Re: Rivet namespace and Rivet package
There is code at SF, available via svn co https://atwf.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/atwf atwf But there is some problem with the repo… svn: URL 'https://atwf.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/atwf/application/modules/Module1' of existing directory 'atwf/application/modules/module1' does not match expected URL 'https://atwf.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/atwf/application/modules/module1' http://sourceforge.net/projects/atwf/ last commit 46 days ago... On Jan 27, 2011, at 8:12 AM, Massimo Manghi wrote: Arnulf's work is the only serious attempt I know to endow Tcl programming with a consistent framework for web development. Still, the SF site has no download to offer. Do you know if Arnulf moved it on to some other resource? -- Massimo On 01/27/2011 02:31 PM, Harald Oehlmann wrote: Maybe ATWF, the port of the zend framework to Rivet by Arnulf Wiedemann may be interesting? See: http://wiki.tcl.tk/25821 or the presentation at TC2010. Harald - To unsubscribe, e-mail: rivet-dev-unsubscr...@tcl.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: rivet-dev-h...@tcl.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: rivet-dev-unsubscr...@tcl.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: rivet-dev-h...@tcl.apache.org
Re: Rivet namespace and Rivet package
Hi, The Tcl paper will be online realSoonNow (tm). We've got the hotel for Tcl2011 chosen and I put last year's proceedings online as part of the first look the new conference is happening publicity. I'll announce to this list when the site (and papers) are live. There were a couple of web things at last year's conference. If anyone wants to consider this as a solicitation for a paper proposal, well, they can do that... :) Clif On Thu, Jan 27, 2011 at 03:12:39PM +0100, Massimo Manghi wrote: Arnulf's work is the only serious attempt I know to endow Tcl programming with a consistent framework for web development. Still, the SF site has no download to offer. Do you know if Arnulf moved it on to some other resource? -- Massimo On 01/27/2011 02:31 PM, Harald Oehlmann wrote: Maybe ATWF, the port of the zend framework to Rivet by Arnulf Wiedemann may be interesting? See: http://wiki.tcl.tk/25821 or the presentation at TC2010. -- ... Clif Flynt ... http://www.cwflynt.com ... c...@cflynt.com ... .. Tcl/Tk: A Developer's Guide (2nd edition) - Morgan Kauffman .. 18'th Annual Tcl/Tk Conference: 2011, Manassas, VA USA . http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2010/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: rivet-dev-unsubscr...@tcl.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: rivet-dev-h...@tcl.apache.org
Speaking of Tcl-US 2011
It seems to me that there's more web activity now than there's been in several years. This might just be because I've got a contract doing some web-work for a change, but... In the Tcl arena, we've got: tclhttpd - old, reliable, stable and obsolete (but I use it). wub - new, snazzy, up-to-date and fluid (I use this one, too). rivet - stable, integrated with the most-used server (yeah, I use this one). ?others? - I probably missed a dozen or two that I don't use. Would it be reasonable to do a compare-and-contrast panel at the Tcl conference? Would anyone be willing to step up and defend their turf? FWIW: I use tclhttpd when I've got a fairly simple task that doesn't need anything fancy. I used tclhttpd to set up sample exams for my students when I taught Tcl at EMU - a separate tclhttpd (and port) for each exam, was trivial. I use wub for the Tcl Community Association pages mostly because the pages are co-hosted with the wiki.tcl.tk, and that's wub. It's nice in that it supports lots of new stuff. Less nice because it changes and grows. I'm using rivet for a commercial task because Apache is solid and nobody questions using it. Rivet isn't moribund like Tclhttpd, but it's not so fluid that I worry about my code breaking with the next release. Happy Tcl'ing, Clif -- ... Clif Flynt ... http://www.cwflynt.com ... c...@cflynt.com ... .. Tcl/Tk: A Developer's Guide (2nd edition) - Morgan Kauffman .. 18'th Annual Tcl/Tk Conference: 2011, Manassas, VA USA . http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2010/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: rivet-dev-unsubscr...@tcl.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: rivet-dev-h...@tcl.apache.org
Re: Rivet namespace and Rivet package
With this latest project of mine I actually started work on a framework built solely around Rivet. I'm not shooting for something that works across web servers or something that is portable, I'm writing something that takes advantage of all the things Rivet has to offer. I call it Skyscraper. It kinda sucks right now because I've only really just started it, but it's coming along. It's based on many of the ideas used in Rails but in a Tcl way. When I looked at Ruby and Rails once before, there was a lot to like about it. Right now it's sort of hardwired for MySQL and jQuery as the external components, but that's purely because it's what I'm using. The ties to jQuery at this point are not much more than just including the tags to include it, and MOST of the SQL code is generic with only a few MySQL-specific things. It uses TDBC as the database backend, so it can easily support any database Tcl does, and the rest is all straight Tcl or Rivet. It doesn't use TclOO though it probably could if someone had a strong feeling about it. I found when using Rails that the object stuff felt kinda' forced. Like you didn't really need it, but because you're in Ruby, that's just the way you do it. Do you really need a new object for each request? Isn't that what Rivet's ::request namespace is doing for you? I'm open to hearing what people have to say on this topic. I needed a good MVC framework for writing Rivet apps, so I made one. I'm up for taking suggestions as I write it if anyone has any. I hope to include it as part of Rivet one day. Unlike TclOO that was supposedly made to build other OO frameworks on top of, I'd like to see Rivet ship with one framework to rule them all and right out of the box. D On Jan 27, 2011, at 8:12 AM, Massimo Manghi wrote: Arnulf's work is the only serious attempt I know to endow Tcl programming with a consistent framework for web development. Still, the SF site has no download to offer. Do you know if Arnulf moved it on to some other resource? -- Massimo On 01/27/2011 02:31 PM, Harald Oehlmann wrote: Maybe ATWF, the port of the zend framework to Rivet by Arnulf Wiedemann may be interesting? See: http://wiki.tcl.tk/25821 or the presentation at TC2010. Harald - To unsubscribe, e-mail: rivet-dev-unsubscr...@tcl.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: rivet-dev-h...@tcl.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: rivet-dev-unsubscr...@tcl.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: rivet-dev-h...@tcl.apache.org
Re: Rivet namespace and Rivet package
I like the name. We are down with jQuery. But it would need to support PostgreSQL to get any traction at FlightAware. You might have a look at yajl-tcl for generating valid JSON really quickly. The library includes returning PostgreSQL query results as JSON. It can parse, too, but the results are left-to-right so it's gotta be taken further to be useful. On 1/27/11 10:49 AM, Damon Courtney da...@tclhome.com wrote: With this latest project of mine I actually started work on a framework built solely around Rivet. I'm not shooting for something that works across web servers or something that is portable, I'm writing something that takes advantage of all the things Rivet has to offer. I call it Skyscraper. It kinda sucks right now because I've only really just started it, but it's coming along. It's based on many of the ideas used in Rails but in a Tcl way. When I looked at Ruby and Rails once before, there was a lot to like about it. Right now it's sort of hardwired for MySQL and jQuery as the external components, but that's purely because it's what I'm using. The ties to jQuery at this point are not much more than just including the tags to include it, and MOST of the SQL code is generic with only a few MySQL-specific things. It uses TDBC as the database backend, so it can easily support any database Tcl does, and the rest is all straight Tcl or Rivet. It doesn't use TclOO though it probably could if someone had a strong feeling about it. I found when using Rails that the object stuff felt kinda' forced. Like you didn't really need it, but because you're in Ruby, that's just the way you do it. Do you really need a new object for each request? Isn't that what Rivet's ::request namespace is doing for you? I'm open to hearing what people have to say on this topic. I needed a good MVC framework for writing Rivet apps, so I made one. I'm up for taking suggestions as I write it if anyone has any. I hope to include it as part of Rivet one day. Unlike TclOO that was supposedly made to build other OO frameworks on top of, I'd like to see Rivet ship with one framework to rule them all and right out of the box. D On Jan 27, 2011, at 8:12 AM, Massimo Manghi wrote: Arnulf's work is the only serious attempt I know to endow Tcl programming with a consistent framework for web development. Still, the SF site has no download to offer. Do you know if Arnulf moved it on to some other resource? -- Massimo On 01/27/2011 02:31 PM, Harald Oehlmann wrote: Maybe ATWF, the port of the zend framework to Rivet by Arnulf Wiedemann may be interesting? See: http://wiki.tcl.tk/25821 or the presentation at TC2010. Harald - To unsubscribe, e-mail: rivet-dev-unsubscr...@tcl.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: rivet-dev-h...@tcl.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: rivet-dev-unsubscr...@tcl.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: rivet-dev-h...@tcl.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: rivet-dev-unsubscr...@tcl.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: rivet-dev-h...@tcl.apache.org
Re: Rivet namespace and Rivet package
MySQL was just my choice, and most all the code in Skyscraper itself is just plain old SQL. There may be a few things in there that are specific, but for the most part it'll work anywhere. But Flightaware isn't going to use something like this. You guys have in development of your stuff, and this is a whole new framework. You're not going to go through and rewrite all your pages in this. 0-] I haven't looked at generating JSON at all as I don't have a need for it, but it's certainly something that should be added out of the box. Being that I develop my stuff in one way while others develop in completely different ways, this is the kind of thing that needs to be brought up. What is the list of things that should be in a modern framework built on Rivet. Someone with some Ruby and Rails experience should pipe in here. Oooh, maybe we can get ol' Welton over there to wake up for a quick response! 0-] D On Jan 27, 2011, at 11:09 AM, Karl Lehenbauer wrote: I like the name. We are down with jQuery. But it would need to support PostgreSQL to get any traction at FlightAware. You might have a look at yajl-tcl for generating valid JSON really quickly. The library includes returning PostgreSQL query results as JSON. It can parse, too, but the results are left-to-right so it's gotta be taken further to be useful. On 1/27/11 10:49 AM, Damon Courtney da...@tclhome.com wrote: With this latest project of mine I actually started work on a framework built solely around Rivet. I'm not shooting for something that works across web servers or something that is portable, I'm writing something that takes advantage of all the things Rivet has to offer. I call it Skyscraper. It kinda sucks right now because I've only really just started it, but it's coming along. It's based on many of the ideas used in Rails but in a Tcl way. When I looked at Ruby and Rails once before, there was a lot to like about it. Right now it's sort of hardwired for MySQL and jQuery as the external components, but that's purely because it's what I'm using. The ties to jQuery at this point are not much more than just including the tags to include it, and MOST of the SQL code is generic with only a few MySQL-specific things. It uses TDBC as the database backend, so it can easily support any database Tcl does, and the rest is all straight Tcl or Rivet. It doesn't use TclOO though it probably could if someone had a strong feeling about it. I found when using Rails that the object stuff felt kinda' forced. Like you didn't really need it, but because you're in Ruby, that's just the way you do it. Do you really need a new object for each request? Isn't that what Rivet's ::request namespace is doing for you? I'm open to hearing what people have to say on this topic. I needed a good MVC framework for writing Rivet apps, so I made one. I'm up for taking suggestions as I write it if anyone has any. I hope to include it as part of Rivet one day. Unlike TclOO that was supposedly made to build other OO frameworks on top of, I'd like to see Rivet ship with one framework to rule them all and right out of the box. D On Jan 27, 2011, at 8:12 AM, Massimo Manghi wrote: Arnulf's work is the only serious attempt I know to endow Tcl programming with a consistent framework for web development. Still, the SF site has no download to offer. Do you know if Arnulf moved it on to some other resource? -- Massimo On 01/27/2011 02:31 PM, Harald Oehlmann wrote: Maybe ATWF, the port of the zend framework to Rivet by Arnulf Wiedemann may be interesting? See: http://wiki.tcl.tk/25821 or the presentation at TC2010. Harald - To unsubscribe, e-mail: rivet-dev-unsubscr...@tcl.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: rivet-dev-h...@tcl.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: rivet-dev-unsubscr...@tcl.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: rivet-dev-h...@tcl.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: rivet-dev-unsubscr...@tcl.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: rivet-dev-h...@tcl.apache.org
Re: Rivet namespace and Rivet package
This is where I'm not exactly sure how tightly things are integrated between Javascript and most frameworks. I know that Rails supports jQuery and Prototype, I believe, but I don't know exactly where they have them integrated and for what purpose. The only integration I have so far is in a proc called ss_button that creates a button widget, and you can do things like: ss_button delete -text Delete This -confirm Are you sure you want to delete this? The -confirm option links into jQuery and pops up a confirmation dialog before proceeding with the button if it exists. Otherwise it just returns and does nothing. So far that's about the only actual integration I've managed to come up with. I'm using jQuery extensively on the site, but it's just pure jQuery and has little or nothing to do with the Tcl code on the backend. D On Jan 27, 2011, at 12:22 PM, Clif Flynt wrote: I've got some sort of javascript interfacing in my future. In a post-FaceBook era, folks don't like the http 2.0 look feel any more than they like Mosaic. I've looked at WubTk briefly - the idea is clever (rework Tk widgets to generate javascript (JQuery, I think) widgets), but it's tied more tightly to Wub than a quick survey was going to disentangle. I think a One-True-Supported javascript thing in Rivet (or as a Rivet add-on) would be great. I can offer to test and complain. I'm not sure just how much I'll be able to actually contribute. Clif -- ... Clif Flynt ... http://www.cwflynt.com ... c...@cflynt.com ... .. Tcl/Tk: A Developer's Guide (2nd edition) - Morgan Kauffman .. 18'th Annual Tcl/Tk Conference: 2011, Manassas, VA USA . http://www.tcl.tk/community/tcl2010/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: rivet-dev-unsubscr...@tcl.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: rivet-dev-h...@tcl.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: rivet-dev-unsubscr...@tcl.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: rivet-dev-h...@tcl.apache.org
