Re: [External] Re: Does a remote free standing FDC require a valve pit?
Tom - you stated "What happened to the balanced supplies? FDC's must equal tank or city in capacity. One inlet for every 250 demand. Stuff went south, maybe southwest" Can you clarify what you meant? Is this about sprinkler or standpipe FDCs? Once I have some more information, I will respond. Thanks, John John August Denhardt, PE *Vice President, Engineering and Technical Services* *American Fire Sprinkler Association* m: p: 301-343-1457 214-349-5965 ext 121 w: firesprinkler.org <https://www.facebook.com/firesprinkler.org/> <https://twitter.com/afsa/status/1039528345367732224> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/american-fire-sprinkler-association-afsa-/> <https://www.instagram.com/firesprinklerorg/> *Our members are at the heart of everything we do* *Expand your business with ITM* Professionalize the role of your inspection team with AFSA’s ITM Inspector Development Program. This comprehensive 20-month program provides a blended learning environment teamed with robust curriculum created by top industry leaders. Plus, the first six-months of instruction is online. Now enrolling for Spring 2021 <https://www.firesprinkler.org/itm>. On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 9:07 PM Tom Duross via Sprinklerforum < sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org> wrote: > 150 should be the base for non high-rise FDC's unless placarded for higher > required pressures. Then maybe 50 over? > I give many FDC's a pass, just me, when they leak, and a lot do. If > they're fitted with plastic or aluminum covers, and changed to plugs, some > hold but many don't. I get a hold of 30 minutes before leaking back BUT > how many of these leak during 5 year tests? A lot. If I can attribute the > leakage to the swivel, and only the swivel, OK, you pass. Keep in mind > many buy cheap chinese tin hats for supplying their systems and they don't > hold anything. Even some of the flush style are cheap junk. Once the > covers are removed, the swivels being put against pressure (some for the > first time) from an aluminum or brass plug, all you have is the gasket. > Even replaced, some don't hold. Getting back, yes to the pit. Who's going > to bring a shovel and dig up a checkvalve? Bueller? > What happened to the balanced supplies? FDC's must equal tank or city in > capacity. One inlet for every 250 demand. Stuff went south, maybe > southwest. > > -Original Message- > From: Sprinklerforum On > Behalf Of John Denhardt via Sprinklerforum > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:11 AM > To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > Cc: John Denhardt > Subject: Re: [External] Re: Does a remote free standing FDC require a > valve pit? > > Once NFPA 25 2022 edition is finalized, I would expect new/revised > language for hydrostatic testing criteria of fire department connections > for ITM. > > NFPA 13 - requires the fire department connection pass a hydrostatic > test. 200 PSI minimum with no drop in pressure or no visible leakage. > > NFPA 13 -2019 edition states: > > 28.2.1.7 Piping between exterior fire department connection and the check > valve in the fire department inlet pipe shall be hydrostatically tested in > the same manner as the balance of > > the system. After repair or replacement work affecting the fire department > connection, the piping between the exterior and > > the check valve in the fire department inlet pipe shall be isolated and > hydrostatically tested at 150 psi (10 bar). > > *The above is my opinion and has not been processed as a formal > interpretation in accordance with the NFPA Regulations Governing Committee > Projects. This is provided with the understanding that the AFSA assumes no > liability for this opinion or actions taken on it and they are not to be > considered the official position of the **AFSA, and/or NFPA or its > technical committees.**AFSA cannot provide design or consulting engineering > services, and this opinion should therefore not be considered, nor relied > upon, as such.* > > Thanks, > John > > John August Denhardt, PE > *Vice President, Engineering and Technical Services* > > *American Fire Sprinkler Association* > m: p: 301-343-1457 > 214-349-5965 ext 121 > w: firesprinkler.org > <https://www.facebook.com/firesprinkler.org/> > <https://twitter.com/afsa/status/1039528345367732224> > < > https://www.linkedin.com/company/american-fire-sprinkler-association-afsa-/ > > ><https://www.instagram.com/firesprinklerorg/> > > *Our members are at the heart of everything we do* > > > *Expand your business with ITM* > Professionalize the role of your inspection team with AFSA’s ITM Inspector > Development Program. This comprehensive 20-month program provides a blended >
RE: [External] Re: Does a remote free standing FDC require a valve pit?
They leak. External corrosion to the piping that penetrates the exterior wall. What this fine gentleman said is so true. Byron Undisclosed Location, US Army Facility, South Pacific Sent from Mail<https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for Windows 10 From: Tom Duross via Sprinklerforum<mailto:sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 2:07 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org<mailto:sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org> Cc: Tom Duross<mailto:tduro...@comcast.net> Subject: RE: [External] Re: Does a remote free standing FDC require a valve pit? 150 should be the base for non high-rise FDC's unless placarded for higher required pressures. Then maybe 50 over? I give many FDC's a pass, just me, when they leak, and a lot do. If they're fitted with plastic or aluminum covers, and changed to plugs, some hold but many don't. I get a hold of 30 minutes before leaking back BUT how many of these leak during 5 year tests? A lot. If I can attribute the leakage to the swivel, and only the swivel, OK, you pass. Keep in mind many buy cheap chinese tin hats for supplying their systems and they don't hold anything. Even some of the flush style are cheap junk. Once the covers are removed, the swivels being put against pressure (some for the first time) from an aluminum or brass plug, all you have is the gasket. Even replaced, some don't hold. Getting back, yes to the pit. Who's going to bring a shovel and dig up a checkvalve? Bueller? What happened to the balanced supplies? FDC's must equal tank or city in capacity. One inlet for every 250 demand. Stuff went south, maybe southwest. -Original Message- From: Sprinklerforum On Behalf Of John Denhardt via Sprinklerforum Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:11 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Cc: John Denhardt Subject: Re: [External] Re: Does a remote free standing FDC require a valve pit? Once NFPA 25 2022 edition is finalized, I would expect new/revised language for hydrostatic testing criteria of fire department connections for ITM. NFPA 13 - requires the fire department connection pass a hydrostatic test. 200 PSI minimum with no drop in pressure or no visible leakage. NFPA 13 -2019 edition states: 28.2.1.7 Piping between exterior fire department connection and the check valve in the fire department inlet pipe shall be hydrostatically tested in the same manner as the balance of the system. After repair or replacement work affecting the fire department connection, the piping between the exterior and the check valve in the fire department inlet pipe shall be isolated and hydrostatically tested at 150 psi (10 bar). *The above is my opinion and has not been processed as a formal interpretation in accordance with the NFPA Regulations Governing Committee Projects. This is provided with the understanding that the AFSA assumes no liability for this opinion or actions taken on it and they are not to be considered the official position of the **AFSA, and/or NFPA or its technical committees.**AFSA cannot provide design or consulting engineering services, and this opinion should therefore not be considered, nor relied upon, as such.* Thanks, John John August Denhardt, PE *Vice President, Engineering and Technical Services* *American Fire Sprinkler Association* m: p: 301-343-1457 214-349-5965 ext 121 w: firesprinkler.org <https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.facebook.com%2Ffiresprinkler.org%2Fdata=04%7C01%7C%7C21a9c3e782e34a6e5ae908d8e4fb98a9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C63756531091636%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000sdata=cNia%2FkMDwV9lRbpl3eOSJgvXeK8jAekqm9BCHPdI58E%3Dreserved=0> <https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2Fafsa%2Fstatus%2F1039528345367732224data=04%7C01%7C%7C21a9c3e782e34a6e5ae908d8e4fb98a9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C63756531091636%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000sdata=DUPRT5nNc6fbWroxMChgEs17auUx5n47wAn1WBl6QPk%3Dreserved=0> <https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.linkedin.com%2Fcompany%2Famerican-fire-sprinkler-association-afsa-%2Fdata=04%7C01%7C%7C21a9c3e782e34a6e5ae908d8e4fb98a9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C63756531101634%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000sdata=mwHeC09mQ1MIw1pI%2BEB9eHgpl1x6mtjNMqQvjgML0r0%3Dreserved=0> <https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.instagram.com%2Ffiresprinklerorg%2Fdata=04%7C01%7C%7C21a9c3e782e34a6e5ae908d8e4fb98a9%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C63756531101634%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJ
RE: [External] Re: Does a remote free standing FDC require a valve pit?
150 should be the base for non high-rise FDC's unless placarded for higher required pressures. Then maybe 50 over? I give many FDC's a pass, just me, when they leak, and a lot do. If they're fitted with plastic or aluminum covers, and changed to plugs, some hold but many don't. I get a hold of 30 minutes before leaking back BUT how many of these leak during 5 year tests? A lot. If I can attribute the leakage to the swivel, and only the swivel, OK, you pass. Keep in mind many buy cheap chinese tin hats for supplying their systems and they don't hold anything. Even some of the flush style are cheap junk. Once the covers are removed, the swivels being put against pressure (some for the first time) from an aluminum or brass plug, all you have is the gasket. Even replaced, some don't hold. Getting back, yes to the pit. Who's going to bring a shovel and dig up a checkvalve? Bueller? What happened to the balanced supplies? FDC's must equal tank or city in capacity. One inlet for every 250 demand. Stuff went south, maybe southwest. -Original Message- From: Sprinklerforum On Behalf Of John Denhardt via Sprinklerforum Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:11 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Cc: John Denhardt Subject: Re: [External] Re: Does a remote free standing FDC require a valve pit? Once NFPA 25 2022 edition is finalized, I would expect new/revised language for hydrostatic testing criteria of fire department connections for ITM. NFPA 13 - requires the fire department connection pass a hydrostatic test. 200 PSI minimum with no drop in pressure or no visible leakage. NFPA 13 -2019 edition states: 28.2.1.7 Piping between exterior fire department connection and the check valve in the fire department inlet pipe shall be hydrostatically tested in the same manner as the balance of the system. After repair or replacement work affecting the fire department connection, the piping between the exterior and the check valve in the fire department inlet pipe shall be isolated and hydrostatically tested at 150 psi (10 bar). *The above is my opinion and has not been processed as a formal interpretation in accordance with the NFPA Regulations Governing Committee Projects. This is provided with the understanding that the AFSA assumes no liability for this opinion or actions taken on it and they are not to be considered the official position of the **AFSA, and/or NFPA or its technical committees.**AFSA cannot provide design or consulting engineering services, and this opinion should therefore not be considered, nor relied upon, as such.* Thanks, John John August Denhardt, PE *Vice President, Engineering and Technical Services* *American Fire Sprinkler Association* m: p: 301-343-1457 214-349-5965 ext 121 w: firesprinkler.org <https://www.facebook.com/firesprinkler.org/> <https://twitter.com/afsa/status/1039528345367732224> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/american-fire-sprinkler-association-afsa-/> <https://www.instagram.com/firesprinklerorg/> *Our members are at the heart of everything we do* *Expand your business with ITM* Professionalize the role of your inspection team with AFSA’s ITM Inspector Development Program. This comprehensive 20-month program provides a blended learning environment teamed with robust curriculum created by top industry leaders. Plus, the first six-months of instruction is online. Now enrolling for Spring 2021 <https://www.firesprinkler.org/itm>. On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 10:57 AM Mitchell, Scott via Sprinklerforum < sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org> wrote: > I can't speak for contractors, but one approach we've taken is to keep > the pressure above the required minimum while visually verifying > absence of physical leakage. In one situation the boundary of the > test section included an existing closed gate valve. Yes, water leaked past > the gate. > We told them to run the test pump as needed to keep the pressure above > the minimum and inspect the work (all visible) to make sure there are no > leaks. > > Applying that approach to what you described - if the ball drip is the > only thing leaking and the test pressure was never allowed to go below > the minimum, I'd say it passed. > > My thoughts, Scott > > -Original Message- > From: Sprinklerforum > On Behalf Of John Denhardt via Sprinklerforum > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 10:36 AM > To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > Cc: John Denhardt > Subject: [External] Re: Does a remote free standing FDC require a > valve pit? > > I would like to know how contractors are passing the required initial > and the periodic NFPA 25 hydrostatic test of the free standing FDC > when an automatic ball drip is installed in the underground piping? > > Thanks, > John > > John August Denhardt, PE > *Vice P
Re: [External] Re: Does a remote free standing FDC require a valve pit?
NFPA 25 has proposed language in the first draft to hydrostatically test the piping from the FDC to the check valve at 150 psi for 2 hours. An acceptable test can lose no more than 5 psi and have no visual signs of leakage. The above is my opinion and has not been processed as a formal interpretation in accordance with the NFPA Regulations Governing Committee Projects. This is provided with the understanding that the AFSA assumes no liability for this opinion or actions taken on it and they are not to be considered the official position of the NFPA or its technical committees. AFSA cannot provide design or consulting engineering services, and this opinion should therefore not be considered, nor relied upon, as such. Kevin Hall, M. Eng, P.E., CWBSP, MSFPE Coordinator, Engineering and Technical Services American Fire Sprinkler Association kh...@firesprinkler.org 214-349-5971 On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 11:11 AM John Denhardt via Sprinklerforum < sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org> wrote: > Once NFPA 25 2022 edition is finalized, I would expect new/revised language > for hydrostatic testing criteria of fire department connections for ITM. > > NFPA 13 - requires the fire department connection pass a hydrostatic > test. 200 PSI minimum with no drop in pressure or no visible leakage. > > NFPA 13 -2019 edition states: > > 28.2.1.7 Piping between exterior fire department connection and the check > valve in the fire department inlet pipe shall be hydrostatically tested in > the same manner as the balance of > > the system. After repair or replacement work affecting the fire department > connection, the piping between the exterior and > > the check valve in the fire department inlet pipe shall be isolated and > hydrostatically tested at 150 psi (10 bar). > > *The above is my opinion and has not been processed as a formal > interpretation in accordance with the NFPA Regulations Governing Committee > Projects. This is provided with the understanding that the AFSA assumes no > liability for this opinion or actions taken on it and they are not to be > considered the official position of the **AFSA, and/or NFPA or its > technical committees.**AFSA cannot provide design or consulting engineering > services, and this opinion should therefore not be considered, nor relied > upon, as such.* > > Thanks, > John > > John August Denhardt, PE > *Vice President, Engineering and Technical Services* > > *American Fire Sprinkler Association* > m: p: 301-343-1457 > 214-349-5965 ext 121 > w: firesprinkler.org > <https://www.facebook.com/firesprinkler.org/> > <https://twitter.com/afsa/status/1039528345367732224> > < > https://www.linkedin.com/company/american-fire-sprinkler-association-afsa-/ > > ><https://www.instagram.com/firesprinklerorg/> > > *Our members are at the heart of everything we do* > > > *Expand your business with ITM* > Professionalize the role of your inspection team with AFSA’s ITM Inspector > Development Program. This comprehensive 20-month program provides a blended > learning environment teamed with robust curriculum created by top industry > leaders. Plus, the first six-months of instruction is online. Now > enrolling for Spring 2021 <https://www.firesprinkler.org/itm>. > > > > > On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 10:57 AM Mitchell, Scott via Sprinklerforum < > sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org> wrote: > > > I can't speak for contractors, but one approach we've taken is to keep > the > > pressure above the required minimum while visually verifying absence of > > physical leakage. In one situation the boundary of the test section > > included an existing closed gate valve. Yes, water leaked past the gate. > > We told them to run the test pump as needed to keep the pressure above > the > > minimum and inspect the work (all visible) to make sure there are no > leaks. > > > > Applying that approach to what you described - if the ball drip is the > > only thing leaking and the test pressure was never allowed to go below > the > > minimum, I'd say it passed. > > > > My thoughts, Scott > > > > -Original Message- > > From: Sprinklerforum On > > Behalf Of John Denhardt via Sprinklerforum > > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 10:36 AM > > To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > > Cc: John Denhardt > > Subject: [External] Re: Does a remote free standing FDC require a valve > > pit? > > > > I would like to know how contractors are passing the required initial and > > the periodic NFPA 25 hydrostatic test of the free standing FDC when an > > automatic ball drip is installed in the underground piping? > > > &
Re: [External] Re: Does a remote free standing FDC require a valve pit?
How can you isolate a check valve in a line that specifically excludes control valves? Todd G Williams, PE Fire Protection Design/Consulting Stonington, CT 860-535-2080 (tel:860-535-2080) (ofc) 860-554-7054 (tel:860-554-7054) (fax) 860-608-4559 (tel:860-608-4559) (cell) > > On Mar 11, 2021 at 11:11 AM, (mailto:sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org)> wrote: > > > > Once NFPA 25 2022 edition is finalized, I would expect new/revised language > for hydrostatic testing criteria of fire department connections for ITM. NFPA > 13 - requires the fire department connection pass a hydrostatic test. 200 PSI > minimum with no drop in pressure or no visible leakage. NFPA 13 -2019 edition > states: 28.2.1.7 Piping between exterior fire department connection and the > check valve in the fire department inlet pipe shall be hydrostatically tested > in the same manner as the balance of the system. After repair or replacement > work affecting the fire department connection, the piping between the > exterior and the check valve in the fire department inlet pipe shall be > isolated and hydrostatically tested at 150 psi (10 bar). *The above is my > opinion and has not been processed as a formal interpretation in accordance > with the NFPA Regulations Governing Committee Projects. This is provided with > the understanding that the AFSA assumes no liability for this opinion or > actions taken on it and they are not to be considered the official position > of the **AFSA, and/or NFPA or its technical committees.**AFSA cannot provide > design or consulting engineering services, and this opinion should therefore > not be considered, nor relied upon, as such.* Thanks, John John August > Denhardt, PE *Vice President, Engineering and Technical Services* *American > Fire Sprinkler Association* m: p: 301-343-1457 (tel:301-343-1457) > 214-349-5965 ext 121 (tel:214-349-5965;121) w: firesprinkler.org > (http://firesprinkler.org) <https://www.facebook.com/firesprinkler.org/> > <https://twitter.com/afsa/status/1039528345367732224> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/american-fire-sprinkler-association-afsa-/> > <https://www.instagram.com/firesprinklerorg/> *Our members are at the > heart of everything we do* *Expand your business with ITM* Professionalize > the role of your inspection team with AFSA’s ITM Inspector Development > Program. This comprehensive 20-month program provides a blended learning > environment teamed with robust curriculum created by top industry leaders. > Plus, the first six-months of instruction is online. Now enrolling for Spring > 2021 <https://www.firesprinkler.org/itm>. On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 10:57 AM > Mitchell, Scott via Sprinklerforum < > sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > (mailto:sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org)> wrote: > I can't speak > for contractors, but one approach we've taken is to keep the > pressure > above the required minimum while visually verifying absence of > physical > leakage. In one situation the boundary of the test section > included an > existing closed gate valve. Yes, water leaked past the gate. > We told them > to run the test pump as needed to keep the pressure above the > minimum and > inspect the work (all visible) to make sure there are no leaks. > > > Applying that approach to what you described - if the ball drip is the > > only thing leaking and the test pressure was never allowed to go below the > > minimum, I'd say it passed. > > My thoughts, Scott > > -Original > Message- > From: Sprinklerforum > (mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org)> On > Behalf Of > John Denhardt via Sprinklerforum > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 10:36 AM > > To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > (mailto:sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org) > Cc: John Denhardt > mailto:jdenha...@firesprinkler.org)> > > Subject: [External] Re: Does a remote free standing FDC require a valve > > pit? > > I would like to know how contractors are passing the required > initial and > the periodic NFPA 25 hydrostatic test of the free standing > FDC when an > automatic ball drip is installed in the underground piping? > > > Thanks, > John > > John August Denhardt, PE > *Vice President, > Engineering and Technical Services* > > *American Fire Sprinkler > Association* > m: p: 301-343-1457 (tel:301-343-1457) > 214-349-5965 > ext 121 (tel:214-349-5965;121) > w: firesprinkler.org > (http://firesprinkler.o
Re: [External] Re: Does a remote free standing FDC require a valve pit?
Once NFPA 25 2022 edition is finalized, I would expect new/revised language for hydrostatic testing criteria of fire department connections for ITM. NFPA 13 - requires the fire department connection pass a hydrostatic test. 200 PSI minimum with no drop in pressure or no visible leakage. NFPA 13 -2019 edition states: 28.2.1.7 Piping between exterior fire department connection and the check valve in the fire department inlet pipe shall be hydrostatically tested in the same manner as the balance of the system. After repair or replacement work affecting the fire department connection, the piping between the exterior and the check valve in the fire department inlet pipe shall be isolated and hydrostatically tested at 150 psi (10 bar). *The above is my opinion and has not been processed as a formal interpretation in accordance with the NFPA Regulations Governing Committee Projects. This is provided with the understanding that the AFSA assumes no liability for this opinion or actions taken on it and they are not to be considered the official position of the **AFSA, and/or NFPA or its technical committees.**AFSA cannot provide design or consulting engineering services, and this opinion should therefore not be considered, nor relied upon, as such.* Thanks, John John August Denhardt, PE *Vice President, Engineering and Technical Services* *American Fire Sprinkler Association* m: p: 301-343-1457 214-349-5965 ext 121 w: firesprinkler.org <https://www.facebook.com/firesprinkler.org/> <https://twitter.com/afsa/status/1039528345367732224> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/american-fire-sprinkler-association-afsa-/> <https://www.instagram.com/firesprinklerorg/> *Our members are at the heart of everything we do* *Expand your business with ITM* Professionalize the role of your inspection team with AFSA’s ITM Inspector Development Program. This comprehensive 20-month program provides a blended learning environment teamed with robust curriculum created by top industry leaders. Plus, the first six-months of instruction is online. Now enrolling for Spring 2021 <https://www.firesprinkler.org/itm>. On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 10:57 AM Mitchell, Scott via Sprinklerforum < sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org> wrote: > I can't speak for contractors, but one approach we've taken is to keep the > pressure above the required minimum while visually verifying absence of > physical leakage. In one situation the boundary of the test section > included an existing closed gate valve. Yes, water leaked past the gate. > We told them to run the test pump as needed to keep the pressure above the > minimum and inspect the work (all visible) to make sure there are no leaks. > > Applying that approach to what you described - if the ball drip is the > only thing leaking and the test pressure was never allowed to go below the > minimum, I'd say it passed. > > My thoughts, Scott > > -Original Message- > From: Sprinklerforum On > Behalf Of John Denhardt via Sprinklerforum > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 10:36 AM > To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > Cc: John Denhardt > Subject: [External] Re: Does a remote free standing FDC require a valve > pit? > > I would like to know how contractors are passing the required initial and > the periodic NFPA 25 hydrostatic test of the free standing FDC when an > automatic ball drip is installed in the underground piping? > > Thanks, > John > > John August Denhardt, PE > *Vice President, Engineering and Technical Services* > > *American Fire Sprinkler Association* > m: p: 301-343-1457 > 214-349-5965 ext 121 > w: firesprinkler.org > <https://www.facebook.com/firesprinkler.org/> > <https://twitter.com/afsa/status/1039528345367732224> > < > https://www.linkedin.com/company/american-fire-sprinkler-association-afsa-/ > > ><https://www.instagram.com/firesprinklerorg/> > > *Our members are at the heart of everything we do* > > > *Expand your business with ITM* > Professionalize the role of your inspection team with AFSA’s ITM Inspector > Development Program. This comprehensive 20-month program provides a blended > learning environment teamed with robust curriculum created by top industry > leaders. Plus, the first six-months of instruction is online. Now enrolling > for Spring 2021 <https://www.firesprinkler.org/itm>. > > > > > On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 10:15 AM Dewayne Martinez via Sprinklerforum < > sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org> wrote: > > > Do you wrap the ball drip in landscaping fabric to keep it from > > getting clogged with sediment? > > > > Thank you, > > > > Dewayne Martinez > > Fire Protection Design Manager > > > > TOTAL Mechanical > > Building Integr
RE: [External] Re: Does a remote free standing FDC require a valve pit?
I can't speak for contractors, but one approach we've taken is to keep the pressure above the required minimum while visually verifying absence of physical leakage. In one situation the boundary of the test section included an existing closed gate valve. Yes, water leaked past the gate. We told them to run the test pump as needed to keep the pressure above the minimum and inspect the work (all visible) to make sure there are no leaks. Applying that approach to what you described - if the ball drip is the only thing leaking and the test pressure was never allowed to go below the minimum, I'd say it passed. My thoughts, Scott -Original Message- From: Sprinklerforum On Behalf Of John Denhardt via Sprinklerforum Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 10:36 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Cc: John Denhardt Subject: [External] Re: Does a remote free standing FDC require a valve pit? I would like to know how contractors are passing the required initial and the periodic NFPA 25 hydrostatic test of the free standing FDC when an automatic ball drip is installed in the underground piping? Thanks, John John August Denhardt, PE *Vice President, Engineering and Technical Services* *American Fire Sprinkler Association* m: p: 301-343-1457 214-349-5965 ext 121 w: firesprinkler.org <https://www.facebook.com/firesprinkler.org/> <https://twitter.com/afsa/status/1039528345367732224> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/american-fire-sprinkler-association-afsa-/> <https://www.instagram.com/firesprinklerorg/> *Our members are at the heart of everything we do* *Expand your business with ITM* Professionalize the role of your inspection team with AFSA’s ITM Inspector Development Program. This comprehensive 20-month program provides a blended learning environment teamed with robust curriculum created by top industry leaders. Plus, the first six-months of instruction is online. Now enrolling for Spring 2021 <https://www.firesprinkler.org/itm>. On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 10:15 AM Dewayne Martinez via Sprinklerforum < sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org> wrote: > Do you wrap the ball drip in landscaping fabric to keep it from > getting clogged with sediment? > > Thank you, > > Dewayne Martinez > Fire Protection Design Manager > > TOTAL Mechanical > Building Integrity > > W234 N2830 Paul Rd. > Pewaukee, WI 53072 > dmarti...@total-mechanical.com > Ph: 262-522-7110 > Cell: 414-406-5208 > http://www.total-mechanical.com/ > > > > -Original Message- > From: Sprinklerforum > On Behalf Of Jamie Seidl via Sprinklerforum > Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 11:27 AM > To: Sprinklerforum > Cc: Jamie Seidl > Subject: Re: Does a remote free standing FDC require a valve pit? > > We've typically installed a ball drip in gravel similar to a french > drain at the low point. > > On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 11:17 AM Dewayne Martinez via Sprinklerforum < > sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org> wrote: > > > I see a trend starting in our area where the architect is specifying > > a remote free standing FDC without a valve pit when the check valve > > can be placed inside the building. Upon talking to my field > > superintendent he was concerned that some check valves let multiple > > gallons of water through whenever a system is drained and refilled > > and that the remote pipe may eventually fill up and freeze. We were > > toying with the idea of installing a return bend in the FDC pipe > > downstream of the check before it leaves the building to help > > prevent this. A ball valve would be installed between the return > > bend and check to drain out the pipe. Anyone else have insight on this? > > > > Thank you, > > > > Dewayne Martinez > > Fire Protection Design Manager > > > > TOTAL Mechanical > > Building Integrity > > > > W234 N2830 Paul Rd. > > Pewaukee, WI 53072 > > dmarti...@total-mechanical.com > > Ph: 262-522-7110 > > Cell: 414-406-5208 > > http://www.total-mechanical.com/ > > ___ > > Sprinklerforum mailing list > > Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > > > > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprin > > kl > > er.org > > > ___ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl > er.o > rg > <http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprink > ler.org> ___ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > Sprinklerforum@lists.firespri
