[SLUG] Fwd: UPDATED: July SLUG meeting - Friday July 31, 2009
CCing lists I missed first time round. -- Forwarded message -- From: James Polley v...@slug.org.au Date: Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 2:19 PM Subject: UPDATED: July SLUG meeting - Friday July 31, 2009 To: annou...@slug.org.au Updated to include details of the Technical Talk. If you think you might come, please visit http://anyvite.com/ewaqa64bwu and sign up. == July SLUG Monthly Meeting == You can read the full version of this announcement at http://slug.org.au/node/116. When: 18.00 - 21.30, Friday, 31 July, 2009 We start at 18.30 but we ask that people arrive 15 minutes early so we can all get into the building and start on time. Please do not arrive before 18.00, as it may hinder business activities for our host! Appropriate signage and directions will be posted on the building. Where: Our venue for this meeting is Google, Level 5, 48 Pirrama Road, Pyrmont. It's across the road from Star City Casino. A map of the area can be found here[1], and public transit directions are at [2]. Appropriate signage and directions will be posted around the building. You will need to sign-in to enter the venue. This can be performed when you arrive, but to save time we recommend that you do so online beforehand at Anyvite[3]. If you are unsure, please sign up as a 'maybe'. This allows us to organise adequate meeting space and facilities. You do not need to create an account to indicate your attendance. General Talk Tom Worthington: Learning to lower costs and carbon emissions with ICT Tom designed the first globally accredited course on Green ICT and has been teaching it via the web since January 2009. The talk will discuss how ICT can be used to reduce greenhouse gas emissions 15% by 2020. Also outlined is how to use the web for running formal, university accredited courses using free open source software with open access content delivered to smartphones. The Istanbul public transport system also gets a mention. ;-) See Tom's Web site[4] for more information. Tom runs green IT courses at ANU and ACS. You can read the free open access version here. In-Depth Talk: Rob Collins: Massively parallel testing via Subunit Subunit [https://launchpad.net/subunit] is a streaming protocol for test results. I used it in bzr to parallelise the test suite and make effective use of multi-core machines (something python isn'tintrinsically good at), and to run tests in a massively parallel way via amazon ec2. Subunit is likely to be useful for anyone doing nontrivial automated testing, particularly when distributing or otherwise running the testsin a noninteractive fashion. SLUGlets General discussion and QA about Linux, free software and open source. Meeting Schedule See here[6] for an explanation of the segments. * 18.15: Open Doors * 18.30: Announcements, News, Introductions * 18.45: General Talk * 19.30: Intermission * 19.45: Split into two groups for: o In-Depth Talk o SLUGlets * 20.30: Dinner Dinner this month will be held locally, Details will be announced on the night. We will be taking numbers at the beginning of the meeting. If you have any particular dietary requirements (e.g. vegetarian), let us know beforehand. Dinner is a great way to socialise and learn in a relaxed atmosphere :) We hope to see you there! [1] http://tinyurl.com/ParkingPyrmont [2] http://wiki.slug.org.au/howtogetthere [3] http://anyvite.com/ewaqa64bwu [4] http://www.tomw.net.au/technology/it/green_it_social_networking/ [5] http://tomw.net.au/moodle/course/view.php?id=11 [6] http://www.slug.org.au/meetings/meetingformat -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Kogan Agora Netbooks
Just got my Agora Pro today. Putting on Ubuntu NBR as per: http://agoranetbook.kayno.net/2009/04/25/installing-ubuntu-over-netboot/ be sure to read comments on blog / click next at top to get touchpad and wifi working. 2009/7/23 Dean Hamstead d...@fragfest.com.au: How does battery life fare? From reports I've read the battery life on the pro (6 cell) is really, really good. The stats I saw were 3:17 under heavy load (HD movie playing full screen max brightness). I would assume using 3G or other wireless would have a significant impact. Ben Dean Terry Dawson wrote: Marghanita da Cruz wrote: Any thoughts on these? Powering the Kogan Agora Netbook is gOS, a very aesthetically pleasing, powerful, intuitive, and fast operating system. Combined with the power and great value of our hardware, it brings you one step closer to cloud computing. gOS facilitates easy access to a number of Google™ services as well as a host of easy to use, powerful open source programs. http://www.kogan.com.au/shop/kogan-agora-netbook/ http://www.kogan.com.au/shop/kogan-agora-netbook-pro/ Marghanita, I realise you posted this message quite a while ago now, but I've recently purchased four of the Agora Pro Netbooks and if you're still considering purchase I thought you might be interested in my comments. In summary I'm really very happy with them. They're surprisingly solidly built for a machine of their class. They feel well-built with no flimsiness and I suspect you'd have to try pretty hard to do any real physical damage to them. The operating system has been well localised for Australia and is Ubuntu 8.04 based. The 8.04 is a little out of date, but the update process is obvious and works as expected. It was almost disappointing to discover that I didn't need/want to do much after creating my login account to customise it; the setup is quite sensible. All I ended up doing was disabling the Google gadgets on the desktop because they're not to my taste and installing a few application package that I like to use. I find the keyboard quite comfortable to use, with the possible exception of the '/' key being a little awkward to get to from some angles. The touchpad works well, but again, from some angles I find that my thumbs sometime accidentally stray onto it while I'm typing. I'm sure both of these problems will dissipate with time as I become more familiar with it. Wireless/sound work as expected. Bluetooth, as you will know, manifests as a small USB dongle which I haven't yet tried, but suspect will work just fine. The screen is quite pretty, with default fonts small but readable even for someone rapidly turning middle-aged and both short and far-sighted :) Happy to field any particular questions you (or others) might have. regards Terry -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Kogan Agora Netbooks
Thanks Terry, The research was prompted by a friend, who has since decided to check out the offerings on the streets of Beijing, before deciding. However, I would like to know what ports are available and whether Wifi is built in (as is the case with eeePC). Though, I don't expect firewire - which my current laptop meets. I have also heard reports about issues with the fan. Have you used an external DVD/CD burner or other external storage? I assume it has no problems with USB drives/cameras/phones? By the way, I have just bought a new motorolla U9 and was pleasantly surprised at the plug and charge/play USB power/data functionality. http://www.ramin.com.au/linux/motorolla-u9.shtml Marghanita Terry Dawson wrote: Marghanita da Cruz wrote: Any thoughts on these? Powering the Kogan Agora Netbook is gOS, a very aesthetically pleasing, powerful, intuitive, and fast operating system. Combined with the power and great value of our hardware, it brings you one step closer to cloud computing. gOS facilitates easy access to a number of Google? services as well as a host of easy to use, powerful open source programs. http://www.kogan.com.au/shop/kogan-agora-netbook/ http://www.kogan.com.au/shop/kogan-agora-netbook-pro/ Marghanita, I realise you posted this message quite a while ago now, but I've recently purchased four of the Agora Pro Netbooks and if you're still considering purchase I thought you might be interested in my comments. In summary I'm really very happy with them. They're surprisingly solidly built for a machine of their class. They feel well-built with no flimsiness and I suspect you'd have to try pretty hard to do any real physical damage to them. The operating system has been well localised for Australia and is Ubuntu 8.04 based. The 8.04 is a little out of date, but the update process is obvious and works as expected. It was almost disappointing to discover that I didn't need/want to do much after creating my login account to customise it; the setup is quite sensible. All I ended up doing was disabling the Google gadgets on the desktop because they're not to my taste and installing a few application package that I like to use. I find the keyboard quite comfortable to use, with the possible exception of the '/' key being a little awkward to get to from some angles. The touchpad works well, but again, from some angles I find that my thumbs sometime accidentally stray onto it while I'm typing. I'm sure both of these problems will dissipate with time as I become more familiar with it. Wireless/sound work as expected. Bluetooth, as you will know, manifests as a small USB dongle which I haven't yet tried, but suspect will work just fine. The screen is quite pretty, with default fonts small but readable even for someone rapidly turning middle-aged and both short and far-sighted :) Happy to field any particular questions you (or others) might have. regards Terry -- Marghanita da Cruz http://www.ramin.com.au Phone: (+61)0414 869202 -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Old SOLTEK motherboard
to all, I have a SOLTEK motherboard that is giving problems. I have spent 3 hours running memtest and it gives a clean bill of health. This means that the CPU is OK and the MEMORY is OK I have run SEATOOLS on any hard disks that I will use in the system. This gives a clean bill of health also. Again, showing cpu,memory now HDD ok So... memory ok, ..cpu.. ok.. hard drives.. ok, and the ide controllers are ok. Now try to install any distro and the system crashes. The KB led flask. OR the livd CD boots or not, but if so, then all can be fine until mounting partitions. I then get unable to mount UUID. I can use fdisk or gparted or MCC to create partition with no problems.Then use mkfs.ext* to format the Drives/Partitions. The only trouble is mounting them, but not all partitions have the problem.At this point it is difficult to be precise. Any partition may mount or not and having tried to mount give the UUID problem. Further.. the problems are still there if a new IDE drive is used or if the drive is mounted USB Any ideas on what is going on. Gerald -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Twin Screen nVidia, second screen always asleep Solution
To anyone curious about the outcome of this. It turns out that it was a faulty DVI splitter cable. There must be a broken pin or wire inside the cable as it worked just enough to allow the software to detect the screen correctly but not enough to display the video signal. Thanks for the input though, as it set me on the path to the solution. Pete -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Old SOLTEK motherboard--update
to all, I have a SOLTEK motherboard that is giving problems. I have spent 3 hours running memtest and it gives a clean bill of health. This means that the CPU is OK and the MEMORY is OK I have run SEATOOLS on any hard disks that I will use in the system. This gives a clean bill of health also. Again, showing cpu,memory now HDD ok I have also run 'DBAN' on the drives and this also finds no problems. So... memory ok, ..cpu.. ok.. hard drives.. ok, and the ide controllers are ok. Now try to install any distro and the system crashes. The KB leds flash. OR the livd CD boots or not, but if so, then all can be fine until mounting partitions. I then get unable to mount UUID. I can use fdisk or gparted or MCC to create partition with no problems.Then use mkfs.ext* to format the Drives/Partitions. The only trouble is mounting them, but not all partitions have the problem.At this point it is difficult to be precise. Any partition may mount or not and having tried to mount give the UUID problem. Further.. the problems are still there if a new IDE drive is used or if the drive is mounted USB Any ideas on what is going on. Gerald -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Old SOLTEK motherboard--update
On 27/07/09 17:34, Gerald wrote: to all, I have a SOLTEK motherboard that is giving problems. I have spent 3 hours running memtest and it gives a clean bill of health. This means that the CPU is OK and the MEMORY is OK I have run SEATOOLS on any hard disks that I will use in the system. This gives a clean bill of health also. Again, showing cpu,memory now HDD ok I have also run 'DBAN' on the drives and this also finds no problems. So... memory ok, ..cpu.. ok.. hard drives.. ok, and the ide controllers are ok. Now try to install any distro and the system crashes. The KB leds flash. OR the livd CD boots or not, but if so, then all can be fine until mounting partitions. I then get unable to mount UUID. I can use fdisk or gparted or MCC to create partition with no problems.Then use mkfs.ext* to format the Drives/Partitions. The only trouble is mounting them, but not all partitions have the problem.At this point it is difficult to be precise. Any partition may mount or not and having tried to mount give the UUID problem. Further.. the problems are still there if a new IDE drive is used or if the drive is mounted USB Any ideas on what is going on. Gerald memtest doesn't test the CPU that much actually. If the power supply caps (particularly those on the MBO close to the cpu) are toast then any sudden CPU intensive spurt (especially if combined with disk activity) can cause it to crash. I've seen this multiple times with other machines, if you get intermittent booting/random weird lockups check the system power supply, and the motherboard caps. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] can I make this recursive?
I have a n000b question. I found a neat housework script to change case space but I'm wondering is it possible to run it recursively? If so where do I put the -r in it? #!/bin/bash for f in *; do file=$(echo $f | tr A-Z a-z | tr ' ' _) [ ! -f $file ] mv $f $file done cheers, Meryl -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] can I make this recursive?
I have a n000b question. I found a neat housework script to change case space but I'm wondering is it possible to run it recursively? If so where do I put the -r in it? #!/bin/bash for f in *; do file=$(echo $f | tr A-Z a-z | tr ' ' _) [ ! -f $file ] mv $f $file done cheers, Meryl Sorry - ignore my suggestion - it is broken, as it would also capitalise the path to the file. I must still be half asleep :) -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] can I make this recursive?
I have a n000b question. I found a neat housework script to change case space but I'm wondering is it possible to run it recursively? If so where do I put the -r in it? #!/bin/bash for f in *; do file=$(echo $f | tr A-Z a-z | tr ' ' _) [ ! -f $file ] mv $f $file done cheers, Meryl Hi Meryl, Change for f in *; do to be find . -type f ; do This will recursively find all files from the current directory down. Cheers, Ben -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Kogan Agora Netbooks
On Mon, July 27, 2009 9:56 am, Marghanita da Cruz wrote: By the way, I have just bought a new motorolla U9 and was pleasantly surprised at the plug and charge/play USB power/data functionality. http://www.ramin.com.au/linux/motorolla-u9.shtml Marghanita, fwiw, AFAIK, Motorola has been using USB power data for a while, if not longer, my last Motorola phone had miniUSB power/data, my 'new' Motorola has microUSB. USB port on phone body is one my pre-reqs for a phone can the camera on U9 focus? -- Voytek -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] can I make this recursive?
Meryl gnu...@aromagardens.com.au writes:
I have a n000b question. I found a neat housework script to change case
space but I'm wondering is it possible to run it recursively? If so where
do I put the -r in it?
#!/bin/bash
for f in *; do
file=$(echo $f | tr A-Z a-z | tr ' ' _)
[ ! -f $file ] mv $f $file
done
Personally, I would consider using rename(1) that came with Perl for this, but
you could write a shell script to do the same thing...
find . -type f -print0 | xargs -0 rename \
'my @name = split qr{/};
$name[-1] =~ y/A-Z /a-z_/;
$_ = join(/, @name);'
rename uses an arbitrary Perl expression to mangle $_, which is the input
filename, and the output value is the name to rename it to.
Alternately, in shell, you can do the same, but harder:
find . -type f | while read file; do
dir=$(dirname $file)
name=$(basename $file | tr 'A-Z ' 'a-z_')
test x$file = x$dir/$name || mv $file $dir/$name
done
Regards,
Daniel
--
✣ Daniel Pittman✉ dan...@rimspace.net☎ +61 401 155 707
♽ made with 100 percent post-consumer electrons
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Re: [SLUG] can I make this recursive?
2009/7/28 Ben Stringer b...@burbong.com:
I have a n000b question.
I found a neat housework script to change case space but
I'm wondering is it possible to run it recursively?
If so where do I put the -r in it?
#!/bin/bash
for f in *; do
file=$(echo $f | tr A-Z a-z | tr ' ' _)
[ ! -f $file ] mv $f $file
done
cheers,
Meryl
Hi Meryl,
Change for f in *; do to be find . -type f ; do
This will recursively find all files from the current directory down.
If you're going to do that then you will probably want to also use
'basename' and 'dirname'.
#!/bin/bash
find . -type f -exec sh -c '
file=$(basename {} | tr A-Z a-z | tr _)
[ ! -f $file ] echo OLD:{} NEW:$(dirname {})/$file
' \;
Edit to 'mv' when you're sure that it works...
cheers,
Owen.
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Motorolla U9 was Re: [SLUG] Kogan Agora Netbooks
Voytek Eymont wrote: On Mon, July 27, 2009 9:56 am, Marghanita da Cruz wrote: By the way, I have just bought a new motorolla U9 and was pleasantly surprised at the plug and charge/play USB power/data functionality. http://www.ramin.com.au/linux/motorolla-u9.shtml Marghanita, fwiw, AFAIK, Motorola has been using USB power data for a while, if not longer, my last Motorola phone had miniUSB power/data, my 'new' Motorola has microUSB. USB port on phone body is one my pre-reqs for a phone can the camera on U9 focus? It isn't just USB data - it pops up on the desktop as a USB disk drive! Whereas, my 4 year old Canon Camcorder/still camera required the use of PTP Cam software to access the photos. What is curious is the U9 comes with a windows software disk! But it was just plug and play on my old Targa Laptop still running Knoppix 5.1. The Motorola U9 has a microUSB socket.which was slightly different to the one on the MVP player (also discussed at above link). It is worth noting that the chinese government has mandated USB power...and the europeans have also done so, with a slight variation see http://www.tomw.net.au/blog/2009/07/micro-usb-standard-for-mobile-phone.html In bright light the photos are good, though it can be hard to see the screen. The photo, of paddy's market, at the page above was the first one I ever took with the camera. It also has upto 8x zoom and a few other camera functions which I haven't checked out yet. It is a 2Megapixel camera. If you would like to compare quality (assuming all photographers are equal) see the photos here ( bear in mind these were all done with hand held cameras (no tripod) so, some of the fuzzyness comes from the photographer and for the close ups the breeze also makes the subject move): * Viki Alonso photos were taken with a SLR *My July 2009 Photos were taken with my U9 (no zoom) *Other photos on the page, were taken with my 5 year old Cannon camcorder/camera http://www.ramin.com.au/annandale/veg-acacia-pods.shtml I'm pretty happy with the correa reflexa here: http://www.ramin.com.au/annandale/veg-purple-flowers.shtml Marghanita -- Marghanita da Cruz http://www.ramin.com.au Phone: (+61)0414 869202 -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Kogan Agora (non-pro) Netbooks discounted again, was: Kogan Agora Netbooks
I just received an email from kogan advising that their non-Pro Agora is now $399, which is a much more attractive price compared to their Pro. regards Terry -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Kogan Agora (non-pro) Netbooks discounted again, was: Kogan Agora Netbooks
only difference is 1/2 the battery (3 cell rather than 6) and 1/2 the ram (1 rather than 2 gig) amazing how much some battery acid and ram can add to the price Dean On 7/28/2009, Terry Dawson t...@animats.net wrote: I just received an email from kogan advising that their non-Pro Agora is now $399, which is a much more attractive price compared to their Pro. regards Terry -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Kogan Agora (non-pro) Netbooks discounted again, was: Kogan Agora Netbooks
Dean Hamstead wrote: only difference is 1/2 the battery (3 cell rather than 6) and 1/2 the ram (1 rather than 2 gig) amazing how much some battery acid and ram can add to the price Thanks for pointing out the difference. For $140 more the pro (listed at $539) seems good value. To date, I've been ambivalent about battery life as my laptops have outlived the batteries. But in the case of a netbook, I would suggest it is pretty important. Though it probably also adds to the weight. With regard to RAM, this has always been expensive and I have generally bought and recommend an upgrade to what the standard machine comes with. Marghanita Dean On 7/28/2009, Terry Dawson t...@animats.net wrote: I just received an email from kogan advising that their non-Pro Agora is now $399, which is a much more attractive price compared to their Pro. regards Terry -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html -- Marghanita da Cruz http://www.ramin.com.au Phone: (+61)0414 869202 -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] can I make this recursive?
On Tuesday 28 July 2009 05:59:39 slug-requ...@slug.org.au wrote: I have a n000b question. I found a neat housework script to change case space but I'm wondering is it possible to run it recursively? If so where do I put the -r in it? #!/bin/bash for f in *; do file=$(echo $f | tr A-Z a-z | tr ' ' _) [ ! -f $file ] mv $f $file done cheers, Meryl Sorry - ignore my suggestion - it is broken, as it would also capitalise the path to the file. I must still be half asleep :) A whole swag of this sort of thing comes to mind: for f in `find . -type f` do ... done James -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Old SOLTEK motherboard--update
Jake Anderson wrote: On 27/07/09 17:34, Gerald wrote: to all, I have a SOLTEK motherboard that is giving problems. I have spent 3 hours running memtest and it gives a clean bill of health. This means that the CPU is OK and the MEMORY is OK I have run SEATOOLS on any hard disks that I will use in the system. This gives a clean bill of health also. Again, showing cpu,memory now HDD ok I have also run 'DBAN' on the drives and this also finds no problems. So... memory ok, ..cpu.. ok.. hard drives.. ok, and the ide controllers are ok. Now try to install any distro and the system crashes. The KB leds flash. OR the livd CD boots or not, but if so, then all can be fine until mounting partitions. I then get unable to mount UUID. I can use fdisk or gparted or MCC to create partition with no problems.Then use mkfs.ext* to format the Drives/Partitions. The only trouble is mounting them, but not all partitions have the problem.At this point it is difficult to be precise. Any partition may mount or not and having tried to mount give the UUID problem. Further.. the problems are still there if a new IDE drive is used or if the drive is mounted USB Any ideas on what is going on. Gerald memtest doesn't test the CPU that much actually. If the power supply caps (particularly those on the MBO close to the cpu) are toast then any sudden CPU intensive spurt (especially if combined with disk activity) can cause it to crash. I've seen this multiple times with other machines, if you get intermittent booting/random weird lockups check the system power supply, and the motherboard caps. I second this advise. I have seen a number of unstable, older Soltek motherboards, with capacitors that have 'bulged' or 'bled' indicating failure of those caps. Have a good look at your motherboard capacitors. D. -- Never ascribe to malice that which may adequately be explained by incompetence. - Napoleon Bonaparte -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] can I make this recursive?
Thank You Ben, Owen, Daniel and James for your responses :D For some reason (unbeknown to this wee brain) the perl script chucked a wobbly: syntax error at line 4, near 0 rename So I opted for Daniel's shell script instead. I'm not sure what you meant by 'harder' Daniel in Alternately, in shell, you can do the same, but harder: the script worked nicely and I'm v pleased with the result. thanks again everyone for all your help cheers, Meryl -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
