Re(3): Need help finding features/functions
On 11/24/03 1:38 AM tass wrote: >Yes, of course I put in my own returns. That's proper typing; >whether on paper, in a computer window, or so it might be printed >at the other end. To do otherwise is, I'm sorry to say, a laziness >induced by word processing programs that do the job for you, if >you let it. But it had never made it proper. Yes, putting in your own returns was proper on a typewriter; you couldn't do it any other way. I am old enough to remember those days. You might have to retype a whole page, or even several pages, in order to add a comma or change a word. I'd like to have 10 cents for every minute I spent figuring out how to make a correction that would avoid all that -- I could buy my wife and myself a fine dinner! I call it "efficiency," not "laziness." In a way, I suppose word processing programs have made us lazy. Corrections are so easy now, I don't think through my wording as carefully as I once had to. I wore out a lot of pencils making drafts back then. Len -- Leonard Morgenstern [EMAIL PROTECTED] People like me like me. --An example of why direct computer translation won't ever work.
Re(3): Need help finding features/functions
On 11/23/03, Marlyse Comte wrote: >I think this is the exact point which hasn't fully been understood yet by >the original poster - I believe he thinks that if it looks nice on HIS >computer, it will arrive the same at some other computer. >---marlyse OK, it's obviously time to let this thing drop. I keep having to repeat myself in order to try to get a few people to finally hear what is being said. One said that "I'm" not listening? And it's obvious that there is a consistent assumption that I must be new to this whole "email" thing with some pie-in-the-sky expectations. So just to "wrap" up and close out the conversation (hopefully), The first computer I ever used was a "IIe" way back in 83. I got my hands of one of the first colour macs in our town in around (what?) 86 or so. Then had a long break from computers. Got my first Windows machine in 94, started using Netscape for email around 95, switched to Calypso in 97 after trying Eudora and a few others, Checked out ThBat, PocoMail, and a few others around 99, kept close watch on the (ehem) "fun" my clients were having with Outlook and Outlook Express, on and on... The only thing about this entire experience over the past 9 years or so that came new to me was finding an email app that DIDN'T allow me to send messages wrapped where I deemed best, and this ancient suggestion, not a protocol, not a rule, not a law, a suggestion. So I asked an innocent question about why this basic function was not present in PM as it is in most EVERY other email program I've tried. Michael seems maybe of too literal a mind to get where I tried to use either humour or simple, obvious exaggeration to make a point. Sorry. (Not being critical, just an observation.) I'm a very "visual" person and metaphors come to me easily. It usually works most times. And his replies did seem to sound as if they had a twinge of sting in them. That's why his and another's posts were seeming a tad bit antagonistic. Mine might have been taken that way by them, as well. If so, my apologies. Never my intention at any turn in my life. I like fun, smiles, and laughs. The rest is for beginners!:-) As for silly "original poster" not getting the point; I got it. I got it years ago, MANY years ago. So I'll say it one last time, I do see my mail at the other end in so many cases. I do see it when it comes back quoted. I have seen the full gamut of possibilities. I'm more than well aware of that which I speak for I am NOT a lone voice in a crowd. I'm coming to you FROM the actual crowd. At the character length I'm speaking of, I'd say 9 out of 10 times it looks exactly there, as it did here (aside from them having set different fonts or slightly different font size on their app). It has worked fine this way for over 9 years - just the same as everyone else, a few obvious exceptions noted. As for freedom being "selfish", well, idealism is a wonderful thing. But reality is what we actually have. And every act, no matter how much it may appear, or we'd like to convince ourselves it is, altruistic, the fact is there's no such thing. Every act we make is, by definition, selfish. How that word got such a bad connotation I'll never understand. It's not really "good" either. It's just reality. I'll close now. I thank you all for your help with some things, your listening to others. And for your thoughts and opinions as well. I appreciate even those that I don't agree with for all ideas are worthy. Again, sorry for the "tempest in a teapot". Be well, be happy, have fun, ht
Re(3): Need help finding features/functions
ahhh! the quiet observer found where this hole commotion stems from! >>Ok, here is something that I'm not getting in the whole "email >>composition" argument. And I'm not meaning to criticize anything, I'm >>just seeking clarification. Are you manually entering line-feeds in your >>paragraphs? > >Absolutely. To do otherwise either relies on the program to break the >line as you type, or for you to set the window width at exactly the >point at which it will be broken when it gets sent. this is the exact point where you ARE getting fooled: obviously you are typing your lines longer than the standard internet protocol and then entering a HARD RETURN and thus your emails arrive not nicely wrapped. Other than for example in QuarkXpress and/or InDesign - both design programs for PRINT, here in the world of the internet there exists no other type of returns in email than hard returns. Powermail basically doesn't wrap at all on out-going mail - you open or close the window width how it is comfortable for you to read and the servers then wrap the lines to the internet standard. >And I've never minded typing in my own RETURN. In fact, that's exactly >how I need it to be. I do know how to type, and to format a proper letter. If you do type a letter, you are used to the fact that paper size is what it is and that you can not endlessly type but you have to hit return within these boundaries. As PM allowes you to widen or tighten the width of the window, one can loose sight of what would be such a boundary and in fact that there ARE such boundaries, even if invisible. If you can get the concept of the standard internet type wrapping as the 'format of the paper' you might better understand what happens if you type longer lines before hitting return. On mechanical typewriters you could easily do that and you'd just continue typing not onto paper but onto the cylinder. In email exchange the 'overwritten' text does not get lost but put onto the next line. Basically, if you INSIST on wanting to use your own hard returns PLUS you want the receiver to get the emails in a pleasing manner, you truly should widen the email window to the width of the standard width and then make sure your returns lie within that width. That then is not silly but rather like you yourself making sure you are not writing over the edge of your letter. ---marlyse
Re(3): Need help finding features/functions
I think this is the exact point which hasn't fully been understood yet by the original poster - I believe he thinks that if it looks nice on HIS computer, it will arrive the same at some other computer. But this is not the case, exactly as Tim and others have tried to explain. Just because other mail programs fool you into believing you've wrapped something into something you like - and that is how it will look when arriving on all other email clients in the world - does not mean that PM is lacking; I'd rather say that PM is just more 'honest' here in the sense of not putting a fake eye candy ability into their interface. ---marlyse --- former message(s) quotes: >On Sat, Nov 22, 2003 at 10:19 am -0700, tass wrote: > >>As I mentioned earlier, this is my VERY first experience with NOT being able >>to decide how MY letter should look/read. And being used to that kind of >>basic freedom, it is not only annoying, it looks stupid at the other end and >>makes the writer look like an idiot - like they never even learned how to >>formulate a letter. Not to mention breaking links making that function of >>email useless. > >Well, as Wayne explained, it doesn't matter how nicely you format your >email, you have no control over what various servers will do to it on its >travels. (In fact, one of your recent posts to this list was obviously >set to something like 120 chars, and arrived here broken into alternating >short/long lines.)
