RE: [Repeater-Builder] Audio limiting on incoming signals

[Steve Bosshard \(NU5D\)]

Lemme get the manuals out and see what the specs are.  Ssb


-Original Message-
From: Kevin Custer [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 

How much exactly is the amount of minor comprerssion, 2 to 1 or more?

Kevin



[Steve Bosshard (NU5D)]  







 
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[Repeater-Builder] Delay Line IC's

[Doug Bade]

I found my stash of delay line IC's. I do not know if they are of help 
as 
the numbers look different than I recall of those requested, but here goes..


6) MN3102 Clock Driver Chip
4) MN3206 BBD
3) MN3207 BBD
5) MN3208 BBD
2) MN3209 BBD
1) MN3214 BBD

Any of value to anyone, let me know

Doug
KD8B






 
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[Repeater-Builder] AE/LZB 119 1878 R1A Audio ALC CARD - RX Audio Processing

[Steve Bosshard]

Title: AE/LZB 119 1878 R1A Audio ALC CARD - RX Audio Processing









http://www.bosshardradio.com/ALCCARD.jpg


Link to specifications on GE ALC CARD - Receive Audio Processing


Ssb
















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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Audio limiting on incoming signals

[John J. Riddell]

Kevin, I had a high level audio problem using a Pryme mike on my Kenwood th-77A
portable. I called Pryme and they suggested a series resistor in the DC line 
feeding the
mike
element. I tried several values and settled on 8.2K ohms.This resistor was 
added in the
Gnd side of the mike element line in series with that lead of the mike cord

The level dropped to near what I would call Normal as I like
to talk fairly close to a mike but not shout in to it.

John VE3AMZ
Waterloo, Ontario.

- Original Message - 
From: Kevin Custer [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2005 8:53 AM
Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Audio limiting on incoming signals



 Mathew Quaife wrote:

 The one user is going to bring his radio by and see just what it is doing
 audio wise, it might be set to high to begin with, and with him having a
 loud voice, might be just over doing it all.
 

 While you *may* find the users radio to be too wide  (too much
 deviation), it has been my observation that users that sound too loud
 are due to them using radios that have too much Microphone Gain (gain
 before the clipper/filter, and deviation control).  Also, don't be
 surprised that you can't find a control to fix the problem, many of the
 newer radios don't have one.  My Kenwood 742A has been modified inside
 the microphone with the addition of a pot in the audio line.  When using
 this approach you must be cautious of the place that you install to
 control as you can affect the DTMF tone level.  In my case, there was no
 good place to install the pot near the mic element because of the bias
 voltage on the element.  While I could have decoupled the audio and
 steered the bias around the pot, there physically wasn't enough room in
 the mic to do that easily.  I opted to simply place the added pot in the
 audio line after the DTMF was mixed in.  Since the DTMF encoder has a
 control to set its level, and its output is fairly hot, I was able to
 turn down the mic element and reset the level of the DTMF encoder to the
 desired amount(s).

 Hope this helps...
 Kevin Custer






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[Repeater-Builder] Heliax for 6m duplexer; other free stuff

[Jeff DePolo WN3A]

1.  If anyone is looking for any 1 5/8 air dielectric feedline for making
6m notch duplexers (WB5WPA style), I have about 30 feet of new Andrew 1 5/8
air left over from an install, and will be taking down a run of Cablewave on
Monday.  If anyone can use some/all of it, pick up in either northeastern PA
(Scranton/Wilkes-Barre area), or I can bring small (6' max) pieces back to
Philadelphia.  Goes in the dumpster on Monday if nobody is interested.  If U
pick up at the site in NE PA, there is some 7/8 line, a Decibel VHF yagi,
and maybe some other stuff laying around too that you can have.

2.  Have a lowband Decibel cavity on 30-some MHz that needs to go away.
Pickup in Philadelphia.  About 7' tall if I remember right.

3.  Micor/PURC UHF 250 watt (tube) station taking up room in my garage
(Philadelphia surburbs).  Haven't tested it, and don't care to.  Taker must
have a strong back.

I will NOT ship any of this stuff, it's pickup only.  Email direct.



Jeff DePolo WN3A - [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Broadcast and Communications Consultant 


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RE: [Repeater-Builder] Audio limiting on incoming signals

[Thomas Oliver]

If your loud user clips at 6 Khz deviation no mater what then you have
your transmiter deviation set at 6 Khz turn it down to 4.5 or 5Khz max.
This is the max limit. Then have someone talk on the repeater or while
there is a conversation going on, use a radio at the site and switch
between input and output and adjust the controller TX audio so that input
equals output in loudness. It is that simple. If recieve audio is shaped
corectly before reaching the transmitter you should not be able to tell
input from output, it should sound like simplex if it sounds tinny or
bassy compared to the input no amount of tweeking of deviation or tx
audio controlls is going to help.

Does the 6 Khz user's input signal sound like his output signal? It should.
I would bet if you put his radio on your service monitor and yelled in the
mic it would be below 5 Khz, some radios have too much mic gain and the
user needs to be told to speak softer. But if he sounds louder on the input
than everyone else then he will when coming through the repeater too. Set
your controller tx level so input = output and all will be fine.

tom n8ies


 [Original Message]
 From: w9mwq [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
 Date: 4/13/2005 7:42:45 PM
 Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Audio limiting on incoming signals



 I have set the deviation level of the repeater to 4.5 Khz, which for 
 most users is excellent, however I have a few users whom no matter 
 what radio they use, alwys clips well over 6 Khz wide.  Is there a way 
 to limit this?  When these users come in, you have to turn down the 
 volume, but then it's difficult to hear the normal voice users of the 
 system.  Any thoughts.  Or am I just plagued with loud voice users.

 Mathew








  
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Swapping TX and RX freqs

[Jim B.]

Kevin Custer wrote:

 My only caution was that *some* duplexers aren't created equal between 
 sides; therefore switching sides *may* not be possible.  Motorola (and 
 others) made a few mobile duplexers that had more rejection on the 
 transmitter side, and simply switching them around wouldn't work 
 satisfactorily.
 
 Kevin

Also I have heard of a few duplexers (usually cheaper or homebrew ones) 
that had parts on the rx leg that could not handle any tx power at all, 
so swapping would likely blow up that leg.

-- 
Jim Barbour
WD8CHL





 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Heliax for 6m duplexer; other free stuff

[bob55]

 i had a strong  back bob k2nk

 1.  If anyone is looking for any 1 5/8 air dielectric feedline for making
 6m notch duplexers (WB5WPA style), I have about 30 feet of new Andrew 1
 5/8
 air left over from an install, and will be taking down a run of Cablewave
 on
 Monday.  If anyone can use some/all of it, pick up in either northeastern
 PA
 (Scranton/Wilkes-Barre area), or I can bring small (6' max) pieces back to
 Philadelphia.  Goes in the dumpster on Monday if nobody is interested.  If
 U
 pick up at the site in NE PA, there is some 7/8 line, a Decibel VHF yagi,
 and maybe some other stuff laying around too that you can have.

 2.  Have a lowband Decibel cavity on 30-some MHz that needs to go away.
 Pickup in Philadelphia.  About 7' tall if I remember right.

 3.  Micor/PURC UHF 250 watt (tube) station taking up room in my garage
 (Philadelphia surburbs).  Haven't tested it, and don't care to.  Taker
 must
 have a strong back.

 I will NOT ship any of this stuff, it's pickup only.  Email direct.


 
 Jeff DePolo WN3A - [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Broadcast and Communications Consultant


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 No virus found in this outgoing message.
 Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
 Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.9.10 - Release Date: 4/14/2005







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[Repeater-Builder] Specs. for TX RX duplexer.

[T.J.]

What info, if any does anyone have on a TX RX Band pass cavity duplexer, model number 89-37-06-CM? It says on the label 144-174 Mhz, but I want to know the specs. The usual, loss and isolation and all that other fun stuff. The duplexer is made up of eight, four inch wide, fifteen inch tall,band pass cans. Four band pass cans transmit side, four band pass cans receive side, no notchs. Any info would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks, T.J.













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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Swapping TX and RX freqs

[T.J.]

Well they are not home brew, but I don't remember the model number off hand. I want to say it'sa Sinclair model, but I can't say for sure. I'll see if I can get over to the site to find out for sure what it is. I remember that it's made up of four eight inch wide cans, that stand aboutthree foot tall in a grey cabinent. I'll get some more info and check back later.

Thanks, T.J."Jim B." [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Kevin Custer wrote: My only caution was that *some* duplexers aren't created equal between  sides; therefore switching sides *may* not be possible. Motorola (and  others) made a few mobile duplexers that had more rejection on the  transmitter side, and simply switching them around wouldn't work  satisfactorily.  KevinAlso I have heard of a few duplexers (usually cheaper or homebrew ones) that had parts on the rx leg that could not handle any tx power at all, so swapping would likely blow up that leg.-- Jim BarbourWD8CHLYahoo! Groups Links* To visit your group on the web, go to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email
 to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/













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RE: [Repeater-Builder] Specs. for TX RX duplexer.

[Rogers, Ron]

Did you check the TX-RX web site ? 



http://www.txrx.com/



If your model is not listed then drop them
an e-mail. They are usually quite responsive.







Ron 

WW8RR















From: T.J.
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2005
11:18 AM
To: Builder Repeater
Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Specs.
for TX RX duplexer.







What info, if any does anyone have on a TX RX Band pass cavity
duplexer, model number 89-37-06-CM? It says on the label 144-174 Mhz, but
I want to know the specs. The usual, loss and isolation and all that
other fun stuff. The duplexer is made up of eight, four inch wide,
fifteen inch tall,band pass cans. Four band pass cans transmit
side, four band pass cans receive side, no notchs. Any info would be
greatly appreciated.











Thanks, T.J.



























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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Audio limiting on incoming signals

[Jim B.]

Ken Arck wrote:

 At 09:27 PM 4/13/2005 -0500, you wrote:
 
 
I think that is what I was getting to as well, if there was a way to limit
the incoming audio, or like it was put, hope the other users lets the louder
ones know they are too loud.  As for the system, the audio levels are set
just right for about 95% of the users.
 
 
 ---I think many are either not listening or not grasping the concept here :-)
 
 It is not a matter of perceived deviation nor is it a matter of incoming
 levels. It is not because some users might be using an Icom and others are
 using a Kenwood. 
 
 Since the deviation levels mentioned were actually measured, it is obvious
 that the transmitter is being to 6 Khz deviation on occasion and the only
 way this is going to happen (assuming the deviation limiter circuitry is
 working properly and I see no reason it shouldn't be) is because the level
 from the controller to the transmitter is not set correctly and probably
 neither is the deviation control. 
 
 Period.
 
 Ken

That's exactly right. One does NOT set the repeat level on a repeater to 
what 'sounds right for the majority of users'. That will GUARANTEE 
splatter and excessive deviation, especially if you have a number of 
users who use older japanese rigs, and also spend a lot of time on SSB 
(louder is better...)

A local repeater, which was a few miles down the road from where I lived 
at the time, had been set up so that 'it sounded good' on the 'tech 
guys' old Heath 2026, which had a VERY broad detector (mod acceptance 
was out around 10-12 Khz). I measured peaks well in excess of +/-15-18 
Khz! Oh, btw, it was a Maggiore repeater. A freind of mine who worked 
for Motorola volunteered to set up the levels, and once he did, it 
wasn't splattering into adjacent channels anymore, but average levels 
were really low (poor audio design in the transmitter), so they went 
back in and turned it up. I bitched again, the moto guy came back and 
re-set it, and in a week it got turned back up again. Finally, they 
junked the Maggiore (and tossed the guy that was working on it) and 
somehow got a Micor mobile, which I set up for them. No problems after that.

Ken, your comment about 'assuming the deviation limiter circuitry is 
working properly' is appropriate here, since he is using a Maggiore, and 
  they are notorious for poor design in that regard, along with every 
other made-for-ham repeater. Poor transmit audio limiting, and 
inadequate rx limiting, resulting in poor noise rejection.

-- 
Jim Barbour
WD8CHL





 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Swapping TX and RX freqs

[John J. Riddell]

Several years ago...maybe 30...we moved my GE 
Progress line repeater and Sinclair
F150-4E duplexer to a Channel 2 TV transmitter site 
for a Motorcycle rally.

The interference from the TV transmitter made the 
system completely useless
on 147.690 (Rx).

We quickly pulled some crystals from a GE mobile 
and flipped the frequency of the repeater
and flipped the cables to the duplexer and it 
worked great !

The F150-4E is quite a good duplexer and this may 
not work with other models as Kevin has pointed out
but when you are in a "Jam" swomething must be done 
:-))

John VE3AMZ





- Original Message - 

  From: 
  T.J. 
  To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com 
  
  Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2005 11:24 
  AM
  Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Swapping 
  TX and RX freqs
  
  Well they are not home brew, but I don't remember the model number off 
  hand. I want to say it'sa Sinclair model, but I can't say for 
  sure. I'll see if I can get over to the site to find out for sure what 
  it is. I remember that it's made up of four eight inch wide cans, that 
  stand aboutthree foot tall in a grey cabinent. I'll get some more 
  info and check back later.
  
  Thanks, T.J."Jim B." [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
  Kevin 
Custer wrote: My only caution was that *some* duplexers aren't 
created equal between  sides; therefore switching sides *may* not be 
possible. Motorola (and  others) made a few mobile duplexers that 
had more rejection on the  transmitter side, and simply switching 
them around wouldn't work  satisfactorily.  
KevinAlso I have heard of a few duplexers (usually cheaper or 
homebrew ones) that had parts on the rx leg that could not handle any tx 
power at all, so swapping would likely blow up that leg.-- 
Jim BarbourWD8CHLYahoo! Groups 
Links* To visit your group on the web, go 
to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/* To 
unsubscribe from this group, send an email 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Audio limiting on incoming signals

[Jim B.]

Steve Bosshard (NU5D) wrote:

 On our local EDACS PST clear voice audio from the switch receives ALC and
 minor compression before going to the dispatch consoles or being repeated.
 This helps maintain reasonably constant loudness to the dispatcher's
 headsets, and makes for more uniform system loudness.  This is an 800 Mhz,
 19 channel, 3 site simulcast system.
 
 Ssb

I'm assuming when you say clear voice, you mean analog, vs either 
encrypted or unencrypted Voice Guard, AEGIS, or ProVoice.
What you are hearing is AGC in the console electronics, and does not 
affect repeat audio. There may also be some AGC in the microwave or what 
ever means they use to connect the sites together, but only to keep the 
levels from exceeding 0dBm.
BTW, what is a PST? Not familar with the term.

-- 
Jim Barbour
WD8CHL





 
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RE: [Repeater-Builder] Audio limiting on incoming signals

[Steve Bosshard]

The ALC cards process both repeated audio and console audio unless the
system is in bypass.  I can scan the block and level diagrams if you
like.  PST is Public Safety Trunk - Ssb




I'm assuming when you say clear voice, you mean analog, (VOICE APPLIED
TO THE CONSOLES IS ANALOG AND CONVERTED FROM DIGITAL TO ANALOG - AT
PRESENT AEGIS IS NOT DECODED AT THE CONSOLES - PROVOICE IS UNDER
CONSTRUCTION AND WILL DECODED AND SENT TO THE C3 MAESTRO CONSOLES) vs
either 
encrypted or unencrypted Voice Guard, AEGIS, or ProVoice.
What you are hearing is AGC in the console electronics, and does not 
affect repeat audio. There may also be some AGC in the microwave (THE
MICROWAVE CARRIES 4, T1 CHANNELS CONVERTED FROM ANALOG IN A HARRIS
INTRAPLEX MUX SHELF0 or what 
ever means they use to connect the sites together, but only to keep the 
levels from exceeding 0dBm.
BTW, what is a PST? Not familar with the term.






 
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RE: [Repeater-Builder] Audio limiting on incoming signals

[Bob Dengler]

At 4/13/2005 10:57 PM, you wrote:

I agree with Kevin on this, it's just a few users, and in person, these few
people talk very loud, I think they are deaf, I just want the system to be
heard all over the band, was the only reason I asked if there was a way to
basically shunt it at a maximum, so they are not all over the place.  I know
they will clip out of the repeater, and that does not bother me, I generally
tell them to talk softer, but I am not always around.  I've already had some
issues, don't need anymore.  I can limit the max deviation from the
controller, but if I set him so that he is no wider than say 5.5 Khz, then
all the rest is down under 2.5 and that is to low.

Your problems appear to be both in the repeater  the users:

-Your repeater's peak deviation should NEVER exceed 5 kHz.  Period.  If it 
does, either the deviation limiting control is not adjusted correctly or 
the limiter is not working properly.  See my prior post on this subject for 
instructions on how to set up your TX audio.

-Your users' deviations vary widely.  Your options in this area are

  1. Get your users to adjust their deviations to 4-5 kHz peak deviation.

  2. Increase your TX audio to achieve greater that 1:1 input to output 
deviation ratio (note that this will cause your 5 kHz deviation users to 
sound distorted as their audio gets clipped in your repeater TX).

  3. Get a CBS Volumax or Orban broadcast audio processor for your TX 
audio.  We use the latter for space shuttle audio over our repeater  it 
really improves intelligibility.

Bob NO6B






 
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[Repeater-Builder] Micor PL reeds

[wd9dau]

I am in need of 10 TLN8381A PL reeds with a freauency of 210.7 (M2).

If you can help me please respond off list.

Thanks,

Tom







 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Specs. for TX RX duplexer.

[Mike Pugh]

Full info can be found on their site. 
http://www.txrx.com/product/product.aspx?UID=5a623bb0-6489-4e26-9ebc-e65d5e8b391b
 
takes you to their VHF  cans page where all of the models are listed. Mike

T.J. wrote:

 What info, if any does anyone have on a TX RX Band pass cavity duplexer, 
 model number 89-37-06-CM?  It says on the label 144-174 Mhz, but I want 
 to know the specs.  The usual, loss and isolation and all that other fun 
 stuff.  The duplexer is made up of eight, four inch wide, fifteen inch 
 tall, band pass cans.  Four band pass cans transmit side, four band pass 
 cans receive side, no notchs.  Any info would be greatly appreciated.
  
 Thanks, T.J.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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[Repeater-Builder] Re: Audio limiting on incoming signals

[Rich Misener]

Anything to limit irritating laughs.

Dick---N7ZH

--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Eric Lemmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:
 Dave,
 
 I should have known that my gambit would raise some eyebrows!  In 
truth, my
 phrase working on is a euphemism for the vague period 
between thinking about
 concepts and experimenting with.hardware.   I know all too well 
that few
 things are more irritating to repeater users than a function or 
voice
 announcement that asserts itself repeatedly for no apparent reason.
 Accordingly, my design must have enough intelligence to 
discriminate between
 real deviation that must be evaluated and false deviation caused 
by noise.  I
 am hopeful that the collective knowledge available on this list 
can synthesize
 a working prototype.  Stay tuned...
 
 73, Eric Lemmon WB6FLY
 
 Dave VanHorn wrote:
 
  
  I know I could use one of a number of  soft AGC circuits to 
control the
  incoming audio before it is repeated, but that would not prompt 
the
  offending users to mend their ways.  I am working on an audio 
monitor that
  will interject the voice warning average modulation too high 
when it
  detects that overdeviation of the input signal is present.  It 
is not a
  simple project!
 
  Interesting..   Can you share any details?
 
 
  Yahoo! Groups Links
 
 
 
 







 
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[Repeater-Builder] 4.5v off Micor back plane

[Rick Charlotte]

is there a spot that I could grab 4.5v off the micor back plane .. 


I need to drive a bias boad with 4.5v and wonder if there is a SAFE 
spot to grab this ?

I know I could build a reg for ti but I would rather keep this simple

Thanks for any and all help in this matter

Rick




Rick Szajkowski VA3 RZS
Charlotte Darby VA3 CMR
Node Owners of IRLP Node 2120
147.300 + VA3 OME
224.420 -  VA3 OME
Part of The Omeme Amateur Radio Club
Peterborough Ont. Canada





 
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[Repeater-Builder] LUNAR PAF-432-2 PREAMP

[R. Crocker]

I have a Lunar Preamp Model PAF-432-2.
Anyone have any info on this unit?
Royce - W3IF





 
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[Repeater-Builder] Re: Audio limiting on incoming signals

[pm3349714]

Well Mr. Barbour I see you are at it again. Since you don't have the 
guts to reply to my emails or my postings on the list I have no choice 
but to defend myself on this list. If you read the postings including 
your own you will see if the equipment is set up properly then there is 
no problem. I think I and everyone else on this list knows that you 
don't like our equipment by now. I also have noticed how you belittle 
people on this list often. I am pretty sure that the repeater you are 
talking about is pre 1982 which makes it one of the ones that was made 
with either Clegg boards or midland. All equipment is now manufactured 
by us and we stand by it 100% and even back it with a 2 year warranty. 
As a matter of fact there is a Motorola repeater in my area thats 
modulation is spiking up to 10khz. I guess it just matters on who sets 
it up. If you where working on one of our machines and didn't know how 
to fix it or adjust it maybe you should have called us and we would 
have been glad to assist you. We have many satisfied customers that do 
not have any of the problems you speak of. 

Paul Maggiore AA3VI V.P.
Maggiore Electronic Lab 







 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] 4.5v off Micor back plane

[Captainlance]

No, micors develop 9.6 and 12 volts only.

- Original Message - 
From: Rick  Charlotte [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2005 3:06 PM
Subject: [Repeater-Builder] 4.5v off Micor back plane



 is there a spot that I could grab 4.5v off the micor back plane ..


 I need to drive a bias boad with 4.5v and wonder if there is a SAFE
 spot to grab this ?

 I know I could build a reg for ti but I would rather keep this simple

 Thanks for any and all help in this matter

 Rick


 

 Rick Szajkowski VA3 RZS
 Charlotte Darby VA3 CMR
 Node Owners of IRLP Node 2120
 147.300 + VA3 OME
 224.420 -  VA3 OME
 Part of The Omeme Amateur Radio Club
 Peterborough Ont. Canada






 Yahoo! Groups Links







 






 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Audio limiting on incoming signals

[Bob Dengler]

Actually, the biggest problem I have with users' deviation on my system is 
not enough of it; none of my users deviate more than 5 kHz.  I have one 
user that likes to stay several inches away from the mic  talk softly, 
yielding about 1 kHz deviation on average.  For those users I've been 
contemplating just the opposite: a circuit that closes the squelch on 
inadequately-deviated users.  This should be easier to implement since the 
noise from noisy stations will be detected as adequate deviation  keep COS 
valid.  COS would only be interrupted if insufficient audio was detected on 
the discriminator for several seconds.

Essentially this would be nothing more than VOX ANDed with COS.

Bob NO6B






 
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[Repeater-Builder] Microphone Gain and Deviation

[Steve Bosshard \(NU5D\)]

Best answer I have found for soft spoken
folks is the little mic preamp board used in some of the old GE Phoenix and MVS
radios. Little single stage amp that operated from bias on the mic line. 

I usually set the deviation limit for
voice at 4.0 Khz. And allow a little for tone/dcg.

NEVER EVER USE THE TRANSMITTER DEVIATION
CONTROL TO MAKE UP FOR LACKING MIC GAIN. A soft spoken person may need a mic
preamp, or a more sensitive microphone. Beware of excessive mic gain competing
with ctcss and causing drop or talk down. A small swamping resistor might be
in order. Wish Helper still made the modulation density meter

SOP is to set a tone gen at around 50 mv
or enough to fully modulate the transmitter, and then set the deviation limit
to around +/- 4.0 Khz @ 1000 Hz. Tone. Using the IDC to boost mic gain will
lead to overmodulation and clipping out of the pass band of the receiver, not
to mention the joy you will bring to your adjacent channel neighbors.

2 cents and 30 years,

Steve








image001.jpgBEGIN:VCARD
VERSION:2.1
N:Bosshard;Steve;S.;;(NU5D)
FN:Steve S. Bosshard
ORG:Bosshard Radio Service
TITLE:Proprietor
TEL;WORK;VOICE:(254) 773-1102
TEL;WORK;VOICE:(254) 773-1174
TEL;HOME;VOICE:(254) 770-0111
TEL;CELL;VOICE:(254) 624-4230
TEL;WORK;FAX:(254) 773-1174
ADR;WORK;ENCODING=QUOTED-PRINTABLE:;;503 B. South 25th. Street=0D=0ATemple, Texas 76504
LABEL;WORK;ENCODING=QUOTED-PRINTABLE:503 B. South 25th. Street=0D=0ATemple, Texas 76504
ADR;HOME;ENCODING=QUOTED-PRINTABLE:;;901 Delaware Drive=0D=0ATemple, Texas 76504
LABEL;HOME;ENCODING=QUOTED-PRINTABLE:901 Delaware Drive=0D=0ATemple, Texas 76504
EMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
REV:20040610T093050Z
END:VCARD

Re: [Repeater-Builder] 4.5v off Micor back plane

[Thomas Oliver]

How about a couple of resistors and make a voltage divider. Two equal value
resistors will put you close. Don't know how much current you need so
resistors might not work. Or you could use a 5 volt regulator and put a
diode in series with the 5 volt output to drop it to 4.4 or u could just
hook a bunch of diodes in series until you get close.

tom n8ies


 [Original Message]
 From: Captainlance [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
 Date: 4/14/2005 4:38:21 PM
 Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] 4.5v off Micor back plane


 No, micors develop 9.6 and 12 volts only.

 - Original Message - 
 From: Rick  Charlotte [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2005 3:06 PM
 Subject: [Repeater-Builder] 4.5v off Micor back plane


 
  is there a spot that I could grab 4.5v off the micor back plane ..
 
 
  I need to drive a bias boad with 4.5v and wonder if there is a SAFE
  spot to grab this ?
 
  I know I could build a reg for ti but I would rather keep this simple
 
  Thanks for any and all help in this matter
 
  Rick
 
 
  
 
  Rick Szajkowski VA3 RZS
  Charlotte Darby VA3 CMR
  Node Owners of IRLP Node 2120
  147.300 + VA3 OME
  224.420 -  VA3 OME
  Part of The Omeme Amateur Radio Club
  Peterborough Ont. Canada
 
 
 
 
 
 
  Yahoo! Groups Links
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
  






  
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Microphone Gain and Deviation

[Chuck Kelsey]

I had a friend who refused to get any closer to the microphone than 12 . He 
was real difficult to understand due to the low audio level that resulted. 
We turned up the gain in his mobile, but it was still a bit of a problem 
since it then increased the road noise.

Chuck
WB2EDV


- Original Message - 
From: Steve Bosshard (NU5D)
To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2005 5:43 PM
Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Microphone Gain and Deviation



Best answer I have found for soft spoken folks is the little mic preamp 
board used in some of the old GE Phoenix and MVS radios.  Little single 
stage amp that operated from bias on the mic line.
I usually set the deviation limit for voice at 4.0 Khz. And allow a little 
for tone/dcg.
NEVER EVER USE THE TRANSMITTER DEVIATION CONTROL TO MAKE UP FOR LACKING MIC 
GAIN.  A soft spoken person may need a mic preamp, or a more sensitive 
microphone.  Beware of excessive mic gain competing with ctcss and causing 
drop or talk down.  A small swamping resistor might be in order.  Wish 
Helper still made the modulation density meter.
SOP is to set a tone gen at around 50 mv or enough to fully modulate the 
transmitter, and then set the deviation limit to around +/- 4.0 Khz @ 1000 
Hz. Tone.  Using the IDC to boost mic gain will lead to overmodulation and 
clipping out of the pass band of the receiver, not to mention the joy you 
will bring to your adjacent channel neighbors.
2 cents and 30 years,
Steve
 






 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] 4.5v off Micor back plane

[Rick Charlotte]

verry verry very little current .. just to drive a input on a chip 

never though about the diodes .. u good ideas .. I guess I 
could use the 5 volt reg it should not have to hard a time going from 
9 to 5 volts .. 

Thanks for the idea .. 

Rick

On 14 Apr 2005 at 17:43, Thomas Oliver wrote:

 
 How about a couple of resistors and make a voltage divider. Two equal
 value resistors will put you close. Don't know how much current you
 need so resistors might not work. Or you could use a 5 volt regulator
 and put a diode in series with the 5 volt output to drop it to 4.4 or
 u could just hook a bunch of diodes in series until you get close.
 
 tom n8ies
 
 
  [Original Message]
  From: Captainlance [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
  Date: 4/14/2005 4:38:21 PM
  Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] 4.5v off Micor back plane
 
 
  No, micors develop 9.6 and 12 volts only.
 
  - Original Message - 
  From: Rick  Charlotte [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com; [EMAIL PROTECTED];
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2005 3:06 PM
  Subject: [Repeater-Builder] 4.5v off Micor back plane
 
 
  
   is there a spot that I could grab 4.5v off the micor back plane ..
  
  
   I need to drive a bias boad with 4.5v and wonder if there is a
   SAFE spot to grab this ?
  
   I know I could build a reg for ti but I would rather keep this
   simple
  
   Thanks for any and all help in this matter
  
   Rick
  
  
   
  
   Rick Szajkowski VA3 RZS
   Charlotte Darby VA3 CMR
   Node Owners of IRLP Node 2120
   147.300 + VA3 OME
   224.420 -  VA3 OME
   Part of The Omeme Amateur Radio Club
   Peterborough Ont. Canada
  
  
  
  
  
  
   Yahoo! Groups Links
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
   
 
 
 
 
 
 
   
  Yahoo! Groups Links
 
 
 
   
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 Yahoo! Groups Links
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 -- 
 No virus found in this incoming message.
 Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
 Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.9.9 - Release Date: 4/13/2005
 




Rick Szajkowski VA3 RZS
Charlotte Darby VA3 CMR
Node Owners of IRLP Node 2120
147.300 + VA3 OME
224.420 -  VA3 OME
Part of The Omeme Amateur Radio Club
Peterborough Ont. Canada





 
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[Repeater-Builder] Re: 4.5v off Micor back plane

[hwingate]

5.1V zener in series with the 9.6V. (9.6 - 5.1 = 4.5)


--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Rick  Charlotte
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 verry verry very little current .. just to drive a input on a chip 
 
 never though about the diodes .. u good ideas .. I guess I 
 could use the 5 volt reg it should not have to hard a time going from 
 9 to 5 volts .. 
 
 Thanks for the idea .. 
 
 Rick
 
 On 14 Apr 2005 at 17:43, Thomas Oliver wrote:
 
  
  How about a couple of resistors and make a voltage divider. Two equal
  value resistors will put you close. Don't know how much current you
  need so resistors might not work. Or you could use a 5 volt regulator
  and put a diode in series with the 5 volt output to drop it to 4.4 or
  u could just hook a bunch of diodes in series until you get close.
  
  tom n8ies
  
  
   [Original Message]
   From: Captainlance [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
   Date: 4/14/2005 4:38:21 PM
   Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] 4.5v off Micor back plane
  
  
   No, micors develop 9.6 and 12 volts only.
  
   - Original Message - 
   From: Rick  Charlotte [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com; [EMAIL PROTECTED];
   [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2005 3:06 PM
   Subject: [Repeater-Builder] 4.5v off Micor back plane
  
  
   
is there a spot that I could grab 4.5v off the micor back plane ..
   
   
I need to drive a bias boad with 4.5v and wonder if there is a
SAFE spot to grab this ?
   
I know I could build a reg for ti but I would rather keep this
simple
   
Thanks for any and all help in this matter
   
Rick
   
   

   
Rick Szajkowski VA3 RZS
Charlotte Darby VA3 CMR
Node Owners of IRLP Node 2120
147.300 + VA3 OME
224.420 -  VA3 OME
Part of The Omeme Amateur Radio Club
Peterborough Ont. Canada
   
   
   
   
   
   
Yahoo! Groups Links
   
   
   
   
   
   
   

  
  
  
  
  
  

   Yahoo! Groups Links
  
  
  

  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  Yahoo! Groups Links
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  -- 
  No virus found in this incoming message.
  Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
  Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.9.9 - Release Date: 4/13/2005
  
 
 
 
 
 Rick Szajkowski VA3 RZS
 Charlotte Darby VA3 CMR
 Node Owners of IRLP Node 2120
 147.300 + VA3 OME
 224.420 -  VA3 OME
 Part of The Omeme Amateur Radio Club
 Peterborough Ont. Canada







 
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[Repeater-Builder] Re: Superflex connectors wanted

[Ed Folta]

Anyone have a stash of 1/4 Superflex connectors type N male?

Ed Folta
Com/Rad Inc.
Des Plaines, IL 





 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Specs. for TX RX duplexer.

[Mike Pugh]

Did you try calling them and asking for tech support? I've got TXRX in 
all of my repeaters,and have found them excellent the help when asked.. 
Good luck! Mike

T.J. wrote:

 I tried looking there already, it's not listed on there site.  I believe 
 that it is an older unsupported model that they don't make any more.  
 That's why I resorted to asking here to see if any one has some old info 
 laying around on this duplexer.
  
 T.J.
 
 Mike Pugh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 
 Full info can be found on their site.
 
 takes you to their VHF cans page where all of the models are listed.
 Mike
 
 T.J. wrote:
 
   What info, if any does anyone have on a TX RX Band pass cavity
 duplexer,
   model number 89-37-06-CM? It says on the label 144-174 Mhz, but I
 want
   to know the specs. The usual, loss and isolation and all that
 other fun
   stuff. The duplexer is made up of eight, four inch wide, fifteen
 inch
   tall, band pass cans. Four band pass cans transmit side, four
 band pass
   cans receive side, no notchs. Any info would be greatly appreciated.
  
   Thanks, T.J.
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
 
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RE: [Repeater-Builder] Specs. for TX RX duplexer.

[Mathew Quaife]

Call and talk to Mary Brown, she is a sweetheart and very helpful.  

Mathew


-Original Message-
From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Pugh
Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2005 5:40 PM
To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Specs. for TX RX duplexer.


Did you try calling them and asking for tech support? I've got TXRX in 
all of my repeaters,and have found them excellent the help when asked.. 
Good luck! Mike

T.J. wrote:

 I tried looking there already, it's not listed on there site.  I believe 
 that it is an older unsupported model that they don't make any more.  
 That's why I resorted to asking here to see if any one has some old info 
 laying around on this duplexer.
  
 T.J.
 
 Mike Pugh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 
 Full info can be found on their site.
 
 takes you to their VHF cans page where all of the models are listed.
 Mike
 
 T.J. wrote:
 
   What info, if any does anyone have on a TX RX Band pass cavity
 duplexer,
   model number 89-37-06-CM? It says on the label 144-174 Mhz, but I
 want
   to know the specs. The usual, loss and isolation and all that
 other fun
   stuff. The duplexer is made up of eight, four inch wide, fifteen
 inch
   tall, band pass cans. Four band pass cans transmit side, four
 band pass
   cans receive side, no notchs. Any info would be greatly
appreciated.
  
   Thanks, T.J.
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  


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Re: [Repeater-Builder] AE/LZB 119 1878 R1A Audio ALC CARD - RX Audio Processing

[Kevin Custer]

Hi Steve,

While the specifications state that ALC (agc) is used with a range of
about 10 dB plus or minus, it doesn't state anything about compression;
at least not that I read. Is there another module that does
compression?

Kevin

Steve Bosshard wrote:

  
  
  AE/LZB 119 1878 R1A Audio ALC CARD - RX Audio Processing
http://www.bosshardradio.com/ALCCARD.jpg
  
  Link to specifications on GE ALC CARD
- Receive Audio Processing
  Steve Bosshard (NU5D) wrote:


On our local EDACS PST clear voice audio
from the switch receives ALC and
  
minor compression before going to the dispatch consoles or being
repeated.
  
  


How much exactly is the amount of "minor comprerssion", 2 to 1 or more?


Kevin















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[Repeater-Builder] mostar

[Larry Kemper]

Anyone have access to a schematic for the D44 UHF Motorola Mostar mobile 
PA?I cut one up for an amp and need to figure out where it all goes.
Thanks

WA0VUSLarry KemperMuscatine, Iowa

[EMAIL PROTECTED]













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attachment: tech.gif

RE: [Repeater-Builder] AE/LZB 119 1878 R1A Audio ALC CARD - RX Audio Processing

[Steve S. Bosshard \(NU5D\)]

Hello,



I am probably a little loose with the
word compressor.  The object of this ALC board is to maintain a -10 dbm output
even though the input may dip to -20 or hit 0 dbm.  The integration time is 10
ms., and the max gain is slightly more than 10 db.  This is a far cry from the
Secode consoles that had 20 db of compressor gain and made the mechanical clock
sound like a teletype machine running in the background.



The ALC board does feed a distribution
amp card that feeds SEL and UNSEL audio to the different consoles.  In the
system I work with there are 13 consoles and around 4000 subscriber units, ½ vehicular
and ½ portable.



Best regards,



Steve

















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Re: [Repeater-Builder] 4.5v off Micor back plane

[Mike Morris WA6ILQ]

Remember the 9.6v regulator runs all the audio circuits in the
Micor. If you are going to be doing ANYTHING that might, if
a circuit failure occurs,  reflect any noise back into the supply
voltage it's best to run it off the 12v unregulated source.

The average 5v regulator, properly heat sunk, does not care if
it's fed by 9.6 or 12v or even 14v, so it's just as easy to grab
12v as 9.6v
Don't forget the bypass caps on each side of the regulator
chip, and physically close to the package.

Mike WA6ILQ

At 03:01 PM 4/14/05, you wrote:

verry verry very little current .. just to drive a input on a chip

never though about the diodes .. u good ideas .. I guess I
could use the 5 volt reg it should not have to hard a time going from
9 to 5 volts ..

Thanks for the idea ..

Rick

On 14 Apr 2005 at 17:43, Thomas Oliver wrote:

 
  How about a couple of resistors and make a voltage divider. Two equal
  value resistors will put you close. Don't know how much current you
  need so resistors might not work. Or you could use a 5 volt regulator
  and put a diode in series with the 5 volt output to drop it to 4.4 or
  u could just hook a bunch of diodes in series until you get close.
 
  tom n8ies
 
 
   [Original Message]
   From: Captainlance [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
   Date: 4/14/2005 4:38:21 PM
   Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] 4.5v off Micor back plane
  
  
   No, micors develop 9.6 and 12 volts only.
  
   - Original Message -
   From: Rick  Charlotte [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com; [EMAIL PROTECTED];
   [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2005 3:06 PM
   Subject: [Repeater-Builder] 4.5v off Micor back plane
  
  
   
is there a spot that I could grab 4.5v off the micor back plane ..
   
   
I need to drive a bias boad with 4.5v and wonder if there is a
SAFE spot to grab this ?
   
I know I could build a reg for ti but I would rather keep this
simple
   
Thanks for any and all help in this matter
   
Rick
   
   

   
Rick Szajkowski VA3 RZS
Charlotte Darby VA3 CMR
Node Owners of IRLP Node 2120
147.300 + VA3 OME
224.420 -  VA3 OME
Part of The Omeme Amateur Radio Club
Peterborough Ont. Canada





 
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RE: [Repeater-Builder] Specs. for TX RX duplexer.

[T.J.]

Ok, I'll try giving them a call tomorrow. Thanks, T.J.Mathew Quaife [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Call and talk to Mary Brown, she is a sweetheart and very helpful. Mathew-Original Message-From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike PughSent: Thursday, April 14, 2005 5:40 PMTo: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comSubject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Specs. for TX RX duplexer.Did you try calling them and asking for tech support? I've got TXRX in all of my repeaters,and have found them excellent the help when asked.. Good luck! MikeT.J. wrote: I tried looking there already, it's not listed on there site. I believe  that it is an older unsupported model that they don't make any more.  That's why I resorted to asking here to see if any one has some old info  laying around on this duplexer.  T.J.
  Mike Pugh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote:   Full info can be found on their site.  takes you to their VHF cans page where all of the models are listed. Mike  T.J. wrote:   What info, if any does anyone have on a TX RX Band pass cavity duplexer,  model number 89-37-06-CM? It says on the label 144-174 Mhz, but I want  to know the specs. The usual, loss and isolation and all that other fun  stuff. The duplexer is made up of eight, four inch wide, fifteen inch  tall, band pass cans. Four band pass cans transmit side, four band pass  cans receive side, no notchs. Any info would be greatlyappreciated.   Thanks, T.J.   
  !  Yahoo! Groups Links   * To visit your group on the web, go to:  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/   * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of  Service . Yahoo! Groups Links    Yahoo! Groups Links  * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/  * To
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Superflex connectors wanted

[Captainlance]

yes, I think we have several new ones. lance 
- Original Message - 
From: Ed Folta [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2005 6:20 PM
Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Superflex connectors wanted


 
 Anyone have a stash of 1/4 Superflex connectors type N male?
 
 Ed Folta
 Com/Rad Inc.
 Des Plaines, IL 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Audio limiting on incoming signals

[Neil McKie]

  You are correct Ken, 

  Neil McKie - WA6KLA 

Ken Arck wrote:
 
 At 07:52 PM 4/13/2005 -0500, you wrote: 

  ... snip ...

 In other words, simply adjusting the output of the controller to 
 obtain 4.5 Khz deviation ain't gonna do it. Unless you force the 
 transmitter into actual limiting (clipping), you'll never limit 
 deviation correctly. 
 
 Ken
 
 --
 President and CTO - Arcom Communications
 Makers of state-of-the-art repeater controllers and accessories.
 http://www.ah6le.net/arcom/index.html
 We now offer complete Kenwood TKR repeater packages!
 AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000
 http://www.irlp.net






 
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[Repeater-Builder] Jazz up a repeater

[geodude2010]

 I have a repeater that is hardly used. I have echolink on this
repeater.  I want some freeware that I can install on my computer
connected with the same interface that will jazz it up. Tools like:
saying the time, courtsy tones..e.c.t. All from my compter, FOR FREE.
Sense I dont own the repeater, I dont want to spend any more(I already
am paying for echolink). Thanks for any help!










 
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[Repeater-Builder] Re: Specs. for TX RX duplexer.

[nj902]

--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, T.J. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
What info, if any does anyone have on a TX RX Band pass cavity
duplexer, model number 89-37-06-CM?  ... I want to know the specs...
__

You probably aren't finding any info because you're looking in the
wrong place - it's not a duplexer - it's a preselector.

89-37-06
Frequency range: 144-174 MHz
Cavities: 4 x 4
Pass bandwidth: 0.5 to 2.0 MHz
Specification bandwidth: 1.0 MHz
Insertion loss: 1.4 dB @ Fo MHz
Passband insertion loss: 1.8 dB
Typical selectivity: 65 dB @ 155 MHz
Return loss: 20 dB
RF power: 125 Watts








 
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Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Audio limiting on incoming signals

[Neil McKie]

  I don't have any problems with Maggiore equipment ... but then 
 again, I don't own any either. 

  All I have here is Motorola, GE, RCA and a couple of others. 

  Neil McKie - WA6KLA 


pm3349714 wrote:
 
 Well Mr. Barbour I see you are at it again. Since you don't have the
 guts to reply to my emails or my postings on the list I have no choice
 but to defend myself on this list. If you read the postings including
 your own you will see if the equipment is set up properly then there is
 no problem. I think I and everyone else on this list knows that you
 don't like our equipment by now. I also have noticed how you belittle
 people on this list often. I am pretty sure that the repeater you are
 talking about is pre 1982 which makes it one of the ones that was made
 with either Clegg boards or midland. All equipment is now manufactured
 by us and we stand by it 100% and even back it with a 2 year warranty.
 As a matter of fact there is a Motorola repeater in my area thats
 modulation is spiking up to 10khz. I guess it just matters on who sets
 it up. If you where working on one of our machines and didn't know how
 to fix it or adjust it maybe you should have called us and we would
 have been glad to assist you. We have many satisfied customers that do
 not have any of the problems you speak of.
 
 Paul Maggiore AA3VI V.P.
 Maggiore Electronic Lab






 
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