[SLUG] Re: slug Digest, Vol 29, Issue 62
On Monday 29 August 2005 12:25, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi What you want to do is very easy. Although I am not certain the existing ADSL router you own can be told or configured to be a dumb bridged ADSL modem, much like the Linksys ADSL2MUE units are by default. All this means is that the linux box would run PPPoE and do the authentication etc. Then you'd install and configure NAT (Network Address Translation) so that your internal lan can see and use the internet. Much like NAT built into the WAG54G, but in this case the linux box could handle more NAT entries and not fall over when too many are opened. etc. This isn't necessary, and IMHO it would be undesirableand IMHO it would be leaving the modem to handle the ADSL connection but setting it to automatically forward all packets to the firewall. The firewall can then choose what to do with them. This way, you are splitting up the tasks amongst the devices. The modem can use PPPoA (which in many cases is better than PPPoE) but it doesn't hinder firewalling/forwarding. Please elaborate, specially why 'and IMHO it would be undesirable' my previous (last post to slug) explained in depth the woes I had trying to use a dynalink router. Every router that I've looked at is hard/obscure when you try to route AND run servers. Also you end up trusting 'their' firewall to work right. tigger.ws, its dns, mail, vpn and www is testament to how easy and sucessfull a bridge can be. James -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
RE: [SLUG] Re: slug Digest, Vol 29, Issue 62
G'day... Please elaborate, specially why 'and IMHO it would be undesirable' my previous (last post to slug) explained in depth the woes I had trying to use a dynalink router. Every router that I've looked at is hard/obscure when you try to route AND run servers. Also you end up trusting 'their' firewall to work right. How many routers have you looked at? Which ones were they? How long ago did you look at them? Most current routers provide NAT firewalling and port forwarding (both TCP and UDP) and work reliably. Some of the older ones may not be as reliable, but they've been around long enough that you can google for people's experiences and opinions on them. (E.g. the old Dlink DSL-300s are having faults as telephone exchanges are being updated but they are not routers anyway.) You can check the features of a router before purchase, even as far as downloading the instruction manual from the manufacturers website. The routers have an Apache web server built into them and are fairly easy to configure. Why would you go to the trouble of reproducing this behaviour when you already have it configured in hardware routers? As for not trusting 'their' firewall to work right, maybe you should reconsider - granted that a software router is as likely to have the same security issues if not more so. (How do you know how secure your box is? How thoroughly have you tested it? What tests did you run? Do you know where potential vulnerabilities exist? Are you up to date with all security updates? How quick to respond are you to security updates given by security authorities? Who do you use as security authorities on a practical level? Are you running additional software on the box other than just the firewall and port fowarding functionality? - If so you're even more at risk and are working with a somewhat broken paradigm.) Running a modem/router is cheaper in terms of hardware costs /and/ time spent assembling the hardware /and/ time spent installing and configuring the necessary software /and/ in terms of space requirements /and/ in terms of energy usage /and/ in terms of pre-requisite knowlege. Regards, Michael Kraus Software Developer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Direct Line 02 8306 0007 Wild Technology Pty Ltd , ABN 98 091 470 692 Sales - Ground Floor, 265/8 Lachlan Street, Waterloo NSW 2017 Admin - Level 4 Tiara, 306/9 Crystal Street, Waterloo NSW 2017 Telephone 1300-13-9453 | Facsimile 1300-88-9453 http://www.wildtechnology.net DISCLAIMER CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: The information contained in this email message and any attachments may be confidential information and may also be the subject of client legal - legal professional privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, interference with, disclosure or copying of this material is unauthorised and prohibited. This email and any attachments are also subject to copyright. No part of them may be reproduced, adapted or transmitted without the written permission of the copyright owner. If you have received this email in error, please immediately advise the sender by return email and delete the message from your system. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Re: slug Digest, Vol 29, Issue 62
As for not trusting 'their' firewall to work right, maybe you should reconsider - Especially because this particular device (http://www1.linksys.com/international/product.asp?coid=19ipid=667) runs linux, and iptables - so their firewall uses exactly the same software that your own firewall would be running anyway. -- There is nothing more worthy of contempt than a man who quotes himself - Zhasper, 2005 -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
RE: [SLUG] Re: slug Digest, Vol 29, Issue 62
Thanks James, I thought this would be the case but I couldn't think of an example quickly. Regards, Michael Kraus Software Developer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Direct Line 02 8306 0007 -Original Message- From: James Polley [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, 29 August 2005 4:50 PM To: Michael Kraus Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; slug@slug.org.au Subject: Re: [SLUG] Re: slug Digest, Vol 29, Issue 62 As for not trusting 'their' firewall to work right, maybe you should reconsider - Especially because this particular device (http://www1.linksys.com/international/product.asp?coid=19ipid=667) runs linux, and iptables - so their firewall uses exactly the same software that your own firewall would be running anyway. -- There is nothing more worthy of contempt than a man who quotes himself - Zhasper, 2005 Wild Technology Pty Ltd , ABN 98 091 470 692 Sales - Ground Floor, 265/8 Lachlan Street, Waterloo NSW 2017 Admin - Level 4 Tiara, 306/9 Crystal Street, Waterloo NSW 2017 Telephone 1300-13-9453 | Facsimile 1300-88-9453 http://www.wildtechnology.net DISCLAIMER CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: The information contained in this email message and any attachments may be confidential information and may also be the subject of client legal - legal professional privilege. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, interference with, disclosure or copying of this material is unauthorised and prohibited. This email and any attachments are also subject to copyright. No part of them may be reproduced, adapted or transmitted without the written permission of the copyright owner. If you have received this email in error, please immediately advise the sender by return email and delete the message from your system. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Konquie crashing when trying to save Ooffice file
Hi all, I left my daughter in the home office and when I came back, she'd been 'playing' with the 'other elements' of the machine - I know, I've been meaning to create a user id for her. This is a FC3 machine running Ooffice 1.1.3. So, today I go to save an ooffice text file and get the following fault from Konqueror: Using host libthread_db library /lib/tls/libthread_db.so.1. [Thread debugging using libthread_db enabled] [New Thread -174834784 (LWP 5988)] [New Thread -179696720 (LWP 5992)] [Thread debugging using libthread_db enabled] [New Thread -174834784 (LWP 5988)] [New Thread -179696720 (LWP 5992)] [Thread debugging using libthread_db enabled] [New Thread -174834784 (LWP 5988)] [New Thread -179696720 (LWP 5992)] [KCrash handler] #4 0xf6747324 in __dynamic_cast () from /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.6 #5 0xf64afb99 in KAcceleratorManager::setNoAccel () from /usr/lib/libkdecore.so.4 #6 0xf64afd10 in KAcceleratorManager::manage () from /usr/lib/libkdecore.so.4 #7 0xf64afd3d in KAcceleratorManager::manage () from /usr/lib/libkdecore.so.4 #8 0xf64f63ec in KCheckAccelerators::checkAccelerators () from /usr/lib/libkdecore.so.4 #9 0xf64f6b02 in KCheckAccelerators::autoCheckSlot () from /usr/lib/libkdecore.so.4 #10 0xf64f6b93 in KCheckAccelerators::qt_invoke () from /usr/lib/libkdecore.so.4 #11 0xf5f1610e in QObject::activate_signal () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #12 0xf5f167e4 in QObject::activate_signal () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #13 0xf624a8dd in QTimer::timeout () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #14 0xf5f35ebc in QTimer::event () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #15 0xf5eb7539 in QApplication::internalNotify () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #16 0xf5eb76ca in QApplication::notify () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #17 0xf63f8028 in KApplication::notify () from /usr/lib/libkdecore.so.4 #18 0xf5eab8ab in QEventLoop::activateTimers () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #19 0xf5e676fe in QEventLoop::processEvents () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #20 0xf5eccb85 in QEventLoop::enterLoop () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #21 0xf5eb6761 in QApplication::enter_loop () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #22 0xf6097ae0 in QDialog::exec () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #23 0x08053ccf in FileDialog::customEvent () #24 0xf5f137be in QObject::event () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #25 0xf5f4be5a in QWidget::event () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #26 0xf5eb7539 in QApplication::internalNotify () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #27 0xf5eb76ca in QApplication::notify () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #28 0xf63f8028 in KApplication::notify () from /usr/lib/libkdecore.so.4 #29 0xf5eb8696 in QApplication::sendPostedEvents () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #30 0xf5eb8722 in QApplication::sendPostedEvents () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #31 0xf5e67125 in QEventLoop::processEvents () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #32 0xf5eccb85 in QEventLoop::enterLoop () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #33 0xf5eccade in QEventLoop::exec () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #34 0xf5eb673b in QApplication::exec () from /usr/lib/qt-3.3/lib/libqt-mt.so.3 #35 0x08057a18 in main () I've uninstalled and reinstalled Ooffice and reinstalled elements of KDE, but no success. In the external program path, for file manager program, it shows: kfmclient openProfile filemanagement I've tried it with: /bin/lib/konqueror but this doesn't help either (BTW in SimplyMepis 3.3, Ooffice shows: a blank space!) I'm not sure where to raise this error (other than this group :)) and I'm not sure what I can do about it. Would someone be able to either interpret the output for me and suggest someway of working through it, or suggest somewhere else I can post? I'm afraid I need a bit of clarity in this... I've just got home from hospital and am on synthetic morphine (no, nothing exciting, just renal colic) so am a little vague and don't want to try anything that requires too much fiddling around :))) Thanks all (as usual) :) Regards, Patrick -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] linux box as router
Hi, On 8/29/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I would like to know it anyone is running a linux box as their adsl router/modem? Very much, alive and kicking. I have an old P2 133 Mhz, x86 system with 128 MB RAM where I installed Slackware and converted it to a router. Earlier, I had used Knoppix 3.6 installed to hard disk on this system. Do check my documentation at: http://www.shakthimaan.com - BSNL DataOne Regards, SK Shakthi Kannan, MS Software Engineer, Specsoft (Hexaware Technologies) [E]: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [M]: (91) 98407-87007 [W]: http://www.shakthimaan.com [L]: Chennai, India __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] linux box as router
Michael Fox wrote: On 8/29/05, Sridhar Dhanapalan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This way, you are splitting up the tasks amongst the devices. The modem can use PPPoA (which in many cases is better than PPPoE) but it doesn't hinder firewalling/forwarding. Yes, PPPoA in my opinion appears to be alot more robust then PPPoE, but YMMV. You most likely find that because oE adds another layer of complexity. PPPoE is actually PPPoAoE. Most DSLAMs actually support PPPoA, but you most likely won't be able to get support from your provider if connection level stuff goes awry. PPPoA is usually marginally (and I mean /marginally/) faster. Cheers! Lindsay -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] First time installing application.
I am running Ubuntu and have just downloaded an application from an outside source but do not know how to install it. It sits on the desktop. The file finishes with .bin. Clicking yields a message which tells me to 'rename the file to the correct extension for shell script'. I do not know how to or what happens after that. Help would be appreciated. John. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] bulk mail script
Alexander Else [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A task has been allocated to me to send out a mail (possibly with a word/pdf attachment) to a few hundred email addresses in an hour and a half. As i don't have a lot of time to do my homework on this one, i hope someone can point me to one or two options for a script that will do this for me. If you're sending to people who do want what you're sending, use mpack: mpack -s Here's some SPAM -d /file/with/text/message -c application/pdf /path/to/pdf/attachment [EMAIL PROTECTED] If you are spamming people who don't want what you're sending, a red hot poker in the eyeball would be too kind. -- Sam Eddie Couter | mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Debian Developer| mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] | jabber:[EMAIL PROTECTED] OpenPGP fingerprint: A46B 9BB5 3148 7BEA 1F05 5BD5 8530 03AE DE89 C75C -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] internet
dial up or broadband? Dean Paul Maloney wrote: Hi, Once again I need your help. I can't for some reason do a connection to my ISP without having to go through a lot of key strokes. Is there an easier way and how do I do it. As you can see I am a very early beginner at Linux but compared to the other OS this one is betterand faster. I am running Fedora Core 4 and so far everything is running well except my internet connection. Regards Paul. -- WWW: http://dean.bong.com.au LAN: http://www.bong.com.au EMAIL: [EMAIL PROTECTED] or [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ: 16867613 -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] ubuntu mod perl2
Thanks Gus, It maybe better for me to hunt around for a post API release for Hoary then. I'll check backports. Regards, Ashley On Sun, 2005-08-28 at 16:46 +0100, Angus Lees wrote: At Sat, 27 Aug 2005 13:30:42 +1000, Ashley Maher wrote: I loaded the mod perl2 package into Ubuntu. The registery scripts worked well. The handler modules test failed misserably. mod_perl/1.99_14 Perl/v5.8.4 PHP/4.3.10-10ubuntu4 configured -- resuming normal operations [...] [Sat Aug 27 12:39:46 2005] [error] [client 127.0.0.1] Can't locate Apache2/RequestRec.pm in @INC (@INC contains: /usr/lib/perl5/Apache2 /var/www /etc/perl /usr/local/lib/perl/5.8.4 /usr/local/share/perl/5.8.4 /usr/lib/perl5 /usr/share/perl5 /usr/lib/perl/5.8 /usr/share/perl/5.8 /usr/local/lib/site_perl . /etc/apache2/ /etc/apache2/lib/perl) at /var/www/MyApache2/Rocks.pm line 8.\nBEGIN failed--compilation aborted at /var/www/MyApache2/Rocks.pm line 8.\nCompilation failed in require at (eval 4) line 3.\n mod_perl2 changed the names of the critical libraries in one of the late prereleases (in order to avoid compatibility problems with mod_perl1) You are using a pre-API-change mod_perl2 with code written from post-API-change documentation. Basically the pre-API-change stuff was to use Apache2 somewhere and then use Apache::RequestRec, etc (ie without the 2 on the prefix). I don't have a box handy with pre-API-change mod_perl2 handy, but you should be able to work things out by looking at what files you actually have below /usr/lib/perl5/Apache2/. Be aware that any code you right to this API will not work against the released version of mod_perl2 (it was released too late into the sarge release process to make it into that release unfortunately). In most cases the changes are a simple search+replace however. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] internet connection
Hi, Well I think I have finally worked it out as to how to connect to internet. It takes a while and I have to be hit on the head a few times but eventially it stays in my head. Thanks for all your help as I am now using Linux to send you this email. It is great not to have to go back to that other OS to send your mail. Thanks again. Paul -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] internet
fc4 should have a nice interface to make it simple Dean Paul Maloney wrote: Sorry dial-up On Mon, 2005-08-29 at 21:47 +1000, Dean Hamstead wrote: dial up or broadband? Dean Paul Maloney wrote: Hi, Once again I need your help. I can't for some reason do a connection to my ISP without having to go through a lot of key strokes. Is there an easier way and how do I do it. As you can see I am a very early beginner at Linux but compared to the other OS this one is betterand faster. I am running Fedora Core 4 and so far everything is running well except my internet connection. Regards Paul. -- WWW: http://dean.bong.com.au LAN: http://www.bong.com.au EMAIL: [EMAIL PROTECTED] or [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ: 16867613 -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] First time installing application.
Open the terminal. Type: chmod +x Desktop/filename.bin enter Desktop/filename.bin enter Then it will install. -- Simon Males [EMAIL PROTECTED] john gibbons wrote: I am running Ubuntu and have just downloaded an application from an outside source but do not know how to install it. It sits on the desktop. The file finishes with .bin. Clicking yields a message which tells me to 'rename the file to the correct extension for shell script'. I do not know how to or what happens after that. Help would be appreciated. John. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] First time installing application.
On 8/29/05, Simon Males [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: chmod +x Desktop/filename.bin enter Desktop/filename.bin enter Then it will install. Depending on what this needs to do to install, you may have to run this as root (using sudo or su). Of course, running it as root means it can do whatever it wants to do, so be careful. Out of curiosity, what is it that you're installing? Unless it's something really bizarre, it probably already has a debian package (.dpkg) version which will install simpler and cleaner.. and if not, compiling from source will probably give you a better result than installing precompiled binaries (although not neccessarily) Oh, and that sms you got tonight? that was from me, you galoot :p See you.. thursday? -- There is nothing more worthy of contempt than a man who quotes himself - Zhasper, 2005 -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] SAMBA weirdness
Hi after 2 weeks of struggling I throw in the towel. Any kind soul able to save the day. I have a samba server, wins support, master domain browser, local master, dns proxy. lmhosts has no effect what so ever resolve order shows this dns (hosts) sort of works ... server:~ # cat /var/lib/samba/browse.dat WORKGROUP c0001000 SERVER WORKGROUP SERVER 400d9a03 Samba 3.0.12-5-SUSE WORKGROUP EDC-1 40011003 WORKGROUP THUNDER 40011203 Thunder Box WORKGROUP MECH40011003 mechWORKGROUP MARKTHRIFT 40011007 WORKGROUP CENTRAL240011203 WORKGROUP This is the wins browse data: server:~ # nmblookup -U server.edc -R EDC-1 querying EDC-1 on 192.168.17.254 name_query failed to find name EDC-1 this fails to find EDC-1 server:~ # nmblookup -U server.edc -R MECH querying MECH on 192.168.17.254 192.168.17.201 MECH00 oh this works, even though the previous didn't server:~ # nmblookup -U server.edc -R THUNDER querying THUNDER on 192.168.17.254 192.168.17.200 THUNDER00 works server:~ # nmblookup -U server.edc -R CENTRAL2 querying CENTRAL2 on 192.168.17.254 name_query failed to find name CENTRAL2 nope server:~ # nmblookup -R CENTRAL2 querying CENTRAL2 on 192.168.17.255 192.168.17.150 CENTRAL200 do a broadcast, yep its there! server:~ # nmblookup -U server.edc -R CENTRAL2 querying CENTRAL2 on 192.168.17.254 name_query failed to find name CENTRAL2 OK by now I'm utterly confused: when does the broswer cache work when does samba's lmhosts work how to trouble shoot the unanswered queries! Using SAMBA, o'reiley, says: this is not difficult with some complexity ... Wow I find no semblance of rational order here. My problem is simple: When a host at the end of a VPN wants to talk to the flexlm on a machine on servers network all goes well until the host says 'I'm george' and the machine says 'hey george' and there is no response. (ie for george read CENTRAL2) Howto resolve 'george' as a netbios name. (yes it's in lmhosts AND dns, and the browser cache, and still the query fails.) Thanks James -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Software Freedom Day 2005 - September 10th
Linux Australia and SLUG is proud to announce Software Freedom Day on September 10! Software Freedom Day is a global initiative to celebrate and give back to the community by taking Free and Open Source software to the streets. SLUG will be celebrating Software Freedom Day by distributing CDs in the central Sydney CBD, whilst holding an installfest for Linux and any sort of Free Software at UTS Broadway. For the day we'll have all kinds of SFD gear to give-out, including balloons, stickers, temporary tattoos, etc. Our aim for the day is to raise awareness of Free Software. Of course, with all events of this size, SLUG is after volunteers for the installfest or getting out on the street. If you are interested in helping out, be sure to let Pia [EMAIL PROTECTED] know, so we can organise hand-out permits and who's where. :) For people unfamiliar with the free software out there, we encourage you to drop by the InstallFest at UTS on the day, running from 10am 'till 4:30pm in room 2.5.30 (Building 2, Level 5, Room 530). Hope to see you out there! - Chris. (For the *socs out there receiving this, you guys are definantly invited and I'd like to encourage you to pass this on to your members). -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] SAMBA weirdness
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: SNIP My problem is simple: When a host at the end of a VPN wants to talk to the flexlm on a machine on servers network all goes well until the host says 'I'm george' and the machine says 'hey george' and there is no response. (ie for george read CENTRAL2) Howto resolve 'george' as a netbios name. (yes it's in lmhosts AND dns, and the browser cache, and still the query fails.) Is server configured as a wins server (wins support = Yes in smb.conf file)? Are the clients configured for a wins server? Unless they are told of a wins server, they will not update the wins server and hence what you describe will happen. If the workstations are windows an ipconfig /all will display whether or not the workstation knows of a WINS server. You can tell workstations about a wins server via dhcp - i think its option-netbios-servers (very similar to option domain-name-servers). Once this is set, the workstations should resolve properly using nmblookup unicast to server. The nmblookup broadcast works because the workstation is replying, but broadcasts don't necessarily work over VPN (depends on VPN - works over a bridged openvpn connection). Fil -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
RE: [SLUG] Webserver behind ADSL router
Thanks James That looks just like what I want to do for this guy. I had not come across the Bind view directive before. I had a look at the Bind documentation and am now even more confused. Does anyone have a nice explanation of how to use the view directive? I guess this is what is known as split DNS isn't it? Regards Richard -Original Message- From: James Gray [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, 29 August 2005 2:26 PM To: Richard Luckhurst; Slug Subject: Re: [SLUG] Webserver behind ADSL router On Monday 29 August 2005 14:03, Jeff Waugh wrote: quote who=Richard Luckhurst Has anyone ever set a web server up on an ADSL line anything like this? If so I would appreciate the benefit of your experience. Has anyone had experience in setting up the DNS for a situation like this? If so I would appreciate any help. There's no trickery involved. Just set the A records for the root domain and the www subdomain to his ADSL's static IP... and you're done. - Jeff Just to add to Jeff's comments, if you need separate addresses returned by the DNS server depending on whether the request came from an internal or external client, you might want to look at ISC Bind's (ver 9+) view directive. Let's say your customer's webserver (www.foo.com) has the address 192.168.0.80 but it's external (internet static IP via NAT) is 1.2.3.4. You probably want internal users to have www.foo.com resolve to 192.168.0.80 but external users resolve to 1.2.3.4. ISC Bind's view will allow you to do this with a single config file and single named daemon - and it's actually quite simple to do. Have a look at the bind 9 admin reference: http://www.nominum.com/content/documents/bind9arm.pdf specifically sections 6.2.19 and 6.2.20 (page 80). HTH, James -- Weekend, where are you? -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Re: Firefox print crash
Phil Scarratt wrote: Hi Has anyone else had trouble with firefox or thunderbird crashing when you press CTRL+P or select Print from the File menu? I'm using Ubuntu Hoary. It's driving me insane. Currently googling but what is really insane is that after I try something to fix it, I have to click print of course and firefox crashes again..arrrggg Fil Well there you goyou think I'd've looked in the Ubuntu forums firstturns out it is related to the Desktop theme - yes you read that right, the desktop not the FF theme. This even though FF and TB are the only apps affected - OOo is fine, as are others. Anyway, I was running Amaranth desktop theme, changed to Simple and all fine. Fil -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] First time installing application.
Thanks James and Simon, it is up and running. The application is called 'cMap', a freebie from 'cmap.ihmc.us'. It is an improvement on the Mind Map way of developing concepts. I gave it a trial run and prefer it to the way Mind Map works. And that triggers a thought - perhaps it might be a useful way of showing Linux converts like me a clearer way of following and understanding the purposes and links of the multiple textual commands of Linux. The GUIs are becoming clearer and easier to use by beginners but the textual stuff is still offputting and confusing. John. James Polley wrote: On 8/29/05, Simon Males [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: chmod +x Desktop/filename.bin enter Desktop/filename.bin enter Then it will install. Depending on what this needs to do to install, you may have to run this as root (using sudo or su). Of course, running it as root means it can do whatever it wants to do, so be careful. Out of curiosity, what is it that you're installing? Unless it's something really bizarre, it probably already has a debian package (.dpkg) version which will install simpler and cleaner.. and if not, compiling from source will probably give you a better result than installing precompiled binaries (although not neccessarily) Oh, and that sms you got tonight? that was from me, you galoot :p See you.. thursday? -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Smb Client GUI
Sluggers, I've a need to provide users with a GUI interface to smbclient. I've found the samba.org/samba/GUI/ page with quite a lot of gui tools on it however some appear to be broken links and other promise a bit but then don't get me want I need. Perhaps someone out there can recommend a tool so that I don't have to download and install the lot to find the one that does the trick. I need to allow my users to browse shares on the local LAN and copy files to and from their Linux directory on the Server to another users share directory on a windows PC. My users are via LTSP on a Linux server so I do *not* want them to have to attach a share to the server in order to transfer files. Of course the PC user can attach the file servers shares to their PC but my users are running on the server and need to either fetch or place a file onto the remote users PC. I'm really looking for a cuteFTP equivilent but using SMB. A lot of the GUI tools blurb describe being able to browse the sub-net and then mount shares... Does anyone know of one that can transfer files without actually mounting the share? TIA's Pete -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Smb Client GUI
Peter Rundle wrote: Sluggers, I've a need to provide users with a GUI interface to smbclient. I've found the samba.org/samba/GUI/ page with quite a lot of gui tools on it however some appear to be broken links and other promise a bit but then don't get me want I need. Perhaps someone out there can recommend a tool so that I don't have to download and install the lot to find the one that does the trick. I need to allow my users to browse shares on the local LAN and copy files to and from their Linux directory on the Server to another users share directory on a windows PC. My users are via LTSP on a Linux server so I do *not* want them to have to attach a share to the server in order to transfer files. Of course the PC user can attach the file servers shares to their PC but my users are running on the server and need to either fetch or place a file onto the remote users PC. I'm really looking for a cuteFTP equivilent but using SMB. A lot of the GUI tools blurb describe being able to browse the sub-net and then mount shares... Does anyone know of one that can transfer files without actually mounting the share? TIA's Pete I know nautilus allows this sort of thing, but not sure what version, or if it is nautilus that does it or some other addon or something in ubuntu or what. On my nautilus (ubuntu hoary), I can just type in the location bar something like network:/// and it displays a list of network locations available. In my case Windows Network appears along with a list of any Windows workstations on my network. Clicking on one changes the location to say smb://workstation1 and lists the shares available. I could then go into one and copy or paste files to/from it. Not sure what underlying distro you're using with LTSP, but if it's a gnome distro then this _may_ be of use. Fil -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Smb Client GUI
Dean Hamstead wrote: i would recommend to you... xsmbclient Did you mean xsmbrowser? I couldn't find an xsmbclient. P. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Webserver behind ADSL router
On Tue, Aug 30, 2005 at 08:56:13AM +1000, Richard Luckhurst ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
wrote:
Thanks James
[snip]
Have a look at the bind 9 admin reference:
http://www.nominum.com/content/documents/bind9arm.pdf
specifically sections 6.2.19 and 6.2.20 (page 80).
In the example below note that:
* directory is the root of the named tree
* data is SUB directory of the directory statement in the options section
* forwarders is what the ISP has given to you
* version is a later thing so people cant find out whether you have a buggy
bind
* in the internal you must set recursion to yes
* in the external you must set recursion to no
* observe the match-clients statement, VERY important.
* make sure that for the domains YOU ARE responsible to set
forwarders to nothing!!
* the forwarders statement in the options section is only
for your *INTERNAL* network to recurse to the next
DNS server (your isp) in case your DNS server does not
have it in cache!
-- example
acl internal { localhost; 192.168.0.0/16; };
options {
directory /var/named;
forwarders { YOUR_UPSTREAM_ISP_DNS_SERVER(s); };
query-source port 53;
version Not_Disclosed;
};
view internal {
match-clients { internal; };
recursion yes;
zone . {
type hint;
file root.hints;
};
zone YOURDOMAIN{
type master;
file data/YOURDOMAIN.internal;
forwarders {};
allow-update { localhost; };
};
};
view external {
match-clients { any; };
recursion no;
zone . {
type hint;
file root.hints;
};
zone YOURDOMAIN{
type master;
file data/YOURDOMAIN.external;
forwarders {};
allow-update { localhost; };
};
}
--
Don't rejoice in his defeat, You men. For though the world stood up and
stopped the Bastard, the Bitch that bore him is in heat again. - Bertold Brecht.
__, Jobst Schmalenbach, Technical Director
_ _.--'-n_/ Barrett Consulting Group P/L The Meditation Room P/L
-(_)--(_)= +61 3 9532 7677, POBox 277, Caulfield South, 3162, Australia
--
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Re: [SLUG] Smb Client GUI
Phil Scarratt wrote: I know nautilus allows this sort of thing, Not sure what underlying distro you're using with LTSP, but if it's a gnome distro then this _may_ be of use. Thanks Phil, but... When I first saw Nautilus a thought it was going to be a really neat piece of gear, but I'm so disappointed with it. I just find it unusable and the end users don't like it either. What my users want is a simple tool to browse their local disk, and those of other PC's on the local lan, and then either open files by double click or move/copy by drag and drop. Forget the skins, forget the fancy colours and image backgrounds and other stuff, lets just do the basics well and simply. So far I've got XFe as the file manager and it does a great job except it isn't smb share aware. xsmbrowser works ok to a degree but again the layout is not exactly logical and it's not integrated with the file browser. Linux on the desktop using terminal server approach, it's a losing battle with the users I'm afraid. I could of course write my own file / network explorer, but I don't have the time nor the skill. Sometimes I think I might just give in to the PC on each desktop mentality. Maybe not as neat from a technology stand point, but then it's not my design nor responsibility and it's what most users are used to. P. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Smb Client GUI
Peter Rundle wrote: When I first saw Nautilus a thought it was going to be a really neat piece of gear, but I'm so disappointed with it. I just find it unusable and the end users don't like it either. What my users want is a simple tool to browse their local disk, and those of other PC's on the local lan, and then either open files by double click or move/copy by drag and drop. Forget the skins, forget the fancy colours and image backgrounds and other stuff, lets just do the basics well and simply. Ahhh yesI've found opening files by double-click doesn't work in that scenario with nautilus either. Usually got to copy the files locally, then open, edit, save and recopy them back - a real fiddle especially if you have to do it often. Like you said, I sometimes wish software would just do the simple basics well, and worry about pretty later. Having said that, pretty does matter to a lot of people (which is ridiculous really). I've known people to go for less functionality/usability over pretty. So far I've got XFe as the file manager and it does a great job except it isn't smb share aware. xsmbrowser works ok to a degree but again the layout is not exactly logical and it's not integrated with the file browser. Linux on the desktop using terminal server approach, it's a losing battle with the users I'm afraid. I could of course write my own file / network explorer, but I don't have the time nor the skill. Sometimes I think I might just give in to the PC on each desktop mentality. Maybe not as neat from a technology stand point, but then it's not my design nor responsibility and it's what most users are used to. Again, I've had the same experience. I found I was pushing it all uphill kinda thing. Good luck...I haven't been able to solve the smb browsing problem yet either. Fil -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Smb Client GUI
On Tuesday 30 August 2005 09:30, Peter Rundle wrote: I'm really looking for a cuteFTP equivilent but using SMB. A lot of the GUI tools blurb describe being able to browse the sub-net and then mount shares... Does anyone know of one that can transfer files without actually mounting the share? If you are using Konqueror ... type smb://x.x.x.x in the URL. Then it just appears just like any other filesystem within konqueror. In my case: smb://192.168.0.95/ ... shows the shares on the domain server. You can even use fish:// or scp:// -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Smb Client GUI
Jesus Salvo Jr. wrote: On Tuesday 30 August 2005 09:30, Peter Rundle wrote: I'm really looking for a cuteFTP equivilent but using SMB. A lot of the GUI tools blurb describe being able to browse the sub-net and then mount shares... Does anyone know of one that can transfer files without actually mounting the share? If you are using Konqueror ... type smb://x.x.x.x in the URL. Then it just appears just like any other filesystem within konqueror. In my case: smb://192.168.0.95/ ... shows the shares on the domain server. You can even use fish:// or scp:// Can you double-click to open the files in their native applications and generally use the files just as if the location was say /home/fil/Documents? Fil -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Smb Client GUI
quote who=Peter Rundle When I first saw Nautilus a thought it was going to be a really neat piece of gear, but I'm so disappointed with it. I just find it unusable and the end users don't like it either. Would love to get more in-depth feedback from you about this at some stage. - Jeff -- EuroOSCON: October 17th-20thhttp://conferences.oreillynet.com/eurooscon/ Odd is good by the way. I knew normal in high school and normal hates me. - Mary Gardiner -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Smb Client GUI
quote who=Phil Scarratt Ahhh yesI've found opening files by double-click doesn't work in that scenario with nautilus either. Usually got to copy the files locally, then open, edit, save and recopy them back - a real fiddle especially if you have to do it often. It depends on the applications you're using. If they're gnome-vfs aware, you won't have any problems at all. These days, that covers most of the major non-GNOME desktop apps (OOo, Mozilla, etc). But yes, more needs to be done. Coming soon in Ubuntu - support for interesting mount options in pmount, letting your users mount and unmount things like nfs, smb, FUSE and crypted filesystems without root, but with strong policy (the p in pmount). Nice! - Jeff -- GNOME Summit: October 8th-10th http://live.gnome.org/Boston2005 Everything I knew about TCP/IP I had downloaded the same day I started hacking the net code. - Alan Cox -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Smb Client GUI
Jeff Waugh wrote: quote who=Phil Scarratt Ahhh yesI've found opening files by double-click doesn't work in that scenario with nautilus either. Usually got to copy the files locally, then open, edit, save and recopy them back - a real fiddle especially if you have to do it often. It depends on the applications you're using. If they're gnome-vfs aware, you won't have any problems at all. These days, that covers most of the major non-GNOME desktop apps (OOo, Mozilla, etc). But yes, more needs to be done. So you're saying that a file say somedoc.sxw on a samba share, if I browse to it using nautilus and double-click to open, it should open in OOo instead of spit the dummy (I can't remember the error)? Or is this something that would work with a later version of OOo - say 2? I've found the above scenario doesn't work on my setup, but if it is supposed to then I'll spend some time trying to work out why it doesn't at the moment. Coming soon in Ubuntu - support for interesting mount options in pmount, letting your users mount and unmount things like nfs, smb, FUSE and crypted filesystems without root, but with strong policy (the p in pmount). Nice! Ahh, very nice indeed. Looking forward to that. That would certainly resolve the problem (I would think anyway). BTW, kudos on ubuntu. Multimedia setup still needs a little bit of work if it is to be used mainstream - but that is probably a linux thing generally. It's not quite easy enough to use with all applications (eg skype and xmms together out of the box don't seem to play ball well without a fair amount of fiddling). I guess in part that's the applications problem. Fil -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Re: slug Digest, Vol 29, Issue 65
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This may explain almost everything. The (open)vpn non-bridged clients have the wins server pushed to them, but the office machines (out of my juristiction :-) almost certainly do not use the wins server, only broadcast resolution, and you say thus they wont update the wins server, which is what is happening If the workstations are windows an ipconfig /all will display whether or not the workstation knows of a WINS server. You can tell workstations about a wins server via dhcp - i think its option-netbios-servers (very similar to option domain-name-servers). Once this is set, the workstations should resolve properly using nmblookup unicast to server. The nmblookup broadcast works because the workstation is replying, but broadcasts don't necessarily work over VPN (depends on VPN - works over a bridged openvpn connection). Will try, thanks lots James Just be wary - each subnet can only have one wins server on it. Fil -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Smb Client GUI
On Tuesday 30 August 2005 11:59, Phil Scarratt wrote: Jesus Salvo Jr. wrote: On Tuesday 30 August 2005 09:30, Peter Rundle wrote: I'm really looking for a cuteFTP equivilent but using SMB. A lot of the GUI tools blurb describe being able to browse the sub-net and then mount shares... Does anyone know of one that can transfer files without actually mounting the share? If you are using Konqueror ... type smb://x.x.x.x in the URL. Then it just appears just like any other filesystem within konqueror. In my case: smb://192.168.0.95/ ... shows the shares on the domain server. You can even use fish:// or scp:// Can you double-click to open the files in their native applications and generally use the files just as if the location was say /home/fil/Documents? Yes -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Smb Client GUI
Jeff Waugh wrote: quote who=Phil Scarratt So you're saying that a file say somedoc.sxw on a samba share, if I browse to it using nautilus and double-click to open, it should open in OOo instead of spit the dummy (I can't remember the error)? Or is this something that would work with a later version of OOo - say 2? If the version of OOo you're using (depends on distro, version, and possibly if you have OOo/GNOME support packages installed) supports gnome-vfs, then 100% yes. :-) H...well there you go. As I'm using ubuntu hoary (all up to date) I would expect so...let's take a look at synaptic...look at that OOo-gnomevfs not installed...installing now...h...the OOo splash appears now (instead of an error as with say a dia file) but the openoffice window doesn't...looks like some investigating to do...thanks Jeff much appreciated. That's the last 2 outstanding problems with my system almost fixed - first was printing from Mozilla apps (kept crashing the app), second and last is this opening docs in nautilus which is almost fixed - well progress being made anyway :) In looking at synaptic, I also noticed that OOo 1.9 is there :) will have to install and try itbeen looking forward to that for awhile. Coming soon in Ubuntu - support for interesting mount options in pmount, letting your users mount and unmount things like nfs, smb, FUSE and crypted filesystems without root, but with strong policy (the p in pmount). Nice! Ahh, very nice indeed. Looking forward to that. That would certainly resolve the problem (I would think anyway). pmount is love. :-) :D BTW, kudos on ubuntu. Multimedia setup still needs a little bit of work if it is to be used mainstream - but that is probably a linux thing generally. Yeah, there are a lot of legal issues to sort out there, which restrict us from doing this stuff *and* making sure it's 100% Open Source. Actually, that's one of the things I like about Ubuntu (not saying other distros aren't though) - the effort to make 100% Open Source. Much appreciated. It's not quite easy enough to use with all applications (eg skype and xmms together out of the box don't seem to play ball well without a fair amount of fiddling). I guess in part that's the applications problem. Yeah, this is an ugly fix the whole Linux audio stack problem. We're working on it. ;-) Indeed that was my conclusion after I managed to setup multimedia on warty and then configure dual sound cards the way I wanted. Most definitely not a pleasing end-user experience, although in some sick twisted way I enjoyed it and learnt somewhat about the linux audio stack in the process. In any case, there was definitely improvement from warty to hoary in that area. Again, appreciate the work of the whole ubuntu teamgreat job. Fil -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Re: Smb Client GUI
On Tuesday 30 August 2005 10:00, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I know nautilus allows this sort of thing, Not sure what underlying distro you're using with LTSP, but if it's a gnome distro then this _may_ be of use. I'm old I'm a command line junkie (I love vi) I setup a linux box, in leau of winders, for a mate, then had to learn a file manager to show him, now have him agreeing that konqueror is nicer than win-explorer. SuSE's subfs (auto mount) and konqueror's view profiles have proven an absolute success with my install. An hour learning the ropes pays huge dividends No stability problems in 18 months of use, heck I even use it as the easiest way of sorting/deleting my 100s of PDFs James -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Simple website CMS?
Hi everyone! I'm looking to setup a very basic CMS for my sister's website. It only needs to be quite simple with the following capabilities: * A blog where she can put up her latest news * Static HTML pages * The ability to create new pages from templates where she can supply the text and pictures to fill in the template * All done server side so she can do updates from any browser. * MySQL DB and PHP (+ static HTML) I'm looking at WordPress as it seems to be the closest to what I need. Does anyone have any suggestions for this style of site or feedback on using WordPress? Most of the CMS's seem to be overpowered, they mostly seem to be based around community sites with forums etc that she just doesn't need. Thanks for any suggestions. -- Simon Wong [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Simple website CMS?
quote who=Simon Wong I'm looking to setup a very basic CMS for my sister's website. I'd recommend Drupal for something simple and easy to use. It only needs to be quite simple with the following capabilities: * A blog where she can put up her latest news * Static HTML pages * The ability to create new pages from templates where she can supply the text and pictures to fill in the template I think that's the only item that Drupal won't satisfy, but there may be a module to help with it. * All done server side so she can do updates from any browser. * MySQL DB and PHP (+ static HTML) I'm looking at WordPress as it seems to be the closest to what I need. You're probably best off trying something that isn't blog-centric. - Jeff -- linux.conf.au 2006: Dunedin, New Zealand http://linux.conf.au/ Debian is not as minor as many business end people think. - Alan Cox -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Simple website CMS?
No suggestion per se, just two useful websites.. cmsmatrix.org has details about a whole lot of CMSes, including a feature that allows you to choose the features you want and see what CMSes match. They're not all free though, so make sure you specify a cost that's appropriate (ie, probably $0) opensourcecms.com goes one step further and has demo installs of a whole bunch of CMSes for you to try out. You (or your sister) can have a play and see what you're comfortable with. On 8/30/05, Simon Wong [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi everyone! I'm looking to setup a very basic CMS for my sister's website. It only needs to be quite simple with the following capabilities: * A blog where she can put up her latest news * Static HTML pages * The ability to create new pages from templates where she can supply the text and pictures to fill in the template * All done server side so she can do updates from any browser. * MySQL DB and PHP (+ static HTML) I'm looking at WordPress as it seems to be the closest to what I need. Does anyone have any suggestions for this style of site or feedback on using WordPress? Most of the CMS's seem to be overpowered, they mostly seem to be based around community sites with forums etc that she just doesn't need. Thanks for any suggestions. -- Simon Wong [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html -- There is nothing more worthy of contempt than a man who quotes himself - Zhasper, 2005 -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
