Zope 3 Boot Camp early bird registration deadline near
The early bird registration deadline for Camp 5 and the BBQ Sprint is Wednesday, February 14: http://trizpug.org/boot-camp/camp5/ You can save $50 by registering early. Registration ends Friday March 2. -- Sincerely, Chris Calloway http://www.seacoos.org office: 332 Chapman Hall phone: (919) 962-4323 mail: Campus Box #3300, UNC-CH, Chapel Hill, NC 27599 -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Zope 3 Boot Camp and Sprint registration open
The Triangle (NC) Zope and Python Users Group invites you to register for Camp 5 and the BBQ Sprint: http://trizpug.org/boot-camp/camp5/ This is a Zope 3 boot camp followed by a Plone 3 sprint. The boot camp is taught by Philipp von Weitershausen, author of Web Component Development with Zope 3. The training has previously only been offered in Europe and is now available in North America for the first time. The sprint includes several sponsored and invited sprinters. TriZPUG hopes you will participate in Camp 5 in Chapel Hill, NC. Camp 5: Saturday March 10 - Tuesday March 13, 2007 BBQ Sprint: Wednesday March 14 - Saturday March 17, 2007 -- Sincerely, Chris Calloway http://www.seacoos.org office: 332 Chapman Hall phone: (919) 962-4323 mail: Campus Box #3300, UNC-CH, Chapel Hill, NC 27599 -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Zope 3
This looks more or less like what I am looking for to learn Zope3! As is mentioned elsewhere in this thread Zope3 is *nothing* like Zope2 and after starting to learn the one, I knew nothing about the other. *Everything* is different - from the interface to the design methodologies. One thing Zope seems to keep pushing is extreme programming - until recently, I thought it is a joke, like extreme ironing, but it seems like a very popular style of programming. I am astounded by how much I need to learn to call myself a programmer! Anyway - If some of you can give me a little insight to what you use to develop on the web using Python, I'd appreciate it. I've heard good things about cherrypy, django, mod_python, zope, etc., etc. There is just so little time - I'd gladly sacrifice a little power / flexibility for an easier learning curve. This will be my first python web project... Thanks for the feedback - it helps a lot :) Derick -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Zope 3
Derick van Niekerk wrote: Anyway - If some of you can give me a little insight to what you use to develop on the web using Python, I'd appreciate it. I've heard good things about cherrypy, django, mod_python, zope, etc., etc. There is just so little time - I'd gladly sacrifice a little power / flexibility for an easier learning curve. working through the Django tutorial shouldn't take you more than an hour or two (*): http://www.djangoproject.com/documentation/ turbogears also have some good tutorials: http://www.turbogears.org/docs/index.html /F *) depending on how much time you need to get things set up. if you just want to tinker, and are using windows, you can easily do it in 5-15 minutes: http://effbot.org/zone/django.htm#installing -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Zope 3
I have been developing in PHP for some time now and needed to look into application frameworks to speed up my development. I was looking into Horde and CakePHP before I was introduced to Python. I started learing python and within a few *hours* I already wrote my first small program and I still use it! I love Python! Then I was introduced to Zope by freak accident. While Zope looked like the answer to my dillemma, I still can't get my head wrapped around it. Is it because I don't know Python well enough? Or is it just that difficult to learn? I would like to start my next web project (a database of demographic info on scientists in Africa) on Zope 3. Could anybody point me in the right direction? Where should I start? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Zope 3
Derick van Niekerk wrote:
I have been developing in PHP for some time now and needed to look into
application frameworks to speed up my development. I was looking into
Horde and CakePHP before I was introduced to Python. I started learing
python and within a few *hours* I already wrote my first small program
and I still use it!
I love Python! Then I was introduced to Zope by freak accident. While
Zope looked like the answer to my dillemma, I still can't get my head
wrapped around it. Is it because I don't know Python well enough? Or is
it just that difficult to learn?
Zope is a world in itself - and is certainly not the simplest tool to
learn (nor the most pythonic). You may want to consider other options
like Django, Pylon or Turbogears.
My 2 cents.
--
bruno desthuilliers
python -c print '@'.join(['.'.join([w[::-1] for w in p.split('.')]) for
p in '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'.split('@')])
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Zope 3
bruno at modulix wrote: Zope is a world in itself - and is certainly not the simplest tool to learn (nor the most pythonic). Those statements apply more to Zope 2 than Zope 3 (and Zope 2 is moving more and more toward Zope 3 these days). One of Zope 3's main goals was to focus on the Python programmer as a primary target. That being said there /are/ some powerful and novel concepts used in Z3 (the component framework). You may want to consider other options like Django, Pylon or Turbogears. It's true that Z3 is not currently focused very well on the middle-class developer. It's more of an industrial-strength kind of thing, but considerable thought has been given lately on how to build bridges so everyone can benefit without being full-time Zope masters. Toward that end, I wrote a little quick start guide that might help the OP: http://www.benjiyork.com/quick_start -- Benji York -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Zope 3
Derick van Niekerk wrote: I love Python! Then I was introduced to Zope by freak accident. While Zope looked like the answer to my dillemma, I still can't get my head wrapped around it. Is it because I don't know Python well enough? Or is it just that difficult to learn? I've been hacking Python now for 6 years. I just picked up Zope last month and found the learning curve to be quite steep. It's not just you. There's a lot of stuff there. I would like to start my next web project (a database of demographic info on scientists in Africa) on Zope 3. Could anybody point me in the right direction? Where should I start? After you look through the tutorial (which is simply a Zope product you can add from the main page of the ZMI (Zope Management Interface), have a peek at the Zope book (http://www.zope.org/Documentation/Books/ZopeBook/2_6Edition/view). Don't worry about the version (2.6) of the book. It's the latest they have (I think they're working on a new one for z3). You can skip the bits about DTML, but keep them handy. You should also take a look at the Zope user list: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope Hope this all helps. -- Steve Juranich Tucson, AZ USA -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Zope 3
Benji York wrote:
bruno at modulix wrote:
Zope is a world in itself - and is certainly not the simplest tool to
learn (nor the most pythonic).
Those statements apply more to Zope 2 than Zope 3 (and Zope 2 is moving
more and more toward Zope 3 these days). One of Zope 3's main goals was
to focus on the Python programmer as a primary target. That being said
there /are/ some powerful and novel concepts used in Z3 (the component
framework).
While it's true that Zope3 is more 'python-programmer oriented' than
Zope2 - and probably much safer wrt/ developper's sanity -, it's still a
world on it's own, it's still a complex framework, and it's still not
very pythonic (IMHO based on 2+ years experience with Zope2, with or
without the CMF, and some time spent evaluating Zope3).
You may want to consider other options like Django, Pylon or Turbogears.
It's true that Z3 is not currently focused very well on the
middle-class developer.
That's an understatement !-)
It's more of an industrial-strength kind of
thing, but considerable thought has been given lately on how to build
bridges so everyone can benefit without being full-time Zope masters.
Toward that end, I wrote a little quick start guide that might help the
OP: http://www.benjiyork.com/quick_start
--
bruno desthuilliers
python -c print '@'.join(['.'.join([w[::-1] for w in p.split('.')]) for
p in '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'.split('@')])
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Zope 3
Steve Juranich wrote:
Derick van Niekerk wrote:
(snip)
I would like to start my next web project (a database of demographic
info on scientists in Africa) on Zope 3. Could anybody point me in the
right direction? Where should I start?
After you look through the tutorial (which is simply a Zope product you can
add from the main page of the ZMI (Zope Management Interface), have a peek
at the Zope book
(http://www.zope.org/Documentation/Books/ZopeBook/2_6Edition/view).
Actually, the OP was asking about Zope3, which is a *very* different beast.
--
bruno desthuilliers
python -c print '@'.join(['.'.join([w[::-1] for w in p.split('.')]) for
p in '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'.split('@')])
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Zope 3
What is pythonic? See: http://faassen.n--tree.net/blog/view/weblog/2005/08/06/0 bruno at modulix schrieb am 25.04.2006 17:10: Benji York wrote: bruno at modulix wrote: Zope is a world in itself - and is certainly not the simplest tool to learn (nor the most pythonic). Those statements apply more to Zope 2 than Zope 3 (and Zope 2 is moving more and more toward Zope 3 these days). One of Zope 3's main goals was to focus on the Python programmer as a primary target. That being said there /are/ some powerful and novel concepts used in Z3 (the component framework). While it's true that Zope3 is more 'python-programmer oriented' than Zope2 - and probably much safer wrt/ developper's sanity -, it's still a world on it's own, it's still a complex framework, and it's still not very pythonic (IMHO based on 2+ years experience with Zope2, with or without the CMF, and some time spent evaluating Zope3). You may want to consider other options like Django, Pylon or Turbogears. It's true that Z3 is not currently focused very well on the middle-class developer. That's an understatement !-) It's more of an industrial-strength kind of thing, but considerable thought has been given lately on how to build bridges so everyone can benefit without being full-time Zope masters. Toward that end, I wrote a little quick start guide that might help the OP: http://www.benjiyork.com/quick_start -- Egon Frerich, Freudenbergstr. 16, 28213 Bremen E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Zope 3
bruno at modulix wrote: Actually, the OP was asking about Zope3, which is a *very* different beast. Okay, so my ignorance is showing (/me pauses to stuff it back where it belongs). So is there some big master diff, along the lines of What's new in Python X.X that I could look at to get an idea of what z3 has that 2.9 (which I'm currently still cutting my teeth on) doesn't? I've looked at the documentation on the main Zope page (zope.org) and all of the documents I've seen are apparently geared towards Zope 2.X. Where are the Zope3 docs? Thanks. -- Steve Juranich Tucson, AZ USA -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Zope 3
Steve Juranich schrieb am 25.04.2006 18:24: bruno at modulix wrote: Actually, the OP was asking about Zope3, which is a *very* different beast. Okay, so my ignorance is showing (/me pauses to stuff it back where it belongs). So is there some big master diff, along the lines of What's new in Python X.X that I could look at to get an idea of what z3 has that 2.9 (which I'm currently still cutting my teeth on) doesn't? I've looked at the documentation on the main Zope page (zope.org) and all of the documents I've seen are apparently geared towards Zope 2.X. Where are the Zope3 docs? For example: http://www.zope.org/Wikis/DevSite/Projects/ComponentArchitecture/FrontPage/Zope3Book Thanks. -- Egon Frerich, Freudenbergstr. 16, 28213 Bremen E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Zope 3
I have been using ZOPE (mostly with CMF/Plone) for a couple years now. MY recolleciton of the initial leraning curve, was hours reading through source code, newsgroups, web site, outdated garbage, days long marathons of coffee, beer and very little sleep. After about 2 weeks of this horrible mindnumbing headache - the eureka moment hit, and it has proven itself to be a fairly robust application server environment, and has really delivered for me in terms of being able to quickle create web apps. I would say though the question of Zope is not a question of implementation language - it is it's own thing. I think a lot of the talk of adding typing to python has emerged from the Zope camp. So the question you should ask yourself, not do I want to use python or php - it's more do I want to use Zope? Zope is pretty well supported and seems to have a good bit of momentum (compared to other python based app servers) My experince is that the learning curve is steep, and the path is heavily littered with debris. But, once the initial curve is passed - the results seems almost magical (at least compared to other app server environments I have worked with) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Zope 3
Steve Juranich: is there some big master diff, along the lines of What's new in Python X.X that I could look at to get an idea of what z3 has that 2.9 (which I'm currently still cutting my teeth on) doesn't? It's a redesign. Z2: mixin base classes Z3: component architecture with interfaces Where are the Zope3 docs? Google! -- René Pijlman -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Zope 3
Steve Juranich a écrit : bruno at modulix wrote: Actually, the OP was asking about Zope3, which is a *very* different beast. Okay, so my ignorance is showing (/me pauses to stuff it back where it belongs). So is there some big master diff, along the lines of What's new in Python X.X that I could look at to get an idea of what z3 has that 2.9 (which I'm currently still cutting my teeth on) doesn't? This is not an incremental change, it's a complete redesign and rewrite and a different architecture. Almost nothing of what you learn with Zope 2.x will hold with Zope3. I've looked at the documentation on the main Zope page (zope.org) and all of the documents I've seen are apparently geared towards Zope 2.X. Where are the Zope3 docs? You can start here: http://www.zope.org/DevHome/Wikis/DevSite/Projects/ComponentArchitecture/FrontPage HTH -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Zope 3?? How do you start it on Windows?
kbperry wrote: Call me crazy and stupid, but how do you start zope? I downloaded the thing, installed it, and then nothing. I can find a stupid README.txt that is useful. Can someone help?Please! Install Python 2.4 Install Zope 3 in that python by using setup.py Make a Zope instance with Python24\Scripts\mkzopeinstance.bat Start that instance by running INSTANCE_HOME/bin/runzope.bat -- hilsen/regards Max M, Denmark http://www.mxm.dk/ IT's Mad Science -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Zope 3?? How do you start it on Windows?
Cool thx Matt. I did finally figure it out, but barely. Why would you want to download and install Zope without creating an instance? It seems kind of dumb to me. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Zope 3?? How do you start it on Windows?
kbperry wrote: Cool thx Matt. I did finally figure it out, but barely. Why would you want to download and install Zope without creating an instance? It seems kind of dumb to me. This is a quite normal separation. I think you will find the same thing among both database systems and various web tool kits. Some database systems do create an instance on installation, but that's because those database systems need one main systems database per install to adminster the other databases. Whether it's Oracle, Zope or Django, you can have many instances running in one installation. I installed Trac yesterday. It worked just the same way. In settings with more than just a few developers, it's quite normal that system admins install software products such as Zope, while software developers create Zope instances. Why on earth would you force the sysadmin to make a Zope instance? He doesn't need one! The developer probably doesn't have root access, and it isn't his job to install third party s/w. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Zope 3?? How do you start it on Windows?
Many good points! Thx Matt. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Zope 3?? How do you start it on Windows?
Call me crazy and stupid, but how do you start zope? I downloaded the thing, installed it, and then nothing. I can find a stupid README.txt that is useful. Can someone help?Please! Thx. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: What's wrong with Zope 3 ?
Kay Schluehr wrote: Wolfram Kraus wrote: Kay Schluehr wrote: The last downloadable release is from november 2004. The Windows installer is configured for Python 2.3(!). The Zope.org main page announces Zope 2.8 beta 2. Is it stillborn? Kay What you see is not Zope 3, it is Zope X 3. To quote from the X3 information page: Zope X3 3.0 is for developers. If you are expecting an end-user application, this is not for you. Yes I noticed this almost 8 months ago, read a bit of the documentation and articles published that time, regarded it as interesting and considered it for future development. But since then absolutely nothing happened. No project plan, no time-schedule, no subsequent releases. You can always scan the zope3-mailinglist at zope.org (or via news.gmane.org) to see whats happening. Migth be a better place for questions, too. The current stable brance is Zope2.X If you want to incorporate some functionalty from X3 in Zope 2.X, do a search for Five No, I do not want to migrate components from a new major release backwards, as well as I do not want to migrate applications from WinXP to Win98. This seems to be the wrong development process direction. Well, the problem is that it is not a new major release but a new mayor experimental release. And X3 is not backward compatible, so a lot of Z2 products, e.g. Plone, don't work with X3. Regards, Kay HTH, Wolfram (still using Z2 ;-)) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: What's wrong with Zope 3 ?
Kay Schluehr wrote: The last downloadable release is from november 2004. The Windows installer is configured for Python 2.3(!). The Zope.org main page announces Zope 2.8 beta 2. Is it stillborn? Kay What you see is not Zope 3, it is Zope X 3. To quote from the X3 information page: Zope X3 3.0 is for developers. If you are expecting an end-user application, this is not for you. The current stable brance is Zope2.X If you want to incorporate some functionalty from X3 in Zope 2.X, do a search for Five HTH, Wolfram -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: What's wrong with Zope 3 ?
Wolfram Kraus wrote: Kay Schluehr wrote: The last downloadable release is from november 2004. The Windows installer is configured for Python 2.3(!). The Zope.org main page announces Zope 2.8 beta 2. Is it stillborn? Kay What you see is not Zope 3, it is Zope X 3. To quote from the X3 information page: Zope X3 3.0 is for developers. If you are expecting an end-user application, this is not for you. Yes I noticed this almost 8 months ago, read a bit of the documentation and articles published that time, regarded it as interesting and considered it for future development. But since then absolutely nothing happened. No project plan, no time-schedule, no subsequent releases. The current stable brance is Zope2.X If you want to incorporate some functionalty from X3 in Zope 2.X, do a search for Five No, I do not want to migrate components from a new major release backwards, as well as I do not want to migrate applications from WinXP to Win98. This seems to be the wrong development process direction. Regards, Kay -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: What's wrong with Zope 3 ?
The current stable brance is Zope2.X If you want to incorporate some functionalty from X3 in Zope 2.X, do a search for Five No, I do not want to migrate components from a new major release backwards, as well as I do not want to migrate applications from WinXP to Win98. This seems to be the wrong development process direction. There are an awful lot of zope 2 applications out there looking to migrate to zope 3. Five is one way to start that. Sort of like there are still a lot of win98 systems out there, and running python2.4 is a great way to get more use from the systems, but still be able to migrate to xp (or mac or linux) when the time comes. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
What's wrong with Zope 3 ?
The last downloadable release is from november 2004. The Windows installer is configured for Python 2.3(!). The Zope.org main page announces Zope 2.8 beta 2. Is it stillborn? Kay -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
