Re: Python is incredible!
In article [EMAIL PROTECTED], Tom Anderson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 12 Dec 2005, Cameron Laird wrote: While there is indeed much to love about Lisp, please be aware that meaningful AI work has already been done in Python Wait - meaningful AI work has been done? . . . I richly deserved that. As penance, I follow-up with URL: http://www.robotwisdom.com/ai/ . -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python is incredible!
On Mon, 12 Dec 2005, Xavier Morel wrote: Luis M. Gonzalez wrote: You are not the first lisper who fell inlove with Python... Check this out: http://www.paulgraham.com/articles.html Paul Graham is not in love with Python though, he's still very much in love with Lisp. He merely admits being unfaithful to Lisp from time to time (and clearly states that Python is one of the non-Lisp languages he likes best). Oh come on - he loves LISP but he plays away with python every chance he gets? What he has with LISP is a hollow sham - he's only keeping up the pretense for the children. ;) tom -- So the moon is approximately 24 toasters from Scunthorpe. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python is incredible!
On Tue, 13 Dec 2005, Cameron Laird wrote: In article [EMAIL PROTECTED], Tom Anderson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 12 Dec 2005, Cameron Laird wrote: While there is indeed much to love about Lisp, please be aware that meaningful AI work has already been done in Python Wait - meaningful AI work has been done? I richly deserved that. As penance, I follow-up with URL: http://www.robotwisdom.com/ai/ . I think that document actually sells AI a little short: it's true that little progress has been made with language or reasoning, but vision's actually done rather well; the recent winning of the Grand Challenge drive across the Mojave is proof of that. But then, i don't think AI was ever really the goal of the AI movement - it was basically a time when DARPA gathered together smart, curious people, and threw torrents of resources at them to use as they pleased. We didn't get AI out of it, but we did get a hell of a lot of cool stuff. It was a bit like the Apollo programme, but without the air force dudes planting flags at the end. An AI refugee, who worked at SAIL in the 70s, recently told me AI was always just a sandpit, now it's become a tarpit the clever people have moved on - because it was the environment and the opportunity to do neat stuff, rather than AI per se, that drove them. tom -- So the moon is approximately 24 toasters from Scunthorpe. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Python is incredible!
Hi everyone, I am using Common Lisp for a while and nowadays I've heard so much about Python that finally I've decided to give it a try becuase Python is not very far away from Lisp family. I cannot believe this! This snake is amazing, incredible and so beautiful! You, Pythonists, why didn't you tell me about this before? :-) Actually I loved Lisp and still don't want to throw it away beacuse of my interest of artificial intelligence, but using Python is not programming, it IS a fun! It is so friendly and soft and nice and blahblahblah I'll be here!!! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python is incredible!
Welcome to Python world :) On 12 Dec 2005 03:44:13 -0800, Tolga [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi everyone, I am using Common Lisp for a while and nowadays I've heard so much about Python that finally I've decided to give it a try becuase Python is not very far away from Lisp family. I cannot believe this! This snake is amazing, incredible and so beautiful! You, Pythonists, why didn't you tell me about this before? :-) Actually I loved Lisp and still don't want to throw it away beacuse of my interest of artificial intelligence, but using Python is not programming, it IS a fun! It is so friendly and soft and nice and blahblahblah I'll be here!!! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python is incredible!
You are not the first lisper who fell inlove with Python... Check this out: http://www.paulgraham.com/articles.html -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python is incredible!
In article [EMAIL PROTECTED], Tolga [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: . . . Actually I loved Lisp and still don't want to throw it away beacuse of my interest of artificial intelligence, but using Python is not programming, it IS a fun! It is so friendly and soft and nice and . . . While there is indeed much to love about Lisp, please be aware that meaningful AI work has already been done in Python (URL: http://programmer-art.org/dan/python-ai.html , for example). -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python is incredible!
Oh, Mr(s) Laird, you've indicated to a very important thing for me: Let's suppose that I actually want to leave Lisp totally but what about AI sources? Most of them are based on Lisp. Oh yes, yes, I know, one may study AI with any language, even with BASIC, but nearly all important AI books start with a short Lisp intro. They say that you do not have to use Lisp, you can use another language with this book. Ohmigod, does somebody explain me how can this be possible? You're trying to learn something you don't know, and you will try to read some important examples written in a language you don't know. This is so weird! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python is incredible!
Tolga wrote: Let's suppose that I actually want to leave Lisp totally but what about AI sources? Most of them are based on Lisp. Oh yes, yes, I know, one may study AI with any language, even with BASIC, but nearly all important AI books start with a short Lisp intro. They say that you do not have to use Lisp, you can use another language with this book. Ohmigod, does somebody explain me how can this be possible? You're trying to learn something you don't know, and you will try to read some important examples written in a language you don't know. This is so weird! on the other hand, http://www.norvig.com/python-lisp.html Python seems to be easier to read than Lisp for someone with no experience in either language. The Python code I developed looks much more like the (independently developed) pseudo-code in the book than does the Lisp code. This is important, because some students were complaining that they had a hard time seeing how the pseudo-code in the book mapped into the online Lisp code (even though it seemed obvious to Lisp programmers). /F -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python is incredible!
I cannot remember where was it, but I saw a sentence in the Internet: When programming, programmers spend more time for reading than writing. This is definitely true. We don't only read others' code but we also read our code again and again and again. Thus, a language which is easier to read can make the programmer very comfortable. I read many statements that Python is a clean language. Now, I see what means clean. By the way, Python IDEs are so nice and powerful. I have downloaded Komodo and WingIDE and I've found them amazing! Of course, Lisp has also very good IDEs but even just these two Python IDEs can attract people to Python. Hmm, or shall I crack them? Gosh, no, no, this is illegal ;-) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python is incredible!
Luis M. Gonzalez wrote: You are not the first lisper who fell inlove with Python... Check this out: http://www.paulgraham.com/articles.html Paul Graham is not in love with Python though, he's still very much in love with Lisp. He merely admits being unfaithful to Lisp from time to time (and clearly states that Python is one of the non-Lisp languages he likes best). -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python is incredible!
On Mon, 12 Dec 2005, Cameron Laird wrote: While there is indeed much to love about Lisp, please be aware that meaningful AI work has already been done in Python Wait - meaningful AI work has been done? ;) tom -- limited to concepts that are meta, generic, abstract and philosophical -- IEEE SUO WG -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python is incredible!
On Mon, 12 Dec 2005, Tolga wrote: I am using Common Lisp for a while and nowadays I've heard so much about Python that finally I've decided to give it a try becuase You read reddit.com, and you want to know why they switched? Python is not very far away from Lisp family. That's an interesting assertion. LISP certainly had an influence on python, but i don't think it's really related - they're pretty different in fundamental ways. On the other hand, i sort of see what you mean - it has this lightweight, magical feeling, a sense of effortless power, as LISP does. using Python is not programming, it IS a fun! +1 QOTW. I'll be here!!! Good to hear it - welcome! tom -- limited to concepts that are meta, generic, abstract and philosophical -- IEEE SUO WG -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
