Re: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all
Can't recall exactly, but there was a URL someone submitted recently (either here or on VFUG) that noted the dismal sales of Vista in China, and how much $$ M$ spent there (and basically didn't get the returnyet). To augment, I bought them because I could afford it, not... well...Why didn't Vi$ta have a 64-bit driver for Realtek 8029AS but Linux does? -- .~.http://changmw.homeip.net / v \ May the Force and Farce be with you! Linux 2.6.20.7 /( _ )\ (Ubuntu 6.10) 21:28:01 up 5 days 2:14 ^ ^0 users load average: 1.00 1.00 1.00 news://news.3home.net news://news.hkpcug.org news://news.newsgroup.com.hk ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all
Definitely a promising sign. http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=39087 Hope is never lost. Why didn't you believe so? :) On the other hand, seems that I wasted money buying 2 copies of Vi$ta Ultimate upgrade ... :) -- .~.http://changmw.homeip.net / v \ May the Force and Farce be with you! Linux 2.6.20.7 /( _ )\ (Ubuntu 6.10) 20:28:01 up 4 days 1:14 ^ ^0 users load average: 0.03 0.51 0.79 news://news.3home.net news://news.hkpcug.org news://news.newsgroup.com.hk ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all
Man-wai CHANG wrote: Definitely a promising sign. http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=39087 Hope is never lost. Why didn't you believe so? :) On the other hand, seems that I wasted money buying 2 copies of Vi$ta Ultimate upgrade ... :) You're in China, aren't you? Seems you must have been one of the 244 who did spend the money on a legitimate license. gdr -- Michael J. Babcock, MCP MB Software Solutions, LLC http://mbsoftwaresolutions.com http://fabmate.com Work smarter, not harder, with MBSS custom software solutions! ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all
On the other hand, seems that I wasted money buying 2 copies of Vi$ta Ultimate upgrade ... :) I don't know about wasted money for Vista. Even though I have advised my clients to hold off on any Vista upgrades (if they are running 2000 or XP there is no technical need to migrate anyway IMHO), and to resist getting new PCs if they are provided with Vista (opting for XP). Yet I went ahead and installed Vista Ultimate (MSDN) on a dual boot PC, just to get a flavor for its antics. Before that I turned my intern (Mike Wohlrab, who posts to ProFox once in a while) loose on the beta version to help identify the hidden rocks in shallow water for me. I am not at all impressed with Vista, but the reality is I have to be prepared to deal with it, as eventually I will come across a client has to deal with it. Sure, My Vista Ultimate license was free (no additional cost) with my MSDN subscription. But it still took me otherwise billable time to set it up, and work through its quirks (that is an ongoing process). So, in considering how much potential income I gave up it still cost me a substantial amount of investment. I would be all the more irritated had I invested a separate amount for a Vista license - but I would have felt it was worth it to get a feel for it in anticipation of client calls and issues. Gil -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Man-wai CHANG Sent: Monday, April 23, 2007 8:30 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all Definitely a promising sign. http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=39087 Hope is never lost. Why didn't you believe so? :) On the other hand, seems that I wasted money buying 2 copies of Vi$ta Ultimate upgrade ... :) -- .~.http://changmw.homeip.net / v \ May the Force and Farce be with you! Linux 2.6.20.7 /( _ )\ (Ubuntu 6.10) 20:28:01 up 4 days 1:14 ^ ^0 users load average: 0.03 0.51 0.79 news://news.3home.net news://news.hkpcug.org news://news.newsgroup.com.hk [excessive quoting removed by server] ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all
He probably just dug up the rant he had when XP came out, and did a search and replace with Vista. ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Alan Bourke Sent: Monday, April 23, 2007 6:17 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all He probably just dug up the rant he had when XP came out, and did a search and replace with Vista. I remember the XP situation well. I am self-employed and XP required I upgrade my equipment just to run. XP itself was *really* an upgrade to NT and W95. My customers upgraded to XP so I had no choice but to upgrade my equipment. Hardware was more expensive at the time, the software was relatively more expensive and I had to re-write my applications. This time, my customers are holding off and I have not heard even a whisper of their plans. I had to upgrade my network, memory and video card to run Vista and my performance index is a 2.0! Although changes are not as significant as XP, I need to rewrite portions of my application to run properly. This time the upgrade yields eye popping graphics (literally), the UAC and WGA. Seems like a repeat to me too. ;^) Jeff Jeff Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 623-582-0323 Fax 623-869-0675 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/signed text/plain (text body -- kept) application/x-pkcs7-signature --- ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all
Jeff Johnson wrote: XP itself was *really* an upgrade to NT and W95. And Windows 2000/NT Workstation ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all
You're in China, aren't you? Seems you must have been one of the 244 who did spend the money on a legitimate license. gdr Sold only 244 copies only in China? Yes, if Hong Kong S.A.R./colony is included in the definition of China in this context. Wait... you talking about a full version or an upgrade? I bought 2 Ultimate upgrade. :) -- .~.http://changmw.homeip.net / v \ May the Force and Farce be with you! Linux 2.6.20.7 /( _ )\ (Ubuntu 6.10) 22:11:01 up 4 days 2:57 ^ ^0 users load average: 1.10 1.03 0.92 news://news.3home.net news://news.hkpcug.org news://news.newsgroup.com.hk ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all
Man-wai CHANG wrote: You're in China, aren't you? Seems you must have been one of the 244 who did spend the money on a legitimate license. gdr Sold only 244 copies only in China? Yes, if Hong Kong S.A.R./colony is included in the definition of China in this context. Wait... you talking about a full version or an upgrade? I bought 2 Ultimate upgrade. :) Can't recall exactly, but there was a URL someone submitted recently (either here or on VFUG) that noted the dismal sales of Vista in China, and how much $$ M$ spent there (and basically didn't get the returnyet). -- Michael J. Babcock, MCP MB Software Solutions, LLC http://mbsoftwaresolutions.com http://fabmate.com Work smarter, not harder, with MBSS custom software solutions! ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Alan Bourke Sent: Monday, April 23, 2007 7:01 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all Jeff Johnson wrote: I had to upgrade my network, memory and video card to run Vista and my performance index is a 2.0! You don't *have* to run Vista with all the eye candy turned on, it has to run on servers and through remote desktop sessions remember, so it can look like Windows 2000 just as easily. Or various levels between that and the full Aero Glass. By upgrading your memory I assume you mean putting more in? Do you mean you had to change your network card because there were no drivers? Alan: I originally had 512mb and I added 1g. A driver for my onboard network card was not available and had to purchase one. Jeff Jeff Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 623-582-0323 Fax 623-869-0675 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/signed text/plain (text body -- kept) application/x-pkcs7-signature --- ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all
Jeff Johnson wrote: Alan: I originally had 512mb and I added 1g. A driver for my onboard network card was not available and had to purchase one. Hmm - the driver situation does seem to be a bit of a disaster at the minute. I think the bulk of businesses and savvy users will wait six months or for an SP1. ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Alan Bourke Sent: Monday, April 23, 2007 8:32 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all Jeff Johnson wrote: Alan: I originally had 512mb and I added 1g. A driver for my onboard network card was not available and had to purchase one. Hmm - the driver situation does seem to be a bit of a disaster at the minute. I think the bulk of businesses and savvy users will wait six months or for an SP1. Alan: These are minor issues for me (although we are locked in with our laptops that have built in network cards, etc.), these are major concerns with the major corps that I work with that have anywhere from 5 to 30 thousand PC's running XP. Another more significant issue I have noticed is the total change in interface. XP moved some things around and that ruffled a lot of feathers. If I was the one ruffling the feathers, I would have tried to prevent it in the future. We have had customers call asking why they can't get a secure website using IE7. We have to tell them the lock is on the top of the page now and not the bottom. What about find? I know a software house that hired someone to train them on how to use Office 2007. While the hardware and interface issues are no problem for people like us, the offer bigger challenges to the people we are developing applications for. Of course, this is my opinion and I may be alone in this; because I have a hard time getting in and out of a rental car that puts the window and door lock controls on the center console. Jeff Jeff Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 623-582-0323 Fax 623-869-0675 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/signed text/plain (text body -- kept) application/x-pkcs7-signature --- ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all
I am self-employed and XP required I upgrade my equipment just to run Oh yeah, as a direct result of having to deal with the Vista issue I ended up upgrading all my PCs to 2Gb RAM. For the dual boot Win2k/Vista PC it was for Vista, although it helps with Win2k a bit also (ran just fine with 1Gb RAM). For the other PCs it was so I could run Virtual PC 2007 on the XP Pro PCs for Vista as a Guest OS, allocating 1Gb to a Vista VPC session. Luckily I already had some decent video cards (dual port for my dual monitor setups), so that did not require a reinvestment. I am also being self-employed, and the RAM upgrades were a dead cost out of my pocket just to make certain I would not get caught with my pants all the way down with Vista's impact on my software (recompiled in VFP9 with SET ENGINEBEHAVIOR 70 just fine, other than recent, mystery LAN/Server permission issues), and Vista behavior in general. Michael (my intern) is still chuckling at how much I spent to boost all my PCs from 1Gb to 2Gb RAM. Just wait until he sees what I have to do with my Dell SC430/SC430 Servers next... 4Gb RAM, one is going to be outfitted with Linux Server and VMWare to run a guest Windows OS. Another one is going to take on all the load currently split between 2 of the Servers. Got to get my head around that stuff at some point. May as well be now, eh? Yep, any time M$ comes out with a new OS I pay, and I pay and I pay, despite the MDSN providing me the new OS at no additional charge unto itself. With Win2000 it was well worth it. With XP it was questionable until it stabilized and became popular, then it was worth it. With Vista, it just flat out is not worth it, it is a waste in fact. Where's the beef? Man cannot live by Eye Candy alone! Gil -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Jeff Johnson Sent: Monday, April 23, 2007 10:03 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Alan Bourke Sent: Monday, April 23, 2007 6:17 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all He probably just dug up the rant he had when XP came out, and did a search and replace with Vista. I remember the XP situation well. I am self-employed and XP required I upgrade my equipment just to run. XP itself was *really* an upgrade to NT and W95. My customers upgraded to XP so I had no choice but to upgrade my equipment. Hardware was more expensive at the time, the software was relatively more expensive and I had to re-write my applications. This time, my customers are holding off and I have not heard even a whisper of their plans. I had to upgrade my network, memory and video card to run Vista and my performance index is a 2.0! Although changes are not as significant as XP, I need to rewrite portions of my application to run properly. This time the upgrade yields eye popping graphics (literally), the UAC and WGA. Seems like a repeat to me too. ;^) Jeff Jeff Johnson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 623-582-0323 Fax 623-869-0675 --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/signed text/plain (text body -- kept) application/x-pkcs7-signature --- [excessive quoting removed by server] ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all
I will try my best to keep my clients on XP for as long as possible. ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Re: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all
Jeff Johnson wrote: While the hardware and interface issues are no problem for people like us, the offer bigger challenges to the people we are developing applications for. I suppose after a couple of hours I can find most things in Vista, it seems to largely be a different interface in front of the same dialogs that XP has. But yes, I do this for a living. ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
RE: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all
I will try my best to keep my clients on XP for as long as possible. Oh yeah? I am going to keep my clients running on Win2k on that as long as possible. Not as many now as PCs are being replaced, but it is still a strong enough OS, with a lighter-than-XP footprint, to keep in service. But, with the proper updates, and adequate RAM (512Mg minimum) XP ain't all that bad either. Ditto Server 2000 2003. Gil -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Michael Madigan Sent: Monday, April 23, 2007 12:23 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [NF] Maybe there is hope for the computer industry after all I will try my best to keep my clients on XP for as long as possible. [excessive quoting removed by server] ___ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/[EMAIL PROTECTED] ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
