Re: [Simh] 101 Basic Games for RSTS/E (was Re: PDP11 on Simh for public access)

[Bryan Davies]

Very many thanks for this Tony.   It should be exactly what I need.

Unfortunately I've downloaded the RL zip and attached it in Simh but RSTS
won't mount it.It gives an 'Offline or Write Locked? error.   I've also
tried the Writeenable switch but without success.   I'll continue to
investigate but I'm posting here in case anyone else has any suggestions.



On 24 January 2018 at 00:00, Tony Nicholson <tony.nichol...@computer.org>
wrote:

> On Tue, Jan 23, 2018 at 11:37 PM, Bryan Davies <bryan.e.dav...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> [snip]
>
> I just need to get it all in a nice neat box, connect up he VT100, and
>> download some games and things for the guests to use.
>>
>>
> Bryan (and all).
>
> I first encountered RSTS/E in 1975 on a PDP-11/45 when I was a student
> when I discovered a book "101 Basic Computer Games" with an accompanying
> DECtape.
>
> Recently I tracked down a copy of the book in PDF format and an image of
> the DECtape (that had to be fixed-up so that it was readable) on bitsavers .
>
> The book is at -
>
> http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/_Books/101_BASIC_Computer_Games_Mar75.pdf
>
> I now have this running on RSTS/E V10.1 and RSTS V06C-03 under SIMH -
> after some minor edits to fix changes to the Basic-Plus source file syntax
> (spaces between keywords etc).
>
> I've zipped-up the fixed DECtape image (DOS format) and an RL01 RSTS level
> 1.2 format disk image (label=GAMES) that you can copy the games from either
> and run them!
>
> The RL01 disk image is easiest (since DECtape support requires some
> fiddling and correct pdp11 unibus 18-bit model selection).
>
> In your SIMH .ini file (assuming you have sysgen'ed some RL type disks)
> you can -
>set rl enable
>set rl0 rl01
>att rl0 rl01-games.dsk
>
> Then once RSTS/E is up as a privileged user just "MOUNT DL0: GAMES" and
> look in DL0:[100,100]
>
> The zip file is https://drive.google.com/file/d/
> 1IgZkafQABxWUXeuEkeq1GjkBe3sF2Zgx/view?usp=sharing
>
> Tony
>
>
>
>
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Re: [Simh] PDP11 on Simh for public access

[Bryan Davies]

That's all handy information.  When I've done it I'll make a DSK file so
others can mount it directly into Simh.

Bryan

On 23 Jan 2018 21:39, "Christian Brunschen" <christ...@brunschen.com> wrote:

> On 23 January 2018 at 21:34, Mark Abene <phi...@phiber.com> wrote:
>
>> I remember Columbia had an ASCII-encoded kermit binary which you could
>> either print/load as paper tape, or copy/paste into an editor.
>>
>
> The correct tense actually seems to be "has":
>
> http://www.columbia.edu/kermit/pdp11.html
>
>> Digital Equipment Corporation's PDP-11 was (and is) a 16-bit mini- or
>> microcomputer used in applications ranging from embedded device control to
>> general-purpose timesharing. Several different Kermit programs are
>> available for the PDP-11.
>>
>> *Kermit-11* is the Kermit software for Digital Equipment Corporation
>> PDP-11 operating systems: RT-11, RSX-11, RSTS/E, IAS, P/OS, and (not a DEC
>> OS) TSX+. Kermit-11 was written by Brian Nelson of the University of
>> Toledo, Ohio, circa 1984-89, in PDP-11 assembly language, Macro-11.
>> Separate programs, listed below, are available for other PDP-11 operating
>> systems like UNIX and MUMPS.
>>
>> The Kermit-11 source code is available at our ftp site
>> <ftp://kermit.columbia.edu/kermit/> in the kermit/b
>> <ftp://kermit.columbia.edu/kermit/b/> subdirectory as k11*.mac, and you
>> can find prebuilt-binaries for various operating systems and configurations
>> inkermit/bin/ <ftp://kermit.columbia.edu/kermit/bin/>, as k11*.tsk or
>> k11*.sav. If you are unfamiliar with FTP, or have problems with it, READ
>> THIS <http://www.columbia.edu/kermit/ftphlp.html>. There are also
>> various utilities -- hex encoders and decoders, etc -- written Macro-11,
>> Fortran, and Basic in the kermit/b directory, along with all the
>> Kermit-11 text files, whose names all start with "k11".
>>
> :)
>
>
>> That's how I loaded KERMIT on my old RSTS/E V7 system.
>>
>
> So that should all be still doable in much the same way now as it was then!
>
>
>> -Mark
>>
>
> // Christian
>
>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 23, 2018 at 12:18 PM, Bryan Davies <bryan.e.dav...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> But I've always wondered - how do you get Kermit onto the target machine?
>>>
>>> On 23 January 2018 at 20:16, Jordi Guillaumes Pons <
>>> j...@jordi.guillaumes.name> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Jordi Guillaumes i Pons
>>>> j...@jordi.guillaumes.name
>>>> HECnet: BITXOW::JGUILLAUMES
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 23 Jan 2018, at 21:13, Paul Koning <paulkon...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> SAV files would be binaries (RT11 format).  BAS are source files.
>>>>
>>>> There are a number of solutions.  Text files you could load via paper
>>>> tape, with the text file attached to the SIMH tape reader.  That's not as
>>>> good an answer for binaries though it could be made to work.
>>>>
>>>> Magtape or disk are better solutions.  Disk works well if you have a
>>>> program that can write disk images in a format the target OS knows.  That's
>>>> easy in this case; you can use my "flx" (RSTS File Exchange) program to do
>>>> this.  There's an older version written in C, a newer one written in Python
>>>> 3.  For the former, look in svn://akdesign.dyndns.org/flx/branches/V2.6,
>>>> for the latter, in svn://akdesign.dyndns.org/flx/trunk.  There's
>>>> documentation for both in those respective directories.  (Commments and bug
>>>> reports, especially for the new version, would be appreciated.)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> There’s always kermit…
>>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
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>
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Re: [Simh] PDP11 on Simh for public access

[Bryan Davies]

Yes I've found a few, but they are mostly .sav or .bas files.

How do I get them into Simh without keying them though?



On 23 January 2018 at 19:18, Paul Koning <paulkon...@comcast.net> wrote:

>
>
> > On Jan 23, 2018, at 1:13 PM, Bryan Davies <bryan.e.dav...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > Ok.  It all boots up nicely on the VT100 and is pretty much
> indistinguishable from the real thing.
> >
> > I'm now looking for something to run on it.  iirc the old RSTS
> distributions came with a games account -  [20,20] or something like that,
> but the V10 distribution doesn't have this.  It only has the [1,2]
> utilities.
> >
> > Can anyone direct me to a source of games or other interesting
> software?  I've found a few, but presumably they need to be in DSK format
> in order for Simh to load them as a disk?  Or is there another way to point
> one of the emulated devices to a file on the host?
>
> You might try the RSTS section of the DECUS library, which should be
> online somewhere.  I'm not sure where.  That will have assorted games as
> well as other stuff.  For example, there's a program package called COSAP
> which is a collection of statistical analysis tools.  That came from my
> alma mater, and was used there particularly in sociology courses for the
> students to do (occasionally meaningful) analysis on various survey
> databases.  It was known for sucking up lots of CPU and disk bandwidth on
> our machine.
>
> paul
>
>
>
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Re: [Simh] PDP11 on Simh for public access

[Bryan Davies]

It works!  Many thanks to all who have assisted.

I installed the changed .ini file and sure enough I now get past the
startup prompts.

Paul - I have kept the modded Init.sys on standby but haven't installed it.

My only comment is that Simh seems to be very heavy on CPU.  The Raspberry
Pi seems to be maxed out when running it - even when the simulated OS isn't
'doing' anything.  But it is nevertheless good enough for display
purposes.  I will be installing it at http://www.computinghistory.org.uk/
tomorrow and the PC / Smartphone generation will be able to see how
computing was in the 'olden days'.


Regards to all,

Bryan.















On 22 January 2018 at 20:01, Paul Koning  wrote:

>
>
> On Jan 22, 2018, at 2:53 PM, Mark Pizzolato  wrote:
>
> The attached pdp11_exp.ini should work, and be simpler to understand.
>
>
> Thanks Mark.
>
> Just to correct a mistake in my earlier note to the list: I mixed up a
> modified version of RSTS V10.1 sources with the original.  I thought that
> the changes for Pro support were in the official one -- the answer yes
> "only in part".  The change to add a timeout on the "start timesharing"
> prompt was one I added as part of Pro support but that didn't make it into
> the official release.
>
> So you're stuck with an "expect" based solution, unless you want to use a
> modified init.sys.  I can supply that to anyone who's interested.
>
> paul
>
>
>
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Re: [Simh] PDP11 on Simh for public access

[Bryan Davies]

Thanks Paul,

unfortunately I'm running RSTS V7 and tbh I'd like to keep it that way
because I want to show the old style CLI rather than DCL.   I did try
depositing the date and time values as suggested and just on the off chance
but it didn't work.

Rgds

Bryan


On 18 January 2018 at 16:05, Paul Koning <paulkon...@comcast.net> wrote:

>
>
> > On Jan 18, 2018, at 10:40 AM, Bryan Davies <bryan.e.dav...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > Many thanks to all for the advice.   Unfortunately I'm still not quite
> there.
>
> There is an easy solution if you have a recent RSTS.
>
> The OS keeps date and time in location 1000-1004.  That is preserved
> across boot, and if on entry to INIT those locations contain what seems
> like a valid date, that's used as the system date/time.  This is why the
> more recent versions of RSTS don't prompt for date/time if you do a restart
> (SHUTUP with restart) or use the BOOT command in INIT.
>
> Second, if you're running V10.1, the "Start timesharing" prompt has a 10
> second timeout, and will default to "yes" (i.e., start RSTS) at that point.
>
> So if you start SIMH with a startup script that deposits the date in 1000,
> and time in 1002, then issues the SIMH boot command, RSTS INIT will pick up
> that date/time and after 10 seconds will go on to start the OS.
>
> RSTS date format: (year-1970)*1000 + day_in_year
> RSTS time format: 1440 - (minutes_since_midnight)
> RSTS seconds: 60 - (seconds_since_minute)
>
> For example:
>
> $ pdp11 pdp11-42.ini
>
> PDP-11 simulator V4.0-0 Betagit commit id: d3b6018d
> sim> d -d 1000 32004
> sim> d -d 1002 720
> sim> d -d 1004 30
> sim> bo rq
> ?
> Thu Jan 18 11:02:00 2018
>
> RSTS P10.1-L V101XM (DU0) INIT V10.1-0L
>
> 04-Jan-02 12:00 PM
>
>
> Start timesharing?  NO
>
> I entered the values in decimal (with -d) for convenience.  You can see
> the correct date and time are picked up by INIT.  Seconds are not displayed
> here but they are saved, so you can set them if you want to be that precise.
>
> paul
>
>
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Re: [Simh] PDP11 on Simh for public access

[Bryan Davies]

Many thanks to all for the advice.   Unfortunately I'm still not quite
there.

I have written an Expect script which runs Simh and sure enough responds to
the startup prompts.  Unfortunately after it completes the terminal isn't
interactive anymore.  Oddly it still echoes characters to the screen but
with no response - either from RSTS or Rasbian.   If I open another
Terminal, PS shows me the pdp11 emulator running as another process but
tty1 is stuck in bash.

I have included a fork and disconnect at the end of the script as suggested
but to no effect.

Expect commands don't seem to work within Simh.  Should they?


On 18 January 2018 at 09:59, Bryan Davies <bryan.e.dav...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I volunteer for a computer museum in Cambridge UK where we would much like
> to extend our mini-computer exhibit.   We want to set up a VT100 running
> RSTS/E for our visitors to use. As the system needs to start unattended I
> need it to boot up RSTS from power up.
>
> I have installed Simh on a Raspberry Pi B and connected the VT100 to the
> serial port ttyAMA0.
>
> While I can login to the Pi on the VT100 and boot the emulator manually,
> RSTS/E has a number of prompts within the boot dialogue (Date, Time etc)
> which need to be answered before it is possible for a User to login.  I
> have tried putting these responses in a Shell script, and while that
> 'works' insofar as the boot process completes, it doesn't return control to
> the terminal after the script ends.
>
> Can anyone advise how to do it?
>
>
>
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[Simh] PDP11 on Simh for public access

[Bryan Davies]

Hi,

I volunteer for a computer museum in Cambridge UK where we would much like
to extend our mini-computer exhibit.   We want to set up a VT100 running
RSTS/E for our visitors to use. As the system needs to start unattended I
need it to boot up RSTS from power up.

I have installed Simh on a Raspberry Pi B and connected the VT100 to the
serial port ttyAMA0.

While I can login to the Pi on the VT100 and boot the emulator manually,
RSTS/E has a number of prompts within the boot dialogue (Date, Time etc)
which need to be answered before it is possible for a User to login.  I
have tried putting these responses in a Shell script, and while that
'works' insofar as the boot process completes, it doesn't return control to
the terminal after the script ends.

Can anyone advise how to do it?
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