Re: Difference between CPython, Python for .NET and IronPython?
Claudio Grondi wrote: > I have asked similar 'question' some weeks ago in the German Python > newsgroup. > It seems, that that Pythonistas have generally not much interest in > IronPython waiting for at least release 2.0 of it which is _perhaps_ > expected to support Mono. My understanding is that Mono developers are trying to make each release of Mono support whatever the last release of IronPython was. So there might be a lag, or you have to run a version behind, to use Mono. But it is supported. At least, I think I read something to that effect in the IronPython archives; I haven't tried it. My more vague impression is that most Python people are happy enough with CPython (because they better be happy, because that's what we've had), and at least people like myself dread nothing more than trying to install software or platforms. I suppose there's also a group who are interested in these interpreter/runtime level issues, but are working away on PyPy. PyPy has stolen away at least one major developer from Jython (though in all fairness I think he'd mostly left anyway). That said, I think concrete instructions on exactly how to get IronPython up and working -- for someone with no .NET experience or familiarity with that toolset -- would be an excellent way to bring more attention to IronPython from the existing Python community. Ian -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Difference between CPython, Python for .NET and IronPython?
> For example, if I'm running IronPython, can I access modules such as Numeric > and numarray? AFAIK not. You can run pure python modules, but not extensions containing native code. > As I understand it, interoperability with C# and .NET works in both > directions with IronPython, but CPython modules cannot be imported, or? If they are pure python they can. However, there isn't e.g. a os-module in IronPython (at least on mono under MacOSX) - so I guess the situation is similar to Jython: you are basically limited to what the host-runtime delivers. > With Python for .NET I can import the .NET Framework and continue using > CPython modules, or? Yes. It's a bridge. Problem is: you can't use Python-Objects in .NET-code, which is at least theoretically possible in IronPython (not sure if it has something like the jythonc of jython that makes that possible for jython, or if it can be done more automagically) > > What is the roadmap for IronPython, will it be possible to import CPython > modules in the near future? I doubt it - it's just not the goal, after all you want the CLR precisely for _not_ needing bindings for C-libs on various platforms. However, I guess a goal is that you get all python modules in IronPython that are availablein the standard dist to make pure-python modules run out of the box. But I don't have any insights on that. > One last question, is IronPython cross-platform. That is, can I use > IronPython with Mono? Yes, I did so under mono/MacOSX. Diez -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Difference between CPython, Python for .NET and IronPython?
Carl Johan Rehn wrote: > What is the difference between CPython, Python for .NET, and IronPython? > > For example, if I'm running IronPython, can I access modules such as Numeric > and numarray? > > As I understand it, interoperability with C# and .NET works in both > directions with IronPython, but CPython modules cannot be imported, or? > > With Python for .NET I can import the .NET Framework and continue using > CPython modules, or? > > What is the roadmap for IronPython, will it be possible to import CPython > modules in the near future? > > One last question, is IronPython cross-platform. That is, can I use > IronPython with Mono? > > Carl I have asked similar 'question' some weeks ago in the German Python newsgroup. It seems, that that Pythonistas have generally not much interest in IronPython waiting for at least release 2.0 of it which is _perhaps_ expected to support Mono. It seems, that usage of IronPython is currently limited to Windows platform, but I was not able to attract any expert on it to give a clear answer to that. My own short test has shown, that compiled DLLs (extension modules) don't work in IronPython and the created .exe-s of simple Python scripts fail to run. Curious to hear if there will be any expert response to your posting here (except replies from people like me, who have no idea about the subject themselves). Claudio -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Difference between CPython, Python for .NET and IronPython?
What is the difference between CPython, Python for .NET, and IronPython? For example, if I'm running IronPython, can I access modules such as Numeric and numarray? As I understand it, interoperability with C# and .NET works in both directions with IronPython, but CPython modules cannot be imported, or? With Python for .NET I can import the .NET Framework and continue using CPython modules, or? What is the roadmap for IronPython, will it be possible to import CPython modules in the near future? One last question, is IronPython cross-platform. That is, can I use IronPython with Mono? Carl -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python for .NET and IronPython
John Salerno wrote:
> Hi all. I'm currently learning C#, and I'm also interested in learning
> Python
In a similar position to yourself - learning both languages - I can
definitely recommend Python ( though C# 's curly brackets might annoy
you more than they did before!!)
> so it seems like a decent
> idea to want to integrate the two
FWIW, what I've been doing lately is calling Python scripts from
Windows.Forms apps, capturing their 'StdOut'. There's an article on
http://www.thecodeproject.com which explains how you can do this
asynchronously, but the following (C#) code is what I'm using ( imagine
a Windows Form with a TextBox to enter the script name, another to
enter any arguments for the script, and 'Run', 'Cancel' and 'Browse'
CommandButtons).
(assumes the script requires no user interaction)
private void BrowseForScript_Click(object sender, System.EventArgs e)
{
if ( this.openFileDialog.ShowDialog() == DialogResult.OK )
{
this.txtIO.Clear();
this.txtIO.Focus();
this.txtIO.AppendText( openFileDialog.FileName);
}
}
private void Run_Click(object sender, System.EventArgs e)
{
System.Diagnostics.ProcessStartInfo startInfo;
System.Diagnostics.Process process;
string directory;
string pyArgs;
string script;
script = this.txtIO.Text.Trim();
if ( script == null || script.Length == 0 )
{
return;
}
try
{
directory = Path.GetDirectoryName( script );
script = Path.GetFileName( script );
}
catch (ArgumentException)
{
MessageBox.Show("The script file path contains invalid
characters.",
"Invalid Script Path",
MessageBoxButtons.OK,
MessageBoxIcon.Error);
return;
}
if ( script.Length == 0 )
{
MessageBox.Show("No script file has been specified.",
"Invalid Script Path",
MessageBoxButtons.OK,
MessageBoxIcon.Error);
return;
}
if ( directory == null || directory.Length == 0 )
{
directory = DEFAULT_SCRIPT_DIRECTORY;
}
pyArgs = this.txtArgs.Text.Trim();
startInfo = new ProcessStartInfo("python");
startInfo.WorkingDirectory = directory;
startInfo.Arguments = script + " " + pyArgs;
startInfo.UseShellExecute = false;
startInfo.CreateNoWindow = true;
startInfo.RedirectStandardOutput = true;
startInfo.RedirectStandardError = true;
process = new Process();
process.StartInfo = startInfo;
process.Start();
string s;
while ((s = process.StandardOutput.ReadLine()) != null)
{
this.__application.Write( s + "\n" );
}
while ((s = process.StandardError.ReadLine()) != null)
{
this.__application.Write( s + "\n" );
}
}
Gerard
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python for .NET and IronPython
I just want to clarify that the above mentioned web site (www.ironpython.com) is no longer maintained. If you want to get updated information on IronPython, you should visit this site: www.gotdotnet.com/Workspaces/Workspace. aspx?id=ad7acff7-ab1e-4bcb-99c0-57ac5a3a9742 Or the mailing list here: http://lists.ironpython.com/pipermail/users-ironpython.com/ By the way, the current version is 0.9.3 and it's advancing at a pretty fast pace towards version 1.0. Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python for .NET and IronPython
hrh1818 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > For more information on Iron Python see http://www.ironpython.com/ > My take on Iron Python is the new job the develolper of Iron Python > started last year takes up just about all of his time and the developer > is currently spending very little time actively developing Iron Python. > I suspect it will be a long time before Iron Python will be a main > stream product. Hence I suggest you spend your time learning Python and > C# and you forget about Iron Python until it is more fully developed. According to the guy who came present IronPython at EURO OScon, there's now 1.5 people (both MS employees) working on IronPython -- the presenter himself, fulltime, and Jim Hugunin, halftime. The language is just about ready (with a few last decisions to make, such as, stick to unicode-only strings like Jython, or strive for greater practical compatibility with current CPython?); it passes the CPython unit-tests, with a few adjustments needed where the tests overspecify some aspects of behavior compared to the Language Manual. What's missing is a lot of the Python standard library -- most of the parts that are written in C in CPython (and, I believe, in Java in Jython). My impression is that the realistic timeframe to implement those is several months; meanwhile, IronPython is usable if you're willing to make direct calls to the standard MSCLR libraries (i.e., forego ease of future moves to CPython). A beginner might be best advised to stick with CPython (and, if DotNet is needed, perhaps the Python-like language Boo) while IronPython stabilizes and fleshes out, but I'm rather more optimistic than you about the speed with which that will happen. Alex -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python for .NET and IronPython
hrh1818 wrote: > For more information on Iron Python see http://www.ironpython.com/ > My take on Iron Python is the new job the develolper of Iron Python > started last year takes up just about all of his time and the developer > is currently spending very little time actively developing Iron Python. Actually, he just stopped updating ironpython.com (a bad idea, imo) apparently. Last release was 10/13 through Microsoft, http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyID=c6a7fee3-6495-427f-8b1f-768a2715170c&DisplayLang=en If that link doesn't work you can just search "IronPython" on microsoft.com Brett -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python for .NET and IronPython
IronPython is good if you want to bring in Python into a .NET world. Python for .NET is good if you want to bring in .NET into a Python world. As for your learning concerns, there need be none. There is really nothing to learn extra for the integration. They just work. Once you learn the .NET framework and Python, there isn't much to know additionally. While you are on topic, check out Boo. It is not the same as the ones you mentioned but you might find it interesting and useful while working with .NET if you have Python tastes. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python for .NET and IronPython
For more information on Iron Python see http://www.ironpython.com/ My take on Iron Python is the new job the develolper of Iron Python started last year takes up just about all of his time and the developer is currently spending very little time actively developing Iron Python. I suspect it will be a long time before Iron Python will be a main stream product. Hence I suggest you spend your time learning Python and C# and you forget about Iron Python until it is more fully developed. Howard John Salerno wrote: > Hi all. I'm currently learning C#, and I'm also interested in learning > Python (all of this just for fun, mind you), so it seems like a decent > idea to want to integrate the two. But I don't quite understand the > difference between these two Python implementations and I was hoping > someone could explain. > > Does either one require learning something different than the core > Python language? With IronPython, would you actually be writing .NET > code? I know Python for .NET is treated as a true language in the CLR, > but I don't quite grasp what all this means for each language, and what > the learning process for either language would be like as a result. > > Thanks, > John -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python for .NET and IronPython
I was under the impression that IronPython is like CPython and Jython, namely an implementation of the Python language. So in that sense it is exactly like normal Python, although I don't know how convenient it is to deploy. I was also under the impression that Python for .NET is like an API wrapper thingy, analagous to the win32com package that wraps that interface and allows you to call functions and stuff provided by the .NET API. It is not at all an implementation of Python. I am confident that we will learn shortly whether I'm wrong. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python for .NET and IronPython
John Salerno wrote: > code? I know Python for .NET is treated as a true language in the CLR, > but I don't quite grasp what all this means for each language isn't* treated, I meant to say! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Python for .NET and IronPython
Hi all. I'm currently learning C#, and I'm also interested in learning Python (all of this just for fun, mind you), so it seems like a decent idea to want to integrate the two. But I don't quite understand the difference between these two Python implementations and I was hoping someone could explain. Does either one require learning something different than the core Python language? With IronPython, would you actually be writing .NET code? I know Python for .NET is treated as a true language in the CLR, but I don't quite grasp what all this means for each language, and what the learning process for either language would be like as a result. Thanks, John -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
