[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Marc Irwin]

If it's raining raining, I wear a Grunden's rain cape with Rivendell Splats and 
leggings.  If it's cool with intermittent or threatening rain I have a Chrome 
Storm hoodie I use with water repellent Gander Mountain pants.  I also have 
some Chrome Storm boots which are great on bad weather.

Marc

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Montclair BobbyB]

Wool, Ventile and waxed cotton all bring a smile to my face Worth the 
extra $ IMO.

On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at 11:18:37 AM UTC-4, Lungimsam wrote:
>
> What works for you in the rain when it is 60 degrees or colder?

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

['Rick' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Some spendy shoes that I purchased earlier this year:  

http://arcteryx.com/ProductFind.aspx?language=EN=Footwear=Shoes

We have had some wet weather lately, of the kind that would have inundated 
my previous go-to gore tex hikers and blundstones, and these worked dandy.  
Stiff sole in the approach shoes works well with my grip kings.


On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at 11:18:37 AM UTC-4, Lungimsam wrote:

> What works for you in the rain when it is 60 degrees or colder?

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Deacon Patrick]

Lynne, you don't say of whom you speak. "Someone doesn't get wet in the 
rain," aye? No need for snarky passive aggressive. I'll make a leap and 
presume you refer to me. Grin.

Though you didn't ask for it, I presume your hypothesis needs more data. 
Here is some. Currently here in sunny, dry Colorado it is 46˚F with 95% 
humidity, foggy to an extent we can't see the mountain across the way 100 
yards from us. While it hasn't rained constantly here the last three days 
it has rained several times for several hours. And the times I'm referring 
to staying dry during were periods of solid, steady rain for 12 hours or 
more, multiple days in a row. Put the tent away wet, set it up wet kind of 
rain for several days. It's common it the Colorado mountains (less on the 
front range) in Spring and Autumn. Not like the "typical" 20 minute summer 
deluge thunderstorms. That's a different kind of rain. And, lest we forget, 
ventile is from Scotland, precisely the type of climate that has this type 
of lingering, steady, multi-day rain more often than Colorado. It still 
exists because a smart niche of alpine climbers have recognized it's value 
and that it keeps them dryer and warmer when active in the wet than 
anything else.

With abandon,
Patrick

On Thursday, October 1, 2015 at 9:16:22 PM UTC-6, Lynne Fitz wrote:
>
> Wool layers are pretty good.  Baselayer, sometimes two, and a wool jersey.
>
> I know someone doesn't get wet in the rain, but I hypothesize that that 
> person lives somewhere that doesn't get the persistent rain that happens on 
> the east and upper west coasts.  Man, there is NOTHING like riding the 
> final 13 hours of a 24 hour event in the rain.  Nothing was dry.  We 
> stopped in a Subway 20 miles out, and puddles formed wherever we stood or 
> sat.  They were super nice, and just put out "wet floor" signs.
>
> Also, in the East Coast, I discovered that the humidity is so high that 
> NOTHING DRIES.  Not that I was getting rained on for most of that adventure.
>
>

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Lynne Fitz]

you grin sardonically, I snark.  Upper left coast; it's what we do.

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Re: [RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Steve Palincsar]

On 10/02/2015 12:57 PM, Lynne Fitz wrote:

you grin sardonically, I snark.  Upper left coast; it's what we do.



A reaction to the climate - perpetual rain and darkness?


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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Deacon Patrick]

I love it, Lynne! Works for me.

With abandon,
Patrick

On Friday, October 2, 2015 at 10:57:01 AM UTC-6, Lynne Fitz wrote:
>
> you grin sardonically, I snark.  Upper left coast; it's what we do.

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Tony DeFilippo]

For Will and Patrick, any issues ordering from Hilltrek or customer service 
notes.  I like the idea of that sort jacket but hate to purchase something that 
spendy both site unseen and from overseas. Can you confirm if the euro VAT gets 
removed for US purchasers?

And one more thing if your willing, it's tough for me to understand based on 
their site what makes up the 160 pound delta between the analogy smock and the 
double centile greenspot.  I see a nikwax pump liner mentioned but not 
explained.  Thanks!

Also how is this type of jacket similar or different from the Riv fancy rain 
jacket other than style?

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Re: [RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Steve Palincsar]

On 10/01/2015 07:02 AM, Tony DeFilippo wrote:

For Will and Patrick, any issues ordering from Hilltrek or customer service 
notes.  I like the idea of that sort jacket but hate to purchase something that 
spendy both site unseen and from overseas. Can you confirm if the euro VAT gets 
removed for US purchasers?


I've purchased many things from UK suppliers over the years including a 
Ventile jacket, and in every case the VAT has been removed.  Obviously, 
before buying a 200 GBP jacket I'd make sure by contacting them first, 
but that Hilltrek Greenspot Double Ventile certainly is a nice looking 
jacket, and it's available with (extra cost) custom sizing for sleeves 
and jacket length.





Also how is this type of jacket similar or different from the Riv fancy rain 
jacket other than style?



Probably very similar, perhaps even identical (hard to say, since it's 
not on the Riv site any longer).


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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Garth]

  You asked what did people wear in the rain in days of yore before the 
"waterproof/breathable" idea and sales pitch ?  

Most of the time when I rode in the rain,  I'm speaking of the late 70's 
early 80's,  I had a Bellwether "water resistant" jacket that of course 
wetted out , but it really never bothered me .  I rode centuries in it in 
the rain and in the 50 somethin' degrees. I had the pants also but rarely 
wore them.  I did have some Protog leg warmers I'd wear in the rain and 
cold at times and I was fine.  

I don't recall considering hands or feet at all , and wore regular shoes 
and gloves if I felt like it. 

Bottom line . . .  . I just rode .  The "conditions" are whatever they are 
,  and so what if they are !  I am as I am regardless of any and all 
"conditions" , nothing can take away or add to this !

Just Ride and Be !

_

No, you don't need special stuff at all, and don't need to be covered head 
to toe .  If you want to be that's okay too . No one needs a 
this-or-that-brand-mine-is-holiest-of-all garment or whatever  . .  ..  but 
it you do , so what !  It too is alright . 

You'll never get it wrong and you'll never get it right :)

Frowns are smiles seen from another perspective 

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Deacon Patrick]

Tony, great questions! First, Cotton analogy is in my experience superior 
to double ventile because of the capillary action that draws liquid 
moisture away to the outer layers. So a double ventile jacket will keep the 
wet out, it is less efficient at getting the wet out. Hilltrek, I believe, 
is the only company to offer Cotton Analogy.

I called Hilltrek and asked all sorts of questions. I explained my 
multi-purpose and they steered me away from the snug Greenspot and to the 
bulkier, but multi purpose Liathach. Everything about their customer 
service has been excellent and we've purchased from them multiple times. 
(Note, their pants/breeches are extremely tight fitting and they don't 
offer a loose fitting version. They tried what ended up being a one-off 
experiment pair of breeches for me, and with modification on our en I have 
a great pair of ventile breeches with enough room for cycling, running, 
squatting, sitting, but they don't offer it and seemed appalled at my 
adding 6" of fabric into the entirety of the inner leg area to make them 
work.) However, the Liathach jacket works great over a t-shirt, or over my 
heavy boiled wool sweater in winter. Lots of flexibility. Talk with them 
about your planned activities and your measurements and they will give 
recommendations. Feel free to email me off list if you have specific 
questions, though obviously my experience is limited and you milage may 
vary. 

Deleting the VAT is smooth and easy. I suspect the price difference you see 
is for the capillary action liner of the Cotton Analogy Jacket, which is a 
proprietary technology licensed from Paramo for use with ventile. "Analogy" 
refers to the liner working like animal fur, actively pushing/wicking 
moisture (vapor and liquid) away from the body to the outer layers. It 
really is amazing stuff and well worth the cost difference, at least in a 
jacket (my gators and breeches are double ventile).

The Rivendell ventile jacket does not have the fur-analogy liner, and I 
don't recall how many layers of ventile it has.

The main issue you'll have with Hilltrek is their timing and production 
line. If they are making to order (custom or not), they are a small shop 
and things can take a while. Well worth the wait. It's similar to waiting 
for a Rivendell frame/build. Small shoppe, amazing results.

With abandon,
Patrick

On Thursday, October 1, 2015 at 5:02:32 AM UTC-6, Tony DeFilippo wrote:
>
> For Will and Patrick, any issues ordering from Hilltrek or customer 
> service notes.  I like the idea of that sort jacket but hate to purchase 
> something that spendy both site unseen and from overseas. Can you confirm 
> if the euro VAT gets removed for US purchasers?
>
> And one more thing if your willing, it's tough for me to understand based 
> on their site what makes up the 160 pound delta between the analogy smock 
> and the double centile greenspot.  I see a nikwax pump liner mentioned but 
> not explained.  Thanks!
>
> Also how is this type of jacket similar or different from the Riv fancy 
> rain jacket other than style?
>
>

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Deacon Patrick]

I would argue that on longer events you will be more aerobic than 
anaerobic, and thus sweating less at any given moment. With a Cotton 
Analogy jacket in all day rain I have stayed wonderfully dry. I spent 
several years trying everything I could, and the lesson I learned is I 
should have bought the Cotton Analogy from the beginning. The difference 
really is that striking.

With abandon,
Patrick

On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at 10:25:35 PM UTC-6, Lungimsam wrote:
>
> So, sounds like for longer events there is no such thing as staying dry, 
> so warm is the thing.
>
>

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Matthew J]

A wool and Schoeller fabric option. 

 

On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at 10:18:37 AM UTC-5, Lungimsam wrote:
>
> What works for you in the rain when it is 60 degrees or colder?

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Lungimsam]

Welp, 400-800$US is outta my price range so Ventile and Cottonanalogy and 
Scholler is out.

I got the J Waterproof/Breathable helmet cover and jacket.
It looks massively vented with the top half of the garment separated from 
the bottom half all the way around, and not just a vent on the back. Big 
pit zips, too. Breathable material.
I'll layer wool underneath and hope it works good.

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Lynne Fitz]

Wool layers are pretty good.  Baselayer, sometimes two, and a wool jersey.

I know someone doesn't get wet in the rain, but I hypothesize that that person 
lives somewhere that doesn't get the persistent rain that happens on the east 
and upper west coasts.  Man, there is NOTHING like riding the final 13 hours of 
a 24 hour event in the rain.  Nothing was dry.  We stopped in a Subway 20 miles 
out, and puddles formed wherever we stood or sat.  They were super nice, and 
just put out "wet floor" signs.

Also, in the East Coast, I discovered that the humidity is so high that NOTHING 
DRIES.  Not that I was getting rained on for most of that adventure.

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Lungimsam]

That's the issue - the cold. What to wear to keep warm and dry. Although on 
long events maybe one cannot keep dry.

Riding in summer heat on a long event in the rain is one thing.

Doing it in the cold is another. 

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Lynne Fitz]

wool jersey, wool baselayers, wool cap, wool sports bra (these are LIFESAVERS), 
wool capris/knickers.  Wool socks.
Showers Pass Elite jacket
Rain Legs
Booties
Helmet cover

Of course, I'm planning to be out there for 200km or further.  I know I will 
not stay dry.  I aim for warm.

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[William deRosset]

Dear Lungimsam,

Effective full fenders come immediately to mind.

Are you riding to work, or out for a tootle, or out all day?

1. To work (running errands, etc): Take it easy, block the wind, and keep 
the rain off of the core. Civilian clothes, SPD shoes, and a double-Ventile 
jacket. Cap with brim. Wool Gloves.

2. Out for a tootle: Either same commuting or as all day, depending on how 
hard I'm working and my intent for the ride.

3. Out all day: You're getting wet. Better to stay warm in the process. 
Lycra cycling shorts. SPD shoes. Ultralight base layer. Wool jersey and 
brushed lycra arm warmers. wool tights or brushed lycra leg warmers on the 
warm side. Wool sox. Gore-tex or some other windproof/stretchy booties, or 
neoprene toe covers if on the warm side. Vented Nylon rain jacket on the 
cool side (though I carry, but haven't yet worn out, the un-vented, narrow 
comfort-range close-fitting goretex racing cape I've carried for the last 
ten years), or a wind-vest on the warm side. Rain claw mitts with 
long-finger wool gloves underneath. Wool cap with brim once it gets cold. 
Brightly-painted (usually white) styrofoam hat. 

I owned (and never used) rain pants for years. I prefer to live with wet 
leggings/tights. If it is not too cold, I'll also tend to not wear the 
racing cape--it is too sweaty under high exertion unless it is pretty 
chilly. A vented, looser fitting solution helps a lot with that issue (my 
Burley coated-nylon raincoat is actually more comfortable at the expense of 
greater bulk, weight, and flappiness). 

Best,

Will
William M. deRosset
Fort Collins, CO

On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at 9:18:37 AM UTC-6, Lungimsam wrote:
>
> What works for you in the rain when it is 60 degrees or colder?

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Will]

You might want to look into a Sierra Designs 60-40 Parka. I have one of the 
originals. Great ventilation. 

The original production had Ventile Cotton lining. Don't know if the 
re-issued line does. But my guess is it still sheds water well and vents 
well. 

On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at 11:08:47 AM UTC-5, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>
> Ventile. Specifically, on top, Hilltrek's Cotton Analogy Ventile. 
> http://www.hilltrek.co.uk
>
> What makes this vastly superior to every other rainwear option such that 
> it is worth the price in money and weight? Simple:
>
> -- Like others, it is waterproof from the outside in so rain won't get you 
> wet
> -- Unlike others (Goretex, poser Goretex, waxed cotton, rubbers and 
> laminated), it uses capillary action to draw vapor AND liquid out to the 
> outer layers so you don't get wet from your own sweat. Because it breathes 
> about as well as a cotton shirt, it is vastly superior at getting rid of 
> interior moisture vs all other options. So you can ride up mountain passes 
> and trails and not be wet in a bag from your own sweat. Try than in 
> anything else. Then immediately ride down and any residual moisture is 
> evaporated away and you stay dry and warm. All other rainwear I've tried 
> makes the descents teeth shattering experiences at 40˚F because of the 
> interior wet they can't get rid of (any moisture has to become vapor before 
> it can breathe through them -- they have no capacity to handle actual 
> liquid moisture).
> -- One rain jacket for any and all activities. Perfect for bikepacking. (I 
> also have a single layer jacket for lighter summer dayride use, when the 
> more extreme jacket's weight/space are not needed).
> -- I can drop a layer of wool from my pack because of the warmth of the 
> jacket, and it doesn't get too warm until you no longer need a jacket on.
> -- depending on what is worn under it, this system works in rain and snow 
> and wind of any combination from 60˚F to -30˚F at full (sweaty) activity 
> levels.
>
> My specific jacket is the Liathach: 
> http://www.hilltrek.co.uk/acatalog/Liathach-Cotton-Analogy-Extreme-Smock-.html
> I ride with the side zips up and the lower front panel tucked up inside, 
> giving free motion of the legs, yet having full coverage behind and all 
> round when off bike.
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
> On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at 9:18:37 AM UTC-6, Lungimsam wrote:
>>
>> What works for you in the rain when it is 60 degrees or colder?
>
>

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Deacon Patrick]

The notion that "you're going to get wet" if it rains all day and you're 
out in it is not true. Demand better from your clothing, because it is 
possible. Cotton Analogy (I believe only available from Hilltrek, keeps me 
dry all day regardless of activity level. There is no need to settle for 
trying to stay warm and wet when you can have dry and wet. 

With abandon,
Patrick

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Lungimsam]

Wow. Some of the prices on waterproof/breathable jackets online are 
unbelieveably high.

What did cyclists do back in the pre-1970 years, when their probably 
weren't lots of "breathable" artificial fiber materials those days? Were 
they paying an arm and a leg for rainwear back then?

 

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Deacon Patrick]

Fascinating, Will. My experience, to go into greater detail, is sweat gets 
things damp inside when I'm climbing, but then evaporates within 10-20 
minutes of my activity level dropping (faster if a downhill descent with 
lots of airflow). Rather like a cotton t-shirt on a summer day. It gets wet 
on the climb up, dries quickly after.

With abandon,
Patrick

On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at 4:44:29 PM UTC-6, William deRosset 
wrote:
>
> I've tried cotton analogy. Yep, it is great stuff, but it doesn't keep up 
> with my sweat rate if I'm riding hard. 
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Eric Norris]

Likely that many of them wore wool, which gets wet but keeps you warm. Or 
perhaps plastic- or rubber-coated fabrics.

On a side note, there was an expedition a few years ago that climbed Mt. 
Everest wearing clothing in the style of the 1920s. Wool, silk, canvas, 
etc.—very Riv-ish. They found that the early clothing worked surprisingly well:

http://www.trailspace.com/articles/2007/05/16/burberry-and-silk-climbing-everest-in-vintage-style.html
 

 

--Eric N
campyonly...@me.com
www.CampyOnly.com
Campyonlyguy.blogspot.com
@Campyonlyguy


> On Sep 30, 2015, at 2:33 PM, Lungimsam  wrote:
> 
> Wow. Some of the prices on waterproof/breathable jackets online are 
> unbelieveably high.
> 
> What did cyclists do back in the pre-1970 years, when their probably weren't 
> lots of "breathable" artificial fiber materials those days? Were they paying 
> an arm and a leg for rainwear back then?
> 
>  
> 
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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Will]

Waxed cotton capes weren't particularly expensive. They work. 

On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at 4:33:59 PM UTC-5, Lungimsam wrote:
>
> Wow. Some of the prices on waterproof/breathable jackets online are 
> unbelieveably high.
>
> What did cyclists do back in the pre-1970 years, when their probably 
> weren't lots of "breathable" artificial fiber materials those days? Were 
> they paying an arm and a leg for rainwear back then?
>
>  
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Steve Palincsar]

On 09/30/2015 05:33 PM, Lungimsam wrote:
Wow. Some of the prices on waterproof/breathable jackets online are 
unbelieveably high.


Ventile isn't cheap either.  (Not even close to cheap.)



What did cyclists do back in the pre-1970 years, when their probably 
weren't lots of "breathable" artificial fiber materials those days? 
Were they paying an arm and a leg for rainwear back then?





Rain capes were popular Way Back When, and with the right bike setup 
were pretty comfortable in the rain (lots of ventilation from 
underneath).  Not too expensive, either.


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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[William deRosset]

Dear Patrick,

I get wet on all-day rides if it is raining, either from wind-driven rain, 
or from my own cooling system. I can stay comfortable, but I won't stay dry.

I've tried cotton analogy. Yep, it is great stuff, but it doesn't keep up 
with my sweat rate if I'm riding hard. 

Others: I don't sweat out single-layer Ventile (I've owned a few over the 
years), but it wets out from the rain. I sweat out double-layer Ventile (my 
current general use jacket is a Hilltrek Greenspot jacket), but it is 
effectively waterproof for walking around and the like, and it is a 
wonderful backpacking jacket. The synthetic waterproof-breatheables don't 
keep up either (or the various gore-tex products, e-vent, and a couple of 
Patagonia WP+B things). The best for cycling is a heavily-vented waterproof 
or waterproof-breathable, and those leak at the openings--wet again.

My favorite commuting jacket is a lined cotton poplin jacket (like the 
Greenspot).

I pays my money and makes my choice. 

Best,

Will
William M. deRosset
Fort Collins, CO
On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at 3:22:15 PM UTC-6, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>
> The notion that "you're going to get wet" if it rains all day and you're 
> out in it is not true. Demand better from your clothing, because it is 
> possible. Cotton Analogy (I believe only available from Hilltrek, keeps me 
> dry all day regardless of activity level. There is no need to settle for 
> trying to stay warm and wet when you can have dry and wet. 
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[William deRosset]

One other note: 

My comment "you're going to get wet" is not necessarily true if you're not 
riding hard. Then the balance between sweat rate and waterproofness is 
different.

I dry off pretty quickly once the rain stops with the stuff I outlined 
above. Internally-generated heat and the wind blast helps with the 
evaporation rate, and I put layers back in the handlebar bag as they dry 
out (usually rain cape, rain gloves, arm warmers, leg warmers, in that 
order), and before I get sweaty and start wetting out the inner layers.

Best,

Will
William M. deRosset
Fort Collins, CO


On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at 4:44:29 PM UTC-6, William deRosset 
wrote:
>
> Dear Patrick,
>
> I get wet on all-day rides if it is raining, either from wind-driven rain, 
> or from my own cooling system. I can stay comfortable, but I won't stay dry.
>
> I've tried cotton analogy. Yep, it is great stuff, but it doesn't keep up 
> with my sweat rate if I'm riding hard. 
>
> Others: I don't sweat out single-layer Ventile (I've owned a few over the 
> years), but it wets out from the rain. I sweat out double-layer Ventile (my 
> current general use jacket is a Hilltrek Greenspot jacket), but it is 
> effectively waterproof for walking around and the like, and it is a 
> wonderful backpacking jacket. The synthetic waterproof-breatheables don't 
> keep up either (or the various gore-tex products, e-vent, and a couple of 
> Patagonia WP+B things). The best for cycling is a heavily-vented waterproof 
> or waterproof-breathable, and those leak at the openings--wet again.
>
> My favorite commuting jacket is a lined cotton poplin jacket (like the 
> Greenspot).
>
> I pays my money and makes my choice. 
>
> Best,
>
> Will
> William M. deRosset
> Fort Collins, CO
> On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at 3:22:15 PM UTC-6, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>>
>> The notion that "you're going to get wet" if it rains all day and you're 
>> out in it is not true. Demand better from your clothing, because it is 
>> possible. Cotton Analogy (I believe only available from Hilltrek, keeps me 
>> dry all day regardless of activity level. There is no need to settle for 
>> trying to stay warm and wet when you can have dry and wet. 
>>
>> With abandon,
>> Patrick
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Philip Kim]

Also forgot to mention pants--I use the levi's commuter collection.

I've had their commuter jeans which are waterproof for about a year and 
they have worked well. I also just wear normal rain boots


On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at 11:18:37 AM UTC-4, Lungimsam wrote:
>
> What works for you in the rain when it is 60 degrees or colder?

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Re: [RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Steve Palincsar]

On 09/30/2015 06:52 PM, William deRosset wrote:

One other note:

My comment "you're going to get wet" is not necessarily true if you're 
not riding hard. Then the balance between sweat rate and 
waterproofness is different.


Balance of sweat rate and waterproofness can also be affected by the 
state of the zippers on your garment.



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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Liesl]

I am just tickled pink to hear a woman proclaim that wool bras are lifesavers. 
And right here on this list! I, too, am a fan of the wooly supports in cold wet 
climes. You go, Riv Chica!

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Lungimsam]

This info I need is mainly for long events. I do pretty good in the rain on 
commutes and sub-30 mile rides. Easy to stay warm on summer rides.
So, sounds like for longer events there is no such thing as staying dry, so 
warm is the thing.

I'm already wool clad head to toe when I ride. So just need to try to keep a 
rain jacket or something to keep my trunk from getting utterly soaked at least. 
Normally I use a poncho but it is cumbersome with drops. I have Gore shoe 
covers. So that covers the feet. Also gloves.

Anyone tried the J waterproof/breathable/heavily vented jacket?
Looks like it and their helmet cover is reasonably priced: 
http://www.bicycleclothing.com/Waterproof-Breathable-Rain-Jackets.html

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Philip Kim]

I mostly use my Patagonia torrent shell has zippers at the armpit which is 
nice. Also use this as a winter wind jacket layering deep winter wool 
underneath it.

If don't know if it's going to rain or not, I carry my lightweight Columbia 
jacket, which goes into its own pocket.

On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at 11:18:37 AM UTC-4, Lungimsam wrote:
>
> What works for you in the rain when it is 60 degrees or colder?

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[RBW] Re: What do Rivendell riders use for cycling in the rain in the cold?

[Deacon Patrick]

Ventile. Specifically, on top, Hilltrek's Cotton Analogy 
Ventile. http://www.hilltrek.co.uk

What makes this vastly superior to every other rainwear option such that it 
is worth the price in money and weight? Simple:

-- Like others, it is waterproof from the outside in so rain won't get you 
wet
-- Unlike others (Goretex, poser Goretex, waxed cotton, rubbers and 
laminated), it uses capillary action to draw vapor AND liquid out to the 
outer layers so you don't get wet from your own sweat. Because it breathes 
about as well as a cotton shirt, it is vastly superior at getting rid of 
interior moisture vs all other options. So you can ride up mountain passes 
and trails and not be wet in a bag from your own sweat. Try than in 
anything else. Then immediately ride down and any residual moisture is 
evaporated away and you stay dry and warm. All other rainwear I've tried 
makes the descents teeth shattering experiences at 40˚F because of the 
interior wet they can't get rid of (any moisture has to become vapor before 
it can breathe through them -- they have no capacity to handle actual 
liquid moisture).
-- One rain jacket for any and all activities. Perfect for bikepacking. (I 
also have a single layer jacket for lighter summer dayride use, when the 
more extreme jacket's weight/space are not needed).
-- I can drop a layer of wool from my pack because of the warmth of the 
jacket, and it doesn't get too warm until you no longer need a jacket on.
-- depending on what is worn under it, this system works in rain and snow 
and wind of any combination from 60˚F to -30˚F at full (sweaty) activity 
levels.

My specific jacket is the Liathach: 
http://www.hilltrek.co.uk/acatalog/Liathach-Cotton-Analogy-Extreme-Smock-.html
I ride with the side zips up and the lower front panel tucked up inside, 
giving free motion of the legs, yet having full coverage behind and all 
round when off bike.

With abandon,
Patrick

On Wednesday, September 30, 2015 at 9:18:37 AM UTC-6, Lungimsam wrote:
>
> What works for you in the rain when it is 60 degrees or colder?

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