Re: [Simh] The missing PDPs

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Tue, Aug 13, 2019 at 06:29:40AM +, Lars Brinkhoff wrote:
> Warren Young wrote:
> > Find some bit of PDP-5 and/or PDP-12 software that you want to make
> > run, then modify the current simulator until it does run.
> 
> What interesting PDP-5 and/or PDP-12 software is there?

For the PDP-12 there is SPACEWAR!

/P
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Re: [Simh] some performance issues

[Pontus Pihlgren]

Hi

I'm having trouble understanding your question. Are 
you comparing CPU-time of a real VAX(which model?) to 
emulated CPU-time on an Itanium machine(which one?).

Emulation will have an associated overhead. If you 
are compareing a fast VAX to an emulation on a slow 
Itanium... well, Itanium is hard to optimize for.

/P

On Tue, Mar 05, 2019 at 03:13:53PM +0100, gérard Calliet wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> Again I have some performance issues with simh.
> 
> I built it  on OpenVMS Itanium. It runs on a process with enought
> memory, it takes 1 of the 8 CPU Itanium with 100%, no page faults,
> and 100 BIO by second.
> 
> On the emulated VAX we are running processes CPU intensive (old Ada
> compiler), they take 100% of the CPU, also very few page fault, very
> few IO.
> 
> And the CPU time is about 2 or 3 times the CPU time on the hardware,
> and so elapsed time 3 or 4 times. (For my understanding, it is
> difficult to think the same stream of instructions can use different
> CPU times between hardware and SIMH).
> 
> Where can I do something to improve performance? Are there
> parameters (or constant in compilation) in SIMH which could help?
> And the specific context is processes doing almost only CPU
> computing.
> 
> 
>  my configuration, and what commit I use
> on error continue
> load -r ka655x.bin
> attach NVR ka655.nvr
> set cpu 512m
> set cpu conhalt
> set RL disable
> set LPT disable
> set TQ disable
> set -L rq0 rauser=1800
> attach rq0 datauser2.dsk
> set xq mac=08-00-2B-3C-96-75
> attach xq eth0
> dep bdr 0
> b cpu
> 
> 
> $ run vax-i64
> MicroVAX 3900 simulator V4.0-0 Beta    git commit id: 8810571d
> sim>
> 
> 
> >>
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Gérard Calliet
> 
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Re: [Simh] Historical gaming devices

[Pontus Pihlgren]

Hi

It has been discussed before, but the PDP-12 had one or two ports of 
Spacewar as well. While there is no support for the PDP-12 in simh, I 
think similar A/D equipment was available for the PDP-8 to attach 
controllers.

Perhaps something to look into?

Regards,
Pontus.

On Mon, Jan 14, 2019 at 09:05:59AM +, Lars Brinkhoff wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I'm adding simulations of some historical gaming devices to SIMH:
> 
> - PDP-6/10 Spacewar consoles.  Five switches, times four players.
> - PDP-6/10 A/D converter.  Not really gaming, but used for games.
> - PDP-11 Dazzle Dart boxes.  Eight switches, times four players.
> - PDP-11 Galaxy Game?  I haven't looked at this yet.
> 
> The SDL2 library used by sim_video provides inputs from USB joysticks
> and game controllers.
> 
> If anyone knows about any other similar devices, I'd like to take those
> into consideration.
> 
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[Simh] Reading PDP-15 and PDP-9 tapes

[Pontus Pihlgren]

Hi

I have a stack of PDP-15 tapes and my friend has a stack of PDP-9 tapes. 
My friend also has a PDP-8/a with TD8E and working DECtape drive. We 
would like to use OS/8 to make images of these tapes.

So first I wanted to do it with SIMH in order to get the details right 
when I start reading actual physical tapes.

Using an OS/8 image by David Gesswein: 
https://www.pdp8online.com/ftp/images/os8/diag-games-kermit.rk05

And a PDP-15 DECtape image from the DOS-15 software kit:
http://simh.trailing-edge.com/kits/dos15.zip

I tried my best to get an image from the emulated TD8E to the emulated 
RK-drive. My simh setup is as follows:

set dt disable
set td enable
at rk diag-games-kermit.rk05
at dt -f update1.dta
boot rk

Then I use PIP10:

.R PIP10
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Re: [Simh] UniBone - access DEC PDP-11 UNIBUS under Linux.

[Pontus Pihlgren]

Looks very promising! You mention it could become a QBUS product in the 
future. Would you have to change buss drivers for that?

Could it also become an Omnibus tool?

Regards,
Pontus.

On Mon, Nov 12, 2018 at 02:32:09PM +0100, Jörg Hoppe wrote:
> Guys,
> 
> I'm about to finish another project:
> "UniBone" - a Linux-to-UNIBUS bridge, based on the BeagleBone Black.
> 
> It is supposed to be a development platform for device emulation.
> At the moment it can emulate memory, emulate an RL11 controller with
> 4 RL drives attached, and act as UNIBUS hardware test adapter.
> 
> Well, physical hardware is not exactly what SimH is about.
> But there were plans to run a modified SimH on UniBone to interact
> with physical
> UNIBUS devices ... so you should know early.
> 
> There are some web pages at http://retrocmp.com/projects/unibone
> And I'll show it on VCFE.CH in Zurich on Nov 24/25,  plugged into a
> PDP-11/05.
> 
> best,
> 
> Joerg
> 
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Re: [Simh] Idea for a Simh guide

[Pontus Pihlgren]

I would be a happy reader! Making simh even more approachable cannot be 
a bad thing.

/P

On Mon, May 08, 2017 at 09:04:36PM -0400, Ray Jewhurst wrote:
> With all of the questions I have asked lately, I have had an idea. First a
> little bit of background. I am 45 years old and have really only had
> exposure to PCs and Macs. Although I briefly ran backups on an IBM
> mainframe and a HP HP/UX machine of some kind, I really didn't learn much
> since I simply followed a script. Then about 10 years ago I discovered
> Simh. I have always been intrigued by minis but I knew nothing about them.
> I did stuff like booted RT- 11 and running Unix but I just flirted with it
> on and off. Then about a year ago I got really interested and for a short
> time I contributed to the "show dev" descriptions but I hate C so I decided
> to immerse myself into various configurations of systems and whatnot. Now I
> am totally infatuated almost obsessed with the PDP- 11 and the VAX although
> I have only seen photos of these systems.
> 
> I want to share my love of these oldies but goodies to a new generation of
> computer aficionados. That is where I hope you all come in. I would like to
> make a guide and maybe a blog introducing people to the various machines
> simulated. I would like to make easy to understand instructions in plain
> English-speaking and advice on how to use the available resources online
> especially Bitsavers. One of my favorite bands say, "Energy is contagious,
> enthusiasm spreads."-Rush, Chain Lightning. That is what I hope to do. What
> do you guys think? Would any of you be willing to contribute? The approach
> I would like to take is as I learn my readers learn.
> 
> Thanks
> Ray

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[Simh] OT: SB11 [WAS: Re: EXT :Re: VT240, VT340 and DS200/300 HW specs info]

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Tue, Apr 11, 2017 at 11:08:19AM -0400, Paul Koning wrote:
> 
> SB-11 size) and the connectors (from some 8 pin connector I don't 

Does anyone have an SB11? I believe the box was called BA-11VA. I know 
of two collectors that has one so they are not exceedingly rare.

What was their target market?

Thank you,
Pontus.
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Re: [Simh] DECserver (terminal server) emulation - MAME

[Pontus Pihlgren]

Hi

I'd be interrested in this to.

It is quite a coincidence that this is brought up just now. I hade the 
idea this friday that I should try to emulate the vt220, seems I don't 
have to now.

Thank you,
Pontus.

On Sat, Apr 08, 2017 at 11:52:17PM +, Sancho Villa, Roberto wrote:
> Hi Folks
> 
> I have MAME 0.177 running VT240 emulation fine.
> I connected it to SimH as "retroterminal". Works very good, and looks very 
> pretty as I set up the config to simulate a CRT.
> 
> Don't know if versions after this still working.
> 
> I can send the config files to anyone interested.
> 
> Best regards
> Roberto
> 
> 
> Date: Sat, 08 Apr 2017 16:48:44 -0400
> From: "Tim Stark" 
> To: 
> Subject: [Simh] DEC VT emulators on MAME
> Message-ID: <000c01d2b0a9$835edec0$8a1c9c40$@verizon.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> Folks,
> 
> 
> 
> I have a copy of MAME emulator and learned that someone is working on new DEC 
> VT emulators for MAME.
> 
> 
> 
> He is implementing some VT series like VT100 through VT520 but they are 
> marked as not working.
> 
> 
> 
> Does anyone know about VT emulators on MAME?
> 
> 
> 
> In that past (at college), I used some VT terminals - VT100, VT102, VT125, 
> VT220, VT240, VK100, and Tek 4207.
> 
> 
> 
> I wrote some programs to draw graphics on VT125, VT240, VK100 and Tek 4207 
> for homework assignments at my computer graphics class.
> 
> 
> 
> Some VT 100/200 series uses 8080 processor.  VT 240 uses T11 processor.
> 
> I found some tech docs but I am still looking for VT330/VT340 tech docs.
> 
> 
> 
> Tim
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Este correo electrónico y, en su caso, cualquier fichero anexo al mismo, 
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Re: [Simh] VAX 8200

[Pontus Pihlgren]

Anders generously donated this machine to me. I think it currently has 
three CPUs.

It sounds like there are a few running 8350 machines out there. But if 
the simh works requires another one I could bump it up the TODO-list.

/P

On Thu, Mar 16, 2017 at 09:57:12PM +0100, Anders Magnusson wrote:
> I can note here that we ran a 4-CPU 8350 (8354? :-)  with Ultrix. Worked
> very well!
> 
> This was also the machine which I used when writing the NetBSD vax SMP
> support.
> 
> -- Ragge
> 
> Den 2017-03-16 kl. 21:17, skrev Dan Gahlinger:
> >the vax smp emulator seems to support that theory.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >Dan
> >
> >
> > Original message 
> >From: Robert Armstrong 
> >Date: 2017-03-16 4:07 PM (GMT-05:00)
> >To: 'Ethan Dicks' , simh@trailing-edge.com
> >Subject: Re: [Simh] VAX 8200
> >
> >> Ethan Dicks (ethan.di...@gmail.com) wrote:
> >>I happen to have one (from when I worked for Jim Ebright).
> >
> >  I have a running 8350 as well, should you need a dump of the console
> >media or something.
> >
> >  It is, I believe, the physically smallest BI bus VAX, and therefore
> >interesting for those reason.  It's the only such machine that I could fit
> >in my garage :-)
> >
> >  It's also the only multi-processor VAX system that I have and equally
> >interesting for that reason too.  FWIW, I've always wondered if the
> >limitation to two CPUs was purely for testing and support reasons - it
> >doesn't seem that there's any reason why you could not plug in three or
> >even more CPU cards.
> >
> >Bob Armstrong
> >
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> >
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Re: [Simh] Sounds

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Mon, Feb 20, 2017 at 09:34:37PM +0100, Johnny Billquist wrote:
> 
> Yes, it would. There are others who can show you around at other times. 

I'm more than happy to give tours of Updates computers. Just give me a 
heads up a few days a priori.

/P
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Re: [Simh] Simulator accuracy (was Re: New TC11)

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Tue, Dec 06, 2016 at 08:29:44PM -0500, Bob Supnik wrote:
> Simulators should never fix "bugs". The question at issue is how deeply to
> mimic them, in order to assure maximum compatibility with software.

My point exactly :) (Note that my question was directed at Paul).

> 
> Over the years, I've concluded that straying too far from the hardware is
> dangerous. I'm not suggesting that every register-transfer-level interaction
> has to be there. It's okay to write
> 
> IR = M[PC];
> 
> instead of
> 
> MA = PC;
> ReadM ();
> IR = MB;

Well, if you want to simulate a front panel you might want to. (I've 
written a fairly competent PDP-8 emulator as an excersize and am 
considering doing a software front panel showing MA, MB among the other 
registers)

> But software often depends on "bugs". The routines that identify the models
> of a PDP8 and a PDP11 are very dependent on 'bugs' (or incompatibilities, if
> you prefer) between models. (And some of those incompatibilities are indeed
> bugs, like the ASH/ASHC problem in the J11.) The IBM 709X's double precision
> floating point divide is clearly rather inaccurate, but the simulator has to
> reproduce the hardware algorithm bit for bit, rather than perform a modern
> divide.
> 
> Fixing, of if you prefer, improving, the way the hardware actually worked is
> hazardous. In the original H316/H516 teletype code, I included lots of
> rational checks to prevent switching the half-duplex interface between input
> and output in "wrong" places. The actual logic had none of those checks, and
> the checks broke the Teletype code in the IMP simulator.
> 

Not premature optimization but premature error checking :-)

Regards,
Pontus.
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Re: [Simh] Simulator accuracy (was Re: New TC11)

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Tue, Dec 06, 2016 at 01:14:47PM -0500, Bob Supnik wrote:
> >Are you suggesting that simulators should fix "bugs" for someone using a
> >simulator for comparison when restoring real hardware it could be very
> >confusing.

I wonder if I made that sentence more confusing that necessary. I meant 
to write:

Are you suggesting that simulators should fix "bugs"?

For someone using a simulator for comparison when restoring real 
hardware it could be very confusing.

/P
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Re: [Simh] on Android [Was: (no subject)]

[Pontus Pihlgren]

It's a good start :)

On Mon, Sep 12, 2016 at 10:55:07AM -0400, Henry Bent wrote:
> I did a proof of concept build a while back using the Android NDK. It
> required manually compiling libpcap for networking support but as I recall
> it was fully functional. I was able to bring up 4.2BSD on a vax780 but disk
> access was painfully slow. I was running as root so I have no idea how well
> it would run on a non-rooted phone. So it's certainly possible but there
> are bugs to be worked out.
> 
> -Henry
> 
> On Sep 10, 2016 6:33 AM, "Pontus Pihlgren" <pon...@update.uu.se> wrote:
> 
> > On Fri, Sep 09, 2016 at 09:19:15AM -0700, Mark Pizzolato wrote:
> > >
> > > A few years back, I added Android build support to the simh
> > > makefile in the github master branch.  I haven't tried building for
> > > Android since shortly after that time.  I'd appreciate any feedback
> > > from anyone who tries now.
> > >
> >
> > I do Android develpoment for a living. Not so much apps and guis but things
> > behind the scenes.
> >
> > I considered doing a (free) simh port as an exercise. If there is
> > significant interrest it might spur me to actually do it.
> >
> > /P
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[Simh] on Android [Was: (no subject)]

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Fri, Sep 09, 2016 at 09:19:15AM -0700, Mark Pizzolato wrote:
> 
> A few years back, I added Android build support to the simh 
> makefile in the github master branch.  I haven't tried building for
> Android since shortly after that time.  I'd appreciate any feedback
> from anyone who tries now.
> 

I do Android develpoment for a living. Not so much apps and guis but things 
behind the scenes.

I considered doing a (free) simh port as an exercise. If there is 
significant interrest it might spur me to actually do it.

/P
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Re: [Simh] TU-56

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Fri, Mar 25, 2016 at 08:57:58AM -0700, Mark Pizzolato wrote:
> 
> That said, the TC11/TU56 has been added to the VAX Unibus simulators
> and confirmed that it works using the Andy Goldstein supplied driver.
> 

That is pretty neat! Knowing that it works makes me want to scrounge up 
the hardware to use a VAX for archiving DECtapes.

:)

/P
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Re: [Simh] PDP-15/76

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Tue, Mar 15, 2016 at 06:31:35PM +0100, Mattis Lind wrote:
> 
> The documentation was the only thing that remained from the PDP-15
> installation at Standard Radio & Telefon (part of the ITT company) that was
> used for development of the ATC (Automatic Train Control) system.

An I have DECtapes from this system. I recall at least one being labled 
DOS. Could the content of these tapes be of help?

In that case I should make another effort to dump these tapes (I have 
dumped a few).

/P

> 
> /Mattis
> 
> 2016-03-15 17:46 GMT+01:00 Bob Supnik :
> 
> > I've pulled together the hardware pieces for the PDP-15/76 (PDP-15 with
> > UC15 PDP-11 IO processor), so now it's time to consider what software can
> > be run.
> >
> > The most likely candidate is XVM/DOS-15. While vanilla DOS-15 had UC15
> > support at some point, neither a complete source kit nor the appropriate
> > restore DECtape images seem to be available. The XVM/DOS-15 kit has all
> > required DECtapes, but it lacks the paper-tape elements. Fortunately, these
> > exist in source form in the XVM/DOS-15 source kit.
> >
> > ABSL11 - a PDP-15 read-in mode tape that allows PDP-11 absolute binary
> > tapes to be read into shared memory and moved to private memory. (This is
> > not strictly necessary, because the PDP-11 side has its "hardware" binary
> > loader via the LOAD command.) This is used to load PIREX. It must be
> > assembled on the PDP-15.
> >
> > PIREX - a PDP-11 absolute mode tape that runs the PDP-11 IO executive. It
> > has to be assembled on an -11, so the source must be loaded into an RT11
> > system, assembled, and punched out as a binary paper tape image. It's
> > possible that the macro11 cross assembler could be used instead.
> >
> > DOSSAV - a PDP-15 binary tape that restores a distribution kit (usually
> > two DECtapes) to RF, RP, or RK disk. It must be assembled on the PDP-15. It
> > uses PIREX.
> >
> > RKBOOT - a PDP-15 read-in mode tape that uses PIREX to boot a PDP-15
> > operating system off the RK15 (an 18b RK11). It must be assembled on the
> > PDP-15. It uses PIREX.
> >
> > /Bob
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Re: [Simh] Sounds

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Wed, Feb 10, 2016 at 11:26:44PM +0100, Johnny Billquist wrote:
> Google for walking disks... It's a known phenomena, or at least it used to
> be...
> 
> By the way - just to make another silly comment... The RK07 is a small disk
> (it's basically just an overgrown RL02). Come back when you've played with
> an RP06 for a while... Then we can talk of walking...

I encourage anyone in this hobby to read the stories arround Fastrand. 
Not sure how much is true or exaggerations, but it's a fun read.


> Or the spinning up of an RM03. Sounds like it is going into warp overdrive,
> and will open a hole into another dimension as it is spinning up...

Let's do the time warp again :-)

/P
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Re: [Simh] SIMH and physical hardware

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Tue, Feb 09, 2016 at 09:41:03PM -0800, Zachary Kline wrote:
> 
> Any thoughts? Apologies for the disjointed post, it’s rather late. ;)

To some it is very important. I have a gadget that replaces the floppy 
drive for my Commodore 64. It has an audio jack that plays the sound of 
a real floppy drive! I don't use it, but it shows the effort put in to 
get the right "feeling".

It also emulates the original loading speed if you want :-)

Anyway, I think the best thing you can do is go to see a real machine, 
perhaps at the LCM. It aught to give you a sense of the size, noise and 
smell of old gear.

Keeping a hand on a big old disk when it spins up is a rather nice thing 
:)

/P
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Re: [Simh] Happy Dec-10

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Thu, Dec 10, 2015 at 02:56:56PM +, Johnny Eriksson wrote:
> ... I had hopes to be able to announce something today, but the thing
> is not yet fully functional.  Watch this space.

Exciting! I hope it runs on KS10 :D

/P
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Re: [Simh] Pontus asks Is [the] BSD [license] liberal enough?

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Mon, Jun 08, 2015 at 08:02:09AM -0700, Mark Pizzolato - Info Comm wrote:
 
 That said, the code involved isn't in any way derived from a simh simulator 
 so 
 there is nothing just waiting to be 'folded in' to the simh project.  Some 
 pieces of might be useful for someone implementing a new simh simulator, but 
 these are just relatively small parts of what would be required to get a 
 whole 
 system working.  As Bob originally mentioned, detailed documentation on the 
 system and useful software to run on it would be needed before undertaking 
 such 
 an effort.


I realise the CPU or device emulation might not be fitting for simh. But the 
graphics code might be of some use?

/P
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Re: [Simh] Pontus asks Is [the] BSD [license] liberal enough?

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Sun, Jun 07, 2015 at 08:45:14PM -0400, Clem Cole wrote:
 ​I fear you might be missunderstanding/confusing the usage rights and the
 ownership rights.​

Perhaps, yes.
 
 On Sun, Jun 7, 2015 at 4:00 AM, Pontus Pihlgren pon...@update.uu.se wrote:
 
  If A gives B a software product under GPL then A must provide
  source code to B upon request. B has no obligations to anyone,
  not even if B modifies the code.
 
 ​Sadly - that is not correct.  If B modifes the code, then B is also
 obligated to make it available - period.  That's the virus and what make
 its powerful as well as difficult.

No, it is in fact correct:

http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#GPLRequireSourcePostedPublic

 ​I wonder if you are getting stuck on the upon request part.​  If B
 modifies the code, the truth is anyone can ask B for the sources to the
 dervitive work.

No, not anyone, just the program's users. See the above link.

 BTW: forcing B to make her/his sources available without any charge is
 exactly the behavior RMS intended with the license.

Indeed, but not to anyone asking.

 I'm not sure it protects the user in any way other than tries to guarrentee
 that a user of an invention/work, can get the sources for it if they want
 it and B still exists to ask.   Which (if you believe in a completely
 shared commons) is a fine thing.

Yes, this is my favourite part of the GPL licenses. I have the drawings 
to my house for a good reason, why not the source for software I use.

 You need to go back the Symbolics vs. Lisp Machines, Inc wars to truly
 understand the whys and hows of the GPL virus.

It's an interesting history, I'm familiar with it. Although I object to 
the term virus in this context :)

/P
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Re: [Simh] Pontus asks Is [the] BSD [license] liberal enough?

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Mon, Jun 08, 2015 at 03:31:42PM +0200, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:
 
 A little contrived, I know, but I still maintain that C has no claim 
 towards A.

I stand corrected:

http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#WhatDoesWrittenOfferValid

Sorry guys :) Educational for me at least.

/P
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Re: [Simh] Pontus asks Is [the] BSD [license] liberal enough?

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Mon, Jun 08, 2015 at 03:21:51PM +0200, Johnny Billquist wrote:
 
 Uh... You cannot choose who to distribute it to. That is the whole
 point of GPL, and is what puts it apart from just any company
 copyright control.

Certainly I can :) at least in the first step.

 If you make it available to anyway, who have to make it available to
 everyone.

Not sure I understand.

/P
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Re: [Simh] Pontus asks Is [the] BSD [license] liberal enough?

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Mon, Jun 08, 2015 at 03:18:50PM +0200, Johnny Billquist wrote:
 On 2015-06-08 13:36, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:
 On Mon, Jun 08, 2015 at 01:24:39PM +0200, Johnny Billquist wrote:
 
 Which is essentially anyone. Since, if you do release it, you cannot
 restrict who can use it.
 
 The point I'm trying to make is that B has no obligation to anyone but
 C. If C starts to make the software available no-one can demand the
 source from B. And certainly not from A.
 
 Not entirely correct. First of all, C can ask the sources from B,
 who then in turn will be required to request the sources from A. So
 C indirectly puts a request through to A anyway.

Of course.

 However, if C have the software from B, but wants the sources from
 A, C just gets the distribution from A, and then they can request
 the sources explicitly from A anyway. There is no way for A to
 prevent this.
 So yes, C can easily, and legally, force A to send the sources to them.

Nope, this is my example, and in my example there is no distribution 
in the usual sense. Just that USB stick that A sent to B. If B made a 
copy and sent to C, how would C obtain a distribution from A?

A little contrived, I know, but I still maintain that C has no claim 
towards A.

/P
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Re: [Simh] Pontus asks Is [the] BSD [license] liberal enough?

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Mon, Jun 08, 2015 at 01:24:39PM +0200, Johnny Billquist wrote:
 
 Which is essentially anyone. Since, if you do release it, you cannot
 restrict who can use it.

The point I'm trying to make is that B has no obligation to anyone but 
C. If C starts to make the software available no-one can demand the 
source from B. And certainly not from A.

/P
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Re: [Simh] Pontus asks Is [the] BSD [license] liberal enough?

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Mon, Jun 08, 2015 at 03:24:32PM +0200, Andreas Davour wrote:
 
 How about we pend this discussion until we know if the code in
 question will be relicenced to Bob's satisfaction?

If the list owner tells me to take it off list I will.

/P
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Re: [Simh] Pontus asks Is [the] BSD [license] liberal enough?

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Mon, Jun 08, 2015 at 11:52:48AM -0400, Clem Cole wrote:
 I appologies to the list for turning this into a religious war, I did not
 intend that ​.

Oh this was hardly a war :) Hardly even a squabble. And there is really nothing 
religious about my views. I think we stand closer than you might think.

  I should have known better, but I had hoped to avoid it by trying to be fair 
 and factual​ .  I had hoped to enducate a few people on why the GPL might 
 night 
 be desired ​ by many projects.​

I consider myself educated, and thats of course a good thing.

 ​To Pontus, I'm not going to debate you.  You asked a question, and I tried
 to answer it fairly. 

You don't have to of course :) And your arguments were fair, I was just a bit 
thick.

 The fact is the lawyers are the ones that term the GPL a viral license.

Fair enough, to bad they chose a word with bad connotations.

/P
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Re: [Simh] Pontus asks Is [the] BSD [license] liberal enough?

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Sat, Jun 06, 2015 at 08:08:29PM -0400, Clem Cole wrote:

 ​Without getting into the good/bad politics of the different 
 license its pretty simple.

I'd also like to avoid a good/bad discussion. I too use both.

 The GPL is a virus which says that if you use the 
 technology, a ny derivitive work ​ is not yours exclusively, ​ 
 you must be willing to give the sources to not only the 
 original but your work anyone that asks for it.  This means 
 that if you use the technology you have to provide a way for 
 people to get your source code.

I believe there is a missconception here, perhaps on my part. 
But the license is a issued by one party to one other.

Lets call the issuer A and the other B.

If A gives B a software product under GPL then A must provide 
source code to B upon request. B has no obligations to anyone,
not even if B modifies the code.

A third party, lets call them C, has no rights to the product or 
source, it's just when B gives the product to C that the 
restrictions apply. And even then B has no obligations to A. Any 
modifications made by B is only available to C upon request.

GPL is a license to protect the user.

/P
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Re: [Simh] Pontus asks Is [the] BSD [license] liberal enough?

[Pontus Pihlgren]

To clarify, this applies to GPLv2. I don't know a lot about GPLv3

/P

On Sun, Jun 07, 2015 at 10:00:47AM +0200, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:
 On Sat, Jun 06, 2015 at 08:08:29PM -0400, Clem Cole wrote:
 
  ​Without getting into the good/bad politics of the different 
  license its pretty simple.
 
 I'd also like to avoid a good/bad discussion. I too use both.
 
  The GPL is a virus which says that if you use the 
  technology, a ny derivitive work ​ is not yours exclusively, ​ 
  you must be willing to give the sources to not only the 
  original but your work anyone that asks for it.  This means 
  that if you use the technology you have to provide a way for 
  people to get your source code.
 
 I believe there is a missconception here, perhaps on my part. 
 But the license is a issued by one party to one other.
 
 Lets call the issuer A and the other B.
 
 If A gives B a software product under GPL then A must provide 
 source code to B upon request. B has no obligations to anyone,
 not even if B modifies the code.
 
 A third party, lets call them C, has no rights to the product or 
 source, it's just when B gives the product to C that the 
 restrictions apply. And even then B has no obligations to A. Any 
 modifications made by B is only available to C upon request.
 
 GPL is a license to protect the user.
 
 /P
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Re: [Simh] PDP-12

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Sat, Jun 06, 2015 at 07:27:51PM +0200, dott.Piergiorgio d' Errico wrote:
 Il 06/06/2015 18:10, Tom Morris ha scritto:
 On Sat, Jun 6, 2015 at 6:41 AM, Bob Supnik b...@supnik.org wrote:
 Thanks for the simulator pointer, but no, I can't use it.
 
 SimH is licensed under an MIT/X11/do-anything-you-damned-well-want Open
 Source license. Andreas' is using GPL v2, which is viral and contaminating.
 I don't want SimH entangled with GPL v2 or v3 components. The lesser or
 library GPL v2 license is fine.
 
 It looks to me like the author switched from GPL v2 to MIT back in 2010.
 
 https://github.com/andysan/greenpea/commit/43ca86e351859d9187b5b0fe97698923c4641b57
 
 someone can clarify the contraddiction between what mr. Philgren and
 Mr. Morris re. greenpea PDP-12 emulator license ?
 

I haven't made a statement either way. I've mailed Andreas regarding license.

/P
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[Simh] Stacken DEC2020 [Was: Re: EXT :Re: PDP-10 simulation: DEUNA support help needed]

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 10:32:11PM +0200, Johnny Billquist wrote:
 
 Anyway, I thought that Stackens machines had met a sadder fate, so I
 guess it is good news if Peter have them.

I think most survived in one way or another. Peter at least had this in 
storage at some point:
http://www.stupi.se/Bilder/pdp-10/

Although, this on twitter made me wonder:
https://twitter.com/brouhaha/status/533019143465734145

I queried Peter about it, but go no reply. I suppose I might not be on 
speaking terms with him either :D It would be onesided though, I have 
nothing against him.
 
 Nice to hear they had it up and running. I was (somewhat) involved
 when the other KSes moved out.

I think you are talking about the same machine(s). We helped move out 
Helena (the 11/70) and Venus (my KS10) when stacken needed space. Nadja 
(a KS10) was left behind and was brought up some time later on. It was 
used, among other things, to retrieve a source copy of Stugan from 
some disk pack.

Also, the other Johnny(hi Bygg) together with Haba has Aurora, a KS10 
which may or may not be complete.

 Hmm. I hope it's ok for now. But if things turn critical, let me
 know. I think I can round up some people to rescue things, if
 needed.

A KS10 would be an easy decision. My place is full, but I can think of 
several other places. Although Nadja came with a boatload of peripherals 
so it's quite a big system.

Hopefully my post cleard up some confusion rather than creating it :)

Regards,
Pontus.
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[Simh] Physical PDP-11/70 front panel interface

[Pontus Pihlgren]

Hi 

I have a physical front panel from a PDP-11/70 (sadly the machine is 
long gone).

But I've begun building an interface to control it from my PC. Much like 
Henk[1], Jörg[2] and John[3] has done before.

Henk says he has a patched version of SIMH, before I contact him. Is 
there any such code in the SIMH repositories?

Regards,
Pontus.

[1] http://www.pdp-11.nl/homebrew/cons1170/cons70startpage.html
[2] http://retrocmp.com/projects/pdp-1170-panel
[3] http://www.saccade.com/writing/projects/PDP11/PDP-11.html
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Re: [Simh] Physical PDP-11/70 front panel interface

[Pontus Pihlgren]

Hi Ed

On Tue, Dec 16, 2014 at 02:40:50PM +0100, E. Groenenberg wrote:

 Let me know if you want these modified files (based on github simh 4.0.0
 from around 1 Nov 2014)

Please do, it would be very helpful, then I don't have to start from scratch. 

I looked at the youtube clip: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qfLkMfLMZVE
And it looks very good.

Regards,
Pontus
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[Simh] Physical disk access

[Pontus Pihlgren]

Hi

Is it possible for SIMH to use a SCSI disk directly under linux? such as 
/dev/sg1 ?

What I want to accomplish is to install RT-11 under SIMH and then 
transfer that installation to a physical PDP-11/73 with a 
SCSI-controller.

Does anyone have any experience doing this?

/Pontus
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Re: [Simh] Physical disk access

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Mon, Sep 29, 2014 at 02:33:41AM -0700, Mark Pizzolato - Info Comm wrote:
 On Monday, September 29, 2014 at 2:28 AM, Pontus Pihlgren wrote:
  Is it possible for SIMH to use a SCSI disk directly under linux? such as
  /dev/sg1 ?
  
  What I want to accomplish is to install RT-11 under SIMH and then transfer
  that installation to a physical PDP-11/73 with a SCSI-controller.
  
  Does anyone have any experience doing this?
 
 The latest codebase at https://github.com/simh/simh/archive/master.zip has 
 support for RAW disk device access on Linux.

Thanks! It will be worth a shot. Does the documentation cover how to do it?

/P
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Re: [Simh] rasberry pi

[Pontus Pihlgren]

Will do :) 

Don't hold your breat though. I'm on the waiting list for the PI and I'm 
moving house.

/P

On Wed, Mar 07, 2012 at 08:57:27AM -, Rob Jarratt wrote:
 Hadn't thought of that. My aim is to run my VAX DECnet area router full time
 on it so was going to just concentrate on that. Do share the code for the
 GPIO pins if you do this.
 
 Regards
 
 Rob
 
  -Original Message-
  From: Pontus Pihlgren [mailto:pon...@update.uu.se]
  Sent: 07 March 2012 07:31
  To: r.jarr...@computer.org
  Cc: villy.mad...@shaw.ca; simh@trailing-edge.com
  Subject: Re: [Simh] rasberry pi
  
  Me too, I also hope to get the GPIO pins hooked up to some blinkenlights.
  
  /P
  
  On Wed, Mar 07, 2012 at 07:12:55AM -, Rob Jarratt wrote:
   That is my plan. As soon as my Raspberry Pi arrives I want to build
   SIMH for it. Not sure what problems I might encounter. My Raspberry Pi
   is on order, but I can't tell if Farnell are using English or American
   dates, so it will arrive either in April or June :-(
  
   Regards
  
   Rob
  
-Original Message-
From: simh-boun...@trailing-edge.com [mailto:simh-bounces@trailing-
edge.com] On Behalf Of Villy Madsen
Sent: 07 March 2012 02:21
To: simh@trailing-edge.com
Subject: [Simh] rasberry pi
   
Anyone given any thoughts to migrating Sim-H to the raspberry pi 
   
Villy Madsen
www.members.shaw.ca/villy.madsen
   
   
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Re: [Simh] rasberry pi

[Pontus Pihlgren]

Me too, I also hope to get the GPIO pins hooked up to some 
blinkenlights.

/P

On Wed, Mar 07, 2012 at 07:12:55AM -, Rob Jarratt wrote:
 That is my plan. As soon as my Raspberry Pi arrives I want to build SIMH for
 it. Not sure what problems I might encounter. My Raspberry Pi is on order,
 but I can't tell if Farnell are using English or American dates, so it will
 arrive either in April or June :-(
 
 Regards
 
 Rob
 
  -Original Message-
  From: simh-boun...@trailing-edge.com [mailto:simh-bounces@trailing-
  edge.com] On Behalf Of Villy Madsen
  Sent: 07 March 2012 02:21
  To: simh@trailing-edge.com
  Subject: [Simh] rasberry pi
  
  Anyone given any thoughts to migrating Sim-H to the raspberry pi 
  
  Villy Madsen
  www.members.shaw.ca/villy.madsen
  
  
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[Simh] PDP-15 DECtapes

[Pontus Pihlgren]

Hi Bob  

I have been in contact with a swedish company that used a PDP-15 in 
development in the seventies. The machine itself is long gone. But they 
happen to have a box of DECtapes still. One tape is labled DOS and
another DOS dump. 

Could this be of interest? I have a broken TU56 and we have semi-working
TU55 (I think) at the computer club. But I doubt we could set something 
up easily to read these tapes. Perhaps we could get help from a friend  
in sthlm that has a working PDP-8/e with tape drives. I'm not sure the  
system is compatible with PDP-15 tapes though.  

Here is a picture of their machine: 

http://www.teknogram.se/album/19xx/1970-srt/1977/1977c-pdp-15h.jpg  

Kind Regards,   
Pontus.
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Re: [Simh] Hardware Requirements

[Pontus Pihlgren]

On Tue, Dec 07, 2010 at 09:21:43AM -0500, Ken Cornetet wrote:
 Keep in mind that the printer port on regular old PCs can be used for a few 
 lines of general input and output. I used to do this on a regular basis back 
 in the DOS days. Looks easy under linux too: 
 http://www.faqs.org/docs/Linux-mini/IO-Port-Programming.html

It's a solution I'm considering, but I have a concern. Besides the 
PDP-15 panel I also have a PDP-12 panel. The PDP-12 panel has arround 
120 lights. So while I think it will be possible to control them by 
cascading shift registers, I'm worried it will be to slow.

Having more I/O pins and narrower shift registers would speed things up.

I would love to be proven wrong here, in which case I can dig out a 
Pentium III with parallel port and start experimenting.

 - Pontus.
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