itz not displayed. What maybe the reason? Is it
possible to be because of the place of the weekly_hits column in the
table? When i try to sort by general hit, it does, but general hits
are started with 600s so i couldn't get what happens.. Thanx for
help..
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Personals - Better first dates. More second dates.
http://personals.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
hello,
i've been searching for a 'setInterval' function in php and haven't had
much luck.
in actionscript (which is similar to php) you can make a function which
calls another function at a set interval, and i was keen to do this with
php for a mail script so that rather than sending 500 emails at once, i
can send 10 emails every 10 seconds etc.
i'm currently thinking i'll have to use flash to make the interval, but
would rather keep it all in php.
basically what i want to do is this.
function SendMail($howManyToSend, $fromWhatIndex){
// gets the number of email addresses ($howManyToSend)
// from the database, starting at index $fromWhatIndex
// then sends them
if(all emails sent, no more emails in DB){
return 'finished';
}else{
return 'keep them coming';
}
}
function IntervalCalled (){
// increment currentIndex
$currentIndex = $currentIndex + 10;
$howDidWeGo = SendMail(10, $currentIndex);
if($howDidWeGo == "finished"){
// FLASH CLEARINTERVAL COMMAND
clearInterval($makeEmailsInterval);
}
}
// THIS IS HOW I WOULD CALL THE INTERVAL IN FLASH
// (for every 10 seconds)
$makeEmailsInterval = setInterval(IntervalCalled, 10000);
so is this possible with PHP by using functions? anything involving
complicated server stuff means i may as well setup flash to call the
interval instead of PHP
many thanks
andrew
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
None of this makes any sense. PHP is a server-side request-based
language. If you want to put a delay in between things on a request,
call sleep(), but it is still just a single request which is going to
take a finite amount of time to run.
The correct way to send a bunch of emails is to queue them in your MTA
and have your MTA do efficient grouping and delivery of the messages.
Use the right tool for the job.
-Rasmus
Andrew wrote:
hello,
i've been searching for a 'setInterval' function in php and haven't had
much luck.
in actionscript (which is similar to php) you can make a function which
calls another function at a set interval, and i was keen to do this with
php for a mail script so that rather than sending 500 emails at once, i
can send 10 emails every 10 seconds etc.
i'm currently thinking i'll have to use flash to make the interval, but
would rather keep it all in php.
basically what i want to do is this.
function SendMail($howManyToSend, $fromWhatIndex){
// gets the number of email addresses ($howManyToSend)
// from the database, starting at index $fromWhatIndex
// then sends them
if(all emails sent, no more emails in DB){
return 'finished';
}else{
return 'keep them coming';
}
}
function IntervalCalled (){
// increment currentIndex
$currentIndex = $currentIndex + 10;
$howDidWeGo = SendMail(10, $currentIndex);
if($howDidWeGo == "finished"){
// FLASH CLEARINTERVAL COMMAND
clearInterval($makeEmailsInterval);
}
}
// THIS IS HOW I WOULD CALL THE INTERVAL IN FLASH
// (for every 10 seconds)
$makeEmailsInterval = setInterval(IntervalCalled, 10000);
so is this possible with PHP by using functions? anything involving
complicated server stuff means i may as well setup flash to call the
interval instead of PHP
many thanks
andrew
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Novice PHPer, and i am wondering why one would use a function instead
of a class (or object)? They seem to server very similar in use.
The way I see it, is a function if for repeated use in a project
specific manner, where as a class could be used for many projects.
is this correct?
Although one could just include the function library in multiple
projects.
Thanks!
Dustin
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Novice PHPer, and i am wondering why one would use a function instead of a
class (or object)? They seem to server very similar in use.
All depends on the specific use and situation - pros and cons by both
models, for speed and performance, I mostly use optimized functions sorted
out in structured files for easy reuse, rather than objects. PHP5 seem to
embrase object orientation more, so lets see if a war starts again - it's
religion. Think before you program.
The way I see it, is a function if for repeated use in a project specific
manner, where as a class could be used for many projects.
It's precisely the same, if you include a file with your class or include a
file with your functions, whats the difference ? none.
--
Lars B. Jensen, Internet Architect
CareerCross Japan
Japan's premier online career resource for english speaking professionals
http://www.careercross.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello,
Quite good and short answer to your question:
http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=207071
--
Domas Juknevicius
DuSTiN KRySaK wrote:
> Novice PHPer, and i am wondering why one would use a function instead of
> a class (or object)? They seem to server very similar in use.
>
> The way I see it, is a function if for repeated use in a project
> specific manner, where as a class could be used for many projects.
>
> is this correct?
>
> Although one could just include the function library in multiple projects.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Dustin
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I was wonderiing how I would go about something like this
$class = 'classname';
return $class::staticMethod(); , not happy isnt working. Any ideas
lemme know.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have problem with creating word file in PHP script. I create table in
word document but sometimes php send me error message : "*Warning*:
(null)(): Invoke() failed: Exception occurred. *Source*: Microsoft Word
*Description*: There is insufficient memory" and then php script
generate only word document without table.
What can I do ?
Thanks
roman
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi all i have a question. There si an how-to that explain step by step
all necessary to create
a myself compiled php distribution ?
I have read about: http://docs.php.net/en/install.windows.building.html
Can you send a new link about this issue.
Thanks so much again and good work to all.
--- End Message ---
