Re: new-air-powered-car-looks-weird

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

the amount of power needed to refill the air tanks will cause more air
pollution then the if they used a  liquid fuel engine . they also
needed to make their body design more streamlined . [ this body will
act like a huge air brake ! ]

On Oct 20, 3:12 pm, Travis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> From: Travis
> Date: 2008/10/20
> Subject: new-air-powered-car-looks-weird
>
> http://green.yahoo.com/blog/ecogeek/790/new-air-powered-car-looks-wei...
>
> --
> *~@):~{>
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Re: A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteria

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

bull shite !

On Oct 20, 10:10 am, jgg1000a <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> ACORN is a partisan group...   You are doing Hitler-like propaganda
> here...
>
> On Oct 18, 2:59 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > ACORN is non partisan action group who work in the community's
> > registering voters as well as other things such as fighting to remove
> > crack houses from neighborhoods  .
>
> > On Oct 18, 2:53 am, "\"Lone Wolf\"" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > You conveniently forget that the US attorneys
> > > scandal that led to the resignation of Attorney General Alberto
> > > Gonzales arose from a Republican attempt to suppress the vote. A
> > > number of the attorneys were sacked because they did not comply with
> > > Republican pressure to expedite the prosecution of voter fraud cases,
> > > so that they would take place before the 2006 elections. For example,
> > > the US Department of Justice has found that US Attorney David
> > > Iglesias
> > > was dismissed for failing to investigate a local ACORN chapter in New
> > > Mexico.
>
> > > More craven than the Republican attacks on ACORN has been the
> > > cowardly
> > > response of Barack Obama and the Democratic Party. In response to
> > > McCain’s attack on ACORN, Obama disowned any relationship to the
> > > organization, which has worked feverishly on his behalf for months.
> > > Moments earlier he had disowned Bill Ayers, the former radical
> > > routinely condemned by Republicans as a terrorist. Shortly afterward
> > > he listed  those he considers his
> > > true  associates. These include the world’s richest man, Warren
> > > Buffett, and former Federal Reserve
> > > Board head Paul Volcker, whose high interest
> > > rate “shock therapy” in 1979 was responsible for devastating many of
> > > the communities where ACORN now seeks to register impoverished
> > > voters.
>
> > > On Oct 15, 8:03 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > It isn't about just the potential fraudulent Votes being cast, it is
> > > > also about Polling Data and the ability of the Election people to do
> > > > their Jobs...
>
> > > > Although it is no surprise that Idiots, like little Liar mikey, would
> > > > try to dismiss this FRAUD because it is his Party that is attempting
> > > > to pull it off, and failing miserably.
>
> > > > On Oct 15, 1:53 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > A Dose of Reality on the ACORN 
> > > > > Hysteriahttp://www.truthout.org/101408VA
> > > > > New voter location cards are being sent to over half of the voters in
> > > > > Kalamazoo, Michigan, notifying them of a change in their poll or
> > > > > precinct location. (Photo: Jill McLane Baker / Kalamazoo Gazette)
> > > > >     It's worth taking a moment to step back from the slew of charges
> > > > > leveled over the last week at ACORN, the community-organizing group
> > > > > that Republicans and the McCain campaign have been trying to turn into
> > > > > a bogeyman for fears about vote fraud (and, of course, tie to Barack
> > > > > Obama).
>
> > > > >     The GOP has accused ACORN of submitting fraudulent voter
> > > > > registration forms numbering in the hundreds or thousands, in
> > > > > battleground states including Ohio, Indiana, Nevada, and Missouri.
>
> > > > >     But the most important point that's getting lost in the Fox-
> > > > > generated hysteria is that, according to voting experts, even when
> > > > > fraudulent voter registration forms are submitted, they virtually
> > > > > never lead to fraudulent votes being cast. Richard Hasen, a law
> > > > > professor at Loyola and an authority on voting law, wrote in a 2007 
> > > > > op-
> > > > > ed published last year in the Dallas Morning News and noted recently
> > > > > by TPM, that "the idea of massive polling-place fraud (through the use
> > > > > of inflated voter rolls) is inherently incredible," because of the
> > > > > sheer logistical challenges it would require to carry out on a large
> > > > > scale.
>
> > > > >     In many states, ACORN is required by la

Re: McCain Campaign Launches Pre-Emptive Strike on NYT

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

they have already investigated her and found nothing  negitive to
report .

On Oct 20, 6:49 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> when is the "investigative" reporter going to do a hit piece on the
> nobama's?  oh wait, that's right, they would never be critical of the
> messiah, the chosen one, the savior.  just another example of the
> liberal msm being the propaganda arm of the nobama campaign.  this is
> the year that real journalism died.
>
> On Oct 20, 4:51 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > McCain Campaign Launches Pre-Emptive Strike on NYT
> >  http://www.truthout.org/article/101908C
> >     Concord, NC - Sen. John McCain's campaign reacted with fury early
> > this morning to a New York Times profile of the senator's wife Cindy.
>
> >     A campaign spokesman called the article a "vicious attack" and
> > released a copy of a letter the campaign's lawyer sent to New York
> > Times executive editor Bill Keller.
>
> >     In the letter, sent before the article was published, McCain
> > lawyer John Dowd described the reporting effort as an example of the
> > "cruel hit pieces designed to injure people that only the worst rag
> > would investigate and publish."
>
> >     "I know you and your colleagues are always preaching about raising
> > the level of civil discourse in our political campaigns," Dowd wrote.
> > "I think taking some your own medicine is in order here."
>
> > Also see below:
> > Behind McCain, Outsider in Capital Wanting Back In    •
>
> >     The story describes Cindy McCain's unique path to the campaign
> > trail, a journey that included her battle with addiction and her
> > isolation in Washington. The article also briefly revisits the
> > substance of the Times article from the winter that first caused
> > friction between McCain and the newspaper.
>
> >     This morning's statement suggests the campaign views this as a
> > fresh opportunity to turn a negative story in the Times into a
> > referendum on the newspaper, and on the national media at large.
> > McCain rallies often include a reference to the national media having
> > "written off" his campaign.
>
> >     And, at least with the crowds at his rallies, the jabs at the
> > press play well.
>
> >     This morning, Rep. Robin Hayes (R-N.C.), got a huge response at a
> > rally in this North Carolina town of 56,000 outside Charlotte when he
> > said, "Good news is, people are watching the news. Bad news is,
> > sometimes they twist what was said into something it's not."
>
> >     Randy Miller, 43, a Concord banker, said the line of attack works
> > because people in towns like his don't trust the national media
> > anymore.
>
> >     "It used to be respected," Miller said. "No more."
>
> > :
> > Behind McCain, Outsider in Capital Wanting Back In
> > Saturday 18 October 2008
>
> > »
> > by: Jodi Kantor and David M. Halbfinger, The New York Times
>
> >     Cindy McCain was new to Washington and not yet 30 when she arrived
> > at a luncheon for Congressional spouses to discover a problem with her
> > name tag.
>
> >     It read "Carol McCain." That was the well-liked wife John McCain
> > had left to marry Cindy, to the disapproval of many in Washington.
>
> >     Fearing that the slight was intentional, she slinked to a half-
> > empty table that never filled. "No one wanted to sit at her table,"
> > said Barbara Ross, a friend who was not surprised when Mrs. McCain
> > announced a few months later that she was moving back to Arizona. "It
> > was like high school."
>
> >     Cindy McCain, the wife of the Republican presidential nominee, has
> > spent the last year pursuing a return to Washington: "a harsh town"
> > that does not suit her, she has said.
>
> >     Nor does campaigning, friends say. She has done relatively few
> > solo events, grants interviews reluctantly- she declined to speak for
> > this article - and in introducing her husband at events, she offers
> > few of the heartwarming anecdotes that are the stock in trade of the
> > political spouse. When she finishes, she stands silently behind him,
> > sometimes with an approving smile, sometimes looking strained.
>
> >     >From the start, Mrs. McCain's marriage has been defined by her
> > husband's ambitions, and

Re: California Republican Arrested for Voter Fraud

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

"This hardly reaches the level of ACORN "
it is a thousand times worse he committed a crime the ACORN
organization did not !
On Oct 20, 8:03 am, "d.b.baker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> This hardly reaches the level of ACORN:
>
> ONTARIO, Calif.—The owner of a signature-gathering firm has been
> arrested on suspicion of voter registration fraud, authorities said
> Sunday.
>
> Mark Anthony Jacoby, who owns the firm Young Political Majors, is
> accused of registering himself to vote twice— in 2006 and in 2007—
> using the address of a childhood home in Los Angeles where he no
> longer lived.
>
> The Secretary of State's Office said Jacoby used the address to meet a
> state requirement that signature-gatherers sign a declaration stating
> that they are either registered to vote in California or are eligible
> to do so. -http://www.mercurynews.com/ci_10762949?source=most_emailed
>
> On Oct 20, 7:36 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > California Republican Arrested for Voter 
> > Fraudhttp://www.alternet.org/blogs/peek/103690/
> > Another report of Republican-related voter registration problems
> > surfaces in California. Yesterday the Los Angeles Times reported on
> > the Republican voter registration outfit who had allegedly been
> > illegally changing thousands of registrations from Democratic to
> > Republican.
>
> > Last night the head of that GOP backed group, Mark Anthony Jacoby of
> > Young Political Majors (YPM), was arrested by the California State
> > Election Fraud Taskforce and the Oxnard Police.
>
> > According to California Secretary of State Debra Bowen's press
> > release, Jacoby himself had committed voter registration fraud and
> > perjury by lying on his own voter registration form. (That's similar
> > to what Ann Coulter did, though she not only committed felony voter
> > registration fraud, she also committed actual voter fraud, as well,
> > even though such fraud is exceedingly rare.)
>
> > It was my pleasure to break this story today on Fox "News" of all
> > places! Thanks to VotersUnite! editor John Gideon for getting it
> > posted as I was on the roll towards the studio. I'll have the video up
> > of my appearance on Fox, and the "Fox News Alert" I was able to do,
> > later tonight.
>
> > Please note, this isn't the first time there have been serious
> > problems with GOP-gathered voter registrations in CA, as outlined
> > recently at Alternet. Looks like the GOP's voter registration record
> > for errors far outpaced ACORN! Whaddaya know?- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
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California Republican Arrested for Voter Fraud

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

California Republican Arrested for Voter Fraud
http://www.alternet.org/blogs/peek/103690/
Another report of Republican-related voter registration problems
surfaces in California. Yesterday the Los Angeles Times reported on
the Republican voter registration outfit who had allegedly been
illegally changing thousands of registrations from Democratic to
Republican.

Last night the head of that GOP backed group, Mark Anthony Jacoby of
Young Political Majors (YPM), was arrested by the California State
Election Fraud Taskforce and the Oxnard Police.

According to California Secretary of State Debra Bowen's press
release, Jacoby himself had committed voter registration fraud and
perjury by lying on his own voter registration form. (That's similar
to what Ann Coulter did, though she not only committed felony voter
registration fraud, she also committed actual voter fraud, as well,
even though such fraud is exceedingly rare.)

It was my pleasure to break this story today on Fox "News" of all
places! Thanks to VotersUnite! editor John Gideon for getting it
posted as I was on the roll towards the studio. I'll have the video up
of my appearance on Fox, and the "Fox News Alert" I was able to do,
later tonight.

Please note, this isn't the first time there have been serious
problems with GOP-gathered voter registrations in CA, as outlined
recently at Alternet. Looks like the GOP's voter registration record
for errors far outpaced ACORN! Whaddaya know?



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Palin's Plunge: Voters Sour on McCain's VP Pick

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

Palin's Plunge: Voters Sour on McCain's VP Pick
http://www.alternet.org/election08/103645/
 Her favorability numbers are dropping like a rock. The more voters
learn about Sarah Palin, the more wary they become. Once the focus of
post-convention Republican euphoria, the Alaska Governor is now viewed
as a serious liability to the McCain campaign.


As it stands, Palin's polling numbers are daunting: with the unfolding
economic crisis, her favorable to unfavorable ratings have switched
from a positive 40-30, according to a September 12-16 New York Times
survey, to a negative 32-41 in an October 10-13 survey.


Palin is, additionally, costing McCain newspaper endorsements. Editor
and Publisher calculated that as of Oct 18, Barack Obama led McCain
58-16 in the competition for the backing of newspapers. Many of the
endorsements cited Palin as a factor in their rejection of McCain. The
Salt Lake Tribune, which supported George W. Bush in 2004, commented
that "out of nowhere, and without proper vetting, the impetuous McCain
picked Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin as his running mate. She quickly proved
grievously under-equipped to step into the presidency should McCain,
at 72 and with a history of health problems, die in office. More than
any single factor, McCain's bad judgment in choosing the inarticulate,
insular and ethically challenged Palin disqualifies him for the
presidency." The Kansas City Star, in turn, described Palin as
"unqualified."


Brookings Senior Fellow Thomas Mann told the Huffington Post that
initially, Palin both built conservative enthusiasm for McCain and
drew widespread interest among voters who had not been closely
following the race. But those benefits soon evanesced:


"Within weeks, she became a liability, primarily as a highly visible
indicator of McCain's impulsiveness and recklessness in picking
someone who is patently unqualified to serve as president and
commander-in-chief. McCain's only chance of making this election
competitive was to contrast his readiness to serve with Obama's
inexperience and naivet. The Palin choice was the first clear sign
(others followed) that McCain could not win that comparison."


Norman Ornstein, of the American Enterprise Institute, agrees about
the immediate gains, noting that the "short term boost dissipated
awfully quickly. Palin's clear lack of capability to serve as VP, much
less as president, her lack of knowledge of even basics about most
areas of policy, her ethical problems in Alaska over Troopergate, and
the campaign decision to cloister her from serious scrutiny, all
caused a drop in her own approval, but also reflected on McCain's
decision-making style." Palin continues to "generate enthusiasm from
hard-core Republicans who would not be as charged-up if the running
mate were, say, a [Mitt] Romney or [Tim] Pawlenty," Ornstein says,
"but the downside is definitely greater than the gain."


Palin's analysis of the current economic crisis has not won over most
voters seeking a serious appraisal of the situation accompanied by
well-thought out proposals. In a highly sympathetic interview with
Sean Hannity on Fox News, the verbatim exchange on the economy went as
follows:


PALIN: "Certainly it is a mess though, the economy is a mess. And
there have been abuses on Wall Street and that adversely affects Main
Street.




And it's that commitment that John McCain is articulating today,
getting in there, reforming the way that Wall Street has been allowed
to work, stopping the abuses and that violation of the public trust
that too many CEOs and top management of some of these companies, that
abuse there has got to stop.


It is, somebody was saying this morning, a toxic waste there on Wall
Street, affecting Main Street. And we've got to cure this."



123Next page »

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Republicans Rain Negative Automated Calls on Voters in Swing States

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

Republicans Rain Negative Automated Calls on Voters in Swing States
http://www.truthout.org/article/101908F
The McCain campaign has launched negative robocalls in a number of
swing states. (Reuters)
Voters in at least 10 swing states are receiving hundreds of
thousands of automated telephone calls - uniformly negative and
sometimes misleading - that the Republican Party and the McCain
campaign are financing this week as they struggle to keep more states
from drifting into the Democratic column.

Senator John McCain, the Republican nominee for president, has
denounced such phone calls in the past: In the 2000 primaries, Mr.
McCain was a target of misleading calls that included innuendo about
his family, and he blamed them in part for his loss to George W. Bush.
This January, too, in South Carolina, Mr. McCain described the calls
against him as "scurrilous stuff," and his campaign set up a "truth
squad" to debunk them.

On Friday, a Democratic official in Minnesota said he had received
one of these so-called robocalls and had tracked it to a company owned
by a prominent Republican consultant, Jeff Larson. According to
published news reports, Mr. Larson and his previous firm helped
develop the phone calls in 2000 that took aim at Mr. McCain.

A spokesman for the McCain campaign could not say Friday night
whether it had contracted with Mr. Larson's current company, FLS
Connect. Phone messages left for Mr. Larson were not answered Friday,
nor were messages left at a subcontractor, King TeleServices, which is
making the actual calls to voters in Minnesota.

The Minnesota Democrat, Christopher Shoff, a commissioner in
Freeborn County, said the automated call described Mr. Obama as
putting "Hollywood above America" because he attended a fund-raiser in
Beverly Hills hours after the federal government seized control of the
insurance giant American International Group. The call was first
reported by The Huffington Post.

"It is a disgusting form of negative campaigning," Mr. Shoff said
in an interview, "calling people randomly off a computerized list,
during dinner time, and reciting a message that is misleading, as I
knew it to be. Republicans should be talking about serious issues."

Tucker Bounds, a spokesman for the McCain campaign, said the
"Hollywood" robocall was based in fact. "I would argue that much of
these calls are based on hardened facts that American voters should
consider," Mr. Bounds said.

Another McCain spokesman, Brian Rogers, said the automated calls
placed this year were different from those used against Mr. McCain in
2000 because they were "100 percent true." Mr. Rogers added that it
was "crazy" to compare these calls to the calls in 2000, which sought
to hurt Mr. McCain by describing his "interracial child" - a reference
to the McCains' adopted daughter from Bangladesh.

On Friday, Senator Susan Collins, Republican of Maine, urged Mr.
McCain to stop placing automated calls in her state, The Associated
Press reported.

Ben LaBolt, a spokesman for the Obama campaign, said Mr. McCain's
use of automated calls in this campaign showed "just how much Senator
McCain has changed since then - adopting not only President Bush's
policies but his tactics." In response to the calls, the Obama
campaign on Friday added a link on its Web site to FightTheSmears.com,
asking supporters to report robocalls.

Mr. LaBolt said the Obama campaign was currently making robocalls,
but he added: "The focus of all of our communications is on the
direction Senator Obama will take the country and on policy
differences between the candidates on issues like health care."
Republican National Committee officials said they were not aware of
any Obama robocalls.

Such calls are a relatively cheap way to reach large numbers of
voters in a short time. A review shows that the current calls on Mr.
McCain's behalf are uniformly negative and at times misleading.

The phone campaign hammers familiar themes that have been playing
out for months in the campaign, focusing on Mr. Obama's past
associations and trying to portray him as a friend of radicals and
liberal Hollywood celebrities.

In one widely reported call, Mr. McCain raises Mr. Obama's links
to William Ayers, a founder of the 1960s-era radical Weather
Underground. "You need to know that Barack Obama has worked closely
with domestic terrorist Bill Ayers," a recorded voice says.

Mr. Obama, 47, and Mr. Ayers, now a 63-year-old education
professor at the University of Illinois at Chicago, served together on
two of that city's philanthropic boards as well as on the board of an
education project, the Chicago Annenberg Challenge. The two men have
been described as friendly, but are not known to be close.

In an Oct. 10 letter to The New York Times, William C. Ibershof,
the lead federal prosecutor of the Weathermen in the 1970s, expressed
outrage that Mr. Obama was being tarred with the association, adding
that he was plea

McCain Campaign Launches Pre-Emptive Strike on NYT

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

McCain Campaign Launches Pre-Emptive Strike on NYT
 http://www.truthout.org/article/101908C
Concord, NC - Sen. John McCain's campaign reacted with fury early
this morning to a New York Times profile of the senator's wife Cindy.

A campaign spokesman called the article a "vicious attack" and
released a copy of a letter the campaign's lawyer sent to New York
Times executive editor Bill Keller.

In the letter, sent before the article was published, McCain
lawyer John Dowd described the reporting effort as an example of the
"cruel hit pieces designed to injure people that only the worst rag
would investigate and publish."

"I know you and your colleagues are always preaching about raising
the level of civil discourse in our political campaigns," Dowd wrote.
"I think taking some your own medicine is in order here."

Also see below:
Behind McCain, Outsider in Capital Wanting Back In•

The story describes Cindy McCain's unique path to the campaign
trail, a journey that included her battle with addiction and her
isolation in Washington. The article also briefly revisits the
substance of the Times article from the winter that first caused
friction between McCain and the newspaper.

This morning's statement suggests the campaign views this as a
fresh opportunity to turn a negative story in the Times into a
referendum on the newspaper, and on the national media at large.
McCain rallies often include a reference to the national media having
"written off" his campaign.

And, at least with the crowds at his rallies, the jabs at the
press play well.

This morning, Rep. Robin Hayes (R-N.C.), got a huge response at a
rally in this North Carolina town of 56,000 outside Charlotte when he
said, "Good news is, people are watching the news. Bad news is,
sometimes they twist what was said into something it's not."

Randy Miller, 43, a Concord banker, said the line of attack works
because people in towns like his don't trust the national media
anymore.

"It used to be respected," Miller said. "No more."


:
Behind McCain, Outsider in Capital Wanting Back In
Saturday 18 October 2008

»
by: Jodi Kantor and David M. Halbfinger, The New York Times

Cindy McCain was new to Washington and not yet 30 when she arrived
at a luncheon for Congressional spouses to discover a problem with her
name tag.

It read "Carol McCain." That was the well-liked wife John McCain
had left to marry Cindy, to the disapproval of many in Washington.

Fearing that the slight was intentional, she slinked to a half-
empty table that never filled. "No one wanted to sit at her table,"
said Barbara Ross, a friend who was not surprised when Mrs. McCain
announced a few months later that she was moving back to Arizona. "It
was like high school."

Cindy McCain, the wife of the Republican presidential nominee, has
spent the last year pursuing a return to Washington: "a harsh town"
that does not suit her, she has said.

Nor does campaigning, friends say. She has done relatively few
solo events, grants interviews reluctantly- she declined to speak for
this article - and in introducing her husband at events, she offers
few of the heartwarming anecdotes that are the stock in trade of the
political spouse. When she finishes, she stands silently behind him,
sometimes with an approving smile, sometimes looking strained.

>From the start, Mrs. McCain's marriage has been defined by her
husband's ambitions, and despite her sometimes punishing ride in
political life, she does whatever she must to help fulfill them. As
his poll numbers have slid recently, her devotion has seemed only to
grow. When the McCain campaign recently stepped up attacks on Senator
Barack Obama, Mrs. McCain joined in with startling intensity. The day
after the second presidential debate, which did not turn around Mr.
McCain's standing in the polls, she interrupted a Fox News interview
he was doing to testify to his virtues. At this late date, Mrs. McCain
is starting to headline her own rallies, starting in Pennsylvania on
Saturday.

"She would walk on broken glass barefoot if it required her to do
so in this campaign," said Matt Salmon, a former Arizona congressman
who knows the couple.

Mrs. McCain, 54, describes herself as her husband's best friend,
though for the last two decades they have mostly lived apart, she in
Arizona, he in Washington. She initially seemed like an ideal
political partner, giving Mr. McCain a home state, money and contacts
that jump-started his career. But as the years passed, she also became
a liability at times. She played a role in the Keating Five savings-
and-loan scandal, and just as her husband was rehabilitating his
reputation, she was caught stealing drugs from her nonprofit
organization to feed her addiction to painkillers. She has a fortune
that sets the McCains apart from most other Americans, a problem in a
presidential race that hinges on economi

Powell Endorses Obama

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

Powell Endorses Obama
http://www.truthout.org/article/101908Y
Former Secretary of State Colin L. Powell endorsed Senator Barack
Obama for president on Sunday morning as a candidate who was reaching
out in a "more diverse and inclusive way across our society" and
offering a "calm, patient, intellectual, steady approach" to the
nation’s problems.

The endorsement, on the NBC public affairs program "Meet the
Press," was a major blow to Senator John McCain, who has been a good
friend of Mr. Powell for decades. Mr. Powell, a Republican, has
advised Mr. McCain in the past on foreign policy.

Mr. Powell told reporters after the taping of "Meet the Press"
that he had been disturbed in recent weeks by the negative tone of Mr.
McCain’s campaign, particularly its focus on Mr. Obama’s passing
relationship with William Ayers, a 1960s radical and founder of the
Weather Underground. The McCain campaign has sought to promote the
idea that Mr. Obama is "palling around with terrorists," in the words
of Mr. McCain’s running mate, Gov. Sarah Palin, because of Mr. Obama’s
weak links to Mr. Ayers.

"I thought that was over the top," Mr. Powell told reporters. "It
was beyond just good political fighting back and forth."


Mr. Powell did offer Mr. McCain a small dose of solace by calling
him a different kind of Republican, although one who would support the
party’s standard positions.

"As gifted as he is, he is essentially going to execute the
Republican agenda, the orthodoxy of the Republican agenda, with a new
face and a maverick approach to it, and he’d be quite good at it," Mr.
Powell said. "But I think we need a generational change."

In offering his endorsement, Mr. Powell becomes the highest
profile Republican to add his support to the Democratic ticket. Aides
said it was not yet known whether the two men would campaign together
– or what Mr. Powell would do alone – in the final two weeks of the
presidential campaign.

Those talks, aides said, were underway on Sunday.

Mr. Powell’s endorsement exposed a fundamental policy rift in the
fractious Republican party foreign policy establishment between the so-
called pragmatists, a number of whom have come to view the Iraq war or
its execution as a mistake, and a competing camp, the
neoconservatives, whose thinking dominated President Bush's first term
and played a pivotal role in building the case for war.

Mr. Powell, who is of the pragmatist camp and has been critical of
the Bush administration’s conduct of the war, was said by friends in
recent months to be disturbed by some of the neoconservatives who have
surrounded Mr. McCain as foreign policy advisers in his presidential
campaign. The McCain campaign’s top foreign policy aide is Randy
Scheunemann, who was a foreign policy adviser to former Senators Trent
Lott and Bob Dole and who has longtime ties to neoconservatives. In
2002, Mr. Scheunemann was a founder of the hawkish Committee for the
Liberation of Iraq and was an enthusiastic supporter of the Iraqi
exile and Pentagon favorite, Ahmad Chalabi, who was viewed with
suspicion and distaste at the State Department when Mr. Powell was
secretary of state.

Mr. Powell met with both Mr. McCain and Mr. Obama in June in
preparation to make a possible endorsement. He has said repeatedly in
recent months that he wanted to wait until after the political
conventions and the presidential debates before making a decision.

Mr. Powell’s support of Mr. Obama was not a surprise to people who
know him well and within Washington’s foreign policy establishment,
but the Obama campaign welcomed it as a powerful reassurance to voters
about Mr. Obama’s national security credentials. Other voters,
however, could discount it as an action of a disgruntled member of the
Bush administration or as simply the support of one African American
for another.

Mr. Powell also told reporters on Sunday that he was troubled that
a number of Americans believe that Mr. Obama is a Muslim, although he
did not directly link that supposition to the McCain campaign. At a
recent town-hall style meeting, Mr. McCain told an audience member who
said she thought that Mr. Obama was an "Arab," "no, ma'am, he’s a
decent family man."

"These are the kinds of images going out on Al Jazeera that are
killing us around the world," Mr. Powell said. "And we have got to say
to the world it doesn’t make any difference who you are and what you
are. If you’re an American you’re an American."

Mr. McCain was asked about Mr. Powell's endorsement during an
interview on Fox News Sunday.

"I have always admired and respected General Powell," Mr. McCain
said. "We have a respectful disagreement."

-


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| Obama's Legal Team Seeks Special Prosecutor for Voter Registration Probe

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

| Obama's Legal Team Seeks Special Prosecutor for Voter Registration
Probe
http://www.truthout.org/article/101808Y
Todd Spangler, The Detroit Free Press: "Barack Obama's legal team
wants a special prosecutor to determine whether partisan politics is
at play in a reported though unconfirmed Justice Department
investigation of a voter registration effort which has been the target
of numerous complaints of late, including one in Michigan."


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Re: Obama Trusted More than McCain on Seven of 10 Electoral Issues

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

i think Obama was sent to us by God in order to turn America away from
the fascist policies of the bush / McCain republican party .

On Oct 19, 4:30 am, "\"Lone Wolf\"" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Why, he's a sleaze bag just like McCain? These people don't give a
> shit about America, they are in it for themselves.
>
> On Oct 19, 7:25 pm, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Obama Trusted More than McCain on Seven of 10 Electoral 
> > Issueshttp://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_2008...
> > With less than three weeks left until the election, voters still trust
> > Barack Obama more than John McCain on seven out of 10 key electoral
> > issues regularly tracked by Rasmussen Reports.
>
> > But two weeks ago, Obama had the edge on all 10 issues.
>
> > In the latest surveys taken Saturday and Sunday nights, McCain now has
> > the edge in the areas of immigration, abortion and the war in Iraq.
>
> > Voters trust McCain more on the war in Iraq by a 50% to 45% margin.
> > Voters who have served in the military overwhelmingly favor McCain on
> > this issue, while voters who have not served are fairly evenly
> > divided. Voters with family in the military favor McCain by a 55% to
> > 42% margin on this issue, while voters whose loved ones are not
> > serving support Obama, 49% to 46%.
>
> > Men now trust McCain 53% to 43% on the war, while women are split
> > between the two candidates at 47% each.
>
> > The Republican also has opened a modest lead on immigration, an issue
> > that has been pushed aside in the debates and in campaign ads this
> > election year. Forty-three percent (43%) of voters say they trust
> > McCain more on the issue, while 40% trust Obama more.
>
> > Voters also trust McCain more on abortion by a 45% to 42% margin, an
> > issue on which Obama held a five-point advantage two weeks ago.
>
> > The candidates are nearly tied on the issue of taxes, where Obama has
> > just a one-percentage point edge, down from three points in the last
> > poll. McCain has warned voters of an increase in taxes if Obama is in
> > office, and men seem to be skeptical of the Democrat, favoring the GOP
> > nominee 48% to 45%. Women still favor Obama on the issue by a 49% to
> > 44% margin.
>
> > The candidates are separated by just two percentage points on
> > balancing the federal budget and negotiating trade agreements. Two
> > weeks ago, Obama had four-point leads on both issues.
>
> > Obama continues to hold solid leads on environmental issues, health
> > care and education.
>
> > Separate Rasmussen tracking has found that voters consistently trust
> > Obama more on the issue of the economy, while McCain has the advantage
> > on national security and the War on Terror.
>
> > Nationally, voters trust the Democratic Party more than the
> > Republicans on 10 key issues tracked regularly by Rasmussen Reports.- Hide 
> > quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
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i love it when a plan comes together !

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

i love it when a plan comes
together !   Daily Update


http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_20082/2008_presidential_election/missouri/election_2008_missouri_presidential_election

Missouri: Obama 52% McCain 46%

Barack Obama has expanded his lead over John McCain in Missouri to six
percentage
points. The latest Rasmussen Reports telephone survey in the state
finds Obama
with 52% of the vote while McCain is supported by 46%. Earlier this
week, Obama
was on top 50% to 47%.



http://visitor.constantcontact.com/email.jsp?m=1102135387545";>

Join Our Mailing List



McCain-Obama Tied in Ohio

Barack Obama and John McCain are now all tied up at 49% each in the
battleground
state of Ohio, according to the latest Rasmussen Reports telephone
survey.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_20082/2008_presidential_election/ohio/election_2008_ohio_presidential_election


Daily Presidential Tracking Poll

The Rasmussen Reports daily Presidential Tracking Poll for Friday
shows Barack
Obama attracting 50% of the vote while John McCain earns 46%. These
figures
reflect a remarkably stable race in which Obama has enjoyed a four-to-
eight
point advantage for twenty-two straight days.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_20082/2008_presidential_election/daily_presidential_tracking_poll



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Obama Trusted More than McCain on Seven of 10 Electoral Issues

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

Obama Trusted More than McCain on Seven of 10 Electoral Issues
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_20082/2008_presidential_election/obama_trusted_more_than_mccain_on_seven_of_10_electoral_issues
With less than three weeks left until the election, voters still trust
Barack Obama more than John McCain on seven out of 10 key electoral
issues regularly tracked by Rasmussen Reports.

But two weeks ago, Obama had the edge on all 10 issues.

In the latest surveys taken Saturday and Sunday nights, McCain now has
the edge in the areas of immigration, abortion and the war in Iraq.

Voters trust McCain more on the war in Iraq by a 50% to 45% margin.
Voters who have served in the military overwhelmingly favor McCain on
this issue, while voters who have not served are fairly evenly
divided. Voters with family in the military favor McCain by a 55% to
42% margin on this issue, while voters whose loved ones are not
serving support Obama, 49% to 46%.

Men now trust McCain 53% to 43% on the war, while women are split
between the two candidates at 47% each.

The Republican also has opened a modest lead on immigration, an issue
that has been pushed aside in the debates and in campaign ads this
election year. Forty-three percent (43%) of voters say they trust
McCain more on the issue, while 40% trust Obama more.

Voters also trust McCain more on abortion by a 45% to 42% margin, an
issue on which Obama held a five-point advantage two weeks ago.

The candidates are nearly tied on the issue of taxes, where Obama has
just a one-percentage point edge, down from three points in the last
poll. McCain has warned voters of an increase in taxes if Obama is in
office, and men seem to be skeptical of the Democrat, favoring the GOP
nominee 48% to 45%. Women still favor Obama on the issue by a 49% to
44% margin.

The candidates are separated by just two percentage points on
balancing the federal budget and negotiating trade agreements. Two
weeks ago, Obama had four-point leads on both issues.

Obama continues to hold solid leads on environmental issues, health
care and education.

Separate Rasmussen tracking has found that voters consistently trust
Obama more on the issue of the economy, while McCain has the advantage
on national security and the War on Terror.

Nationally, voters trust the Democratic Party more than the
Republicans on 10 key issues tracked regularly by Rasmussen Reports.


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Voters say they were duped into registering as Republicans

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

Voters say they were duped into registering as Republicans
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-fraud18-2008oct18,0,1216330.story?track=ntothtml
YPM, a group hired by the GOP, allegedly deceived Californians who
thought they were signing a petition. YPM denies any wrongdoing.
Similar accusations have been leveled against the company elsewhere.
SACRAMENTO -- Dozens of newly minted Republican voters say they were
duped into joining the party by a GOP contractor with a trail of fraud
complaints stretching across the country.

Voters contacted by The Times said they were tricked into switching
parties while signing what they believed were petitions for tougher
penalties against child molesters. Some said they were told that they
had to become Republicans to sign the petition, contrary to California
initiative law. Others had no idea their registration was being
changed.
It is a bait-and-switch scheme familiar to election experts. The firm
hired by the California Republican Party -- a small company called
Young Political Majors, or YPM, which operates in several states --
has been accused of using the tactic across the country.

Election officials and lawmakers have launched investigations into the
activities of YPM workers in Florida and Massachusetts. In Arizona,
the firm was recently a defendant in a civil rights lawsuit.
Prosecutors in Los Angeles and Ventura counties say they are
investigating complaints about the company.


The firm, which a Republican Party spokesman said is paid $7 to $12
for each registration it secures, has denied any wrongdoing and says
it has never been charged with a crime.

The 70,000 voters YPM has registered for the Republican Party this
year will help combat the public perception that it is struggling amid
Democratic gains nationally, give a boost to fundraising efforts and
bolster member support for party leaders, political strategists from
both parties say.

Those who were formerly Democrats may stop receiving phone calls and
literature from that party, perhaps affecting its get-out-the-vote
efforts. They also will be given only a Republican ballot in the next
primary election if they do not switch their registration back before
then.

Some also report having their registration status changed to absentee
without their permission; if they show up at the polls without a
ballot they may be unable to vote.

The Times randomly interviewed 46 of the hundreds of voters whose
election records show they were recently re-registered as Republicans
by YPM, and 37 of them -- more than 80% -- said that they were misled
into making the change or that it was done without their knowledge.

Lydia Laws, a Palm Springs retiree, said she was angry to find
recently that her registration had been switched from Democrat to
Republican.

Laws said the YPM staffer who instructed her to identify herself on a
petition as a Republican assured her that it was a formality, and that
her registration would not be changed. Later, a card showed up in the
mail saying she had joined the GOP.

"I said, 'No, no, no. That's not right,' " Laws said.

It all sounds familiar to Beverly Hill, a Democrat and the former
election supervisor in Florida's Alachua County. About 200 voters --
mostly college students -- were unwittingly registered as Republicans
there in 2004 by YPM staffers using the same tactic, Hill said.

"It is just incredible that this can keep happening election after
election," she said.

YPM and Republican Party officials said they were surprised by the
complaints. The officials said the signature gatherers wear shirts
bearing the Republican symbol, an elephant -- a contention disputed by
some of the voters interviewed.

Every person registered signs an affidavit confirming they voluntarily
joined the GOP, party leaders said.

"It does the state party no good to register people in a party they
don't want to be in," said Hector Barajas, communications director for
the California Republican Party.

The document that voters thought was an initiative petition has no
legal implications at all. YPM founder Mark Jacoby said the petition
was clearly labeled as a "plebiscite," which does nothing more than
show public support.

He also said that plainclothes investigators for Secretary of State
Debra Bowen, a Democrat, have conducted multiple spot checks and told
his firm it is doing nothing improper.



Single Page | 1 | 2 | Next
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Re: McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard Claims

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

the guard was there also and as far we know he hasn't lied yet .
mccain on the other hand has lied over and over again .

On Oct 18, 11:28 am, frankg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Mike,
>
> I did read it. Perhaps it's you who did not. I know what those who
> were there have had to say, including Day, and nothing in the article
> changes it. Care to cite the passage from the article you feel I
> missed?
>
> As for positive postings; let's be honest... if McCain single handedly
> pulled 100 people from a burning building you would find fault. You
> are about as politically bias as one can get. You are certainly free
> to be whoever you want to be but I have some sagacious advice for you;
> neither party has all the right answers. Neither party is good or
> evil; they simply have two different philosophies about dealing with
> problems. What this country needs is compromise. It needs people who
> can assess situations for what they are and find solutions that will
> work, regardless of which party that solution may tend to represent.
> People such as yourself, who automatically reject anything not coming
> from 'your' party, are not helping.
>
> You always back up your position with facts?  Like the 'facts' you've
> presented in this stupid thread?  Like the facts you presented in your
> 'beginning of life' argument? Like the facts you presented in the
> countless 'accuse Palin of anything' threads you and PA wrote for
> almost two months? Mike, you're not fooling anyone.
>
> On Oct 18, 2:42 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > if you has bothered to read the article you would have seen it stated
> > what the people who supported McCain's claims had to say . as for my
> > posting anything positive about McCain or palin i have yet to see
> > anything positive that they have done ! and i always back up my
> > positions with facts .
>
> > On Oct 17, 4:34 pm, frankg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > Hollywood,
>
> > > I disagree. I have been both complimentary and critical of both
> > > candidates and their parties. I try to maintain an open mind, but if I
> > > have come to a conclusion I try to support that conclusion by
> > > explaining my rational as well as posting links to data, editorials,
> > > etc., that helped get me there. I am always willing to participate in
> > > meaningful debate (thoughtful, two-way exchange of ideas and
> > > reasoning) on the matter. I am a registered independent who happens to
> > > be a chronic fence sitter.
>
> > > Mike, on the other hand, is completely different. Mike has never
> > > posted anything positive about McCain, Palin or any Republican. He’s
> > > never posted anything negative about Obama, Biden or the Democrats.
> > > Mike will believe anything about McCain, Palin or Republicans as long
> > > as it’s negative. Conversely, he will argue to the death anything
> > > that’s negative about Obama, Biden or the Democrats. Therefore, Mike
> > > does tend to stick to Kamakazee’s definition of ‘divine lie’, i.e.,
> > > “If a lie is said, but ends up in an overall "good" then it really
> > > isn't a lie.”. I guess this idiotic lie about McCain in this thread
> > > that Mike has bought into must be a 'divine lie' cause it's anti-
> > > McCain (i.e. "good" in Mike's world) so it's not a lie.
>
> > > I can cite post after post from Mike where he promoted anti-McCain/
> > > Palin/Republican bull shit, even when everyone else knew it wasn’t so.
> > > The most recently example of this being this particular thread. This
> > > is simply how Mike operates - at least in this forum (I do not know
> > > him outside this forum). However, I challenge you to find just one
> > > post from me where I stated as fact anti-Obama or anti-McCain tripe
> > > without citing my sources and my reasoning for taking issue, or where
> > > I would refuse to debate my findings and instead just repeat the same
> > > shit and insult people.
>
> > > I do agree that no one here is clean, but some are way worse than
> > > others. I'll leave it at that.
>
> > > On Oct 17, 1:52 pm, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > frankg,
>
> > > > And you do exactly the same, no one is clean here.
>
> > > > On Oct 17, 12:46 pm, frankg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > Hollywood,
>
> > > > > Gi

Re: Palin Explains What Parts Of Country Not "Pro-America"

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

[ McCain is better equiped to deal with what's coming.// ]
rigsy that is just crazy mccain is the last thing America needs !

On Oct 18, 5:29 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Less impact upon the national fortune/future, I'll bet.// It's
> dangerous to have Congress and the Executive from the same party- it
> ruins the concept of checks and balances.//Obama will have a nightmare
> term if he wins. McCain is better equiped to deal with what's
> coming.//
>
> On Oct 18, 4:22 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > do you think Wasilla Alaska has ?
>
> > On Oct 18, 5:15 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > Do you think Washington, D.C. has been a good steward of America?
>
> > > On Oct 18, 3:02 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > Palin Explains What Parts Of Country Not 
> > > > "Pro-America"http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/17/palin-clarifies-what-part_n_...
> > > > The McCain campaign is seeking to clarify a remark reported from a
> > > > Sarah Palin fundraiser in North Carolina yesterday in which the Alaska
> > > > Governor declared that she loved to visit the "pro-America" areas of
> > > > the country -- implying, implicitly, that there were some parts of the
> > > > United States she viewed as not pro-America.
>
> > > > The reporter who broke the story, the Washington Post's Juliet
> > > > Eilperin, sends over the following, extended quote from a more
> > > > detailed version of the pool report.
>
> > > > "We believe that the best of America is not all in Washington, D.C. We
> > > > believe" -- here the audience interrupted Palin with applause and
> > > > cheers -- "We believe that the best of America is in these small towns
> > > > that we get to visit, and in these wonderful little pockets of what I
> > > > call the real America, being here with all of you hard working very
> > > > patriotic, um, very, um, pro-America areas of this great nation. This
> > > > is where we find the kindness and the goodness and the courage of
> > > > everyday Americans. Those who are running our factories and teaching
> > > > our kids and growing our food and are fighting our wars for us. Those
> > > > who are protecting us in uniform. Those who are protecting the virtues
> > > > of freedom."
> > > > Not sure how much this helps Palin out. Is the VP candidate saying
> > > > that small towns are more authentically American than, say, suburbia
> > > > or cities?
>
> > > > As Eilperin writes: "The upshot? Washington D.C. is neither 'real
>
> > > > America' or 'pro-America.' Other parts of the nation? It's unclear,
> > > > but if you live in a small town, you're probably patriotic from
> > > > Palin's point of view."- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
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Re: Palin Explains What Parts Of Country Not "Pro-America"

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

do you think Wasilla Alaska has ?

On Oct 18, 5:15 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Do you think Washington, D.C. has been a good steward of America?
>
> On Oct 18, 3:02 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Palin Explains What Parts Of Country Not 
> > "Pro-America"http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/17/palin-clarifies-what-part_n_...
> > The McCain campaign is seeking to clarify a remark reported from a
> > Sarah Palin fundraiser in North Carolina yesterday in which the Alaska
> > Governor declared that she loved to visit the "pro-America" areas of
> > the country -- implying, implicitly, that there were some parts of the
> > United States she viewed as not pro-America.
>
> > The reporter who broke the story, the Washington Post's Juliet
> > Eilperin, sends over the following, extended quote from a more
> > detailed version of the pool report.
>
> > "We believe that the best of America is not all in Washington, D.C. We
> > believe" -- here the audience interrupted Palin with applause and
> > cheers -- "We believe that the best of America is in these small towns
> > that we get to visit, and in these wonderful little pockets of what I
> > call the real America, being here with all of you hard working very
> > patriotic, um, very, um, pro-America areas of this great nation. This
> > is where we find the kindness and the goodness and the courage of
> > everyday Americans. Those who are running our factories and teaching
> > our kids and growing our food and are fighting our wars for us. Those
> > who are protecting us in uniform. Those who are protecting the virtues
> > of freedom."
> > Not sure how much this helps Palin out. Is the VP candidate saying
> > that small towns are more authentically American than, say, suburbia
> > or cities?
>
> > As Eilperin writes: "The upshot? Washington D.C. is neither 'real
>
> > America' or 'pro-America.' Other parts of the nation? It's unclear,
> > but if you live in a small town, you're probably patriotic from
> > Palin's point of view."- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
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Re: Republicans file new lawsuit against Brunner

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

the court will throw it out

On Oct 18, 5:12 am, Travis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Let's hope there is some sense on that court. I think instead of the party
> filing, an individual needs to be the filer.  re-file with the sup ct that
> way also.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Oct 18, 2008 at 3:49 AM, Cold Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >  * Republicans file new lawsuit against Brunner
> > Rebuffed at U.S. Supreme Court, they turn to Ohio's top court
>
> > Friday,  October 17, 2008 11:53 AM
> > Updated: Friday, October 17, 2008 06:05 PM
> >  By Mark Niquette <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > THE COLUMBUS DISPATCH
> >   Associated Press
> > People line up to go to the Lorain County Board of Elections during a voter
> > registration drive earlier this month.
>
> > Having lost before the U.S. Supreme Court in a lawsuit involving the
> > verification of new voter registrations, Republicans now are turning to the
> > Ohio Supreme Court.
>
> > David Myhal, a Republican from New Albany, filed a lawsuit this afternoon
> > asking the state's highest court to issue an order related to instances when
> > new voter information doesn't match records in state or federal databases.
>
> > Specifically, the lawsuit asks the Ohio Supreme Court to require Secretary
> > of State Jennifer Brunner to order county elections boards not to count any
> > absentee ballot from voters registered after Jan. 1 without first checking
> > the statewide voter registration database to ensure there is no mismatch.
>
> > If there is a mismatch, the boards would be required to determine whether
> > the person is an eligible voter.
>
> > "This action seeks this (Ohio Supreme Court's) urgent intervention to
> > remedy the secretary of state's steadfast refusal to fully implement the
> > Statewide Voter Registration Database (SWVRD) in a manner required by both
> > federal and state law -- in essence, to share 'mismatch' information
> > regarding a registrant's driver's license or Social Security information
> > with county boards of elections in a manner that gives those boards a
> > meaningful opportunity to investigate the mismatches," the lawsuit says.
>
> > The court ordered that arguments by both sides must be filed by next
> > Friday, only 10 days before the Nov. 4 election.
>
> > The U.S. Supreme Court ruled in favor of Brunner this morning, overturning
> > a lower-court order that she provide to county elections boards by today
> > details of discrepancies discovered with new voter registrations.
>
> > In a 9-0 ruling, the court did not decide whether Brunner was violating
> > federal law by not providing the information, as the Ohio Republican Party
> > contended in its lawsuit.
>
> > Rather, the court said it was unlikely that as a private entity, the GOP
> > had the legal authority to sue Brunner on the issue or that the lower court
> > had the power to issue its order in this case.
>
> > Justice John Paul Stevens initially reviewed the case but referred the
> > matter for the entire court to decide.
>
> > The ruling had at least temporarily settled a dispute that had worked its
> > way through the lower federal courts in recent days, with district and
> > appellate judges taking different sides on the issue.
>
> > Brunner, a first-term Democrat, has argued that Republicans were trying to
> > force her to create a list of voters who could be forced to cast a
> > provisional ballot, which is held for 10 days to determine eligibility and
> > that she said is "subject to partisan wrangling and legal fights."
>
> > "Now that the nation's highest court has ruled in favor of Ohio voters, I
> > encourage everyone to support the bipartisan system of elections
> > administration in our state," Brunner said. "I ask all involved to stop the
> > legal maneuvers that unnecessarily shake public confidence."
>
> > But the Ohio GOP called on Brunner to provide clear instructions to
> > election administrators on how to handle questionable voter registration
> > forms and accused her of "actively working to conceal fraudulent activity in
> > this election."
>
> > "This decision was made on a technicality, not on the merits of the case,"
> > state Republican Chairman Robert T. Bennett said. "The justices did not
> > disagree with our argument that Jennifer Brunner has failed to comply with
> > federal election law. They merely said we don't have a right to bring a
> > private challenge against her under this particular provision."
>
> > The dispute involves what should be done when personal information from
> > newly registered voters doesn't match state motor vehicle and federal Social
> > Security records after an automatic computer check is done.
>
> > The Republican Party had sued Brunner on grounds she allegedly was
> > violating the federal Help America Vote Act by not giving counties the
> > results of mismatches as a way to correct registration errors and weed out
> > any fraud.
>
> > When Ohioans register to vote, they must provide their names, addresses,
>

Re: Republicans file new lawsuit against Brunner

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

Justices Rule Against Ohio G.O.P. in Voting Case
 http://www.truthout.org/101708R
Washington - The Supreme Court on Friday overturned a lower court's
order requiring state officials in Ohio to supply information that
would have made it easier to challenge prospective voters. The
decision was a setback for Ohio Republicans, who had sued to force
the
Ohio secretary of state, a Democrat, to provide information about
database mismatches to county officials.


On Oct 18, 4:49 am, Cold Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Republicans file new lawsuit against Brunner
> Rebuffed at U.S. Supreme Court, they turn to Ohio's top court
>
> Friday,  October 17, 2008 11:53 AM
> Updated: Friday, October 17, 2008 06:05 PM
> By Mark Niquette
>
> THE COLUMBUS DISPATCH
>
> Associated Press
> People line up to go to the Lorain County Board of Elections during a voter 
> registration drive earlier this month.
> Having lost before the U.S. Supreme Court in a lawsuit involving the 
> verification of new voter registrations, Republicans now are turning to the 
> Ohio Supreme Court.
>
> David Myhal, a Republican from New Albany, filed a lawsuit this afternoon 
> asking the state's highest court to issue an order related to instances when 
> new voter information doesn't match records in state or federal databases.
>
> Specifically, the lawsuit asks the Ohio Supreme Court to require Secretary of 
> State Jennifer Brunner to order county elections boards not to count any 
> absentee ballot from voters registered after Jan. 1 without first checking 
> the statewide voter registration database to ensure there is no mismatch.
>
> If there is a mismatch, the boards would be required to determine whether the 
> person is an eligible voter.
>
> "This action seeks this (Ohio Supreme Court's) urgent intervention to remedy 
> the secretary of state's steadfast refusal to fully implement the Statewide 
> Voter Registration Database (SWVRD) in a manner required by both federal and 
> state law -- in essence, to share 'mismatch' information regarding a 
> registrant's driver's license or Social Security information with county 
> boards of elections in a manner that gives those boards a meaningful 
> opportunity to investigate the mismatches," the lawsuit says.
>
> The court ordered that arguments by both sides must be filed by next Friday, 
> only 10 days before the Nov. 4 election.
>
> The U.S. Supreme Court ruled in favor of Brunner this morning, overturning a 
> lower-court order that she provide to county elections boards by today 
> details of discrepancies discovered with new voter registrations.
>
> In a 9-0 ruling, the court did not decide whether Brunner was violating 
> federal law by not providing the information, as the Ohio Republican Party 
> contended in its lawsuit.
>
> Rather, the court said it was unlikely that as a private entity, the GOP had 
> the legal authority to sue Brunner on the issue or that the lower court had 
> the power to issue its order in this case.
>
> Justice John Paul Stevens initially reviewed the case but referred the matter 
> for the entire court to decide.
>
> The ruling had at least temporarily settled a dispute that had worked its way 
> through the lower federal courts in recent days, with district and appellate 
> judges taking different sides on the issue.
>
> Brunner, a first-term Democrat, has argued that Republicans were trying to 
> force her to create a list of voters who could be forced to cast a 
> provisional ballot, which is held for 10 days to determine eligibility and 
> that she said is "subject to partisan wrangling and legal fights."
>
> "Now that the nation's highest court has ruled in favor of Ohio voters, I 
> encourage everyone to support the bipartisan system of elections 
> administration in our state," Brunner said. "I ask all involved to stop the 
> legal maneuvers that unnecessarily shake public confidence."
>
> But the Ohio GOP called on Brunner to provide clear instructions to election 
> administrators on how to handle questionable voter registration forms and 
> accused her of "actively working to conceal fraudulent activity in this 
> election."
>
> "This decision was made on a technicality, not on the merits of the case," 
> state Republican Chairman Robert T. Bennett said. "The justices did not 
> disagree with our argument that Jennifer Brunner has failed to comply with 
> federal election law. They merely said we don't have a right to bring a 
> private challenge against her under this particular provision."
>
> The dispute involves what should be done when personal information from newly 
> registered voters doesn't match state motor vehicle and federal Social 
> Security records after an automatic computer check is done.
>
> The Republican Party had sued Brunner on grounds she allegedly was violating 
> the federal Help America Vote Act by not giving counties the results of 
> mismatches as a way to correct registration errors and weed out any fraud.
>
> When Ohioa

Palin Explains What Parts Of Country Not "Pro-America"

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

Palin Explains What Parts Of Country Not "Pro-America"
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/17/palin-clarifies-what-part_n_135641.html
The McCain campaign is seeking to clarify a remark reported from a
Sarah Palin fundraiser in North Carolina yesterday in which the Alaska
Governor declared that she loved to visit the "pro-America" areas of
the country -- implying, implicitly, that there were some parts of the
United States she viewed as not pro-America.

The reporter who broke the story, the Washington Post's Juliet
Eilperin, sends over the following, extended quote from a more
detailed version of the pool report.

"We believe that the best of America is not all in Washington, D.C. We
believe" -- here the audience interrupted Palin with applause and
cheers -- "We believe that the best of America is in these small towns
that we get to visit, and in these wonderful little pockets of what I
call the real America, being here with all of you hard working very
patriotic, um, very, um, pro-America areas of this great nation. This
is where we find the kindness and the goodness and the courage of
everyday Americans. Those who are running our factories and teaching
our kids and growing our food and are fighting our wars for us. Those
who are protecting us in uniform. Those who are protecting the virtues
of freedom."
Not sure how much this helps Palin out. Is the VP candidate saying
that small towns are more authentically American than, say, suburbia
or cities?

As Eilperin writes: "The upshot? Washington D.C. is neither 'real
America' or 'pro-America.' Other parts of the nation? It's unclear,
but if you live in a small town, you're probably patriotic from
Palin's point of view."

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* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
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Justices Rule Against Ohio G.O.P. in Voting Case

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

Justices Rule Against Ohio G.O.P. in Voting Case
 http://www.truthout.org/101708R
Washington - The Supreme Court on Friday overturned a lower court's
order requiring state officials in Ohio to supply information that
would have made it easier to challenge prospective voters. The
decision was a setback for Ohio Republicans, who had sued to force the
Ohio secretary of state, a Democrat, to provide information about
database mismatches to county officials.

The decision has the potential to affect as many as 200,000 of the
660,000 new voters who have been registered in Ohio since Jan. 1,
according Social Security Administration and state election
officials.

The Supreme Court, in a brief, unsigned decision, said lower
federal courts in Ohio should not have ordered the secretary of state,
Jennifer Brunner, to turn over the information. The court acted just
before a deadline requiring Ms. Brunner to act set by a federal judge
in Columbus.

A 2002 federal law, the Help America Vote Act, or HAVA, requires
states to check voter registration applications against government
databases like those for driver's license records. Names that do not
match are flagged. Ohio Republicans sought to require Ms. Brunner to
provide information about mismatches to local officials.

Those officials could use information to require voters to cast
provisional ballots rather than regular ones. They could also allow
partisan poll workers to challenge people on the lists. Given
Democratic success in registering new voters this year, those actions
would probably affect that party's supporters disproportionately.

The court said it expressed "no opinion on the question whether
HAVA is being properly implemented." But it said that Congress
probably had not intended to allow private litigants like political
parties to sue to enforce the part of the law concerning databases.

Ms. Brunner welcomed Friday's ruling from the Supreme Court.

"Our nation's highest court has protected the voting rights of all
Ohioans, allowing our bipartisan elections officials to continue
preparing for a successful November election," Ms. Brunner said. "We
filed this appeal to protect all Ohio voters from illegal challenges
and barriers that unfairly silence the votes of some to the advantage
of others."

Edward B. Foley, a law professor at Ohio State, said the Supreme
Court's action in letting state authorities handle matters in the face
of a late challenge was consistent with a general premise of election
law. "Federal court intervention is a last resort, even if it's not at
the last minute," Professor Foley said.

A federal judge in Columbus ordered Ms. Brunner to supply the
information on Oct. 9, and the United States Court of Appeals for the
Sixth Circuit, in Cincinnati, affirmed that decision on Tuesday by a
vote of 10-to-6.

The majority decision in the Sixth Circuit acknowledged that the
question about whether private parties may sue under the 2002 law was
a close one. But Judge Jeffrey S. Sutton said that question could be
deferred, as what the Republican party sought was just information.

No one argues, Judge Sutton wrote, "that a mismatch necessarily
requires a voter to be removed from the rolls." A mismatch may merely
prompt further investigation, he said, one that may be satisfied with
an explanation as simple as a recent address change.

Voting experts and state election officials added that many voters
were likely to be flagged erroneously because the databases used to
check voter registrations were prone to errors. Most non-matches are
the result of typographical errors by government officials, computer
errors, use of nicknames or middle initials, not voter ineligibility,
they said.

In one audit of match failures in 2004 by New York City election
officials, more than 80 percent of the failures were found to have
resulted from errors by government officials; most of the remaining
failures were because of immaterial discrepancies between the two
records.

Ms. Brunner had also argued that requiring so many voters to cast
provisional ballots would raise tensions at the polls and worsen lines
and confusion on Election Day in a year when she is expecting
unprecedented turnout.

The state Republican Party rejected those arguments.

"Secretary Brunner has fought every effort to validate hundreds of
thousands of questionable registrations," said Ohio Republican Party
Chairman Robert Bennett. "As far as I'm concerned, Secretary Brunner
is actively working to conceal fraudulent activity in this election."

The Ohio Republican Party had said it wanted the list so that
local election officials could clear up any discrepancies before
Election Day and in cases where that was not possible, those voters
should vote using a provision ballot. Provisional ballots in Ohio are
held for 10 days before being counted while workers check eligibility,
and they are often subject to partisan wrangling and le

Re: A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteria

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

ACORN is non partisan action group who work in the community's
registering voters as well as other things such as fighting to remove
crack houses from neighborhoods  .

On Oct 18, 2:53 am, "\"Lone Wolf\"" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> You conveniently forget that the US attorneys
> scandal that led to the resignation of Attorney General Alberto
> Gonzales arose from a Republican attempt to suppress the vote. A
> number of the attorneys were sacked because they did not comply with
> Republican pressure to expedite the prosecution of voter fraud cases,
> so that they would take place before the 2006 elections. For example,
> the US Department of Justice has found that US Attorney David
> Iglesias
> was dismissed for failing to investigate a local ACORN chapter in New
> Mexico.
>
> More craven than the Republican attacks on ACORN has been the
> cowardly
> response of Barack Obama and the Democratic Party. In response to
> McCain’s attack on ACORN, Obama disowned any relationship to the
> organization, which has worked feverishly on his behalf for months.
> Moments earlier he had disowned Bill Ayers, the former radical
> routinely condemned by Republicans as a terrorist. Shortly afterward
> he listed  those he considers his
> true  associates. These include the world’s richest man, Warren
> Buffett, and former Federal Reserve
> Board head Paul Volcker, whose high interest
> rate “shock therapy” in 1979 was responsible for devastating many of
> the communities where ACORN now seeks to register impoverished
> voters.
>
> On Oct 15, 8:03 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > It isn't about just the potential fraudulent Votes being cast, it is
> > also about Polling Data and the ability of the Election people to do
> > their Jobs...
>
> > Although it is no surprise that Idiots, like little Liar mikey, would
> > try to dismiss this FRAUD because it is his Party that is attempting
> > to pull it off, and failing miserably.
>
> > On Oct 15, 1:53 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteriahttp://www.truthout.org/101408VA
> > > New voter location cards are being sent to over half of the voters in
> > > Kalamazoo, Michigan, notifying them of a change in their poll or
> > > precinct location. (Photo: Jill McLane Baker / Kalamazoo Gazette)
> > >     It's worth taking a moment to step back from the slew of charges
> > > leveled over the last week at ACORN, the community-organizing group
> > > that Republicans and the McCain campaign have been trying to turn into
> > > a bogeyman for fears about vote fraud (and, of course, tie to Barack
> > > Obama).
>
> > >     The GOP has accused ACORN of submitting fraudulent voter
> > > registration forms numbering in the hundreds or thousands, in
> > > battleground states including Ohio, Indiana, Nevada, and Missouri.
>
> > >     But the most important point that's getting lost in the Fox-
> > > generated hysteria is that, according to voting experts, even when
> > > fraudulent voter registration forms are submitted, they virtually
> > > never lead to fraudulent votes being cast. Richard Hasen, a law
> > > professor at Loyola and an authority on voting law, wrote in a 2007 op-
> > > ed published last year in the Dallas Morning News and noted recently
> > > by TPM, that "the idea of massive polling-place fraud (through the use
> > > of inflated voter rolls) is inherently incredible," because of the
> > > sheer logistical challenges it would require to carry out on a large
> > > scale.
>
> > >     In many states, ACORN is required by law to turn in all the forms
> > > it collects, though the law differs from state to law, according to
> > > experts.
>
> > >     ACORN has consistently said that it flags suspicious forms for
> > > election officials. Indeed, in Nevada where last week an ACORN office
> > > was raided in an investigation headed by the Secretary of State, ACORN
> > > was already cooperating with authorities.
>
> > >     According to a statement from the group which has not been
> > > disputed by state officials, in July, ACORN set up a meeting with
> > > county elections officials and the Secretary of State's office to urge
> > > them to take action on information ACORN had provided. Since then,
> > > "ACORN has provided officials with copies and - in some cases - second
> > > copies of many of the personnel records and the 'pro

Re: Obama Hints at Communist Presidency

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

the GOP was in control of both the house and the senate it was their
bill not Clinton's . but hey nice try anyway !

On Oct 17, 12:43 pm, Kamakazee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Partially right, but dig back deeper circa 96-97 when Clinton (through
> expanding the Community Reinvestment
> Act) blackmailed banks and lending institutions into making loans to
> people that should have never
> allowed to borrow money.
>
> It's a simple, but cruel, fact that some people are not responsible
> enough to own a home.
>
> They just aren't.
>
> On Oct 16, 3:05 am, "\"Lone Wolf\"" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Wrong I'm afraid Gaar. The total non-regulation of risk exposure was
> > the product of the Bush administration and in particular Henry
> > Paulson, the very same corporate swindler who is now giving billions
> > to his buddies for screwing over hard working US workers. This fiasco
> > is the sole result of Conservative government and business greed,
> > corruption and malfeasance. The filthy underbelly of US politics.
>
> > In 2004, at the request of the major Wall Street investment houses,
> > including Goldman Sachs, then headed by Henry Paulson, the U.S.
> > Securities and Exchange Commission agreed unanimously to release the
> > major investment houses from the net capital rule, the requirement
> > that their brokerages hold reserve capital that limited their
> > leverage
> > and risk exposure. The complaint that was put forth by the investment
> > banks was of increasingly onerous regulatory requirements -- in this
> > case, not U.S. regulator oversight, but European Union regulation of
> > the foreign operations of US investment groups. In the immediate
> > lead-
> > up to the decision, EU regulators also acceded to US pressure, and
> > agreed not to scrutinize foreign firms' reserve holdings if the SEC
> > agreed to do so instead. The 1999 Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act, however,
> > put
> > the parent holding company of each of the big American brokerages
> > beyond SEC oversight. In order for the agreement to go ahead, the
> > investment banks lobbied for a decision that would allow "voluntary"
> > inspection of their parent and subsidiary holdings by the SEC.
>
> > During this repeal of the net capital rule, SEC Chairman William H.
> > Donaldson agreed to the establishment of a risk management office
> > that
> > would monitor signs of future problems. This office was eventually
> > dismantled by Chairman Christopher Cox, after discussions with
> > Paulson. According to the New York Times, "While other financial
> > regulatory agencies criticized a blueprint by Mr. Paulson, the [new]
> > Treasury secretary, that proposed to reduce their stature — and that
> > of the S.E.C. — Mr. Cox did not challenge the plan, leaving it to
> > three former Democratic and Republican commission chairmen to
> > complain
> > that the blueprint would neuter the agency."[11]
>
> > In late September 2008, Chairman Cox and the other Commissioners
> > agreed to end the 2004 program of voluntary regulation.
>
> > On Oct 16, 12:18 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > Yes holly, it is an attempt to help the Lending Institutions that were
> > > screwed by the Loony Liberal "Regulations" which made them give Loans
> > > to unqualified buyers, so that they can continue to do the daily
> > > Business of this Nation, despite these Loans going bad in droves...
>
> > > On Oct 15, 5:58 pm, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > Travis,
>
> > > > What do you think the $700 billion plus bail-out was if not a re-
> > > > distribution a wealth?
>
> > > > On Oct 15, 5:01 pm, Travis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > From: Travis
> > > > > Subject: Obama Hints at Communist Presidency
> > > > > Date: Wednesday, October 15, 2008
>
> > > > > New Media Alliance - Sher Zieve - Obama Hints at Communist Presidency
> > > > > 
>
> > > > >http://thenma.org/blogs/index.php/zieve/2008/10/14/obama_hints_at_com...
>
> > > > >  --
> > > > >  *Oct 14 '08
> > > > > Obama Hints at Communist Presidency
> > > > > *
>
> > > > > In 1848, the founder of Communism—Karl Marx—wrote in his infamous 
> > > > > Manifest
> > > > > of the Communist Party about the "crying inequalities in the 
> > > > > distribution of
> > > > > wealth." Then, in 1867, in what has been referred to as his 
> > > > > masterpiece, the
> > > > > first volume of Das Kapital was published. In this anti-capitalism 
> > > > > work,
> > > > > Marx continues his extolling of Communism and advises that wealth 
> > > > > must be
> > > > > redistributed from the 'rich-and-evil wealthy' to the
> > > > > 'poor-and-downtrodden'.
>
> > > > > In 1875, Marx continued with his theme with his treatise Critique of 
> > > > > the
> > > > > Gotha Program, in which he expounds upon and summarizes the 
> > > > > principles of

Re: McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard Claims

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

i have to disagree with you about mccain being a war criminal . i have
read reports that when he crashed his last plane he was in an area
that he wasn't supposed to be in . but that would make him stupid not
a war criminal !

On Oct 18, 2:48 am, "\"Lone Wolf\"" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> While the post proves nothing conclusive, I fail too see the
> significance it has with running the affairs of the nation, which are
> far more important.
>
> Secondly, McCain is a war criminal, not a war hero. He was not a
> conscript, but a volunteer who had no qualms bombing and killing
> innocent civilians.
>
> Apart from his war crimes, he is an absolute intellectual philistine,
> he is no more than an sadistic meglomaniac, which of course is a
> prerequisite to be the President.
>
> On Oct 17, 10:26 pm, NavyBrat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > An interview with the chief prison guard of the North Vietnamese jail
> > in which McCain was held claims, "We never tortured
> > McCain."
> > ***
>
> > I didn't have to read one sentence further. That you would believe
> > what a former enemy says rather than our own fellow american
> > hero...well that tells me all I need or want to  know about you. Nuff
> > said.
>
> > On Oct 17, 4:44 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard 
> > > Claimshttp://www.alternet.org/election08/103233/
> > > An interview with the chief prison guard of the North Vietnamese jail
> > > in which McCain was held claims, "We never tortured
> > > McCain."
> > > The Republican US presidential candidate John McCain was not tortured
> > > during his captivity in North Vietnam, the chief prison guard of the
> > > jail in which he was held has claimed.
>
> > > In an interview with the Italian daily Corriere della Sera, Nguyen
> > > Tien Tran acknowledged that conditions in the prison were "tough,
> > > though not inhuman". But, he added: "We never tortured McCain. On the
> > > contrary, we saved his life, curing him with extremely valuable
> > > medicines that at times were not available to our own wounded."
>
> > > McCain, who fell into enemy hands after his plane was shot down in
> > > 1967, has frequently referred to being tortured and has cited his
> > > experiences as a reason for vigorously opposing the endorsement by the
> > > Bush administration of the use of techniques such as "water-boarding"
> > > on terrorist suspects.
>
> > > Shortly after his release in 1973 McCain told US News & World Report
> > > that his prison guards had beaten him "from pillar to post". After
> > > being worked over at intervals for four days, he said, he had become
> > > suicidal and agreed to sign a "confession" admitting to war crimes.
>
> > > In his 1999 autobiography, Faith of My Fathers, he described how after
> > > his capture he was subjected to inhuman treatment in an effort to
> > > force him to disclose his ship's name, squadron number and the target
> > > of his final mission. He was threatened with the withdrawal of medical
> > > assistance and, while still suffering from his crash injuries, his
> > > guards "knocked me around a little".
>
> > > For his service in Vietnam and his actions as a POW, McCain was
> > > awarded the Silver Star, the Legion of Merit, the Bronze Star, the
> > > Navy Commendation Medal and the Purple Heart.
>
> > > Tran, now 75, said McCain reached Hanoi with the worst injuries he had
> > > seen in a downed pilot. But he denied torturing him, saying it was his
> > > mission to ensure that McCain survived. As the son of the US naval
> > > commander in Vietnam, he offered a potential valuable propaganda
> > > weapon.
>
> > > However, recommending McCain for a medal after the war, his former
> > > cellmate, the much-decorated Colonel George Day, said the admiral's
> > > son had forced his interrogators to "drug him and torture him to get
> > > any cooperation", according to a letter in the US National Archives
> > > cited earlier this year by the Washington Post. Day said McCain
> > > suffered "torturous abuse".
>
> > > Tran told Corriere that McCain was sent to hospital the day after he
> > > was brought to Hanoi and stayed there for a month. "I never los

Re: A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteria

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

acorn is not a part of or an agent of the DNC . and to date they have
not been convicted of voter fraud in fact very few people have ever
been convicted of that crime because it is almost non existent except
in the fevered imagination of the GOP who want to block poor people
and blacks from voting !

On Oct 17, 3:39 pm, jgg1000a <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Acorn for one.  Under investigation in about 1/3 of all the states for
> voter fraud..
>
> On Oct 17, 3:39 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > post even one link to an " agent " of the DNC being convicted of voter
> > fraud !
>
> > On Oct 16, 2:48 pm, jgg1000a <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > Agents the DNC and Obama regularly use have...
>
> > > On Oct 16, 3:41 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > are you claiming the DNC or the Obama campaign has committed voter
> > > > fraud ?
>
> > > > On Oct 15, 12:21 pm, jgg1000a <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > ACORN HAS committed voter fraud...  That is the point you miss...
> > > > > There are numberous convictions in the past...   1/3 of the states are
> > > > > investigating ACORN for fraud now...   Why, if Obama is concerned
> > > > > about fair elections, is Obama ignoring fraud done by his side in this
> > > > > election???
>
> > > > > On Oct 15, 4:53 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > A Dose of Reality on the ACORN 
> > > > > > Hysteriahttp://www.truthout.org/101408VA
> > > > > > New voter location cards are being sent to over half of the voters 
> > > > > > in
> > > > > > Kalamazoo, Michigan, notifying them of a change in their poll or
> > > > > > precinct location. (Photo: Jill McLane Baker / Kalamazoo Gazette)
> > > > > >     It's worth taking a moment to step back from the slew of charges
> > > > > > leveled over the last week at ACORN, the community-organizing group
> > > > > > that Republicans and the McCain campaign have been trying to turn 
> > > > > > into
> > > > > > a bogeyman for fears about vote fraud (and, of course, tie to Barack
> > > > > > Obama).
>
> > > > > >     The GOP has accused ACORN of submitting fraudulent voter
> > > > > > registration forms numbering in the hundreds or thousands, in
> > > > > > battleground states including Ohio, Indiana, Nevada, and Missouri.
>
> > > > > >     But the most important point that's getting lost in the Fox-
> > > > > > generated hysteria is that, according to voting experts, even when
> > > > > > fraudulent voter registration forms are submitted, they virtually
> > > > > > never lead to fraudulent votes being cast. Richard Hasen, a law
> > > > > > professor at Loyola and an authority on voting law, wrote in a 2007 
> > > > > > op-
> > > > > > ed published last year in the Dallas Morning News and noted recently
> > > > > > by TPM, that "the idea of massive polling-place fraud (through the 
> > > > > > use
> > > > > > of inflated voter rolls) is inherently incredible," because of the
> > > > > > sheer logistical challenges it would require to carry out on a large
> > > > > > scale.
>
> > > > > >     In many states, ACORN is required by law to turn in all the 
> > > > > > forms
> > > > > > it collects, though the law differs from state to law, according to
> > > > > > experts.
>
> > > > > >     ACORN has consistently said that it flags suspicious forms for
> > > > > > election officials. Indeed, in Nevada where last week an ACORN 
> > > > > > office
> > > > > > was raided in an investigation headed by the Secretary of State, 
> > > > > > ACORN
> > > > > > was already cooperating with authorities.
>
> > > > > >     According to a statement from the group which has not been
> > > > > > disputed by state officials, in July, ACORN set up a meeting with
> > > > > > county elections officials and the Secretary of State's office to 
> > > 

Re: McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard Claims

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

read the article !

On Oct 18, 2:42 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Because he wants Obama to become President?
>
> Can you dispute anything McCain's cell mate attested to or give a
> reason why he would lie about it?
>
> On Oct 17, 11:37 pm, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > can you dispute anything this guard has said or give a  reason why he
> > would lie about it ?
>
> > On Oct 17, 2:34 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > So now little Liar mikey and his Loony Liberal cohorts have taken to
> > > smearing an American Hero in an effort to get their Marxist Leader
> > > Elected.
>
> > > No surprise there.
>
> > > On Oct 17, 3:44 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard 
> > > > Claimshttp://www.alternet.org/election08/103233/
> > > > An interview with the chief prison guard of the North Vietnamese jail
> > > > in which McCain was held claims, "We never tortured
> > > > McCain."
> > > > The Republican US presidential candidate John McCain was not tortured
> > > > during his captivity in North Vietnam, the chief prison guard of the
> > > > jail in which he was held has claimed.
>
> > > > In an interview with the Italian daily Corriere della Sera, Nguyen
> > > > Tien Tran acknowledged that conditions in the prison were "tough,
> > > > though not inhuman". But, he added: "We never tortured McCain. On the
> > > > contrary, we saved his life, curing him with extremely valuable
> > > > medicines that at times were not available to our own wounded."
>
> > > > McCain, who fell into enemy hands after his plane was shot down in
> > > > 1967, has frequently referred to being tortured and has cited his
> > > > experiences as a reason for vigorously opposing the endorsement by the
> > > > Bush administration of the use of techniques such as "water-boarding"
> > > > on terrorist suspects.
>
> > > > Shortly after his release in 1973 McCain told US News & World Report
> > > > that his prison guards had beaten him "from pillar to post". After
> > > > being worked over at intervals for four days, he said, he had become
> > > > suicidal and agreed to sign a "confession" admitting to war crimes.
>
> > > > In his 1999 autobiography, Faith of My Fathers, he described how after
> > > > his capture he was subjected to inhuman treatment in an effort to
> > > > force him to disclose his ship's name, squadron number and the target
> > > > of his final mission. He was threatened with the withdrawal of medical
> > > > assistance and, while still suffering from his crash injuries, his
> > > > guards "knocked me around a little".
>
> > > > For his service in Vietnam and his actions as a POW, McCain was
> > > > awarded the Silver Star, the Legion of Merit, the Bronze Star, the
> > > > Navy Commendation Medal and the Purple Heart.
>
> > > > Tran, now 75, said McCain reached Hanoi with the worst injuries he had
> > > > seen in a downed pilot. But he denied torturing him, saying it was his
> > > > mission to ensure that McCain survived. As the son of the US naval
> > > > commander in Vietnam, he offered a potential valuable propaganda
> > > > weapon.
>
> > > > However, recommending McCain for a medal after the war, his former
> > > > cellmate, the much-decorated Colonel George Day, said the admiral's
> > > > son had forced his interrogators to "drug him and torture him to get
> > > > any cooperation", according to a letter in the US National Archives
> > > > cited earlier this year by the Washington Post. Day said McCain
> > > > suffered "torturous abuse".
>
> > > > Tran told Corriere that McCain was sent to hospital the day after he
> > > > was brought to Hanoi and stayed there for a month. "I never lost him
> > > > from sight. I was frightened a doctor or nurse might do him harm."
>
> > > > Tran dismissed as "absolutely impossible" perhaps the most famous
> > > > story from McCain's autobiography: that one Christmas, a guard traced
> > > > a cross in the mud in front of him. "My men were all communists and
> > > > atheists," he said.
>
> > > > As to why McCain, then 36, left North Vietnam with prematurely grey
> > > > hair, Tran denied it was because of mistreatment. "It's that in prison
> > > > you think too much."
>
> > > > AlterNet is a nonprofit organization and does not make political
> > > > endorsements. The opinions expressed by its writers are their own.- 
> > > > Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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* It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. 
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Re: McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard Claims

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

; > > > points.
> > > > > > > Damn surprising, especially that it's pretty much a home game for 
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > Cowboys.
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 17, 10:57 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > Ramakazee,
>
> > > > > > > > Oh fucking please, you boys don't EVEN have the moral high 
> > > > > > > > ground
> > > > > > > > here.
> > > > > > > > Give me a break, I just finished my breakfast.
>
> > > > > > > > On Oct 17, 10:42 am, Kamakazee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > Mike apparently subscribes to the "divine lie" logic of the 
> > > > > > > > > moonies.
> > > > > > > > > If a lie is said, but ends up in an overall "good" then it 
> > > > > > > > > really
> > > > > > > > > isn't a lie.
>
> > > > > > > > > Maybe not a "lie" so much as just pure bullshit.
>
> > > > > > > > > On Oct 17, 10:21 am, frankg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > Mike,
>
> > > > > > > > > > You're not only calling McCain a liar, you're calling 
> > > > > > > > > > Colonel George
> > > > > > > > > > Day a liar as well. Details of McCain’s torture were well 
> > > > > > > > > > known right
> > > > > > > > > > from day one, before he became a Senator, way before he 
> > > > > > > > > > became a
> > > > > > > > > > presidential nominee.
>
> > > > > > > > > > You'd rather take the word of a NVA guard than you would 
> > > > > > > > > > two American
> > > > > > > > > > war heroes just so you can make a pitiful, desperate 
> > > > > > > > > > attempt to smear
> > > > > > > > > > McCain. This truly is a new low, even for you.
>
> > > > > > > > > > I'm curious; since you feel you can't trust anything McCain 
> > > > > > > > > > says
> > > > > > > > > > because he lies, then how can you trust Obama, who also 
> > > > > > > > > > lies?
>
> > > > > > > > > > On Oct 17, 10:46 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > i don't know anything about tran or what his motives 
> > > > > > > > > > > could be for
> > > > > > > > > > > lying if any . but i do know McCain lies which brings up 
> > > > > > > > > > > the point of
> > > > > > > > > > > what is he telling the truth about and what is he lying 
> > > > > > > > > > > about .
>
> > > > > > > > > > > On Oct 17, 10:43 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > > > mike,
>
> > > > > > > > > > > > I usually agree with you but I think there is little 
> > > > > > > > > > > > doubt that Mccain
> > > > > > > > > > > > and many other prisoners of ours were tortured by the 
> > > > > > > > > > > > NVA.  I oppose,
> > > > > > > > > > > > and will continue to oppose Mccain politically. But I 
> > > > > > > > > > > > see no reason to
> > > > > > > > > > > > believe Tran's statement.
>
> > > > > > > > > > > > On Oct 17, 5:44 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  
> > > > > > > > > > > > ]"
>
> > > > > > > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard 
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Claimshttp://www.alternet.org/election08/103233

Re: McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard Claims

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

can you dispute anything this guard has said or give a  reason why he
would lie about it ?

On Oct 17, 2:34 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> So now little Liar mikey and his Loony Liberal cohorts have taken to
> smearing an American Hero in an effort to get their Marxist Leader
> Elected.
>
> No surprise there.
>
> On Oct 17, 3:44 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard 
> > Claimshttp://www.alternet.org/election08/103233/
> > An interview with the chief prison guard of the North Vietnamese jail
> > in which McCain was held claims, "We never tortured
> > McCain."
> > The Republican US presidential candidate John McCain was not tortured
> > during his captivity in North Vietnam, the chief prison guard of the
> > jail in which he was held has claimed.
>
> > In an interview with the Italian daily Corriere della Sera, Nguyen
> > Tien Tran acknowledged that conditions in the prison were "tough,
> > though not inhuman". But, he added: "We never tortured McCain. On the
> > contrary, we saved his life, curing him with extremely valuable
> > medicines that at times were not available to our own wounded."
>
> > McCain, who fell into enemy hands after his plane was shot down in
> > 1967, has frequently referred to being tortured and has cited his
> > experiences as a reason for vigorously opposing the endorsement by the
> > Bush administration of the use of techniques such as "water-boarding"
> > on terrorist suspects.
>
> > Shortly after his release in 1973 McCain told US News & World Report
> > that his prison guards had beaten him "from pillar to post". After
> > being worked over at intervals for four days, he said, he had become
> > suicidal and agreed to sign a "confession" admitting to war crimes.
>
> > In his 1999 autobiography, Faith of My Fathers, he described how after
> > his capture he was subjected to inhuman treatment in an effort to
> > force him to disclose his ship's name, squadron number and the target
> > of his final mission. He was threatened with the withdrawal of medical
> > assistance and, while still suffering from his crash injuries, his
> > guards "knocked me around a little".
>
> > For his service in Vietnam and his actions as a POW, McCain was
> > awarded the Silver Star, the Legion of Merit, the Bronze Star, the
> > Navy Commendation Medal and the Purple Heart.
>
> > Tran, now 75, said McCain reached Hanoi with the worst injuries he had
> > seen in a downed pilot. But he denied torturing him, saying it was his
> > mission to ensure that McCain survived. As the son of the US naval
> > commander in Vietnam, he offered a potential valuable propaganda
> > weapon.
>
> > However, recommending McCain for a medal after the war, his former
> > cellmate, the much-decorated Colonel George Day, said the admiral's
> > son had forced his interrogators to "drug him and torture him to get
> > any cooperation", according to a letter in the US National Archives
> > cited earlier this year by the Washington Post. Day said McCain
> > suffered "torturous abuse".
>
> > Tran told Corriere that McCain was sent to hospital the day after he
> > was brought to Hanoi and stayed there for a month. "I never lost him
> > from sight. I was frightened a doctor or nurse might do him harm."
>
> > Tran dismissed as "absolutely impossible" perhaps the most famous
> > story from McCain's autobiography: that one Christmas, a guard traced
> > a cross in the mud in front of him. "My men were all communists and
> > atheists," he said.
>
> > As to why McCain, then 36, left North Vietnam with prematurely grey
> > hair, Tran denied it was because of mistreatment. "It's that in prison
> > you think too much."
>
> > AlterNet is a nonprofit organization and does not make political
> > endorsements. The opinions expressed by its writers are their own.- Hide 
> > quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups.
For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum

* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
* It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. 
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Re: McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard Claims

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

i don't know anything about tran or what his motives could be for
lying if any . but i do know McCain lies which brings up the point of
what is he telling the truth about and what is he lying about .

On Oct 17, 10:43 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> mike,
>
> I usually agree with you but I think there is little doubt that Mccain
> and many other prisoners of ours were tortured by the NVA.  I oppose,
> and will continue to oppose Mccain politically. But I see no reason to
> believe Tran's statement.
>
> On Oct 17, 5:44 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard 
> > Claimshttp://www.alternet.org/election08/103233/
> > An interview with the chief prison guard of the North Vietnamese jail
> > in which McCain was held claims, "We never tortured
> > McCain."
> > The Republican US presidential candidate John McCain was not tortured
> > during his captivity in North Vietnam, the chief prison guard of the
> > jail in which he was held has claimed.
>
> > In an interview with the Italian daily Corriere della Sera, Nguyen
> > Tien Tran acknowledged that conditions in the prison were "tough,
> > though not inhuman". But, he added: "We never tortured McCain. On the
> > contrary, we saved his life, curing him with extremely valuable
> > medicines that at times were not available to our own wounded."
>
> > McCain, who fell into enemy hands after his plane was shot down in
> > 1967, has frequently referred to being tortured and has cited his
> > experiences as a reason for vigorously opposing the endorsement by the
> > Bush administration of the use of techniques such as "water-boarding"
> > on terrorist suspects.
>
> > Shortly after his release in 1973 McCain told US News & World Report
> > that his prison guards had beaten him "from pillar to post". After
> > being worked over at intervals for four days, he said, he had become
> > suicidal and agreed to sign a "confession" admitting to war crimes.
>
> > In his 1999 autobiography, Faith of My Fathers, he described how after
> > his capture he was subjected to inhuman treatment in an effort to
> > force him to disclose his ship's name, squadron number and the target
> > of his final mission. He was threatened with the withdrawal of medical
> > assistance and, while still suffering from his crash injuries, his
> > guards "knocked me around a little".
>
> > For his service in Vietnam and his actions as a POW, McCain was
> > awarded the Silver Star, the Legion of Merit, the Bronze Star, the
> > Navy Commendation Medal and the Purple Heart.
>
> > Tran, now 75, said McCain reached Hanoi with the worst injuries he had
> > seen in a downed pilot. But he denied torturing him, saying it was his
> > mission to ensure that McCain survived. As the son of the US naval
> > commander in Vietnam, he offered a potential valuable propaganda
> > weapon.
>
> > However, recommending McCain for a medal after the war, his former
> > cellmate, the much-decorated Colonel George Day, said the admiral's
> > son had forced his interrogators to "drug him and torture him to get
> > any cooperation", according to a letter in the US National Archives
> > cited earlier this year by the Washington Post. Day said McCain
> > suffered "torturous abuse".
>
> > Tran told Corriere that McCain was sent to hospital the day after he
> > was brought to Hanoi and stayed there for a month. "I never lost him
> > from sight. I was frightened a doctor or nurse might do him harm."
>
> > Tran dismissed as "absolutely impossible" perhaps the most famous
> > story from McCain's autobiography: that one Christmas, a guard traced
> > a cross in the mud in front of him. "My men were all communists and
> > atheists," he said.
>
> > As to why McCain, then 36, left North Vietnam with prematurely grey
> > hair, Tran denied it was because of mistreatment. "It's that in prison
> > you think too much."
>
> > AlterNet is a nonprofit organization and does not make political
> > endorsements. The opinions expressed by its writers are their own.- Hide 
> > quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups.
For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum

* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
* It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. 
* Read the latest breaking news, and more.
-~--~~~~--~~--~--~---

Re: McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard Claims

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

of course not the holocaust has been proven to have happened

On Oct 17, 10:16 am, Kamakazee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Sweet Lord, quit burning my time.
>
> I guess you also need proof of the holocaust?
>
> I don't think anyone other than you has ever doubted what happened to
> McCain in Vietnam.  Even the limpnuts across the hall at the other
> site haven't suggested otherwise.
>
> On Oct 17, 7:52 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > don't talk about it do it ! post your proof that this guard is
> > lying .
>
> > On Oct 17, 8:39 am, Kamakazee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > All I can do is stack up all the books, articles, documentaries, press
> > > releases and videos articulating that McCain basically got the shit
> > > beat out of him everyday, the whole while refusing to leave until
> > > those who were captured before him left.
>
> > > And then hit you over the head with a shovel.
>
> > > Does that help?
>
> > > On Oct 17, 7:33 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > so if you can dispute any thing in this article please do this !
>
> > > > On Oct 17, 8:30 am, Kamakazee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > Good Lord, you're off the stupidity charts.
>
> > > > > Congrats, take the afternoon off, you must be worn out.
>
> > > > > On Oct 17, 5:44 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard 
> > > > > > Claimshttp://www.alternet.org/election08/103233/
> > > > > > An interview with the chief prison guard of the North Vietnamese 
> > > > > > jail
> > > > > > in which McCain was held claims, "We never tortured
> > > > > > McCain."
> > > > > > The Republican US presidential candidate John McCain was not 
> > > > > > tortured
> > > > > > during his captivity in North Vietnam, the chief prison guard of the
> > > > > > jail in which he was held has claimed.
>
> > > > > > In an interview with the Italian daily Corriere della Sera, Nguyen
> > > > > > Tien Tran acknowledged that conditions in the prison were "tough,
> > > > > > though not inhuman". But, he added: "We never tortured McCain. On 
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > contrary, we saved his life, curing him with extremely valuable
> > > > > > medicines that at times were not available to our own wounded."
>
> > > > > > McCain, who fell into enemy hands after his plane was shot down in
> > > > > > 1967, has frequently referred to being tortured and has cited his
> > > > > > experiences as a reason for vigorously opposing the endorsement by 
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > Bush administration of the use of techniques such as 
> > > > > > "water-boarding"
> > > > > > on terrorist suspects.
>
> > > > > > Shortly after his release in 1973 McCain told US News & World Report
> > > > > > that his prison guards had beaten him "from pillar to post". After
> > > > > > being worked over at intervals for four days, he said, he had become
> > > > > > suicidal and agreed to sign a "confession" admitting to war crimes.
>
> > > > > > In his 1999 autobiography, Faith of My Fathers, he described how 
> > > > > > after
> > > > > > his capture he was subjected to inhuman treatment in an effort to
> > > > > > force him to disclose his ship's name, squadron number and the 
> > > > > > target
> > > > > > of his final mission. He was threatened with the withdrawal of 
> > > > > > medical
> > > > > > assistance and, while still suffering from his crash injuries, his
> > > > > > guards "knocked me around a little".
>
> > > > > > For his service in Vietnam and his actions as a POW, McCain was
> > > > > > awarded the Silver Star, the Legion of Merit, the Bronze Star, the
> > > > > > Navy Commendation Medal and the Purple Heart.
>
> > > > > > Tran, now 75, said McCain reached Hanoi wi

Re: McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard Claims

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

McCain has been shown to be a liar time and time again during the
campaign . so until someone can show this guard to be lying i will
consider him to be telling the truth .

On Oct 17, 9:10 am, NavyBrat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Post your proof he's not!
>
> On Oct 17, 6:52 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > don't talk about it do it ! post your proof that this guard is
> > lying .
>
> > On Oct 17, 8:39 am, Kamakazee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > All I can do is stack up all the books, articles, documentaries, press
> > > releases and videos articulating that McCain basically got the shit
> > > beat out of him everyday, the whole while refusing to leave until
> > > those who were captured before him left.
>
> > > And then hit you over the head with a shovel.
>
> > > Does that help?
>
> > > On Oct 17, 7:33 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > so if you can dispute any thing in this article please do this !
>
> > > > On Oct 17, 8:30 am, Kamakazee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > Good Lord, you're off the stupidity charts.
>
> > > > > Congrats, take the afternoon off, you must be worn out.
>
> > > > > On Oct 17, 5:44 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard 
> > > > > > Claimshttp://www.alternet.org/election08/103233/
> > > > > > An interview with the chief prison guard of the North Vietnamese 
> > > > > > jail
> > > > > > in which McCain was held claims, "We never tortured
> > > > > > McCain."
> > > > > > The Republican US presidential candidate John McCain was not 
> > > > > > tortured
> > > > > > during his captivity in North Vietnam, the chief prison guard of the
> > > > > > jail in which he was held has claimed.
>
> > > > > > In an interview with the Italian daily Corriere della Sera, Nguyen
> > > > > > Tien Tran acknowledged that conditions in the prison were "tough,
> > > > > > though not inhuman". But, he added: "We never tortured McCain. On 
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > contrary, we saved his life, curing him with extremely valuable
> > > > > > medicines that at times were not available to our own wounded."
>
> > > > > > McCain, who fell into enemy hands after his plane was shot down in
> > > > > > 1967, has frequently referred to being tortured and has cited his
> > > > > > experiences as a reason for vigorously opposing the endorsement by 
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > Bush administration of the use of techniques such as 
> > > > > > "water-boarding"
> > > > > > on terrorist suspects.
>
> > > > > > Shortly after his release in 1973 McCain told US News & World Report
> > > > > > that his prison guards had beaten him "from pillar to post". After
> > > > > > being worked over at intervals for four days, he said, he had become
> > > > > > suicidal and agreed to sign a "confession" admitting to war crimes.
>
> > > > > > In his 1999 autobiography, Faith of My Fathers, he described how 
> > > > > > after
> > > > > > his capture he was subjected to inhuman treatment in an effort to
> > > > > > force him to disclose his ship's name, squadron number and the 
> > > > > > target
> > > > > > of his final mission. He was threatened with the withdrawal of 
> > > > > > medical
> > > > > > assistance and, while still suffering from his crash injuries, his
> > > > > > guards "knocked me around a little".
>
> > > > > > For his service in Vietnam and his actions as a POW, McCain was
> > > > > > awarded the Silver Star, the Legion of Merit, the Bronze Star, the
> > > > > > Navy Commendation Medal and the Purple Heart.
>
> > > > > > Tran, now 75, said McCain reached Hanoi with the worst injuries he 
> > > > > > had
> > > > > > seen in a downed pilot. But he denied torturing him, saying it w

Re: McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard Claims

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

don't talk about it do it ! post your proof that this guard is
lying .

On Oct 17, 8:39 am, Kamakazee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> All I can do is stack up all the books, articles, documentaries, press
> releases and videos articulating that McCain basically got the shit
> beat out of him everyday, the whole while refusing to leave until
> those who were captured before him left.
>
> And then hit you over the head with a shovel.
>
> Does that help?
>
> On Oct 17, 7:33 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > so if you can dispute any thing in this article please do this !
>
> > On Oct 17, 8:30 am, Kamakazee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > Good Lord, you're off the stupidity charts.
>
> > > Congrats, take the afternoon off, you must be worn out.
>
> > > On Oct 17, 5:44 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard 
> > > > Claimshttp://www.alternet.org/election08/103233/
> > > > An interview with the chief prison guard of the North Vietnamese jail
> > > > in which McCain was held claims, "We never tortured
> > > > McCain."
> > > > The Republican US presidential candidate John McCain was not tortured
> > > > during his captivity in North Vietnam, the chief prison guard of the
> > > > jail in which he was held has claimed.
>
> > > > In an interview with the Italian daily Corriere della Sera, Nguyen
> > > > Tien Tran acknowledged that conditions in the prison were "tough,
> > > > though not inhuman". But, he added: "We never tortured McCain. On the
> > > > contrary, we saved his life, curing him with extremely valuable
> > > > medicines that at times were not available to our own wounded."
>
> > > > McCain, who fell into enemy hands after his plane was shot down in
> > > > 1967, has frequently referred to being tortured and has cited his
> > > > experiences as a reason for vigorously opposing the endorsement by the
> > > > Bush administration of the use of techniques such as "water-boarding"
> > > > on terrorist suspects.
>
> > > > Shortly after his release in 1973 McCain told US News & World Report
> > > > that his prison guards had beaten him "from pillar to post". After
> > > > being worked over at intervals for four days, he said, he had become
> > > > suicidal and agreed to sign a "confession" admitting to war crimes.
>
> > > > In his 1999 autobiography, Faith of My Fathers, he described how after
> > > > his capture he was subjected to inhuman treatment in an effort to
> > > > force him to disclose his ship's name, squadron number and the target
> > > > of his final mission. He was threatened with the withdrawal of medical
> > > > assistance and, while still suffering from his crash injuries, his
> > > > guards "knocked me around a little".
>
> > > > For his service in Vietnam and his actions as a POW, McCain was
> > > > awarded the Silver Star, the Legion of Merit, the Bronze Star, the
> > > > Navy Commendation Medal and the Purple Heart.
>
> > > > Tran, now 75, said McCain reached Hanoi with the worst injuries he had
> > > > seen in a downed pilot. But he denied torturing him, saying it was his
> > > > mission to ensure that McCain survived. As the son of the US naval
> > > > commander in Vietnam, he offered a potential valuable propaganda
> > > > weapon.
>
> > > > However, recommending McCain for a medal after the war, his former
> > > > cellmate, the much-decorated Colonel George Day, said the admiral's
> > > > son had forced his interrogators to "drug him and torture him to get
> > > > any cooperation", according to a letter in the US National Archives
> > > > cited earlier this year by the Washington Post. Day said McCain
> > > > suffered "torturous abuse".
>
> > > > Tran told Corriere that McCain was sent to hospital the day after he
> > > > was brought to Hanoi and stayed there for a month. "I never lost him
> > > > from sight. I was frightened a doctor or nurse might do him harm."
>
> > > > Tran dismissed as "absolutely impossible" perhaps the most famous
> > > > story from McCain's autobiography: that one Ch

Re: McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard Claims

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

why would this guy lie about torturing mccain

On Oct 17, 7:26 am, NavyBrat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> An interview with the chief prison guard of the North Vietnamese jail
> in which McCain was held claims, "We never tortured
> McCain."
> ***
>
> I didn't have to read one sentence further. That you would believe
> what a former enemy says rather than our own fellow american
> hero...well that tells me all I need or want to  know about you. Nuff
> said.
>
> On Oct 17, 4:44 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard 
> > Claimshttp://www.alternet.org/election08/103233/
> > An interview with the chief prison guard of the North Vietnamese jail
> > in which McCain was held claims, "We never tortured
> > McCain."
> > The Republican US presidential candidate John McCain was not tortured
> > during his captivity in North Vietnam, the chief prison guard of the
> > jail in which he was held has claimed.
>
> > In an interview with the Italian daily Corriere della Sera, Nguyen
> > Tien Tran acknowledged that conditions in the prison were "tough,
> > though not inhuman". But, he added: "We never tortured McCain. On the
> > contrary, we saved his life, curing him with extremely valuable
> > medicines that at times were not available to our own wounded."
>
> > McCain, who fell into enemy hands after his plane was shot down in
> > 1967, has frequently referred to being tortured and has cited his
> > experiences as a reason for vigorously opposing the endorsement by the
> > Bush administration of the use of techniques such as "water-boarding"
> > on terrorist suspects.
>
> > Shortly after his release in 1973 McCain told US News & World Report
> > that his prison guards had beaten him "from pillar to post". After
> > being worked over at intervals for four days, he said, he had become
> > suicidal and agreed to sign a "confession" admitting to war crimes.
>
> > In his 1999 autobiography, Faith of My Fathers, he described how after
> > his capture he was subjected to inhuman treatment in an effort to
> > force him to disclose his ship's name, squadron number and the target
> > of his final mission. He was threatened with the withdrawal of medical
> > assistance and, while still suffering from his crash injuries, his
> > guards "knocked me around a little".
>
> > For his service in Vietnam and his actions as a POW, McCain was
> > awarded the Silver Star, the Legion of Merit, the Bronze Star, the
> > Navy Commendation Medal and the Purple Heart.
>
> > Tran, now 75, said McCain reached Hanoi with the worst injuries he had
> > seen in a downed pilot. But he denied torturing him, saying it was his
> > mission to ensure that McCain survived. As the son of the US naval
> > commander in Vietnam, he offered a potential valuable propaganda
> > weapon.
>
> > However, recommending McCain for a medal after the war, his former
> > cellmate, the much-decorated Colonel George Day, said the admiral's
> > son had forced his interrogators to "drug him and torture him to get
> > any cooperation", according to a letter in the US National Archives
> > cited earlier this year by the Washington Post. Day said McCain
> > suffered "torturous abuse".
>
> > Tran told Corriere that McCain was sent to hospital the day after he
> > was brought to Hanoi and stayed there for a month. "I never lost him
> > from sight. I was frightened a doctor or nurse might do him harm."
>
> > Tran dismissed as "absolutely impossible" perhaps the most famous
> > story from McCain's autobiography: that one Christmas, a guard traced
> > a cross in the mud in front of him. "My men were all communists and
> > atheists," he said.
>
> > As to why McCain, then 36, left North Vietnam with prematurely grey
> > hair, Tran denied it was because of mistreatment. "It's that in prison
> > you think too much."
>
> > AlterNet is a nonprofit organization and does not make political
> > endorsements. The opinions expressed by its writers are their own.- Hide 
> > quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum

* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
* It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. 
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Re: McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard Claims

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

so if you can dispute any thing in this article please do this !

On Oct 17, 8:30 am, Kamakazee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Good Lord, you're off the stupidity charts.
>
> Congrats, take the afternoon off, you must be worn out.
>
> On Oct 17, 5:44 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard 
> > Claimshttp://www.alternet.org/election08/103233/
> > An interview with the chief prison guard of the North Vietnamese jail
> > in which McCain was held claims, "We never tortured
> > McCain."
> > The Republican US presidential candidate John McCain was not tortured
> > during his captivity in North Vietnam, the chief prison guard of the
> > jail in which he was held has claimed.
>
> > In an interview with the Italian daily Corriere della Sera, Nguyen
> > Tien Tran acknowledged that conditions in the prison were "tough,
> > though not inhuman". But, he added: "We never tortured McCain. On the
> > contrary, we saved his life, curing him with extremely valuable
> > medicines that at times were not available to our own wounded."
>
> > McCain, who fell into enemy hands after his plane was shot down in
> > 1967, has frequently referred to being tortured and has cited his
> > experiences as a reason for vigorously opposing the endorsement by the
> > Bush administration of the use of techniques such as "water-boarding"
> > on terrorist suspects.
>
> > Shortly after his release in 1973 McCain told US News & World Report
> > that his prison guards had beaten him "from pillar to post". After
> > being worked over at intervals for four days, he said, he had become
> > suicidal and agreed to sign a "confession" admitting to war crimes.
>
> > In his 1999 autobiography, Faith of My Fathers, he described how after
> > his capture he was subjected to inhuman treatment in an effort to
> > force him to disclose his ship's name, squadron number and the target
> > of his final mission. He was threatened with the withdrawal of medical
> > assistance and, while still suffering from his crash injuries, his
> > guards "knocked me around a little".
>
> > For his service in Vietnam and his actions as a POW, McCain was
> > awarded the Silver Star, the Legion of Merit, the Bronze Star, the
> > Navy Commendation Medal and the Purple Heart.
>
> > Tran, now 75, said McCain reached Hanoi with the worst injuries he had
> > seen in a downed pilot. But he denied torturing him, saying it was his
> > mission to ensure that McCain survived. As the son of the US naval
> > commander in Vietnam, he offered a potential valuable propaganda
> > weapon.
>
> > However, recommending McCain for a medal after the war, his former
> > cellmate, the much-decorated Colonel George Day, said the admiral's
> > son had forced his interrogators to "drug him and torture him to get
> > any cooperation", according to a letter in the US National Archives
> > cited earlier this year by the Washington Post. Day said McCain
> > suffered "torturous abuse".
>
> > Tran told Corriere that McCain was sent to hospital the day after he
> > was brought to Hanoi and stayed there for a month. "I never lost him
> > from sight. I was frightened a doctor or nurse might do him harm."
>
> > Tran dismissed as "absolutely impossible" perhaps the most famous
> > story from McCain's autobiography: that one Christmas, a guard traced
> > a cross in the mud in front of him. "My men were all communists and
> > atheists," he said.
>
> > As to why McCain, then 36, left North Vietnam with prematurely grey
> > hair, Tran denied it was because of mistreatment. "It's that in prison
> > you think too much."
>
> > AlterNet is a nonprofit organization and does not make political
> > endorsements. The opinions expressed by its writers are their own.- Hide 
> > quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups.
For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum

* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
* It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. 
* Read the latest breaking news, and more.
-~--~~~~--~~--~--~---

Re: McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard Claims

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

navy we already know mccain lies

On Oct 17, 7:28 am, NavyBrat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Mike? Thats you? I'm so disappointed I can't even tell you.
>
> On Oct 17, 5:26 am, NavyBrat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > An interview with the chief prison guard of the North Vietnamese jail
> > in which McCain was held claims, "We never tortured
> > McCain."
> > ***
>
> > I didn't have to read one sentence further. That you would believe
> > what a former enemy says rather than our own fellow american
> > hero...well that tells me all I need or want to  know about you. Nuff
> > said.
>
> > On Oct 17, 4:44 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard 
> > > Claimshttp://www.alternet.org/election08/103233/
> > > An interview with the chief prison guard of the North Vietnamese jail
> > > in which McCain was held claims, "We never tortured
> > > McCain."
> > > The Republican US presidential candidate John McCain was not tortured
> > > during his captivity in North Vietnam, the chief prison guard of the
> > > jail in which he was held has claimed.
>
> > > In an interview with the Italian daily Corriere della Sera, Nguyen
> > > Tien Tran acknowledged that conditions in the prison were "tough,
> > > though not inhuman". But, he added: "We never tortured McCain. On the
> > > contrary, we saved his life, curing him with extremely valuable
> > > medicines that at times were not available to our own wounded."
>
> > > McCain, who fell into enemy hands after his plane was shot down in
> > > 1967, has frequently referred to being tortured and has cited his
> > > experiences as a reason for vigorously opposing the endorsement by the
> > > Bush administration of the use of techniques such as "water-boarding"
> > > on terrorist suspects.
>
> > > Shortly after his release in 1973 McCain told US News & World Report
> > > that his prison guards had beaten him "from pillar to post". After
> > > being worked over at intervals for four days, he said, he had become
> > > suicidal and agreed to sign a "confession" admitting to war crimes.
>
> > > In his 1999 autobiography, Faith of My Fathers, he described how after
> > > his capture he was subjected to inhuman treatment in an effort to
> > > force him to disclose his ship's name, squadron number and the target
> > > of his final mission. He was threatened with the withdrawal of medical
> > > assistance and, while still suffering from his crash injuries, his
> > > guards "knocked me around a little".
>
> > > For his service in Vietnam and his actions as a POW, McCain was
> > > awarded the Silver Star, the Legion of Merit, the Bronze Star, the
> > > Navy Commendation Medal and the Purple Heart.
>
> > > Tran, now 75, said McCain reached Hanoi with the worst injuries he had
> > > seen in a downed pilot. But he denied torturing him, saying it was his
> > > mission to ensure that McCain survived. As the son of the US naval
> > > commander in Vietnam, he offered a potential valuable propaganda
> > > weapon.
>
> > > However, recommending McCain for a medal after the war, his former
> > > cellmate, the much-decorated Colonel George Day, said the admiral's
> > > son had forced his interrogators to "drug him and torture him to get
> > > any cooperation", according to a letter in the US National Archives
> > > cited earlier this year by the Washington Post. Day said McCain
> > > suffered "torturous abuse".
>
> > > Tran told Corriere that McCain was sent to hospital the day after he
> > > was brought to Hanoi and stayed there for a month. "I never lost him
> > > from sight. I was frightened a doctor or nurse might do him harm."
>
> > > Tran dismissed as "absolutely impossible" perhaps the most famous
> > > story from McCain's autobiography: that one Christmas, a guard traced
> > > a cross in the mud in front of him. "My men were all communists and
> > > atheists," he said.
>
> > > As to why McCain, then 36, left North Vietnam with prematurely grey
> > > hair, Tran denied it was because of mistreatment. "It's that in prison
> > > you think too much."
>
> > > AlterNet is a nonprofit organization and does not make political
> > > endorsements. The opinions expressed by its writers are their own.- Hide 
> > > quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups.
For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum

* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
* It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. 
* Read the latest breaking news, and more.
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Re: Keating Son-in-Law to Serve Prison Term

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

nice try at rewriting history

On Oct 17, 6:47 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> except that the real keating associates were all dems murky, all
> dems.
>
> On Oct 17, 6:39 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > it is another republican ascosiate of McCain on his way to prison .
>
> > On Oct 17, 6:22 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > and this matters because?
>
> > > On Oct 17, 5:20 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > Keating Son-in-Law to Serve Prison 
> > > > Termhttp://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9F0CE7DE123CF930A25751...
> > > > A son-in-law of the former head of Lincoln Savings, Charles H. Keating
> > > > Jr., must surrender next year to begin a 40-month prison sentence.
>
> > > > United States District Judge Mariana R. Pfaelzer imposed the sentence
> > > > last week on the son-in-law, Robert M. Wurzelbacher Jr., who had
> > > > pleaded guilty to three counts of misapplying $14 million from
> > > > Lincoln, an Irvine, Calif., savings association.
>
> > > > Mr. Wurzelbacher, 39, was an executive with Lincoln's parent, the
> > > > American Continental Corporation, which Mr. Keating controlled.
>
> > > > Prosecutors asked for a six-year sentence, saying Mr. Wurzelbacher had
> > > > volunteered little of use to them after making a plea bargain.
>
> > > > Mr. Wurzelbacher's lawyer, Mark Beck, had asked for probation and
> > > > community service. He said Mr. Wurzelbacher was likely to serve 26
> > > > months before parole.
>
> > > > On Tuesday, Judge Pfaelzer ordered Mr. Wurzelbacher to begin his
> > > > sentence on Feb. 4. She said she would recommend that he be sent to
> > > > prison camp at Nellis Air Force Base in Nevada.
>
> > > > Mr. Wurzelbacher did not plead guilty to the indictment charging him
> > > > and others, including Mr. Keating and Mr. Keating's son, with looting
> > > > Lincoln and swindling investors who lost money buying risky bonds.
> > > > Instead, he admitted that he helped Lincoln extend loans to a hotel
> > > > partnership in which he, Mr. Keating and other insiders had interests.
> > > > He said he knew the loans were unlikely to be repaid.
>
> > > > Lincoln's failure in April 1989 cost taxpayers $3.4 billion, a
> > > > record.
>
> > > > Ads by Google- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
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Re: A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteria

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

i am your worst nightmare sparky i am a patriotic republican who votes
for America first and political party last !

On Oct 17, 6:51 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> you are as much a republican as your boy barry is murky.  both extreme
> leftwing liberal retards.
>
> On Oct 17, 4:31 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > i vote early although i am not to worried about being blocked from
> > voting because i am registered as a republican .
>
> > On Oct 17, 4:01 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > I am voting by mail-in ballot. So are many others. Why cause a
> > > riot? :-)
>
> > > On Oct 17, 2:39 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > post even one link to an " agent " of the DNC being convicted of voter
> > > > fraud !
>
> > > > On Oct 16, 2:48 pm, jgg1000a <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > Agents the DNC and Obama regularly use have...
>
> > > > > On Oct 16, 3:41 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > are you claiming the DNC or the Obama campaign has committed voter
> > > > > > fraud ?
>
> > > > > > On Oct 15, 12:21 pm, jgg1000a <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > ACORN HAS committed voter fraud... That is the point you miss...
> > > > > > > There are numberous convictions in the past... 1/3 of the states 
> > > > > > > are
> > > > > > > investigating ACORN for fraud now... Why, if Obama is concerned
> > > > > > > about fair elections, is Obama ignoring fraud done by his side in 
> > > > > > > this
> > > > > > > election???
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 15, 4:53 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > A Dose of Reality on the ACORN 
> > > > > > > > Hysteriahttp://www.truthout.org/101408VA
> > > > > > > > New voter location cards are being sent to over half of the 
> > > > > > > > voters in
> > > > > > > > Kalamazoo, Michigan, notifying them of a change in their poll or
> > > > > > > > precinct location. (Photo: Jill McLane Baker / Kalamazoo 
> > > > > > > > Gazette)
> > > > > > > > It's worth taking a moment to step back from the slew of charges
> > > > > > > > leveled over the last week at ACORN, the community-organizing 
> > > > > > > > group
> > > > > > > > that Republicans and the McCain campaign have been trying to 
> > > > > > > > turn into
> > > > > > > > a bogeyman for fears about vote fraud (and, of course, tie to 
> > > > > > > > Barack
> > > > > > > > Obama).
>
> > > > > > > > The GOP has accused ACORN of submitting fraudulent voter
> > > > > > > > registration forms numbering in the hundreds or thousands, in
> > > > > > > > battleground states including Ohio, Indiana, Nevada, and 
> > > > > > > > Missouri.
>
> > > > > > > > But the most important point that's getting lost in the Fox-
> > > > > > > > generated hysteria is that, according to voting experts, even 
> > > > > > > > when
> > > > > > > > fraudulent voter registration forms are submitted, they 
> > > > > > > > virtually
> > > > > > > > never lead to fraudulent votes being cast. Richard Hasen, a law
> > > > > > > > professor at Loyola and an authority on voting law, wrote in a 
> > > > > > > > 2007 op-
> > > > > > > > ed published last year in the Dallas Morning News and noted 
> > > > > > > > recently
> > > > > > > > by TPM, that "the idea of massive polling-place fraud (through 
> > > > > > > > the use
> > > > > > > > of inflated voter rolls) is inherently incredible," because of 
> > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > sheer logistical challenges it would requir

McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard Claims

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

McCain Was Not Tortured, POW Guard Claims
http://www.alternet.org/election08/103233/
An interview with the chief prison guard of the North Vietnamese jail
in which McCain was held claims, "We never tortured
McCain."
The Republican US presidential candidate John McCain was not tortured
during his captivity in North Vietnam, the chief prison guard of the
jail in which he was held has claimed.

In an interview with the Italian daily Corriere della Sera, Nguyen
Tien Tran acknowledged that conditions in the prison were "tough,
though not inhuman". But, he added: "We never tortured McCain. On the
contrary, we saved his life, curing him with extremely valuable
medicines that at times were not available to our own wounded."

McCain, who fell into enemy hands after his plane was shot down in
1967, has frequently referred to being tortured and has cited his
experiences as a reason for vigorously opposing the endorsement by the
Bush administration of the use of techniques such as "water-boarding"
on terrorist suspects.

Shortly after his release in 1973 McCain told US News & World Report
that his prison guards had beaten him "from pillar to post". After
being worked over at intervals for four days, he said, he had become
suicidal and agreed to sign a "confession" admitting to war crimes.

In his 1999 autobiography, Faith of My Fathers, he described how after
his capture he was subjected to inhuman treatment in an effort to
force him to disclose his ship's name, squadron number and the target
of his final mission. He was threatened with the withdrawal of medical
assistance and, while still suffering from his crash injuries, his
guards "knocked me around a little".

For his service in Vietnam and his actions as a POW, McCain was
awarded the Silver Star, the Legion of Merit, the Bronze Star, the
Navy Commendation Medal and the Purple Heart.

Tran, now 75, said McCain reached Hanoi with the worst injuries he had
seen in a downed pilot. But he denied torturing him, saying it was his
mission to ensure that McCain survived. As the son of the US naval
commander in Vietnam, he offered a potential valuable propaganda
weapon.

However, recommending McCain for a medal after the war, his former
cellmate, the much-decorated Colonel George Day, said the admiral's
son had forced his interrogators to "drug him and torture him to get
any cooperation", according to a letter in the US National Archives
cited earlier this year by the Washington Post. Day said McCain
suffered "torturous abuse".

Tran told Corriere that McCain was sent to hospital the day after he
was brought to Hanoi and stayed there for a month. "I never lost him
from sight. I was frightened a doctor or nurse might do him harm."

Tran dismissed as "absolutely impossible" perhaps the most famous
story from McCain's autobiography: that one Christmas, a guard traced
a cross in the mud in front of him. "My men were all communists and
atheists," he said.

As to why McCain, then 36, left North Vietnam with prematurely grey
hair, Tran denied it was because of mistreatment. "It's that in prison
you think too much."

AlterNet is a nonprofit organization and does not make political
endorsements. The opinions expressed by its writers are their own.




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Re: Keating Son-in-Law to Serve Prison Term

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

it is another republican ascosiate of McCain on his way to prison .

On Oct 17, 6:22 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> and this matters because?
>
> On Oct 17, 5:20 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Keating Son-in-Law to Serve Prison 
> > Termhttp://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9F0CE7DE123CF930A25751...
> > A son-in-law of the former head of Lincoln Savings, Charles H. Keating
> > Jr., must surrender next year to begin a 40-month prison sentence.
>
> > United States District Judge Mariana R. Pfaelzer imposed the sentence
> > last week on the son-in-law, Robert M. Wurzelbacher Jr., who had
> > pleaded guilty to three counts of misapplying $14 million from
> > Lincoln, an Irvine, Calif., savings association.
>
> > Mr. Wurzelbacher, 39, was an executive with Lincoln's parent, the
> > American Continental Corporation, which Mr. Keating controlled.
>
> > Prosecutors asked for a six-year sentence, saying Mr. Wurzelbacher had
> > volunteered little of use to them after making a plea bargain.
>
> > Mr. Wurzelbacher's lawyer, Mark Beck, had asked for probation and
> > community service. He said Mr. Wurzelbacher was likely to serve 26
> > months before parole.
>
> > On Tuesday, Judge Pfaelzer ordered Mr. Wurzelbacher to begin his
> > sentence on Feb. 4. She said she would recommend that he be sent to
> > prison camp at Nellis Air Force Base in Nevada.
>
> > Mr. Wurzelbacher did not plead guilty to the indictment charging him
> > and others, including Mr. Keating and Mr. Keating's son, with looting
> > Lincoln and swindling investors who lost money buying risky bonds.
> > Instead, he admitted that he helped Lincoln extend loans to a hotel
> > partnership in which he, Mr. Keating and other insiders had interests.
> > He said he knew the loans were unlikely to be repaid.
>
> > Lincoln's failure in April 1989 cost taxpayers $3.4 billion, a
> > record.
>
> > Ads by Google- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
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Republicans Abuse Prosecutorial Powers to Intimidate Voters

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

Republicans Abuse Prosecutorial Powers to Intimidate Voters
http://www.alternet.org/election08/103398/
>From the FBI to Ohio county prosecutors, GOP-connected lawmen are
seeking to scare new voters.   As the
presidential election comes to a close, the Republican Party -- and
its allies in law enforcement at the FBI and at county levels in Ohio
-- are announcing voting-related prosecutions that civil rights
advocates say are intended to intimidate voters, despite prosecutorial
rules that bar these disclosures before an election.

The foremost example was Thursday's leak to the media by top FBI
officials of a new investigation of ACORN, a low-income advocacy group
which registered 1.3 million new voters in swing states in 2008. The
Associated Press reported "senior officials" confirmed the FBI
investigation, saying they "spoke on condition of anonymity because
Justice Department regulations forbid discussing ongoing
investigations particularly so close to an election."

"The reports by unnamed sources within the FBI that they have begun an
investigation of ACORN is patently inconsistent with the DOJ
prosecution manual," said Gerry Hebert, a former Justice Department
Voting Section Chief who now runs the Campaign Legal Center in
Washington.

"Whether they are prosecuting or not, it is clearly intimidation,"
said Jeff Gamso, legal director of the American Civil Liberties Union
(ACLU) of Ohio. "That is what press reports do. You intimidate people
into not going to the polls and not voting."

The FBI leak has counterparts at the county level in Ohio, raising the
same voter intimidation concerns.

In Columbus, Franklin County Prosecuting Attorney Ron O'Brien, a
Republican, confirmed in numerous state media reports on Wednesday
that he was investigating a group called Vote From Home that
registered more than 11,000 new voters from inner-city neighborhoods.
A Franklin County Board of Elections spokesman said it learned about
the group from a college website and found some of its members had
registered and already voted in Ohio.

"The story indicated that these people were out of state Democratic
Party activists who moved into Columbus to work temporarily and they
listed this Columbus address as their residence to vote," said Ben
Piscitelli, the BOE spokesman. "Under state law, you have to be a
resident in the state 30 days prior to the election. The residence has
to be a place to which you plan to return."

Piscitelli said it did not appear the group's members, who include
students from the nation's top law schools, could meet the ongoing
residency requirement. "We referred this to the Franklin County
prosecutor to see what is illegal about this," he said. "As we
explained to local reporters, there is nothing inherently illegal
about having 13 people register at a single address."

"Vote From Home's great crime is they helped 11,000 people register to
vote and helped people get absentee ballots," said Robert Fitrakis, a
Columbus election lawyer. "All this was leaked to the press, to FOX
news, to TV-6, which is Sinclair Broadcasting, which is more
conservative than Fox News ... They are trying to put a chilling
effect on voting. They are trying to scare people into not voting by
using criminal prosecutions."

Franklin County Prosecuting Attorney Ron O'Brien did not return
requests to comment.

The FBI leak and Franklin County investigation are not the only
examples of publicized legal tactics in Ohio that civil rights lawyers
say are intended to scare new voters.

In recent weeks, the Ohio Republican Party and Democratic secretary of
State have been at odds in federal court over whether Social Security
and state motor vehicle records can be used to verify or reject more
than 200,000 voter registrations -- equal to a third of the state's
new voters in 2008. On Wednesday, the day the secretary of state
appealed a federal court ruling to the U.S. Supreme Court, an Ohio
Republican Party spokesman said the GOP did not intend to use these
database records to challenge voter registrations -- an assertion that
left some Democrats saying the Republicans had embarked on a "chaos"
campaign to confuse the public.



12Next page »

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Keating Son-in-Law to Serve Prison Term

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

Keating Son-in-Law to Serve Prison Term
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9F0CE7DE123CF930A25751C1A965958260
A son-in-law of the former head of Lincoln Savings, Charles H. Keating
Jr., must surrender next year to begin a 40-month prison sentence.

United States District Judge Mariana R. Pfaelzer imposed the sentence
last week on the son-in-law, Robert M. Wurzelbacher Jr., who had
pleaded guilty to three counts of misapplying $14 million from
Lincoln, an Irvine, Calif., savings association.

Mr. Wurzelbacher, 39, was an executive with Lincoln's parent, the
American Continental Corporation, which Mr. Keating controlled.

Prosecutors asked for a six-year sentence, saying Mr. Wurzelbacher had
volunteered little of use to them after making a plea bargain.

Mr. Wurzelbacher's lawyer, Mark Beck, had asked for probation and
community service. He said Mr. Wurzelbacher was likely to serve 26
months before parole.

On Tuesday, Judge Pfaelzer ordered Mr. Wurzelbacher to begin his
sentence on Feb. 4. She said she would recommend that he be sent to
prison camp at Nellis Air Force Base in Nevada.

Mr. Wurzelbacher did not plead guilty to the indictment charging him
and others, including Mr. Keating and Mr. Keating's son, with looting
Lincoln and swindling investors who lost money buying risky bonds.
Instead, he admitted that he helped Lincoln extend loans to a hotel
partnership in which he, Mr. Keating and other insiders had interests.
He said he knew the loans were unlikely to be repaid.

Lincoln's failure in April 1989 cost taxpayers $3.4 billion, a
record.

Ads by Google


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Re: A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteria

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

i vote early although i am not to worried about being blocked from
voting because i am registered as a republican .

On Oct 17, 4:01 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I am voting by mail-in ballot. So are many others. Why cause a
> riot? :-)
>
> On Oct 17, 2:39 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > post even one link to an " agent " of the DNC being convicted of voter
> > fraud !
>
> > On Oct 16, 2:48 pm, jgg1000a <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > Agents the DNC and Obama regularly use have...
>
> > > On Oct 16, 3:41 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > are you claiming the DNC or the Obama campaign has committed voter
> > > > fraud ?
>
> > > > On Oct 15, 12:21 pm, jgg1000a <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > ACORN HAS committed voter fraud... That is the point you miss...
> > > > > There are numberous convictions in the past... 1/3 of the states are
> > > > > investigating ACORN for fraud now... Why, if Obama is concerned
> > > > > about fair elections, is Obama ignoring fraud done by his side in this
> > > > > election???
>
> > > > > On Oct 15, 4:53 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > A Dose of Reality on the ACORN 
> > > > > > Hysteriahttp://www.truthout.org/101408VA
> > > > > > New voter location cards are being sent to over half of the voters 
> > > > > > in
> > > > > > Kalamazoo, Michigan, notifying them of a change in their poll or
> > > > > > precinct location. (Photo: Jill McLane Baker / Kalamazoo Gazette)
> > > > > > It's worth taking a moment to step back from the slew of charges
> > > > > > leveled over the last week at ACORN, the community-organizing group
> > > > > > that Republicans and the McCain campaign have been trying to turn 
> > > > > > into
> > > > > > a bogeyman for fears about vote fraud (and, of course, tie to Barack
> > > > > > Obama).
>
> > > > > > The GOP has accused ACORN of submitting fraudulent voter
> > > > > > registration forms numbering in the hundreds or thousands, in
> > > > > > battleground states including Ohio, Indiana, Nevada, and Missouri.
>
> > > > > > But the most important point that's getting lost in the Fox-
> > > > > > generated hysteria is that, according to voting experts, even when
> > > > > > fraudulent voter registration forms are submitted, they virtually
> > > > > > never lead to fraudulent votes being cast. Richard Hasen, a law
> > > > > > professor at Loyola and an authority on voting law, wrote in a 2007 
> > > > > > op-
> > > > > > ed published last year in the Dallas Morning News and noted recently
> > > > > > by TPM, that "the idea of massive polling-place fraud (through the 
> > > > > > use
> > > > > > of inflated voter rolls) is inherently incredible," because of the
> > > > > > sheer logistical challenges it would require to carry out on a large
> > > > > > scale.
>
> > > > > > In many states, ACORN is required by law to turn in all the forms
> > > > > > it collects, though the law differs from state to law, according to
> > > > > > experts.
>
> > > > > > ACORN has consistently said that it flags suspicious forms for
> > > > > > election officials. Indeed, in Nevada where last week an ACORN 
> > > > > > office
> > > > > > was raided in an investigation headed by the Secretary of State, 
> > > > > > ACORN
> > > > > > was already cooperating with authorities.
>
> > > > > > According to a statement from the group which has not been
> > > > > > disputed by state officials, in July, ACORN set up a meeting with
> > > > > > county elections officials and the Secretary of State's office to 
> > > > > > urge
> > > > > > them to take action on information ACORN had provided. Since then,
> > > > > > "ACORN has provided officials with copies and - in some cases - 
> > > > > > second
> >

Re: Obama Wins Final Debate by a Large Margin

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

i believe McCain is insane

On Oct 17, 3:52 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Drudge had McCain "winning" the debate but poll numbers are flying
> like leaves in the autumn winds. I am left with Obama's grin and
> chuckle when meeting with Putin and others. Someone should inform
> Obama- the antagonists already think America has become a joke.
>
> On Oct 17, 2:42 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > :o-]
>
> > On Oct 17, 3:40 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > Faux?
>
> > > On Oct 17, 2:37 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > fox ?
>
> > > > On Oct 16, 9:59 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > mark,
>
> > > > > Who would be "independent" enough for you lad?
>
> > > > > On Oct 16, 5:35 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > back to cbs again. do find a truly independent pollster murky.
>
> > > > > > On Oct 16, 5:04 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > Obama Wins Final Debate by a Large 
> > > > > > > Marginhttp://www.electoral-vote.com/
> > > > > > > John McCain had to give it everything he had last night and he 
> > > > > > > did,
> > > > > > > but it probably wasn't enough. He attacked Barack Obama on his
> > > > > > > character, on his relationship with William Ayers, on everything. 
> > > > > > > His
> > > > > > > best sound bite was: "Senator Obama. I am not President Bush. If 
> > > > > > > you
> > > > > > > wanted to run against President Bush, you should have run four 
> > > > > > > years
> > > > > > > ago." But Obama parried this by saying: "on the core economic 
> > > > > > > issues
> > > > > > > that matter to the American people--on tax policy, on energy 
> > > > > > > policy,
> > > > > > > and spending priorities--you have been a vigorous supporter of
> > > > > > > President Bush."
>
> > > > > > > The day before the debate, Obama practically dared McCain to 
> > > > > > > bring up
> > > > > > > the subject of William Ayers. McCain hesitated to do it, but 
> > > > > > > moderator
> > > > > > > Bob Schieffer called his bluff saying to him: "Your running mate 
> > > > > > > said
> > > > > > > he palled around with terrorists." McCain was now on the spot and
> > > > > > > angrily said: "I don't care about an old, washed up terrorist. 
> > > > > > > But as
> > > > > > > Sen. Clinton said in her debates with you we need to know the full
> > > > > > > extent of that relationship. Obama calmly replied: "Bill Ayers is 
> > > > > > > a
> > > > > > > professor of education in Chicago. Forty years ago, when I was 8 
> > > > > > > years
> > > > > > > old, he engaged in despicable acts with a radical domestic group. 
> > > > > > > I
> > > > > > > have roundly condemned those acts. Ten years ago, he served and I
> > > > > > > served on a board that was funded by one of Ronald Reagan's former
> > > > > > > ambassadors and close friends, Mr. Annenberg." From now on, when 
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > Republicans bring up Ayers, the Democrats are going to point out 
> > > > > > > that
> > > > > > > one of Reagan's close friends liked him enough to put him on the 
> > > > > > > board
> > > > > > > of one of his foundations.
>
> > > > > > > While McCain scored more formal debating points than he did in his
> > > > > > > earlier debates, he lost the body language war. He was tense, 
> > > > > > > angry,
> > > > > > > smirking, and sarcastic, anything but presidential. Prof. Obama, 
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > law professor, acted like Pr

Re: Obama Wins Final Debate by a Large Margin

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

:o-]

On Oct 17, 3:40 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Faux?
>
> On Oct 17, 2:37 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > fox ?
>
> > On Oct 16, 9:59 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > mark,
>
> > > Who would be "independent" enough for you lad?
>
> > > On Oct 16, 5:35 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > back to cbs again. do find a truly independent pollster murky.
>
> > > > On Oct 16, 5:04 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > Obama Wins Final Debate by a Large 
> > > > > Marginhttp://www.electoral-vote.com/
> > > > > John McCain had to give it everything he had last night and he did,
> > > > > but it probably wasn't enough. He attacked Barack Obama on his
> > > > > character, on his relationship with William Ayers, on everything. His
> > > > > best sound bite was: "Senator Obama. I am not President Bush. If you
> > > > > wanted to run against President Bush, you should have run four years
> > > > > ago." But Obama parried this by saying: "on the core economic issues
> > > > > that matter to the American people--on tax policy, on energy policy,
> > > > > and spending priorities--you have been a vigorous supporter of
> > > > > President Bush."
>
> > > > > The day before the debate, Obama practically dared McCain to bring up
> > > > > the subject of William Ayers. McCain hesitated to do it, but moderator
> > > > > Bob Schieffer called his bluff saying to him: "Your running mate said
> > > > > he palled around with terrorists." McCain was now on the spot and
> > > > > angrily said: "I don't care about an old, washed up terrorist. But as
> > > > > Sen. Clinton said in her debates with you we need to know the full
> > > > > extent of that relationship. Obama calmly replied: "Bill Ayers is a
> > > > > professor of education in Chicago. Forty years ago, when I was 8 years
> > > > > old, he engaged in despicable acts with a radical domestic group. I
> > > > > have roundly condemned those acts. Ten years ago, he served and I
> > > > > served on a board that was funded by one of Ronald Reagan's former
> > > > > ambassadors and close friends, Mr. Annenberg." From now on, when the
> > > > > Republicans bring up Ayers, the Democrats are going to point out that
> > > > > one of Reagan's close friends liked him enough to put him on the board
> > > > > of one of his foundations.
>
> > > > > While McCain scored more formal debating points than he did in his
> > > > > earlier debates, he lost the body language war. He was tense, angry,
> > > > > smirking, and sarcastic, anything but presidential. Prof. Obama, the
> > > > > law professor, acted like Prof. Obama, the law professor, focused,
> > > > > unruffled, and in control on the facts and in his demeanor. Watch him
> > > > > at Youtube.
>
> > > > > Immediately after the debate, Opinion Research Corp., CNN's pollster
> > > > > this year, ran a poll on who won. Once again, Obama won, 58% to 31%,
> > > > > an almost 2 to 1 margin. To shake up the race, McCain had to win
> > > > > decisively. All Obama needed was a draw. Instead he got a resounding
> > > > > victory. On the economy, which is topic A (as well as topic B and
> > > > > topic C) at the moment, 59% said Obama would manage it better and 24%
> > > > > said McCain would. Respondents also preferred Obama's stand on taxes
> > > > > by 56% to 41% and also his stand on health care by 62% to 31%. In
> > > > > addition, the people polled also said Obama expressed his views
> > > > > better, was the stronger leader, was more likeable, and was less of a
> > > > > typical politician. And on the heart of the McCain campaign--that he
> > > > > never met William Ayers and Obama did--51% said Ayers didn't matter to
> > > > > them at all. Maybe Lee Atwater is really dead, finally.
>
> > > > > As it did before, CBS commissioned Knowledge Networks to run a poll
> > > > > among uncommitted voters. The 638 respondents said Obama won, 53% to
> > >

Re: A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteria

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

post even one link to an " agent " of the DNC being convicted of voter
fraud !

On Oct 16, 2:48 pm, jgg1000a <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Agents the DNC and Obama regularly use have...
>
> On Oct 16, 3:41 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > are you claiming the DNC or the Obama campaign has committed voter
> > fraud ?
>
> > On Oct 15, 12:21 pm, jgg1000a <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > ACORN HAS committed voter fraud...  That is the point you miss...
> > > There are numberous convictions in the past...   1/3 of the states are
> > > investigating ACORN for fraud now...   Why, if Obama is concerned
> > > about fair elections, is Obama ignoring fraud done by his side in this
> > > election???
>
> > > On Oct 15, 4:53 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteriahttp://www.truthout.org/101408VA
> > > > New voter location cards are being sent to over half of the voters in
> > > > Kalamazoo, Michigan, notifying them of a change in their poll or
> > > > precinct location. (Photo: Jill McLane Baker / Kalamazoo Gazette)
> > > >     It's worth taking a moment to step back from the slew of charges
> > > > leveled over the last week at ACORN, the community-organizing group
> > > > that Republicans and the McCain campaign have been trying to turn into
> > > > a bogeyman for fears about vote fraud (and, of course, tie to Barack
> > > > Obama).
>
> > > >     The GOP has accused ACORN of submitting fraudulent voter
> > > > registration forms numbering in the hundreds or thousands, in
> > > > battleground states including Ohio, Indiana, Nevada, and Missouri.
>
> > > >     But the most important point that's getting lost in the Fox-
> > > > generated hysteria is that, according to voting experts, even when
> > > > fraudulent voter registration forms are submitted, they virtually
> > > > never lead to fraudulent votes being cast. Richard Hasen, a law
> > > > professor at Loyola and an authority on voting law, wrote in a 2007 op-
> > > > ed published last year in the Dallas Morning News and noted recently
> > > > by TPM, that "the idea of massive polling-place fraud (through the use
> > > > of inflated voter rolls) is inherently incredible," because of the
> > > > sheer logistical challenges it would require to carry out on a large
> > > > scale.
>
> > > >     In many states, ACORN is required by law to turn in all the forms
> > > > it collects, though the law differs from state to law, according to
> > > > experts.
>
> > > >     ACORN has consistently said that it flags suspicious forms for
> > > > election officials. Indeed, in Nevada where last week an ACORN office
> > > > was raided in an investigation headed by the Secretary of State, ACORN
> > > > was already cooperating with authorities.
>
> > > >     According to a statement from the group which has not been
> > > > disputed by state officials, in July, ACORN set up a meeting with
> > > > county elections officials and the Secretary of State's office to urge
> > > > them to take action on information ACORN had provided. Since then,
> > > > "ACORN has provided officials with copies and - in some cases - second
> > > > copies of many of the personnel records and the 'problem card
> > > > packages' and cover sheets with which we originally identified the
> > > > problem cards."
>
> > > >     It's also worth noting that similar allegations were made against
> > > > ACORN in the last few election cycles, and several investigations were
> > > > conducted, none of which found evidence of widespread voter fraud.
> > > > Many of these were conducted by US attorneys, who were pressured by
> > > > GOP political figures to investigate the issue, then fired after they
> > > > failed to come up with sufficient evidence.
>
> > > >     So as the GOP campaign to make an issue out of ACORN continues -
> > > > and we'll be keeping you posted as it does - remember that the number
> > > > of fraudulent votes that will be cast in November as a result of the
> > > > group's voter-registration activities is close to zero. But the number
> > > > of valid voters who could potentially have obstacles placed in their
> > > > way of voting, as a result of the Republican campaign, is far larger.- 
> > > > Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
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Re: Obama Wins Final Debate by a Large Margin

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

fox ?

On Oct 16, 9:59 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> mark,
>
> Who would be "independent" enough for you lad?
>
> On Oct 16, 5:35 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > back to cbs again.  do find a truly independent pollster murky.
>
> > On Oct 16, 5:04 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > Obama Wins Final Debate by a Large Marginhttp://www.electoral-vote.com/
> > > John McCain had to give it everything he had last night and he did,
> > > but it probably wasn't enough. He attacked Barack Obama on his
> > > character, on his relationship with William Ayers, on everything. His
> > > best sound bite was: "Senator Obama. I am not President Bush. If you
> > > wanted to run against President Bush, you should have run four years
> > > ago." But Obama parried this by saying: "on the core economic issues
> > > that matter to the American people--on tax policy, on energy policy,
> > > and spending priorities--you have been a vigorous supporter of
> > > President Bush."
>
> > > The day before the debate, Obama practically dared McCain to bring up
> > > the subject of William Ayers. McCain hesitated to do it, but moderator
> > > Bob Schieffer called his bluff saying to him: "Your running mate said
> > > he palled around with terrorists." McCain was now on the spot and
> > > angrily said: "I don't care about an old, washed up terrorist. But as
> > > Sen. Clinton said in her debates with you we need to know the full
> > > extent of that relationship. Obama calmly replied: "Bill Ayers is a
> > > professor of education in Chicago. Forty years ago, when I was 8 years
> > > old, he engaged in despicable acts with a radical domestic group. I
> > > have roundly condemned those acts. Ten years ago, he served and I
> > > served on a board that was funded by one of Ronald Reagan's former
> > > ambassadors and close friends, Mr. Annenberg." From now on, when the
> > > Republicans bring up Ayers, the Democrats are going to point out that
> > > one of Reagan's close friends liked him enough to put him on the board
> > > of one of his foundations.
>
> > > While McCain scored more formal debating points than he did in his
> > > earlier debates, he lost the body language war. He was tense, angry,
> > > smirking, and sarcastic, anything but presidential. Prof. Obama, the
> > > law professor, acted like Prof. Obama, the law professor, focused,
> > > unruffled, and in control on the facts and in his demeanor. Watch him
> > > at Youtube.
>
> > > Immediately after the debate, Opinion Research Corp., CNN's pollster
> > > this year, ran a poll on who won. Once again, Obama won, 58% to 31%,
> > > an almost 2 to 1 margin. To shake up the race, McCain had to win
> > > decisively. All Obama needed was a draw. Instead he got a resounding
> > > victory. On the economy, which is topic A (as well as topic B and
> > > topic C) at the moment, 59% said Obama would manage it better and 24%
> > > said McCain would. Respondents also preferred Obama's stand on taxes
> > > by 56% to 41% and also his stand on health care by 62% to 31%. In
> > > addition, the people polled also said Obama expressed his views
> > > better, was the stronger leader, was more likeable, and was less of a
> > > typical politician. And on the heart of the McCain campaign--that he
> > > never met William Ayers and Obama did--51% said Ayers didn't matter to
> > > them at all. Maybe Lee Atwater is really dead, finally.
>
> > > As it did before, CBS commissioned Knowledge Networks to run a poll
> > > among uncommitted voters. The 638 respondents said Obama won, 53% to
> > > 22%. Before the debate 54% thought Obama shared their values (a key
> > > Republican selling point). Afterwards it was 64%. For McCain the
> > > figures were 52% and 55%, respectively. Before the debate, 54% thought
> > > Obama would make the right decisions about the economy; after it was
> > > 65%. For McCain the numbers were 38% and 48%, respectively. Before the
> > > debate, 66% thought Obama understood their needs; afterwards it was
> > > 76%. For McCain it was 36% to 46%.
>
> > > In short, in the World Series of Debate, the Democrats won 4-0. There
> > > will be no game 5. Obama was already ahead when he started and he
> > > increased his lead in every area that matters to 

Re: Obama Wins Final Debate by a Large Margin

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

get your mommy to read it to you then do try and make an intelligent
response to the article

On Oct 16, 6:35 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> back to cbs again.  do find a truly independent pollster murky.
>
> On Oct 16, 5:04 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Obama Wins Final Debate by a Large Marginhttp://www.electoral-vote.com/
> > John McCain had to give it everything he had last night and he did,
> > but it probably wasn't enough. He attacked Barack Obama on his
> > character, on his relationship with William Ayers, on everything. His
> > best sound bite was: "Senator Obama. I am not President Bush. If you
> > wanted to run against President Bush, you should have run four years
> > ago." But Obama parried this by saying: "on the core economic issues
> > that matter to the American people--on tax policy, on energy policy,
> > and spending priorities--you have been a vigorous supporter of
> > President Bush."
>
> > The day before the debate, Obama practically dared McCain to bring up
> > the subject of William Ayers. McCain hesitated to do it, but moderator
> > Bob Schieffer called his bluff saying to him: "Your running mate said
> > he palled around with terrorists." McCain was now on the spot and
> > angrily said: "I don't care about an old, washed up terrorist. But as
> > Sen. Clinton said in her debates with you we need to know the full
> > extent of that relationship. Obama calmly replied: "Bill Ayers is a
> > professor of education in Chicago. Forty years ago, when I was 8 years
> > old, he engaged in despicable acts with a radical domestic group. I
> > have roundly condemned those acts. Ten years ago, he served and I
> > served on a board that was funded by one of Ronald Reagan's former
> > ambassadors and close friends, Mr. Annenberg." From now on, when the
> > Republicans bring up Ayers, the Democrats are going to point out that
> > one of Reagan's close friends liked him enough to put him on the board
> > of one of his foundations.
>
> > While McCain scored more formal debating points than he did in his
> > earlier debates, he lost the body language war. He was tense, angry,
> > smirking, and sarcastic, anything but presidential. Prof. Obama, the
> > law professor, acted like Prof. Obama, the law professor, focused,
> > unruffled, and in control on the facts and in his demeanor. Watch him
> > at Youtube.
>
> > Immediately after the debate, Opinion Research Corp., CNN's pollster
> > this year, ran a poll on who won. Once again, Obama won, 58% to 31%,
> > an almost 2 to 1 margin. To shake up the race, McCain had to win
> > decisively. All Obama needed was a draw. Instead he got a resounding
> > victory. On the economy, which is topic A (as well as topic B and
> > topic C) at the moment, 59% said Obama would manage it better and 24%
> > said McCain would. Respondents also preferred Obama's stand on taxes
> > by 56% to 41% and also his stand on health care by 62% to 31%. In
> > addition, the people polled also said Obama expressed his views
> > better, was the stronger leader, was more likeable, and was less of a
> > typical politician. And on the heart of the McCain campaign--that he
> > never met William Ayers and Obama did--51% said Ayers didn't matter to
> > them at all. Maybe Lee Atwater is really dead, finally.
>
> > As it did before, CBS commissioned Knowledge Networks to run a poll
> > among uncommitted voters. The 638 respondents said Obama won, 53% to
> > 22%. Before the debate 54% thought Obama shared their values (a key
> > Republican selling point). Afterwards it was 64%. For McCain the
> > figures were 52% and 55%, respectively. Before the debate, 54% thought
> > Obama would make the right decisions about the economy; after it was
> > 65%. For McCain the numbers were 38% and 48%, respectively. Before the
> > debate, 66% thought Obama understood their needs; afterwards it was
> > 76%. For McCain it was 36% to 46%.
>
> > In short, in the World Series of Debate, the Democrats won 4-0. There
> > will be no game 5. Obama was already ahead when he started and he
> > increased his lead in every area that matters to the voters. Many
> > observers have said all along this is Obama's race to win or lose and
> > there is nothing John McCain can do about it. The voters are sick and
> > tired of George Bush and his enablers and angry about the direction
> > the country is going. They desperately want change. The only issue is
> &g

Re: Obama Hints at Communist Presidency

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

i have to give you credit for being consistent in rewriting history to
fit your free trade at all costs talking points .

On Oct 15, 9:18 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Yes holly, it is an attempt to help the Lending Institutions that were
> screwed by the Loony Liberal "Regulations" which made them give Loans
> to unqualified buyers, so that they can continue to do the daily
> Business of this Nation, despite these Loans going bad in droves...
>
> On Oct 15, 5:58 pm, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Travis,
>
> > What do you think the $700 billion plus bail-out was if not a re-
> > distribution a wealth?
>
> > On Oct 15, 5:01 pm, Travis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > From: Travis
> > > Subject: Obama Hints at Communist Presidency
> > > Date: Wednesday, October 15, 2008
>
> > > New Media Alliance - Sher Zieve - Obama Hints at Communist Presidency
> > > 
>
> > >http://thenma.org/blogs/index.php/zieve/2008/10/14/obama_hints_at_com...
>
> > >  --
> > >  *Oct 14 '08
> > > Obama Hints at Communist Presidency
> > > *
>
> > > In 1848, the founder of Communism—Karl Marx—wrote in his infamous Manifest
> > > of the Communist Party about the "crying inequalities in the distribution 
> > > of
> > > wealth." Then, in 1867, in what has been referred to as his masterpiece, 
> > > the
> > > first volume of Das Kapital was published. In this anti-capitalism work,
> > > Marx continues his extolling of Communism and advises that wealth must be
> > > redistributed from the 'rich-and-evil wealthy' to the
> > > 'poor-and-downtrodden'.
>
> > > In 1875, Marx continued with his theme with his treatise Critique of the
> > > Gotha Program, in which he expounds upon and summarizes the principles of 
> > > a
> > > Communist system. It is from this work that Marx wrote of the distribution
> > > of society's wealth: "From each according to his abilities, to each
> > > according to his need." With this, he advises the reader that those who 
> > > are
> > > the most able should and must produce more than those who are not as able.
> > > However, under Marx's Communism all will be able to take equal amounts 
> > > from
> > > the community trough—regardless of their contributions. Suffice it to say,
> > > those who are actually productive are not big advocates of Communism. Side
> > > Note: Black Liberation Theology—as taught by Barack Obama's over 20-year
> > > mentor Jeremiah Wright—has its roots in Marxist philosophy.
>
> > > Communism has never worked in any country in which it has been tried. In
> > > practice, Communism—the ultimate goal of liberalism—affords everything to
> > > and for the power elite and little to nothing for everyone else. It also
> > > does away with the concept of meritocracy—unless of course one is a member
> > > of the aforementioned power elite. However, more and more this is what
> > > Democrat presidential candidate and Senator Barack Obama seems to be
> > > proposing.
>
> > > On Monday 13 October, Barack Obama was asked by an Ohio plumber: "Your new
> > > tax plan is going to tax me more, isn't it?" Obama answered him with: 
> > > "It's
> > > not that I want to punish your success. I just want to make sure that
> > > everybody who is behind you, that they've got a chance for success too. My
> > > attitude is that if the economy's good for folks from the bottom up, it's
> > > gonna be good for everybody. I think when you spread the wealth around 
> > > [AKA
> > > wealth redistribution], it's good for everybody." We have to imagine that
> > > Karl Marx would be extremely proud.
>
> > > We already have the set-up for a USA-Communist government in place. The
> > > Democrats—via their organizations Freddie Mac, Fannie Mae and ACORN (to be
> > > fair to other Democrats ACORN is actually almost solely Obama's 
> > > group)—have
> > > pretty much brought the world's financial institutions and its people to
> > > their knees and on their way to complete destruction. Similar to what Hugo
> > > Chavez has done to Venezuela, Democrats are first going for 
> > > nationalization
> > > of financial institutions, which will be followed by Democrat's takeover 
> > > of
> > > other industries. Does anyone out there still remember California Democrat
> > > Rep. Maxine Waters' threat to take over US oil companies?
>
> > > Electing Barack Obama to the presidency of the United States of America 
> > > will
> > > pretty much finish the Democrats' job.
>
> > > Communist 
> > > Manifesto:http://www.anu.edu.au/polsci/marx/classics/manifesto.html
>
> > > Das Kapital:http://www.sparknotes.com/philosophy/daskapital
>
> > > Das Kapital complete 
> > > version:http://www.bibliomania.com/2/1/261/1294/frameset.html
>
> > >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Das_Kapital
>
> > > The Marxist Roots of Black Liberation 
> > > Theology:http://www.acton.o

Obama Wins Final Debate by a Large Margin

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

Obama Wins Final Debate by a Large Margin
http://www.electoral-vote.com/
John McCain had to give it everything he had last night and he did,
but it probably wasn't enough. He attacked Barack Obama on his
character, on his relationship with William Ayers, on everything. His
best sound bite was: "Senator Obama. I am not President Bush. If you
wanted to run against President Bush, you should have run four years
ago." But Obama parried this by saying: "on the core economic issues
that matter to the American people--on tax policy, on energy policy,
and spending priorities--you have been a vigorous supporter of
President Bush."

The day before the debate, Obama practically dared McCain to bring up
the subject of William Ayers. McCain hesitated to do it, but moderator
Bob Schieffer called his bluff saying to him: "Your running mate said
he palled around with terrorists." McCain was now on the spot and
angrily said: "I don't care about an old, washed up terrorist. But as
Sen. Clinton said in her debates with you we need to know the full
extent of that relationship. Obama calmly replied: "Bill Ayers is a
professor of education in Chicago. Forty years ago, when I was 8 years
old, he engaged in despicable acts with a radical domestic group. I
have roundly condemned those acts. Ten years ago, he served and I
served on a board that was funded by one of Ronald Reagan's former
ambassadors and close friends, Mr. Annenberg." From now on, when the
Republicans bring up Ayers, the Democrats are going to point out that
one of Reagan's close friends liked him enough to put him on the board
of one of his foundations.

While McCain scored more formal debating points than he did in his
earlier debates, he lost the body language war. He was tense, angry,
smirking, and sarcastic, anything but presidential. Prof. Obama, the
law professor, acted like Prof. Obama, the law professor, focused,
unruffled, and in control on the facts and in his demeanor. Watch him
at Youtube.

Immediately after the debate, Opinion Research Corp., CNN's pollster
this year, ran a poll on who won. Once again, Obama won, 58% to 31%,
an almost 2 to 1 margin. To shake up the race, McCain had to win
decisively. All Obama needed was a draw. Instead he got a resounding
victory. On the economy, which is topic A (as well as topic B and
topic C) at the moment, 59% said Obama would manage it better and 24%
said McCain would. Respondents also preferred Obama's stand on taxes
by 56% to 41% and also his stand on health care by 62% to 31%. In
addition, the people polled also said Obama expressed his views
better, was the stronger leader, was more likeable, and was less of a
typical politician. And on the heart of the McCain campaign--that he
never met William Ayers and Obama did--51% said Ayers didn't matter to
them at all. Maybe Lee Atwater is really dead, finally.

As it did before, CBS commissioned Knowledge Networks to run a poll
among uncommitted voters. The 638 respondents said Obama won, 53% to
22%. Before the debate 54% thought Obama shared their values (a key
Republican selling point). Afterwards it was 64%. For McCain the
figures were 52% and 55%, respectively. Before the debate, 54% thought
Obama would make the right decisions about the economy; after it was
65%. For McCain the numbers were 38% and 48%, respectively. Before the
debate, 66% thought Obama understood their needs; afterwards it was
76%. For McCain it was 36% to 46%.

In short, in the World Series of Debate, the Democrats won 4-0. There
will be no game 5. Obama was already ahead when he started and he
increased his lead in every area that matters to the voters. Many
observers have said all along this is Obama's race to win or lose and
there is nothing John McCain can do about it. The voters are sick and
tired of George Bush and his enablers and angry about the direction
the country is going. They desperately want change. The only issue is
whether Obama is up to the job. The Republicans have thrown everything
including the kitchen sink at him, but he has come off as cool (in at
least two ways), knowledgeable, and completely unflappable. There will
be more complete polls in the next few days, but Obama probably closed
the deal last night.


--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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Poll: Obama Opens 14-Point Lead On McCain

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

Poll: Obama Opens 14-Point Lead On McCain
[ CBS News/New York Times Survey Shows Major Swing Among Independents,
Suggests McCain's Strategy May Be Hurting Him
Obama Takes Big Lead In Poll ]
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/10/14/opinion/polls/main4522273.shtml
With only three weeks until the election, Barack Obama has a 14-point
lead over John McCain, according to a new poll. Obama also leads in
the personality department.
The Obama-Biden ticket now leads the McCain-Palin ticket 53 percent to
39 percent among likely voters, a 14-point margin. One week ago, prior
to the Town Hall debate that uncommitted voters saw as a win for
Obama, that margin was just three points.

Among independents who are likely voters - a group that has swung back
and forth between McCain and Obama over the course of the campaign -
the Democratic ticket now leads by 18 points. McCain led among
independents last week.

McCain's campaign strategy may be hurting hurt him: Twenty-one percent
of voters say their opinion of the Republican has changed for the
worse in the last few weeks. The top two reasons cited for the change
of heart are McCain's attacks on Obama and his choice of Sarah Palin
as running mate.
Obama is widely seen as running the more positive campaign: Sixty-one
percent of those surveyed say McCain is spending more time attacking
his opponent than explaining what he would do as president. Just 27
percent say the same of Obama.

McCain's favorable rating has fallen four points from last week, to 36
percent, and is now lower than his 41 percent unfavorable rating.
Obama, by contrast, is now viewed favorably by half of registered
voters and unfavorably by just 32 percent.

Obama holds a considerable edge over his rival on having the right
"personality and temperament" to be president, with 69 percent saying
Obama does and 53 percent saying McCain does. The Democratic nominee
is also widely seen as more likely to make the right decision on the
economy, far and away the top issue for voters, in a survey taken in
the immediate aftermath of last week's historic Wall Street losses.

Opinions of the candidates could still change, and potential trouble
spots remain for Obama, among them the fact that small percentages of
voters cite Obama's past associations with Bill Ayers (9 percent) and
Reverend Jeremiah Wright (11 percent) as issues that bother them.

But with more than four out of five of each candidate’s supporters now
saying their minds are made up, the poll suggests that McCain faces
serious challenges as he looks to close the gap on his Democratic
rival in the final three weeks of the campaign.

Views Of The Candidates

Obama's lead over McCain when it comes to the economy has grown since
last week, and a majority of registered voters now say they are not
confident in McCain to make the right decisions on economic issues.
Thirty-nine percent are not confident in Obama.

There is, however, an opening for the candidates in this area: Fewer
than one quarter are presently very confident in either Obama or
McCain to make the right decisions on the economic crisis.

On raising taxes - an area where a Republican nominee might be
expected to have an edge - Obama also leads. Despite the McCain
campaign's efforts to cast Obama as a tax-raiser, more registered
voters say McCain is likely to raise their taxes (51 percent) than say
Obama will raise their taxes (46 percent).

Voters are almost three times more likely to be very confident in
Obama when it comes to health care (28 percent) than McCain (10
percent). A majority of voters, 54 percent, are not confident in
McCain to handle health care, while 33 percent are not confident in
Obama.

McCain continues to be hurt by his perceived ties to the unpopular
Republican president, George W. Bush, whose approval rating is 24
percent. More than half of registered voters surveyed say they expect
McCain to continue Mr. Bush's economic policies if he is elected.
Continued

 1  |   2


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Re: A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteria

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

if they do that what would you do ?

On Oct 15, 12:56 pm, Kamakazee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> too bad that can't stop ignorant people from posting.  Maybe that's in
> the second wave
>
> On Oct 15, 11:16 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > unfortunately you are correct about the GOP trying to block Americans
> > from voting .
>
> > On Oct 15, 5:03 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > It isn't about just the potential fraudulent Votes being cast, it is
> > > also about Polling Data and the ability of the Election people to do
> > > their Jobs...
>
> > > Although it is no surprise that Idiots, like little Liar mikey, would
> > > try to dismiss this FRAUD because it is his Party that is attempting
> > > to pull it off, and failing miserably.
>
> > > On Oct 15, 1:53 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteriahttp://www.truthout.org/101408VA
> > > > New voter location cards are being sent to over half of the voters in
> > > > Kalamazoo, Michigan, notifying them of a change in their poll or
> > > > precinct location. (Photo: Jill McLane Baker / Kalamazoo Gazette)
> > > >     It's worth taking a moment to step back from the slew of charges
> > > > leveled over the last week at ACORN, the community-organizing group
> > > > that Republicans and the McCain campaign have been trying to turn into
> > > > a bogeyman for fears about vote fraud (and, of course, tie to Barack
> > > > Obama).
>
> > > >     The GOP has accused ACORN of submitting fraudulent voter
> > > > registration forms numbering in the hundreds or thousands, in
> > > > battleground states including Ohio, Indiana, Nevada, and Missouri.
>
> > > >     But the most important point that's getting lost in the Fox-
> > > > generated hysteria is that, according to voting experts, even when
> > > > fraudulent voter registration forms are submitted, they virtually
> > > > never lead to fraudulent votes being cast. Richard Hasen, a law
> > > > professor at Loyola and an authority on voting law, wrote in a 2007 op-
> > > > ed published last year in the Dallas Morning News and noted recently
> > > > by TPM, that "the idea of massive polling-place fraud (through the use
> > > > of inflated voter rolls) is inherently incredible," because of the
> > > > sheer logistical challenges it would require to carry out on a large
> > > > scale.
>
> > > >     In many states, ACORN is required by law to turn in all the forms
> > > > it collects, though the law differs from state to law, according to
> > > > experts.
>
> > > >     ACORN has consistently said that it flags suspicious forms for
> > > > election officials. Indeed, in Nevada where last week an ACORN office
> > > > was raided in an investigation headed by the Secretary of State, ACORN
> > > > was already cooperating with authorities.
>
> > > >     According to a statement from the group which has not been
> > > > disputed by state officials, in July, ACORN set up a meeting with
> > > > county elections officials and the Secretary of State's office to urge
> > > > them to take action on information ACORN had provided. Since then,
> > > > "ACORN has provided officials with copies and - in some cases - second
> > > > copies of many of the personnel records and the 'problem card
> > > > packages' and cover sheets with which we originally identified the
> > > > problem cards."
>
> > > >     It's also worth noting that similar allegations were made against
> > > > ACORN in the last few election cycles, and several investigations were
> > > > conducted, none of which found evidence of widespread voter fraud.
> > > > Many of these were conducted by US attorneys, who were pressured by
> > > > GOP political figures to investigate the issue, then fired after they
> > > > failed to come up with sufficient evidence.
>
> > > >     So as the GOP campaign to make an issue out of ACORN continues -
> > > > and we'll be keeping you posted as it does - remember that the number
> > > > of fraudulent votes that will be cast in November as a result of the
> > > > group's voter-registration activities is close to zero. But the number
> > > > of valid voters who could potentially have obstacles placed in their
> > > > way of voting, as a result of the Republican campaign, is far larger.- 
> > > > Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum

* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
* It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. 
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Re: A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteria

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

are you claiming the DNC or the Obama campaign has committed voter
fraud ?

On Oct 15, 12:21 pm, jgg1000a <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> ACORN HAS committed voter fraud...  That is the point you miss...
> There are numberous convictions in the past...   1/3 of the states are
> investigating ACORN for fraud now...   Why, if Obama is concerned
> about fair elections, is Obama ignoring fraud done by his side in this
> election???
>
> On Oct 15, 4:53 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteriahttp://www.truthout.org/101408VA
> > New voter location cards are being sent to over half of the voters in
> > Kalamazoo, Michigan, notifying them of a change in their poll or
> > precinct location. (Photo: Jill McLane Baker / Kalamazoo Gazette)
> >     It's worth taking a moment to step back from the slew of charges
> > leveled over the last week at ACORN, the community-organizing group
> > that Republicans and the McCain campaign have been trying to turn into
> > a bogeyman for fears about vote fraud (and, of course, tie to Barack
> > Obama).
>
> >     The GOP has accused ACORN of submitting fraudulent voter
> > registration forms numbering in the hundreds or thousands, in
> > battleground states including Ohio, Indiana, Nevada, and Missouri.
>
> >     But the most important point that's getting lost in the Fox-
> > generated hysteria is that, according to voting experts, even when
> > fraudulent voter registration forms are submitted, they virtually
> > never lead to fraudulent votes being cast. Richard Hasen, a law
> > professor at Loyola and an authority on voting law, wrote in a 2007 op-
> > ed published last year in the Dallas Morning News and noted recently
> > by TPM, that "the idea of massive polling-place fraud (through the use
> > of inflated voter rolls) is inherently incredible," because of the
> > sheer logistical challenges it would require to carry out on a large
> > scale.
>
> >     In many states, ACORN is required by law to turn in all the forms
> > it collects, though the law differs from state to law, according to
> > experts.
>
> >     ACORN has consistently said that it flags suspicious forms for
> > election officials. Indeed, in Nevada where last week an ACORN office
> > was raided in an investigation headed by the Secretary of State, ACORN
> > was already cooperating with authorities.
>
> >     According to a statement from the group which has not been
> > disputed by state officials, in July, ACORN set up a meeting with
> > county elections officials and the Secretary of State's office to urge
> > them to take action on information ACORN had provided. Since then,
> > "ACORN has provided officials with copies and - in some cases - second
> > copies of many of the personnel records and the 'problem card
> > packages' and cover sheets with which we originally identified the
> > problem cards."
>
> >     It's also worth noting that similar allegations were made against
> > ACORN in the last few election cycles, and several investigations were
> > conducted, none of which found evidence of widespread voter fraud.
> > Many of these were conducted by US attorneys, who were pressured by
> > GOP political figures to investigate the issue, then fired after they
> > failed to come up with sufficient evidence.
>
> >     So as the GOP campaign to make an issue out of ACORN continues -
> > and we'll be keeping you posted as it does - remember that the number
> > of fraudulent votes that will be cast in November as a result of the
> > group's voter-registration activities is close to zero. But the number
> > of valid voters who could potentially have obstacles placed in their
> > way of voting, as a result of the Republican campaign, is far larger.- Hide 
> > quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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Re: GOP Attacks on American Voters Turn Desperate, Ugly and Dangerous

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

" Because it is the empirical data one must use in order to make an
informed decision. :
what a load of bull shit ! you posted it knowing it implied a
distorted view of Obama and then tried to distance yourself by saying
but i don't believe it .
you fish boy are a hypocrite of the highest order and so obsessed with
yourself that you can not stand to not get in the last word like a
spoiled child on the playground .
On Oct 15, 7:18 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Oct 15, 9:12 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > if they didn't matter to you why did you post them ? you have shown
> > yourself to be nothing more than a hypocrite once again !
>
> Because it is the empirical data one must use in order to make an
> informed decision.
>
> I know such a thing is lost on you, but intelligent people use such
> things to make up their minds.
>
> The Hypocrite being the one that allows from himself things he berates
> others for...
>
> Like trying to get the last word.
>
> Most every time you start whining about that, you yourself have the
> last word.
>
> And you are calling other's a Hypocrite?
>
> I believe that makes you a lying Hypocrite First Class.
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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Re: The Terrorist Barack Hussein Obama

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

" And you wonder why I call you a Liar? "
i don't have to wonder why you do that ! it is because from the very
first i have shown you to be on the wrong side of almost every debate
or statement made on this forum . and you can't stand it which is why
you resort to mindless insults !
On Oct 15, 7:15 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Oct 15, 9:06 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > whoopee we are now playing the fish boy must have the last word game
> > once again !
>
> Anyone is free to look back and SEE just who attempts to always get
> the last word with such tripe.
>
> And you wonder why I call you a Liar?
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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Re: GOP Attacks on American Voters Turn Desperate, Ugly and Dangerous

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

if they didn't matter to you why did you post them ? you have shown
yourself to be nothing more than a hypocrite once again !

On Oct 15, 9:54 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Yeah, I pointed out the FACTS about his childhood, and explained that
> it didn't matter to me that such things had happened, he himself
> decided he was a Christian and that is good enough for me.
>
> Your ignorance on the matter notwithstanding.
>
> On Oct 15, 4:24 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > i did not lie about your position on obama's being a Muslim . i
> > pointed out what you were doing and most intelligent people will see
> > this ! when and if they read the thread .
>
> > On Oct 15, 6:13 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > I do it as you do them, and I care to address them...
>
> > > I understand that most intelligent people see you for what you are.
>
> > > You just now lied about my position on Obama being Muslim, as I just
> > > pointed out.
>
> > > On Oct 15, 2:51 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > as always please post any lies that i have made .
>
> > > > On Oct 15, 5:21 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > Yes little Liar mikey, I am sure you are proud of every one of your
> > > > > Lies...
>
> > > > > Doesn't surprise me one bit.
>
> > > > > On Oct 15, 2:09 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > i am very proud of my record for pointing out the corruption in the
> > > > > > bush administration and the distortion of the truth by bush
> > > > > > loyalists !
>
> > > > > > On Oct 15, 5:06 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > Just as your's does you little Liar mikey.
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 15, 1:51 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > his record speaks for him .
>
> > > > > > > > On Oct 15, 4:25 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > No. Ike was decent and human and probably furious with his 
> > > > > > > > > soul.
> > > > > > > > > Omaha Beach. Fire bombings. Death camps, Ugly Mamie. Stuff 
> > > > > > > > > happens.
>
> > > > > > > > > On Oct 15, 3:06 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > when i was a boy i respected Ike now that i am grown i 
> > > > > > > > > > realize he was
> > > > > > > > > > just another republican !
>
> > > > > > > > > > On Oct 15, 4:03 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > > Let's face it! America is messed up going back since the 
> > > > > > > > > > > end of WWII.
> > > > > > > > > > > The Marshall Plan was probably our zenith and everything 
> > > > > > > > > > > else has been
> > > > > > > > > > > downhill. Even Ike dealt in revenge. Sad!!!
>
> > > > > > > > > > > On Oct 14, 2:46 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > > > > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > should mccain and palin be held to the same standard ?
>
> > > > > > > > > > > > On Oct 13, 3:39 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > On Oct 13, 12:26 pm, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > What you,
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > and others, are doing is simply attempting to 
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > attach Sen. Obama's name
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > to a negative in any fashion that you can.
>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > If it is "negative" to point out his Political and 
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Personal
> > > > > > > > > > > > > relationships with many people over his "career", how 
> > > > > > > > > > > > > do we get to
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Judge the Man's Character and Judgement before we 
> > > > > > > > > > > > > decide if he should
> > > > > > > > > > > > > be President?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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Re: See Y'all Later- I Just Realized

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

to put it bluntly you are full of shit !

On Oct 15, 9:55 am, "d.b.baker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I have a different story, this one regarding the ascent of African
> Americans, that is, their ascending welfare payments via so-called
> "affordable housing." On a recent visit to my nephew's condo
> neighborhood, I was alerted to the influx of the aforementioned
> affordable housers, many to the tune of grants and subsidies
> [initially] amounting to $60,000. The primary qualification being the
> taking of a 6 hour course on how to live in a middle-class
> neighborhood. The main thrust of the course focuses on "How To Use A
> Dumpster." Also, "Why You Shouldn't Park On The Grass," or leave bad
> habits lying exposed on the patio.
>
> The condo association, like many others, is dealing not just with
> willful ignorance, but deep seated ghetto defiance. In other words,
> the affordable housers know what the dumpster is for, but feign
> ignorance regarding how to raise the lid and place their raw garbage
> inside - and as a result leave a trail of neck bones and unwanted
> onions from their doors to the dumpster.
>
> These affordable housers are also having difficulty distinguishing
> between the driveways and the flora and fauna. In fact, I suspect
> that's why my nephew invited me over, as an ad hoc, affordable
> adviser. Of course, I counciled against overt violence, instead
> suggesting they petition their municipality for relief. I also offered
> to knock rather vigorously on the offending doors, say, to recite a
> cautionary tale - dressed in worn fatigues, which originally had to be
> tailored to reach an atypical 6'8".
>
> Of course, the affordables seemed quite amenable to my humble
> suggestions, but only time will tell.
>
> On Oct 15, 3:44 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Then there is another story from your neck of the woods where a Black
> > man asked to use the phone and used a screwdriver to attack a father
> > and his daughter. They recovered.
>
> > On Oct 14, 8:33 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > rigs,
>
> > > I ALWAYS carry a concealed weapon.
>
> > > On Oct 14, 1:16 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > Will you be wearing a gun?
>
> > > > On Oct 13, 9:25 pm, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > that I'm wasting far too much time here. Looked on my profile and
> > > > > counted 9,092 posts on this and "the other" forum so far this calander
> > > > > year. And that's with me spending a good part of Jan. & Feb. in
> > > > > Mexico.It's a close race here in Missouri and there is not much time
> > > > > left. Need to spend more time working the phones and knocking on doors
> > > > > to dum up thr votes for Obama/Biden and Jay Nixon.
> > > > > We are weakest in the rural areas and I need to spend more time away
> > > > > from St. Louis, where we are already strong.
> > > > > I'm not get all pissed off at anyone and un-subscribing or anything.
> > > > > just wanted to say I won't be arouns as much.
> > > > > Plus, i wanted Gaar, mark, Travis and a few others to know when I'm
> > > > > not here I will be working hard for the Democratic effort here in
> > > > > Missouri.
>
> > > > > Whether you're Republican, Democrat, Independent or whatever be sure
> > > > > and exercise your constituional right and VOTE for the candidates of
> > > > > your choice on Nov. 4th.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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Re: A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteria

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

yes i know !

On Oct 15, 8:43 am, jenius <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> its the GOP that rigs elections ie. Florida and Ohio the last two
> elections. vote Obama. jenius
>
> On Oct 15, 4:53 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteriahttp://www.truthout.org/101408VA
> > New voter location cards are being sent to over half of the voters in
> > Kalamazoo, Michigan, notifying them of a change in their poll or
> > precinct location. (Photo: Jill McLane Baker / Kalamazoo Gazette)
> >     It's worth taking a moment to step back from the slew of charges
> > leveled over the last week at ACORN, the community-organizing group
> > that Republicans and the McCain campaign have been trying to turn into
> > a bogeyman for fears about vote fraud (and, of course, tie to Barack
> > Obama).
>
> >     The GOP has accused ACORN of submitting fraudulent voter
> > registration forms numbering in the hundreds or thousands, in
> > battleground states including Ohio, Indiana, Nevada, and Missouri.
>
> >     But the most important point that's getting lost in the Fox-
> > generated hysteria is that, according to voting experts, even when
> > fraudulent voter registration forms are submitted, they virtually
> > never lead to fraudulent votes being cast. Richard Hasen, a law
> > professor at Loyola and an authority on voting law, wrote in a 2007 op-
> > ed published last year in the Dallas Morning News and noted recently
> > by TPM, that "the idea of massive polling-place fraud (through the use
> > of inflated voter rolls) is inherently incredible," because of the
> > sheer logistical challenges it would require to carry out on a large
> > scale.
>
> >     In many states, ACORN is required by law to turn in all the forms
> > it collects, though the law differs from state to law, according to
> > experts.
>
> >     ACORN has consistently said that it flags suspicious forms for
> > election officials. Indeed, in Nevada where last week an ACORN office
> > was raided in an investigation headed by the Secretary of State, ACORN
> > was already cooperating with authorities.
>
> >     According to a statement from the group which has not been
> > disputed by state officials, in July, ACORN set up a meeting with
> > county elections officials and the Secretary of State's office to urge
> > them to take action on information ACORN had provided. Since then,
> > "ACORN has provided officials with copies and - in some cases - second
> > copies of many of the personnel records and the 'problem card
> > packages' and cover sheets with which we originally identified the
> > problem cards."
>
> >     It's also worth noting that similar allegations were made against
> > ACORN in the last few election cycles, and several investigations were
> > conducted, none of which found evidence of widespread voter fraud.
> > Many of these were conducted by US attorneys, who were pressured by
> > GOP political figures to investigate the issue, then fired after they
> > failed to come up with sufficient evidence.
>
> >     So as the GOP campaign to make an issue out of ACORN continues -
> > and we'll be keeping you posted as it does - remember that the number
> > of fraudulent votes that will be cast in November as a result of the
> > group's voter-registration activities is close to zero. But the number
> > of valid voters who could potentially have obstacles placed in their
> > way of voting, as a result of the Republican campaign, is far larger.- Hide 
> > quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
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Re: A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteria

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

unfortunately you are correct about the GOP trying to block Americans
from voting .

On Oct 15, 5:03 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> It isn't about just the potential fraudulent Votes being cast, it is
> also about Polling Data and the ability of the Election people to do
> their Jobs...
>
> Although it is no surprise that Idiots, like little Liar mikey, would
> try to dismiss this FRAUD because it is his Party that is attempting
> to pull it off, and failing miserably.
>
> On Oct 15, 1:53 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteriahttp://www.truthout.org/101408VA
> > New voter location cards are being sent to over half of the voters in
> > Kalamazoo, Michigan, notifying them of a change in their poll or
> > precinct location. (Photo: Jill McLane Baker / Kalamazoo Gazette)
> >     It's worth taking a moment to step back from the slew of charges
> > leveled over the last week at ACORN, the community-organizing group
> > that Republicans and the McCain campaign have been trying to turn into
> > a bogeyman for fears about vote fraud (and, of course, tie to Barack
> > Obama).
>
> >     The GOP has accused ACORN of submitting fraudulent voter
> > registration forms numbering in the hundreds or thousands, in
> > battleground states including Ohio, Indiana, Nevada, and Missouri.
>
> >     But the most important point that's getting lost in the Fox-
> > generated hysteria is that, according to voting experts, even when
> > fraudulent voter registration forms are submitted, they virtually
> > never lead to fraudulent votes being cast. Richard Hasen, a law
> > professor at Loyola and an authority on voting law, wrote in a 2007 op-
> > ed published last year in the Dallas Morning News and noted recently
> > by TPM, that "the idea of massive polling-place fraud (through the use
> > of inflated voter rolls) is inherently incredible," because of the
> > sheer logistical challenges it would require to carry out on a large
> > scale.
>
> >     In many states, ACORN is required by law to turn in all the forms
> > it collects, though the law differs from state to law, according to
> > experts.
>
> >     ACORN has consistently said that it flags suspicious forms for
> > election officials. Indeed, in Nevada where last week an ACORN office
> > was raided in an investigation headed by the Secretary of State, ACORN
> > was already cooperating with authorities.
>
> >     According to a statement from the group which has not been
> > disputed by state officials, in July, ACORN set up a meeting with
> > county elections officials and the Secretary of State's office to urge
> > them to take action on information ACORN had provided. Since then,
> > "ACORN has provided officials with copies and - in some cases - second
> > copies of many of the personnel records and the 'problem card
> > packages' and cover sheets with which we originally identified the
> > problem cards."
>
> >     It's also worth noting that similar allegations were made against
> > ACORN in the last few election cycles, and several investigations were
> > conducted, none of which found evidence of widespread voter fraud.
> > Many of these were conducted by US attorneys, who were pressured by
> > GOP political figures to investigate the issue, then fired after they
> > failed to come up with sufficient evidence.
>
> >     So as the GOP campaign to make an issue out of ACORN continues -
> > and we'll be keeping you posted as it does - remember that the number
> > of fraudulent votes that will be cast in November as a result of the
> > group's voter-registration activities is close to zero. But the number
> > of valid voters who could potentially have obstacles placed in their
> > way of voting, as a result of the Republican campaign, is far larger.- Hide 
> > quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
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Re: The Terrorist Barack Hussein Obama

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

whoopee we are now playing the fish boy must have the last word game
once again !

On Oct 15, 9:52 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> It was over on your end long before it started...
>
> On Oct 15, 4:21 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > then you have nothing to worry about do you . and the conversation is
> > now over !
>
> > On Oct 15, 6:15 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > As am I...
>
> > > I explained my position very well, as you have failed to even address
> > > the point and aknoledge that I did in fact state nothing but FACTS.
>
> > > Your inability to reconcile your own position with the facts is, yet
> > > again, duly noted little Liar mikey.
>
> > > On Oct 15, 2:53 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > i am content to let anyone interested to read the thread and make
> > > > their own assessment of what you were attempting to do with your
> > > > post .
>
> > > > On Oct 15, 5:24 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > So you do or don't understand that that is Obama's History?
>
> > > > > I only explained the facts and how I see them.
>
> > > > > I have no way of making you understand, since you have shown here, day
> > > > > in and day out, to be completely clueless, and only interested in how
> > > > > you can spin everything to your Loony Liberal bias.
>
> > > > > Again, no big surprise with you, same old shit, just another day.
>
> > > > > On Oct 15, 2:13 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > you tried to make an end run around the truth and got slapped down 
> > > > > > for
> > > > > > it .
> > > > > > showing you to be a hypocrite and a fool is like shooting fish in a
> > > > > > barrel !
> > > > > > On Oct 15, 5:00 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > So you say...
>
> > > > > > > I say he is not a Muslim, despite what he was Registered as when 
> > > > > > > he
> > > > > > > was a child, and you claim I am trying to call him a Muslim.
>
> > > > > > > Your ignorance is beyond belief.
>
> > > > > > > And you wonder why I call you little Liar mikey?
>
> > > > > > > The only way you are able to say anything about anyone here is by
> > > > > > > lying about them and then railing on about your Lie.
>
> > > > > > > Loony Liberal little Liar mikey, same old shit from you, just 
> > > > > > > another
> > > > > > > day.
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 15, 1:55 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > i am pointing out you are a hypocrite trying to have it both 
> > > > > > > > ways !
>
> > > > > > > > On Oct 15, 4:53 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > Are you denying what I posted is the Truth?
>
> > > > > > > > > Are you not aware of Obama's childhood?
>
> > > > > > > > > On Oct 15, 1:48 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > no you posted it as a back door attempt to label obama as a 
> > > > > > > > > > muslim
> > > > > > > > > > while claiming you were not . once again your feeble 
> > > > > > > > > > attempt at
> > > > > > > > > > distorting the truth has failed  !
>
> > > > > > > > > > On Oct 15, 4:27 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > > I posted it because it is a FACT.
>
> > > > > > > > > > > I also explained why it doesn't make him a Muslim, in my 
> > > > > > > > > > > mind.
>
> > > > > > > > > > > Not sure what you don't get about that?
>
> > > > > >

Re: Ohio Secretary of State Jennifer Brunner on Voter Rights, Faulty Electronic Voting Machines, Voter Fraud and GOP Voter Challenges

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

now i see you were being serious and stupid !

On Oct 15, 6:43 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> do pay attention murky.  she has been ordered by a federal judge to
> follow Ohio law, which she has not been doing.  let me repeat this
> murky so do try to follow.  she has been trying to steal the election
> in Ohio for your boy, and she got caught.
>
> On Oct 15, 3:02 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > you are trying to make a joke right ?
>
> > On Oct 14, 6:52 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > brunner is doing her best to steal this election for nobama.  to her
> > > dismay she has been caught.
>
> > > On Oct 14, 6:00 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > Ohio Secretary of State Jennifer Brunner on Voter Rights, Faulty
> > > > Electronic Voting Machines, Voter Fraud and GOP Voter 
> > > > Challengeshttp://www.truthout.org/101308VA
> > > > Ohio is a key swing state that ended up deciding the outcome of the
> > > > 2004 election. But the state was riddled with voting problems, ranging
> > > > from breakdowns in electronic voting machines to accusations of
> > > > widespread voter disenfranchisement. We speak to Democrat Jennifer
> > > > Brunner, who was elected secretary of state of Ohio in November 2006.
>
> > > >     Juan Gonzalez: Ohio is a key swing state that ended up deciding
> > > > the outcome of the 2004 election. But the state was riddled with
> > > > voting problems, ranging from breakdowns in electronic voting machines
> > > > to accusations of widespread voter disenfranchisement.
>
> > > >     Amy Goodman: Democrat Jennifer Brunner was elected Secretary of
> > > > State in Ohio in November of 2006. She replaced Republican Kenneth
> > > > Blackwell. Since then, she has faced fire from virtually every side-
> > > > Republicans operatives, voting machine companies, voting rights groups
> > > > and more-as she has worked to resolve some of the voting problems from
> > > > four years ago.
>
> > > >     Most recently, the GOP asked a federal judge on Sunday to force
> > > > Secretary of State Brunner to match voter registration information,
> > > > such as a driver's license number, against information in the state
> > > > Bureau of Motor Vehicles database. Republicans filed the complaint
> > > > Sunday as an extension of a previous action against a week-long period
> > > > in which Ohioans could register and vote on that same day.
>
> > > >     Juan Gonzalez: Ohio Secretary of State Jennifer Brunner joins us
> > > > on the telephone now. Welcome to Democracy Now!
>
> > > >     Jennifer Brunner: Thank you, Juan. Good morning, Amy.
>
> > > >     Amy Goodman: It's good to have you with us. Why don't you talk-to
> > > > start off by talking about what this latest controversy is, this
> > > > lawsuit?
>
> > > >     Jennifer Brunner: This is currently pending in the federal
> > > > district court in the Southern District of Ohio in Columbus, and the
> > > > judge will be hearing arguments on this this morning at 11:00. The
> > > > Republican Party had this lawsuit in place when they were fighting the-
> > > > what we call the overlap voting, which is when absentee voting
> > > > started, before the close of voter registration, which allowed people
> > > > to go to an early voting site, register to vote, request an absentee
> > > > ballot, and vote it on the spot.
>
> > > >     In that original lawsuit, they were denied relief, first by the
> > > > federal judge, and then again by the Sixth Circuit Court of Appeals.
> > > > But what they did was to try to renew a motion for a temporary
> > > > restraining order and now push this effort. And what really concerns
> > > > me is that the way these papers are pled, they're looking for a list
> > > > of all the mismatches by October 12th, and this is in light of the
> > > > fact that at this point in time we are informed that the Social
> > > > Security Administration will be shutting down its computers for the
> > > > comparisons from the 10th to the 13th for maintenance over the holiday
> > > > weekend. And they want that in time to-the Republican Party wants it
> > > > in time to be able to file c

Re: Study: Many Cancer Patients Forgoing Care Because of Cost

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

bull shite ! the republicans who were in control of the house and
senate gutted the public health care system such as it is

On Oct 15, 6:50 am, "\"Lone Wolf\"" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> The Clinton administration was the one that gutted the public health
> care system, Bush continued his ggod work.
>
> On Oct 15, 7:46 pm, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Study: Many Cancer Patients Forgoing Care Because of 
> > Costhttp://www.truthout.org/101408HA
> > At a time when they're already fighting for their lives, more cancer
> > patients are now struggling to pay for their medicines.
>
> >     One in eight people with advanced cancer turned down recommended
> > care because of the cost, according to a new analysis from Thomson
> > Reuters, which provides news and business information. Among patients
> > with incomes under $40,000, one in four in advanced stages of the
> > disease refused treatment.
>
> >     Of late-stage colon cancer patients, 12% spent more than $25,000
> > out of pocket, according to the survey, in which 1,767 people answered
> > an online questionnaire. This type of survey isn't considered
> > scientifically rigorous, because it didn't use a random sample of
> > people. But its findings are similar to a 2006 study in Cancer, which
> > found that cost caused more than 20% of all cancer survivors - not
> > just those with advanced cases - to delay or miss needed care.
>
> >     Experts say the signs of stress are everywhere:
>
> > Nearly 20% of Americans have problems paying their medical bills,
> > according to a report in September from the Center for Studying Health
> > System Change.
>
> > One in four cancer patients or their families said they used up all or
> > most of their savings to pay for treatment, according to a 2006 survey
> > of nearly 1,000 survivors and their families by USA TODAY, the Kaiser
> > Family Foundation and the Harvard School of Public Health.
>
> > One in 10 in that survey said they were unable to pay for basic
> > necessities, such as food, heat and housing.
> >     Many of the medical advances that allow cancer patients to live
> > longer come at a high cost, says Joseph Singer of HealthCore, a
> > Delaware-based health research company.
>
> >     As costs rise, insurers are shifting a greater share to patients,
> > says Neal Meropol of Philadelphia's Fox-Chase Cancer Center. Many
> > plans now require patients to pay for 20% of their health care - a
> > heavy burden in the case of drugs such as Erbitux, which costs $10,000
> > a month.
>
> >     Charities that assist cancer patients say they're straining to
> > keep up with the demand.
>
> >     At CancerCare, a national group that provides social work and
> > small grants for transportation expenses, requests for financial help
> > increased 30% this summer compared with last, says executive director
> > Diane Blum.
>
> >     David Johnson, director of hematology and oncology at Nashville's
> > Vanderbilt-Ingram Cancer Center, says some of his patients have opted
> > to stop treatment partly because of the cost. His own brother-in-law,
> > a truck driver, turned down Erbitux when he was facing colon cancer
> > four years ago. He says patients face a painful dilemma: "Do they pay
> > out of pocket - sometimes in the thousands of dollars - or do they
> > forgo the therapy to preserve for their family what modest assets they
> > may have?"- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups.
For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum

* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
* It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. 
* Read the latest breaking news, and more.
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Re: GOP Attacks on American Voters Turn Desperate, Ugly and Dangerous

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

i did not lie about your position on obama's being a Muslim . i
pointed out what you were doing and most intelligent people will see
this ! when and if they read the thread .

On Oct 15, 6:13 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I do it as you do them, and I care to address them...
>
> I understand that most intelligent people see you for what you are.
>
> You just now lied about my position on Obama being Muslim, as I just
> pointed out.
>
> On Oct 15, 2:51 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > as always please post any lies that i have made .
>
> > On Oct 15, 5:21 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > Yes little Liar mikey, I am sure you are proud of every one of your
> > > Lies...
>
> > > Doesn't surprise me one bit.
>
> > > On Oct 15, 2:09 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > i am very proud of my record for pointing out the corruption in the
> > > > bush administration and the distortion of the truth by bush
> > > > loyalists !
>
> > > > On Oct 15, 5:06 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > Just as your's does you little Liar mikey.
>
> > > > > On Oct 15, 1:51 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > his record speaks for him .
>
> > > > > > On Oct 15, 4:25 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > No. Ike was decent and human and probably furious with his soul.
> > > > > > > Omaha Beach. Fire bombings. Death camps, Ugly Mamie. Stuff 
> > > > > > > happens.
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 15, 3:06 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > when i was a boy i respected Ike now that i am grown i realize 
> > > > > > > > he was
> > > > > > > > just another republican !
>
> > > > > > > > On Oct 15, 4:03 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > Let's face it! America is messed up going back since the end 
> > > > > > > > > of WWII.
> > > > > > > > > The Marshall Plan was probably our zenith and everything else 
> > > > > > > > > has been
> > > > > > > > > downhill. Even Ike dealt in revenge. Sad!!!
>
> > > > > > > > > On Oct 14, 2:46 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > should mccain and palin be held to the same standard ?
>
> > > > > > > > > > On Oct 13, 3:39 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > > On Oct 13, 12:26 pm, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > > > What you,
> > > > > > > > > > > > and others, are doing is simply attempting to attach 
> > > > > > > > > > > > Sen. Obama's name
> > > > > > > > > > > > to a negative in any fashion that you can.
>
> > > > > > > > > > > If it is "negative" to point out his Political and 
> > > > > > > > > > > Personal
> > > > > > > > > > > relationships with many people over his "career", how do 
> > > > > > > > > > > we get to
> > > > > > > > > > > Judge the Man's Character and Judgement before we decide 
> > > > > > > > > > > if he should
> > > > > > > > > > > be President?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum

* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
* It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. 
* Read the latest breaking news, and more.
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Re: The Terrorist Barack Hussein Obama

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

then you have nothing to worry about do you . and the conversation is
now over !

On Oct 15, 6:15 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> As am I...
>
> I explained my position very well, as you have failed to even address
> the point and aknoledge that I did in fact state nothing but FACTS.
>
> Your inability to reconcile your own position with the facts is, yet
> again, duly noted little Liar mikey.
>
> On Oct 15, 2:53 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > i am content to let anyone interested to read the thread and make
> > their own assessment of what you were attempting to do with your
> > post .
>
> > On Oct 15, 5:24 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > So you do or don't understand that that is Obama's History?
>
> > > I only explained the facts and how I see them.
>
> > > I have no way of making you understand, since you have shown here, day
> > > in and day out, to be completely clueless, and only interested in how
> > > you can spin everything to your Loony Liberal bias.
>
> > > Again, no big surprise with you, same old shit, just another day.
>
> > > On Oct 15, 2:13 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > you tried to make an end run around the truth and got slapped down for
> > > > it .
> > > > showing you to be a hypocrite and a fool is like shooting fish in a
> > > > barrel !
> > > > On Oct 15, 5:00 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > So you say...
>
> > > > > I say he is not a Muslim, despite what he was Registered as when he
> > > > > was a child, and you claim I am trying to call him a Muslim.
>
> > > > > Your ignorance is beyond belief.
>
> > > > > And you wonder why I call you little Liar mikey?
>
> > > > > The only way you are able to say anything about anyone here is by
> > > > > lying about them and then railing on about your Lie.
>
> > > > > Loony Liberal little Liar mikey, same old shit from you, just another
> > > > > day.
>
> > > > > On Oct 15, 1:55 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > i am pointing out you are a hypocrite trying to have it both ways !
>
> > > > > > On Oct 15, 4:53 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > Are you denying what I posted is the Truth?
>
> > > > > > > Are you not aware of Obama's childhood?
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 15, 1:48 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > no you posted it as a back door attempt to label obama as a 
> > > > > > > > muslim
> > > > > > > > while claiming you were not . once again your feeble attempt at
> > > > > > > > distorting the truth has failed  !
>
> > > > > > > > On Oct 15, 4:27 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > I posted it because it is a FACT.
>
> > > > > > > > > I also explained why it doesn't make him a Muslim, in my mind.
>
> > > > > > > > > Not sure what you don't get about that?
>
> > > > > > > > > On Oct 15, 1:19 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > if you were not trying to hold it against him why did you 
> > > > > > > > > > post it ?
> > > > > > > > > > your feeble attempt at distorting the truth has failed once 
> > > > > > > > > > again fish
> > > > > > > > > > boy !
>
> > > > > > > > > > On Oct 15, 4:10 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > > No, I did, and it is a FACT.
>
> > > > > > > > > > > I also explained how I don't hold that against him.
>
> > > > > > > > > > > Did you miss that part?
>
> > > > > > > > > > > On Oct 15, 1:03 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]&q

Re: The Terrorist Barack Hussein Obama

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

i am content to let anyone interested to read the thread and make
their own assessment of what you were attempting to do with your
post .

On Oct 15, 5:24 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> So you do or don't understand that that is Obama's History?
>
> I only explained the facts and how I see them.
>
> I have no way of making you understand, since you have shown here, day
> in and day out, to be completely clueless, and only interested in how
> you can spin everything to your Loony Liberal bias.
>
> Again, no big surprise with you, same old shit, just another day.
>
> On Oct 15, 2:13 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > you tried to make an end run around the truth and got slapped down for
> > it .
> > showing you to be a hypocrite and a fool is like shooting fish in a
> > barrel !
> > On Oct 15, 5:00 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > So you say...
>
> > > I say he is not a Muslim, despite what he was Registered as when he
> > > was a child, and you claim I am trying to call him a Muslim.
>
> > > Your ignorance is beyond belief.
>
> > > And you wonder why I call you little Liar mikey?
>
> > > The only way you are able to say anything about anyone here is by
> > > lying about them and then railing on about your Lie.
>
> > > Loony Liberal little Liar mikey, same old shit from you, just another
> > > day.
>
> > > On Oct 15, 1:55 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > i am pointing out you are a hypocrite trying to have it both ways !
>
> > > > On Oct 15, 4:53 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > Are you denying what I posted is the Truth?
>
> > > > > Are you not aware of Obama's childhood?
>
> > > > > On Oct 15, 1:48 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > no you posted it as a back door attempt to label obama as a muslim
> > > > > > while claiming you were not . once again your feeble attempt at
> > > > > > distorting the truth has failed  !
>
> > > > > > On Oct 15, 4:27 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > I posted it because it is a FACT.
>
> > > > > > > I also explained why it doesn't make him a Muslim, in my mind.
>
> > > > > > > Not sure what you don't get about that?
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 15, 1:19 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > if you were not trying to hold it against him why did you post 
> > > > > > > > it ?
> > > > > > > > your feeble attempt at distorting the truth has failed once 
> > > > > > > > again fish
> > > > > > > > boy !
>
> > > > > > > > On Oct 15, 4:10 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > No, I did, and it is a FACT.
>
> > > > > > > > > I also explained how I don't hold that against him.
>
> > > > > > > > > Did you miss that part?
>
> > > > > > > > > On Oct 15, 1:03 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > { Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" 
> > > > > > > > > > (that's the
> > > > > > > > > > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was 
> > > > > > > > > > Registered
> > > > > > > > > > as a Muslim }
> > > > > > > > > > are you now trying to claim you didn't post that ?
> > > > > > > > > > On Oct 15, 3:48 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > > Again, mI make no such claim...
>
> > > > > > > > > > > I explained my position.
>
> > > > > > > > > > > Doesn't surprise me you don't understand.
>
> > > > > > > > > > > I was just stating the facts.
>
> > > > > > > > > &

Re: GOP Attacks on American Voters Turn Desperate, Ugly and Dangerous

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

as always please post any lies that i have made .

On Oct 15, 5:21 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Yes little Liar mikey, I am sure you are proud of every one of your
> Lies...
>
> Doesn't surprise me one bit.
>
> On Oct 15, 2:09 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > i am very proud of my record for pointing out the corruption in the
> > bush administration and the distortion of the truth by bush
> > loyalists !
>
> > On Oct 15, 5:06 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > Just as your's does you little Liar mikey.
>
> > > On Oct 15, 1:51 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > his record speaks for him .
>
> > > > On Oct 15, 4:25 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > No. Ike was decent and human and probably furious with his soul.
> > > > > Omaha Beach. Fire bombings. Death camps, Ugly Mamie. Stuff happens.
>
> > > > > On Oct 15, 3:06 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > when i was a boy i respected Ike now that i am grown i realize he 
> > > > > > was
> > > > > > just another republican !
>
> > > > > > On Oct 15, 4:03 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > Let's face it! America is messed up going back since the end of 
> > > > > > > WWII.
> > > > > > > The Marshall Plan was probably our zenith and everything else has 
> > > > > > > been
> > > > > > > downhill. Even Ike dealt in revenge. Sad!!!
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 14, 2:46 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > should mccain and palin be held to the same standard ?
>
> > > > > > > > On Oct 13, 3:39 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > On Oct 13, 12:26 pm, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > What you,
> > > > > > > > > > and others, are doing is simply attempting to attach Sen. 
> > > > > > > > > > Obama's name
> > > > > > > > > > to a negative in any fashion that you can.
>
> > > > > > > > > If it is "negative" to point out his Political and Personal
> > > > > > > > > relationships with many people over his "career", how do we 
> > > > > > > > > get to
> > > > > > > > > Judge the Man's Character and Judgement before we decide if 
> > > > > > > > > he should
> > > > > > > > > be President?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum

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Re: The Terrorist Barack Hussein Obama

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

you tried to make an end run around the truth and got slapped down for
it .
showing you to be a hypocrite and a fool is like shooting fish in a
barrel !
On Oct 15, 5:00 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> So you say...
>
> I say he is not a Muslim, despite what he was Registered as when he
> was a child, and you claim I am trying to call him a Muslim.
>
> Your ignorance is beyond belief.
>
> And you wonder why I call you little Liar mikey?
>
> The only way you are able to say anything about anyone here is by
> lying about them and then railing on about your Lie.
>
> Loony Liberal little Liar mikey, same old shit from you, just another
> day.
>
> On Oct 15, 1:55 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > i am pointing out you are a hypocrite trying to have it both ways !
>
> > On Oct 15, 4:53 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > Are you denying what I posted is the Truth?
>
> > > Are you not aware of Obama's childhood?
>
> > > On Oct 15, 1:48 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > no you posted it as a back door attempt to label obama as a muslim
> > > > while claiming you were not . once again your feeble attempt at
> > > > distorting the truth has failed  !
>
> > > > On Oct 15, 4:27 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > I posted it because it is a FACT.
>
> > > > > I also explained why it doesn't make him a Muslim, in my mind.
>
> > > > > Not sure what you don't get about that?
>
> > > > > On Oct 15, 1:19 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > if you were not trying to hold it against him why did you post it ?
> > > > > > your feeble attempt at distorting the truth has failed once again 
> > > > > > fish
> > > > > > boy !
>
> > > > > > On Oct 15, 4:10 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > No, I did, and it is a FACT.
>
> > > > > > > I also explained how I don't hold that against him.
>
> > > > > > > Did you miss that part?
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 15, 1:03 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > { Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" 
> > > > > > > > (that's the
> > > > > > > > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was 
> > > > > > > > Registered
> > > > > > > > as a Muslim }
> > > > > > > > are you now trying to claim you didn't post that ?
> > > > > > > > On Oct 15, 3:48 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > Again, mI make no such claim...
>
> > > > > > > > > I explained my position.
>
> > > > > > > > > Doesn't surprise me you don't understand.
>
> > > > > > > > > I was just stating the facts.
>
> > > > > > > > > Not my problem facts disturb you so much.
>
> > > > > > > > > On Oct 15, 12:11 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > thank you for proving that you are indeed one of the fools 
> > > > > > > > > > claiming
> > > > > > > > > > obama was muslim ! [  You see little Liar mikey...
>
> > > > > > > > > > > Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" 
> > > > > > > > > > > (that's the
> > > > > > > > > > > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was 
> > > > > > > > > > > Registered
> > > > > > > > > > > as a Muslim there, ]
>
> > > > > > > > > > On Oct 14, 8:55 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > > It wasn't.
>
> > > > > > > > > > > You see little Liar mikey...
>
> > > > > > > > >

Re: GOP Attacks on American Voters Turn Desperate, Ugly and Dangerous

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

i am very proud of my record for pointing out the corruption in the
bush administration and the distortion of the truth by bush
loyalists !

On Oct 15, 5:06 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Just as your's does you little Liar mikey.
>
> On Oct 15, 1:51 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > his record speaks for him .
>
> > On Oct 15, 4:25 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > No. Ike was decent and human and probably furious with his soul.
> > > Omaha Beach. Fire bombings. Death camps, Ugly Mamie. Stuff happens.
>
> > > On Oct 15, 3:06 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > when i was a boy i respected Ike now that i am grown i realize he was
> > > > just another republican !
>
> > > > On Oct 15, 4:03 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > Let's face it! America is messed up going back since the end of WWII.
> > > > > The Marshall Plan was probably our zenith and everything else has been
> > > > > downhill. Even Ike dealt in revenge. Sad!!!
>
> > > > > On Oct 14, 2:46 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > should mccain and palin be held to the same standard ?
>
> > > > > > On Oct 13, 3:39 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 13, 12:26 pm, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > What you,
> > > > > > > > and others, are doing is simply attempting to attach Sen. 
> > > > > > > > Obama's name
> > > > > > > > to a negative in any fashion that you can.
>
> > > > > > > If it is "negative" to point out his Political and Personal
> > > > > > > relationships with many people over his "career", how do we get to
> > > > > > > Judge the Man's Character and Judgement before we decide if he 
> > > > > > > should
> > > > > > > be President?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum

* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
* It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. 
* Read the latest breaking news, and more.
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Obama for president the Globe endorses Senator Barack Obama for president.

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

Obama for president
http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/editorial_opinion/editorials/articles/2008/10/14/obama_for_president/
COME JANUARY, a new president will take charge of a nation diminished,
an America that is far shakier economically, less secure militarily,
and less respected internationally than it was eight years before. The
nation needs a chief executive who has the temperament and the nerves
to shepherd Americans through what promises to be a grueling period -
and who has the vision to restore this country to its place of
leadership in the world.

Such a leader is at hand. With great enthusiasm, the Globe endorses
Senator Barack Obama for president. The charismatic Democrat from
Illinois has the ability to channel Americans' hopes and rally the
public together, at a time when the winds are picking up and the
clouds keep on darkening.

Unlike many of his rivals this year of either party, Obama isn't
refighting the political or cultural battles of the 1960s. Instead, he
is asking Americans to take responsibility for the nation's problems
now; no one else will take care of them, and the consequences of years
of disunity and profligacy should not be visited upon future
generations.

Obama shows great faith in the possibility of persuasion overseas and
in the ingenuity of the American economy. While intransigent rogue
states can't be finger-wagged into giving up on nuclear weapons,
perhaps they can be talked back from the brink. As fossil fuels become
scarcer, and the ecological damage more evident, Americans can put up
windmills and solar panels and drive more efficient cars.

Encouragingly, Obama has assembled an impressive economic team that
understands both the power of the market and the need to discourage
recklessness and promote social equity. He would broaden access to
health insurance, using a mechanism akin to this state's Commonwealth
Connector. And he offers a tax plan that, in offering modest cuts to
most taxpayers and taking back some past cuts for the highest earners,
acknowledges the widening gap between the wealthiest Americans and
everyone else.

The question, of course, is whether Obama can make good on his
promises under the circumstances. For George W. Bush will leave a
woeful legacy. The Iraq war, which was sold to Congress and the public
on false pretenses, continues to consume billions upon billions of
dollars, even as many of the plotters of Sept. 11 are still at large.
In his efforts to cultivate democracy abroad, Bush has hacked away at
its roots here: due process, the separation of powers, the conviction
that there are some things that government must not do. Waterboarding
and secret prisons abroad, warrantless wiretapping at home - these
acts belie America's image of forthrightness, the nation's greatest
asset in world affairs.

Meanwhile, as the planet gets warmer, its top energy consumer has no
plan to wean itself from fossil fuels. Healthcare costs are strangling
businesses. Real wages have declined for the average worker, even as
the cost of food and fuel has skyrocketed. Vague unease about the
economy has turned into outright fear as the financial system sank
into quicksand and 500-point-plus plunges on the stock market have
become a near-daily occurrence. Obama's opponent, Senator John McCain,
would try to solve all these problems by going back to the same
Republican set of tools: tough talk abroad, tax cuts for the richest
at home.Continued...

In contrast, Obama's presidency would benefit from the Illinois
senator's formidable political gifts. A graduate of Harvard Law School
and a former community organizer on Chicago's South Side, Obama
debuted on the national political scene with a dazzling speech at the
Democratic National Convention four years ago. Since then, every word
of his books and his speeches has been closely parsed. Evident from
all that scrutiny is a nimble mind, an ever more impressive grasp of
policy detail, and an ability to listen to contradictory viewpoints.
Obama is clearly a liberal. But when he led the Harvard Law Review, he
won praise from conservative thinkers because he genuinely wanted to
hear what they had to say.

Obama is hardly immune to political calculation. Though he has
positioned himself as a supporter of campaign finance reform, he
backed out of the public financing system after his ability to raise
jaw-dropping sums over the Internet became apparent. In the general
election campaign, he has been slow to admit how much the financial
crisis would limit his policy options come January.

Even so, the way Obama has run his campaign has been a marvel of sound
management: He laid down principles, put the right people in positions
of authority, and spent money strategically. And he has shown a
remarkable steadiness. Whether he was far behind Hillary Clinton
before the Iowa caucuses or on the verge of locking up the Democratic
nomination, whether he was leading or trailing McCain in the general
election contest, Obama made the same for

Re: The Terrorist Barack Hussein Obama

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

i am pointing out you are a hypocrite trying to have it both ways !

On Oct 15, 4:53 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Are you denying what I posted is the Truth?
>
> Are you not aware of Obama's childhood?
>
> On Oct 15, 1:48 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > no you posted it as a back door attempt to label obama as a muslim
> > while claiming you were not . once again your feeble attempt at
> > distorting the truth has failed  !
>
> > On Oct 15, 4:27 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > I posted it because it is a FACT.
>
> > > I also explained why it doesn't make him a Muslim, in my mind.
>
> > > Not sure what you don't get about that?
>
> > > On Oct 15, 1:19 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > if you were not trying to hold it against him why did you post it ?
> > > > your feeble attempt at distorting the truth has failed once again fish
> > > > boy !
>
> > > > On Oct 15, 4:10 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > No, I did, and it is a FACT.
>
> > > > > I also explained how I don't hold that against him.
>
> > > > > Did you miss that part?
>
> > > > > On Oct 15, 1:03 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > { Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" (that's 
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was Registered
> > > > > > as a Muslim }
> > > > > > are you now trying to claim you didn't post that ?
> > > > > > On Oct 15, 3:48 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > Again, mI make no such claim...
>
> > > > > > > I explained my position.
>
> > > > > > > Doesn't surprise me you don't understand.
>
> > > > > > > I was just stating the facts.
>
> > > > > > > Not my problem facts disturb you so much.
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 15, 12:11 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > thank you for proving that you are indeed one of the fools 
> > > > > > > > claiming
> > > > > > > > obama was muslim ! [  You see little Liar mikey...
>
> > > > > > > > > Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" 
> > > > > > > > > (that's the
> > > > > > > > > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was 
> > > > > > > > > Registered
> > > > > > > > > as a Muslim there, ]
>
> > > > > > > > On Oct 14, 8:55 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > It wasn't.
>
> > > > > > > > > You see little Liar mikey...
>
> > > > > > > > > Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" 
> > > > > > > > > (that's the
> > > > > > > > > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was 
> > > > > > > > > Registered
> > > > > > > > > as a Muslim there, I understand that such things were done as 
> > > > > > > > > a matter
> > > > > > > > > of course, and not because he was in fact a Muslim.
>
> > > > > > > > > I am able to discern, for myself, the legitimacy of such 
> > > > > > > > > claims, and I
> > > > > > > > > don't find them to be something that Barack decided for 
> > > > > > > > > himself.
> > > > > > > > > Which is what Religion is all about.
>
> > > > > > > > > On Oct 14, 1:53 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > okay i would have bet money you were one of the ones 
> > > > > > > > > > claiming he
> > > > > > > > > > attended a rad

A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteria

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

A Dose of Reality on the ACORN Hysteria
http://www.truthout.org/101408VA
New voter location cards are being sent to over half of the voters in
Kalamazoo, Michigan, notifying them of a change in their poll or
precinct location. (Photo: Jill McLane Baker / Kalamazoo Gazette)
It's worth taking a moment to step back from the slew of charges
leveled over the last week at ACORN, the community-organizing group
that Republicans and the McCain campaign have been trying to turn into
a bogeyman for fears about vote fraud (and, of course, tie to Barack
Obama).

The GOP has accused ACORN of submitting fraudulent voter
registration forms numbering in the hundreds or thousands, in
battleground states including Ohio, Indiana, Nevada, and Missouri.

But the most important point that's getting lost in the Fox-
generated hysteria is that, according to voting experts, even when
fraudulent voter registration forms are submitted, they virtually
never lead to fraudulent votes being cast. Richard Hasen, a law
professor at Loyola and an authority on voting law, wrote in a 2007 op-
ed published last year in the Dallas Morning News and noted recently
by TPM, that "the idea of massive polling-place fraud (through the use
of inflated voter rolls) is inherently incredible," because of the
sheer logistical challenges it would require to carry out on a large
scale.

In many states, ACORN is required by law to turn in all the forms
it collects, though the law differs from state to law, according to
experts.

ACORN has consistently said that it flags suspicious forms for
election officials. Indeed, in Nevada where last week an ACORN office
was raided in an investigation headed by the Secretary of State, ACORN
was already cooperating with authorities.

According to a statement from the group which has not been
disputed by state officials, in July, ACORN set up a meeting with
county elections officials and the Secretary of State's office to urge
them to take action on information ACORN had provided. Since then,
"ACORN has provided officials with copies and - in some cases - second
copies of many of the personnel records and the 'problem card
packages' and cover sheets with which we originally identified the
problem cards."

It's also worth noting that similar allegations were made against
ACORN in the last few election cycles, and several investigations were
conducted, none of which found evidence of widespread voter fraud.
Many of these were conducted by US attorneys, who were pressured by
GOP political figures to investigate the issue, then fired after they
failed to come up with sufficient evidence.

So as the GOP campaign to make an issue out of ACORN continues -
and we'll be keeping you posted as it does - remember that the number
of fraudulent votes that will be cast in November as a result of the
group's voter-registration activities is close to zero. But the number
of valid voters who could potentially have obstacles placed in their
way of voting, as a result of the Republican campaign, is far larger.

--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups.
For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum

* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
* It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. 
* Read the latest breaking news, and more.
-~--~~~~--~~--~--~---

Re: GOP Attacks on American Voters Turn Desperate, Ugly and Dangerous

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

his record speaks for him .

On Oct 15, 4:25 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> No. Ike was decent and human and probably furious with his soul.
> Omaha Beach. Fire bombings. Death camps, Ugly Mamie. Stuff happens.
>
> On Oct 15, 3:06 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > when i was a boy i respected Ike now that i am grown i realize he was
> > just another republican !
>
> > On Oct 15, 4:03 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > Let's face it! America is messed up going back since the end of WWII.
> > > The Marshall Plan was probably our zenith and everything else has been
> > > downhill. Even Ike dealt in revenge. Sad!!!
>
> > > On Oct 14, 2:46 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > should mccain and palin be held to the same standard ?
>
> > > > On Oct 13, 3:39 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > On Oct 13, 12:26 pm, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > What you,
> > > > > > and others, are doing is simply attempting to attach Sen. Obama's 
> > > > > > name
> > > > > > to a negative in any fashion that you can.
>
> > > > > If it is "negative" to point out his Political and Personal
> > > > > relationships with many people over his "career", how do we get to
> > > > > Judge the Man's Character and Judgement before we decide if he should
> > > > > be President?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups.
For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum

* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
* It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. 
* Read the latest breaking news, and more.
-~--~~~~--~~--~--~---

Re: The Terrorist Barack Hussein Obama

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

he is our hope to save America from the fascists in the free trade at
all costs GOP

On Oct 15, 4:31 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Obama is a paper doll- like a paper moon shining over cardboard sea.
> And it wouldn;t be make-believe- except it is.
>
> On Oct 15, 2:27 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > trying to label Obama as a terrorist is all the radical right wing
> > have left in their arsenal of propaganda .
>
> > On Oct 15, 3:20 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > Being a Muslim does not equal warfare/terrorism. There is a majority
> > > of peaceful Muslims in history. How do you rate Christians over the
> > > centuries? And what is your definition of warfare? Actual battles and
> > > victories or a steady erosion of values. fortunes, cultures? There are
> > > all sorts of warfare.
>
> > > On Oct 15, 2:11 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > thank you for proving that you are indeed one of the fools claiming
> > > > obama was muslim ! [ You see little Liar mikey...
>
> > > > > Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" (that's the
> > > > > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was Registered
> > > > > as a Muslim there, ]
>
> > > > On Oct 14, 8:55 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > It wasn't.
>
> > > > > You see little Liar mikey...
>
> > > > > Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" (that's the
> > > > > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was Registered
> > > > > as a Muslim there, I understand that such things were done as a matter
> > > > > of course, and not because he was in fact a Muslim.
>
> > > > > I am able to discern, for myself, the legitimacy of such claims, and I
> > > > > don't find them to be something that Barack decided for himself.
> > > > > Which is what Religion is all about.
>
> > > > > On Oct 14, 1:53 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > okay i would have bet money you were one of the ones claiming he
> > > > > > attended a radical Muslim school and was there for a Muslim . but i
> > > > > > will take you at your word that it wasn't you .
>
> > > > > > On Oct 14, 4:06 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > I have never claimed he was Muslim...
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 14, 12:16 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > Wright was his Religious mentor, who Married he and his Wife and
> > > > > > > > Baptised their Children.
> > > > > > > > lets see you claim Obama is a secret Muslim and a baptist ! a 
> > > > > > > > little
> > > > > > > > confused aren't you ?
>
> > > > > > > > On Oct 13, 4:07 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > On Oct 13, 6:11 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > You have a rather loose definition of the word "friends".
>
> > > > > > > > > Yes he does...
>
> > > > > > > > > Obama was MORE than friends with many of them, by his OWN 
> > > > > > > > > admission.
>
> > > > > > > > > Wright was his Religious mentor, who Married he and his Wife 
> > > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > Baptised their Children.
>
> > > > > > > > > He began his Political Career in Ayer's Living Room. Not 
> > > > > > > > > something
> > > > > > > > > you do for a stranger...
>
> > > > > > > > > Shall I go on?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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Re: The Terrorist Barack Hussein Obama

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

no you posted it as a back door attempt to label obama as a muslim
while claiming you were not . once again your feeble attempt at
distorting the truth has failed  !


On Oct 15, 4:27 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I posted it because it is a FACT.
>
> I also explained why it doesn't make him a Muslim, in my mind.
>
> Not sure what you don't get about that?
>
> On Oct 15, 1:19 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > if you were not trying to hold it against him why did you post it ?
> > your feeble attempt at distorting the truth has failed once again fish
> > boy !
>
> > On Oct 15, 4:10 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > No, I did, and it is a FACT.
>
> > > I also explained how I don't hold that against him.
>
> > > Did you miss that part?
>
> > > On Oct 15, 1:03 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > { Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" (that's the
> > > > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was Registered
> > > > as a Muslim }
> > > > are you now trying to claim you didn't post that ?
> > > > On Oct 15, 3:48 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > Again, mI make no such claim...
>
> > > > > I explained my position.
>
> > > > > Doesn't surprise me you don't understand.
>
> > > > > I was just stating the facts.
>
> > > > > Not my problem facts disturb you so much.
>
> > > > > On Oct 15, 12:11 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > thank you for proving that you are indeed one of the fools claiming
> > > > > > obama was muslim ! [  You see little Liar mikey...
>
> > > > > > > Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" (that's 
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was 
> > > > > > > Registered
> > > > > > > as a Muslim there, ]
>
> > > > > > On Oct 14, 8:55 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > It wasn't.
>
> > > > > > > You see little Liar mikey...
>
> > > > > > > Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" (that's 
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was 
> > > > > > > Registered
> > > > > > > as a Muslim there, I understand that such things were done as a 
> > > > > > > matter
> > > > > > > of course, and not because he was in fact a Muslim.
>
> > > > > > > I am able to discern, for myself, the legitimacy of such claims, 
> > > > > > > and I
> > > > > > > don't find them to be something that Barack decided for himself.
> > > > > > > Which is what Religion is all about.
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 14, 1:53 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > okay i would have bet money you were one of the ones claiming he
> > > > > > > > attended a radical Muslim school and was there for a Muslim . 
> > > > > > > > but i
> > > > > > > > will take you at your word that it wasn't you .
>
> > > > > > > > On Oct 14, 4:06 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > I have never claimed he was Muslim...
>
> > > > > > > > > On Oct 14, 12:16 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > Wright was his Religious mentor, who Married he and his 
> > > > > > > > > > Wife and
> > > > > > > > > > Baptised their Children.
> > > > > > > > > > lets see  you claim Obama is a secret Muslim and a baptist 
> > > > > > > > > > ! a little
> > > > > > > > > > confused aren't you ?
>
> > 

Study: Many Cancer Patients Forgoing Care Because of Cost

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

Study: Many Cancer Patients Forgoing Care Because of Cost
http://www.truthout.org/101408HA
At a time when they're already fighting for their lives, more cancer
patients are now struggling to pay for their medicines.

One in eight people with advanced cancer turned down recommended
care because of the cost, according to a new analysis from Thomson
Reuters, which provides news and business information. Among patients
with incomes under $40,000, one in four in advanced stages of the
disease refused treatment.

Of late-stage colon cancer patients, 12% spent more than $25,000
out of pocket, according to the survey, in which 1,767 people answered
an online questionnaire. This type of survey isn't considered
scientifically rigorous, because it didn't use a random sample of
people. But its findings are similar to a 2006 study in Cancer, which
found that cost caused more than 20% of all cancer survivors - not
just those with advanced cases - to delay or miss needed care.

Experts say the signs of stress are everywhere:



Nearly 20% of Americans have problems paying their medical bills,
according to a report in September from the Center for Studying Health
System Change.


One in four cancer patients or their families said they used up all or
most of their savings to pay for treatment, according to a 2006 survey
of nearly 1,000 survivors and their families by USA TODAY, the Kaiser
Family Foundation and the Harvard School of Public Health.


One in 10 in that survey said they were unable to pay for basic
necessities, such as food, heat and housing.
Many of the medical advances that allow cancer patients to live
longer come at a high cost, says Joseph Singer of HealthCore, a
Delaware-based health research company.

As costs rise, insurers are shifting a greater share to patients,
says Neal Meropol of Philadelphia's Fox-Chase Cancer Center. Many
plans now require patients to pay for 20% of their health care - a
heavy burden in the case of drugs such as Erbitux, which costs $10,000
a month.

Charities that assist cancer patients say they're straining to
keep up with the demand.

At CancerCare, a national group that provides social work and
small grants for transportation expenses, requests for financial help
increased 30% this summer compared with last, says executive director
Diane Blum.

David Johnson, director of hematology and oncology at Nashville's
Vanderbilt-Ingram Cancer Center, says some of his patients have opted
to stop treatment partly because of the cost. His own brother-in-law,
a truck driver, turned down Erbitux when he was facing colon cancer
four years ago. He says patients face a painful dilemma: "Do they pay
out of pocket - sometimes in the thousands of dollars - or do they
forgo the therapy to preserve for their family what modest assets they
may have?"

--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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Re: McCain-Palin Lies

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

you are living proof that age does not bring wisdom !

On Oct 15, 3:40 am, Travis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> What we ned is a fed court order that throws out every voter registration
> that acornoshit has submitted for the past 20 years.  and make
> acornoshits inelligible for any fed or state funding forever.
>
> On Wed, Oct 15, 2008 at 2:15 AM, [ the last patriotic Republican ] <
>
>
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > seven members of ACORN turned in suspicious registration forms . that
> > sparky is a few  !
>
> > On Oct 14, 8:05 am, Kamakazee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > It aint "a few people", they're being investigate across the country.
>
> > > Grab a paper, have someone read it to you, let me know what you find.
>
> > > Are we square?
>
> > > On Oct 14, 4:45 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > bull shit a few of the people who worked for ACORN decided to take the
> > > > easy way out and faked some forms so they wouldn't have to work . to
> > > > condemn ACORN for a few bad employees is ludicrous ! the Republican
> > > > party is trying to use this minor incident to disenfranchise thousands
> > > > of voters whose only crime was they didn't register as republicans !
>
> > > > On Oct 13, 2:34 pm, frankg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > Hollywood,
>
> > > > > Did you read this article?
>
> > > > >http://www.eppc.org/publications/pubID.3566/pub_detail.asp
>
> > > > > This article was cited in at least two threads a few days back. I'm
> > no
> > > > > economic genius, so have been researching the past few weeks in an
> > > > > attempt to understand what really has happened. I read this article
> > > > > and found it to be high level enough to make sense of, but I also
> > > > > wondered how accurate it was. I assumed that Democrats and Obama
> > > > > supporters on this board would respond, countering the charges, but I
> > > > > never really saw that happen. So my question is; what's not correct,
> > > > > or what is being left off in this article?
>
> > > > > As for the article Mike posted above;
>
> > > > > Do you consider bogus sarcasm an untruth? The article tries to
> > portray
> > > > > "poor black people" as the force behind the collapse, then questions
> > > > > how this powerless bloc of people, one step removed from slavery, can
> > > > > turn global economics on its ear. However, it wasn't poor black
> > > > > people, but organizations like ACORN and high powered lobbyists who
> > > > > helped push legislation that made it possible for poor people (black,
> > > > > white and everything in between) to get loans they should never have
> > > > > qualified for. And quite honestly, this is an extremely racist
> > article
> > > > > that is trying to promote a black vs white issue when that has
> > > > > absolutely nothing to do with it. Unqualified, sub-prime loans did
> > not
> > > > > just go out to blacks.
>
> > > > > The article is also rather sarcastic about ACORN and voter fraud,
> > > > > except now we have Congressional testimony that sure does seem to
> > > > > prove that ACORN is involved in fraudulent voter registration.
> > > > > Attempts at dismissing this as something Republicans have done for
> > > > > years is disingenuous. If it's illegal, immoral and jeopardizes the
> > > > > legitimacy of the election process it needs to be rejected by all of
> > > > > us. This should not be turned into party politics, regardless of who
> > > > > is at fault.
>
> > > > > The final two paragraphs alone disqualify the article as nothing more
> > > > > than a racial hack. Obama has historical ties to ACORN. That's a
> > fact.
> > > > > Whether that should be an issue for this election is for the public
> > to
> > > > > decide. But to use racism and sarcasm to try to dismiss the issue
> > > > > entirely, and then go so far as to call it a McCain dirty trick is
> > > > > ludicrous.
>
> > > > > On Oct 13, 9:19 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > mark,
>
> > > > &

Re: The Terrorist Barack Hussein Obama

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

if you were not trying to hold it against him why did you post it ?
your feeble attempt at distorting the truth has failed once again fish
boy !

On Oct 15, 4:10 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> No, I did, and it is a FACT.
>
> I also explained how I don't hold that against him.
>
> Did you miss that part?
>
> On Oct 15, 1:03 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > { Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" (that's the
> > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was Registered
> > as a Muslim }
> > are you now trying to claim you didn't post that ?
> > On Oct 15, 3:48 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > Again, mI make no such claim...
>
> > > I explained my position.
>
> > > Doesn't surprise me you don't understand.
>
> > > I was just stating the facts.
>
> > > Not my problem facts disturb you so much.
>
> > > On Oct 15, 12:11 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > thank you for proving that you are indeed one of the fools claiming
> > > > obama was muslim ! [  You see little Liar mikey...
>
> > > > > Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" (that's the
> > > > > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was Registered
> > > > > as a Muslim there, ]
>
> > > > On Oct 14, 8:55 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > It wasn't.
>
> > > > > You see little Liar mikey...
>
> > > > > Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" (that's the
> > > > > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was Registered
> > > > > as a Muslim there, I understand that such things were done as a matter
> > > > > of course, and not because he was in fact a Muslim.
>
> > > > > I am able to discern, for myself, the legitimacy of such claims, and I
> > > > > don't find them to be something that Barack decided for himself.
> > > > > Which is what Religion is all about.
>
> > > > > On Oct 14, 1:53 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > okay i would have bet money you were one of the ones claiming he
> > > > > > attended a radical Muslim school and was there for a Muslim . but i
> > > > > > will take you at your word that it wasn't you .
>
> > > > > > On Oct 14, 4:06 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > I have never claimed he was Muslim...
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 14, 12:16 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > Wright was his Religious mentor, who Married he and his Wife and
> > > > > > > > Baptised their Children.
> > > > > > > > lets see  you claim Obama is a secret Muslim and a baptist ! a 
> > > > > > > > little
> > > > > > > > confused aren't you ?
>
> > > > > > > > On Oct 13, 4:07 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > On Oct 13, 6:11 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > > You have a rather loose definition of the word "friends".
>
> > > > > > > > > Yes he does...
>
> > > > > > > > > Obama was MORE than friends with many of them, by his OWN 
> > > > > > > > > admission.
>
> > > > > > > > > Wright was his Religious mentor, who Married he and his Wife 
> > > > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > > > Baptised their Children.
>
> > > > > > > > > He began his Political Career in Ayer's Living Room.  Not 
> > > > > > > > > something
> > > > > > > > > you do for a stranger...
>
> > > > > > > > > Shall I go on?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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Re: GOP Attacks on American Voters Turn Desperate, Ugly and Dangerous

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

when i was a boy i respected Ike now that i am grown i realize he was
just another republican !

On Oct 15, 4:03 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Let's face it! America is messed up going back since the end of WWII.
> The Marshall Plan was probably our zenith and everything else has been
> downhill. Even Ike dealt in revenge. Sad!!!
>
> On Oct 14, 2:46 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > should mccain and palin be held to the same standard ?
>
> > On Oct 13, 3:39 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > On Oct 13, 12:26 pm, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > What you,
> > > > and others, are doing is simply attempting to attach Sen. Obama's name
> > > > to a negative in any fashion that you can.
>
> > > If it is "negative" to point out his Political and Personal
> > > relationships with many people over his "career", how do we get to
> > > Judge the Man's Character and Judgement before we decide if he should
> > > be President?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups.
For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum

* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
* It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. 
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Re: The Terrorist Barack Hussein Obama

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

{ Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" (that's the
name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was Registered
as a Muslim }
are you now trying to claim you didn't post that ?
On Oct 15, 3:48 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Again, mI make no such claim...
>
> I explained my position.
>
> Doesn't surprise me you don't understand.
>
> I was just stating the facts.
>
> Not my problem facts disturb you so much.
>
> On Oct 15, 12:11 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > thank you for proving that you are indeed one of the fools claiming
> > obama was muslim ! [  You see little Liar mikey...
>
> > > Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" (that's the
> > > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was Registered
> > > as a Muslim there, ]
>
> > On Oct 14, 8:55 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > It wasn't.
>
> > > You see little Liar mikey...
>
> > > Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" (that's the
> > > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was Registered
> > > as a Muslim there, I understand that such things were done as a matter
> > > of course, and not because he was in fact a Muslim.
>
> > > I am able to discern, for myself, the legitimacy of such claims, and I
> > > don't find them to be something that Barack decided for himself.
> > > Which is what Religion is all about.
>
> > > On Oct 14, 1:53 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > okay i would have bet money you were one of the ones claiming he
> > > > attended a radical Muslim school and was there for a Muslim . but i
> > > > will take you at your word that it wasn't you .
>
> > > > On Oct 14, 4:06 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > I have never claimed he was Muslim...
>
> > > > > On Oct 14, 12:16 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > Wright was his Religious mentor, who Married he and his Wife and
> > > > > > Baptised their Children.
> > > > > > lets see  you claim Obama is a secret Muslim and a baptist ! a 
> > > > > > little
> > > > > > confused aren't you ?
>
> > > > > > On Oct 13, 4:07 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 13, 6:11 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > You have a rather loose definition of the word "friends".
>
> > > > > > > Yes he does...
>
> > > > > > > Obama was MORE than friends with many of them, by his OWN 
> > > > > > > admission.
>
> > > > > > > Wright was his Religious mentor, who Married he and his Wife and
> > > > > > > Baptised their Children.
>
> > > > > > > He began his Political Career in Ayer's Living Room.  Not 
> > > > > > > something
> > > > > > > you do for a stranger...
>
> > > > > > > Shall I go on?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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Obama's Economic Rescue Package So On The Mark It Would Be A True Game Changer

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

  BARACK'S BRILLIANT PLAN

Obama's Economic Rescue Package So On The Mark It Would Be A True Game
Changer, In A Good Way
by

Ben F. Terton
  October 14, 2008 –   Half a decade.  That's how long I've waited to
write this article.



For half a decade the only articles I've been able to write were the
ones that explained that, despite "expert" commentary to the contrary,
the nation was headed toward a major economic collapse.  And then that
the collapse was beginning.  And then to repeat, yes, really, there's
going to be a collapse.  And then, finally, I guess now you see what I
meant.



The reason I've been able to predict exactly what was going to happen
to the economy half a decade ahead of time was not because I'm
psychic.  It was because during that period, with Republican
conservatives in control of the government, there were no significant
changes of policy.  And so the disastrous course that was set
beginning with the first round of Bush tax cuts just trickled on and
on, like a slow motion bullet headed toward the nation's heart but
with the nation pinned there by the GOP, blindfolded by media
nonsense, and so doomed by an easily escapable problem.



Any significant change of policy during that time could have headed
off this disaster.  But neither Republican nor Democrat ever really
hit the mark.



Until now.



Senator Obama's plan was shocking for many reasons.  So far ahead in
the race, it was unexpected that he would release such a bold,
detailed plan.  But more than that, it was truly shocking to see, for
the first time in a generation, a politician hit a mark so directly on
the head.  Delivering exactly to the true middle class, rather than to
either the poorer people or the richer, Obama's simple, relatively
cheap economic rescue plan, if enacted, would immediately and
significantly alter the course of the American economy for the better.



Here's why this plan blows all previous ones away.



The first part is pretty simple and only somewhat significant.  His
offer of tax cuts directly tied to the creation of new jobs - offering
$3000 per new job created in America.  For years one of the things I
pointed out as a flaw in the conservative dogma was that they claimed
giving tax cuts to businesses would create jobs, but they never
attached any mechanism to the cuts that made it so.  They simply
handed money to companies, which could decide to use the money for
bonuses for their CEO's - which is what they did - rather than create
jobs.  If they truly wanted to use tax cuts to business to create
jobs, I wrote for years, there had to be something in the cuts that
required them to be used for hiring.



Obama's plan does exactly that.  And notice the last part of his plan
- "$3000 per new job created in America."  Previous cuts allowed
companies to spend their cash overseas.  Obama explicitly stops this.



What you see here is a fundamental shift - Obama is actually looking
out for America and for the American people.  The Republicans were not
stupid.  They knew if you just handed cuts to businesses without
specifying what the money had to be used for, it would go to bonuses
and overseas projects.  They just didn't care.  They were the rich
CEO's and they just wanted companies to get richer.



What Obama proposes in this part is simple, but massively different.
For the first time in years, the American people are not having their
hands tied behind their back while the government spits directly in
their face.  No lies, no games, no looking the other way.  Barack
Obama knew what needed to be done, but didn't put his trust in
businesses, as conservatives do.  He, in effect, instituted oversight
and regulation all within a tax cut.  And with that he got at the
fundamental flaw of the conservative economic scheme:  the idea that
businesses act with America's best interest in mind, rather than for
the profit of their executives and stock holders, which we all know is
actually the case.



This part of Obama's plan is very nice.  But what he came up with next
was not only brilliant, but the most significantly positive step one
could have imagined to immediately fix what is broken in the American
economy - and in such a way that it has no real downside.



Barack's plan would allow people to withdraw 15% of their retirement
funds, up to $10,000, in 2008 and again in 2009.



Now why is this such a big deal?  And when I say big deal, I mean so
big this could single-handedly save the American economy and head off
depression and collapse.



Here's the rub:  the average American family currently owes just under
$10,000 in credit card debt.



What was destroying the American economy - and going to continue to
destroy it for years - was that the American people weren't just spent
out, they were overspent.  After decades of spending more than they
actually had thanks to easy credit, not only were they going to have
to cut spending to get back to what they could afford, but all across
the nation, people 

Re: The Terrorist Barack Hussein Obama

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

trying to label Obama as a terrorist is all the radical right wing
have left in their arsenal of propaganda .

On Oct 15, 3:20 am, rigsy03 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Being a Muslim does not equal warfare/terrorism. There is a majority
> of peaceful Muslims in history. How do you rate Christians over the
> centuries? And what is your definition of warfare? Actual battles and
> victories or a steady erosion of values. fortunes, cultures? There are
> all sorts of warfare.
>
> On Oct 15, 2:11 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > thank you for proving that you are indeed one of the fools claiming
> > obama was muslim ! [ You see little Liar mikey...
>
> > > Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" (that's the
> > > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was Registered
> > > as a Muslim there, ]
>
> > On Oct 14, 8:55 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > It wasn't.
>
> > > You see little Liar mikey...
>
> > > Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" (that's the
> > > name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was Registered
> > > as a Muslim there, I understand that such things were done as a matter
> > > of course, and not because he was in fact a Muslim.
>
> > > I am able to discern, for myself, the legitimacy of such claims, and I
> > > don't find them to be something that Barack decided for himself.
> > > Which is what Religion is all about.
>
> > > On Oct 14, 1:53 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > okay i would have bet money you were one of the ones claiming he
> > > > attended a radical Muslim school and was there for a Muslim . but i
> > > > will take you at your word that it wasn't you .
>
> > > > On Oct 14, 4:06 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > I have never claimed he was Muslim...
>
> > > > > On Oct 14, 12:16 am, "[ the last patriotic Republican ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > Wright was his Religious mentor, who Married he and his Wife and
> > > > > > Baptised their Children.
> > > > > > lets see you claim Obama is a secret Muslim and a baptist ! a little
> > > > > > confused aren't you ?
>
> > > > > > On Oct 13, 4:07 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 13, 6:11 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > You have a rather loose definition of the word "friends".
>
> > > > > > > Yes he does...
>
> > > > > > > Obama was MORE than friends with many of them, by his OWN 
> > > > > > > admission.
>
> > > > > > > Wright was his Religious mentor, who Married he and his Wife and
> > > > > > > Baptised their Children.
>
> > > > > > > He began his Political Career in Ayer's Living Room. Not something
> > > > > > > you do for a stranger...
>
> > > > > > > Shall I go on?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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Re: See Y'all Later- I Just Realized

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

i have access to a former gray hound bus we use that to give people
rides to the polls . vote for American vote against McCain !

On Oct 14, 9:40 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> mike,
>
> Good idea, I usually rent a 15 passenger van. Important to get as many
> people to the polls as possible. Certainly hope the weather is good
> Nov. 4th.
>
> On Oct 14, 5:41 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > i am thinking about renting another bus this election to drive people
> > to the polls !
>
> > On Oct 13, 10:25 pm, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > that I'm wasting far too much time here. Looked on my profile and
> > > counted 9,092 posts on this and "the other" forum so far this calander
> > > year. And that's with me spending a good part of Jan. & Feb. in
> > > Mexico.It's a close race here in Missouri and there is not much time
> > > left. Need to spend more time working the phones and knocking on doors
> > > to dum up thr votes for Obama/Biden and Jay Nixon.
> > > We are weakest in the rural areas and I need to spend more time away
> > > from St. Louis, where we are already strong.
> > > I'm not get all pissed off at anyone and un-subscribing or anything.
> > > just wanted to say I won't be arouns as much.
> > > Plus, i wanted Gaar, mark, Travis and a few others to know when I'm
> > > not here I will be working hard for the Democratic effort here in
> > > Missouri.
>
> > > Whether you're Republican, Democrat, Independent or whatever be sure
> > > and exercise your constituional right and VOTE for the candidates of
> > > your choice on Nov. 4th.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum

* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
* It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. 
* Read the latest breaking news, and more.
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Re: McCain-Palin Lies

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

seven members of ACORN turned in suspicious registration forms . that
sparky is a few  !

On Oct 14, 8:05 am, Kamakazee <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> It aint "a few people", they're being investigate across the country.
>
> Grab a paper, have someone read it to you, let me know what you find.
>
> Are we square?
>
> On Oct 14, 4:45 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > bull shit a few of the people who worked for ACORN decided to take the
> > easy way out and faked some forms so they wouldn't have to work . to
> > condemn ACORN for a few bad employees is ludicrous ! the Republican
> > party is trying to use this minor incident to disenfranchise thousands
> > of voters whose only crime was they didn't register as republicans !
>
> > On Oct 13, 2:34 pm, frankg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > Hollywood,
>
> > > Did you read this article?
>
> > >http://www.eppc.org/publications/pubID.3566/pub_detail.asp
>
> > > This article was cited in at least two threads a few days back. I'm no
> > > economic genius, so have been researching the past few weeks in an
> > > attempt to understand what really has happened. I read this article
> > > and found it to be high level enough to make sense of, but I also
> > > wondered how accurate it was. I assumed that Democrats and Obama
> > > supporters on this board would respond, countering the charges, but I
> > > never really saw that happen. So my question is; what's not correct,
> > > or what is being left off in this article?
>
> > > As for the article Mike posted above;
>
> > > Do you consider bogus sarcasm an untruth? The article tries to portray
> > > "poor black people" as the force behind the collapse, then questions
> > > how this powerless bloc of people, one step removed from slavery, can
> > > turn global economics on its ear. However, it wasn't poor black
> > > people, but organizations like ACORN and high powered lobbyists who
> > > helped push legislation that made it possible for poor people (black,
> > > white and everything in between) to get loans they should never have
> > > qualified for. And quite honestly, this is an extremely racist article
> > > that is trying to promote a black vs white issue when that has
> > > absolutely nothing to do with it. Unqualified, sub-prime loans did not
> > > just go out to blacks.
>
> > > The article is also rather sarcastic about ACORN and voter fraud,
> > > except now we have Congressional testimony that sure does seem to
> > > prove that ACORN is involved in fraudulent voter registration.
> > > Attempts at dismissing this as something Republicans have done for
> > > years is disingenuous. If it's illegal, immoral and jeopardizes the
> > > legitimacy of the election process it needs to be rejected by all of
> > > us. This should not be turned into party politics, regardless of who
> > > is at fault.
>
> > > The final two paragraphs alone disqualify the article as nothing more
> > > than a racial hack. Obama has historical ties to ACORN. That's a fact.
> > > Whether that should be an issue for this election is for the public to
> > > decide. But to use racism and sarcasm to try to dismiss the issue
> > > entirely, and then go so far as to call it a McCain dirty trick is
> > > ludicrous.
>
> > > On Oct 13, 9:19 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > mark,
>
> > > > Feel free to point out the untruths or inaccuracies in mike's post. Do
> > > > ahead, no one stopping you.
>
> > > > On Oct 13, 5:44 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > this article is so full of shit, no womder ,murky buys into it.  even
> > > > > the liberal msm has finally accepted the fact that nobama has been
> > > > > lying about his ties to acorn.
>
> > > > > On Oct 13, 4:16 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > McCain-Palin Lies
> > > > > > By Lloyd Hart
>
> > > > > > You may have noticed over the last week the word acorn or to be more
> > > > > > exact A.C.O.R.N. which stands for the Association of Community
> > > > > >ticle is so full of shit Organizations for Reform Now. I personally 
> > > > > >have known about this group

Re: GOP Attacks on American Voters Turn Desperate, Ugly and Dangerous

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

so tell us fish boy why haven't you answered the question ?

On Oct 14, 8:50 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I do...
>
> We can all SEE that this kind of stuff comes MUCH MORE from Loony
> Liberals, like you little Liar mikey, than they do from Republicans.
>
> But you don't care if Democrats do it, only if Republicans do.
>
> Why is that you suppose, little Liar mikey?
>
> On Oct 14, 1:56 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > then why haven't you done so ?
>
> > On Oct 14, 4:08 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > Yep.
>
> > > On Oct 14, 12:46 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > should mccain and palin be held to the same standard ?
>
> > > > On Oct 13, 3:39 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > On Oct 13, 12:26 pm, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > What you,
> > > > > > and others, are doing is simply attempting to attach Sen. Obama's 
> > > > > > name
> > > > > > to a negative in any fashion that you can.
>
> > > > > If it is "negative" to point out his Political and Personal
> > > > > relationships with many people over his "career", how do we get to
> > > > > Judge the Man's Character and Judgement before we decide if he should
> > > > > be President?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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Re: The Terrorist Barack Hussein Obama

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

thank you for proving that you are indeed one of the fools claiming
obama was muslim ! [  You see little Liar mikey...
>
> Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" (that's the
> name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was Registered
> as a Muslim there, ]

On Oct 14, 8:55 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> It wasn't.
>
> You see little Liar mikey...
>
> Even though there is DOCUMENTATION that Barry "Sorento" (that's the
> name they Registered him under in that Muslim School) was Registered
> as a Muslim there, I understand that such things were done as a matter
> of course, and not because he was in fact a Muslim.
>
> I am able to discern, for myself, the legitimacy of such claims, and I
> don't find them to be something that Barack decided for himself.
> Which is what Religion is all about.
>
> On Oct 14, 1:53 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > okay i would have bet money you were one of the ones claiming he
> > attended a radical Muslim school and was there for a Muslim . but i
> > will take you at your word that it wasn't you .
>
> > On Oct 14, 4:06 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > I have never claimed he was Muslim...
>
> > > On Oct 14, 12:16 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > Wright was his Religious mentor, who Married he and his Wife and
> > > > Baptised their Children.
> > > > lets see  you claim Obama is a secret Muslim and a baptist ! a little
> > > > confused aren't you ?
>
> > > > On Oct 13, 4:07 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > On Oct 13, 6:11 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > You have a rather loose definition of the word "friends".
>
> > > > > Yes he does...
>
> > > > > Obama was MORE than friends with many of them, by his OWN admission.
>
> > > > > Wright was his Religious mentor, who Married he and his Wife and
> > > > > Baptised their Children.
>
> > > > > He began his Political Career in Ayer's Living Room.  Not something
> > > > > you do for a stranger...
>
> > > > > Shall I go on?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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Re: Ohio Secretary of State Jennifer Brunner on Voter Rights, Faulty Electronic Voting Machines, Voter Fraud and GOP Voter Challenges

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

you are trying to make a joke right ?

On Oct 14, 6:52 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> brunner is doing her best to steal this election for nobama.  to her
> dismay she has been caught.
>
> On Oct 14, 6:00 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Ohio Secretary of State Jennifer Brunner on Voter Rights, Faulty
> > Electronic Voting Machines, Voter Fraud and GOP Voter 
> > Challengeshttp://www.truthout.org/101308VA
> > Ohio is a key swing state that ended up deciding the outcome of the
> > 2004 election. But the state was riddled with voting problems, ranging
> > from breakdowns in electronic voting machines to accusations of
> > widespread voter disenfranchisement. We speak to Democrat Jennifer
> > Brunner, who was elected secretary of state of Ohio in November 2006.
>
> >     Juan Gonzalez: Ohio is a key swing state that ended up deciding
> > the outcome of the 2004 election. But the state was riddled with
> > voting problems, ranging from breakdowns in electronic voting machines
> > to accusations of widespread voter disenfranchisement.
>
> >     Amy Goodman: Democrat Jennifer Brunner was elected Secretary of
> > State in Ohio in November of 2006. She replaced Republican Kenneth
> > Blackwell. Since then, she has faced fire from virtually every side-
> > Republicans operatives, voting machine companies, voting rights groups
> > and more-as she has worked to resolve some of the voting problems from
> > four years ago.
>
> >     Most recently, the GOP asked a federal judge on Sunday to force
> > Secretary of State Brunner to match voter registration information,
> > such as a driver's license number, against information in the state
> > Bureau of Motor Vehicles database. Republicans filed the complaint
> > Sunday as an extension of a previous action against a week-long period
> > in which Ohioans could register and vote on that same day.
>
> >     Juan Gonzalez: Ohio Secretary of State Jennifer Brunner joins us
> > on the telephone now. Welcome to Democracy Now!
>
> >     Jennifer Brunner: Thank you, Juan. Good morning, Amy.
>
> >     Amy Goodman: It's good to have you with us. Why don't you talk-to
> > start off by talking about what this latest controversy is, this
> > lawsuit?
>
> >     Jennifer Brunner: This is currently pending in the federal
> > district court in the Southern District of Ohio in Columbus, and the
> > judge will be hearing arguments on this this morning at 11:00. The
> > Republican Party had this lawsuit in place when they were fighting the-
> > what we call the overlap voting, which is when absentee voting
> > started, before the close of voter registration, which allowed people
> > to go to an early voting site, register to vote, request an absentee
> > ballot, and vote it on the spot.
>
> >     In that original lawsuit, they were denied relief, first by the
> > federal judge, and then again by the Sixth Circuit Court of Appeals.
> > But what they did was to try to renew a motion for a temporary
> > restraining order and now push this effort. And what really concerns
> > me is that the way these papers are pled, they're looking for a list
> > of all the mismatches by October 12th, and this is in light of the
> > fact that at this point in time we are informed that the Social
> > Security Administration will be shutting down its computers for the
> > comparisons from the 10th to the 13th for maintenance over the holiday
> > weekend. And they want that in time to-the Republican Party wants it
> > in time to be able to file challenges twenty days before the election,
> > to require ID, which is already required in Ohio, and also to push
> > people into provisional voting.
>
> >     Juan Gonzalez: Well, I'd like to ask you, you've been now
> > Secretary of State-you replaced the infamous and controversial Kenneth
> > Blackwell. And in the first year, you had a report called "EVEREST"
> > that looked at the situation in the voting system of Ohio. Could you
> > tell us about some of the main concerns that you had out of that
> > report?
>
> >     Jennifer Brunner: We focused on four areas. We focused on
> > security; reliability of the equipment and the systems; the
> > configuration, whether all of the systems throughout the state were
> > configured to the same software level; and also whether or not
> > procedures that local officials used were mitigating some of the
> > concerns that we found.
>
> >     Unfortunately, all of the equipment fail

Re: Biohazard bag baby's death blamed on unlicensed staff

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

how in your muddled brain does a natural death become a murder ?

On Oct 14, 6:10 pm, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> murder and mayhem from the left
>
> On Oct 14, 6:39 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > seems to me I just posted that murky.
>
> > On Oct 14, 6:38 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > ---­-
>
> > > ---­-
> > > MATTERS OF LIFE AND DEATH
> > > Biohazard bag baby's death blamed on unlicensed staff
> > > Civil case launched for girl born alive during abortion
>
> > > ---­-
> > > Posted: October 13, 2008
> > > 9:40 pm Eastern
>
> > > By Bob Unruh
> > > © 2008 WorldNetDaily
>
> > > A civil lawsuit is being launched in the Florida case of a baby girl
> > > who survived an abortion procedure but promptly was shoved into a
> > > chemical-laden biohazard bag where police found the body nine days
> > > later.
>
> > > Officials with the Thomas More Society of Chicago say they have begun
> > > work with Florida lawyer Tom Pennekamp Jr. on the case stemming from
> > > the 2006 death of Shanice Denise Osbourne.
>
> > > A funeral is scheduled tomorrow for the infant, 27 months after she
> > > survived an abortion at the A Gyn Diagnostic Center in Hialeah, Fla.
>
> > > In front of her shocked mother and a stunned clinic worker, "Shanice
> > > was stuffed into a medical waste bag filled with chlorine bleach just
> > > after she was delivered alive by abortion clinic owner Belkis
> > > Gonzalez," the non-profit legal group said. "This all took place
> > > without any licensed medical personnel (doctors or even nurses) in
> > > attendance."
>
> > > Although investigators previously have told WND they were pursuing
> > > criminal counts for Shanice's death, no charges have yet been filed.
> > > The charges apparently have been delayed or prevented because of the
> > > abortion procedure.
>
> > > (Story continues below)
>
> > > "While the Miami-Dade County medical examiner determined that Shanice
> > > was born alive, he concluded her death was 'natural,' resulting merely
> > > from her 'extreme prematurity,'" officials with the Thomas More
> > > Society said. "Then so-called 'experts' publicly claimed that unless
> > > an infant could be proved to be 'viable' – able to live on her own –
> > > her killing could not be condemned as 'homicide' or otherwise culpable
> > > as a matter of law."
>
> > > On Oct 14, 6:30 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > A civil lawsuit is being launched in the Florida case of a baby girl
> > > > who survived an abortion procedure but promptly was shoved into a
> > > > chemical-laden biohazard bag where police found the body nine days
> > > > later.
>
> > > > Officials with the Thomas More Society of Chicago say they have begun
> > > > work with Florida lawyer Tom Pennekamp Jr. on the case stemming from
> > > > the 2006 death of Shanice Denise Osbourne.
>
> > > > A funeral is scheduled tomorrow for the infant, 27 months after she
> > > > survived an abortion at the A Gyn Diagnostic Center in Hialeah, Fla.
>
> > > > In front of her shocked mother and a stunned clinic worker, "Shanice
> > > > was stuffed into a medical waste bag filled with chlorine bleach just
> > > > after she was delivered alive by abortion clinic owner Belkis
> > > > Gonzalez," the non-profit legal group said. "This all took place
> > > > without any licensed medical personnel (doctors or even nurses) in
> > > > attendance."
>
> > > > The investigation was delayed even though a search warrant cited
> > > > probable cause for investigation of second-degree murder, because,
> > > > according to the Thomas More Society, "the clinic owner put the baby's
> > > > corpse on the building's tin roof where it decayed for days under the
> > > > hot Florida sun."
>
> > > > "But police were called again. This time they found the body," the
> > > > report said.
>
&g

Re: See Y'all Later- I Just Realized

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

i am thinking about renting another bus this election to drive people
to the polls !

On Oct 13, 10:25 pm, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> that I'm wasting far too much time here. Looked on my profile and
> counted 9,092 posts on this and "the other" forum so far this calander
> year. And that's with me spending a good part of Jan. & Feb. in
> Mexico.It's a close race here in Missouri and there is not much time
> left. Need to spend more time working the phones and knocking on doors
> to dum up thr votes for Obama/Biden and Jay Nixon.
> We are weakest in the rural areas and I need to spend more time away
> from St. Louis, where we are already strong.
> I'm not get all pissed off at anyone and un-subscribing or anything.
> just wanted to say I won't be arouns as much.
> Plus, i wanted Gaar, mark, Travis and a few others to know when I'm
> not here I will be working hard for the Democratic effort here in
> Missouri.
>
> Whether you're Republican, Democrat, Independent or whatever be sure
> and exercise your constituional right and VOTE for the candidates of
> your choice on Nov. 4th.
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Re: Biohazard bag baby's death blamed on unlicensed staff

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

MATTERS OF LIFE AND DEATH
Biohazard bag baby's death blamed on unlicensed staff
Civil case launched for girl born alive during abortion


Posted: October 13, 2008
9:40 pm Eastern


By Bob Unruh
© 2008 WorldNetDaily


A civil lawsuit is being launched in the Florida case of a baby girl
who survived an abortion procedure but promptly was shoved into a
chemical-laden biohazard bag where police found the body nine days
later.

Officials with the Thomas More Society of Chicago say they have begun
work with Florida lawyer Tom Pennekamp Jr. on the case stemming from
the 2006 death of Shanice Denise Osbourne.

A funeral is scheduled tomorrow for the infant, 27 months after she
survived an abortion at the A Gyn Diagnostic Center in Hialeah, Fla.

In front of her shocked mother and a stunned clinic worker, "Shanice
was stuffed into a medical waste bag filled with chlorine bleach just
after she was delivered alive by abortion clinic owner Belkis
Gonzalez," the non-profit legal group said. "This all took place
without any licensed medical personnel (doctors or even nurses) in
attendance."

Although investigators previously have told WND they were pursuing
criminal counts for Shanice's death, no charges have yet been filed.
The charges apparently have been delayed or prevented because of the
abortion procedure.

(Story continues below)




"While the Miami-Dade County medical examiner determined that Shanice
was born alive, he concluded her death was 'natural,' resulting merely
from her 'extreme prematurity,'" officials with the Thomas More
Society said. "Then so-called 'experts' publicly claimed that unless
an infant could be proved to be 'viable' – able to live on her own –
her killing could not be condemned as 'homicide' or otherwise culpable
as a matter of law."



On Oct 14, 6:30 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> A civil lawsuit is being launched in the Florida case of a baby girl
> who survived an abortion procedure but promptly was shoved into a
> chemical-laden biohazard bag where police found the body nine days
> later.
>
> Officials with the Thomas More Society of Chicago say they have begun
> work with Florida lawyer Tom Pennekamp Jr. on the case stemming from
> the 2006 death of Shanice Denise Osbourne.
>
> A funeral is scheduled tomorrow for the infant, 27 months after she
> survived an abortion at the A Gyn Diagnostic Center in Hialeah, Fla.
>
> In front of her shocked mother and a stunned clinic worker, "Shanice
> was stuffed into a medical waste bag filled with chlorine bleach just
> after she was delivered alive by abortion clinic owner Belkis
> Gonzalez," the non-profit legal group said. "This all took place
> without any licensed medical personnel (doctors or even nurses) in
> attendance."
>
> The investigation was delayed even though a search warrant cited
> probable cause for investigation of second-degree murder, because,
> according to the Thomas More Society, "the clinic owner put the baby's
> corpse on the building's tin roof where it decayed for days under the
> hot Florida sun."
>
> "But police were called again. This time they found the body," the
> report said.
>
> But Tom Brejcha, president of the Thomas More Society, said, "Just
> because a human being is feeble or disabled and supposedly can't live
> independently, on his or her own, doesn't mean that anybody has the
> right to kill him or her.
>
> "If you suffocate a dying elder with a pillow, you're guilty of
> homicide," he continued. "If you fail to examine, or aid, or treat an
> infant – once born – who is struggling for breath and who – with
> proper care – has any chance to survive to live a healthy life, you
> should be held equally guilty."
>
> http://worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=77946
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Re: Obama believes women should register for draft

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

so what ?

On Oct 14, 6:32 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Presidential candidate Sen. Barack Obama may not have drafted a woman
> to be his running mate, as his rival John McCain has, but he does
> believe that America's young women should be eligible for the military
> draft and possibly combat duty.
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Ohio Secretary of State Jennifer Brunner on Voter Rights, Faulty Electronic Voting Machines, Voter Fraud and GOP Voter Challenges

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

Ohio Secretary of State Jennifer Brunner on Voter Rights, Faulty
Electronic Voting Machines, Voter Fraud and GOP Voter Challenges
http://www.truthout.org/101308VA
Ohio is a key swing state that ended up deciding the outcome of the
2004 election. But the state was riddled with voting problems, ranging
from breakdowns in electronic voting machines to accusations of
widespread voter disenfranchisement. We speak to Democrat Jennifer
Brunner, who was elected secretary of state of Ohio in November 2006.

Juan Gonzalez: Ohio is a key swing state that ended up deciding
the outcome of the 2004 election. But the state was riddled with
voting problems, ranging from breakdowns in electronic voting machines
to accusations of widespread voter disenfranchisement.

Amy Goodman: Democrat Jennifer Brunner was elected Secretary of
State in Ohio in November of 2006. She replaced Republican Kenneth
Blackwell. Since then, she has faced fire from virtually every side-
Republicans operatives, voting machine companies, voting rights groups
and more-as she has worked to resolve some of the voting problems from
four years ago.

Most recently, the GOP asked a federal judge on Sunday to force
Secretary of State Brunner to match voter registration information,
such as a driver's license number, against information in the state
Bureau of Motor Vehicles database. Republicans filed the complaint
Sunday as an extension of a previous action against a week-long period
in which Ohioans could register and vote on that same day.

Juan Gonzalez: Ohio Secretary of State Jennifer Brunner joins us
on the telephone now. Welcome to Democracy Now!

Jennifer Brunner: Thank you, Juan. Good morning, Amy.

Amy Goodman: It's good to have you with us. Why don't you talk-to
start off by talking about what this latest controversy is, this
lawsuit?

Jennifer Brunner: This is currently pending in the federal
district court in the Southern District of Ohio in Columbus, and the
judge will be hearing arguments on this this morning at 11:00. The
Republican Party had this lawsuit in place when they were fighting the-
what we call the overlap voting, which is when absentee voting
started, before the close of voter registration, which allowed people
to go to an early voting site, register to vote, request an absentee
ballot, and vote it on the spot.

In that original lawsuit, they were denied relief, first by the
federal judge, and then again by the Sixth Circuit Court of Appeals.
But what they did was to try to renew a motion for a temporary
restraining order and now push this effort. And what really concerns
me is that the way these papers are pled, they're looking for a list
of all the mismatches by October 12th, and this is in light of the
fact that at this point in time we are informed that the Social
Security Administration will be shutting down its computers for the
comparisons from the 10th to the 13th for maintenance over the holiday
weekend. And they want that in time to-the Republican Party wants it
in time to be able to file challenges twenty days before the election,
to require ID, which is already required in Ohio, and also to push
people into provisional voting.

Juan Gonzalez: Well, I'd like to ask you, you've been now
Secretary of State-you replaced the infamous and controversial Kenneth
Blackwell. And in the first year, you had a report called "EVEREST"
that looked at the situation in the voting system of Ohio. Could you
tell us about some of the main concerns that you had out of that
report?

Jennifer Brunner: We focused on four areas. We focused on
security; reliability of the equipment and the systems; the
configuration, whether all of the systems throughout the state were
configured to the same software level; and also whether or not
procedures that local officials used were mitigating some of the
concerns that we found.

Unfortunately, all of the equipment failed-I hate to say the word
"miserably," but it was a very big disappointment when we compared the
equipment, which is essentially computer-based equipment, to general
standards for security in the computer industry, computers that we
would use for banking, for travel, for communication. The type of
security that would be required was just not engineered in this
equipment. Not to say that it can't count correctly, but there were so
many risks presented that we took this to the legislature, asked the
legislature to fund us for all-paper ballot systems throughout the
state. But unfortunately, I think in part due to budget problems in
Ohio, but also due to the partisan nature of how that body is
operating, they were silent on providing us with any relief.

So, what we did instead was to move forward with a bipartisan team
of election officials, devise best practices for security during every
step of the voting process, and then we have required security plans
from every board of elections. So we're making the best of it. In the
process, we discov

McCain linked to ACORN in Florida !

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

Ohio GOP Plays Voter Fraud Card
http://www.truthout.org/101308R
While the McCain campaign has raised significant controversy about the
message of ACORN, he attended a meeting co-sponsored by ACORN in March
2006 in Florida. (Photo: ACORN)
Columbus, Ohio - If Republican lawsuits and rhetoric are any
indication, the specter of voting fraud is looming large over the
November election.

A weeklong period in which new voters can register and immediately
cast a ballot? Ripe for voting fraud. The state's method of verifying
voter registration information? Insufficient to prevent voter fraud.

Voter fraud was a buzz phrase for the Ohio GOP when it pushed
voter identification requirements through the state Legislature in
2005. It's now a driving factor behind a flurry of GOP lawsuits
leveled against Democratic Secretary of State Jennifer Brunner,
seeking either to restrict early voting or mandate how voter
information should be checked.

But do the arguments come with supporting evidence that voter
fraud is prominent, or that the current election system isn't catching
it when it does happen? No.

Voter fraud is not a widely studied phenomenon, but the vast
majority who have studied allegations say that it's extremely rare.

"There's a lot more rhetoric than reality when it comes to actual
voter fraud," said Dan Tokaji, an elections law expert at Ohio State
University. "There's this public perception that voter fraud is common
when the reality is that it's quite rare."

A 2005 report by the League of Women Voters of Ohio and the
Coalition on Homelessness and Housing in Ohio found that of about 9
million votes cast in the state from 2002-2004, there were four
fraudulent ballots. The data was collected from interviews with all 88
county boards of elections.

"Voter fraud" is often construed to include fraudulent
registrations turned in by activist voter registration groups. Most
infamously, names like Jive Turkey, Mary Poppins and Dick Tracy showed
up in a 2004 registration drive and were cited by GOP lawmakers as
demonstrating the pressing need to employ anti-fraud measures, such as
requiring voter ID.

The GOP often points to groups like the Association of Community
Organizations for Reform Now, or ACORN, which have routinely been
accused of fraud and are currently under investigation in Cuyahoga
County and across the country. ACORN said Wednesday that it can't
possibly make sure that all the registrations it turns in are valid.

But this is not voter fraud, it's voter registration fraud. The
two are not the same. Jive Turkey isn't showing up at the polls asking
for a ballot.

This type of voter fraud happens when an unqualified voter
actually casts an actual ballot in an election. This type of activity
is extremely rare, says a 2007 report by the nonpartisan Brennan
Center for Justice at New York University School of Law.

In the U.S. Supreme Court case on Indiana's law requiring a photo
ID at the polls, the state could not present one example of a voter
going to the polls and pretending to be someone he or she was not,
Tokaji said. The court upheld the state law, despite the lack of
evidence.

People attempting to commit voter fraud in Ohio's November
election would have to impersonate someone they're not, and do so
despite voter identification requirements. Or they must register under
a false Ohio name and address and have the ID to back it up.

Registrations are put into a statewide database and matched
against information from the state Bureau of Motor Vehicles and the
Social Security Administration, making voter fraud quite difficult.
The system also checks for duplicate registrations.

Additionally, as the Brennan Center report notes, the consequences
of getting caught for voter fraud in a federal election - five years
in prison and a $10,000 fine - are probably not worth the reward: one
vote.

When Ohio Republicans sought, unsuccessfully, to close a weeklong
window that ended Oct. 6 in which Ohioans could register and
immediately cast a ballot, the main argument was that Ohio law did not
permit same-day registration and voting. But a secondary argument was
that the process would make it too easy to commit voting fraud because
voters could cast ballots before having their registration information
verified.

That window was viewed as a benefit to Democrat Barack Obama, as
the campaign and outside groups transported college students, low-
income voters, the homeless and minorities to the polls.

Greene County Sheriff Gene Fischer on Thursday requested
registration records for all 302 people who registered and voted on
the same day in the county. Greene County is home to five colleges and
universities, including two historically black colleges.

Democrats were outraged, calling the tactic pure voter
intimidation. Fischer withdrew the request Friday, citing a federal
court decision requiring Brunner to match registration records with
data

Re: McCain-Palin Lies

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

bull shit a few of the people who worked for ACORN decided to take the
easy way out and faked some forms so they wouldn't have to work . to
condemn ACORN for a few bad employees is ludicrous ! the Republican
party is trying to use this minor incident to disenfranchise thousands
of voters whose only crime was they didn't register as republicans !

On Oct 13, 2:34 pm, frankg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hollywood,
>
> Did you read this article?
>
> http://www.eppc.org/publications/pubID.3566/pub_detail.asp
>
> This article was cited in at least two threads a few days back. I'm no
> economic genius, so have been researching the past few weeks in an
> attempt to understand what really has happened. I read this article
> and found it to be high level enough to make sense of, but I also
> wondered how accurate it was. I assumed that Democrats and Obama
> supporters on this board would respond, countering the charges, but I
> never really saw that happen. So my question is; what's not correct,
> or what is being left off in this article?
>
> As for the article Mike posted above;
>
> Do you consider bogus sarcasm an untruth? The article tries to portray
> "poor black people" as the force behind the collapse, then questions
> how this powerless bloc of people, one step removed from slavery, can
> turn global economics on its ear. However, it wasn't poor black
> people, but organizations like ACORN and high powered lobbyists who
> helped push legislation that made it possible for poor people (black,
> white and everything in between) to get loans they should never have
> qualified for. And quite honestly, this is an extremely racist article
> that is trying to promote a black vs white issue when that has
> absolutely nothing to do with it. Unqualified, sub-prime loans did not
> just go out to blacks.
>
> The article is also rather sarcastic about ACORN and voter fraud,
> except now we have Congressional testimony that sure does seem to
> prove that ACORN is involved in fraudulent voter registration.
> Attempts at dismissing this as something Republicans have done for
> years is disingenuous. If it's illegal, immoral and jeopardizes the
> legitimacy of the election process it needs to be rejected by all of
> us. This should not be turned into party politics, regardless of who
> is at fault.
>
> The final two paragraphs alone disqualify the article as nothing more
> than a racial hack. Obama has historical ties to ACORN. That's a fact.
> Whether that should be an issue for this election is for the public to
> decide. But to use racism and sarcasm to try to dismiss the issue
> entirely, and then go so far as to call it a McCain dirty trick is
> ludicrous.
>
> On Oct 13, 9:19 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > mark,
>
> > Feel free to point out the untruths or inaccuracies in mike's post. Do
> > ahead, no one stopping you.
>
> > On Oct 13, 5:44 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > this article is so full of shit, no womder ,murky buys into it.  even
> > > the liberal msm has finally accepted the fact that nobama has been
> > > lying about his ties to acorn.
>
> > > On Oct 13, 4:16 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > McCain-Palin Lies
> > > > By Lloyd Hart
>
> > > > You may have noticed over the last week the word acorn or to be more
> > > > exact A.C.O.R.N. which stands for the Association of Community
> > > >ticle is so full of shit Organizations for Reform Now. I personally have 
> > > >known about this group
> > > > for many years and nearly fell off my couch when I began to hear the
> > > > accusations coming out of the McCain campaign that poor black people
> > > > (A.C.O.R.N.) held a gun to Congress's head (cause black people, you
> > > > know, they can get guns. (wink) ) and forced it to pass a law that
> > > > forced rich white guys to stop redlining minority neighborhoods and to
> > > > stop predatory lending practices in minority neighborhoods - a
> > > > deliberate practice of banks not providing equal access to credit
> > > > products like loans and mortgages at the same fare market value in
> > > > terms of interest rates that the white folks recieved who were forced
> > > > into the terrible exodus of white flight when they had to relocate to
> > > > the suburbs when they were afraid their children might have sex with
> > > > black folks if they lived next door to them and you know (wink)
> > >

Re: McCain helped businessman buy Fort Ord land for a fraction of its market value

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

hollywood  mark is one step above a troll he can not process compound
thoughts . there for loudly spouts the radical talking points of the
GOP as if they were facts .

On Oct 13, 7:56 pm, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> mark,
>
> Bull-fucking-shit. Even YOU said Sen. Obama bought a "strip" of
> unspecified size from the "lot" of unspecified size owned by Rezko.
>
> Even IF ever fucking word you say is true Sen. Obama is STILL a rank
> amatuer in fraud and corruption when it comes to Mr. Diamond and Sen.
> McCain.
>
> On Oct 13, 4:47 pm, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > my point is barry got a piece of $600,000 proprety for $100,000.  that
> > is not being a good businessman that is accepting a bribe.  that is
> > being corrupt.  that is committing fraud.
>
> > On Oct 13, 9:09 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > mark,
>
> > > Obama paid $1.65 mil for a house. SO? Are you claiming the the house
> > > was worth 10 times that on the open market or something and that he
> > > got such a deal with the help of a U.S. Senator.
>
> > > Rezko paid $625,000.00 for a building lot? So? What was the size of
> > > the lot? Was the price paid significantly lower than it's market
> > > value, on the scale of Mr. Diamond's deal?
>
> > > Later Obama bought for $104,500.00 a "strip" of Rezko's lot to enlarge
> > > his sideyard? SO?  Did Obama sell that strip 2 years later for a
> > > couple of million$? How big was the "strip" of Rezko's as yet
> > > unspecified size lot?
>
> > > Is your point that Obama is not as good a "businessman" as Mr. Diamond
> > > or fucking what?
>
> > > On Oct 13, 5:42 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > In June 2005, Obama and Rezko purchased adjoining parcels in Kenwood.
> > > > The state's junior senator paid $1.65 million for a Georgian revival
> > > > mansion, while Rezko paid $625,000 for the adjacent, undeveloped lot.
> > > > Both closed on their properties on the same day.
>
> > > > Last January, aiming to increase the size of his sideyard, Obama paid
> > > > Rezko $104,500 for a strip of his land.
>
> > > > The transaction occurred at a time when it was widely known Tony Rezko
> > > > was under investigation by U.S. Attorney Patrick Fitzgerald and as
> > > > other Illinois politicians befriended by Rezko distanced themselves
> > > > from him.
>
> > > > On Oct 13, 4:58 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > McCain helped businessman buy Fort Ord land for a fraction of its
> > > > > market valuehttp://www.mercurynews.com/ci_10703310?source=most_emailed
> > > > > MONTEREY -- An Arizona businessman, with help from Sen. John McCain's
> > > > > office, paid the federal government a mere fraction of the market
> > > > > value when he bought a Fort Ord land parcel in 1999, an Army appraisal
> > > > > obtained by The Monterey Herald shows.
>
> > > > > Donald R. Diamond, an 80-year-old real estate developer, lobbyist and
> > > > > top fundraiser for McCain's presidential campaign, bought the land for
> > > > > $250,000, though it was valued at $7.2 million, according to Pentagon
> > > > > appraisals made three years before the sale.
>
> > > > > He held on to the parcel for a little more than two years before
> > > > > selling it and the buildings on it for an estimated profit of more
> > > > > than $18 million.
>
> > > > > When negotiating with the Army over the no-bid sale, Diamond had more
> > > > > than one advantage on other potential buyers. He held a lease on the
> > > > > land that would have made it difficult for the Army to find another
> > > > > buyer. When Rep. Sam Farr, D-Carmel, later criticized the Army for
> > > > > "giving away" Fort Ord land during the 1990s, Deputy Assistant
> > > > > Secretary of the Army Paul "PJ" Johnson said, "That was a very
> > > > > complicated realignment and closure at Ford Ord." Johnson retired
> > > > > later that month.
>
> > > > > But it was McCain's office, as reported earlier this year by The New
> > > > > York Times and The Monterey Herald, that Diamond credited with helping
>

Re: GOP Attacks on American Voters Turn Desperate, Ugly and Dangerous

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

then why haven't you done so ?

On Oct 14, 4:08 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Yep.
>
> On Oct 14, 12:46 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > should mccain and palin be held to the same standard ?
>
> > On Oct 13, 3:39 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > On Oct 13, 12:26 pm, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > What you,
> > > > and others, are doing is simply attempting to attach Sen. Obama's name
> > > > to a negative in any fashion that you can.
>
> > > If it is "negative" to point out his Political and Personal
> > > relationships with many people over his "career", how do we get to
> > > Judge the Man's Character and Judgement before we decide if he should
> > > be President?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
Thanks for being part of "PoliticalForum" at Google Groups.
For options & help see http://groups.google.com/group/PoliticalForum

* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
* It's active and moderated. Register and vote in our polls. 
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Re: Dear ACLU Supporter, Help put an end to out-of-control government eavesdropping.

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

free trade with regulations not free trade at all costs as the new
breed of republicans believe

On Oct 13, 8:26 am, "\"Lone Wolf\"" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Obama is an advocate of free trade. Obama receives more money from
> Wall St moguels than McCain. He is a corporate prostitute just like
> the rest
> The idea that out of two parties you get to choose from that one is
> good and one is bad is absurd.
>
> American capitalism is finished. The subprime crisis is only one
> quarter of the way through.
>
> On Oct 13, 6:25 pm, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > only if you vote for a free trade at all costs republican !
>
> > On Oct 12, 5:48 pm, "\"Lone Wolf\"" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > Whoever you votr for is a vote against the people of America
>
> > > On Oct 12, 10:32 pm, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > vote for America vote against mccain !
>
> > > > On Oct 12, 6:34 am, "\"Lone Wolf\"" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > If you believe in freedom and equality for all oppose impotent
> > > > > liberalism
>
> > > > > On Oct 12, 9:10 pm, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > if you believe in the constitution and civil liberties for all 
> > > > > > support
> > > > > > the ACLU .
>
> > > > > > On Oct 12, 6:02 am, "\"Lone Wolf\"" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > They have however declared war on political consciousness, by
> > > > > > > encouraging the idea that impotent petty-bougeois law and its
> > > > > > > philistine psuedo intellectuals (who own their own status in 
> > > > > > > society
> > > > > > > to maintaing this fraud) representitives are going to use the laws
> > > > > > > written by the ruling class to supress the working class is a way 
> > > > > > > of
> > > > > > > stopping illegal wire tapping. They have passed the law, it is now
> > > > > > > legal. Instead of fighting the disease you run around putting
> > > > > > > thousands of baindaids on its symptoms, while the disease spreads 
> > > > > > > even
> > > > > > > more virulntley right under your nose.
>
> > > > > > > "Your very ideas are but the outgrowth of the conditions of your
> > > > > > > bourgeois production and bourgeois property, just as your
> > > > > > > jurisprudence is but the will of your class made into a law for 
> > > > > > > all, a
> > > > > > > will whose essential character and direction are determined by the
> > > > > > > economical conditions of existence of your class."
> > > > > > > Karl Marx
>
> > > > > > > On Oct 12, 6:46 pm, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > > > the ACLU did not in  any way declare war on Christianity except 
> > > > > > > > in
> > > > > > > > your fevered imagination ! and if you are against protecting the
> > > > > > > > constitution just come out and say so .
>
> > > > > > > > On Oct 11, 1:07 pm, Cold Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > > This is true in theory Marge but the ACLU decided to declare 
> > > > > > > > > war on
> > > > > > > > > Christianity and made many people suspicious of their true 
> > > > > > > > > objective.
> > > > > > > > > "Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; 
> > > > > > > > > in its worst
> > > > > > > > > state, an intolerable one."  The most important function of 
> > > > > > > > > the necessary
> > > > > > > > > evil is to protect it's citizens.
>
> > > > > > > > > - Original Message -
> > > > > > > > > From: "margareth" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >

Re: The Terrorist Barack Hussein Obama

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

okay i would have bet money you were one of the ones claiming he
attended a radical Muslim school and was there for a Muslim . but i
will take you at your word that it wasn't you .

On Oct 14, 4:06 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I have never claimed he was Muslim...
>
> On Oct 14, 12:16 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Wright was his Religious mentor, who Married he and his Wife and
> > Baptised their Children.
> > lets see  you claim Obama is a secret Muslim and a baptist ! a little
> > confused aren't you ?
>
> > On Oct 13, 4:07 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > On Oct 13, 6:11 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > You have a rather loose definition of the word "friends".
>
> > > Yes he does...
>
> > > Obama was MORE than friends with many of them, by his OWN admission.
>
> > > Wright was his Religious mentor, who Married he and his Wife and
> > > Baptised their Children.
>
> > > He began his Political Career in Ayer's Living Room.  Not something
> > > you do for a stranger...
>
> > > Shall I go on?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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Re: GOP Attacks on American Voters Turn Desperate, Ugly and Dangerous

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

should mccain and palin be held to the same standard ?

On Oct 13, 3:39 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Oct 13, 12:26 pm, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > What you,
> > and others, are doing is simply attempting to attach Sen. Obama's name
> > to a negative in any fashion that you can.
>
> If it is "negative" to point out his Political and Personal
> relationships with many people over his "career", how do we get to
> Judge the Man's Character and Judgement before we decide if he should
> be President?
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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Re: Make sure McCain explains his record on birth control at the last presidential debate.

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

mark has a hard time dealing with facts they make his head spin around
and pea soup spew out of his mouth !

On Oct 13, 8:54 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> mark,
>
> Wait a minute here, isn't the dictionary the book that tells you the
> meaning of words? Looking in the dictionary is how everyone determines
> what a fucking word means nitwit. it IS proof as to what a given word
> means.
>
> On Oct 12, 7:21 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > murky keeps spewing his crap and the only proof he provides is the
> > dictionary.  he is just a typical lib who enjoys torturing and
> > murdering the helpless.  they are afraid to stand up to those who can
> > fend for themselves, so they must prey on the weak.
>
> > On Oct 12, 5:14 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > OH boy its the garr must have the last word game . okay your turn fish
> > > boy !
>
> > > On Oct 12, 5:01 am, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > On Oct 12, 12:25 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > you can not murder what isn't alive sunshine !
>
> > > > You keep telling yourself that...
>
> > > > Seems the only one you are trying to convince is yourself.- Hide quoted 
> > > > text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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-~--~~~~--~~--~--~---

Re: The Terrorist Barack Hussein Obama

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

Wright was his Religious mentor, who Married he and his Wife and
Baptised their Children.
lets see  you claim Obama is a secret Muslim and a baptist ! a little
confused aren't you ?



On Oct 13, 4:07 pm, Gaar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Oct 13, 6:11 am, Hollywood <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > You have a rather loose definition of the word "friends".
>
> Yes he does...
>
> Obama was MORE than friends with many of them, by his OWN admission.
>
> Wright was his Religious mentor, who Married he and his Wife and
> Baptised their Children.
>
> He began his Political Career in Ayer's Living Room.  Not something
> you do for a stranger...
>
> Shall I go on?
--~--~-~--~~~---~--~~
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* Visit our other community at http://www.PoliticalForum.com/  
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* Read the latest breaking news, and more.
-~--~~~~--~~--~--~---

Re: GOP Attacks on American Voters Turn Desperate, Ugly and Dangerous

[[ the last patriotic Republican ]]

post any links or proof you have that ACORN is part of the DNC

On Oct 13, 6:46 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> yes murky they are.  and nobama has his fingerprints all over acorn.
>
> On Oct 13, 3:23 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
>
>
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > you think ACORN is a part of the DNC ?
>
> > On Oct 12, 8:19 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > ACORN you stupid fuck.
>
> > > On Oct 12, 7:30 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > dem operation ? what in the fuck are you talking about sunshime ?
>
> > > > On Oct 12, 7:00 am, mark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > > > > considering the dem operation acorn is under investigation in half the
> > > > > states for illegal activities, someone needs to make attempts to
> > > > > ensure a fair election.
>
> > > > > On Oct 12, 5:47 am, "[ the last  patriotic Republican  ]"
>
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > > > GOP Attacks on American Voters Turn Desperate, Ugly and Dangerous
> > > > > >  http://www.truthout.org/101108B
> > > > > > The GOP assault on American voters has hit full stride as the 
> > > > > > economy
> > > > > > and John McCain tank in synch.
>
> > > > > >     With just over three weeks until election day, the Republicans
> > > > > > have mounted an all-out attack against newly registered voters and 
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > organizations working to sign them up. As many as 75% of these new
> > > > > > voters are expected to vote Democratic, but the attacks have also
> > > > > > spread to long-established voters as well. Recent calculations show
> > > > > > more than a million more newly registered Democrats in Ohio than
> > > > > > Republicans.
>
> > > > > >     The usual drumbeat claiming massive voter fraud has become
> > > > > > ceaseless at Fox "News" and other right wing media mouthpieces.
>
> > > > > >     As expected, the assault centers in Ohio, which once again could
> > > > > > decide the presidency, but has manifested throughout the nation:
>
> > > > > >     1) A Republican sheriff in Greene County, Ohio, has demanded
> > > > > > social security and other records from 302 local voters whose 
> > > > > > ballots
> > > > > > he apparently wants to negate. Sheriff Gene Fischer has requested
> > > > > > registration cards and address forms for all Greene County residents
> > > > > > who voted in a special session established in Ohio allowing new 
> > > > > > voters
> > > > > > to register and vote on the same day. The process was challenged in
> > > > > > court by the GOP. The Ohio Supreme Court turned down that challenge,
> > > > > > and allowed the same-day voting to proceed. But now Fischer claims
> > > > > > telephone calls complaining about the potential for voter fraud have
> > > > > > prompted him to go after the information.
>
> > > > > >     In Franklin County, home of Ohio State University, Columbus 
> > > > > > State
> > > > > > Community College, Capital University, Ohio Dominican University, 
> > > > > > and
> > > > > > Otterbein College, election protection observers are reporting
> > > > > > continuing surveillance by Republicans at Veterans Memorial, the 
> > > > > > site
> > > > > > for early voting. The observers have documented Republican 
> > > > > > operatives
> > > > > > taking photographs and writing down license plate numbers of voters.
> > > > > > Election activists expect similar criminal charges as in Greene 
> > > > > > County
> > > > > > to be filed in the state's capital.
>
> > > > > >     Greene County is home to Wright State, Central State, 
> > > > > > Wilberforce
> > > > > > and Cedarville Universities, along with Antioch College, which was
> > > > > > recently put out of business by a right-wing putsch on its board of
> > > > > > directors.
>
> > > > > >     Llyn McCoy,