RE: Ministerial Exception Cert Petition

2010-11-08 Thread Rick Garnett
Thanks for this, Tom.  Forgive me, all, if there has already been a big 
discussion of this case, which I missed, responding to Tom's post.  It *does* 
strike me, for what it's worth, that it is time for the Court to weigh in on 
the many interesting (and difficult) questions that the ministerial exception 
raises, e.g., how do we identify the positions to which the exception applies, 
does the exception apply without regard to the reasons (if any) for the 
challenged conduct, and what is the constitutional basis (Free Exercise?  
Church Autonomy? Establishment?  Something else?) for the exception?

Best, Rick

Richard W. Garnett
Professor of Law and Associate Dean
Notre Dame Law School
P.O. Box 780
Notre Dame, Indiana 46556-0780

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From: religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu 
[mailto:religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu] On Behalf Of Berg, Thomas C.
Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2010 1:51 PM
To: Religionlaw
Subject: Ministerial Exception Cert Petition

The Becket Fund and Doug Laycock have filed a cert. petition in Hosanna-Tabor 
Evangelical Lutheran Church and School v. EEOC, raising the question [w]hether 
the ministerial exception applies to a teacher at a religious elementary school 
who teaches the full secular curriculum, but also teaches daily religion 
classes, is a commissioned minister, and regularly leads students in prayer and 
worship.  See the links at Howard Friedman's Religion Clause blog, 
http://religionclause.blogspot.com/2010/10/cert-petition-filed-in-ministerial.html.

The petition makes the case that ignoring the teacher's clergy-type duties on 
the ground that her primary duties were to teach secular classes is 
unconstitutional, and that the courts of appeals are divided on how to 
determine whether the ministerial exception applies to a given employee.  
Eugene commended the petition's quality, 
http://volokh.com/2010/10/28/antidiscrimination-laws-and-religious-organizations,
 but I don't know what he thinks about the merits.  Rick Garnett called it one 
of the most important religious freedom cases in years.  
http://mirrorofjustice.blogs.com/mirrorofjustice/2010/11/one-of-the-most-important-religious-freedom-cases-in-years.html
  And Marci has referred to the case among others in arguing that the Court 
ought to take a case to define the ministerial exception.  
http://writ.news.findlaw.com/hamilton/20100722.html.



Seems like a case worth discussing.  Thoughts from anyone on the list, 
including any of these folks?

-
Thomas C. Berg
St. Ives Professor of Law, Associate Dean for Academic Affairs
University of St. Thomas School of Law
MSL 400, 1000 LaSalle Avenue
Minneapolis, MN   55403-2015
Phone: (651) 962-4918
Fax: (651) 962-4996
E-mail: tcb...@stthomas.edumailto:tcb...@stthomas.edu
SSRN: http://ssrn.com/author='261564
Weblog: 
http://www.mirrorofjustice.blogs.comhttp://www.mirrorofjustice.blogs.com/mirrorofjustice


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Pro-lifer guilty in free speech, free press case

2010-11-08 Thread Gordon James Klingenschmitt
Curious what our expert legal list members might say.this case is the first 
attempt at enforcing a new residential peace law that prohibits raising your 
voice on a public sidewalk outside the home of an abortion doctorthe doctor 
had never met the protester until today in court, so the stalking definition 
is dubiousbut the wanted posters should be protected as freedom of the 
press.  Or are they?  The actual text on the posters said Wanted by Jesus to 
stop killing babies.  No threats of physical violence were ever reported.  In 
Jesus, Chaplain Klingenschmitt
---

http://www.wsoctv.com/news/25678662/detail.html

CHARLOTTE, N.C. -- A local pastor was  found guilty Monday of stalking a doctor 
who performs abortions. 

He was  sentenced to 24 months probation and plans to appeal.
Reverend  Flip Benham posted wild west-style Wanted posters which gave the  
doctor's name and home address. 

Benham said this was a free speech  issue, that he has a constitutional right 
to 
speak his mind.
He  said, [The doctor] kills babies.  He does it for a living. 
He has no  respect for life of children in the safety and neighborhoods of 
their  
mothers' wombs.
But others saw the posters as threats to women's rights and the doctor himself.
Cindy  Thompson, with the Charlotte chapter of the National Organization for  
Women said, 

It's none of his business.  He needs to leave women alone  and let us make up 
our minds.
Some worried anti-abortion  activists might kill the doctor, something that has 
happened elsewhere 

and was mentioned multiple times in court Monday. 
Prosecutors said it  was like putting a target on the doctor's back. 
The doctor said he felt  the poster was a call for my murder. 
He said he was always looking  over his shoulder, that he'd get down on his 
hands and knees 

to make  sure there were no bombs under his car, that he was worried someone  
would be 

on the roof waiting to shoot him, and that he even watched TV  in rooms with 
fewer windows.
Benham replied, Nobody has gone and  killed because [he or she] saw a poster. 
That is most absurd and  logical fallacy that there possibly could be. ___
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