Re: [RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank

[Ray Walters via RE-wrenches]

I highly recommend _against_ the 2v L16s.  You are not going to a better 
battery, or fewer cells; just the cells are wired internally, making it 
very difficult to assess each cell independently.  I trouble shot a 
system of Trojan 2 v L16s, that was only 2 years old, but was trying to 
run a large compound.  I had to use my infared camera to ID the dead 
cells, and there were plenty of them, but each individual"2v" battery 
had correct voltage.


A system anywhere in this size range needs to go to real 2 v cells, like 
the HUP or other large format battery that is designed for what you are 
trying to do.  L16s are the equivalent of buying 4 VW bugs, when you 
really need one 3/4 ton Dodge.


Do yourself and your customers a favor, and save the L16s for systems 
that require less than 800 AH.   Batteries are the number one source of 
failure and dissatisfaction off grid.  Don't cheap out.


Ray Walters
Remote Solar

On 4/4/2023 5:42 PM, Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches wrote:
Hurts my head !  Agree that you will have more trips to this house 
after the next one. This is most likely not going to get you 2 more 
years. All of the wiring is good, clean, and tight?  Who really knows 
how long it could last? Probably fine thru summer and fall.
Much better with the next L16 size up and 24 (2V) cells. Lot's of 
capacity choices there from Rolls and others.

Almost Cheers time !
  
*Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar "we go where powerlines don't" 
http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/ e-mail offgridso...@sti.net text 
209 813 0060*



On 2023-04-04 4:21 pm, Ray Walters via RE-wrenches wrote:

So the 24 batteries are actually 72 individual cells that are trying 
to charge equally, with essentially no BMS. Its not just max strings, 
but max # of cells, and that's double my maximum.


You mentioned they use it pretty hard, so that's the other big part 
of how long L16s will last.  If the customer is barely using the 
available capacity, I've seen batteries last closer to 10 years, but 
in this case, I think the remaining cells are close to finished. I'm 
into using batteries for as long as possible as well, but customer 
and installer suffering come into play, as well as the fact they'll 
use much more water at the end of life, and cause a lot more 
corrosion damage.


Not to be a turd at the pool party, but its not reasonable to plan on 
another 2 years of service.  My guess is that you will probably have 
more cells fail by the time you return with the prorated warranty 
replacements.  Certainly rolling into the summer months, more cells 
are going to start failing like pop corn. (Pop, pop, pop)


Fortress is a good battery, but some of the programming, (especially 
LVD) can be tricky with older inverters.  I had to use the aux out on 
the CC to switch off the inverters.  IF the inverters are Outback, 
they have a remote switch, if its something else, you might have to 
actually switch off a relay on the AC output.


Ray

On 4/4/2023 2:45 PM, Daniel Young via RE-wrenches wrote:


Thanks all for the advice. I figured it was not worth trying on a 
different battery brand. I honestly needed to be able to tell them I 
researched it and asked my peers.


The client really uses the 3 x strings they have and did not really 
want to go down to 3. They are currently choosing to get the two 
Rolls under the prorated warranty, and hopes to get another 2 useful 
years out of the bank before planning to replace.


Already prepared him on the cost of the equivalent Li+ at todays 
prices. So he knows roughly where he is heading.


Side note: I am in the camp of trying for 2 x strings when possible 
(agree that 3 x strings is the absolute limit, and not the best 
option), simply because if a single cell goes bad, I don't want a 
client with essentially nothing available until we can get a 
replacement and get on site. With 2 strings, they can make due at 
least. That'll go out the window with Lithium though. Looking at 
Fortress Power for the next battery bank for this client. But we 
will see what changes in the market by the time it's needed.


With Regards,

--

Danny Young

NABCEP PV Installation Professional #031508-90

Engineering Team Lead
Solar Energy Solutions

Lexington | Louisville | Bloomington | Cincinnati | Evansville | 
Indianapolis


513-448-5176 (mobile)

877-312-7456 (Main Office)

da...@sesre.com 

*From:* RE-wrenches  
 *On Behalf Of 
*Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches

*Sent:* Monday, April 3, 2023 4:34 PM
*To:* RE-wrenches  

*Cc:* Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar  


*Subject:* Re: [RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank

5 years old on 3 strings, it might not matter to mix, better get 
ready for a new bank.


I have never used more than 1 string for my clients and get closer 
to 10 years life, so maybe there is better advice out there.


Good 

Re: [RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank

[Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches]

Hurts my head !  Agree that you will have more trips to this house after 
the next one. This is most likely not going to get you 2 more years. All 
of the wiring is good, clean, and tight?  Who really knows how long it 
could last? Probably fine thru summer and fall.


Much better with the next L16 size up and 24 (2V) cells. Lot's of 
capacity choices there from Rolls and others.


Almost Cheers time !

Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net
text 209 813 0060

On 2023-04-04 4:21 pm, Ray Walters via RE-wrenches wrote:

So the 24 batteries are actually 72 individual cells that are trying to 
charge equally, with essentially no BMS.  Its not just max strings, but 
max # of cells, and that's double my maximum.


You mentioned they use it pretty hard, so that's the other big part of 
how long L16s will last.  If the customer is barely using the available 
capacity, I've seen batteries last closer to 10 years, but in this 
case, I think the remaining cells are close to finished. I'm into using 
batteries for as long as possible as well, but customer and installer 
suffering come into play, as well as the fact they'll use much more 
water at the end of life, and cause a lot more corrosion damage.


Not to be a turd at the pool party, but its not reasonable to plan on 
another 2 years of service.  My guess is that you will probably have 
more cells fail by the time you return with the prorated warranty 
replacements.  Certainly rolling into the summer months, more cells are 
going to start failing like pop corn. (Pop, pop, pop)


Fortress is a good battery, but some of the programming, (especially 
LVD) can be tricky with older inverters.  I had to use the aux out on 
the CC to switch off the inverters.  IF the inverters are Outback, they 
have a remote switch, if its something else, you might have to actually 
switch off a relay on the AC output.


Ray

On 4/4/2023 2:45 PM, Daniel Young via RE-wrenches wrote:

Thanks all for the advice. I figured it was not worth trying on a 
different battery brand. I honestly needed to be able to tell them I 
researched it and asked my peers.


The client really uses the 3 x strings they have and did not really 
want to go down to 3. They are currently choosing to get the two Rolls 
under the prorated warranty, and hopes to get another 2 useful years 
out of the bank before planning to replace.


Already prepared him on the cost of the equivalent Li+ at todays 
prices. So he knows roughly where he is heading.


Side note: I am in the camp of trying for 2 x strings when possible 
(agree that 3 x strings is the absolute limit, and not the best 
option), simply because if a single cell goes bad, I don't want a 
client with essentially nothing available until we can get a 
replacement and get on site. With 2 strings, they can make due at 
least. That'll go out the window with Lithium though. Looking at 
Fortress Power for the next battery bank for this client. But we will 
see what changes in the market by the time it's needed.


With Regards,

--

Danny Young

NABCEP PV Installation Professional #031508-90

Engineering Team Lead
Solar Energy Solutions

Lexington | Louisville | Bloomington | Cincinnati | Evansville | 
Indianapolis


513-448-5176 (mobile)

877-312-7456 (Main Office)

da...@sesre.com

From: RE-wrenches  On Behalf 
Of Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches

Sent: Monday, April 3, 2023 4:34 PM
To: RE-wrenches 
Cc: Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank

5 years old on 3 strings, it might not matter to mix, better get ready 
for a new bank.


I have never used more than 1 string for my clients and get closer to 
10 years life, so maybe there is better advice out there.


Good Luck!

Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar

"we go where powerlines don't"

http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/

e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net

text 209 813 0060

On 2023-04-03 11:03 am, Daniel Young via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hello Wrenches,

Have a client with 24 x Rolls S550's. 2 of the batteries have given up 
the ghost. Rolls will replace them under the pro rated warranty.


The issue us, the client is wanting to replace them with non Rolls 
batteries to save $. They can get 400AH 6V L-16 form factor FLA 
batteries from a local battery house for the same price I am going to 
get the new Rolls for. And that also means they don't need to pay for 
freight. The net result is that they could save $4-500 by getting the 
batteries locally. No freight, and no markup on the batteries we 
provide (I can technically add the lost markup back in as labor, we do 
need to make something off of the 3hr one way drive to swap the 
batteries)


Question is, has anyone got experience mixing battery brands like this?

3 x strings of 8 c S550's (L-16HC would be the replacements) both dead 
batteries are on the same string.


Whole battery bank is near the 5yr old mark.

The last 

Re: [RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank

[Ray Walters via RE-wrenches]

So the 24 batteries are actually 72 individual cells that are trying to 
charge equally, with essentially no BMS.  Its not just max strings, but 
max # of cells, and that's double my maximum.


You mentioned they use it pretty hard, so that's the other big part of 
how long L16s will last.  If the customer is barely using the available 
capacity, I've seen batteries last closer to 10 years, but in this case, 
I think the remaining cells are close to finished. I'm into using 
batteries for as long as possible as well, but customer and installer 
suffering come into play, as well as the fact they'll use much more 
water at the end of life, and cause a lot more corrosion damage.


Not to be a turd at the pool party, but its not reasonable to plan on 
another 2 years of service.  My guess is that you will probably have 
more cells fail by the time you return with the prorated warranty 
replacements.  Certainly rolling into the summer months, more cells are 
going to start failing like pop corn. (Pop, pop, pop)


Fortress is a good battery, but some of the programming, (especially 
LVD) can be tricky with older inverters.  I had to use the aux out on 
the CC to switch off the inverters.  IF the inverters are Outback, they 
have a remote switch, if its something else, you might have to actually 
switch off a relay on the AC output.


Ray

On 4/4/2023 2:45 PM, Daniel Young via RE-wrenches wrote:


Thanks all for the advice. I figured it was not worth trying on a 
different battery brand. I honestly needed to be able to tell them I 
researched it and asked my peers.


The client really uses the 3 x strings they have and did not really 
want to go down to 3. They are currently choosing to get the two Rolls 
under the prorated warranty, and hopes to get another 2 useful years 
out of the bank before planning to replace.


Already prepared him on the cost of the equivalent Li+ at todays 
prices. So he knows roughly where he is heading.


Side note: I am in the camp of trying for 2 x strings when possible 
(agree that 3 x strings is the absolute limit, and not the best 
option), simply because if a single cell goes bad, I don’t want a 
client with essentially nothing available until we can get a 
replacement and get on site. With 2 strings, they can make due at 
least. That’ll go out the window with Lithium though. Looking at 
Fortress Power for the next battery bank for this client. But we will 
see what changes in the market by the time it’s needed.


With Regards,

--

Danny Young

NABCEP PV Installation Professional #031508-90

Engineering Team Lead
Solar Energy Solutions

Lexington | Louisville | Bloomington | Cincinnati | Evansville | 
Indianapolis


513-448-5176 (mobile)

877-312-7456 (Main Office)

da...@sesre.com

*From:* RE-wrenches  *On 
Behalf Of *Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches

*Sent:* Monday, April 3, 2023 4:34 PM
*To:* RE-wrenches 
*Cc:* Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar 
*Subject:* Re: [RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank

5 years old on 3 strings, it might not matter to mix, better get ready 
for a new bank.


I have never used more than 1 string for my clients and get closer to 
10 years life, so maybe there is better advice out there.


Good Luck!

  
*Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar*

*"we go where powerlines don't"*
*http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/*
*e-mail offgridso...@sti.net*
*text 209 813 0060*

On 2023-04-03 11:03 am, Daniel Young via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hello Wrenches,

Have a client with 24 x Rolls S550’s. 2 of the batteries have
given up the ghost. Rolls will replace them under the pro rated
warranty.

The issue us, the client is wanting to replace them with non Rolls
batteries to save $. They can get 400AH 6V L-16 form factor FLA
batteries from a local battery house for the same price I am going
to get the new Rolls for. And that also means they don’t need to
pay for freight. The net result is that they could save $4-500 by
getting the batteries locally. No freight, and no markup on the
batteries we provide (I can technically add the lost markup back
in as labor, we do need to make something off of the 3hr one way
drive to swap the batteries)

Question is, has anyone got experience mixing battery brands like
this?

3 x strings of 8 c S550’s (L-16HC would be the replacements) both
dead batteries are on the same string.

Whole battery bank is near the 5yr old mark.

The last rolls battery bank the client had lasted them 10 years.
(they baby the battery bank to be sure, and take maintenance
seriously)

I understand where the client is coming from, but do not want to
let them shoot themselves in the foot, and I simply do not know
what the chances are of swapping in batteries from a different
brand. In my head, I don’t see a big issue, even if they are sub
par, they will likely just get older faster, and fail around the
same time as the rest of the 4-5yr old battery 

Re: [RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric SCP

[Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches]

This just went up on the Schneider website thanks to Eric Bentsen. A 
complete guide on how to do this with a Samsung tablet


https://solar.se.com/us/wp-content/uploads/sites/7/2022/02/Tablet-Setup-for-InsightLocal-e-Guide.pdf

 It is under the Insight down loads at the bottom of page.

Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net
text 209 813 0060

On 2023-04-03 7:28 pm, Maverick Brown via RE-wrenches wrote:

The key word there is Cobbled. The off grid or grid interactive 
(battery backup in case of grid down) world really needs to rely on a 
smart phone?


Why couldn't Schnieder go the extra step and put a display "with enough 
memory" to support legacy and XW Pro equipment on the Insight product 
family. I.E. Cerbo GX with display from Victron. Schneider has all 
these cheap Chinese all in one product competition with display screens 
built in and some other products like the most excellent  Outback 
Radian that has yet to delete the Simple Man's display.


I understand the potential semiconductor shortage. I just hope 
Schneider can balance their approach.


Thank you,

Maverick

On Apr 3, 2023, at 9:15 PM, Glenn Burt via RE-wrenches 
 wrote:


Eric Benstennof SE demoed a pretty slick replacement that he cobbled 
together from off the shelf parts using a small tablet.

I saw it in Jan at an Alt-E installer conference.
I think I might have the details somewhere in my files, but it is 
basically an inexpensive android tablet, a USB charging wart 
usingneither WiFi or a USB type c Ethernet and power adaptwr and a 
wall mount for the tablet


-Glenn
Sent from my 'smart'phone, so please excuse typos and spelling errors.

-- Original message--
From: Mac Lewis via RE-wrenches
Date: Mon, Apr 3, 2023 7:31 PM
To: RE-wrenches;
Cc: Mac Lewis;
Subject:[RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric SCP

Hello Wrenches,

Now that Schneider has phased out SCP, what are the options for a GUI 
onsite for non-savvy consumers?


Thanks!
--

Mac Lewis

"Yo solo sé que no sé nada." -Sócrates 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank

[Daniel Young via RE-wrenches]

Thanks all for the advice. I figured it was not worth trying on a different 
battery brand. I honestly needed to be able to tell them I researched it and 
asked my peers.

The client really uses the 3 x strings they have and did not really want to go 
down to 3. They are currently choosing to get the two Rolls under the prorated 
warranty, and hopes to get another 2 useful years out of the bank before 
planning to replace.

Already prepared him on the cost of the equivalent Li+ at todays prices. So he 
knows roughly where he is heading.

Side note: I am in the camp of trying for 2 x strings when possible (agree that 
3 x strings is the absolute limit, and not the best option), simply because if 
a single cell goes bad, I don’t want a client with essentially nothing 
available until we can get a replacement and get on site. With 2 strings, they 
can make due at least. That’ll go out the window with Lithium though. Looking 
at Fortress Power for the next battery bank for this client. But we will see 
what changes in the market by the time it’s needed.

With Regards,
--

Danny Young
NABCEP PV Installation Professional #031508-90
Engineering Team Lead
Solar Energy Solutions
Lexington | Louisville | Bloomington | Cincinnati | Evansville | Indianapolis
513-448-5176 (mobile)
877-312-7456 (Main Office)
da...@sesre.com

From: RE-wrenches  On Behalf Of Dave 
Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches
Sent: Monday, April 3, 2023 4:34 PM
To: RE-wrenches 
Cc: Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar 
Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] replace part of rolls battery bank

5 years old on 3 strings, it might not matter to mix, better get ready for a 
new bank.
I have never used more than 1 string for my clients and get closer to 10 years 
life, so maybe there is better advice out there.

Good Luck!



Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar

"we go where powerlines don't"

http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/

e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net

text 209 813 0060



On 2023-04-03 11:03 am, Daniel Young via RE-wrenches wrote:

Hello Wrenches,



Have a client with 24 x Rolls S550’s. 2 of the batteries have given up the 
ghost. Rolls will replace them under the pro rated warranty.



The issue us, the client is wanting to replace them with non Rolls batteries to 
save $. They can get 400AH 6V L-16 form factor FLA batteries from a local 
battery house for the same price I am going to get the new Rolls for. And that 
also means they don’t need to pay for freight. The net result is that they 
could save $4-500 by getting the batteries locally. No freight, and no markup 
on the batteries we provide (I can technically add the lost markup back in as 
labor, we do need to make something off of the 3hr one way drive to swap the 
batteries)



Question is, has anyone got experience mixing battery brands like this?



3 x strings of 8 c S550’s (L-16HC would be the replacements) both dead 
batteries are on the same string.

Whole battery bank is near the 5yr old mark.

The last rolls battery bank the client had lasted them 10 years. (they baby the 
battery bank to be sure, and take maintenance seriously)



I understand where the client is coming from, but do not want to let them shoot 
themselves in the foot, and I simply do not know what the chances are of 
swapping in batteries from a different brand. In my head, I don’t see a big 
issue, even if they are sub par, they will likely just get older faster, and 
fail around the same time as the rest of the 4-5yr old battery bank. But I’m 
unsure if there are any more subtle issue that these other batteries would 
cause.



Client has been loyal for more than a decade, so I want to give them a fair 
shake at saving some $ now, as they plan to move to lithium when the whole 
battery bank finally gives out.



With Regards,

--



Danny Young

NABCEP PV Installation Professional #031508-90

Engineering Team Lead
Solar Energy Solutions

Lexington | Louisville | Bloomington | Cincinnati | Evansville | Indianapolis

513-448-5176 (mobile)

877-312-7456 (Main Office)

da...@sesre.com



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Re: [RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric SCP

[Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches]

Saying this again, you all should tell Schneider this.

BTW, a tablet can wifi station mode connect to a non internet installed 
"conext home" with a saved password. It also can be set-up as a "user" 
and no password is required. Neither of these require wifi at the home. 
It is all in the 3 ways to install conext home or facility for 
configuration.


Maybe this is what Eric Bentsen was telling Glen?

Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net
text 209 813 0060

On 2023-04-04 9:49 am, Glenn Burt via RE-wrenches wrote:

The setup I described is dedicated to the system only, only requires a 
login once and it on all the time.


-Glenn
Sent from my 'smart'phone, so please excuse typos and spelling errors.

-- Original message--
From: Michael Morningstar via RE-wrenches
Date: Tue, Apr 4, 2023 11:31 AM
To: RE-wrenches;
Cc: Michael Morningstar;
Subject:Re: [RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric SCP

Yah, What the heck? The XW Pro/Discover AES pairing makes up 2/3s of 
our installs. Right now I have a client who's Insight Home is glitching 
and drops out his smartphone connection. Without the SCP He'd be in the 
dark. I just purchased an SCP off of Ebay for 700.00 for a system we 
are building for a retiree who uses a flip-phone and doesn't use the 
internet. Him having to login in to Insight on a tablet every time he 
wants to see SOC would be laughable.


On Tue, Apr 4, 2023 at 4:22 AM Chris Sparadeo via RE-wrenches 
 wrote:


I don't like the idea of a system being dependent on the functionality 
of the insight home/facility or the battery life of a smart device / AC 
output of the inverter to be able to change settings. As limited as the 
SCP is, I think it serves a very important function in system 
operation. I'm all for removing unnecessary components, but don't paint 
the windshield black. Schneider should offer a Xanbus tablet if this is 
the route they want to go.


On Mon, Apr 3, 2023 at 10:29 PM Maverick Brown via RE-wrenches 
 wrote:
The key word there is Cobbled. The off grid or grid interactive 
(battery backup in case of grid down) world really needs to rely on a 
smart phone?


Why couldn't Schnieder go the extra step and put a display "with enough 
memory" to support legacy and XW Pro equipment on the Insight product 
family. I.E. Cerbo GX with display from Victron. Schneider has all 
these cheap Chinese all in one product competition with display screens 
built in and some other products like the most excellent  Outback 
Radian that has yet to delete the Simple Man's display.


I understand the potential semiconductor shortage. I just hope 
Schneider can balance their approach.


Thank you,

Maverick

On Apr 3, 2023, at 9:15 PM, Glenn Burt via RE-wrenches 
 wrote:


Eric Benstennof SE demoed a pretty slick replacement that he cobbled 
together from off the shelf parts using a small tablet.

I saw it in Jan at an Alt-E installer conference.
I think I might have the details somewhere in my files, but it is 
basically an inexpensive android tablet, a USB charging wart 
usingneither WiFi or a USB type c Ethernet and power adaptwr and a wall 
mount for the tablet


-Glenn
Sent from my 'smart'phone, so please excuse typos and spelling errors.

-- Original message--
From: Mac Lewis via RE-wrenches
Date: Mon, Apr 3, 2023 7:31 PM
To: RE-wrenches;
Cc: Mac Lewis;
Subject:[RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric SCP

Hello Wrenches,

Now that Schneider has phased out SCP, what are the options for a GUI 
onsite for non-savvy consumers?


Thanks!
--

Mac Lewis

"Yo solo sé que no sé nada." -Sócrates 
___

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Re: [RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric SCP

[Glenn Burt via RE-wrenches]

The setup I described is dedicated to the system only, only requires a login 
once and it on all the time.-GlennSent from my 'smart'phone, so please excuse 
typos and spelling errors.-- Original message--From: Michael 
Morningstar via RE-wrenchesDate: Tue, Apr 4, 2023 11:31 AMTo: RE-wrenches;Cc: 
Michael Morningstar;Subject:Re: [RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric 
SCPYah, What the heck? The XW Pro/Discover AES pairing makes up 2/3s of our 
installs. Right now I have a client who's Insight Home is glitching and drops 
out his smartphone connection. Without the SCP He'd be in the dark. I just 
purchased an SCP off of Ebay for 700.00 for a system we are building for a 
retiree who uses a flip-phone and doesn't use the internet. Him having to login 
in to Insight on a tablet every time he wants to see SOC would be laughable.On 
Tue, Apr 4, 2023 at 4:22 AM Chris Sparadeo via RE-wrenches 
 wrote:I don’t like the idea of a system 
being dependent o
 n the
 functionality of the insight home/facility or the battery life of a smart 
device / AC output of the inverter to be able to change settings. As limited as 
the SCP is, I think it serves a very important function in system operation. 
I’m all for removing unnecessary components, but don’t paint the windshield 
black. Schneider should offer a Xanbus tablet if this is the route they want to 
go. On Mon, Apr 3, 2023 at 10:29 PM Maverick Brown via RE-wrenches 
 wrote:The key word there is Cobbled. The 
off grid or grid interactive (battery backup in case of grid down) world really 
needs to rely on a smart phone?Why couldn’t Schnieder go the extra step and put 
a display “with enough memory” to support legacy and XW Pro equipment on the 
Insight product family. I.E. Cerbo GX with display from Victron. Schneider has 
all these cheap Chinese all in one product competition with display screens 
built in and some other products like the most excellent  Outb
 ack Radian
 that has yet to delete the Simple Man’s display. I understand the potential 
semiconductor shortage. I just hope Schneider can balance their approach. Thank 
you,MaverickOn Apr 3, 2023, at 9:15 PM, Glenn Burt via RE-wrenches 
 wrote:








Eric Benstennof SE demoed a pretty slick replacement that he cobbled 
together from off the shelf parts using a small tablet.I saw it in Jan at an 
Alt-E installer conference.I think I might have the details somewhere in my 
files, but it is basically an inexpensive android tablet, a USB charging wart 
usingneither WiFi or a USB type c Ethernet and power adaptwr and a wall mount 
for the tablet-GlennSent from my 'smart'phone, so please excuse typos and 
spelling errors.-- Original message--From: Mac Lewis via
 RE-wrenchesDate: Mon, Apr 3, 2023 7:31 PMTo: RE-wrenches;Cc: Mac 
Lewis;Subject:[RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric SCPHello Wrenches,Now 
that Schneider has phased out SCP, what are the options
 for a GUI onsite for non-savvy consumers?Thanks!-- Mac Lewis"Yo solo sé que no 
sé nada." -Sócrates



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Re: [RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric SCP

[William Miller via RE-wrenches]

Chris:

Respectfully:  it’s not the same thing. Outback is not discontinuing the
Mate.

If you have an Outback inverter you need a Mate and the Mate accesses the
FM100.

Sure it would be better if the FM100 had a display, but there is a viable
option in the Mate.

William

On Tue, Apr 4, 2023 at 8:57 AM Chris Schaefer via RE-wrenches <
re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:

> akin to outback and their FM100 charger controller with no display. I use
> the Midnite classic 200 instead.
>
> Christopher
>
> On Tue, Apr 4, 2023 at 11:34 AM Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via
> RE-wrenches  wrote:
>
>> Thanks Glen !  I will ask him on Thursday at a webinar.
>>
>>
>> Register here:
>>
>> https://solar.se.com/us/en/event/webinar-backup-control-switch-launch/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
>> "we go where powerlines don't"
>> http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/ 
>> e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net 
>> text 209 813 0060*
>>
>>
>> On 2023-04-03 7:14 pm, Glenn Burt via RE-wrenches wrote:
>>
>> Eric Benstennof SE demoed a pretty slick replacement that he cobbled
>> together from off the shelf parts using a small tablet.
>> I saw it in Jan at an Alt-E installer conference.
>> I think I might have the details somewhere in my files, but it is
>> basically an inexpensive android tablet, a USB charging wart usingneither
>> WiFi or a USB type c Ethernet and power adaptwr and a wall mount for the
>> tablet
>>
>> -Glenn
>> Sent from my 'smart'phone, so please excuse typos and spelling errors.
>>
>> -- Original message--
>> *From: *Mac Lewis via RE-wrenches
>> *Date: *Mon, Apr 3, 2023 7:31 PM
>> *To: *RE-wrenches;
>> *Cc: *Mac Lewis;
>> *Subject:*[RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric SCP
>>
>> Hello Wrenches,
>>
>> Now that Schneider has phased out SCP, what are the options for a GUI
>> onsite for non-savvy consumers?
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> --
>>
>>
>>
>> Mac Lewis
>>
>> "Yo solo sé que no sé nada." -Sócrates
>>
>> ___
>> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance
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>
> --
>
> Chris Schaefer’s
> 
>
> *Tel/Fax 585-229-2083 or Cell 585-748-1870 *
> *5115 South Hill Road ~ Canandaigua New York 14424
> **www.solarandwindfx.com
>  ~ E-mail: ch...@solarandwindfx.com
> *
>
>
> Thomas Jefferson, the author of our great Constitution, once said,
> "democracy" will cease to exist when you take away from those who are
> willing to work and give to those who would not."
> ___
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> --

William Miller
Miller Solar.com
895-438-5600
www.millersolar.com
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric SCP

[Chris Schaefer via RE-wrenches]

akin to outback and their FM100 charger controller with no display. I use
the Midnite classic 200 instead.

Christopher

On Tue, Apr 4, 2023 at 11:34 AM Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches
 wrote:

> Thanks Glen !  I will ask him on Thursday at a webinar.
>
>
> Register here:
>
> https://solar.se.com/us/en/event/webinar-backup-control-switch-launch/
>
>
>
>
>
> *Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
> "we go where powerlines don't"
> http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/ 
> e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net 
> text 209 813 0060*
>
>
> On 2023-04-03 7:14 pm, Glenn Burt via RE-wrenches wrote:
>
> Eric Benstennof SE demoed a pretty slick replacement that he cobbled
> together from off the shelf parts using a small tablet.
> I saw it in Jan at an Alt-E installer conference.
> I think I might have the details somewhere in my files, but it is
> basically an inexpensive android tablet, a USB charging wart usingneither
> WiFi or a USB type c Ethernet and power adaptwr and a wall mount for the
> tablet
>
> -Glenn
> Sent from my 'smart'phone, so please excuse typos and spelling errors.
>
> -- Original message--
> *From: *Mac Lewis via RE-wrenches
> *Date: *Mon, Apr 3, 2023 7:31 PM
> *To: *RE-wrenches;
> *Cc: *Mac Lewis;
> *Subject:*[RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric SCP
>
> Hello Wrenches,
>
> Now that Schneider has phased out SCP, what are the options for a GUI
> onsite for non-savvy consumers?
>
> Thanks!
>
> --
>
>
>
> Mac Lewis
>
> "Yo solo sé que no sé nada." -Sócrates
>
> ___
> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance
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> Pay optional member dues here: http://re-wrenches.org
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-- 

Chris Schaefer’s


*Tel/Fax 585-229-2083 or Cell 585-748-1870 *
*5115 South Hill Road ~ Canandaigua New York 14424**www.solarandwindfx.com
 ~ E-mail: ch...@solarandwindfx.com
*


Thomas Jefferson, the author of our great Constitution, once said,
"democracy" will cease to exist when you take away from those who are
willing to work and give to those who would not."
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric SCP

[Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar via RE-wrenches]

Thanks Glen !  I will ask him on Thursday at a webinar.

Register here:

https://solar.se.com/us/en/event/webinar-backup-control-switch-launch/

Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where powerlines don't"
http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net
text 209 813 0060

On 2023-04-03 7:14 pm, Glenn Burt via RE-wrenches wrote:

Eric Benstennof SE demoed a pretty slick replacement that he cobbled 
together from off the shelf parts using a small tablet.

I saw it in Jan at an Alt-E installer conference.
I think I might have the details somewhere in my files, but it is 
basically an inexpensive android tablet, a USB charging wart 
usingneither WiFi or a USB type c Ethernet and power adaptwr and a wall 
mount for the tablet


-Glenn
Sent from my 'smart'phone, so please excuse typos and spelling errors.

-- Original message--
From: Mac Lewis via RE-wrenches
Date: Mon, Apr 3, 2023 7:31 PM
To: RE-wrenches;
Cc: Mac Lewis;
Subject:[RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric SCP

Hello Wrenches,

Now that Schneider has phased out SCP, what are the options for a GUI 
onsite for non-savvy consumers?


Thanks!
--

Mac Lewis

"Yo solo sé que no sé nada." -Sócrates
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric SCP

[Michael Morningstar via RE-wrenches]

Yah, What the heck? The XW Pro/Discover AES pairing makes up 2/3s of our
installs. Right now I have a client who's Insight Home is glitching and
drops out his smartphone connection. Without the SCP He'd be in the dark. I
just purchased an SCP off of Ebay for 700.00 for a system we are building
for a retiree who uses a flip-phone and doesn't use the internet. Him
having to login in to Insight on a tablet every time he wants to see SOC
would be laughable.


On Tue, Apr 4, 2023 at 4:22 AM Chris Sparadeo via RE-wrenches <
re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:

> I don’t like the idea of a system being dependent on the functionality of
> the insight home/facility or the battery life of a smart device / AC output
> of the inverter to be able to change settings. As limited as the SCP is, I
> think it serves a very important function in system operation. I’m all for
> removing unnecessary components, but don’t paint the windshield black.
> Schneider should offer a Xanbus tablet if this is the route they want to
> go.
>
> On Mon, Apr 3, 2023 at 10:29 PM Maverick Brown via RE-wrenches <
> re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>
>> The key word there is Cobbled. The off grid or grid interactive (battery
>> backup in case of grid down) world really needs to rely on a smart phone?
>>
>> Why couldn’t Schnieder go the extra step and put a display “with enough
>> memory” to support legacy and XW Pro equipment on the Insight product
>> family. I.E. Cerbo GX with display from Victron. Schneider has all these
>> cheap Chinese all in one product competition with display screens built in
>> and some other products like the most excellent  Outback Radian that has
>> yet to delete the Simple Man’s display.
>>
>> I understand the potential semiconductor shortage. I just hope Schneider
>> can balance their approach.
>>
>>
>> Thank you,
>>
>> Maverick
>>
>>
>> On Apr 3, 2023, at 9:15 PM, Glenn Burt via RE-wrenches <
>> re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>> Eric Benstennof SE demoed a pretty slick replacement that he cobbled
>> together from off the shelf parts using a small tablet.
>> I saw it in Jan at an Alt-E installer conference.
>> I think I might have the details somewhere in my files, but it is
>> basically an inexpensive android tablet, a USB charging wart usingneither
>> WiFi or a USB type c Ethernet and power adaptwr and a wall mount for the
>> tablet
>>
>> -Glenn
>> Sent from my 'smart'phone, so please excuse typos and spelling errors.
>>
>> -- Original message--
>> *From: *Mac Lewis via RE-wrenches
>> *Date: *Mon, Apr 3, 2023 7:31 PM
>> *To: *RE-wrenches;
>> *Cc: *Mac Lewis;
>> *Subject:*[RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric SCP
>>
>> Hello Wrenches,
>>
>> Now that Schneider has phased out SCP, what are the options for a GUI
>> onsite for non-savvy consumers?
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> --
>>
>>
>>
>> Mac Lewis
>>
>> *"Yo solo sé que no sé nada." -Sócrates*
>> ___
>> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance
>>
>> Pay optional member dues here: http://re-wrenches.org
>>
>> List Address: RE-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org
>>
>> Change listserver email address & settings:
>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org
>>
>> There are two list archives for searching. When one doesn't work, try the
>> other:
>> https://www.mail-archive.com/re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org/
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>>
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>> http://www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm
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>> http://www.members.re-wrenches.org
>>
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>> --
> Chris Sparadeo
>
>
> C_802-369-4458
> H_802-728-3059
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric SCP

[Chris Sparadeo via RE-wrenches]

I don’t like the idea of a system being dependent on the functionality of
the insight home/facility or the battery life of a smart device / AC output
of the inverter to be able to change settings. As limited as the SCP is, I
think it serves a very important function in system operation. I’m all for
removing unnecessary components, but don’t paint the windshield black.
Schneider should offer a Xanbus tablet if this is the route they want to
go.

On Mon, Apr 3, 2023 at 10:29 PM Maverick Brown via RE-wrenches <
re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:

> The key word there is Cobbled. The off grid or grid interactive (battery
> backup in case of grid down) world really needs to rely on a smart phone?
>
> Why couldn’t Schnieder go the extra step and put a display “with enough
> memory” to support legacy and XW Pro equipment on the Insight product
> family. I.E. Cerbo GX with display from Victron. Schneider has all these
> cheap Chinese all in one product competition with display screens built in
> and some other products like the most excellent  Outback Radian that has
> yet to delete the Simple Man’s display.
>
> I understand the potential semiconductor shortage. I just hope Schneider
> can balance their approach.
>
>
> Thank you,
>
> Maverick
>
>
> On Apr 3, 2023, at 9:15 PM, Glenn Burt via RE-wrenches <
> re-wrenches@lists.re-wrenches.org> wrote:
>
> 
>
> Eric Benstennof SE demoed a pretty slick replacement that he cobbled
> together from off the shelf parts using a small tablet.
> I saw it in Jan at an Alt-E installer conference.
> I think I might have the details somewhere in my files, but it is
> basically an inexpensive android tablet, a USB charging wart usingneither
> WiFi or a USB type c Ethernet and power adaptwr and a wall mount for the
> tablet
>
> -Glenn
> Sent from my 'smart'phone, so please excuse typos and spelling errors.
>
> -- Original message--
> *From: *Mac Lewis via RE-wrenches
> *Date: *Mon, Apr 3, 2023 7:31 PM
> *To: *RE-wrenches;
> *Cc: *Mac Lewis;
> *Subject:*[RE-wrenches] Phased out Schneider Electric SCP
>
> Hello Wrenches,
>
> Now that Schneider has phased out SCP, what are the options for a GUI
> onsite for non-savvy consumers?
>
> Thanks!
>
> --
>
>
>
> Mac Lewis
>
> *"Yo solo sé que no sé nada." -Sócrates*
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