Re: [Scottish] Help - Need some good arguments
On Monday 09 February 2004 13:01, Paxton, Darren wrote: > What about also demonstrating compatibility with MS systems, potentially > things like OpenOffice and the like. I know this is a big sticking point of > a lot of organisations considering a switch. > > From: Huard, Elise - D C&W Consultant > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Sent: 09 February 2004 12:47 > To: 'SLUG-list' > Subject: RE: [Scottish] Help - Need some good arguments > > > Well, a few screen prints and maybe a wee demo ... show them it's as pretty > > From: Philip Ward[SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > I need your argumentative help. I've built a LInux Terminal Server > > based Cyber Cafe for our Church community project, but a couple of > > influential board of management members have cried "It's not > > Microsoft, we hate it!" It looks like my work is to be tossed out and I think you've missed the biggest points: 1) you have delivered a working solution 2) you have the skills to maintain the system Certainly cost is a major issue: take the time to cost out a comparable installation using Microsoft products. Don't forget anti-virus, firewall, anti-spyware and internet 'safety' products (you have installed squidguard?). Include the ongoing cost of upgrading the software and hardware to accomodate it (OS upgrade every 3 years, application upgrade every 4 years). Try to put a figure on the hidden costs of admin time; I reckon that in the last 6 months (Blaster, Welchia, MyDoom) have directly or indirectly cost me about half a day for each Microsoft PC in my work. I would expect to pay at least £25/hour for someone to do this adequately for me. Although these machines are driven by technically literate people, I will still spend a significant amount of time fixing broken configs/installs just because the machines have lost the plot or the users have done something stupid. Putting machines into a public facing scenario also requires a great deal of specialised hardening. (The most effective way I've seen of doing this was to use Ghost to create disk images which are restored at regular intervals - obviously, the images need to be maintained properly). Committees are talking shops, but don't be misled - if you play them at their own game, you stand a good chance of losing, don't be argumentative - talk the proponents and ask them how they would advise you to solve the problems of locking down the machines, remote management, egress filtering, but cost out the tangibles and as much as you can of the intangibles then ask the board if: 1) they want to spend this much money replacing a proven system 2) if they can quantify exactly what they would gain by spending the money 3) justify why the money should be spent on dismantling something which delivers. (it DOES deliver, doesn't it?) Another good way to make them stop and think (but make sure you've wayed up your opposition first) is good old-fashioned spoiling - ask the cheif Microsoft proponent to produce a Microsoft machine so that the board can see for themselves in a straight comparison. Meanwhile get together a CD of (tame) porn warez and virus to demonstrate why the systems need to be managed and secure. HTH Colin ___ Scottish mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/scottish
RE: [Scottish] Help - Need some good arguments
What about also demonstrating compatibility with MS systems, potentially things like OpenOffice and the like. I know this is a big sticking point of a lot of organisations considering a switch. -Original Message- From: Huard, Elise - D C&W Consultant [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 09 February 2004 12:47 To: 'SLUG-list' Subject: RE: [Scottish] Help - Need some good arguments Well, a few screen prints and maybe a wee demo ... show them it's as pretty and user-friendly as microsoft (and looks almost the same, in better). That's what important for most people. > -- > From: Philip Ward[SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Reply To: SLUG-list > Sent: 09 February 2004 12:17 > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: [Scottish] Help - Need some good arguments > > <> > Hi Folks, > > I need your argumentative help. I've built a LInux Terminal Server > based Cyber Cafe for our Church community project, but a couple of > influential board of management members have cried "It's not > Microsoft, we hate it!" It looks like my work is to be tossed out and > a pile of crap put in its place. If I get the chance to present to the > board of management what sort of arguments should I give? > I've already got stability, price, no mass-mailing viruses, ease of > maintenance (one terminal server verses umpteen workstations), oh yes, and > the fact that they can count me out if they go this route. > > Any other arguments I could use? > > Phil. > > > > *** This email and any accompanying files are confidential. If you are not the intended recipient you must not use, copy or disclose the content. If you have received this email in error please contact the sender by return email and delete this message. Thankyou for your co-operation. * ___ Scottish mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/scottish This e-mail and any attachments may be confidential or legally privileged. If you received this message in error or are not the intended recipient, you should destroy the e-mail message and any attachments or copies, and you are prohibited from retaining, distributing, disclosing or using any information contained herein. Please inform us of the erroneous delivery by return e-mail. Thank you for your co-operation. Mercer Human Resource Consulting Limited is authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority and is a member of the General Insurance Standards Council. Registered in England No. 984275. Registered Office: Telford House, 14 Tothill Street, London SW1H 9NB ___ Scottish mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/scottish
Re: [Scottish] Help - Need some good arguments
OK - you could probably add in the following arguments: 1. Security, in terms of the amount of control a user gets over the machine - you can lock the machines down much more easily. 2. Fair trade - most churches are into fairly traded goods - Bill Gates may have a (reasonably) impressive history of giving to charity, but Microsoft have a history of tying people, including governments of developing nations, into their proprietary, costly, environments. I think you could probably find some good examples of MS giving out "freebies" to nations thinking of using Linux, but their "freebies" are only free until the license needs renewed. 3. If you really want to go for it, you can suggest that Open Source represents the 'grace' of the software world, whereas MS is an unrepentant sinner, convicted of antitrust, but still living by greed, and that no self-respecting church could, without-guilt, use MS software. ;o) 4. If it's in a poorer area, you could point out that free software like OpenOffice.org can be provided, so that everyone can be equally 'endowed' without the need for a trip to the Barras ;o) Ultimately, churches tend to be very technologically naive - if they didn't want your opinion then they shouldn't have asked for it! However, they are usually very cost conscious: each of your main points has a cost benefit: less worms = less maintenance = less cost, etc, etc. HTH Ben Thorp "Philip Ward" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent by:cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Subject: [Scottish] Help - Need some good arguments .lug.org.uk 09-02-04 12:17 Please respond to SLUG-list Hi Folks, I need your argumentative help. I've built a LInux Terminal Server based Cyber Cafe for our Church community project, but a couple of influential board of management members have cried "It's not Microsoft, we hate it!" It looks like my work is to be tossed out and a pile of crap put in its place. If I get the chance to present to the board of management what sort of arguments should I give? I've already got stability, price, no mass-mailing viruses, ease of maintenance (one terminal server verses umpteen workstations), oh yes, and the fact that they can count me out if they go this route. Any other arguments I could use? Phil. ___ Scottish mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/scottish ___ Scottish mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/scottish
RE: [Scottish] Help - Need some good arguments
Well, a few screen prints and maybe a wee demo ... show them it's as pretty and user-friendly as microsoft (and looks almost the same, in better). That's what important for most people. > -- > From: Philip Ward[SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Reply To: SLUG-list > Sent: 09 February 2004 12:17 > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: [Scottish] Help - Need some good arguments > > <> > Hi Folks, > > I need your argumentative help. I've built a LInux Terminal Server based > Cyber Cafe for our Church community project, but a couple of influential > board of management members have cried "It's not Microsoft, we hate it!" > It looks like my work is to be tossed out and a pile of crap put in its > place. > If I get the chance to present to the board of management what sort of > arguments should I give? > I've already got stability, price, no mass-mailing viruses, ease of > maintenance (one terminal server verses umpteen workstations), oh yes, and > the fact that they can count me out if they go this route. > > Any other arguments I could use? > > Phil. > > > > *** This email and any accompanying files are confidential. If you are not the intended recipient you must not use, copy or disclose the content. If you have received this email in error please contact the sender by return email and delete this message. Thankyou for your co-operation. * ___ Scottish mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.lug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/scottish
