Re: [RBW] Rivendell Rambouillet Randonneuring Road Bicycle "pointy lugs" Toyo? Waterford?

[Doug Van Cleve]

AFAIK, IIRC, these were all Toyo built.

Doug Van Cleve
Chandler, AZ

On Thu, May 9, 2024 at 3:28 PM Jerry Lynn  wrote:

> No mine, and no affiliation...
> $1,6999
>

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[RBW] Butternut touch up?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

Is there such a thing, other than as a science experiment?  Are the new
Homers the same color as the old Sam Appas, etc?

Thanks, Doug

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[RBW] Current cork grip gluing BKM?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

I just did a search on this and found a (largely inconclusive) thread from
2020.  RBW currently shows something like Amazing Goop/Shoe Goo being
liberally smeared on the bar before sliding on the grip, which of course
results in a bunch of that toxic goo pushing out from under the grip and a
grip that is completely fused to the bar.  I have read a couple folks
suggesting that they managed to secure the grips well (enough) but still
remove without destroying, which sounds pretty good.  Is there a current
"best" way/product for doing this?

Thanks, Doug

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[RBW] Nicest silver Tektro upright canti brake levers?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

What are the nicest all silver Tektro upright bar canti brake levers
currently available?  I’m redoing the bars and shifters on my Joe Appaloosa
and the cantis already on it are Tektro.

Thanks, Doug

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[RBW] WTB: unpunched/grooved cork grips

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

Anybody sitting on a set of these with no particular plans?  They are
currently out of stock at RBW and I’d love to get my hands on a set…

Thanks, Doug

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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Doug Van Cleve]

I clearly too WAY too long pondering my response, Garth nailed it here
IMHO...

Doug

On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 4:27 PM Garth  wrote:

> Now that I see Ted's bike the picture is more clear. the VO bars are the
> Grand Randonneur version which is markedly different from the Nouveau
> version.  The difference in reach is 35mm, 120mm down to 85mm. I was going
> to mention this but I assumed you had the Nouveau version. That bar or one
> like it, as there are many shorter reach and relatively normal looking drop
> bars these days, plus a bit more narrow width @46cm(hoods) may be enough
> without a different stem. The Salsa Cowbell, Zipp Service Course 70 XPLR,
> and some Ritchey versions come to mind as having 68-70mm reach and very
> slight flares.
>
> see here : https://bikepacking.com/index/gravel-bars/
>

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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Doug Van Cleve]

Hey Ted,

Pretty sure your pic confirms my suspicion...  Those bars have quite a long
reach and a fair bit of drop.  Even keeping the stem, something like a Soma
Highway One in 44 or 46cm would shorten your reach and drop a decent
amount:
https://www.somafabshop.com/shop/soma-handlebar-hwy-one-road-bar-4369?page=2=783#attr=3003,1855,2365
(I think ;^)

Doug


On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 3:37 PM Ted W  wrote:

> Well, if we’re sharing pictures. I don’t have any glamor shots yet but
> here’s what I’ve got right now (pardon the messy house, just moved).
>
> From back to front:
> * Velocity Cliffhanger rear wheel with Velo-Orange hub
> * 10spd 11-36 cassette
> * Deore derailleur
> * Shimano Alivio T4000 v-brakes
> * B17 saddle w/ Randy Joe Fab waxed canvas cover
> * Kaloy seatpost
> * Velo-Orange 1x crank with 42T ring
> * 60mm stem
> * Velo-Orange Rando bars
> * Grepp bar cotton wrap
> * Tektro aero levers
> * Velo-Orange rack
> * Cliffhanger rim, Shutter Precision PD-8 hub
>
> Riding on 29x2.2 SimWorks Super Yummy tires
> Bag by The Spindle ATL.
>

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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Doug Van Cleve]

Hey Ted.

Not sure if you mean the OG Moustache or the Albastache, but I can tell you
the OG requires a very short stem compared to drops.  It's because the main
hand position is the full reach, there really isn't a good tops position
like drops.  I gather that Albastache was designed mostly to shorten the
reach...  Also, you can't use upright bar stuff on either of them so a
flipped Albatross, Billie or Choco would seem to be best.

Doug


On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 9:18 AM Ted W  wrote:

> That's an interesting idea, Doug. I would have never considered flipping
> Albatross bars like that. Another option I've considered is Mustache bars
> with flat bar levers near the back instead of the typical road levers up
> front. It seems to me like those are similar, if narrower, than something
> like the Albatross bar but have a similar (slightly more accentuated)
> curve. And, like flipping the albatross bars, would give a drop instead of
> a rise... I might play with that idea a bit tonight.
>
> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 11:36 AM Doug Van Cleve 
> wrote:
>
>> Hey Ted.
>>
>> I personally wouldn't run a super short stem, but those wide drops (and
>> if I'm not mistaken relatively long reach) are making things worse for
>> you.  A narrower modern bend, short and shallow drop bar would reduce the
>> reach a fair bit, I think.  That said, I don't think any of the current
>> super long chainstay RBW bikes are really suited for drops.  I just put
>> together a JA that came with Albatross' and a Technomic, 9cm I think, and
>> it feels too close and too tall in front.  It's a 51cm IIRC, whichever size
>> is 650B, and the PBH size chart would have put me one size smaller.  I have
>> a Choco-Moose waiting to go on it, I'm hoping that slammed it will give me
>> more reach and lower bar height.
>>
>> Doug
>>
>> P.S.  You might consider flipped Albatross' as well, less reach and drop
>> than any actual drop bar but still some...
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 7:08 AM Ted W  wrote:
>>
>>> Got my Appa on Monday, built it yesterday and commuted to work on it
>>> today. First impressions are that it's exactly what I had hoped for. The
>>> ride is amazing and it feels so plush while still remaining responsive;
>>> nimble yet stable. But I think it could still be better and I want to
>>> channel the wisdom of the group.
>>>
>>> Currently, I have the bike built with drop bars (50cm V/O Randonneur).
>>> However, I know this frame, like many of the Riv frames, is really built
>>> with swept back bars in mind. Knowing this, I went with a stem that's about
>>> half my "typical" length. Unfortunately, it still feels like quite a reach
>>> to get on the hoods, not impossible, but not "normal". So, this is where my
>>> question starts:
>>>
>>> Do I continue to try shortening the stem, say to maybe 30-40mm, or do I
>>> give in to my swept bar destiny and spring for some new bars? And if I go
>>> with sweeps, which bars do people like on the Appa? I have 65mm Tosco bars
>>> on my Gus and it's wonderful on that bike, but being that I don't want to
>>> be quite so upright (and there's not quite as much room) on the Appa. I was
>>> thinking of going with either Billie or Albatross bars. The two are so
>>> similar, however, that I'm having a hard time deciding between the two. I'm
>>> probably splitting hairs, as usual, but I'm genuinely curious to see what
>>> y'all think.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> --
>>> Ted Wood < ted.l.w...@gmail.com >
>>>
>> --
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>> .
>>
>
>
> --
> Ted Wood < ted.l.w...@gmail.com >
>
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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Doug Van Cleve]

Hey Ted.

I personally wouldn't run a super short stem, but those wide drops (and if
I'm not mistaken relatively long reach) are making things worse for you.  A
narrower modern bend, short and shallow drop bar would reduce the reach a
fair bit, I think.  That said, I don't think any of the current super long
chainstay RBW bikes are really suited for drops.  I just put together a JA
that came with Albatross' and a Technomic, 9cm I think, and it feels too
close and too tall in front.  It's a 51cm IIRC, whichever size is 650B, and
the PBH size chart would have put me one size smaller.  I have a
Choco-Moose waiting to go on it, I'm hoping that slammed it will give me
more reach and lower bar height.

Doug

P.S.  You might consider flipped Albatross' as well, less reach and drop
than any actual drop bar but still some...


On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 7:08 AM Ted W  wrote:

> Got my Appa on Monday, built it yesterday and commuted to work on it
> today. First impressions are that it's exactly what I had hoped for. The
> ride is amazing and it feels so plush while still remaining responsive;
> nimble yet stable. But I think it could still be better and I want to
> channel the wisdom of the group.
>
> Currently, I have the bike built with drop bars (50cm V/O Randonneur).
> However, I know this frame, like many of the Riv frames, is really built
> with swept back bars in mind. Knowing this, I went with a stem that's about
> half my "typical" length. Unfortunately, it still feels like quite a reach
> to get on the hoods, not impossible, but not "normal". So, this is where my
> question starts:
>
> Do I continue to try shortening the stem, say to maybe 30-40mm, or do I
> give in to my swept bar destiny and spring for some new bars? And if I go
> with sweeps, which bars do people like on the Appa? I have 65mm Tosco bars
> on my Gus and it's wonderful on that bike, but being that I don't want to
> be quite so upright (and there's not quite as much room) on the Appa. I was
> thinking of going with either Billie or Albatross bars. The two are so
> similar, however, that I'm having a hard time deciding between the two. I'm
> probably splitting hairs, as usual, but I'm genuinely curious to see what
> y'all think.
>
> Cheers,
> --
> Ted Wood < ted.l.w...@gmail.com >
>

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[RBW] Re: WTB: Silver 170 triple crank

[Doug Van Cleve]

Wow, I did a fantastically bad job with my initial request!  I’m looking
for a 170mm crankset, or maybe 167mm if anybody has tripled on of the
external BB versions…

Doug

On Sat, Jun 24, 2023 at 9:32 PM Doug Van Cleve  wrote:

> Okay, I just realized I was not specific enough…  I’m looking for an RBW
> Silver brand crankset :^)
>
> Doug
>
> On Sat, Jun 24, 2023 at 10:21 AM Doug Van Cleve 
> wrote:
>
>> A 42/28 double *might* also do the trick...
>>
>> Doug Van Cleve
>> Chandler, AZ
>>
>> On Sat, Jun 24, 2023 at 10:12 AM Doug Van Cleve 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Howdy folks.
>>>
>>> Anybody holding an unwanted Silver 170mm triple crank in good
>>> condition?  I might buy a new one, now that they're back in stock, but I
>>> wouldn't hate saving some dough either.
>>>
>>> On a related note, what width BB would I need for a Silver triple on a
>>> Joe Appa?  The bike currently has a Sugino triple, it would be swell if the
>>> same BB would work (well)...
>>>
>>> Thanks, Doug
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: WTB: Silver 170 triple crank

[Doug Van Cleve]

Okay, I just realized I was not specific enough…  I’m looking for an RBW
Silver brand crankset :^)

Doug


On Sat, Jun 24, 2023 at 10:21 AM Doug Van Cleve  wrote:

> A 42/28 double *might* also do the trick...
>
> Doug Van Cleve
> Chandler, AZ
>
> On Sat, Jun 24, 2023 at 10:12 AM Doug Van Cleve 
> wrote:
>
>> Howdy folks.
>>
>> Anybody holding an unwanted Silver 170mm triple crank in good condition?
>> I might buy a new one, now that they're back in stock, but I wouldn't hate
>> saving some dough either.
>>
>> On a related note, what width BB would I need for a Silver triple on a
>> Joe Appa?  The bike currently has a Sugino triple, it would be swell if the
>> same BB would work (well)...
>>
>> Thanks, Doug
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: WTB: Silver 170 triple crank

[Doug Van Cleve]

A 42/28 double *might* also do the trick...

Doug Van Cleve
Chandler, AZ

On Sat, Jun 24, 2023 at 10:12 AM Doug Van Cleve  wrote:

> Howdy folks.
>
> Anybody holding an unwanted Silver 170mm triple crank in good condition?
> I might buy a new one, now that they're back in stock, but I wouldn't hate
> saving some dough either.
>
> On a related note, what width BB would I need for a Silver triple on a Joe
> Appa?  The bike currently has a Sugino triple, it would be swell if the
> same BB would work (well)...
>
> Thanks, Doug
>

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[RBW] WTB: Silver 170 triple crank

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

Anybody holding an unwanted Silver 170mm triple crank in good condition?  I
might buy a new one, now that they're back in stock, but I wouldn't hate
saving some dough either.

On a related note, what width BB would I need for a Silver triple on a Joe
Appa?  The bike currently has a Sugino triple, it would be swell if the
same BB would work (well)...

Thanks, Doug

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Re: [RBW] Re: WTB/WTT: Berthoud saddle anti-twist clamp

[Doug Van Cleve]

Hey Luke,

Thanks for the tip!  I will definitely give that a shot, nothing to lose…
 I’m no lightweight, I’m sure it would be a good idea on mine.

Thanks, Doug


On Fri, Jun 2, 2023 at 11:21 PM Luke Hendrickson 
wrote:

> I have an old Berthoud from the first 400 made and faced the same issue. I
> emailed Berthoud direct and they were willing to ship one via the post at
> no cost to me. I just explained that I had an older one without the clamp
> and they obliged. Hope that helps!
>
> On Friday, June 2, 2023 at 5:56:32 PM UTC-5 Doug Van Cleve wrote:
>
>> Howdy folks
>>
>> I’m looking for one of these for a didn't-come-with-one older but lightly
>> used Berthoud saddle.  As far as I can tell, it is not currently available
>> in the U.S. and shipping from Europe quadruples the price :^(  Please give
>> me a holler if you have one that you aren’t using or know of an economical
>> source...
>>
>> Thanks, Doug
>>
>

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[RBW] WTB/WTT: Berthoud saddle anti-twist clamp

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks

I’m looking for one of these for a didn't-come-with-one older but lightly
used Berthoud saddle.  As far as I can tell, it is not currently available
in the U.S. and shipping from Europe quadruples the price :^(  Please give
me a holler if you have one that you aren’t using or know of an economical
source...

Thanks, Doug

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[RBW] New crank?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

Have there been any pics or any info (other than it’s less chunky) about
this new crank set that’s coming out?

Thanks, Doug

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Re: [RBW] Craigslist, etc 2023

[Doug Van Cleve]

This Saluki seems pretty sweet, only weirdness is Campy Ergopower and
Shimano derailleurs matched up with a Shift Mate...

Doug

On Thu, May 4, 2023 at 7:56 PM Matthew Williams <
matthewwilliamsdes...@gmail.com> wrote:

> ==
>
>
> SALUKI
>
> 62cm
>
> 1550
>
> Hercules, CA
>
>
> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/bik/d/hercules-rivendell-saluki-650b-62cm/7615055602.html
>
>
> ==
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Atlantis Old vs New?

[Doug Van Cleve]

The OG Atlantis was a production frameset made in Japan by Toyo, based on
the Allrounder, which was first made by Waterford then some other builders
RBW used for a bit.  Not sure about lug variations in the Toyo Atlantis,
but other than color and name it is a completely different bike than that
current MIT version.  The Toyos are relatively conventional, not super long
like the current ones.  I'm pretty sure the Toyos never had any kind of
double "top tube" like many of the larger MITs did/do...

Doug

On Thu, May 4, 2023 at 11:51 AM Cyclofiend Jim  wrote:

> The "2" was on the first Atlantii, to acknowledge that the name had been
> used in the past by Bridgestone
>
> I have the old Atlantis page yonder -
> http://www.cyclofiend.com/rbw/atlantis/index.html
>
> There are a few scans of the pertinent flyers.
>
> J
> On Thursday, May 4, 2023 at 11:47:45 AM UTC-7 MisterMo wrote:
>
>> Is there a place to go to get Atlantis history and updates over the
>> years? ie, was there a Waterford Atlantis? Atlantis to Atlantis2 was? Did
>> Toyo produce Atlanti with both the roundy lugs and the pointy lugs?  How
>> does one tell the difference between Toyo, MIT and Wford? etc, etc. Thanks
>> for pointing me to a place with this info (or providing it here).
>
>

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Re: [RBW] WTB 650b conversion parts for Riv Road Standard

[Doug Van Cleve]

Are you sure this isn’t a Long Low?  I have a ‘99 JS Road Std, also with
short reach brakes (that probably maxes out between 32 and 35mm) and I
don’t recall the Road Std having any other brake option…

Doug


On Fri, Apr 28, 2023 at 2:03 PM Jim Bronson  wrote:

> I also have a Joe Starck Road Standard from that era, but mine has short
> reach brakes.  It barely fits a 700c 30mm under the brakes, I'm surprised
> you got a 35 in there.  Yours must have been built with more brake
> clearance than mine.   I also converted mine to 650B and have ridden it
> 10,000 kilometers of brevets that way and lots of other rides.  I'm not so
> sure you'll be able to fit a 42 in there though, the chainstay width and
> fork width is the limiting factor on my bike.  I'm pretty sure a 42mm would
> rub.  However, if you can make it work then more power to you.  I'm happy
> with my 38s and cream longboards I got from Rivendell.
>
> I want to also convert my Redwood, and I'm hoping it will fit 650Bx48.  I
> do have the parts to do it, but you would not like the rims I have anyway,
> I'm 6'7" 300+ and I've destroyed too many lightweight rims to buy any more,
> it gets expensive.  600-650 grams is where I shoot for now.  I've gotten
> good service from Velocity Atlas 650B, to name one in particular.
> Eventually though they all crack around the spoke bed and I have to get
> another wheel built.  I need to get back down to my pre-parenthood weight,
> more in the 240-260 range, that was easier on bike parts.
>
> Anyway good luck with your older Rivendell!  I love mine!
>
> Jim
> Austin suburbs
>

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[RBW] FYI, Clementine on eBay (not mine)

[Doug Van Cleve]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/115757177085

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[RBW] FYI, Joe Appa on eBay (not mine)

[Doug Van Cleve]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/166012105716

Doug

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Re: [RBW] Re: WTB: Nitto 32F mini front rack

[Doug Van Cleve]

Thanks guys.  Mine is a 51mm with cantis…

Doug

On Mon, Apr 3, 2023 at 10:26 AM greenteadrinkers 
wrote:

> Just for general knowledge, I recently installed a 32F on my 54cm Sam with
> Shimano Deore V-Brakes, plenty of clearance, and zero interference. Can't
> speak to any other combo, but if you have a 54 Sam with V-brakes, rest
> assured it will work (some light bending required).
>
> I'm super curious if anyone has mounted a Nitto NR20 to a 700c frame set.
> Might be one of those situations where you just have to buy and bend.
>
> Scott
>
>
> On Sunday, April 2, 2023 at 11:37:44 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> Don't have one but can confirm it fits an Appa BUT..it fits better with
>> cantilever brakes. The horizontal cable on v-brakes tends to interfere with
>> the center strut on those racks.
>>
>

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[RBW] WTB: Nitto 32F mini front rack

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks,

Anybody have one collecting dust?  These bolt on to an RBW Joe Appa fork,
correct?

Thanks, Doug

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let's talk about the All Rounder

[Doug Van Cleve]

Match was definitely after Joe Starck, my recollection is they were brought
online primarily because Joe could not keep up. While I was waiting for my
bike, so around ‘99, the match announcement was made. I think match was
making the relatively stock ones and Joe was making the more custom ones.
Mine is standard geometry, but custom tube selection, and I requested that
Joe make it if possible…

Regards, Doug

P.S.  I seem to recall that the match made bikes were brass brazed, the
first time for Rivendell frames, IIRC.


On Wed, Mar 29, 2023 at 8:19 PM Joe Bernard  wrote:

> Very strange. My memory is match was first - I think Starck was there at
> some point? - then he built on his own and for a while it was split between
> Starck and Curt Goodrich, then it was just Curt.
>
> Also this and that and the other thing happened, but I won't go over those
> old memories 
>

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Re: [RBW] WTB 54 Rambouillet or 55 Bleriot

[Doug Van Cleve]

Not sure what sizes the Romulus came in, but one of those would probably
work for you as well 

Doug

On Wed, Mar 22, 2023 at 4:01 PM mike naranjo 
wrote:

> Hi Everyone,
>
> I know it's a long shot, but thought I'd see if anyone has any leads for a
> Rambouillet in a size 54 or a Bleriot in a size 55.  Thanks in advance.
>
> Best,
>
> Mike
>

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Re: [RBW] Rivendell Garage Sale Saturday

[Doug Van Cleve]

Is that custom paint, or was there an orange Atlantis at some point?

Doug

On Sat, Mar 25, 2023 at 10:08 AM Keith Paugh  wrote:

> Did you achieve #7?
>
> (Beautiful Atlantis )
>
> k.
>
> On Mar 25, 2023, at 9:53 AM, Matthew Williams <
> matthewwilliamsdes...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Rivendell Garage Sale Saturday

[Doug Van Cleve]

So are the Silver cranks that are allegedly going to be available blems or
something, or in any case cheaper than usual?  I'd love to get a set on my
JA, but I won't be there and I'm still not sure about the old standard 170
triple or the 52/28 double...

Doug

On Fri, Mar 24, 2023 at 3:44 PM  wrote:

> Is anyone from Sacramento going?
> I really wanted to go but ended up on call this weekend.
> I want a Tosco bar and planned to go get one but maybe there’s a sale one
> at the garage sale.
> If anyone from Sacramento was going and could look for a Tosco for me, I
> can pay immediately on demand. Please reply offlist.
>
> Liz in Sacramento
>
> On Mar 24, 2023, at 05:00, Eric Marth  wrote:
>
> Brendan — Since one's a racer/half-basket I think that throws off your
> calculus. How exactly, I can't be sure.
>
> On Thursday, March 23, 2023 at 11:21:35 PM UTC-4 Brendan Willard in SF
> wrote:
>
>> I'll be there.  I set the Sam to carry home mode.  If I mount a 137 and a
>> 139, do I have a Wald 276?
>>
>> On Thursday, March 23, 2023 at 8:20:53 PM UTC-7 Brendan Willard in SF
>> wrote:
>>
>>> [image: IMG_4695.JPG]
>>>
>>> On Thursday, March 23, 2023 at 8:20:23 PM UTC-7 Brendan Willard in SF
>>> wrote:
>>>
 I'll be there.  I set the Sam to carry home mode.  If I mount a 137 and
 a 139, do I have a Wald 376?
>>>
>>>
 On Thursday, March 23, 2023 at 6:18:54 PM UTC-7 divis...@gmail.com
 wrote:

> I'm going to use my usual get-to-WC method:
>
> 1) wake, dress, coffee+carbs+insulin
>
> 2) ride the four miles uphill from West Berkeley to Rockridge BART on
> my Trek 720 (I'm barely a mile from North Berkeley and Berkeley BART
> stations, but they're on a different line. I'd have to go to MacArthur to
> change trains, and backtracking ticks me off. Rockridge is the last stop 
> on
> the Diablo Valley line before you cross the hills)
>
> 3) ride to Walnut Creek BART, about 2 blocks from RBWHQ
>
> Figure about 1 hour travel time, assuming that BART isn't cancelling
> alternate trains the way they've done every other time I've gone to Walnut
> Creek this year.
>
> Fortunately, they're starting at 10AM, instead of the 8 or 9AM that
> used to be the start time. I might actually get out the door at a
> reasonable hour and get there on time, to see if the NDS TA Criterium
> crankarm (which Joe Bunik said had gone AWOL somewhere about ten years 
> ago,
> when I bought the DS arm) has finally resurfaced.
>
> Peter "if I've only got panniers, that caps what I can buy and carry
> off" Adler
> Berkeley, CA/USA
>
> On Thursday, March 23, 2023 at 2:45:45 PM UTC-7 Greg J wrote:
>
> I'm planning to ride over on my A/R, if anyone wants to join me.
>
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[RBW] Old RBW road bike like the Rambouillet?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

Wasn't there an RBW road frame BITD that was basically a more basic
Rambouillet?  I think they were blue, and I don't remember if they were
offered concurrently or after.  I think there was also a tall version
called the Redwood...

Thanks, Doug

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let's talk about the All Rounder

[Doug Van Cleve]

Another plus, in 2023, is that most folks looking at pics of that bike
probably assume those are 29er or 27.5 wheels and it belongs to a GIANT ;^)

Doug

On Thu, Mar 23, 2023 at 10:12 AM iamkeith  wrote:

> 4. Counter-balancing this, I think small-diameter tires on big frame (mine
> is a 60cm) look really cool.  I know Grant doesn't though.   You have to
> remember that, when these and the XO-1 were made, 26" wheels were the ONLY
> way to get fat tires.  I can fit Rat Trap Pass tires or, currently 2..1
> gravel kings with no problem, but they're a bit tight under fenders.   I
> have some 1.95 Sim work Homage tires coming from Conway.  Maybe they'll be
> the goldilox size.
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Let's talk about the All Rounder

[Doug Van Cleve]

Pretty much what Joe said here, early RBW Waterford/Starck/Goodrich bikes
generally only had seat stay mounts if that.  My '99 Starck RS only has
dropout eyelets.  Very little about the current long chainstay, non-drop
bar offerings relates at all to the early(ish) day designs.  I would say
really the only constant is GP has always been an advocate of high bars...

Doug

On Wed, Mar 22, 2023 at 6:50 PM Joe Bernard  wrote:

> Long wheelbase: I've ridden a bunch of both, they're both good but my
> custom is a longbike cuz it's MAGIC.
>
> What Grant's opinion was 20-25 years ago: has changed on a bunch of stuff.
> The first iteration of Atlantis didn't come with mid-fork mounts, now just
> about everything from the company does. He changed his mind.
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Widest fenders that easily fit a Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Well I haven’t done anything with them yet, but I went ahead and ordered
the 700C 63mm fenders while they were on sale.  My thought is that I just
skip the centimeter or so where the fenders pass between the forks and the
seat stays when I’m reshaping. I doubt the minor difference in width will
be noticeable , but I can’t think of any reason why it shouldn’t work just
fine.  I’ll update with pics when I get to work on them…

Doug


On Wed, Mar 22, 2023 at 4:02 PM Paul Yokanovich  wrote:

> That's an idea Doug, however by reshaping the 63mm 700c fender to fit the
> smaller diameter 650b you would be widening the fender.  You would probably
> want to start with a fender that's more narrower.
>
>
> Paul
> On Thursday, March 9, 2023 at 3:34:50 PM UTC-6 Edwin W wrote:
>
>> Berthoud 60mm (700c) fit my 58cm Joe Appa fine with no manipulation.
>>
>> Edwin
>>
>> On Thursday, March 9, 2023 at 2:48:37 PM UTC-6 Doug Van Cleve wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks Paul!  Great info, I think Honjos are more scratch than I want to
>>> spend though :^(
>>>
>>> I wonder if getting a set of the V-O 63mm 700c fenders with the plan to
>>> reshape them would be nuts?  Apparently you just gently bend them as if
>>> you’re trying to widen them and it tightens up the curve…  I suppose it
>>> would be pretty cool if it worked, and pretty darn lame if they ended up
>>> ugly or ruined…
>>>
>>> Doug
>>>
>>> On Thu, Mar 9, 2023 at 9:36 AM Paul (GlennsBikeGarage) <
>>> pa...@myrealagent.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Doug,
>>>>
>>>> I'm currently installing the Honjo H80 62mm smooth fenders on my
>>>> daughter's 51cm Joe Appaloosa (650b) with 42mm Grand Bois tires. These
>>>> fenders fit without any special bending, cutting, or manipulation and I
>>>> would consider these the widest fender that will fit.  Hope that helps.
>>>>
>>>> Paul
>>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: FYI, 60cm Sam Hillborne complete in the Paceline classifieds

[Doug Van Cleve]

Now just a frameset and $900:
https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=292940…

On Sat, Feb 4, 2023 at 9:56 AM Doug Van Cleve  wrote:

> Should probably have added, "not mine"...
>
>
> On Sat, Feb 4, 2023 at 9:23 AM Doug Van Cleve  wrote:
>
>> Not sure this link will work:
>>
>> https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=281364
>>
>> Doug
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Has anybody 650'ed a Riv Road?

[Doug Van Cleve]

FWIW,

Mine is a Joe Starck ‘99 (maybe the earlier Waterfords are different), but
it fits a true 32mm with Campy dual pivots…

Doug


On Tue, Mar 14, 2023 at 10:58 AM 'Peter Bridge' via RBW Owners Bunch <
rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> Has anybody on the list 650'ed one of the old Rivendell Road frames, the
> ones that take short brakes and that max out at 28c tires?  What was the
> outcome?
>
> ~pb
>

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[RBW] WTT: Brooks Champion Flyer for B.17

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

I have a never mounted/ridden honey Champion Flyer that I *think* I bought
when Brooks was going out of business BITD.  It has lived in my bike
room/den since then, never been on a bike or out of the house.  I have a
use for a honey Brooks, but I suppose I would really rather have a B.17.
Anybody have a very clean, unmolested honey B.17 that you wish had
springs?  For that matter, I also have plain black B.17 that has certainly
not been ridden much, maybe only around the block.  I would also trade it
for one in honey...

Thanks, Doug

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Re: [RBW] Re: Widest fenders that easily fit a Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Alrighty, maybe the correct response was "no U.S. retailers have 650B x 60
Berthouds" ;^)  Thanks for the info!  Any thoughts on the long vs. short
for a bike that doesn't have a front rack now, but conceivably could in the
future?

Doug

On Thu, Mar 9, 2023 at 6:08 PM Mr. Ray  wrote:

> I bought my Berthoud 60mm x 650b here in stock.  If you have a front rack,
> buy the "long version" in the link otherwise buy the "short version":
>
>
> https://berthoudcycles.fr/en/1406-stainless-smooth-fenders-650b-x-60mm-front-long-w-hardware-polished.html?_gl=1*4zzmn0*_up*MQ..*_ga*MTE3NjA2MTg2MS4xNjc4NDEwMzY0*_ga_LLD45P3CY9*MTY3ODQxMDM2NC4xLjEuMTY3ODQxMDM3MS41My4wLjA
> .
>
> They also sell them in black.
>
>
> On Thursday, March 9, 2023 at 5:40:28 PM UTC-5 Doug Van Cleve wrote:
>
>> Not so fast, Doug!  Alas, there are no 60mm Berthoud 650B fenders that I
>> can find, so it looks like the V-O 58mm wavies are the best easy choice
>> after all...
>>
>> Doug
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 9, 2023 at 3:36 PM Doug Van Cleve  wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks Edwin :^)  These might be my winner, cheaper than anything but on
>>> sale V-O and the widest (of the economical options) that will fit without
>>> manipulation...
>>>
>>> Doug
>>>
>>> On Thu, Mar 9, 2023 at 2:34 PM Edwin W  wrote:
>>>
>>>> Berthoud 60mm (700c) fit my 58cm Joe Appa fine with no manipulation.
>>>>
>>>> Edwin
>>>>
>>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Widest fenders that easily fit a Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Not so fast, Doug!  Alas, there are no 60mm Berthoud 650B fenders that I
can find, so it looks like the V-O 58mm wavies are the best easy choice
after all...

Doug

On Thu, Mar 9, 2023 at 3:36 PM Doug Van Cleve  wrote:

> Thanks Edwin :^)  These might be my winner, cheaper than anything but on
> sale V-O and the widest (of the economical options) that will fit without
> manipulation...
>
> Doug
>
> On Thu, Mar 9, 2023 at 2:34 PM Edwin W  wrote:
>
>> Berthoud 60mm (700c) fit my 58cm Joe Appa fine with no manipulation.
>>
>> Edwin
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Widest fenders that easily fit a Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Thanks Edwin :^)  These might be my winner, cheaper than anything but on
sale V-O and the widest (of the economical options) that will fit without
manipulation...

Doug

On Thu, Mar 9, 2023 at 2:34 PM Edwin W  wrote:

> Berthoud 60mm (700c) fit my 58cm Joe Appa fine with no manipulation.
>
> Edwin
>
> On Thursday, March 9, 2023 at 2:48:37 PM UTC-6 Doug Van Cleve wrote:
>
>> Thanks Paul!  Great info, I think Honjos are more scratch than I want to
>> spend though :^(
>>
>> I wonder if getting a set of the V-O 63mm 700c fenders with the plan to
>> reshape them would be nuts?  Apparently you just gently bend them as if
>> you’re trying to widen them and it tightens up the curve…  I suppose it
>> would be pretty cool if it worked, and pretty darn lame if they ended up
>> ugly or ruined…
>>
>> Doug
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 9, 2023 at 9:36 AM Paul (GlennsBikeGarage) <
>> pa...@myrealagent.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Doug,
>>>
>>> I'm currently installing the Honjo H80 62mm smooth fenders on my
>>> daughter's 51cm Joe Appaloosa (650b) with 42mm Grand Bois tires. These
>>> fenders fit without any special bending, cutting, or manipulation and I
>>> would consider these the widest fender that will fit.  Hope that helps.
>>>
>>> Paul
>>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Widest fenders that easily fit a Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Yikes, of course...  If they are already max width, widening them to fit
the smaller radius is NOT a great idea after all.  Thanks for the reality
check :^)

Doug

On Thu, Mar 9, 2023 at 3:01 PM DavidP  wrote:

> Re-radiusing aluminum fenders is possible
> <https://velo-orange.com/pages/re-radiusing-fenders>, the concern in this
> case is that the VO 63mm fenders are already as wide as will fit. I suppose
> it may possible to do the "widening" on most of the fender, leaving the
> places where it would hit frame/fork alone, and this line from the linked
> article may suggest that could work "You don't need to do a lot at a time.
> Little bits over the length of the fender can decrease the radius enough to
> work."
>
> -Dave
>
> On Thursday, March 9, 2023 at 3:48:37 PM UTC-5 Doug Van Cleve wrote:
>
>> Thanks Paul!  Great info, I think Honjos are more scratch than I want to
>> spend though :^(
>>
>> I wonder if getting a set of the V-O 63mm 700c fenders with the plan to
>> reshape them would be nuts?  Apparently you just gently bend them as if
>> you’re trying to widen them and it tightens up the curve…  I suppose it
>> would be pretty cool if it worked, and pretty darn lame if they ended up
>> ugly or ruined…
>>
>> Doug
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Widest fenders that easily fit a Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Thanks Paul!  Great info, I think Honjos are more scratch than I want to
spend though :^(

I wonder if getting a set of the V-O 63mm 700c fenders with the plan to
reshape them would be nuts?  Apparently you just gently bend them as if
you’re trying to widen them and it tightens up the curve…  I suppose it
would be pretty cool if it worked, and pretty darn lame if they ended up
ugly or ruined…

Doug

On Thu, Mar 9, 2023 at 9:36 AM Paul (GlennsBikeGarage) 
wrote:

> Doug,
>
> I'm currently installing the Honjo H80 62mm smooth fenders on my
> daughter's 51cm Joe Appaloosa (650b) with 42mm Grand Bois tires. These
> fenders fit without any special bending, cutting, or manipulation and I
> would consider these the widest fender that will fit.  Hope that helps.
>
> Paul
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Widest fenders that easily fit a Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Thanks Dave!

Bummer that V-O 650B fenders max out at 58mm.  Honjos are out of my price
range…  There is a 68mm(!) Tanaka that is “cheap” enough but I fear will
require more manipulation than I prefer.  I’ve seen the really nice looking
indentations for fork blades and seat stays, but I have no idea how to
neatly do that and I’m pretty particular about stuff…

Doug


On Tue, Mar 7, 2023 at 1:13 PM DavidP  wrote:

> Hi Doug,
>
> Luke recently posted that he was able to squeeze Flat 65s on his Atlantis
> <https://groups.google.com/g/rbw-owners-bunch/c/kVYT0-CbniY/> but it
> wasn't a slam dunk. In the same thread, brizbarn posted that VO Fluted
> 63mm fenders just fit his 700c Joe
> <https://groups.google.com/g/rbw-owners-bunch/c/kVYT0-CbniY/m/cC5M6HioAAAJ>
> .
>
> I've been following such posts with interest as I consider fendering my
> Platypus.
>
> -Dave
>
> On Tuesday, March 7, 2023 at 2:30:29 PM UTC-5 Doug Van Cleve wrote:
>
>> Howdy folks.
>>
>> What are the widest fenders that fit a JA (650B, if it matters) without
>> any manipulation?  I don’t have mine assembled yet, but I have SKS P50s
>> that have previously been on the bike and a set of never mounted V-O 52mm
>> Zeppelins.  If something wider fits without cutting etc. I would probably
>> prefer that…
>>
>> Thanks, Doug
>>
>

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[RBW] Widest fenders that easily fit a Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

What are the widest fenders that fit a JA (650B, if it matters) without any
manipulation?  I don’t have mine assembled yet, but I have SKS P50s that
have previously been on the bike and a set of never mounted V-O 52mm
Zeppelins.  If something wider fits without cutting etc. I would probably
prefer that…

Thanks, Doug

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Re: [RBW] Velocity Dually Wheelset - $225

[Doug Van Cleve]

Funny question for you Joe,

Are the spokes on these porkers double butted (doesn't look like it but
maybe hard to tell)? Any opinions about these wheels on a Big Dummy?

Thanks, Doug

On Sat, Mar 4, 2023 at 9:26 AM Joe D.  wrote:

> For sale is a wheelset with perhaps the best plus size 26 inch rim on the
> market, the Velocity Dually, paired with Deore hubs. Great for a tire
> between 2.3 - 3 inches wide. The rear wheel is for 135mm quick release,
> disc brake only. Front is for 100mm quick release. Already taped for
> tubeless (but can run tubes just fine). Less than 100 miles on it and in
> like new condition.
>
> Price is $225, shipped. I had been selling only the rear wheel, but plans
> for another project changed so now it's the whole wheelset for sale.
>
> Why post on the rim-brake loving Riv site? Ha, good question! I think
> there are enough Riv aficionados with old Surly, Crust, etc. bikes that
> take 135mm rear and big 26" tires. Maybe I'm wrong though?
>
>
>
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[RBW] Re: FYI, 60cm Sam Hillborne complete in the Paceline classifieds

[Doug Van Cleve]

Should probably have added, "not mine"...


On Sat, Feb 4, 2023 at 9:23 AM Doug Van Cleve  wrote:

> Not sure this link will work:
>
> https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=281364
>
> Doug
>

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[RBW] FYI, 60cm Sam Hillborne complete in the Paceline classifieds

[Doug Van Cleve]

Not sure this link will work:

https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=281364

Doug

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Re: [RBW] Leker Leks Albacore bar (Simworks Ramble etc)

[Doug Van Cleve]

Looks kinda cool, love the cottage industry aspect of it.  All of these
types of bars seem VERY derivative of RBW and/or Nitto products though,
IMHO of course.  Also pretty sure the steel Nitto stuff will also rust
under the right (wrong ;^) conditions...

Doug

On Thu, Feb 2, 2023 at 10:31 AM Eliot Balogh  wrote:

> I think it looks cool but I’m pretty put off by the fact that it will rust…
>
> On Thu, Feb 2, 2023 at 8:28 AM  wrote:
>
>> Speaking of the Ramble bar, has anyone checked out the Albacore bar by
>> Lekerleks? Leker bars to be sold by Hope Cyclery. Sold at Mack’s Bikes and
>> Goods. Made in PA. A wide steel Albatross inspired bar. Not sure they’re
>> out there in the world yet.
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Craigslist (and others) Bikes For Sale: 3

[Doug Van Cleve]

This kind of stuff cracks me up:   "No haggling at this price- if you know,
it's a good deal!"

Doug

On Thu, Jan 19, 2023 at 9:17 PM JAS  wrote:

> CLEM H  59cm  $1500  Eugene, OR
>   lime-olive color
>
> https://eugene.craigslist.org/bik/d/eugene-rivendell-clem-smith-jr/7571155810.html
>
>
> PLATYPUS frameset  60cm  $1637  Eugene, OR
>   looks like the dark green color
>
> https://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/bik/d/eugene-new-rivendell-60cm-platypus/7580365799.html
> On Thursday, January 19, 2023 at 8:19:55 AM UTC-8 Keith Weaver wrote:
>
>> There's a small (48 cm), red(!) Hillborne in the Bay Area that I'm trying
>> to resist buying myself. I think it may be a bit small for me with my 79 cm
>> PBH, and not quite what I need to replace my Disc Trucker. I'm trying to
>> hold out until the next batch of Appaloosas.
>>
>>
>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/bik/d/oakland-red-48cm-rivendell-sam-hillborne/7578783667.html
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 19, 2023 at 5:40 AM MCT  wrote:
>>
>>> There is a 61cm Waterford A. Homer Hilsen for sale on Paceine for $1,000
>>>
>>> https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=291519


>>> 
>>
>> 
> 
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Tanaka 68mm fenders on a Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Thanks Nick!

On Mon, Jan 16, 2023 at 9:47 PM Nick Payne  wrote:

> They're not going to fit through the fork without a bit of work to narrow
> them where they pass through. I have the VO 63mm fenders on my Appaloosa
> (they actually measure 63.5mm), and there's only a fraction of a millimetre
> clearance each side where they pass between the fork blades - I fitted
> plastic frame protector dots on the inside of the fork blades each side to
> prevent the paint being worn off by the fender.
>
> The rear should fit OK, but it will probably need an indentation on the
> drive side just above the chainstay to clear the chain when in your lowest
> gear. The VO 63mm fenders come with this indentation already done, but
> looking at the Tanaka fenders on the Soma website, I couldn't see that they
> are similarly treated.
>
> Nick
>

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[RBW] Tanaka 68mm fenders on a Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

These seem like a great choice for a good price IF they fit without a bunch
of tweaking.  Anybody know if they do?

Thanks, Doug

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Re: [RBW] Re: Joe Appa sizing vs. PBH

[Doug Van Cleve]

Thanks Joe :^)

On Sat, Jan 14, 2023 at 1:25 PM Joe Bernard  wrote:

> My PBH is 79, I had a 51 Appa and it fit perfect. You're good to go!
>
> On Saturday, January 14, 2023 at 10:57:11 AM UTC-8 Doug Van Cleve wrote:
>
>> Oh, I am also wondering if the geometry chart for the JA still exists
>> somewhere?  I see one for the Atlantis, and I know they are similar...  Doug
>>
>> On Sat, Jan 14, 2023 at 11:52 AM Doug Van Cleve 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Howdy folks.
>>>
>>> So I already have one of these (shamefully not assembled yet), and I
>>> specifically wanted the 650B wheel size.  I would say that in general I
>>> ride about a 55cm classic road frame and I didn't/don't want to run the
>>> bars higher than about saddle height (I run about 72cm, depending on pedals
>>> & shoes).  I just did some digging, and my official done-by-GP PBH appears
>>> to be 79cm.
>>>
>>> It looks like the current rivbike.com listing shows 81 as the minimum
>>> PBH for the 51cm size, which I found interesting...  At this point it very
>>> much is what it is, but now I'm curious about the typical PBH for the 51cm
>>> model.  Any of you who own one that size, what is your PBH?
>>>
>>> Thanks, Doug
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Joe Appa sizing vs. PBH

[Doug Van Cleve]

Oh, I am also wondering if the geometry chart for the JA still exists
somewhere?  I see one for the Atlantis, and I know they are similar...  Doug

On Sat, Jan 14, 2023 at 11:52 AM Doug Van Cleve  wrote:

> Howdy folks.
>
> So I already have one of these (shamefully not assembled yet), and I
> specifically wanted the 650B wheel size.  I would say that in general I
> ride about a 55cm classic road frame and I didn't/don't want to run the
> bars higher than about saddle height (I run about 72cm, depending on pedals
> & shoes).  I just did some digging, and my official done-by-GP PBH appears
> to be 79cm.
>
> It looks like the current rivbike.com listing shows 81 as the minimum PBH
> for the 51cm size, which I found interesting...  At this point it very much
> is what it is, but now I'm curious about the typical PBH for the 51cm
> model.  Any of you who own one that size, what is your PBH?
>
> Thanks, Doug
>

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[RBW] Fwd: Joe Appa sizing vs. PBH

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

So I already have one of these (shamefully not assembled yet), and I
specifically wanted the 650B wheel size.  I would say that in general I
ride about a 55cm classic road frame and I didn't/don't want to run the
bars higher than about saddle height (I run about 72cm, depending on pedals
& shoes).  I just did some digging, and my official done-by-GP PBH appears
to be 79cm.

It looks like the current rivbike.com listing shows 81 as the minimum PBH
for the 51cm size, which I found interesting...  At this point it very much
is what it is, but now I'm curious about the typical PBH for the 51cm
model.  Any of you who own one that size, what is your PBH?

Thanks, Doug

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Re: [RBW] Do the Clem Smith Junior stepthrough bicycles have a used value?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Just a few thoughts, in no particular order...  Patience is a virtue
selling anything like this.  If you have time, just update your sales
post(s) and wait.  Fancy-ish parts are always worth the most separated from
the bike.  If you have the original parts, putting them back on and selling
off the upgrades will almost certainly net you the most moolah.  I sold a
nicely built ~58cm Saluki (predecessor to the AHH, I think) on this list
years ago for something like $1500 and purchased a Joe Appa with a dyno hub
but no saddle a year or so ago for about the same.  My $0.02 would be to
return it to stock configuration if you can and sell off the upgraded
parts.  Set the price at 3/4 or so of new and I bet it eventually sells...

Doug

On Thu, Feb 25, 2021 at 8:34 PM Brian Oldham 
wrote:

> I am surprised that in a month of listing my Clem for sale that I have not
> had one serious look or offer.  Does that mean that this bicycle has no
> market value?  It is the good bicycle that we all know and love, well made
> and superbly designed.  Apparently while is is a good bicycle to have it is
> not a good one to sell.
>
> I've added over $1,000 of upgrades and paid $1,600 to purchase.  It has
> treated handlebars, Cork grips, upgraded Shimano pedals, Nitto racks in
> front and back, a large Wald basket, Brooks seat, double kick stand, and a
> generator hub and light system.  I have asked for $1,500 thinking all the
> upgrades for free would be attractive.
>
> So what suggestions do you have for finding new homes for your used
> Rivendells"  Mine was new last October (2020).  Craigslist only works with
> an 80% discount on the purchase replacement value,  same with local ads.
> Pro's Closet is looking for fancy road bikes so not an option for this
> transaction.  I've considered returning it to Rivendell so they could find
> someone who would appreciate it.  I know I can give it to a bike collective
> or charity and that might be the best option.  I have done that in the
> past. Ive given bicycles to Bike East Bay and Silicon Valley Bike
> Coalition.  Trying to show repect to the bicycle and the waiting time to
> find one of these.
>
> Just wondering.
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: (Best) metal fenders for Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

THOSE seem perfect, and cheap!  Wonder if they are temporarily or
permanently out of stock?

Thanks, Doug

On Sun, Oct 11, 2020 at 6:53 AM Pat Smith  wrote:

> Soma sells "68mm" Tanaka fenders:
>
> https://www.somafabshop.com/shop/product/tanaka-fenders-3554?search=Fender--
>
>
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> 
> .
>

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[RBW] Re: (Best) metal fenders for Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Thanks everybody :^)

So the V-O Zeppelins are really too narrow, correct?  They would (of
course) work but would become the tire size limiter rather than the
frame/fork clearance...  Does anyone in the U.S. sell the 60mm Berthouds?
I also stumbled across the PDW Full Metal Beast 65mm fenders, pricey but do
they fit?

Doug

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[RBW] (Best) metal fenders for Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

I bought one of these off the list last year, came with the SKS vendors as
is typical for an RBW bike. I would like to put metal fenders on it, just
because. I have an unused set of the first generation V-O Zepplins, which
would work, but I suspect wider is really ideal based on the clearances of
the JA.   Cheap(er)-but-good is always the best for me, so I suspect the
V-O Wavy fender is the best choice. Am I missing anything?

Thanks, Doug

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[RBW] Re: Best smallish rear rack for long chainstay models?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks,

Kinda bumping this and rephrasing the question a bit.  Are there any
not-huge racks that mount up on the long chainstay RBW models without just
using super long stays to the rack top(ie. sit closer to the seat tube and
don't need the super long stays)?  Most pictures I see manage to work on
the long chainstay bikes by using really long supports from the rack top to
the seatstay mounts, which seems sub-optimal to me for at least a couple
reasons (looks, flexibility).  I would think with the LONG rear end, heel
clearance wouldn't be a big concern and a rack could sit further forward.
If such a rack doesn't exist, I wonder if there will be one at some point?

Thanks again,
Doug

On Fri, Mar 29, 2019 at 11:00 AM Doug Van Cleve  wrote:

> Howdy folks.
>
> Despite the whole front basket thing, AFAIK GP has never really been pro
> front loading.  It seems to me the long back end is perfect for a rear
> rack, assuming the stays and what-not are long enough.  What rear racks
> look good on these and fit well?
>
> Thanks, Doug
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: New Here. I am thinking of selling my Betty Foy, any advice on value?

[Doug Van Cleve]

You got it Patrick, knee wear and tear ;^)

Doug

On Sat, Apr 20, 2019 at 12:21 PM 'Deacon Patrick' via RBW Owners Bunch <
rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> - I'm unsure what Doug is referring to about "dangerous" low saddle.
> Saddles can be "too low" (whatever that is) and ride just fine and safe.
> Feel free to ride you saddle low as you get used to standing at stops, and
> raise it slowly if you desire or keep it there. The only issue I can think
> some folks may have with a "too low" saddle is knee strain, but proper
> riding techniques can make that a non-issue as well.
>
> It sounds like in every other way you delight in your Betty Foy. That
> seems to indicate it is properly sized and that some patience and practice
> will iron this issue out and you'l have a lifetime together of amazing
> riding! Feel free to holler at us with any head-scratchers! Grin.
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>

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Re: [RBW] New Here. I am thinking of selling my Betty Foy, any advice on value?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Hey cinzaw.

If I'm understanding what you wrote, you want to be able to touch both feet
to the ground while seated on the saddle?  If that is what you're saying,
that is not really related to the bike fitting you or not.  That saddle
height will also be far too low for efficient and safe pedaling, IMHO.
OTOH, there are bikes designed with a very slack seat tube angle to allow
this and still have adequate reach to the pedals for efficient pedaling.
Electra was the first I know of to do this, but I'm sure there are lots
like that available now...

Regards, Doug

On Fri, Apr 19, 2019 at 1:56 PM cinzaw  wrote:

> I have a blue Betty Foy I got fall of  2012 in quite  good condition.  It
> is a smidge too tall for my toes to hit the ground even with the post all
> the way down.  I may sell it if I can not get a good fit with a different
> saddle.  (currently B67  .. I will try B17s or C19)
>
> Any general advice on selling?   Condition very good, paint has nicks from
> locking.  Albatross handles, cork grips, gears on the handles Set for
> upright .
>
> How much might I hope for?
>
> ps.. My BF  a wonderful ride.. like a Rolls, but terrifying to jump off of
> in slippery conditions when I don't quite have my feet on the ground.
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Possible to remove cork grips w/out destroying them?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Thanks guys :^)

I didn't do the install, so I guess some investigation is in order.  If it
was me, I probably would have used plenty of whatever glue I chose and they
would probably be goners...

Doug

On Fri, Apr 19, 2019 at 9:27 AM David Bivins  wrote:

> I have a bike that had cork grips installed by Rivendell and I wanted to
> replace the bars. I assumed I would have to destroy them, but based on a
> post to this list recently, I just twisted them off. Riv had put just
> enough adhesive to keep them in place, but not so much as to make them
> impossible to remove with a very firm rotation.
> I did close to what Mark said when I put them back on the new bars - I put
> some bar tape on lengthwise and pushed/twisted the grips on. To be honest,
> one is loose now, so I'll add another bit of grip tape under that one.
> It was the perfect solution for me, because I didn't know if the bars I
> installed would be right for me.
>
> On Fri, Apr 19, 2019 at 11:44 AM Mark Anderson  wrote:
>
>> On Friday, April 19, 2019 at 9:09:20 AM UTC-6, Doug Van Cleve wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> I gather these are always glued on and there are at least a couple
>>> adhesive options.
>>>
>>
>> Not necessarily.  The ones that are punched out and grooved for use with
>> bar-end shifters can just be held in place by the shifters/cables/brake
>> levers, but you're probably not talking about those.
>>
>> Depending on how much risk you're willing to accept, cork grips that
>> cover the ends of the bar can be attached reversibly by putting a little
>> cotton bar tape lengthwise on the bar to tighten up the fit if it's too
>> loose and just a little bit of shellac near the other end (still
>> wet/wicked-in when you install the grips) to secure the grip a little
>> better.  It is then possible, but slow, to dissolve the shellac holding the
>> grip on with alcohol later, just so long as the shellac didn't go too far
>> down the grip initially.
>>
>>
>>> Have any of you succeeded in removing a pair without completely
>>> destroying it?  I have a nice looking pair on some Albatross', but I want
>>> to try a Chocomoose on the bike and reusing the grips would be ideal.
>>>
>>
>> Unfortunately, the time to consider these questions was before installing
>> the grips.  I know whereof I speak.  I write this within sight of the bike
>> with cork grips I attached with Gorilla glue.  The grips, brake levers and
>> handlebar are now permanently a set, never to be parted.
>>
>> Cork grips are much more brittle than common rubber/plastic/silicone
>> grips and tightly fitting examples may not survive removal, or installation
>> for that matter, even if they aren't glued at all.
>>
>> Good luck,
>> Mark Anderson
>>
>>

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[RBW] Possible to remove cork grips w/out destroying them?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

I gather these are always glued on and there are at least a couple adhesive
options.  Have any of you succeeded in removing a pair without completely
destroying it?  I have a nice looking pair on some Albatross', but I want
to try a Chocomoose on the bike and reusing the grips would be ideal.

Thanks, Doug

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Re: [RBW] Re: WTB: Chocomoose bar

[Doug Van Cleve]

Thanks :^)

On Fri, Apr 5, 2019 at 4:50 PM J Imler  wrote:

> My Chocomoose measure 54cm.
>

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Re: [RBW] Metal Fabrication of headbadge type thing?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Jen Green:  https://www.headbadges.com/ !  She can work from a drawing or
photo...

Doug

On Fri, Apr 5, 2019 at 1:43 PM 'Deacon Patrick' via RBW Owners Bunch <
rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> My Boots will be named Beorn and thus my wife wants to get a bear badge
> (brass or metal of some kind) for it. Ideas of where to find such a thing?
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
> www.MindYourHeadCoop.org
> www.CatholicHalos.org
> www.DeaconPatrick.org
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: WTB: Chocomoose bar

[Doug Van Cleve]

Well I just found this under the RBW Choco Moose listing:

" Assuming price is not the decider, how to pick:

If you’re putting it on a mountain bike or a bike for loaded touring, and
that bike isn’t too small for you, get the CHOCO-MOOSE. Why not? It’ll work
great.

For any roadish or touringish bike get the CHOCO-NORM.

Specs
CHOCO-MOOSE: CrMo, 2.25lb, effective extension 12cm, 54cm wide.
CHOCO-NORM: Heat-Treated 2014 Aluminum, 0.75lb, 54cm wide.

Not to indulge your obsession with weight, only to make apples-to-apples
easier: A CHOCO-NORM with a 12cm Tallux stem weighs 9.6oz less than a
CHOCO-MOOSE"

So it appears there might only be one version...

Doug

On Fri, Apr 5, 2019 at 1:37 PM 'Deacon Patrick' via RBW Owners Bunch <
rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> Doug,
>
> I believe the Chocomoose are the same width as the standard Choco bar,
> which Riv states as 54cm wide. I say “believe” because I “think” I measured
> my Chocomoose when I got them and they matched, but to be sure I’d have to
> do that again. With the success of the Bullmoose bars, the Chocomoose are
> in reserve somewhere and I’d have to dig them out.
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: WTB: Chocomoose bar

[Doug Van Cleve]

Thanks Patrick,

It never occurred to me that it might be different...  I don't know what
the RBW specs were, can't find anything on the website now.  Blue Lug seems
to say theirs is 54cm wide, at least I assume that is width since I can't
think of anything else it might be.  Anybody know if that is the same?

Regards, Doug

On Fri, Apr 5, 2019 at 12:55 PM 'Deacon Patrick' via RBW Owners Bunch <
rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> Look closely at the dimentions et al on the Blue Lug version. The
> Bullmoose is narrower than Riv’s Bullmoose bar (66cm vs. 61?), which I
> found out the hard way getting one from Ben’s Cyclery (I decided to keep it
> for the shipping issue of a big bar, though they generiously offered to
> take it back. They were unaware of the difference). I think Riv now has
> exclusive on their Nitto bar designs (which is a good thing), but it also
> means bars with the same basic design with “just enough” changes may be out
> there.
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: WTB: Chocomoose bar

[Doug Van Cleve]

Hey Joe,

I have no idea what RBW was selling them for when they had them.  I just
Googled "chocomoose" and Blue Lug popped up.  Shipping is not super cheap,
but if you include one of their t-shirts in your order, shipping is free
and you get a shirt for a bit less than just the bars shipped...

Regards, Doug

On Fri, Apr 5, 2019 at 12:04 PM Joe Bernard  wrote:

> Wasn't that a $160 bar from Riv? If Blue Lug is asking $83 I'd jump on it;
> there aren't a billion of them out there.
>
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[RBW] Re: WTB: Chocomoose bar

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks,

Still looking for one of these bad boys.  Looks like Blue Lug has them for
about $83, and shipping is free if I buy a moderately overpriced t-shirt,
so I probably don't want to spend much more than 90 bucks or so...  Anyone?

Thanks, Doug

On Mon, Mar 25, 2019 at 10:58 PM Doug Van Cleve  wrote:

> Howdy folks.
>
> Looks like a Joe Appa will probably be heading my way in the relatively
> near future.  It doesn’t have a Chocomoose though, and I always thought if
> I got one it should.  Anybody have an unloved Chocomoose gathering dust?
>
> Thanks, Doug
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Touch-up for the mustard/butternut color?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Thanks Weston, please send us an update with your impressions!

Doug

On Mon, Apr 1, 2019 at 2:09 PM Weston Hein  wrote:

> I have a mustard Clem and was going to order a RAL 1027 touch up pen. Not
> sure if it's exact but should be close enough for me. Hope this helps!
>
> https://www.lvppaints.com/RAL-1027-Touch-Up-Pen.html
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Best smallish rear rack for long chainstay models?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Thanks Jeremy :^)

No particular goal, probably not looking for a rack that is optimized for
big panniers though...

Doug

On Fri, Mar 29, 2019 at 11:58 AM Jeremy Till  wrote:

> What kind of bags are you thinking about using? Kind of determines which
> rack is best. I've had my Nitto Big Back rack on my Clem to carry panniers
> and it worked well. I'd say it's a touch flexier than the same rack on a
> shorter chain stay bike (like my Long Haul Trucker) because the upper stays
> are more extended to reach the upper mounts on the seat stays. Most of the
> long chain stay models have a second set of M6 eyelets mounted a few cm up
> from the dropouts which helps center the load within the wheelbase more.
>
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[RBW] Touch-up for the mustard/butternut color?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

Is there an official or unofficial best matching touch-up for this color?
I believe it was used on the Joe Appa and Clem, not sure if there were any
others.

Thanks, Doug

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[RBW] Best smallish rear rack for long chainstay models?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

Despite the whole front basket thing, AFAIK GP has never really been pro
front loading.  It seems to me the long back end is perfect for a rear
rack, assuming the stays and what-not are long enough.  What rear racks
look good on these and fit well?

Thanks, Doug

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Re: [RBW] Chocomoose on 51cm Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Thanks Ryan, I will check it out :^)

On Fri, Mar 29, 2019 at 9:53 AM Ryan M. 
wrote:

> Other recipients:
> I have a 51cm Appaloosa and a Chocomoose bar that I originally was using
> on the bike; I am not using a regular bullmoose bar on it. You can slam it
> all the way down in the steer tube. On Friday, March 29, 2019 at 8:40:59 AM
> UTC-5, Bill Lindsay
>
> I have a 51cm Appaloosa that I originally used with a Chocomoose bar
> setup. I am now using a regular bullmoose bar setup on it. You can slam
> both of those bars all the way down into the steer tube on a 51cm. They
> still have some rise. Check out my Instagram at merrill8686 for pictures of
> the original build...hell, follow me if you want. Lol. (I love Instagram).
> I have one shot that shows the saddle/seatheight pretty good.
>
>
> On Friday, March 29, 2019 at 8:40:59 AM UTC-5, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> Email Mark at Riv. He’s certainly buillt more 51cm Appas than anyone else
>> on earth and would definitely be able to tell you if the Chocomoose stem is
>> slammable on a 51. He probably won’t be able to tell you what your final
>> saddle to bars height difference will be, but at least he can cover that
>> slam/no slam question.
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito Ca
>
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Re: [RBW] Chocomoose on 51cm Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Thanks Bill :^)

On Fri, Mar 29, 2019 at 6:41 AM Bill Lindsay  wrote:

> Email Mark at Riv. He’s certainly buillt more 51cm Appas than anyone else
> on earth and would definitely be able to tell you if the Chocomoose stem is
> slammable on a 51. He probably won’t be able to tell you what your final
> saddle to bars height difference will be, but at least he can cover that
> slam/no slam question.
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito Ca
>
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Re: [RBW] Chocomoose on 51cm Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Hey David, great tip!

I would rather pay $27.10 for a t-shirt and get free shipping than pay
$33.04 for shipping and get no shirt ;^)

Doug

On Thu, Mar 28, 2019 at 2:12 PM David Bivins  wrote:

> FYI - if you need more than the Chocomoose bars, you can check what
> qualifies for free shipping from bluelug.com - I just bought the same
> bars from them and threw in a t-shirt I liked to qualify for free
> shipping.
>
> But Shoji's right, that setup has some rise.
>
> On Thu, Mar 28, 2019 at 4:25 PM Doug Van Cleve 
> wrote:
> >
> > Howdy folks,
> >
> > I am in the process of buying a 51cm Joe Appa.  It is complete, but I
> always envisioned Chocomooses on mine if I got one and it doesn't have
> them.  I also assumed I would "slam" them, I don't generally run bars above
> saddle height.  My saddle height is somewhere in the 71-72cm range,
> depending on pedals.  Anybody know if the Chocomoose quill will go the
> whole way down on a 51cm?  Anybody running one like that with a saddle
> height around 72cm?  I only ask because getting a the Chocomoose isn't
> cheap with the big box to ship and all...
> >
> > Thanks, Doug
> >
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Re: [RBW] Chocomoose on 51cm Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Thanks, folks :^)

Joe, it looks like the quill was the whole way down without bottoming out
in the steerer?  That might be good enough for me...

BTW, you had a 51cm Joe Appa and got rid of it to get a nearly the same
53cm MIT Atlantis?  I was pondering which to pursue, it seems like
everything is the same except the 51cm Joe has a bit more standover
clearance?

Doug

On Thu, Mar 28, 2019 at 3:34 PM Joe Bernard  wrote:

> Doug, based on these photos of that bike with those bars, it's a definite
> maybe that you'll get them level with the saddle, definitely NOT below.
> They're a little higher than my saddle here, which was set about 69-70cm.
>
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/6aXFGF2TcTdddV637
>
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[RBW] Chocomoose on 51cm Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks,

I am in the process of buying a 51cm Joe Appa.  It is complete, but I
always envisioned Chocomooses on mine if I got one and it doesn't have
them.  I also assumed I would "slam" them, I don't generally run bars above
saddle height.  My saddle height is somewhere in the 71-72cm range,
depending on pedals.  Anybody know if the Chocomoose quill will go the
whole way down on a 51cm?  Anybody running one like that with a saddle
height around 72cm?  I only ask because getting a the Chocomoose isn't
cheap with the big box to ship and all...

Thanks, Doug

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Re: [RBW] Re: I got a MIT Atlantis

[Doug Van Cleve]

Silver cranks w/ black chainrings (or at least the outer) might look nice...

Doug

On Wed, Mar 27, 2019 at 7:25 PM Joe Bernard  wrote:

> Good point, Doug, I have a couple all-silver cranks on other bikes. I may
> do some swapping around among silvers cuz I'd like to use the black one on
> my Seven.
>
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[RBW] WTB: Chocomoose bar

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

Looks like a Joe Appa will probably be heading my way in the relatively
near future.  It doesn’t have a Chocomoose though, and I always thought if
I got one it should.  Anybody have an unloved Chocomoose gathering dust?

Thanks, Doug

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Re: [RBW] Biggest tire/fender combo on a Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Thanks Ryan, that would be great for dirt riding so good to know...

Doug

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 12:57 PM Ryan M. 
wrote:

> I don’t run fenders but my Appaloosa, 51cm with 650b Velocity Cliffhanger
> rims, can run the 57mm Schwalbe G one with a bit of room for dirt and mud
> but not room for fenders.
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Biggest tire/fender combo on a Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Thanks guys.

I wonder if the tire clearance is equal across the different wheel sizes?
Sounds like tires marked 50mm should fit under big enough fenders...

Doug

On Wed, Mar 20, 2019 at 9:45 PM Ash  wrote:

> I have 46cm Appa and 50cm MIT Atlantis.  Tire clearance is the same.  With
> Compass RTP tire there was no room for fender.   These frames have 26'
> wheels, btw.
>
> Previously I had 51cm Appa.  I was able to use Schwalbe Almotion 650bx50mm
> with SKS fenders.  If I recall correctly there wasn't much room for tires
> any wider if I wanted to keep the fenders.
>
> On Wednesday, 20 March 2019 17:47:17 UTC-7, Jonathan K. wrote:
>>
>> Doug,
>>
>> I'm sure someone will chime in with bigger tires than me, but I have a
>> 58cm Appaloosa with 700x50c Big Bens under SKS fenders. The tires measure
>> 47mm on Alex DM18 rims. Plenty of clearance under the fenders, and I'm
>> guessing I could go 55mm. The tightest spot appears to be at the chainstay,
>> but I definitely have room to go bigger than my Big Bens. I'm thinking
>> about trying a set of Antelope Hills.
>>
>> I'm also curious how big people have gone with the Appaloosa. Also, I
>> think the new Atlantis has the same tire clearance (the geometry chart says
>> they're the same), so maybe Atlantis owner experiences would be helpful too?
>>
>> Jonathan
>>
>> On Wednesday, March 20, 2019 at 6:53:35 PM UTC-5, Doug Van Cleve wrote:
>>>
>>> Howdy folks.
>>>
>>> I will probably be getting my hands on a JA in the relatively near
>>> future.  I think what I'll probably want to do is put some alloy fenders on
>>> it that will work with the largest tire that fits with fenders.  I suppose
>>> it might matter that I'm talking about 650B.  What is the biggest
>>> tire/fender combo that has adequate clearance?
>>>
>>> Thanks, Doug
>>>
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[RBW] Biggest tire/fender combo on a Joe Appa?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

I will probably be getting my hands on a JA in the relatively near future.
I think what I'll probably want to do is put some alloy fenders on it that
will work with the largest tire that fits with fenders.  I suppose it might
matter that I'm talking about 650B.  What is the biggest tire/fender combo
that has adequate clearance?

Thanks, Doug

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Re: [RBW] Re: Cargo e-bikes are an amazing concept, but the options are imperfect

[Doug Van Cleve]

Not sure cargo bikes are for me, and pretty sure eBikes are not for me, but
I always thought the Bullitt was pretty darn cool and there are a couple
e-versions of it now:
http://www.larryvsharry.com/steps-ebullitt-technical-info/.  It does use
some kind of Shimano system, so maybe that is sub-optimal...

Doug

On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 8:25 PM William Henderson <
william.c.hender...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Another plus one on the center stand. Xtracycle has this nailed. This is
> probably the worst thing about the Tern, but thankfully there is an
> aftermarket center stand available (for major $$).
>
> William
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Mon, Mar 18 2019 at 6:25 PM,  wrote:
>
>> Plus one for the center stand (which the bakfiets has in spades). You
>> will never be able to control the climbing in and out factor without it &
>> they will climb when you’re least ready
>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: PSA - 1999 Riv All Rounder

[Doug Van Cleve]

That is old skool Riv there, tripleized Mavic crank, non-aero brake levers,
friction shifting long cage Simplex rear derailleur...  What a great color,
my '99 Joex2 RRS is the same color.  Congrats, Matt!

Doug

On Thu, Mar 14, 2019 at 12:33 PM Matt Beecher  wrote:

> What All-Rounder.  Nothing to see here
>
> Thanks,
> Matt
>
> On Thursday, March 14, 2019 at 2:06:10 PM UTC-5, Alan H wrote:
>>
>> Hey Folks,
>>
>> Just noticed a Riv All Rounder for sale on the Pros Closet today. Size
>> 57. Way too big for me but maybe it'll work for someone here...
>>
>>
>> https://www.theproscloset.com/products/rivendell-all-rounder-57cm-bike-1999
>>
>> Alan
>>
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Re: [RBW] Repair and Wet Paint Services on West Coast?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Noah's work is gorgeous, but a paint job from anybody like that (Joe Bell,
etc.) IS a small fortune.  Check out Allan Wanta:
http://www.wantaframes.com/. He isn't west coast any more, but he has a lot
of experience with complicated, factory replica paint jobs and better than
average pricing.  Search "Rivendell Road Repair & Repaint" here on RBW for
more info.  You might also look up Ed Litton, he did a tube replacement and
repaint on my bro's vintage Bianchi years ago.  Not sure what he is up to
these days...

Doug

On Thu, Mar 14, 2019 at 9:18 AM Kieran J  wrote:

> I've stripped down my very grimy orange Rambouillet for a post-winter
> makeover. Another frame I bought recently that arrived in near pristine
> condition really highlighted how tired looking the Ram is. It has collected
> many chips and scratches. It also has some light damage in the form of
> chain ring marring, and some minor mangling of the seat cluster and a tiny
> dent/ripple on the TT where something fell on it prior to my ownership.
>
> Over the years I have meant to have it fixed and repainted. Particularly
> when I lived in Toronto and VeloColour was located a 5-min drive from home.
> A 2-tone paint with repairs and decal recreation would have run probably
> upwards of $1k so I always put it off. Can anyone recommend/suggest an
> affordable painter in the PNW/West Coast Canada/USA that could also
> roll/Bondo the dent and massage the rest?
>
> The work will no doubt eclipse the value of the frameset but I love this
> bike and am loathe to part with it. It honestly doesn't give up much to the
> Della Santa racer I just put on the road. It deserves some TLC.
>
> Kieran
> Victoria, BC
>
>

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[RBW] WTB: 51cm Joe Appaloosa, preferably that mustard color

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

Anybody have one of these collecting dust, sad and neglected in a corner?
My preference would probably the complete stock build, but I would consider
anything not super fancy (unless of course super fancy is selling for a
similar price to ordinary ;^)  I REALLY want to try the Choco-moose bars,
so it would be ideal if it has them.  I would also go for frame/fork/bars,
as I probably have all the bits to build up a bike.  OTOH, I definitely
don't have any 650B wheels so those would also be good to get.

Thanks, Doug

P.S.  I have some possible trades, although I'm not sure shipping frames is
really the way to go (~56cm Mg Pinarello Dogma, NOS M Surly Big Dummy,
possibly others).

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Re: [RBW] Rivendell Timeline

[Doug Van Cleve]

I ordered my Riv Road Standard in ‘98 and received it in ‘99. It could have
been match built, but I specifically asked for Joe Starck to build it.
They were encouraging people to go with match, but left it up to the buyer
at that point.  I’m pretty sure the intent was for match to replace
Waterford for most of the builds and then the individual builder(s) would
do the “customs“.  I’m just going by memory, and it isn’t what it once was,
but I think match was only in the picture for a couple of years...

Doug


On Mon, Feb 25, 2019 at 9:21 AM Addison Wilhite 
wrote:

> This is great.  Something I'd love to see clarified if someone is more in
> the know than myself1)  What about the "Match" built era?  My 1998ish
> AR is match built but I don't really know the ins and outs of that window.
> Also, 2) Roland Della Santa had a brief stint building for Riv.  Not sure
> exactly when that occurred.
>
> Best,
>
> Addison Wilhite, M.A.
>
> Academy of Arts, Careers and Technology
> 
>
> *“Blazing the Trail to College and Career Success”*
>
> Educator: Professional Portfolio 
>
> Blogger: Reno Rambler 
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 25, 2019 at 7:28 AM Ted Shwartz  wrote:
>
>> The Quickbeam was announced in 2002, delivered on 2004
>>
>> Ted
>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: FS-Riv Road Custom frame/fork 54cm

[Doug Van Cleve]

It has a "56" engraved/stamped in the BB shell, I suspect that is a C-T
measurement and I'm also pretty sure the RRS had a slight upslope in the TT
as well.  Remember, this is a custom.  GP wouldn't do anything too weird,
but it could have a shorter TT than standard RBW geometry.  I'm pretty sure
my 55cm Joe x2 '99, which has custom tube selections but standard geometry
is closer to square...

Doug

On Fri, Feb 22, 2019 at 3:00 PM George Schick  wrote:

> Yeah, something about these dimensions just doesn't "click" right.  I have
> a 54cm Rambouillet and it measures 54cm from C (of the BB) to T (of the top
> tube).  From the photo of this Riv custom, it looks like the length of the
> head tube is almost exactly the same as my Ram.  BUT, the Ram has a 2
> degree sloping TT in order to make the head tube longer so the bars can be
> set higher.  The custom in the photo appears to have a straight
> (non-sloping) TT.  I'm suspicioning that this frame is a 56cm.
>
>
> On Thursday, February 21, 2019 at 8:13:22 PM UTC-6, Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>> Hey Jim, is the C-to-T measurement to the tip of the seatpost? I'd be
>> curious what the number is at the top of where the toptube bisects.
>
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[RBW] Joe Appa vs. new Atlantis?

[Doug Van Cleve]

 Howdy folks.

Apparently my first lazy attempt to post this resulted in it being buried
in an unrelated thread, as did my attempted re-post.  What the heck?
Anyway, here it is again...

Not sure if the current RBW offerings are really my style, but the Joe Appa
piqued my curiousity when it came out.  I see that it is currently not
available, but the new Atlantis seems very similar.  I would have gone for
a 51cm/650B Joe, and it seems like the 53cm Atlantis would be the most
comparable to it.  The main difference I see is the Atlantis has about 1cm
more top tube and can clear a bit bigger tires.  Am I missing anything, or
are they pretty darn similar?

Thanks, Doug

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Re: [RBW] Well done Cheviot marketing

[Doug Van Cleve]

Hey Patrick, thanks.

I have been on iBOB forever (although not as much as I used to be) and RBW
since it started (I think), just not a lot of posting here.  FWIW, I have a
Joe Starck built '99 Riv Road Standard, burnt orange, spec'ed by GP after
fitting me in person and built for me.  It has had a cool Mavic crank and
Ti railed B.17 on it since new and is possibly the only bike I own that I
will never part with.  Ironically by modern RBW standards, it has short
reach calipers and won't clear much over a true 32mm tire.

The reality of CF frames is that they aren't failing willy nilly all over
the place and are at least as repairable as steel.  That said, you can
certainly bend any not-super-technical steel frame back into shape and I
agree that CF handlebars, stems & seatposts require vigilance and torque
wrenches not really necessary with not-crazy-light alloy parts.  A steel
fork bent enough stop the front wheel/otherwise make the bike unridable
will, however, still put you on the ground.

I'm all for the durable and proven, I just didn't like that email, that's
all ;^)

Interesting to me, but I think there used to be a lot of overlap between
iBOB and the RBW list when RBW was young, but there doesn't seem to be much
at all any more.  I suspect it's because GP's frame design ideas have
changed a lot since the early days of Rivendell...

Regards, Doug

On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 1:57 PM 'Deacon Patrick' via RBW Owners Bunch <
rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> Doug,
>
> Welcome to the group! I think you’re new here? Diving into the deep end
> with this! Grin. “Not sure it matters much if a CF or aluminum frame breaks
> vs steel getting all bent up, severe crashing is bad either way.  I think
> RBW can do a good job promoting their offerings as versatile and unique
> without making statements that are opinion at best and easily disproved at
> worst...”
>
> The differences in fatigue and failure rates between CF, AL, and steel are
> science, not opinion. Grant has described that while CF tests strong one
> directionally (not laterally, so never ding your CF bike on a post, tree,
> or rock!), than invisibly fatigues quickly with use. The facts are the CF
> fails without warning and those failures can be catastrophic; steel bends
> and may remain rideable after an impact that visibly causes damage.
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
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[RBW] Joe Appa vs new Atlantis?

[Doug Van Cleve]

 Howdy folks.

Apparently my lazy attempt to post this resulted in it being buried in an
unrelated thread, thanks for the heads up IanA :^)  Here it is again...

Not sure the current RBW offerings are really my style, but the Joe Appa
piqued my curiousity when it came out.  I see that it is currently not
available, but the new Atlantis seems very similar.  I would have gone for
a 51cm/650B Joe, and it seems like the 53cm Atlantis would be the best
choice there.  The main difference I see is the Atlantis has about 1cm more
top tube and can clear a bit bigger tires.  Am I missing anything, or are
they pretty darn similar?

Thanks, Doug

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Re: [RBW] Well done Cheviot marketing

[Doug Van Cleve]

 The Cheviot seems pretty cool, I personally didn't like that email much.
More than ever, there are LOTS of "road" bikes that fit big cushy tires,
aren't quick handling and easily allow (pretty) high bars.  Not sure it
matters much if a CF or aluminum frame breaks vs steel getting all bent up,
severe crashing is bad either way.  I think RBW can do a good job promoting
their offerings as versatile and unique without making statements that are
opinion at best and easily disproved at worst...

Doug

On Thu, Jan 24, 2019 at 4:44 PM Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! <
jonasandle...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Rivendell and its dealers are really doing a great job promoting the
> Cheviot since the new batch arrived. I’ve seen them being pictured and
> adored all over Instagram lately. The Blaugh and BLUG have been saturated
> with gorgeous Chev photos and commentary, and we even got an email to boot.
> Even if I wasn’t already sweet on the Riv mixtes, I would be a convert
> after all this positive press. Folks have chimed in on how they love their
> Cheviots and the high praise they offer should make the rest of us rush to
> hit the “add to cart” button. It’s been fantastic to see this bike get such
> rich and rightly-deserved public adoration.
>
> In that vein, if anyone here has ordered a new Cheviot, it would be so
> enjoyable to see your photos, and same goes for the rest of you lucky Chev
> owners from previous batches! I really hope Rivendell SELLS OUT of them, 1.
> Because it’s good for them 2. Because I can stop hand-wringing.
>
> I can’t wait to see everyone’s photos and commentary - you guys are such
> fun.
> L
>
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[RBW] Joe Appa vs new Atlantis?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Howdy folks.

Not sure the current RBW offerings are really my style, but the Joe Appa
piqued my curiousity.  I see that it is currently not available, but the
new Atlantis seems very similar.  I would have gone for a 51cm/650B Joe,
and it seems like the 53cm Atlantis would be the best choice there.  The
main difference I see is the Atlantis has about 1cm more top tube and can
clear a bit bigger tires.  Am I missing anything, or are they pretty darn
similar?

Thanks, Doug

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Re: [RBW] Should I be concerned?

[Doug Van Cleve]

I should have mentioned that RBW bikes in general are pretty sturdy and I
would ride it without concern.  You might consider getting the frame/fork
alignment checked, although if it steers and tracks normally it probably
won't buy you anything...

Doug

On Thu, Jul 19, 2018 at 8:48 AM, Doug Van Cleve  wrote:

> Looks to me like it might have had at least a mild front end collision,
> although the cracks etc. would generally be on the bottom of the top and
> down tubes...  Maybe a roof rack incident?  The BB marks might be from a
> kickstand, highly unlikely the BB shell has been compromised in any way
> (IMHO, of course).
>
> Doug
>

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Re: [RBW] Should I be concerned?

[Doug Van Cleve]

Looks to me like it might have had at least a mild front end collision,
although the cracks etc. would generally be on the bottom of the top and
down tubes...  Maybe a roof rack incident?  The BB marks might be from a
kickstand, highly unlikely the BB shell has been compromised in any way
(IMHO, of course).

Doug

On Thu, Jul 19, 2018 at 7:02 AM, Ray Varella 
wrote:

> Does the Downtube have the same wrinkled paint at the head tube lug?
> That looks like the result of a crash. Is the fork bent?
>
> Ray
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Lower price Atlantis!

[Doug Van Cleve]

 ​Howdy folks
​​
I think the original Atlantis was really more of a somewhat stoutened All
Rounder (which was intended to be good for a lot of things ;^) than a true
touring bike.  Also, going back to the beginning, IMHO RBW wasn't really
about hand crafted bikes (although that aspect was celebrated).  Having
Waterford, then others, make them was the only way to get what GP wanted to
offer.  I think GP would have been happy to offer batch made/low production
bikes from the beginning, if it had been feasible...

Doug

On Thu, Mar 22, 2018 at 1:49 PM, Ryan Merrill  wrote:

> The one thing Rivs are are versatile machines and I don't think the new
> Atlantis can be pigeon holed like that. The original Atlantis was a touring
> bike, but how many people turned it into a trail bike?  That's the way I
> had mine set up and I never once toured on it. Worked pretty well on the
> trails.
>
> On Thursday, March 22, 2018 at 3:01:04 PM UTC-5, John Phillips wrote:
>>
>> Grant wrote,
>>
>> "We've ridden a lot of bikes, lots of variations, and we live surrounded
>> by roads and trails no more than 15 minutes by bike away. It's not DP-Rocky
>> Mtn style, but as BL and JW and other locals will attest, it's hard to
>> beat. More important, we ride them. I admittedly don't have the challenges
>> of fitting bikes into elevators or navigating 3-floor walkups, and I'm
>> sympathetic to those who do, but that's what Bromptons are for."
>>
>>So...the Atlantis is changing from a touring bike to a Mt. Diablo
>> trail/fire road model for East Bay, non-multi-modal commuting, ranch home
>> owners? To me this is clear as mud, and it seems like a very small
>> demographic to be aiming at.
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Eat Bacon Don't Jog--Goal set, goal met

[Doug Van Cleve]

Pretty sure it is a similar idea/effect as "bulletproof" coffee...

Doug

On Thu, Mar 8, 2018 at 7:12 AM, Steve Palincsar  wrote:

>
>
> On 03/08/2018 08:45 AM, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> Steve asked why put coconut oil in your coffee.
>>
>> One tablespoon is about 120 calories of good fat.  A cup of coconut
>> coffee (like the one I’m enjoying now) is a pretty satisfying breakfast to
>> one who has gotten off carbs. I was going to drink the coffee and I wanted
>> to get those calories in. Eating a spoonful of coconut oil on its own would
>> have been fine I suppose. In my coffee makes me feel ‘Paleo Fancy’
>>
>>
> OK, got it.
>
> --
> Steve Palincsar
> Alexandria, Virginia
> USA
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: actual Roadini geometry specs?

[Doug Van Cleve]

My '99 JS Riv Road Std has a so-called "baseball bat" down tube that is
28.6 at the head tube and 31.8 at the BB...

Doug

On Wed, Nov 1, 2017 at 6:25 PM, Eric Daume  wrote:

> That's interesting, on the 61cm/XL at least, it looks like the top tube
> goes from 28.6 OD at the seat tube to 31.8 OD at the head tube. I can't
> recall seeing that kind of diameter change on other steel bikes.
>
> The clearances look tight for a 33mm tire with a fender.
>
> Eric
>
> On Wed, Nov 1, 2017 at 9:17 PM, 'Mark in Beacon' via RBW Owners Bunch <
> rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>
>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2017 at 5:16:59 PM UTC-7, eflayer wrote:
>> *I grew up in the 60's. I don't drink kool aid anymore.*
>>
>> Maybe not, but somebody needs a Snickers Bar.
>>
>> [image: Image result for snickers bar hangry][image: Image result for
>> snickers bar hangry][image: Image result for snickers bar hangry]
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Tuesday, October 31, 2017 at 7:26:10 PM UTC-7, eflayer wrote:

 I get GP's orientation to PBH but give the rest of the biking world a
 break. What are the actual dimensions of this frameset?

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Re: [RBW] WTB / WTT Tektro R559 with hex nut

[Doug Van Cleve]

Hey Jack.

Not sure if you'd be into this, but if you have a set of normal recessed
nut brakes you can use the rear on the front and the front on the rear. You
put the short bolt brake on the fork and put the nut inside the steerer. In
the back, use an external nut with a washer or one of those curved brake
bridge fittings. Works perfectly well and it's Sheldon Brown approved 

Doug

On Aug 20, 2017 6:16 PM, "Jack Barnes"  wrote:

I need the front brake with exposed hex nut, for older bikes.

I have a like-new front R559 with recessed nut that I could trade, but also
happy to just buy one if you aren't into trades.

Shipping to/from 97215.

cheers,
Jack

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Re: [RBW] Re: Jan's Yellow Rivendell

[Doug Van Cleve]

I wasn't accounting for inflation, and Jan might not have paid much more
than that.  My JS built Riv Road Standard was $1225 (or something like
that) in '98-'99.  Also, used ≠ new...

Doug

On Fri, Aug 18, 2017 at 5:56 AM, 'Mark in Beacon' via RBW Owners Bunch <
rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> Accounting for inflation, $900 in 1995 equals $1,444 in 2017, so unless
> Jan paid less than $900 back then, it did not sell for more than he paid
> for it.
>
> On Thursday, August 17, 2017 at 4:18:46 PM UTC-4, Doug Van Cleve wrote:
>>
>> It depends on your perspective...  Yes, you couldn't buy a new frameset
>> built like this one for that amount of moolah.  Very few things increase in
>> value though, and it sold for more that Jan paid for it, so I would say it
>> was above market value.  I am sure its provenance drove up the cost at
>> least a bit, and it has more than the usual number of braze-ons.  BTW, it
>> may not be custom from a geometry perspective (don't recall), but Jan chose
>> the color and the braze-on combo so it is at least semi-custom IMHO.
>>
>> Doug
>>
>> P.S.  Most custom bikes are not too different from stock geometries.  I
>> don't think there is anything odd about the geometry of the RS Riv that
>> is/was for sale, the issue is how much value e-Richie added to it compared
>> to any of the other non-Waterford Riv builders.
>>
>> On Tue, Aug 15, 2017 at 9:15 PM, iamkeith <keith...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I guess i don't see how that could be considered a high or artificially
>>> driven-up price.  It's still considerably less than any current, lugged
>>> production frame - US or otherwise - and,  in near perfect condition, has
>>> just as much life left in it.  It's also historically significant and more
>>> unique with those lugs and that crown.  On the other hand, in contrast to
>>> the Sachs-built frame being discussed concurrently, it doesn't suffer from
>>> the baggage of being a custom, and the idea that it was 'too' unique, and
>>> built for a specific person.  I guess I understand that some people might
>>> think that a used bike should always be obtainable for bargain prices, but
>>> not me.  If i was in the market for a road frame and this one fit, I'd
>>> choose it over a roadeo in a heartbeat, even at the same price.  Unique is
>>> good.
>>
>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Jan's Yellow Rivendell

[Doug Van Cleve]

It depends on your perspective...  Yes, you couldn't buy a new frameset
built like this one for that amount of moolah.  Very few things increase in
value though, and it sold for more that Jan paid for it, so I would say it
was above market value.  I am sure its provenance drove up the cost at
least a bit, and it has more than the usual number of braze-ons.  BTW, it
may not be custom from a geometry perspective (don't recall), but Jan chose
the color and the braze-on combo so it is at least semi-custom IMHO.

Doug

P.S.  Most custom bikes are not too different from stock geometries.  I
don't think there is anything odd about the geometry of the RS Riv that
is/was for sale, the issue is how much value e-Richie added to it compared
to any of the other non-Waterford Riv builders.

On Tue, Aug 15, 2017 at 9:15 PM, iamkeith  wrote:

> I guess i don't see how that could be considered a high or artificially
> driven-up price.  It's still considerably less than any current, lugged
> production frame - US or otherwise - and,  in near perfect condition, has
> just as much life left in it.  It's also historically significant and more
> unique with those lugs and that crown.  On the other hand, in contrast to
> the Sachs-built frame being discussed concurrently, it doesn't suffer from
> the baggage of being a custom, and the idea that it was 'too' unique, and
> built for a specific person.  I guess I understand that some people might
> think that a used bike should always be obtainable for bargain prices, but
> not me.  If i was in the market for a road frame and this one fit, I'd
> choose it over a roadeo in a heartbeat, even at the same price.  Unique is
> good.

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Re: [RBW] Re: PSA: Richard Sachs(!) Rivendell on CL

[Doug Van Cleve]

Don't get me wrong, it's super cool that e-Richie built it. For me, that
adds some value but it certainly doesn't double the value or anything close
to it…


On Fri, Aug 11, 2017 at 1:44 PM Joe Bernard  wrote:

> Yes, this is what I was alluding to in my earlier comment. I don't think
> there would be an appreciable difference in design and construction because
> e-RICHIE brazed it. It's a very nice Grant-designed Rivendell.
>

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