Re: death of newsgroups (Microsoft closing their newsgroups)
> So, if newsgroups die and get replaced by web forums, that would be a move for > the better. If they get replaced by mailing lists, that would be a move for > the worse. Uday has gotten the valuation of the three communications media - a little wrong. 1/ Newsgroups are international, free and without censorship in the true spirit of democracy. 2/ The forums are privately owned, serve private interests and the most autocratic medium, you can be denied reading permissions if you go against official line which is never described. 3/ The mailing lists are archived, so read permission is often available and write permission can be denied. They are the second best. Moderated lists are no good. The quality of discussion in any of these media only depends on the generosity of the members in sharing information. Take a look at past archives of the newsgroups, and marvel at the quality of information. They stand as a counterexample to anyone bickering about newsgroups. Today, after monetary interests have attached to the software and the internet, the whole game is about controlling discourse, about marketing and creating hype towards sales and prominence without giving anything of substance. The forums are an excellent tool for this corporate control. The newsgroups are the ONLY NEUTRAL medium. Its obvious about the spam going on here today that the OCCASIONAL political messages are disliked by some groups and they start MASSIVELY spamming with sex-viagra-xanax etc. to drown OCCASIONAL political messages and hide them in a burst of spam. Alternatively, some companies dont like discussion and they produce the spam. The best method is to put some of these VIAGRA-XANAX words in the kill file or spam filter or search filters. On Jul 16, 1:22 am, Uday S Reddy wrote: > > Doing "better" means having more posts? I don't believe that having a lot of > posts is necessarily a measure of goodness. > > In my opinion, discussion forums do well when they encourage people to think > carefully and communicate clearly. In this respect, I think mailing lists do > worse, newsgroups better, and web-based forums the best. Uday presents a FACTOID on the order of "goodness". Forums are generally against freedom. They appeared around 2001 to control discourse and kill newsgroups, democracy and freedom of speech. Its the same forces who wanted to institute the Patriot Law and who mailed the ANTHRAX for that are the ones destroying the newsgroups by spamming. They operate on the principle of "provocation/reaction" cycle as explained Lucidly by Alex Jones which you can learn in first 2 minutes of this video http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5792753647750188322 > Mailing lists seem to turn into talking shops where people get to know each > other over time and their "public" nature gets lost. Those who write a lot > end > up dominating them, independent of whether they write any sense or not. The > other people get tired and stop reading. So, you can generate a lot of > traffic, but its value is dubious. > > Newsgroups are much better because they are public and, visibly so. If > somebody says something stupid, a lot of people will jump on them. And, so, > over time, they develop some quality. (There is no guarantee, of course. I > have also seen a lot of newsgroups, especially in politics, really degenerate > with opposing factions fighting and dominating everything else.) > > Web-based forums, especially those where people have to register, work the > best > in my experience. They are very visibly public, discouraging people to write > nonsense. The difficulty of writing on the web instead of your favorite > editor > hopefully provides some resistance to write. So, people tend to think more > than they write. > > I used a forum called silentpcforum last year to help me build myself a new > computer. There was a lot of high quality information dating back to years, > which was easy to find and easy to use. > -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: GNU Emacs Developement Inefficiency (commentary)
On Jul 16, 1:41 am, Uday S Reddy wrote: > On 7/16/2010 12:23 AM, Xah Lee wrote: > > > > > It got closed right away i suppose partly has to do with my > > unforgiving nature of criticizing and run-in with some GNU emacs > > developers in gnu.emacs.help and comp.emacs in the past 5 or so years. > > I think "criticizing" is an understatement for what you do. Insulting and > abusing might be closer to the truth. You do write a lot of sense, but you > also go off on rants occasionally writing stuff that has no place in civil > conversation. I am sure that the emacs developers try to be as professional > as > they can, but they would only be human if they undervalue your input because > of > your writing style. Well, there is a lot of resistance from the emacs community in sharing information. Richard Stallman is a true STALLER of progress. He has held the whole process hostage by not sharing information. He has RENEGED on his promise to make it truly open by suppressing documentation of his softwares. > > Re-writing the whole doc in a modern perspective might take me one > > month full time. (e.g. 160 hours) But if it were to be done in a > > public way, or submit to him, the time it takes to communicate, email, > > write justifications, create diffs, etc, can easily take half a year > > full time (960 hours). In the end, i'm not even sure half of the text > > in the new doc would be accepted. > > If you can rewrite it in a month's time, then what are you waiting for? You > can write it and publish it on your own, calling it a "Modernized Emacs > Manual". If people find it valuable and it is accurate, then I am sure Gnu > will distribute it. The one who has the key can open the lock in a jiffy. The one who does not have the key will take lots of labor to do it esp if he has never opened the lock before. All Richard Stallman has to do is to hand draw the data-structures and architecture of the various programs. Give references to the places where he got the ideas. He does not even have to type. He can write with pencil and scan and thats all. This way he can make marvelously elaborate diagrams. He can even make audios or videos. He has plenty of time to make POLITICAL videos. He has plenty of time to to write that elaborate manual on LISP MACHINE PROPOSAL on the internet. Its less about bugs and more about releasing the details and tricks of the softwares he has written. Yes, he can do in one month because he has the key. Will he do it only after he is anointed as a king in the temple of Solomon ? > > The GNU Emacs's bug database sucks majorly. I have problem finding all > > bugs posted by me. (it's using Debbugs.) Hard to find any bug by its > > search feature. They did not have a bug database, only in around 2008. > > Most commercial software have a bug database system in 1990s, and most > > large open source projects have one by early 2000s. (I wrote a bug > > tracker in 1998, 4k lines of Perl (with CGI, MySQL), in about 2 weeks, > > for a startup brainpower.com.) > > I go to gmane.emacs.bugs and view it in Thunderbird. I have no problem > finding > my bug reports or any one else's. The FSF people have intentionally erected lots of barriers for others. FSF plays a crooked game and this will be discussed in detail. In this video, Stall man makes 4 promises to public but stalls on 2nd of them. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BfCJq_zIdk&feature=fvsr 1/ Freedom to Run to the Program 2/ Freedom to study the source code, you control it <-- Software is a puzzle and it must be explained to be able to do that, its like a lock 3/ Freedom to help your neightbors, share with them 4/ Freedom to contribute to your community Software is a puzzle and it must be explained to be able to do that, its like a lock "to MAKE SURE you get the four freedoms" He is WRONG !!! He has not made sure. He has not taken the first steps. Software architecture must be documented. A model minimal release must be given. If it takes too long to document the program by writing in Latex, then he can write by hand or make an video with camera on the paper and he can talk. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: GNU Emacs Developement Inefficiency (commentary)
On Jul 16, 2:59 pm, Xah Lee wrote: > In comp.emacs Xah Lee wrote: > > > GNU Emacs Developement Inefficiency > > It [a bug report] got closed right away i suppose partly has to do with > > my unforgiving nature of criticizing and run-in with some GNU emacs > > developers in gnu.emacs.help and comp.emacs in the past 5 or so years. > > On Jul 16, 9:25 am, Alan Mackenzie wrote: > > > It has to be said that that criticism has sometimes involved the use of > > curse words. > > i admit that's true. Didnt you say that you wrote several polite emails and it did not work ??? Have some spine and say the truth !!! > > So if your bug reports are getting things moved, what's so frustrating? > > couldn've been better. You meant "could've" > > > Re-writing the whole doc in a modern perspective might take me one > > > month full time. (e.g. 160 hours) > > > I think it would take you a great deal longer than that. But it would be > > easy enough to experiment on. Chose some chapter from the Emacs or Elisp > > manual, fire away and see how long it takes you. > > btw, i don't think elisp manual needs to be re-worked, or at least not > critical... but i think it's much critical that the emacs manual be. What he needs is to give a clear and concise explanation of the data- structures and algorithms of the software. If he used ideas from others, he need to give reference to them so others can find it and get into depth. There is no need to make professional diagrams using xfig etc if it takes too much time. He only needs a scanner, pencil , eraser and a ruler. Others who worked for him and learnt the hard way can also do it , but I suspect he extracted such a price that they wont be able to give freely. The XEMACs people deserve some commendation . > > I think your changes would not be accepted as such. Quite bluntly, your > > English isn't good enough, so somebody would have to go through your > > version eliminating solecisms. There's a vast gap between being able to > > use English adequately to transmit your meaning and being able to write > > stylish and correct English. Your English belongs to the former > > category. As a matter of interest, what is your native language? > > Haha, that's a good one. This is why they brought indians to checkmate the chinese. They can put this accusation of english as they used to do on the asians and japanese throughout the 90s by Japanese Bashing. I remember very well that George Bush senior vomited on the face of Toshiki Kaifu to insult him intentionally in Japan. This is just a false excuse to give proper space to you. I think you write excellently. > i disconcur. See: > > • The Writing Style on XahLee.org > http://xahlee.org/Periodic_dosage_dir/bangu/xah_style.html > > > > (the GNU emacs dev's revision control system was CVS up to ~2008. CVS > > > has been phased out by 2000 in vast majority of software orgs or > > > projects. I think GNU emacs now using SVN, while most bleeding edge > > > orgs have switched to git, mercurial, distributed systems. (e.g. > > > FireFox, Google)) > > > What's your source for "the vast majority" of projects no longer using > > CVS, again as a matter of interest? > > sloppy exaggeration. Though, i would say “majority”, from experience. > e.g. look at google and other large orgs commercial or open source, > and look at the revision system supported by large project hosters > such as google code, SourceForge, github... Mackenzie, bring a properly written documentation by FSF for example on emacs of gcc. I want to see where RMS got his ideas ? Did he invent all of them himself ? Is he giving proper references to the sources of the ideas ? Is that plagiarism ? I am sick of such jews/zionists like RMS, Roman Polansky, Bernard Madoff, Larry Ellison (he had to pay 100K in court to a chinese girl he screwed), Stephen Wolfram, Albert Einstein spreading anti-semitism by their flagrant unethical behaviour. If you use someone else's ideas, give reference. Dont try to portray yourself falsely as a genius by hiding sources and weaving rosy false pictures of being a victim or born out of wedlock. you went to school and got good education. you got insights from your community and good mentorship from other jews in aggressive networking in the jews like other communities dont have. These are facts. Thats why these people dont stand to scrutiny and questioning. > > Emacs uses BZR, not SVN, and has > > done since the beginning of 2010. > > Thanks for your correction. Updated my site. Write a good documentation using pencil and scan that helps newbies enter the field. If it is not there, you will be subject of perpetual criticism and no thanks. > (also thanks to Uday S Reddy & David Kastrup for comment.) > > Xah > ∑http://xahlee.org/ > > ☄ -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: GNU Emacs Developement Inefficiency (commentary)
On Jul 15, 4:23 pm, Xah Lee wrote: > • GNU Emacs Developement Inefficiency > http://xahlee.org/emacs/GNU_Emacs_dev_inefficiency.html > > essay; commentary. Plain text version follows. > > -- > GNU Emacs Developement Inefficiency > > Xah Lee, 2010-07-15 > > I've also written to Richard Stallman a few times in private in about > 2008 or 2009, about documentation improvements. With extreme > politeness and respect on my part. You took good precaution to deny him any excuse to fend you off ... so that we can all know the true reality of the situation. Its long said by others that this idea of freedom is a bait. Still, I want to give him / FSF a chance to prove their sincerity in enabling others in reading the code and learning from it ... > Without going into detail, i'm just > disenchanted by his reaction. In short, it appears to me he did not > pay much attention, and basically in the end asked me to submit > changes to him. Yeah right. The whole shebang seems to be very well > described by Ben Wing. (See: GNU Emacs and Xemacs Schism, by Ben > Wing.) (Richard Stallman's emails are pretty short, just a couple > terse sentences; but he does, however, whenever he got a chance, tell > his correspondents to use the term GNU/Linux, and ask them to > contribute.) > > Re-writing the whole doc in a modern perspective might take me one > month full time. (e.g. 160 hours) But if it were to be done in a > public way, or submit to him, the time it takes to communicate, email, > write justifications, create diffs, etc, can easily take half a year > full time (960 hours). In the end, i'm not even sure half of the text > in the new doc would be accepted. > > The GNU Emacs's bug database sucks majorly. I have problem finding all > bugs posted by me. (it's using Debbugs.) Hard to find any bug by its > search feature. They did not have a bug database, only in around 2008. > Most commercial software have a bug database system in 1990s, and most > large open source projects have one by early 2000s. (I wrote a bug > tracker in 1998, 4k lines of Perl (with CGI, MySQL), in about 2 weeks, > for a startup brainpower.com.) > > Am pretty sure there are several good “FSF Free” bug databases. (see: > Comparison of issue-tracking systems) Few years ago, some may have > problem to be politically qualified to be “Free” for FSF to adopt. > However, these days there are many that FSF officially sactions as > “Free”. However, when you look at FSF, you see that even when a > software became free, they usually are still picky with lots qualms, > and typically always ends up using their OWN ones (i.e. from GNU > project), even though it is clear that it is inferior. (the GNU emacs > dev's revision control system was CVS up to ~2008. CVS has been phased > out by 2000 in vast majority of software orgs or projects. I think GNU > emacs now using SVN, while most bleeding edge orgs have switched to > git, mercurial, distributed systems. (e.g. FireFox, Google)) > > These are consequence of old and large orgs, with its old policies and > beaucracies. See: “Free” Software Morality, Richard Stallman, and > Paperwork Bureaucracy. > > Who are the main developers of FSF software these days? Mostly, they > are either paid as FSF employee, or students still trying to break out > their craft in programing, or 40/50 years old semi-retired programers > who otherwise isn't doing anything. Those willing and able, spend time > and get decent salary in commercial corps, or went to start their own > projects or business that'd be far more rewarding financially or not > than being another name in FSF's list of contributors. > > These days, FSF and Richard Stallman more serves as a figure-head and > political leader in open source movement. FSF's software, largely are > old and outdated (e.g. unix command line utils), with the exception of > perhaps GCC and GPG. If we go by actual impact of open source software > in society, i think Google's role, and other commercial orgs (such as > Apache, Perl, Python, PHP, various langs on JVM, and other project > hosters hosting any odd-end single-man projects), exceeded FSF by > ~2000. > > Xah > ∑http://xahlee.org/ > > ☄ -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Fascinating interview by Richard Stallman on Russia TV
On Jul 7, 1:57 pm, bolega wrote: > "Democracy is sick in the US, government monitors your > Internet"http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BfCJq_zIdk&feature=fvsr > > Enjoy . In this video, Stall man makes 4 promises to public but stalls on 2nd of them. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BfCJq_zIdk&feature=fvsr 1/ Freedom to Run to the Program 2/ Freedom to study the source code, you control it <-- Software is a puzzle and it must be explained to be able to do that, its like a lock 3/ Freedom to help your neightbors, share with them 4/ Freedom to contribute to your community Software is a puzzle and it must be explained to be able to do that, its like a lock "to MAKE SURE you get the four freedoms" He is WRONG !!! He has not made sure. He has not taken the first steps. Software architecture must be documented. A model minimal release must be given. If it takes too long to document the program by writing in Latex, then he can write by hand or make an video with camera on the paper and he can talk. Mackenzie, bring a properly written documentation by FSF for example on emacs of gcc. I want to see where RMS got his ideas ? Did he invent all of them himself ? Is he giving proper references to the sources of the ideas ? Is that plagiarism ? I am sick of such jews/zionists like RMS, Roman Polansky, Bernard Madoff, Larry Ellison (he had to pay 100K in court to a chinese girl he screwed), Stephen Wolfram, Albert Einstein spreading anti-semitism by their flagrant unethical behaviour. If you use someone else's ideas, give reference. Dont try to portray yourself falsely as a genius by hiding sources and weaving rosy false pictures of being a victim or born out of wedlock. you went to school and got good education. you got insights from your community and good mentorship from other jews in aggressive networking in the jews like other communities dont have. These are facts. Thats why these people dont stand to scrutiny and questioning. > > Emacs uses BZR, not SVN, and has > > done since the beginning of 2010. > Thanks for your correction. Updated my site. Write a good documentation using pencil and scan that helps newbies enter the field. If it is not there, you will be subject of perpetual criticism and no thanks. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Fascinating interview by Richard Stallman on Russia TV
On Jul 17, 2:49 pm, Cor Gest wrote: > Some entity, AKA David Kastrup , > wrote this mindboggling stuff: > (selectively-snipped-or-not-p) >>> Software is a puzzle and it must be explained to be able to do that, >>> its like a lock >> There is no unfreedom involved here. Freedom does not hand you a free >> ride. Only a free road. No one asks for a free ride. A free road is good enough. If RMS used other people's free roads (gnu is not the first free thing. the first free thing is what he got at AI labs at TAX Payer money. I read his interview where he said that the hackers would break into professor's offices. Perhaps we do the same to him and break into his FSF office and leave a "friend" note we came to get the docs he has not released.) which has proper signs, proper references, and he could ask profs proper questions, and get straight answers, he must do the same in return. The concise answer: We want a free road but not a free puzzle. Perhaps, next time when he is sick he take his DNA code and parse it using bison. Now, dont run away from this argument and bring each and every of the boys from his mailing list to tackle this question. He is a manager and he can put the volunteers to the task of documenting, illuminating and revealing the operation of his softwares and its evolution. He owes it to others [just like he got for free , I bet ya he could never afford any of his machines on his own money at that time when they were so rare so it must be public money. Even a company like IBM gets public funding. Its all issue of ethics, not of free software. Its issue of two way road. Or else our society would die. People all away in Africa are beginning to agitate from the theft of their resources and evolutionary time by europeans led by jews and so you gotta give them back by fully disclosing technologies. I know you can bribe say a big player like india. We dont want anti-semitism to spread and want the same ethical requirements for everyone.] to describe the algorithms used, references, or else, describe them if he dont want to give references. He need to give priorty to the past undocumented tools. Automatically, more volunteers will come. Right now, the mistrust of Richard Stall man and FSF is growing everywhere. Strength of my arguments stand on their validity. I repeat, no one wants a free ride. We want a free road that you seemed to offer. But we dont want a free puzzle. Or else, ask him to decode his own DNA alone in reasonable time. Its nothing but a code. > You know, nowdadys many 'people' are used to get everything on a platter > any mental incovieniences are circumvented as much as possible, so is > any try for independent thinking about anything strongly dissuaded. > > The last 25 years, since click-tah-icon-software emerged > "the dumbing down of programming" [1] has been on a rampage. > > [1]http://www.salon.com/21st/feature/1998/05/cov_12feature.html -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Fascinating interview by Richard Stallman on Russia TV
The XEMACS programmers have documented in writing that Richard Matthews Stallman asked them to explain every single line of code. They got exasperated and would explain him blocks. I suspect that they were playing the same game as him - perhaps giving him the same medicine. If he was NEEDY of an explanation of every single line, isn't it UTTERLY SHAMELESS of him to deny others similar information and give them such a puzzle ? We have the right to tell the people what it really is all about. By writing the GNU license, he eliminated the competition only from those one-in-a-million who were persistent enough to read his code and figure it out. This is because by not documenting and describing his softwares, he ensured that there is little chance that the multitude would be able to take the code and do anything with it. But by writing the GNU license, he made sure that those few who can understand it cant take it away and build on it. An new type of license is needed that requires concurrent documentation with each release, even if hand-written. Scans can be put together in a pdf and diagrams drawn with hand. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Fascinating interview by Richard Stallman on Russia TV
On Jul 18, 12:27 am, David Kastrup wrote:
> Emmy Noether writes:
> >> Some entity, AKA David Kastrup ,
> >> wrote this mindboggling stuff:
> >> (selectively-snipped-or-not-p)
>
> >>>> Software is a puzzle and it must be explained to be able to do that,
> >>>> its like a lock
>
> >>> There is no unfreedom involved here. Freedom does not hand you a free
> >>> ride. Only a free road.
>
> > No one asks for a free ride. A free road is good enough.
>
> Obviously you don't understand what you are talking about.
>
> > Perhaps we do the same to him and break into his FSF office and leave
> > a "friend" note we came to get the docs he has not released.
>
> You can't "get" anything that has not been written.
>
> > The concise answer: We want a free road but not a free puzzle.
>
> You have the freedom to walk the forest you perceive. You have the
> freedom to build the road that you want, in that forest.
>
> If it is a puzzle to you, that is your own problem. It is not a puzzle
> because somebody would have cut a whole into pieces and scattered them
> around. It is a puzzle because nobody put it together yet.
>
> Feel free to do so, doing others the service you want done.
>
> > Now, dont run away from this argument and bring each and every of the
> > boys from his mailing list to tackle this question. He is a manager
> > and he can put the volunteers to the task of documenting, illuminating
> > and revealing the operation of his softwares and its evolution.
>
> You want a free ride, very obviously.
>
> > He owes it to others
>
> And you think your whining entitles you to it.
By his own admission he broke into professor's offices to help others,
ie unlock the monitors. He has tried to project an image of a saint
for freedom. Its a DECEPTION. A scoundrel has a right to be scoundrel.
But if he projects himself as a saint, then people have a right to
clear the facts.
> What did you ever do to _deserve_ others working for you?
What did we do to deserve him to write that elisp manual of 800+
pages ? NOTHING. He gave it to us in the hope that his software will
spread like a VIRUS. He had hopes for money from big companies
probably, which he must be making to pay the astronomical rent in tbe
boston/cambridge area. I can assure you that he can document all the
essentials of his program in a thin book of a few hundred pages with a
trivial amount of man-hours compared to being spent on things which
brings fewer volunteers.
It is said : A picture is worth a thousand words. Make some transition
diagrams, structures, and UML type diagrams of the operation of the
software.
> What did you ever do to _deserve_ others working for you?
Draw a diagram, A state transition diagram to understand how illogical
you are.
A person arrives in the state of a newbie and wants to exit in a state
of having made a contribution to FSF. How can one do it without
adequate documentation ? Xah Lee has been complaining for a year.
First you deprive people of ESSENTIAL documentation to contribute.
Stall man has written user manuals to effect viral spread. But he has
not written operational details to get the same viral contribution by
others. He must not want it. Yet you want to use it as a taunt as in
pot calling the kettle black ???!!!
OK, why dont you explain a few basic things, if it not a
puzzle
DEFUN ("or", For, Sor, 0, UNEVALLED, 0,
"Eval args until one of them yields non-NIL, then return that value.
\n\
The remaining args are not evalled at all.\n\
If all args return NIL, return NIL.")
(args)
Lisp_Object args;
{
register Lisp_Object val;
Lisp_Object args_left;
struct gcpro gcpro1;
if (NULL(args))
return Qnil;
args_left = args;
GCPRO1 (args_left);
do
{
val = Feval (Fcar (args_left));
if (!NULL (val))
break;
args_left = Fcdr (args_left);
}
while (!NULL(args_left));
UNGCPRO;
return val;
}
I saw that on comp.lang.c and found no one capable of explaining it.
And where does the manual explain the C struct or ADT of the basic
cons cell ? which file has the definition ? where is his eval_quote
function definition ?
Basically, Richard Mathew Stall man is a STALLER of PROGRESS. He
expected the XEMACS people to EXPLAIN HIM EVERY SINGLE line of code.
What did he do to expect all this ? He was even paid money , as
claimed by the XEMACS people.
What did he do to deserve and EXPECT a line by line explanation from
them ?!! ANSWER this question and dont run away !!
He is prone to forgetting like all mortals and if he is prolific to
write that 900 page manual, I am sure he has hidden notes that he has
not released. Where was he recording the line by line explanation he
was receiving from t
Re: Fascinating interview by Richard Stallman on Russia TV
On Jul 18, 1:09 am, Nick <3-nos...@temporary-address.org.uk> wrote: > Emmy Noether writes: > > On Jul 7, 1:57 pm, bolega wrote: > >> "Democracy is sick in the US, government monitors your > >> Internet"http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BfCJq_zIdk&feature=fvsr > > >> Enjoy . > > > In this video, Stall man makes 4 promises to public but stalls on 2nd > > of them. > > I have no idea of the rights or wrongs of this case. But I've found > through experience that when someone uses a "witty" misspelling of > someone's name, they are almost always the one in the wrong. Huh, you forgot that the whole of GNU = Gnu Not Unix You have double standard and you know very well whats right and whats wrong. > 5 lines in > and here we are - so if your case has merit, think about whether you > want to do this. > > BTW - Did you see what I did there? I snipped all the rest of the post > as it wasn't relevant. I know several people have asked you to do it, > but you seem to be having difficulty with the concept, so I thought I'd > give you a practical example. > -- > Online waterways route planner |http://canalplan.eu > Plan trips, see photos, check facilities |http://canalplan.org.uk -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
A portable LISP interpreter that includes all the major list-processing functions is described. A complete, annotated listing of the program's code, written in PASCAL, is included.
Title Portable LISP interpreter Creator/Author Cox, L.A. Jr. ; Taylor, W.P. Publication Date1978 May 31 OSTI Identifier OSTI ID: 7017786 Report Number(s)UCRL-52417 DOE Contract Number W-7405-ENG-48 Resource Type Technical Report Research OrgCalifornia Univ., Livermore (USA). Lawrence Livermore Lab. Subject 99 GENERAL AND MISCELLANEOUS//MATHEMATICS, COMPUTING, AND INFORMATION SCIENCE; COMPUTER CODES; L CODES; COMPUTERS; PROGRAMMING; PROGRAMMING LANGUAGES Description/AbstractA portable LISP interpreter that includes all the major list-processing functions is described. A complete, annotated listing of the program's code, written in PASCAL, is included. Country of Publication United States LanguageEnglish Format Medium: X; Size: Pages: 21 AvailabilityDep. NTIS, PC A02/MF A01. System Entry Date 2008 Feb 12 -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: A portable LISP interpreter that includes all the major list-processing functions is described. A complete, annotated listing of the program's code, written in PASCAL, is included.
On Jul 23, 9:27 pm, TheFlyingDutchman wrote: > On Jul 23, 12:06 pm, Emmy Noether wrote: > > > > > Title Portable LISP interpreter > > Creator/Author Cox, L.A. Jr. ; Taylor, W.P. > > Publication Date 1978 May 31 > > OSTI Identifier OSTI ID: 7017786 > > Report Number(s) UCRL-52417 > > DOE Contract Number W-7405-ENG-48 > > Resource Type Technical Report > > Research Org California Univ., Livermore (USA). Lawrence Livermore > > Lab. > > Subject 99 GENERAL AND MISCELLANEOUS//MATHEMATICS, COMPUTING, AND > > INFORMATION SCIENCE; COMPUTER CODES; L CODES; COMPUTERS; PROGRAMMING; > > PROGRAMMING LANGUAGES > > Description/Abstract A portable LISP interpreter that includes all the > > major list-processing functions is described. A complete, annotated > > listing of the program's code, written in PASCAL, is included. > > Country of Publication United States > > Language English > > Format Medium: X; Size: Pages: 21 > > Availability Dep. NTIS, PC A02/MF A01. > > System Entry Date 2008 Feb 12 > > Is this available online? If only in hardcopy form, do they lend it > out? I am glad to share with everyone. However its useless without the ability to compile and run. Also with text, its easy to read and discuss the code which has a listing of 900 lines. I have already spent 4 hours scanning/processing to a stage where I got a decent OCR which needs hand-verification of pages. I need 4 or 8 volunteers depending on whether one want to do two pages each or 1 page each. Its an hour of joyful work each for two pages. Explanation are good quality. We will re-write to C, python etc. It must be edited in emacs in fundamental mode to override pascal mode indentation. Go to pascal mode periodically to colorize to indicate errors, and then revert before inserting anything. Stay close to the original page. Email me to receive image and initial ocr and lots of fixes I did by hand for more than 4hrs. Send only plain text message or it goes to spam. Then we share with everyone here or put it on some site. E.N. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: A portable LISP interpreter that includes all the major list-processing functions is described. A complete, annotated listing of the program's code, written in PASCAL, is included.
On Jul 23, 9:27 pm, TheFlyingDutchman wrote: > On Jul 23, 12:06 pm, Emmy Noether wrote: > > > > > Title Portable LISP interpreter > > Creator/Author Cox, L.A. Jr. ; Taylor, W.P. > > Publication Date 1978 May 31 > > OSTI Identifier OSTI ID: 7017786 > > Report Number(s) UCRL-52417 > > DOE Contract Number W-7405-ENG-48 > > Resource Type Technical Report > > Research Org California Univ., Livermore (USA). Lawrence Livermore > > Lab. > > Subject 99 GENERAL AND MISCELLANEOUS//MATHEMATICS, COMPUTING, AND > > INFORMATION SCIENCE; COMPUTER CODES; L CODES; COMPUTERS; PROGRAMMING; > > PROGRAMMING LANGUAGES > > Description/Abstract A portable LISP interpreter that includes all the > > major list-processing functions is described. A complete, annotated > > listing of the program's code, written in PASCAL, is included. > > Country of Publication United States > > Language English > > Format Medium: X; Size: Pages: 21 > > Availability Dep. NTIS, PC A02/MF A01. > > System Entry Date 2008 Feb 12 > > Is this available online? If only in hardcopy form, do they lend it > out? Are you willing to do some work on this ? On Jul 23, 9:27 pm, TheFlyingDutchman wrote: > On Jul 23, 12:06 pm, Emmy Noether wrote: > > > > > Title Portable LISP interpreter > > Creator/Author Cox, L.A. Jr. ; Taylor, W.P. > > Publication Date1978 May 31 > > OSTI Identifier OSTI ID: 7017786 > > Report Number(s)UCRL-52417 > > DOE Contract Number W-7405-ENG-48 > > Resource Type Technical Report > > Research OrgCalifornia Univ., Livermore (USA). Lawrence Livermore > > Lab. > > Subject 99 GENERAL AND MISCELLANEOUS//MATHEMATICS, COMPUTING, AND > > INFORMATION SCIENCE; COMPUTER CODES; L CODES; COMPUTERS; PROGRAMMING; > > PROGRAMMING LANGUAGES > > Description/AbstractA portable LISP interpreter that includes all the > > major list-processing functions is described. A complete, annotated > > listing of the program's code, written in PASCAL, is included. > > Country of Publication United States > > LanguageEnglish > > Format Medium: X; Size: Pages: 21 > > AvailabilityDep. NTIS, PC A02/MF A01. > > System Entry Date 2008 Feb 12 > > Is this available online? If only in hardcopy form, do they lend it > out? I am glad to share with everyone. However its useless without the ability to compile and run. Also with text, its easy to read and discuss the code which has a listing of 900 lines. I have already spent 4 hours scanning/processing to a stage where I got a decent OCR which needs hand-verification of pages. I need 4 or 8 volunteers depending on whether one want to do two pages each or 1 page each. Its an hour of joyful work each for two pages. Explanation are good quality. We will re-write to C, python etc. It must be edited in emacs in fundamental mode to override pascal mode indentation. Go to pascal mode periodically to colorize to indicate errors, and then revert before inserting anything. Stay close to the original page. Email me to receive image and initial ocr and lots of fixes I did by hand for more than 4hrs. Send only plain text message or it goes to spam. Then we share with everyone here or put it on some site. E.N. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
