Re: [SLUG] Call for volunteers for June Slug distribution roundtable
On Wed, Jun 15, 2005 at 08:36:43PM +1000, Lindsay Holmwood wrote: At the June Slug meeting we're going to have a distribution roundtable! We need a representative for distributions to give a breif summary of how their distribution handles package management. Once we're done with the summaries the audience can field questions to the representatives. Right now we have a speakers for Gentoo, Arch Linux, and Rubyx. A distribution/package management system can't be represented twice, so you'll need to get in early if you want to talk about yours! I'll talk about CentOS, it should be a short talk if it comes after the RedHat talk. But who is giving the RedHat talk? - Tel -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] is a floppy inserted ?
On Thu, Jun 16, 2005 at 03:04:13 +1000, Mike MacCana wrote: You all suck. Hah! Probably. Trouble with 'file' is that it 'succeeds' either way. With mdir you can if mdir /dev/null 21 then echo floppy in else echo floppy out or drive broken fi Matt -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] CMS for Debian sarge
Dear Slugger is there any CMS that is shipped within 14 Debian Sarge CD :) since i could find one many thanks -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Linux Printing
Hai folks I asked about a month ago about what would be a good mono laser printer, for a small office setup. Some of the information was very useful, and I thank everyone. So what did I end up buying, well after running the slide rule over everything I ended up getting a Kyocera FS-820, the main reasons being very low TCO compared to all the printers I looked into. The two main factors were the up front price of only $320ex, and that I don't have to change the drum for 100,000 pages (you just buy another printer). It works fine with Linux (don't use it with Mandrake 10.1 there is a PCL/lp0 bug in the kernel easily fixed by updating to a kernel 2.6.10 or later). I have no commercial relationship to Kyocera so this is all a personal decision. Regards Richard Neal Childlessness is hereditary, if your parents don't have children neither will you. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] CMS for Debian sarge
yosep kasim wrote: Dear Slugger is there any CMS that is shipped within 14 Debian Sarge CD :) since i could find one many thanks How did you look ? $ apt-cache search cms Turns out 25 results, then buy looking up each package individually you'll get a decent list: bamboo, dacode, med-cms, plone, zope Searching for wiki will give you even more results. -- Simon Males [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] is a floppy inserted ?
Matthew Hannigan wrote: On Thu, Jun 16, 2005 at 03:04:13 +1000, Mike MacCana wrote: You all suck. Hah! Probably. Trouble with 'file' is that it 'succeeds' either way. Aye, but you can print different messages looking for stuff in the output. Using mtools is a good idea, but they'd have to have it installed. Mike -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Linux Printing
Sounds like a great deal and much cheaper to run than my Brother HL1430 which is a nice little machine. Can the drum/toner be replaced with a new one? Cost? John. Richard wrote: Hai folks I asked about a month ago about what would be a good mono laser printer, for a small office setup. Some of the information was very useful, and I thank everyone. So what did I end up buying, well after running the slide rule over everything I ended up getting a Kyocera FS-820, the main reasons being very low TCO compared to all the printers I looked into. The two main factors were the up front price of only $320ex, and that I don't have to change the drum for 100,000 pages (you just buy another printer). It works fine with Linux (don't use it with Mandrake 10.1 there is a PCL/lp0 bug in the kernel easily fixed by updating to a kernel 2.6.10 or later). I have no commercial relationship to Kyocera so this is all a personal decision. Regards Richard Neal Childlessness is hereditary, if your parents don't have children neither will you. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Ubuntu kernel compilation
Isthe kernel source provided with Ubuntu configured exactly the same way as the default kernel it ships with? -- Carlo Sogono [EMAIL PROTECTED] This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working around the clock, around the globe, visit http://www.hi-speed.net.au -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] is a floppy inserted ?
quote who=Mike MacCana Matthew Hannigan wrote: On Thu, Jun 16, 2005 at 03:04:13 +1000, Mike MacCana wrote: You all suck. Hah! Probably. Trouble with 'file' is that it 'succeeds' either way. Aye, but you can print different messages looking for stuff in the output. Using mtools is a good idea, but they'd have to have it installed. thanks for all the fine, and, sucking, suggestions, all the same. after due consideration, I've decided asking someone to go to the machine was perhaps the simplest in this instance. ;0 Voytek -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Debian ISO's wanted in exchange for stuff
Grant, If you still require this stuff, let me know. I'd be happy to download the files required. Have plenty of data usage available :) On 6/15/05, Grant Parnell - EverythingLinux [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: EverythingLinux is a bit bandwidth challenged but would like CD ISO's of Debian 3.1. We only need ISO's 9-14 or if you have the DVD ISO that'll be fine as well. We'll accept on CDR/DVD or loan us a HDD or DDS2 tape or some other USB/Firewire media. In exchange we'll give you a free pressed set when we manage to produce them (est 2 weeks after we have ISO's) and a Debian T-Shirt. -- ---GRiP--- Grant Parnell - senior consultant EverythingLinux services - the consultant's backup tech support. Web: http://www.everythinglinux.com.au/support.php We're also busybits.com.au and linuxhelp.com.au and elx.com.au. Phone 02 8756 3522 to book service or discuss your needs. ELX or its employees participate in the following:- OSIA (Open Source Industry Australia) - http://www.osia.net.au AUUG (Australian Unix Users Group) - http://www.auug.org.au SLUG (Sydney Linux Users Group) - http://www.slug.org.au LA (Linux Australia) - http://www.linux.org.au -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Ubuntu kernel compilation
On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 08:24 am, Carlo Sogono wrote: Is the kernel source provided with Ubuntu configured exactly the same way as the default kernel it ships with? IIRC the kernel source package is UN-CONFIGURED by default. If you want to compile your own kernel with the same options as the pre-compiled version, simply: sudo cp /boot/config-2.6.10-5-386 /usr/src/linux/.config The file in /boot may have a slightly different name depending on your architecture, but this file contains the kernel configuration options for the pre-compiled kernel. Of course, once the .config file is in /usr/src/linux, you can edit it with your preferred method (make config/menuconfig/xconfig/etc) to customise your kernel. You may also want the install the kernel-package package which is the debian-way of rolling your own kernels and integrating them into the package database :) HTH, James -- I've looked at the listing, and it's right! -- Joel Halpern -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Linux Printing
On Thu, Jun 16, 2005 at 09:53:56PM +1000, Richard wrote: So what did I end up buying, well after running the slide rule over everything I ended up getting a Kyocera FS-820, the main reasons being very low TCO compared to all the printers I looked into. The two main factors were the up front price of only $320ex, and that I don't have to change the drum for 100,000 pages (you just buy another printer). You don't buy the drum but you need toner after 6,000 pages. Kyocera TK-110 cartridges seem to be $133 Seems a TAD expensive, I wonder what a refiller would cost? Jamie -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Ubuntu kernel compilation
On 6/17/05, James Gray [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 08:24 am, Carlo Sogono wrote: Is the kernel source provided with Ubuntu configured exactly the same way as the default kernel it ships with? IIRC the kernel source package is UN-CONFIGURED by default. If you want to compile your own kernel with the same options as the pre-compiled version, simply: sudo cp /boot/config-2.6.10-5-386 /usr/src/linux/.config The file in /boot may have a slightly different name depending on your architecture, but this file contains the kernel configuration options for the pre-compiled kernel. Of course, once the .config file is in /usr/src/linux, you can edit it with your preferred method (make config/menuconfig/xconfig/etc) to customise your kernel. You may also want the install the kernel-package package which is the debian-way of rolling your own kernels and integrating them into the package database :) After the copy of the file suggested above, I recommend running make oldconfig first (after the filecopy of the config file is done). This will make things a little easier, before running (make comnfig/menuconfig/xconfig/etc). -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] stolen laptop
Sorry to use the list for this kind of things, but considering the context, it may be suitable. My laptop got stolen 3 days ago from my home (around Ultimo). It's a small silver Twinhead (don't quite remember the model right now), with 2 operating systems running on it (LILO: Slackware Linux and Windows XP). If anybody sees it around, please contact me via email soon as possible. I'm willing to pay for it's return. The content is important for me. Thanks a lot. -- Julio C. Ody http://rootshell.be/~julioody -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Call for volunteers for June Slug distribution roundtable
Lindsay Holmwood wrote: At the June Slug meeting we're going to have a distribution roundtable! We need a representative for distributions to give a breif summary of how their distribution handles package management. Once we're done with the summaries the audience can field questions to the representatives. Right now we have a speakers for Gentoo, Arch Linux, and Rubyx. A distribution/package management system can't be represented twice, so you'll need to get in early if you want to talk about yours! Hopefully everybody will be able to come away knowing a bit more about distro's out there. A rough outline of things to talk about can be found at http://wiki.slug.org.au/wiki/TopicSuggest Can volunteers please email me if they'd like like to participate. I'll update a list of volunteers on the wiki as they come. Cheers, Lindsay I'd offer to talk about YAST but it is so simple and user friendly that it hardly needs more than Here it is, the most user friendly system of them all! ;-p Stay well and happy Heracles -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] stolen laptop
On 6/17/05, Julio Cesar Ody [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sorry to use the list for this kind of things, but considering the context, it may be suitable. My laptop got stolen 3 days ago from my home (around Ultimo). It's a small silver Twinhead (don't quite remember the model right now), with 2 operating systems running on it (LILO: Slackware Linux and Windows XP). Do you remember the serial number? Or has this never been noted? -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] stolen laptop
Now that I think of it, in the fall 2004 edition of the 2600 there was a really good article about laptop security. It focused on putting together a 'phone home' programme that would send a heartbeat to a remote server every 15 minutes when plugged into a network. There might have been something in the article about getting data off it remotely too. Very handy for this type of theft. I'll make a scan of it if anyone is interested. Good luck! Lindsay Julio Cesar Ody wrote: Sorry to use the list for this kind of things, but considering the context, it may be suitable. My laptop got stolen 3 days ago from my home (around Ultimo). It's a small silver Twinhead (don't quite remember the model right now), with 2 operating systems running on it (LILO: Slackware Linux and Windows XP). If anybody sees it around, please contact me via email soon as possible. I'm willing to pay for it's return. The content is important for me. Thanks a lot. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] stolen laptop
On 2005.06.17 12:02 Lindsay Holmwood wrote: Now that I think of it, in the fall 2004 edition of the 2600 there was a really good article about laptop security. It focused on putting together a 'phone home' programme that would send a heartbeat to a remote server every 15 minutes when plugged into a network. There might have been something in the article about getting data off it remotely too. Very handy for this type of theft. I'll make a scan of it if anyone is interested. Yes please. Robert Thorsby -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Linux Printing
Jamie Honan wrote:
On Thu, Jun 16, 2005 at 09:53:56PM +1000, Richard wrote:
So what did I end up buying, well after running the slide rule over
everything I ended up getting a Kyocera FS-820, the main reasons being
very low TCO compared to all the printers I looked into.
The two main factors were the up front price of only $320ex, and that I
don't have to change the drum for 100,000 pages (you just buy another
printer).
You don't buy the drum but you need toner after 6,000 pages.
Kyocera TK-110 cartridges seem to be $133
Seems a TAD expensive, I wonder what a refiller would cost?
So about 4c per printed page for the first 100,000 pages if you don't
scratch the drum in the meantime.
round-up(100((capital is ($320+gst)/1**5) + (toner is $133/6**3) +
(paper is ~$5/500)) is 4c per page.
Which is normal range pricing to me.
With my lasers, Gestetner GLP800 Scout, HP4v HP5siMX, I have always
found that the refillers are light on toner than the brand cartridges,
but variations in print jobs made it difficult to work out who was the
best value.
One thing I did lean is that Kyocera has a duplexer for ~$700, so I will
not be paying $800-$1,200 to have the 300,000 page service on my HP5si
(we no longer need A3 duplex print).
--
Terry Collins {:-)}}} email: terryc at woa.com.au www:
http://www.woa.com.au
Wombat Outdoor Adventures Bicycles, Computers, GIS, Printing,
Publishing
People without trees are like fish without clean water
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Re: [SLUG] stolen laptop
On Fri, 17 Jun 2005, Robert Thorsby wrote:
On 2005.06.17 12:02 Lindsay Holmwood wrote:
Now that I think of it, in the fall 2004 edition of the
2600 there was a really good article about laptop security.
It focused on putting together a 'phone home' programme
that would send a heartbeat to a remote server every 15
minutes when plugged into a network. There might have
been something in the article about getting data off it
remotely too.
Very handy for this type of theft.
I'll make a scan of it if anyone is interested.
Yes please.
There's a mob called Stealth Signal which basically run a tracking
service for laptops.
http://www.stealthsignal.com
Doesn't seem to support Linux, which is a bit of a bummer. But it
basically installs a little app in a hidden sector on the HD which reports
location {IP address, usually, but apparently it also interfaces with the
phone system - in the US at least. Oh, and Australia too, apparently}.
It also allows you to delete files remotely - not sure about anything
else. It's useful for tracking stolen laptops etc if whoever steals it is
stupid enough to connect to the internet.
DaZZa
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Re: [SLUG] stolen laptop
An old flatmate of mine bought a laptop from somewhere-or-other (I genuinuely can't remember, i think it may have been a second-hand store) and paid cash for it. It was from a big-name manufacturer, and as he tried to connect to the Internet, it 'phoned home', as described by Lindsay. I'm pretty sure that no functionality was disabled in Windows, only a message box asking for a number to be called, but he was good enough to return the laptop to its owner. Unfortunately, the owner of the laptop wasn't good enough to refund the several hundred dollars my flatmate paid for the laptop... Not sure what the moral of the story is, but if you do get your laptop returned, please help whoever was good enough to return it by helping them/the police to recover the money they paid for it. That's assuming the supposedly honest citizen didn't nick it :-) Cheers, Rob. On 6/17/05, Robert Thorsby [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 2005.06.17 12:02 Lindsay Holmwood wrote: Now that I think of it, in the fall 2004 edition of the 2600 there was a really good article about laptop security. It focused on putting together a 'phone home' programme that would send a heartbeat to a remote server every 15 minutes when plugged into a network. There might have been something in the article about getting data off it remotely too. Very handy for this type of theft. I'll make a scan of it if anyone is interested. Yes please. Robert Thorsby -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html -- Rob Sharp email/jabber: [EMAIL PROTECTED] web: http://sharp.id.au pgp: 0E2C C63B BA04 DEB4 7CC0 84FD 17E3 6AA4 87FB 62DF -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Distributions and Package Managers
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Thu, Jun 16, 2005 at 09:37:58PM +1000, Ashley wrote: I'd offer to talk about YAST but it is so simple and user friendly that it hardly needs more than Here it is, the most user friendly system of them all! ;-p I think we want each of the talks to be shortish anyhow but there are a bunch of things about package managers that might be of interest: * How does it handle dependencies conflicts? - --- file level conflicts - --- file level dependencies - --- package level dependencies - --- versioning for dependencies * Support for alternative packages that do the same job - --- e.g. postfix and sendmail - --- how to switch from one to the other without forcing dependencies * Support for back-compatible code - --- I have this program xxx that NEEDS some old version of a library but I want the rest of the system running on the latest libraries. - --- Can you install two versions of the one package? - --- Are there compat packages available to help you? - --- The various libtool and automake scripts are shockingly version specific, at any time you need at least 5 different versions of these in order to have the special one that each build needs. * Querying the system state? - --- checking where a file comes from - --- figuring out how to get a library file that you don't have - --- listing the files that a NOT owned by a package - --- listing the files that are owned by a package but have been modified * How does it handle configuration? - --- ask questions when installing/upgrading? - --- overwrite of configuration files on upgrade? - --- attempt to merge configuration files on upgrade? One excellent example is the X11 system when comparing debian to RedHat. On RedHat you install all the x11 packages but that won't give you a working X11 system... you can then either put in the config files by hand or run: system-config-display and then it goes through setting up the display. On debian, packages get installed and then configured by the package manager and it asks you questions right after you install. If you want to go through those questions again you need to use: dpkg-reconfigure xorg-xserver (Or something similar, there is also apt-reconfigure which I found didn't work on ubuntu, there's probably other stuff I don't know about). * Methods of upgrading the system? - --- Put CDROM in and choose upgrade (chunkular) - --- Track latest packages from website or ftp mirror (trickle) * How to roll your own packages? - --- source code archives - --- patch to source - --- versioning - --- distribution * How easy is it to get someone else's source code package and make some modifications of your own then use that package? - --- making a patch - --- testing the partly modified article - --- getting around an annoying dependency (e.g. I don't want PDF docs and I don't want to install all these crap tools just to get the thing to build) * How to include non-packaged code in your system but still have a working package manager at the end of the day? My experience with apt-get is that as soon as you break some dependency, it will never work properly for you again. It doesn't matter if you tell it, don't worry, I have this under control, it always thinks it knows best. It doesn't even matter if you want to use apt-get to install something unrelated to the broken dependency... it still goes nuts. This might have been fixed in recent years, it was the reason I finally got the shits with debian (that and lack of CDROM distributions). Anyhow, the ability to include a hybrid of packaged and non-packaged code in your system it pretty much essential. Another issue to look at is auto-update facilities (e.g. RedHat network) and how much control the sysadmin gets over the update (e.g. up2date vs yum vs apt) * Can you easily check what is out of date? * Can you hold packages back? * Will the held-back packages also hold back other things based on dependency linkage? * Can you source from several mirrors and if you do, how does it know which version is the latest? To my mind, NONE of the systems have it really under control. They are all so user friendly until you want to actually do something with the thing and then they drive you nuts. - Tel -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.6 (GNU/Linux) iQIVAwUBQrI288fOVl0KFTApAQJoCQ/+NxBTs0/OQ3aSq/XTJgfSStbwzIO3r4kG oTRa1H2TkE15r6U8ER5TAug8fNqCVtFMyvxaWpTR8FTo0svAmJhoaQ+5rDtuAC6F cf5mATRBPAZVn33CWB/M/tFQ4bfnVFh2rC9Cz0vOa2hRkb1XZ94/aNzclQFcZhiI PmLS8OHpnkFBjOXEf2qHl8ettWCB/cWZQZ1KPgVpdQeX1klq/fGrUHYM57E7Qqvb 6/NlwvAT+TJAmdDJ3CA+2wHlP0nI/rak7Sl8erv9ugQE4ixo9Gxiu4z7C4yfGfxE Gmsf8BZCHmNqBHCzWgx5gxHhPYvn6pUZAWx7OEBSmTUr6QOkVGUQjbg63kb7XXQu YOiCd2fuCFHCULjknLGnVnGNHeHKAVXUS22+mVYHRmZKT0ll0RX68TkG5Z97xZeQ 5OoM9Pm9TcYjbzPeMNDTPZORY9DlQKdEaiJgaB8xCp14PewXytBMgrq1/wAEWgKR 4rL/z5OnsCF4X7oZkZbZxEV+BUaYnGkcWlPJ1c/QIDGy2SZZtqLFuW7KDelDPPI/
Re: [SLUG] stolen laptop
This is actually the kind of thing you want to kill yourself later for not having done before =) But then, every time I thought about coding it, i said to myself no worries, this ain't gonna happen, and kicked it from my priorities list. Good riddance. I seem to be one of those who lock the house up *after* the burglary took place. I always thought about installing a small backdoor on my init (and in windows, a small app and a registry entry would do the job) to shoot a string to a remote server every time my laptop booted. An IP address is all you need. Give the ISP a call, explain the situation, and I'm sure they'll help. As for the guy who stole, how many laptops are equipped with such things? It would take more than an average burglar to guess he's being tracked when he turns the laptop on. IF he's the one to use it. Michael: wish I had the serial number. documentation is gone along with it. another good lesson to keep in mind next time =) Thanks guys. On 6/17/05, Lindsay Holmwood [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Now that I think of it, in the fall 2004 edition of the 2600 there was a really good article about laptop security. It focused on putting together a 'phone home' programme that would send a heartbeat to a remote server every 15 minutes when plugged into a network. There might have been something in the article about getting data off it remotely too. Very handy for this type of theft. I'll make a scan of it if anyone is interested. Good luck! Lindsay Julio Cesar Ody wrote: Sorry to use the list for this kind of things, but considering the context, it may be suitable. My laptop got stolen 3 days ago from my home (around Ultimo). It's a small silver Twinhead (don't quite remember the model right now), with 2 operating systems running on it (LILO: Slackware Linux and Windows XP). If anybody sees it around, please contact me via email soon as possible. I'm willing to pay for it's return. The content is important for me. Thanks a lot. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html -- Julio C. Ody http://rootshell.be/~julioody -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Distributions and Package Managers
telford == telford [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: telford -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 telford On Thu, Jun 16, 2005 at 09:37:58PM +1000, Ashley wrote: I'd offer to talk about YAST but it is so simple and user friendly that it hardly needs more than Here it is, the most user friendly system of them all! ;-p telford I think we want each of the talks to be shortish anyhow but telford there are a bunch of things about package managers that might telford be of interest: Another issue is how easy is it to set up multiple sources, so that if one is broken or incomplete another is used, and so on. Easy with apt, hard (or at least I couldn;t work out how to do it) with yast. -- Dr Peter Chubb http://www.gelato.unsw.edu.au peterc AT gelato.unsw.edu.au The technical we do immediately, the political takes *forever* -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] stolen laptop
On Fri, Jun 17, 2005 at 12:23:51PM +1000, DaZZa wrote: It also allows you to delete files remotely - not sure about anything else. It's useful for tracking stolen laptops etc if whoever steals it is stupid enough to connect to the internet. If he doesn't reinstall first... I remember talking to a guy who was selling this phone home software and he was saying that it will stay on the system (and stay active) even after a format and reinstall. He also said that it would keep working even if someone installed Linux over the top. Needless to say I didn't believe him but I still wonder if such a thing is possible? My approach is just to get a Dremmel and carve a phone number into the case. Makes it difficult to sell down at the pub and sooner or later someone will ring the number (maybe not the new owner, maybe one of their friends) then you have something to give the police to work with (since every phone call is logged). - Tel -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] stolen laptop
On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It also allows you to delete files remotely - not sure about anything else. It's useful for tracking stolen laptops etc if whoever steals it is stupid enough to connect to the internet. If he doesn't reinstall first... I remember talking to a guy who was selling this phone home software and he was saying that it will stay on the system (and stay active) even after a format and reinstall. He also said that it would keep working even if someone installed Linux over the top. Needless to say I didn't believe him but I still wonder if such a thing is possible? Apparently, this product does just that. Those are the claims, anyway. The only way to stop it working is to physically replace the hard drive which is in the machine. YMMV - I haven't actually had one stolen to test it yet. :) DaZZa -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] stolen laptop
On Fri, Jun 17, 2005 at 01:09:04PM +1000, DaZZa wrote: Apparently, this product does just that. Those are the claims, anyway. The only way to stop it working is to physically replace the hard drive which is in the machine. Pretty strange when you consider that they say they don't support Linux but then they also say that if someone installs Linux over the top of it then it will keep working. Somehow I have trouble reconciling those two chunks of information. I guess that bluff is half the ballgame in the security arena, certainly seems that the airports are working on that theory. - Tel -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] stolen laptop
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I remember talking to a guy who was selling this phone home software and he was saying that it will stay on the system (and stay active) even after a format and reinstall. He also said that it would keep working even if someone installed Linux over the top. Needless to say I didn't believe him but I still wonder if such a thing is possible? Yes. There are readable and writable areas on the physical platter that are not normally accessable by the OS or BIOS. They are usually reserved by the hard disk manufacturer for their use. By working with the HD manufacturer and the laptop builder you could get a driver written which will be able to access those regions. Mike -- Michael Lake Chemistry, Materials Forensic Science, UTS Ph: 9514 1725 Fx: 9514 1460 [pls ignore idiot lawyer's msg below] -- UTS CRICOS Provider Code: 00099F DISCLAIMER: This email message and any accompanying attachments may contain confidential information. If you are not the intended recipient, do not read, use, disseminate, distribute or copy this message or attachments. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete this message. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender expressly, and with authority, states them to be the views the University of Technology Sydney. Before opening any attachments, please check them for viruses and defects. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] stolen laptop
On Fri, Jun 17, 2005 at 12:43:22PM +1000, Julio Cesar Ody wrote: This is actually the kind of thing you want to kill yourself later for not having done before =) Yes. Same for backups. A friend of mine knows a well-known ABC guy whose hard disk on his lappy just died taking years of precious documents with it. I've just come back from buying hardware for my backup system - an external 250gb disk + a dual layer burner. The disk was only $200. The enclosure (firewire+usb2) was only $50. The dual layer burner was only $75 -- rockin! Backup is a lot cheaper these days. Matt -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
RE: [SLUG] Ubuntu kernel compilation
Thanks. Just what I needed. -- Carlo Sogono [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of James Gray Sent: Friday, 17 June 2005 9:42 AM To: slug@slug.org.au Subject: Re: [SLUG] Ubuntu kernel compilation On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 08:24 am, Carlo Sogono wrote: Is the kernel source provided with Ubuntu configured exactly the same way as the default kernel it ships with? IIRC the kernel source package is UN-CONFIGURED by default. If you want to compile your own kernel with the same options as the pre-compiled version, simply: sudo cp /boot/config-2.6.10-5-386 /usr/src/linux/.config The file in /boot may have a slightly different name depending on your architecture, but this file contains the kernel configuration options for the pre-compiled kernel. Of course, once the .config file is in /usr/src/linux, you can edit it with your preferred method (make config/menuconfig/xconfig/etc) to customise your kernel. You may also want the install the kernel-package package which is the debian-way of rolling your own kernels and integrating them into the package database :) HTH, James -- I've looked at the listing, and it's right! -- Joel Halpern -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html _ This message has been checked for all known viruses by the MessageLabs Virus Scanning Service. For further information visit http://www.Hi-Speed.net.au __ __ This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs SkyScan service. For more information on a proactive anti-virus service working around the clock, around the globe, visit http://www.hi-speed.net.au -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] MSN on the fritz?
Not that I particularly *like* MSN or their privacy (sic) policy etc and therefore give a rats hairy sphincter, but more that I run a Jabber server with an MSN connector. As of this morning, I've been getting remote server error whenever a user tries to use the MSN connector (bugger) after a fairly substantial timeout (5 min or so). Seems the fine folk at M$ may have re-jigged the MSN protocol (again) - I can't log into MSN directly with Kopete or Gaim either. The guy who sits in the cube behind me can connect with the M$-MSN client...just seems to be affecting all my non-M$ clients (Jabber/Kopete/Gaim/etc). Anyone else seeing the same behaviour?? Cheers, James -- The error of youth is to believe that intelligence is a substitute for experience, while the error of age is to believe experience is a substitute for intelligence. -- Lyman Bryson -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] MSN on the fritz?
On 6/17/05, James Gray [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Not that I particularly *like* MSN or their privacy (sic) policy etc and therefore give a rats hairy sphincter, but more that I run a Jabber server with an MSN connector. As of this morning, I've been getting remote server error whenever a user tries to use the MSN connector (bugger) after a fairly substantial timeout (5 min or so). Seems the fine folk at M$ may have re-jigged the MSN protocol (again) - I can't log into MSN directly with Kopete or Gaim either. The guy who sits in the cube behind me can connect with the M$-MSN client...just seems to be affecting all my non-M$ clients (Jabber/Kopete/Gaim/etc). Anyone else seeing the same behaviour?? Now that you mention it, this might explain why my old version of Trillian on my work PC is not connecting to MSN no more. So I'd say yes it would appear something has changed -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] MSN on the fritz?
I'm using aMSN on gentoo and have had troubles all morning, but its working fine again now. Luke James Gray wrote: Not that I particularly *like* MSN or their privacy (sic) policy etc and therefore give a rats hairy sphincter, but more that I run a Jabber server with an MSN connector. As of this morning, I've been getting remote server error whenever a user tries to use the MSN connector (bugger) after a fairly substantial timeout (5 min or so). Seems the fine folk at M$ may have re-jigged the MSN protocol (again) - I can't log into MSN directly with Kopete or Gaim either. The guy who sits in the cube behind me can connect with the M$-MSN client...just seems to be affecting all my non-M$ clients (Jabber/Kopete/Gaim/etc). Anyone else seeing the same behaviour?? Cheers, James -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] MSN on the fritz?
On 6/17/05, Luke Skywalker [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm using aMSN on gentoo and have had troubles all morning, but its working fine again now. Mine has just came good.. -shrugs- -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] MSN on the fritz?
Looks like MSN Messenger is having trouble. This is from the website http://messenger.ninemsn.com.au/Status.aspx The .NET Messenger Service is temporarily experiencing difficulty. You may be unable to sign in. Please try again later. Last Update: 16/06/2005 7:17:00 PM Pacific Time (GMT -8:00) James Gray wrote: Not that I particularly *like* MSN or their privacy (sic) policy etc and therefore give a rats hairy sphincter, but more that I run a Jabber server with an MSN connector. As of this morning, I've been getting remote server error whenever a user tries to use the MSN connector (bugger) after a fairly substantial timeout (5 min or so). Seems the fine folk at M$ may have re-jigged the MSN protocol (again) - I can't log into MSN directly with Kopete or Gaim either. The guy who sits in the cube behind me can connect with the M$-MSN client...just seems to be affecting all my non-M$ clients (Jabber/Kopete/Gaim/etc). Anyone else seeing the same behaviour?? Cheers, James -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] MSN on the fritz?
On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 01:51 pm, James Gray wrote: Not that I particularly *like* MSN or their privacy (sic) policy etc and therefore give a rats hairy sphincter, but more that I run a Jabber server with an MSN connector. As of this morning, I've been getting remote server error whenever a user tries to use the MSN connector (bugger) after a fairly substantial timeout (5 min or so). Gah - repeat after me: ip_conntrack can loose the plot occasionally. Just needed to restart the iptables fru-fru on the jabber swerver and all is well. Seems the ip_conntrack was b0rked after restarting the Jabber server this morning which also screwed local clients as well. NFI why MSN Messenger wasn't affectedalthough the dude behind me was in the office and MSN-ing before I restarted the Jabber swerver. shrug James -- The happiest time of a person's life is after his first divorce. -- J.K. Galbraith -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Re: Distributions and Package Managers
Hi telford On Thu, Jun 16, 2005 at 09:37:58PM +1000, Ashley wrote: I'd offer to talk about YAST but it is so simple and user friendly that it hardly needs more than Here it is, the most user friendly system of them all! ;-p telford I think we want each of the talks to be shortish anyhow but telford there are a bunch of things about package managers that might telford be of interest: Another issue is how easy is it to set up multiple sources, so that if one is broken or incomplete another is used, and so on. Easy with apt, hard (or at least I couldn;t work out how to do it) with yast. So you are going to install some random binaries, packaged by some random person/s onto your machine because it's often easy and there are not lots of war stories good luck!! SuSE is often a PITA. (eg try to mount a flash as hdc to format it, with subfs fooling with your DVD drive) However yast is the best package manager I've used. I built a system, used apt-get to install mythtv and 50M later had it working. I built a system, downloaded lame-src mythtv-src and the total footprint was 10M by the time it worked. Ummm 40M of 'something'! James -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] stolen laptop
On Fri, Jun 17, 2005 at 01:27:11PM +1000, Michael Lake wrote: Yes. There are readable and writable areas on the physical platter that are not normally accessable by the OS or BIOS. They are usually reserved by the hard disk manufacturer for their use. By working with the HD manufacturer and the laptop builder you could get a driver written which will be able to access those regions. Supposing that you do get access to those regions, that gives some space for the program... there's still the boot process to consider and where is this code going to reside in memory? If I'm running some sort of NAT system (which everyone does), how is it going to know my local network settings? If I use a pppoe tunnel (typical ADSL user) then it is even worse. I guess it could try for DHCP but that requires the resident code to take over from the OS for long enough to get a reply on the DHCP (i.e. a long time, long enough for the OS to attempt a context switch or a device driver interrupt). What about network card buffer space and packet queues? Frankly, I don't see any way it could work independently of the operating system except for if it can grab the bootstrap process and get a quick packet out the door just as the sustem boots up, and then only if DHCP is working, and if there is no local proxy. Contrariwise, if it does work with the operating system then it must be hooked into the OS files somehow (and thus living in regular IDE disk space where the OS can find those files). - Tel -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Re: Distributions and Package Managers
On Fri, Jun 17, 2005 at 12:02:44PM +0800, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Another issue is how easy is it to set up multiple sources, so that if one is broken or incomplete another is used, and so on. Easy with apt, hard (or at least I couldn;t work out how to do it) with yast. So you are going to install some random binaries, packaged by some random person/s onto your machine because it's often easy and there are not lots of war stories good luck!! Where I choose to get code from is my decision, not the package manager's decision. I'm the guy who has hold of the on/off switch. I'm the guy who is going to reinstall if the distro doesn't do what I want (and easily). Lots of package managers seem to forget this. I built a system, used apt-get to install mythtv and 50M later had it working. I built a system, downloaded lame-src mythtv-src and the total footprint was 10M by the time it worked. Ummm 40M of 'something'! apt tends to drag in anything that even smells related (tv rhymes with hippie so you are going to need some hair-care programs with that). I've noticed that most debian package authors tend to set dependencies to be everything that I have on my box right now rather than thinking carefully about what they really need. However, we were commenting earlier about human nature and why it never really changes... if the system makes it easy to just drag in every possible extra package then thats what everyone is going to do because people always do what is easy. I think that the talk on Friday night should have a slot available for war stories because that's where some of the real grist starts to come out. - Tel -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Re: Distributions and Package Managers
quote who=[EMAIL PROTECTED] I built a system, used apt-get to install mythtv and 50M later had it working. I built a system, downloaded lame-src mythtv-src and the total footprint was 10M by the time it worked. Ummm 40M of 'something'! apt tends to drag in anything that even smells related (tv rhymes with hippie so you are going to need some hair-care programs with that). apt doesn't do this, the package definition tells apt to do it. More often than not, packagers will include the absolute bare minimum in the Depends line, and put useful related stuff in Recommends and Suggests. I've noticed that most debian package authors tend to set dependencies to be everything that I have on my box right now rather than thinking carefully about what they really need. This is poppycock. Most packagers use debhelper to do the library dependency information for them. If binaries in the package use those libraries, they are automagic dependencies. On very rare occasions, that may bring in libraries that are not 100% necessary. More often than that, debhelper will depend on unnecessarily new versions (it depends on the current package version, not a matrix of shlibsyms to package versions, but that is being looked at). There are similar debhelper tools for Python, Mono, etc. So, in the common case, dependencies are *exactly what the binaries* require and no more (and it's the no more bit that is the source of more bugs than depending on too much). - Jeff -- OSCON 2005: August 1st-5th http://conferences.oreillynet.com/os2005/ What do you get when you cross a web server and a hen? Apoache. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
RE: [SLUG] stolen laptop
I must admit that have never heard of such a program but what a good idea!. I actually doesn't have to know anything about the local network. It only has to know how to ping the server. The server can then use the HTTP protocol to get the IP address of the client Regards, Phill O'Flynn -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, 17 June 2005 2:44 PM To: slug@slug.org.au Subject: Re: [SLUG] stolen laptop On Fri, Jun 17, 2005 at 01:27:11PM +1000, Michael Lake wrote: Yes. There are readable and writable areas on the physical platter that are not normally accessable by the OS or BIOS. They are usually reserved by the hard disk manufacturer for their use. By working with the HD manufacturer and the laptop builder you could get a driver written which will be able to access those regions. Supposing that you do get access to those regions, that gives some space for the program... there's still the boot process to consider and where is this code going to reside in memory? If I'm running some sort of NAT system (which everyone does), how is it going to know my local network settings? If I use a pppoe tunnel (typical ADSL user) then it is even worse. I guess it could try for DHCP but that requires the resident code to take over from the OS for long enough to get a reply on the DHCP (i.e. a long time, long enough for the OS to attempt a context switch or a device driver interrupt). What about network card buffer space and packet queues? Frankly, I don't see any way it could work independently of the operating system except for if it can grab the bootstrap process and get a quick packet out the door just as the sustem boots up, and then only if DHCP is working, and if there is no local proxy. Contrariwise, if it does work with the operating system then it must be hooked into the OS files somehow (and thus living in regular IDE disk space where the OS can find those files). - Tel -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
