RE: CSFurther argyria comments
Regarding: Alexander G. Schauss, Hopkins PHD though he is, is wrong. The EPA established RISK for silver is 3.8 grams, not per day, but over a lifetime. 1. Does anyone have a copy of Roger Altman's self-study of silver excretion handy? It would be interesting to compare his rate of excretion with the rate that you would have to ingest silver to get to the 3.8 g. 2. Jason, do you have references for your quote? Thanks in advance, JOH -Original Message- From: Jason Eaton [mailto:ey...@cox.net] Sent: Friday, April 09, 2004 1:29 PM To: silver-list@eskimo.com Subject: Re: CSFurther argyria comments Hi Terry: There are a few problems with the quoted material below. Fine silver particles, in the form of industrial and silver dust in mining environments, inhalted into the lungs, used to cause an abundance of argyria cases. These cases were not studied medically as much as the proteins and compounds, because there was no reason to. Medical attention was given to silver compounds that might have potential for treatment in humans, and/or products that were being used as such; therefore, the abundance of medically related material found was written on these products. So, fine silver particles subjected to normal body fluids can cause argyria. Here, we then have to focus on particle sizing: http://www.silvermedicine.org/silver-lung-study.html Silver particles sized less than 15 nanometers, in one modern study, were readily eliminated by the lungs; the same can be said for dissolved silver. Of course, the silver nitrate was not retained in the lungs either, but can still be retained in other body organs. Concerning production with impure water, the real primary concern is not the silver salts formed, it is a) the large particles formed by the runaway reaction and b) the actual amount of silver ingested by this method. People commonly using salt or spring water go through rods pretty quickly; and they've ingested all of that silver. I used a silver-puppy generator and tap water with a dash of salt, and ran it for an hour with the current limited to about .3 Ma, just to get an idea of what Stan was drinking. Less than 15 minutes into the current limited reaction, tiny flakes of silver were already being deposited into the water. Obviously, it makes sense that ingesting a great deal of actual silver in a short period of time ( a few doses ) presents a greater risk than ingesting the same amount of silver over days/months/years. Alexander G. Schauss, Hopkins PHD though he is, is wrong. The EPA established RISK for silver is 3.8 grams, not per day, but over a lifetime. You'd have to chop tiny silver chips to ingest 3.8 grams a day or mix ground silver with your water, and doing so would not turn you blue, it would eventually kill you, probably before you turned blue. Silver is going to be retained in the major organs prior to the skin; this has been demonstrated over and over with lab rat type studies and autopsies. The established minimum critical dose is 1.9 milligrams daily. While this number is contested, it's a pretty close approximation to what is accepted by the World Health Organization and the EPA, and it is based on the available scientific data, which, granted, has a great many holes that have never been filled, especially concerning isolated silver products. At one point, I attempted to enduce argyria by utilizing large amounts of silver orally and via a nebulizer. Alot of interesting observations were made during this period, but argyria was not one of them. I am able to drink extraordinary amounts of good isolated silver, and my risk for argyria is not equal to others', as I have a fast burning metabolism, a very healthy liver, kidneys, and a digestive system that is managed via natural medicine ( at least that's what my accupuncturist states ). Best Regards, Jason - Original Message - From: Terry Chamberlin tcj...@yahoo.ca To: silver-list@eskimo.com Sent: Friday, April 09, 2004 11:20 AM Subject: CSFurther argyria comments Quoting from Alexander G. Schauss, Ph.D. ...you should be advised that we recently completed an extensive review of the scientific literature on the safety of silver, especially as it relates to its one known potential side effect, namely, Argyria. Argyia is an irreversible discoloration of the pigment (skin) caused by excessive silver intake or chronic exposure to silver by certain tissues. The amount of silver required to develop Argyria is estimated to be 3.8 grams per day. By comparison, standard 10 ppm colloidal silver contains silver in amounts equaling less than 1 milligram of silver (1,000 micrograms = 1 milligram; 1,000 milligrams - 1 gram), which therefore represents an amount approximately 1/500th to 1/1000th of the amount of silver considered to be a risk in the development of Argyria. And again We know that dogs died from injections of a type of protein-bound silver in dosages ranging from
RE: CSFurther argyria comments
Here Ya go, James, http://www.silvermedicine.org/AltmanStudy.pdf Chuck Particle physicists are always trying to hold a meeting, but whenever they decide on a place, the time changes. 1. Does anyone have a copy of Roger Altman's self-study of silver excretion handy? It would be interesting to compare his rate of excretion with the rate that you would have to ingest silver to get to the 3.8 g. -- The Silver List is a moderated forum for discussing Colloidal Silver. Instructions for unsubscribing are posted at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver List archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html Address Off-Topic messages to: silver-off-topic-l...@eskimo.com OT Archive: http://escribe.com/health/silverofftopiclist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
RE: CSFurther argyria comments
Particle physicists are always trying to hold a meeting, but whenever they decide on a place, the time changes. LOL... good joke. Will have to remember it. Ted __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - File online by April 15th http://taxes.X/filing.html -- The Silver List is a moderated forum for discussing Colloidal Silver. Instructions for unsubscribing are posted at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver List archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html Address Off-Topic messages to: silver-off-topic-l...@eskimo.com OT Archive: http://escribe.com/health/silverofftopiclist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
CSFurther argyria comments
Quoting from Alexander G. Schauss, Ph.D. ...you should be advised that we recently completed an extensive review of the scientific literature on the safety of silver, especially as it relates to its one known potential side effect, namely, Argyria. Argyia is an irreversible discoloration of the pigment (skin) caused by excessive silver intake or chronic exposure to silver by certain tissues. The amount of silver required to develop Argyria is estimated to be 3.8 grams per day. By comparison, standard 10 ppm colloidal silver contains silver in amounts equaling less than 1 milligram of silver (1,000 micrograms = 1 milligram; 1,000 milligrams - 1 gram), which therefore represents an amount approximately 1/500th to 1/1000th of the amount of silver considered to be a risk in the development of Argyria. And again We know that dogs died from injections of a type of protein-bound silver in dosages ranging from 500 mg to 1.9 grams of silver depending on the frequency of administration. This was equivalent in silver content to giving [per day] a 150 pound adult between 150 litres and 570 litres of 10 ppm colloidal silver, or between 75 and 285 liters of 20 ppm colloidal silver or between 50 and 190 litres of 30 ppm colloidal silver. The 10 gram estimated lethal dose for humans from Goodman and Gillman is equivalent to 1000 liters of 10 ppm colloidal silver. Quoting another silver-list member: Argyria is caused by the same mechanism that is used when developing photographs. It is the same thing. If you start with a salt of silver, and expose it to light, some of it will reduce to silver metal. Then if you have a developer (caffeine is a good developer) in an alkaline solution (blood is normally alkaline), additional silver will plate out from the compound onto the metallic particles, making them grow. That is the photographic process, and that is how one gets argyria. Now, the process requires silver salts. There are no substitutes. Colloidal silver contains no silver salts. Basically silver salts are what are in unexposed film. Silver colloid is what is in a developed photograph. If you put a developed photo into the sun what does it do. It fades, it doesn't turn darker. That is because a developed photo has no silver salts to add to the silver particles since it is already nothing but reduced silver particles. Thus colloidal silver cannot cause argyria. Theoretically I guess one could take CS with sufficient ppm and in sufficient quantity to cause aggregation, but one would likely drown from too much water first, as the amounts would be truly phenomenal. In years of pouring over hardcopy of obscure medical cases no one has yet found a single report of any adverse reaction to very fine particles of very fine silver floating in very pure water. Stan Jones did not drink very fine particles in very pure water. He drank colloidal silver mud. Stay away from the mud. Terry Chamberlin __ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca -- The Silver List is a moderated forum for discussing Colloidal Silver. Instructions for unsubscribing are posted at: http://silverlist.org To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com Silver List archive: http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html Address Off-Topic messages to: silver-off-topic-l...@eskimo.com OT Archive: http://escribe.com/health/silverofftopiclist/index.html List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@eskimo.com
Re: CSFurther argyria comments
Hi Terry: There are a few problems with the quoted material below. Fine silver particles, in the form of industrial and silver dust in mining environments, inhalted into the lungs, used to cause an abundance of argyria cases. These cases were not studied medically as much as the proteins and compounds, because there was no reason to. Medical attention was given to silver compounds that might have potential for treatment in humans, and/or products that were being used as such; therefore, the abundance of medically related material found was written on these products. So, fine silver particles subjected to normal body fluids can cause argyria. Here, we then have to focus on particle sizing: http://www.silvermedicine.org/silver-lung-study.html Silver particles sized less than 15 nanometers, in one modern study, were readily eliminated by the lungs; the same can be said for dissolved silver. Of course, the silver nitrate was not retained in the lungs either, but can still be retained in other body organs. Concerning production with impure water, the real primary concern is not the silver salts formed, it is a) the large particles formed by the runaway reaction and b) the actual amount of silver ingested by this method. People commonly using salt or spring water go through rods pretty quickly; and they've ingested all of that silver. I used a silver-puppy generator and tap water with a dash of salt, and ran it for an hour with the current limited to about .3 Ma, just to get an idea of what Stan was drinking. Less than 15 minutes into the current limited reaction, tiny flakes of silver were already being deposited into the water. Obviously, it makes sense that ingesting a great deal of actual silver in a short period of time ( a few doses ) presents a greater risk than ingesting the same amount of silver over days/months/years. Alexander G. Schauss, Hopkins PHD though he is, is wrong. The EPA established RISK for silver is 3.8 grams, not per day, but over a lifetime. You'd have to chop tiny silver chips to ingest 3.8 grams a day or mix ground silver with your water, and doing so would not turn you blue, it would eventually kill you, probably before you turned blue. Silver is going to be retained in the major organs prior to the skin; this has been demonstrated over and over with lab rat type studies and autopsies. The established minimum critical dose is 1.9 milligrams daily. While this number is contested, it's a pretty close approximation to what is accepted by the World Health Organization and the EPA, and it is based on the available scientific data, which, granted, has a great many holes that have never been filled, especially concerning isolated silver products. At one point, I attempted to enduce argyria by utilizing large amounts of silver orally and via a nebulizer. Alot of interesting observations were made during this period, but argyria was not one of them. I am able to drink extraordinary amounts of good isolated silver, and my risk for argyria is not equal to others', as I have a fast burning metabolism, a very healthy liver, kidneys, and a digestive system that is managed via natural medicine ( at least that's what my accupuncturist states ). Best Regards, Jason - Original Message - From: Terry Chamberlin tcj...@yahoo.ca To: silver-list@eskimo.com Sent: Friday, April 09, 2004 11:20 AM Subject: CSFurther argyria comments Quoting from Alexander G. Schauss, Ph.D. ...you should be advised that we recently completed an extensive review of the scientific literature on the safety of silver, especially as it relates to its one known potential side effect, namely, Argyria. Argyia is an irreversible discoloration of the pigment (skin) caused by excessive silver intake or chronic exposure to silver by certain tissues. The amount of silver required to develop Argyria is estimated to be 3.8 grams per day. By comparison, standard 10 ppm colloidal silver contains silver in amounts equaling less than 1 milligram of silver (1,000 micrograms = 1 milligram; 1,000 milligrams - 1 gram), which therefore represents an amount approximately 1/500th to 1/1000th of the amount of silver considered to be a risk in the development of Argyria. And again We know that dogs died from injections of a type of protein-bound silver in dosages ranging from 500 mg to 1.9 grams of silver depending on the frequency of administration. This was equivalent in silver content to giving [per day] a 150 pound adult between 150 litres and 570 litres of 10 ppm colloidal silver, or between 75 and 285 liters of 20 ppm colloidal silver or between 50 and 190 litres of 30 ppm colloidal silver. The 10 gram estimated lethal dose for humans from Goodman and Gillman is equivalent to 1000 liters of 10 ppm colloidal silver. Quoting another silver-list member: Argyria is caused by the same mechanism that is used when developing photographs. It is the same thing. If you start
