RE: Catholic University sued about prayer rooms for Muslims
Since Jesus is a prophet in the Muslim faith, I wonder how serious the complaint is. * Paul Finkelman, Ph.D. President William McKinley Distinguished Professor of Law Albany Law School 80 New Scotland Avenue Albany, NY 12208 518-445-3386 (p) 518-445-3363 (f) paul.finkel...@albanylaw.edumailto:paul.finkel...@albanylaw.edu www.paulfinkelman.comhttp://www.paulfinkelman.com * From: religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu [religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu] on behalf of Brad Pardee [bp51...@windstream.net] Sent: Wednesday, November 02, 2011 11:14 PM To: religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu Subject: Catholic University sued about prayer rooms for Muslims I'm intrigued by this story. Apparently, in Washington DC, it may turn out to be a human rights violation for Catholic University to be pervasively Catholic. http://radio.foxnews.com/toddstarnes/top-stories/muslims-want-catholic-school-to-provide-room-without-crosses.html Is there some perspective from the view of an impartial scholar where this is NOT patently absurd? Brad Pardee ___ To post, send message to Religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu To subscribe, unsubscribe, change options, or get password, see http://lists.ucla.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/religionlaw Please note that messages sent to this large list cannot be viewed as private. Anyone can subscribe to the list and read messages that are posted; people can read the Web archives; and list members can (rightly or wrongly) forward the messages to others.
RE: Catholic University sued about prayer rooms for Muslims
Isn't there a strong tradition of aniconism in Islam. You're not supposed to depict Allah, Muhammed or the lesser prophets? Richard M. Esenberg President General Counsel Wisconsin Institute for Law Liberty 225 E. Mason Street, Suite 300 Milwaukee, Wisconsin 53202 414-727-WILL (9455) 414-727-6367 (direct) 414-213-3957 (mobile) r...@will-law.orgmailto:r...@will-law.org Adunct Professor of Law Marquette University Law School 1215 W. Michigan Street Milwaukee, Wisconsin 5202 414-288-6908 richard.esenb...@marquette.edumailto:richard.esenb...@marquette.edu From: religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu [religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu] on behalf of Finkelman, Paul paul.finkel...@albanylaw.edu [paul.finkel...@albanylaw.edu] Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2011 6:30 AM To: Law Religion issues for Law Academics Subject: RE: Catholic University sued about prayer rooms for Muslims Since Jesus is a prophet in the Muslim faith, I wonder how serious the complaint is. * Paul Finkelman, Ph.D. President William McKinley Distinguished Professor of Law Albany Law School 80 New Scotland Avenue Albany, NY 12208 518-445-3386 (p) 518-445-3363 (f) paul.finkel...@albanylaw.edumailto:paul.finkel...@albanylaw.edu www.paulfinkelman.comhttp://www.paulfinkelman.com * From: religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu [religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu] on behalf of Brad Pardee [bp51...@windstream.net] Sent: Wednesday, November 02, 2011 11:14 PM To: religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu Subject: Catholic University sued about prayer rooms for Muslims I'm intrigued by this story. Apparently, in Washington DC, it may turn out to be a human rights violation for Catholic University to be pervasively Catholic. http://radio.foxnews.com/toddstarnes/top-stories/muslims-want-catholic-school-to-provide-room-without-crosses.html Is there some perspective from the view of an impartial scholar where this is NOT patently absurd? Brad Pardee ___ To post, send message to Religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu To subscribe, unsubscribe, change options, or get password, see http://lists.ucla.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/religionlaw Please note that messages sent to this large list cannot be viewed as private. Anyone can subscribe to the list and read messages that are posted; people can read the Web archives; and list members can (rightly or wrongly) forward the messages to others.
RE: Catholic University sued about prayer rooms for Muslims
Colleagues, My understanding (just from news reports) is that no Muslim students have complained about this matter; instead, John Banzhaf filed the complaint, as a kind of follow-up to his complaint about Catholic University's recently announced move to single-sex housing for undergraduates. In a recent statement, Pres. John Garvey said: Banzhaf has created the perception that it is our Muslim students themselves who are offended by the symbols of Catholicism on our campus, and that they object to the absence of worship space set aside specifically for them, Garvey said. The fact is that no Muslim student at Catholic University has registered a complaint with the university about the exercise of their religion on campus. And today we learned from an article in The Washington Post that Mr. Banzhaf himself has not received any complaints from our Muslim students. Garvey added, I regret very much that our Muslim students have been used as pawns in a manufactured controversy. http://www.thebostonpilot.com/article.asp?ID=13952 Elsewhere, Garvey said: Contrary to the impression Mr. Banzhaf would like to create, [a] December 2010 [Washington] Post article spoke in overwhelmingly positive terms about the experience of Muslim students at Catholic University, and explained why they are attracted to us. A considerable part of the attraction stems from the fact that our community, because of its own outward expressions of Catholic faith, makes them feel comfortable living their faith among us. http://m.christianpost.com/news/muslim-students-not-behind-complaint-against-catholic-university-59796/ Best, Rick Richard W. Garnett Professor of Law and Associate Dean Notre Dame Law School P.O. Box 780 Notre Dame, Indiana 46556-0780 574-631-6981 (w) 574-276-2252 (cell) ___ To post, send message to Religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu To subscribe, unsubscribe, change options, or get password, see http://lists.ucla.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/religionlaw Please note that messages sent to this large list cannot be viewed as private. Anyone can subscribe to the list and read messages that are posted; people can read the Web archives; and list members can (rightly or wrongly) forward the messages to others.
RE: Driveway Fee as Tax on Churches
I litigated this case on behalf of two churches in Mission, Kansas (one Baptist and one Catholic). The City recently settled the case by providing an exemption in the ordinance for all organizations who hold a property tax exemption under state law. Here is a link to ADF's press release on the settlement which also contains a link to the Complaint: http://www.adfmedia.org/News/PRDetail/5112. Kansas has great precedent on the difference between a tax and a fee. This was plainly in the nature of a tax and the City should have provided an exemption in the first place. Erik [cid:image001.jpg@01CC9A19.AED97AD0] Erik Stanley Senior Legal Counsel (913) 685-8000 (913) 685-8001 (fax) estan...@telladf.orgmailto:estan...@telladf.org www.telladf.orghttp://www.telladf.org/ Truth is immortal Dr. Balthasar Hubmaier, 1527 From: religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu [mailto:religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu] On Behalf Of James Edward Maule Sent: Wednesday, November 02, 2011 8:24 PM To: Law Religion issues for Law Academics Subject: Driveway Fee as Tax on Churches One of my readers sent this link to me. The article describes the use of a driveway fee (measured by estimated number of vehicle transits) to get around state property tax exemptions for churches. Apparently the instance described is not the first time this has been tried. This is new to me. It's from almost a year ago, but I don't recall seeing any discussion about it on this list but perhaps I missed it. Comments welcome. http://www.charismamag.com/index.php/news-old/29819-kansas-town-tries-to-tax-church Kansas Town Tries to Tax Church Attendance http://www.charismamag.com/index.php/news-old/29819-kansas-town-tries-to-tax-church-attendance Wednesday, 22 December 2010 07:03 AM EST Jennifer LeClaire News http://www.charismamag.com/index.php/component/content/section/34 - Featured News http://www.charismamag.com/index.php/news-old The Kansas City of Mission is working to make sure churches in its area understand that there are two things certain in life: death and taxes-even in the sanctuary. Mission implemented a property tax in the name of a driveway fee in efforts to evade having to grant tax exemptions to two local churches, according to the Alliance Defense Fund (ADF). ADF filed a suit on behalf of the churches, First Baptist Church of Mission and The Archdiocese of Kansas City in Kansas. [rest of article omitted] This e-mail message from the Alliance Defense Fund and any accompanying documents or embedded messages is intended for the named recipients only. Because ADF is a legal entity engaged in the practice of law, this communication contains information, which may include metadata, that is confidential, privileged, attorney work product, or otherwise protected from disclosure under applicable law. If you have received this message in error, are not a named recipient, or are not the employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to a named recipient, be advised that any review, disclosure, use, dissemination, distribution, or reproduction of this message or its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately notify the sender and permanently delete the message. PRIVILEGED AND CONFIDENTIAL - ATTORNEY-CLIENT COMMUNICATION/ATTORNEY WORK PRODUCT. IRS CIRCULAR 230 DISCLOSURE: Any tax advice contained in this communication was not written and is not intended to be used for the purpose of (i) avoiding penalties imposed by the Internal Revenue Code or (ii) promoting, marketing, or recommending any transaction or matter addressed herein. inline: image001.jpg___ To post, send message to Religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu To subscribe, unsubscribe, change options, or get password, see http://lists.ucla.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/religionlaw Please note that messages sent to this large list cannot be viewed as private. Anyone can subscribe to the list and read messages that are posted; people can read the Web archives; and list members can (rightly or wrongly) forward the messages to others.
RE: Driveway Fee as Tax on Churches
Thanks for the update. Jim Maule From: religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu [mailto:religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu] On Behalf Of Erik Stanley Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2011 12:14 PM To: Law Religion issues for Law Academics Subject: RE: Driveway Fee as Tax on Churches I litigated this case on behalf of two churches in Mission, Kansas (one Baptist and one Catholic). The City recently settled the case by providing an exemption in the ordinance for all organizations who hold a property tax exemption under state law. Here is a link to ADF's press release on the settlement which also contains a link to the Complaint: http://www.adfmedia.org/News/PRDetail/5112. Kansas has great precedent on the difference between a tax and a fee. This was plainly in the nature of a tax and the City should have provided an exemption in the first place. Erik [cid:image001.jpg@01CC9A36.B5D41B70] Erik Stanley Senior Legal Counsel (913) 685-8000 (913) 685-8001 (fax) estan...@telladf.orgmailto:estan...@telladf.org www.telladf.orghttp://www.telladf.org/ Truth is immortal Dr. Balthasar Hubmaier, 1527 From: religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu [mailto:religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu] On Behalf Of James Edward Maule Sent: Wednesday, November 02, 2011 8:24 PM To: Law Religion issues for Law Academics Subject: Driveway Fee as Tax on Churches One of my readers sent this link to me. The article describes the use of a driveway fee (measured by estimated number of vehicle transits) to get around state property tax exemptions for churches. Apparently the instance described is not the first time this has been tried. This is new to me. It's from almost a year ago, but I don't recall seeing any discussion about it on this list but perhaps I missed it. Comments welcome. http://www.charismamag.com/index.php/news-old/29819-kansas-town-tries-to-tax-church Kansas Town Tries to Tax Church Attendance http://www.charismamag.com/index.php/news-old/29819-kansas-town-tries-to-tax-church-attendance Wednesday, 22 December 2010 07:03 AM EST Jennifer LeClaire News http://www.charismamag.com/index.php/component/content/section/34 - Featured News http://www.charismamag.com/index.php/news-old The Kansas City of Mission is working to make sure churches in its area understand that there are two things certain in life: death and taxes-even in the sanctuary. Mission implemented a property tax in the name of a driveway fee in efforts to evade having to grant tax exemptions to two local churches, according to the Alliance Defense Fund (ADF). ADF filed a suit on behalf of the churches, First Baptist Church of Mission and The Archdiocese of Kansas City in Kansas. [rest of article omitted] This e-mail message from the Alliance Defense Fund and any accompanying documents or embedded messages is intended for the named recipients only. Because ADF is a legal entity engaged in the practice of law, this communication contains information, which may include metadata, that is confidential, privileged, attorney work product, or otherwise protected from disclosure under applicable law. If you have received this message in error, are not a named recipient, or are not the employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to a named recipient, be advised that any review, disclosure, use, dissemination, distribution, or reproduction of this message or its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately notify the sender and permanently delete the message. PRIVILEGED AND CONFIDENTIAL - ATTORNEY-CLIENT COMMUNICATION/ATTORNEY WORK PRODUCT. IRS CIRCULAR 230 DISCLOSURE: Any tax advice contained in this communication was not written and is not intended to be used for the purpose of (i) avoiding penalties imposed by the Internal Revenue Code or (ii) promoting, marketing, or recommending any transaction or matter addressed herein. inline: image001.jpg___ To post, send message to Religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu To subscribe, unsubscribe, change options, or get password, see http://lists.ucla.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/religionlaw Please note that messages sent to this large list cannot be viewed as private. Anyone can subscribe to the list and read messages that are posted; people can read the Web archives; and list members can (rightly or wrongly) forward the messages to others.
Catholic University sued about prayer rooms for Muslims
I'm intrigued by this story. Apparently, in Washington DC, it may turn out to be a human rights violation for Catholic University to be pervasively Catholic. http://radio.foxnews.com/toddstarnes/top-stories/muslims-want-catholic-schoo l-to-provide-room-without-crosses.html Is there some perspective from the view of an impartial scholar where this is NOT patently absurd? Brad Pardee ___ To post, send message to Religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu To subscribe, unsubscribe, change options, or get password, see http://lists.ucla.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/religionlaw Please note that messages sent to this large list cannot be viewed as private. Anyone can subscribe to the list and read messages that are posted; people can read the Web archives; and list members can (rightly or wrongly) forward the messages to others.
Re: Driveway Fee as Tax on Churches
Erik-- Just so I understand the principle here. The city should have provided an exemption because the state law grants all religious organizations a property tax exemption? Or are you saying that the exemption was constitutionally required? Thanks--- Marci A. Hamilton Paul R. Verkuil Chair in Public Law Benjamin N. Cardozo School of Law Yeshiva University 55 Fifth Avenue New York, NY 10003 215-353-8984 In a message dated 11/3/2011 2:43:58 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, ma...@law.villanova.edu writes: I litigated this case on behalf of two churches in Mission, Kansas (one Baptist and one Catholic). The City recently settled the case by providing an exemption in the ordinance for all organizations who hold a property tax exemption under state law. Here is a link to ADF’s press release on the settlement which also contains a link to the Complaint: _http://www.adfmedia.org/News/PRDetail/5112_ (http://www.adfmedia.org/News/PRDetail/5112) . Kansas has great precedent on the difference between a “tax” and a “fee.” This was plainly in the nature of a tax and the City should have provided an exemption in the first place. Erik Erik Stanley Senior Legal Counsel (913) 685-8000 (913) 685-8001 (fax) _EStanley@telladf.org_ (mailto:estan...@telladf.org) _www.telladf.org_ (http://www.telladf.org/) Truth is immortal Dr. Balthasar Hubmaier, 1527 inline: marci%20hamilton%20signature%20cropped.jpginline: image001.jpg___ To post, send message to Religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu To subscribe, unsubscribe, change options, or get password, see http://lists.ucla.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/religionlaw Please note that messages sent to this large list cannot be viewed as private. Anyone can subscribe to the list and read messages that are posted; people can read the Web archives; and list members can (rightly or wrongly) forward the messages to others.
RE: Driveway Fee as Tax on Churches
Marci: The main argument the City made in this case was that the assessment was a “fee” and not a “tax.” Kansas has good precedent about the distinction between fees and taxes and my main argument was that this was a tax and not a fee – and that it was specifically a property tax. As a tax, the City should have respected the uniform state law in Kansas that provides a property tax exemption for non-profit organizations. Instead, the City tried to subvert the property tax exemption provided for in state law by terming this a “fee” for services. I did not argue that the exemption was constitutionally required because the case did not require that argument (although I am still looking for a case where I can make that argument – this is an issue I believe will come to a head at some point in the near future). This was a straightforward application of state law and I think the City saw that its position was weak under state law – that’s why they settled. Best, Erik From: religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu [mailto:religionlaw-boun...@lists.ucla.edu] On Behalf Of hamilto...@aol.com Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2011 8:25 PM To: religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu Subject: Re: Driveway Fee as Tax on Churches Erik-- Just so I understand the principle here. The city should have provided an exemption because the state law grants all religious organizations a property tax exemption? Or are you saying that the exemption was constitutionally required? Thanks--- [cid:image002.jpg@01CC9A68.11C87D50] Marci A. Hamilton Paul R. Verkuil Chair in Public Law Benjamin N. Cardozo School of Law Yeshiva University 55 Fifth Avenue New York, NY 10003 215-353-8984 In a message dated 11/3/2011 2:43:58 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, ma...@law.villanova.edu writes: I litigated this case on behalf of two churches in Mission, Kansas (one Baptist and one Catholic). The City recently settled the case by providing an exemption in the ordinance for all organizations who hold a property tax exemption under state law. Here is a link to ADF’s press release on the settlement which also contains a link to the Complaint: http://www.adfmedia.org/News/PRDetail/5112. Kansas has great precedent on the difference between a “tax” and a “fee.” This was plainly in the nature of a tax and the City should have provided an exemption in the first place. Erik [cid:image003.jpg@01CC9A68.11C87D50] Erik Stanley Senior Legal Counsel (913) 685-8000 (913) 685-8001 (fax) estan...@telladf.orgmailto:estan...@telladf.org www.telladf.orghttp://www.telladf.org/ Truth is immortal Dr. Balthasar Hubmaier, 1527 This e-mail message from the Alliance Defense Fund and any accompanying documents or embedded messages is intended for the named recipients only. Because ADF is a legal entity engaged in the practice of law, this communication contains information, which may include metadata, that is confidential, privileged, attorney work product, or otherwise protected from disclosure under applicable law. If you have received this message in error, are not a named recipient, or are not the employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to a named recipient, be advised that any review, disclosure, use, dissemination, distribution, or reproduction of this message or its contents is strictly prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please immediately notify the sender and permanently delete the message. PRIVILEGED AND CONFIDENTIAL – ATTORNEY-CLIENT COMMUNICATION/ATTORNEY WORK PRODUCT. IRS CIRCULAR 230 DISCLOSURE: Any tax advice contained in this communication was not written and is not intended to be used for the purpose of (i) avoiding penalties imposed by the Internal Revenue Code or (ii) promoting, marketing, or recommending any transaction or matter addressed herein. inline: image002.jpginline: image003.jpg___ To post, send message to Religionlaw@lists.ucla.edu To subscribe, unsubscribe, change options, or get password, see http://lists.ucla.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/religionlaw Please note that messages sent to this large list cannot be viewed as private. Anyone can subscribe to the list and read messages that are posted; people can read the Web archives; and list members can (rightly or wrongly) forward the messages to others.
