Re: Rietveld

[Miguel Delgado]

*/> Loopstra is not alive either/* (A fact. True).

> */Scientists cannot ask anyone for the absolute truth/* (A 
consideration valid for one but also for two, and beyond).


> */We have to look at the available evidence, and different people may 
reach different conclusions./* (A well-based scientific -human- statement)


>*/If you want the opinion of the actual people involved, you now have 
van Laar's account and you have Rietveld's account/*. Again, too bad 
that Dr. Rietveld is not alive. In my humble opinion, for the sake of 
the proper scientific exchange of ideas and facts in the _actual 
context_, Dr. Rietveld’s statements of many years ago is not enough. The 
vL&S publication, after the passing of Dr. Rietveld, needs a lot more 
than that.



On 8/20/2018 1:47 AM, Alan Hewat wrote:
*> For the sake of the scientific exchange of ideas and facts, too bad 
that Dr. Rietveld is not alive.*
Loopstra is not alive either. Scientists cannot ask anyone for the 
absolute truth. We have to look at the available evidence, and 
different people may reach different conclusions. If you want the 
opinion of the actual people involved, you now have van Laar's account 
  and you have 
Rietveld's account <%20http://home.wxs.nl/%7Erietv025/>.


*> ...why did this happen 49 years after?*
1) At Petten there was apparently a problem from the beginning. 
According to vL&S 
"/After publishing this important project alone, Rietveld found his 
position in the small Petten group increasingly difficult. In 1974 he 
successfully applied for the post of head of the RCN library/"

2) For the first 20 years, it simply wasn't important
"/It was only really adopted by the wider crystallographic community 
20 years later, after the original small group at Petten had all left 
science/".
3) When the importance of the method was finally recognised, these 
reservations about its origins were published, at least in the NL - D. 
Andriesse (2000), H. Schenk (2001) as quoted by vL&S 
.


*Just as profile refinement "/did not suddenly appear in a flash of 
inspiration of a single person/", questions about the origin of the 
method did not suddenly appear in 2018.*


On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 at 07:35, Davide Levy > wrote:


Hi,

I am too young and out of the mainstream of powder diffraction to
know all the stories about the born of the Rietveld Method.

My question is: the article of Rietveld is published in 1969 and
 the article about the born of this method come out after that
Hugo Rietveld pass away, why did this happen 49 years after?

*Dr. Davide Levy, Ph.D.*

*Head of XRD laboratory
Wolfson Applied Materials Research Center*
*Tel Aviv University*

*Phone: +972-3-6407815 *
*Fax: +972-3-6407819 *
*http://www3.tau.ac.il/wamrc/ *


http://www3.tau.ac.il/wamrc/templates/labs_3/images/new-tau-logo.pngWAMRC-LOGO_new

*From:*rietveld_l-requ...@ill.fr

[mailto:rietveld_l-requ...@ill.fr
] *On Behalf Of *Le Bail Armel
*Sent:* Monday, 20 August, 2018 2:22 AM
*To:* Rietveld_l@ill.fr 
*Subject:* Re: Rietveld

*>"...*/*the method did not suddenly appear in a flash of
inspiration of a single person, but was the result of the work of
three individuals... Loopstra, van Laar and Rietveld.*/*".*

And more precisely :

" HS wrote in Dutch:

‘Loopstra had the idea that it should be better to use the whole
powder profile rather than estimated intensities to solve
structures, van Laar worked it out mathematically and Rietveld
programmed it."

I conclude then :

no idea for Rietveld and van Laar since they are from Loopstra;

no mathematics for Rietveld and Loopstra;

no programming for Loopstra and van Laar.

A very clear result of the work of three individuals. The HS view...

Seems that Rietveld had not the same opinion and claimed for ideas
too and possibly for mathematics as well.

Best,

Armel

++
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Send commands to mailto:lists...@ill.fr>> eg:
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The Rietveld_L list archive is on
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++



--
__
*   Dr Alan Hewat, NeutronOptics, Grenoble, FRANCE *
 +33.476.98.41.68
http://www.NeutronOptics.com/hewat
__


++
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Re: Rietveld

[Miguel Delgado]

Seems that Rietveld had not the same opinion and claimed for ideas too 
and possibly for mathematics as well.


Best,

Armel



Armel,

For the sake of the scientific exchange of ideas and facts, too bad that 
Dr. Rietveld is not alive.


Regards,

Miguel Delgado


On 8/19/2018 6:21 PM, Le Bail Armel wrote:


*>".../the method did not suddenly appear in a flash of inspiration of 
a single person, but was the result of the work of three 
individuals... Loopstra, van Laar and Rietveld./".*


And more precisely :

" HS wrote in Dutch:

‘Loopstra had the idea that it should be better to use the whole 
powder profile rather than estimated intensities to solve structures, 
van Laar worked it out mathematically and Rietveld programmed it."


I conclude then :

no idea for Rietveld and van Laar since they are from Loopstra;

no mathematics for Rietveld and Loopstra;

no programming for Loopstra and van Laar.

A very clear result of the work of three individuals. The HS view...

Seems that Rietveld had not the same opinion and claimed for ideas too 
and possibly for mathematics as well.


Best,

Armel



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++



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Re:

[Miguel Delgado]

Prof. Schenk,

Thank you for your interesting article. For the sake of the scientific 
exchange of ideas and facts, too bad that Dr. Rietveld is not alive.


Regards,

Miguel Delgado


On 8/9/2018 6:32 AM, h.sch...@uva.nl wrote:
Bob van Laar and I wrote an article about the development of the 
powder Profile Refinement at the Reactor Centre Netherlands. This 
method is later called Rietveld refinement. We show that there were 
three persons involved in this enterprise, Bert Loopstra for the idea, 
Bob van Laar for the mathematical treatment and Hugo Rietveld for the 
computer program, rather than one. For all users of the method it will 
be interesting to read.


The article (Acta Cryst. (2018). A74, 88-92) is Open Access and can be 
downloaded from: 
http://journals.iucr.org/a/issues/2018/02/00/ib5058/ib5058.pdf 
<http://journals.iucr.org/a/issues/2018/02/00/ib5058/ib5058.pdf>


At the moment it is the most read article of Acta Cryst. A of the last 
6 months: *MailScanner warning: numerical links are often malicious:* 
http://178.33.252.149/a/services/mostread.html


<http://178.33.252.149/a/services/mostread.html>Kind greetings,
Henk Schenk


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Re: atomic position

[Miguel Delgado]

Dear All,

For more information about the PDF-4+, feel free to visit the following 
page: http://www.icdd.com/products/pdf4.htm


Kind Regards,

Miguel Delgado


On 6/14/2016 4:16 AM, Matteo Leoni wrote:

dear everybody,

I think there is some misconception here.

It is true that the PDF-4+ is a commercial database: this means that 
sharing the information taken from the database (as recently done 
here) is an explicit violation of copyrights of ICDD and the violator 
might be legally prosecuted. When you use the database you save the 
time needed to look through the literature for the same information, 
paying the rights to the original owner and checking for errors in 
transcription and, sometimes, interpretation. That's why (at least) 
you pay for it.


However, please update your records. The PDF-4+ is not the PDF-2. The 
PDF-4+ is a materials database that contains the "old" PDF-2 
information, but it contains also structural data for a large quantity 
of compounds as well as properties and experimental patterns for 
several compounds. It contains also most of the ICSD coordinates that 
have been however thoroughly checked in house, quality marked, cross 
referenced and corrected when needed.


So if the material is inorganic and the structure is not in PDF-4+, it 
usually means the structure is either very doubtful, too new or not 
yet extracted from the literature.
In this particular case, as the chemistry and the space group are 
known, it is also likely that the compounds are isostructural to 
others already described in the literature


Just notice that there are free alternatives to the commercial 
databases (e.g. COD, RRUFF) that in some cases can provide useful 
information, but in all cases the copyright warning exists


Matteo (Chair of the BoD of the ICDD)


-

  Prof. Matteo Leoni, PhD

  DICAM - University of Trento
  via Mesiano, 77
  38123 Trento - Italy

  Tel +39 0461 282416 Fax +39 0461 282672

  e-mail: matteo.le...@unitn.it <mailto:matteo.le...@unitn.it>



2016-06-14 9:04 GMT+02:00 Alan Hewat <mailto:alan.he...@neutronoptics.com>>:


maybe they are in PDF4.


PDF4 is a commercial database of d-spacings and unit cells derived
from them. It does not normally contain atomic positions, and not
all structures in PDF4 have been determined. ICSD does contain
atomic positions if they have been determined.

Both PDF4 and ICSD are copyright and must not be posted to this
mailing list. As well, there is an explicit warning not to attach
files to the mailing list. Anyone who does so risks exclusion.

There are other free databases that may contain the information
you require, but I doubt it. Try using Google Scholar to first
determine if the structures have been published. If not, you will
have to determine them yourself. It is not so difficult if you
have good data and know the space group and lattice dimensions.

Alan
__
*   Dr Alan Hewat, NeutronOptics, Grenoble, FRANCE *
 +33.476.98.41.68
http://www.NeutronOptics.com/hewat
__

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++





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++
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++

Re: SARX 2008 Second Announcement

[Miguel Delgado]

SARX-2008 wrote:

Dear Colleagues

I am writing to inform you about the new issues of SARX 2008 which will be 
held in Cabo Frio, Rio de Janeiro, Brazil, 16-20 November 2008. 

The deadline of abstract submission has been extended until 30th June 2008, 
as well as notification (11st August) and the full paper submition (26th October).


There are new information about accommodation and the scientific program.
Please, visit the webapge: www.lin.ufrj.br/sarx2008

If you have any questions, please do not hesitate to contact us: [EMAIL 
PROTECTED]
   
The Organizing Committee of SARX 2008 is looking forward to meeting you in 
Rio de Janeiro! 


Yours sincerely,

Ricado Tadeu Lopes
Congress Chairman.


_
The Organizing Committee of SARX 2008
Nuclear Instrumentation Laboratory - COPPE - UFRJ 
P.O.Box.: 68.509 Zip:21941-972 
Av Horacio Macedo 2030, bloco G, sala 206 - Cidade Universitária, zip:21941- 
914, Rio de Janeiro, Brazil 
Tel: + 55 21 25627311 
Fax: + 55 21 25628444

([EMAIL PROTECTED])
_
www.lin.ufrj.br/sarx2008

  

[Fwd: SARX 2008 - Abstract Submission]

[Miguel Delgado]

*
The /Latin American Seminary of Analysis by X-Ray Techniques/ (SARX) is 
an international meeting held in South America countries and assembles 
researchers to promote the exchange of experiences in research and 
technology developments by X-ray techniques. Since 1997, SARX has been 
taken place in many countries all over the Latin America with many 
researchers from several parts of the world.


The Seminary is held every two years and the next one will be in 2008, 
in Brazil. SARX 2008 will be organized by the Nuclear Instrumentation 
Laboratory at Federal University of Rio de Janeiro. It will be held in 
Cabo Frio, RJ - Brazil at **Malibu Palace Hotel 
**.*


*The Organizing Committee of the SARX 2008 is pleased to invite you to 
participate in the event and become part of our group.

*


 Original Message 
Subject:SARX 2008 - Abstract Submission
Date:   Thu, 21 Feb 2008 18:15:45 -0300
From:   SARX-2008 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: undisclosed-recipients:;



Dear Colleagues

We would like to remind you that the registration and abstract 
submission is open at the Seminary website (www.lin.ufrj.br/sarx2008 
)


We kindly encourage you to submit an abstract in English until April 
6th, 2008, using the template available at Seminary website.


Best Regards,

The Organizing Committee of SARX 2008.


_ 


The Organizing Committee of SARX 2008
Nuclear Instrumentation Laboratory - COPPE - UFRJ
P.O.Box.: 68.509 Zip:21941-972
Av Horacio Macedo 2030, bloco G, sala 206 - Cidade Universitária, 
zip:21941-

914, Rio de Janeiro, Brazil
Tel:  55 21 25627311
Fax: 55 21 25628444
([EMAIL PROTECTED])
_
www.lin.ufrj.br /sarx2008

XVIII ICCOSS in Venezuela...

[Miguel Delgado]

Dear Colleague,

We cordially invite you to participate in the XVIII International 
Conference on the Chemistry of the Organic Solid State (XVIII-ICCOSS) 
which will take place in Mérida, Venezuela, from July 8 to 13, 2007. For 
this ocassion, we have also planned a "School on Materials Applications 
of the Organic Solid State" (SMAOSS) from July 1 to 6, 2007. Please 
check the Conference website for information: 
http://www.ula.ve/eventos/iccoss.


We certainly hope that you would consider participating in these events. 
They are being sponsored by IUCr, ICDD, Bruker AXS, PDVSA-INTEVEP and 
other national institutions.



Sincerely,

Prof. Graciela Díaz de Delgado
Chair, Local Organizing Committee
XVIII-ICCOSS and SMAOSS


**ICCOSS International Advisory Board**

Lia Addadi, Israel
Roger Bishop, Australia
Gautam R. Desiraju, India
Graciela Díaz de Delgado, Venezuela
Volker Enkelmann, Germany
Bruce Foxman, USA
Miguel A. Garcia-Garibay, USA
Kenneth Harris, UK
Mark D. Hollingsworth, USA
William Jones, UK
Meir Lahav, Israel
Mortimer M. Labes, USA
Leslie Leiserowitz, Israel
J. Michael McBride, USA
Daniel J. Sandman, USA
Gleb B. Sergeev, Russia
John R. Scheffer, Canada
Piero Sozzani, Italy
Juliusz Sworakowski, Poland
Fumio Toda, Japan
Michael D. Ward, USA
Gerhard Wegner, Germany

XVIII ICCOSS and SMAOSS Local Organizing Committee**

Graciela Díaz de Delgado, ULA
Miguel Delgado, ULA
Asiloé Mora, ULA
Belkis Ramírez, ULA
Gerzon Delgado, ULA
Jines Contreras, ULA
Julia Bruno-Colmenárez, ULA
Robert Toro, ULA
Patricia Quintero, ULA

National Collaborators**

Haydelba D'Armas, Universidad de Oriente-Cumaná
Alexander Briceño, IVIC-Los Teques
Reinaldo Atencio, IVIC-Los Teques
Teresa González, IVIC-Los Teques
Merlin Rosales, Universidad del Zulia-Maracaibo

Re: Announcement for XVIII-ICCOSS in Merida, Venezuela

[Miguel Delgado]

My apologies for enclosing an attachment!. I am sorry I sent it
inadvertently.


Best regards,

Miguel Delgado


Miguel Delgado wrote:

  
Dear Colleague,
  
  
  We cordially invite you to participate in the
XVIII International
Conference on the Chemistry of the Organic Solid State (XVIII-ICCOSS)
which will take place in Mérida, Venezuela, from July 8 to 13, 2007.
For this ocassion, we have also planned a "School on Materials
Applications of the Organic Solid State" (SMAOSS) from July 1 to 6,
2007. Please check the Conference website for information: http://www.ula.ve/eventos/iccoss.
  
  
  
  We certainly hope that you would consider
participating in these
events. If you would like to receive information on XVIII-ICCOSS and
I-SMAOSS directly to your e-mail account, please let us know.
  
  
  
Sincerely,
  
  
  
Prof. Graciela Díaz de Delgado
  
Chair, Local Organizing Committee
  
XVIII-ICCOSS and SMAOSS
  
  [EMAIL PROTECTED],
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  
  www.webdelprofesor.ula.ve/ciencias/diaz
  
  
  
*ICCOSS International Advisory Board*
  
Lia Addadi, Israel
  
Roger Bishop, Australia
  
Gautam R. Desiraju, India
  
Graciela Díaz de Delgado, Venezuela
  
Volker Enkelmann, Germany
  
Bruce Foxman, USA
  
Miguel A. Garcia-Garibay, USA
  
Kenneth Harris, UK
  
Mark D. Hollingsworth, USA
  
William Jones, UK
  
Meir Lahav, Israel
  
Mortimer M. Labes, USA
  
Leslie Leiserowitz, Israel
  
J. Michael McBride, USA
  
Daniel J. Sandman, USA
  
Gleb B. Sergeev, Russia
  
John R. Scheffer, Canada
  
Piero Sozzani, Italy
  
Juliusz Sworakowski, Poland
  
Fumio Toda, Japan
  
Michael D. Ward, USA
  
Gerhard Wegner, Germany
  
  
  
  
  *XVIII
ICCOSS
and SMAOSS Local Organizing Committee*
  
  
Graciela Díaz de Delgado, ULA
  
Miguel Delgado, ULA
  
Asiloé Mora, ULA
  
Belkis Ramírez, ULA
  
Gerzon Delgado, ULA
  
Jines Contreras, ULA
  
Julia Bruno-Colmenárez, ULA
  
Robert Toro, ULA
  
Patricia Quintero, ULA
  
  
  
  *National
Collaborators*
  
  
Haydelba D’Armas, Universidad de Oriente-Cumaná
  
Alexander Briceño, IVIC-Los Teques
  
Reinaldo Atencio, IVIC-Los Teques
  
Teresa González, IVIC-Los Teques
  
Merlin Rosales, Universidad del Zulia-Maracaibo
  
  
  
  
  
  
  

Re: For the spanish speaking community..

[José Miguel Delgado Q.]

I apologize to you and to other members of the list for the inconvenience
caused by my last message. If I have broken any of the rules expected to be
followed by the members of this list, I express my sincere apology to
everybody, specially to Alan Hewatt, the very capable list moderator.

We are at the moment setting up the list RAYOS-X, in spanish (those
interested in participating in this list, please, send a message to:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]). We are also putting together a web page in spanish from
where interested parties can download files, programs, and information
related to the use of X-rays for characterization of materials. We hope to
have these facilities set up for next January. The idea is not to isolate us
from the mainstream scientific forum, but to address more appropriately and
freely local and more specific issues of interest to the iberoamerican
community.

>From time to time, it might not be a bad idea to remind ourselves that there
is a vibrant world outside the english language. That, in spite of the
dominance of the english as the language of the world in this short period of
time, History teaches us that other languages dominated the world for much
longer periods and that a number of them have even disapeared. I have no
problem with wishing LONG LIVE THE ENGLISH LANGUAGE but it may not be long
into the milenium around the corner, people may have to learn another
language to survive in the “civilized” world. Who knows?.

Once again my apologies.

With kind regards,


Miguel Delgado



[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> I propose the administrator(s) of this group should make a decision if we
> subscribers are indeed on a multilingual platform or not and if file
> attachment are OK.
>
> L. Keller

For the spanish speaking community..

[José Miguel Delgado Q.]

... FOR THE SPANISH SPEAKING COMMUNITY !!..

CURSO: "CARACTERIZACION
DE MATERIALES CRISTALINOS
MEDIANTE TECNICAS DE RAYOS-X"

Entre el 24 y el 28 de Enero del próximo año se realizará
en las instalaciones de la Facultad de Ciencias de la Universidad de Los
Andes en Mérida, el curso “Caracterización de Materiales
Cristalinos Mediante Técnicas de Rayos-X”. La información
detallada sobre dicho curso se encuentra en el archivo que se anexa al
presente mensaje.

Le agradecemos si pudiera re-enviar esta información a otras
personas e instituciones que pudieran estar interesadas en esta actividad.

Cordialmente,
 

Miguel Delgado
 

P.S. Si tiene dificultades en leer el archivo, no dude en contactarnos.
 
 curso199.pdf

Desde Venezuela

[Jose Miguel Delgado Q.]

I apologize for asking about a hardware-related matter in this very
interesting software-oriented mailing list. But, I guess we have no other
way of reaching this important part of the international powder
diffraction community. 

In Venezuela we are in the process of consolidating the diffraction
facilities of three University X-ray Laboratories under the auspices of
CONICIT (our National Science and Technology Office). With this support we
have recently purchased two brand new diffractometers and successfully
automated two old Philips PW1250 goniometers we received from a goverment
X-Ray Laboratory. Since we have adequate financial support to automate
another two Philips goniometers we would like to explore the possibility
of obtaining from generous donors one or two goniometers in good
mechanical conditions. 

We would gladly pay the shipping and handling expenses to transport the
goniometers to Venezuela. 

With best regards,

   Jose Miguel Delgado

--
Prof. Jose Miguel Delgado
Current address (until August '99)   Permanent address:
University of California Universidad de Los Andes
Materials Research LaboratoryFac. de Ciencias-Depto. de Quimica
Room 2027-C  Apdo. Postal 40, La Hechicera,
Santa Barbara,  CA  93106Merida,  5251
Phone: (805) 893-7926Venezuela
FAX:   (805) 893-8502Phone: 58 74 401372  FAX: 58 74 401286