[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Mahmud Al Hasan]

Mahmud Al Hasan  added the comment:

Thanks to Steve Dower the problem is solved!

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Steve Dower]

Steve Dower  added the comment:

The attached files should work on Python 3.4. Feel free to use them.

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Serhiy Storchaka]

Serhiy Storchaka  added the comment:

Does the problem still exist on Python 3.6? Python 3.4 is now in security fixes 
only mode. The only solution for you may be upgrading to Python 3.6.

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Mark Lawrence]

Change by Mark Lawrence :


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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Mahmud Al Hasan]

Mahmud Al Hasan  added the comment:

The problem still exists on python 3.4 and I need to use this version.
Any solution?

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versions:  -Python 2.7, Python 3.5, Python 3.6

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Marc-Andre Lemburg]

Marc-Andre Lemburg added the comment:

On 23.09.2015 02:33, Steve Dower wrote:
> 
> Done.

Thanks.

> As this is (meant to be) a purely informational/diagnostic module, seems like 
> a good idea to fix every version we're supporting in any way.

Yep, that's the intention behind the platform module.

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Roundup Robot]

Roundup Robot added the comment:

New changeset fa869ccf9368 by Steve Dower in branch '3.5':
Issue #19143: platform module now reads Windows version from kernel32.dll to 
avoid compatibility shims.
https://hg.python.org/cpython/rev/fa869ccf9368

New changeset 2f55d73e5ad6 by Steve Dower in branch 'default':
Issue #19143: platform module now reads Windows version from kernel32.dll to 
avoid compatibility shims.
https://hg.python.org/cpython/rev/2f55d73e5ad6

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Roundup Robot]

Roundup Robot added the comment:

New changeset d8453733cc0c by Steve Dower in branch '2.7':
Issue #19143: platform module now reads Windows version from kernel32.dll to 
avoid compatibility shims.
https://hg.python.org/cpython/rev/d8453733cc0c

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Roundup Robot]

Roundup Robot added the comment:

New changeset 2f57270374f7 by Steve Dower in branch '3.4':
Issue #19143: platform module now reads Windows version from kernel32.dll to 
avoid compatibility shims.
https://hg.python.org/cpython/rev/2f57270374f7

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Steve Dower]

Steve Dower added the comment:

Done. As this is (meant to be) a purely informational/diagnostic module, seems 
like a good idea to fix every version we're supporting in any way.

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assignee:  -> steve.dower
resolution:  -> fixed
stage:  -> resolved
status: open -> closed
type:  -> behavior
versions: +Python 3.6

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Marc-Andre Lemburg]

Marc-Andre Lemburg added the comment:

Steve: Could you please merge your changes into platform.py ?

I think it should go into Python 2.7.

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Steve Dower]

Steve Dower added the comment:

The newer attachment should handle back to Windows 2000. Unfortunately, I have 
no machines to test this on, but all of the API calls existed at least on XP 
and the version numbers are correct.

It runs correctly back to Python 2.7, works on 2.6 but gives the wrong result 
(possibly a ctypes bug?), and is fine on Python 3.

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Added file: http://bugs.python.org/file38102/win32_ver.py

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Marc-Andre Lemburg]

Marc-Andre Lemburg added the comment:

On 09.02.2015 16:17, Steve Dower wrote:
 
 Steve Dower added the comment:
 
 Including the one shipped in the stdlib? Python 3.5 no longer supports XP.

We normally have the platform.py module support multiple Python
versions (at least that's how we did this in Python 2). The reason
is that we'd like to make it possible to easily backport the module
to earlier versions.

This has generally not been a major problem, so if possible,
let's keep it that way for Python 3 as well.

Thanks,
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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Steve Dower]

Steve Dower added the comment:

Including the one shipped in the stdlib? Python 3.5 no longer supports XP.

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Steve Dower]

Steve Dower added the comment:

@Marc-Andre: Okay, I'll make it easier to backport. You're listed as maintainer 
- would you like me to post updates here and let you merge them in?

@Mark - yep, I'm aware of that. That's how I know that 3.5 doesn't support XP 
anymore :) (I think we're even past the 3 years on keeping old project files 
around for VS 2008, which is good since they're already gone from tip.)

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Mark Lawrence]

Mark Lawrence added the comment:

@Steve just in case you didn't know the rules are given here 
https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0011/#microsoft-windows.  I find it a 
nuisance that you have to follow an external link to get the status of Python, 
but maybe it's the lesser of two evils?  An aside, at some point the fourth 
paragraph will need changing to reflect that VS 2015 and later versions will be 
maintaining backward compatibility.

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Steve Dower]

Steve Dower added the comment:

(Was reminded about this by #23417)

Any word on the back compat issues in platform.py? Can we make the version in 
3.5 only work with Vista+, or do I need to handle XP in case someone takes the 
file onto an earlier Python version?

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Marc-Andre Lemburg]

Marc-Andre Lemburg added the comment:

On 09.02.2015 15:14, Steve Dower wrote:
 
 Steve Dower added the comment:
 
 (Was reminded about this by #23417)
 
 Any word on the back compat issues in platform.py? Can we make the version in 
 3.5 only work with Vista+, or do I need to handle XP in case someone takes 
 the file onto an earlier Python version?

platform.py has to work on as many platforms as possible (by design),
so as long as Python still runs on Windows XP, we cannot leave that
version behind.

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[eryksun]

eryksun added the comment:

 if (not version.GetFileVersionInfoW(name, None, size, ver_block) or
not ver_block):

Arrays don't implement __bool__ and have fixed __len__, so ver_block is always 
True. You could look at ver_block[0] or ver_block.value (i.e. the C string 
value).

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Steve Dower]

Steve Dower added the comment:

Thanks for the feedback. Updated the attachment with some other tidying too.

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Added file: http://bugs.python.org/file37586/win32_ver.py

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Steve Dower]

Changes by Steve Dower steve.do...@microsoft.com:


Removed file: http://bugs.python.org/file37578/win32_ver.py

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Steve Dower]

Steve Dower added the comment:

I've attached a replacement for the win32_ver function in platform.py that will 
get the actual version number from kernel32.dll's resources. Originally I was 
just writing a helper function, but it seemed easy enough to replace the entire 
function.

The attached function only really supports Python 3.5 as it assumes that the 
earliest Windows version will be Vista (6.0). The comments in platform.py 
suggest backwards compatibility is important for this file, so my win32_ver() 
may be a better reference for someone who wants to add this functionality in a 
backwards-compatible way. Though if it's okay for the stdlib platform.py to not 
support pre-3.5 this should be fine (and I'll do the extra work to make sure).

It's probably also easy to support 3.4 and Windows XP/WS2K3 as well, but I 
don't have any machines handy to test it.

As part of my patch for #23018, I'll add the manifest required so that 
GetVersionEx() will recognise 8.1 and 10.

--
versions: +Python 3.5 -Python 3.3
Added file: http://bugs.python.org/file37578/win32_ver.py

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[eryksun]

eryksun added the comment:

 actual_len = kernel32.GetModuleFileNameW(kernel32._handle, name, len(name))

A module handle is the module's base address. kernel32 is loaded at a 32-bit 
base address in a 64-bit process, but I don't know whether that will always be 
true in current and future versions. It's safer to use HANDLE(kernel32._handle) 
instead of the default C int conversion.

 ver_block = byref(c_buffer(size))

byref is unnecessary. An array gets passed as a pointer.

 maj = int(pvi.contents.dwProductVersionMS  16)
 min = int(pvi.contents.dwProductVersionMS  0x)
 build = int(pvi.contents.dwProductVersionLS  16)

pvi.contents.dwProductVersionMS is already an int, else the bitshift would fail.

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Marc-Andre Lemburg]

Marc-Andre Lemburg added the comment:

I don't have a Windows 8.1 handy, but if ver reports the correct version, why 
not have platform.win32_ver() use _syscmd_ver() in case the other APIs report 
6.2.9200 and then have win32_ver() the higher version ?!

FWIW: I don't think we should add anything to the python.exe manifest to have 
it report the correct version. This could potentially break other APIs. AFAIK, 
MS just used this trick to prevent having existing 8.0 applications fail on 
8.1 due to the minor version bump. I suppose they'll undo this with the next 
official Windows release.

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Steve Dower]

Steve Dower added the comment:

The two 'correct' options are adding the manifest or doing nothing (based on a 
number of very passionate internal discussions I was able to dig up).

Without the manifest, various APIs may behave differently - it's the new way 
that Windows decides whether to apply compatibility settings. If 
sys.getwindowsversion() reports the actual version number and people are 
getting old APIs through ctypes, more problems are caused than solved. The 
theory is that if you apply the manifest, you are stating that you have tested 
the application against that version (helped by having an unpredictable scheme 
without supersets).

Without the manifest, Python is always going to be run in compatibility mode 
for Windows 8, even as breaking changes are made in the future.

It would be quite a reasonable position (compatibility-wise) for Python to only 
manifest for the earliest version it supported. That way, all Python scripts 
are going to behave the same on later versions of Windows, even as the API 
behaviours change. (Note that I'm not advocating this - I'm just trying to 
explain the rationale better than our docs have done it.)

But basically, the result of sys.getwindowsversion() should return the 
behaviour that the program is going to get. If python.exe itself is manifested 
to support Windows 8.1, or if it isn't, both the behaviour and the version will 
match. IMO, and the Windows dev's opinion, this is correct.


The one concession that the Windows dev is willing to make is for logging, in 
which case the version number should be read as a string from a standard DLL 
like kernel32.dll. This would be appropriate for platform.win32_ver(), but as 
discussed above, not for sys.getwindowsversion().

Reading the registry is not recommended - the argument is roughly GetVersionEx 
was being misused so we 'fixed' it, and when the registry starts being misused 
we'll 'fix' that too.

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Marc-Andre Lemburg]

Marc-Andre Lemburg added the comment:

On 10.06.2014 18:28, Steve Dower wrote:
 
 The one concession that the Windows dev is willing to make is for logging, in 
 which case the version number should be read as a string from a standard DLL 
 like kernel32.dll. This would be appropriate for platform.win32_ver(), but as 
 discussed above, not for sys.getwindowsversion().

So have platform.win32_ver() return the true version is acceptable ?

Note that the platform module is meant for identifying the platform,
not the runtime compatibility environment, so it has a slightly
different target audience.

Thanks,
-- 
Marc-Andre Lemburg
eGenix.com

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Steve Dower]

Steve Dower added the comment:

 So have platform.win32_ver() return the true version is acceptable ?

 Note that the platform module is meant for identifying the platform,
 not the runtime compatibility environment, so it has a slightly
 different target audience

Yes, and that's exactly the reason it's acceptable.

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[STINNER Victor]

Changes by STINNER Victor victor.stin...@gmail.com:


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title: Finding the Windows version getting messier - Finding the Windows 
version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier (detect windows 8.1?)

[Antoine Pitrou]

Changes by Antoine Pitrou pit...@free.fr:


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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier

[Zachary Ware]

Changes by Zachary Ware zachary.w...@gmail.com:


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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier

[Giampaolo Rodola']

Changes by Giampaolo Rodola' g.rod...@gmail.com:


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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier

[Serhiy Storchaka]

Changes by Serhiy Storchaka storch...@gmail.com:


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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier

[Jeremy Kloth]

Changes by Jeremy Kloth jeremy.kloth+python-trac...@gmail.com:


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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier

[Antoine Pitrou]

Changes by Antoine Pitrou pit...@free.fr:


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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier

[Tim Golden]

Tim Golden added the comment:

I was surprised that GetVersionEx would lie. But sure enough. Here:

http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/Forums/windowsdesktop/en-US/c471de52-611f-435d-ab44-56064e5fd7d5/windows-81-preview-getversionex-reports-629200

(Including a heartfelt comment by long-time Python developer Tim Roberts)

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier

[Tim Golden]

Tim Golden added the comment:

I've just installed a Win 8.1 VM and can (unsurprisingly) confirm the
report: The ver command shows 6.3.9600 while GetVersionEx and
consequently sys.getwindowsversion report 6.2.9200

We do use GetVersionEx in a few other places (timemodule.c,
unicodeobject.c, install.c) but they're limited to checking that we're
running at least XP or at least Vista which will continue work as such.

I'm not really sure what to propose: we could simply sit back and say
We're telling you what Windows tells us. It's unappealing, but I'm not
sure there's a clear alternative.

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier

[Tim Golden]

Tim Golden added the comment:

platform.platform  platform.uname are also affected although they already use 
ver-parsing in some circumstances so could presumably fallback to that 
approach here as well.

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier

[Antoine Pitrou]

Antoine Pitrou added the comment:

(One explanation is they did it for the enjoyment of non-Windows programmers)

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier

[Martin v . Löwis]

Martin v. Löwis added the comment:

tim.peters: looking at the implementation of the proposed annoying functions 
with names like IsWindows8Point1OrGreater, it turns out that they all go back 
to VerifyVersionInfoW, which is available since W2k (but still doesn't tell the 
actual version).

tim.golden: a work-around is documented in 

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/dn302074.aspx

Put

supportedOS Id={1f676c76-80e1-4239-95bb-83d0f6d0da78}/

into the manifest of python.exe, and it should report the correct version. Of 
course

a) this would fail for somebody embedding Python (unless they have that in 
their exe's manifest), and
b) we don't know the Id of upcoming windows versions, so the binaries produced 
today might still lie on future Windows releases.

It seems possible to query the compatibility using QueryActCtxW and 
CompatibilityInformationInActivationContext, but I couldn't find a way to put 
the compatibility into a new activation context (which would allow to claim 
compatibility dynamically).

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier

[Martin v . Löwis]

Martin v. Löwis added the comment:

According to

http://stackoverflow.com/questions/17399302/how-can-i-detect-windows-8-1-in-a-desktop-application

another strategy is to directly read the version out of the registry, from

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion
(values CurrentVersion, CurrentBuild)

Not sure where to get service pack information from, though.

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[issue19143] Finding the Windows version getting messier

[Tim Peters]

New submission from Tim Peters:

This question:

http://stackoverflow.com/questions/19128219/detect-windows-8-1-in-python

reports that Python is returning incorrect version info under Windows 8.1.

Alas, it appears MS is deprecating `GetVersionEx()`:


http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/ms724451(v=vs.85).aspx

and replacing it with a whole slew of annoying yes or no? functions:


http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/dn424972(v=vs.85).aspx

Heh ;-)

--
components: Interpreter Core, Windows
messages: 198814
nosy: tim.peters
priority: normal
severity: normal
status: open
title: Finding the Windows version getting messier
versions: Python 2.7, Python 3.3, Python 3.4

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