Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
Better men then me can do it. I was hit or miss. More miss than hit. I would even run it by the field super to make sure I was figuring it right. Usually took me actually doing a small mock up in the shop to be 100% sure. There was a guy in my office when I started. He could have the whole job pre-fabbed and he usually had a 97% fit rate. God speed! Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 13, 2014, at 10:41 PM, Brad Casterline bcasterl...@fsc-inc.com wrote: My confidence level is a bit low and I would appreciate a boost: I'm hanging 1 thru 2 pipe at center of 19 below smooth concrete, using drop-in anchors. Elevation-wise this puts me center 5 above finished ceiling. I'm using 2-pc deep escutcheon. For simplicity I'm thinking 3/8x18 A.T.R. and 5 drops should work? Thanks, Brad ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
Back in the day (when the earth was new) we would cut everything to fit. That was our job as designers. Thank you, Sharon Alves Senior Fire Sprinkler Specialist, Project Manager, SET LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. MEP/FS . Sustainability . CxA 1663 Eureka Rd - Roseville, CA 95661 (916) 771-0778 x114 sal...@lpengineers.com www.lpengineers.com This email and its attachments are the sole property of LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. and Copyrighted by LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. 2013. This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication. The sender and its company do not guarantee that this email or its attachments is free of viruses nor does it accept any liability for same. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Aaron Peck Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 9:35 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Cc: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Better men then me can do it. I was hit or miss. More miss than hit. I would even run it by the field super to make sure I was figuring it right. Usually took me actually doing a small mock up in the shop to be 100% sure. There was a guy in my office when I started. He could have the whole job pre-fabbed and he usually had a 97% fit rate. God speed! Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 13, 2014, at 10:41 PM, Brad Casterline bcasterl...@fsc-inc.com wrote: My confidence level is a bit low and I would appreciate a boost: I'm hanging 1 thru 2 pipe at center of 19 below smooth concrete, using drop-in anchors. Elevation-wise this puts me center 5 above finished ceiling. I'm using 2-pc deep escutcheon. For simplicity I'm thinking 3/8x18 A.T.R. and 5 drops should work? Thanks, Brad ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl er.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
Was that along with punchcard hydraulics? Lol I wish I had been better but I had my moments of very nice fit jobs. Coordinating around huge duct work. The foreman called me out to find out what I was on during this design. I just said wait and see. He was amazed when the duct came in and it worked perfectly. More proper coordination instead of prefab. Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 13, 2014, at 11:47 PM, Sharon Alves sal...@lpengineers.com wrote: Back in the day (when the earth was new) we would cut everything to fit. That was our job as designers. Thank you, Sharon Alves Senior Fire Sprinkler Specialist, Project Manager, SET LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. MEP/FS . Sustainability . CxA 1663 Eureka Rd - Roseville, CA 95661 (916) 771-0778 x114 sal...@lpengineers.com www.lpengineers.com This email and its attachments are the sole property of LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. and Copyrighted by LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. 2013. This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication. The sender and its company do not guarantee that this email or its attachments is free of viruses nor does it accept any liability for same. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Aaron Peck Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 9:35 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Cc: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Better men then me can do it. I was hit or miss. More miss than hit. I would even run it by the field super to make sure I was figuring it right. Usually took me actually doing a small mock up in the shop to be 100% sure. There was a guy in my office when I started. He could have the whole job pre-fabbed and he usually had a 97% fit rate. God speed! Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 13, 2014, at 10:41 PM, Brad Casterline bcasterl...@fsc-inc.com wrote: My confidence level is a bit low and I would appreciate a boost: I'm hanging 1 thru 2 pipe at center of 19 below smooth concrete, using drop-in anchors. Elevation-wise this puts me center 5 above finished ceiling. I'm using 2-pc deep escutcheon. For simplicity I'm thinking 3/8x18 A.T.R. and 5 drops should work? Thanks, Brad ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl er.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
I hear you Aaron! Thanks, and you too. 35 years ago FSC stood for Fire Sprinkler Consultants. Now with MEP and Code divisions that doesn't work. The recent thread about the rod being threaded on the ends and smooth in the middle made me grin. It was called MT (machine thread) Rod-- why spend the time and money threading the whole thing when all you need is a bit on each end? :) The first Phase of the job I'm working on now (retrofit) was hanging to the side of concrete beams so I gave the rod length as the dim. from center of pipe to center of beam stem, and the ring take-out put it an inch or two or three above... straight up is a different story. I just thought someone might know off the top of their head, i.e, i'm being lazy! thanks again, brad -Original Message- From: Aaron Peck [mailto:amp...@me.com] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 11:35 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Cc: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Better men then me can do it. I was hit or miss. More miss than hit. I would even run it by the field super to make sure I was figuring it right. Usually took me actually doing a small mock up in the shop to be 100% sure. There was a guy in my office when I started. He could have the whole job pre-fabbed and he usually had a 97% fit rate. God speed! Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 13, 2014, at 10:41 PM, Brad Casterline bcasterl...@fsc-inc.com wrote: My confidence level is a bit low and I would appreciate a boost: I'm hanging 1 thru 2 pipe at center of 19 below smooth concrete, using drop-in anchors. Elevation-wise this puts me center 5 above finished ceiling. I'm using 2-pc deep escutcheon. For simplicity I'm thinking 3/8x18 A.T.R. and 5 drops should work? Thanks, Brad ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
Come on Sharon! We're not older than dirt, we were just the first to play in it ;) -Original Message- From: Aaron Peck [mailto:amp...@me.com] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 11:58 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Was that along with punchcard hydraulics? Lol I wish I had been better but I had my moments of very nice fit jobs. Coordinating around huge duct work. The foreman called me out to find out what I was on during this design. I just said wait and see. He was amazed when the duct came in and it worked perfectly. More proper coordination instead of prefab. Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 13, 2014, at 11:47 PM, Sharon Alves sal...@lpengineers.com wrote: Back in the day (when the earth was new) we would cut everything to fit. That was our job as designers. Thank you, Sharon Alves Senior Fire Sprinkler Specialist, Project Manager, SET LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. MEP/FS . Sustainability . CxA 1663 Eureka Rd - Roseville, CA 95661 (916) 771-0778 x114 sal...@lpengineers.com www.lpengineers.com This email and its attachments are the sole property of LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. and Copyrighted by LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. 2013. This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication. The sender and its company do not guarantee that this email or its attachments is free of viruses nor does it accept any liability for same. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Aaron Peck Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 9:35 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Cc: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Better men then me can do it. I was hit or miss. More miss than hit. I would even run it by the field super to make sure I was figuring it right. Usually took me actually doing a small mock up in the shop to be 100% sure. There was a guy in my office when I started. He could have the whole job pre-fabbed and he usually had a 97% fit rate. God speed! Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 13, 2014, at 10:41 PM, Brad Casterline bcasterl...@fsc-inc.com wrote: My confidence level is a bit low and I would appreciate a boost: I'm hanging 1 thru 2 pipe at center of 19 below smooth concrete, using drop-in anchors. Elevation-wise this puts me center 5 above finished ceiling. I'm using 2-pc deep escutcheon. For simplicity I'm thinking 3/8x18 A.T.R. and 5 drops should work? Thanks, Brad ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl er.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
I think it'll work fine. Why deep plates? Vince On 3/13/2014 11:41 AM, Brad Casterline wrote: My confidence level is a bit low and I would appreciate a boost: I'm hanging 1 thru 2 pipe at center of 19 below smooth concrete, using drop-in anchors. Elevation-wise this puts me center 5 above finished ceiling. I'm using 2-pc deep escutcheon. For simplicity I'm thinking 3/8x18 A.T.R. and 5 drops should work? Thanks, Brad ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org -- West Tech Fire Protection, Inc. 11351 Pearl Road / Strongsville, Ohio 44136 Phone 440 238-4800Fax 440 238-4876 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
Better that than the phone call of I moved that pipe up nice and tight and eliminated those offsets we didn't need, had that one happen a time or two. Mike Morey, CFPS, SET Planner Scheduler/Designer BMWC Constructors, Inc. 1740 W. Michigan St, Indianapolis, IN 46222 O: 317.651.0596 | C: 317.586.8111 mo...@bmwc.com | www.bmwc.com From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] on behalf of Aaron Peck [amp...@me.com] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 12:58 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Was that along with punchcard hydraulics? Lol I wish I had been better but I had my moments of very nice fit jobs. Coordinating around huge duct work. The foreman called me out to find out what I was on during this design. I just said wait and see. He was amazed when the duct came in and it worked perfectly. More proper coordination instead of prefab. Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 13, 2014, at 11:47 PM, Sharon Alves sal...@lpengineers.com wrote: Back in the day (when the earth was new) we would cut everything to fit. That was our job as designers. Thank you, Sharon Alves Senior Fire Sprinkler Specialist, Project Manager, SET LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. MEP/FS . Sustainability . CxA 1663 Eureka Rd - Roseville, CA 95661 (916) 771-0778 x114 sal...@lpengineers.com www.lpengineers.com This email and its attachments are the sole property of LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. and Copyrighted by LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. 2013. This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication. The sender and its company do not guarantee that this email or its attachments is free of viruses nor does it accept any liability for same. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Aaron Peck Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 9:35 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Cc: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Better men then me can do it. I was hit or miss. More miss than hit. I would even run it by the field super to make sure I was figuring it right. Usually took me actually doing a small mock up in the shop to be 100% sure. There was a guy in my office when I started. He could have the whole job pre-fabbed and he usually had a 97% fit rate. God speed! Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 13, 2014, at 10:41 PM, Brad Casterline bcasterl...@fsc-inc.com wrote: My confidence level is a bit low and I would appreciate a boost: I'm hanging 1 thru 2 pipe at center of 19 below smooth concrete, using drop-in anchors. Elevation-wise this puts me center 5 above finished ceiling. I'm using 2-pc deep escutcheon. For simplicity I'm thinking 3/8x18 A.T.R. and 5 drops should work? Thanks, Brad ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl er.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
I want it to be very obvious to the students that their dormitory is sprinklered, and if they get to horsing around too much and break one, they will all go off and flood the place. Once they graduate I will set them straight. Thanks Vince, my mentor*, I knew I could count on you. Brad *i hope you are not ashamed of that-- I am not your fault! :) ! -Original Message- From: Vince Sabolik [mailto:vi...@wtfp.net] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 12:11 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops I think it'll work fine. Why deep plates? Vince On 3/13/2014 11:41 AM, Brad Casterline wrote: My confidence level is a bit low and I would appreciate a boost: I'm hanging 1 thru 2 pipe at center of 19 below smooth concrete, using drop-in anchors. Elevation-wise this puts me center 5 above finished ceiling. I'm using 2-pc deep escutcheon. For simplicity I'm thinking 3/8x18 A.T.R. and 5 drops should work? Thanks, Brad ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org -- West Tech Fire Protection, Inc. 11351 Pearl Road / Strongsville, Ohio 44136 Phone 440 238-4800Fax 440 238-4876 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
*facepalm ya I've had similar things happen. Milded mannered foreman helping out. Sometimes good but others not so much. That's the importance of a pre-con meeting to go over the hows and whys of your design. A general rule is if your design and pre-fab was good you won't hear anything. You'll only hear if something is wrong. Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 14, 2014, at 12:22 AM, Morey, Mike mo...@bmwc.com wrote: Better that than the phone call of I moved that pipe up nice and tight and eliminated those offsets we didn't need, had that one happen a time or two. Mike Morey, CFPS, SET Planner Scheduler/Designer BMWC Constructors, Inc. 1740 W. Michigan St, Indianapolis, IN 46222 O: 317.651.0596 | C: 317.586.8111 mo...@bmwc.com | www.bmwc.com From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] on behalf of Aaron Peck [amp...@me.com] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 12:58 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Was that along with punchcard hydraulics? Lol I wish I had been better but I had my moments of very nice fit jobs. Coordinating around huge duct work. The foreman called me out to find out what I was on during this design. I just said wait and see. He was amazed when the duct came in and it worked perfectly. More proper coordination instead of prefab. Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 13, 2014, at 11:47 PM, Sharon Alves sal...@lpengineers.com wrote: Back in the day (when the earth was new) we would cut everything to fit. That was our job as designers. Thank you, Sharon Alves Senior Fire Sprinkler Specialist, Project Manager, SET LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. MEP/FS . Sustainability . CxA 1663 Eureka Rd - Roseville, CA 95661 (916) 771-0778 x114 sal...@lpengineers.com www.lpengineers.com This email and its attachments are the sole property of LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. and Copyrighted by LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. 2013. This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication. The sender and its company do not guarantee that this email or its attachments is free of viruses nor does it accept any liability for same. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Aaron Peck Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 9:35 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Cc: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Better men then me can do it. I was hit or miss. More miss than hit. I would even run it by the field super to make sure I was figuring it right. Usually took me actually doing a small mock up in the shop to be 100% sure. There was a guy in my office when I started. He could have the whole job pre-fabbed and he usually had a 97% fit rate. God speed! Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 13, 2014, at 10:41 PM, Brad Casterline bcasterl...@fsc-inc.com wrote: My confidence level is a bit low and I would appreciate a boost: I'm hanging 1 thru 2 pipe at center of 19 below smooth concrete, using drop-in anchors. Elevation-wise this puts me center 5 above finished ceiling. I'm using 2-pc deep escutcheon. For simplicity I'm thinking 3/8x18 A.T.R. and 5 drops should work? Thanks, Brad ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl er.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org
RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
I hate to admit it, but I calculated grids by hand. Thank you, Sharon Alves Senior Fire Sprinkler Specialist, Project Manager, SET LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. MEP/FS . Sustainability . CxA 1663 Eureka Rd - Roseville, CA 95661 (916) 771-0778 x114 sal...@lpengineers.com www.lpengineers.com This email and its attachments are the sole property of LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. and Copyrighted by LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. 2013. This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication. The sender and its company do not guarantee that this email or its attachments is free of viruses nor does it accept any liability for same. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Aaron Peck Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 9:58 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Was that along with punchcard hydraulics? Lol I wish I had been better but I had my moments of very nice fit jobs. Coordinating around huge duct work. The foreman called me out to find out what I was on during this design. I just said wait and see. He was amazed when the duct came in and it worked perfectly. More proper coordination instead of prefab. Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 13, 2014, at 11:47 PM, Sharon Alves sal...@lpengineers.com wrote: Back in the day (when the earth was new) we would cut everything to fit. That was our job as designers. Thank you, Sharon Alves Senior Fire Sprinkler Specialist, Project Manager, SET LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. MEP/FS . Sustainability . CxA 1663 Eureka Rd - Roseville, CA 95661 (916) 771-0778 x114 sal...@lpengineers.com www.lpengineers.com This email and its attachments are the sole property of LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. and Copyrighted by LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. 2013. This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication. The sender and its company do not guarantee that this email or its attachments is free of viruses nor does it accept any liability for same. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Aaron Peck Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 9:35 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Cc: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Better men then me can do it. I was hit or miss. More miss than hit. I would even run it by the field super to make sure I was figuring it right. Usually took me actually doing a small mock up in the shop to be 100% sure. There was a guy in my office when I started. He could have the whole job pre-fabbed and he usually had a 97% fit rate. God speed! Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 13, 2014, at 10:41 PM, Brad Casterline bcasterl...@fsc-inc.com wrote: My confidence level is a bit low and I would appreciate a boost: I'm hanging 1 thru 2 pipe at center of 19 below smooth concrete, using drop-in anchors. Elevation-wise this puts me center 5 above finished ceiling. I'm using 2-pc deep escutcheon. For simplicity I'm thinking 3/8x18 A.T.R. and 5 drops should work? Thanks, Brad ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprink l er.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl er.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl er.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
Yes, when the earth was new. I've had fun playing in it though. Thank you, Sharon Alves Senior Fire Sprinkler Specialist, Project Manager, SET LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. MEP/FS . Sustainability . CxA 1663 Eureka Rd - Roseville, CA 95661 (916) 771-0778 x114 sal...@lpengineers.com www.lpengineers.com This email and its attachments are the sole property of LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. and Copyrighted by LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. 2013. This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication. The sender and its company do not guarantee that this email or its attachments is free of viruses nor does it accept any liability for same. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brad Casterline Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 10:09 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Come on Sharon! We're not older than dirt, we were just the first to play in it ;) -Original Message- From: Aaron Peck [mailto:amp...@me.com] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 11:58 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Was that along with punchcard hydraulics? Lol I wish I had been better but I had my moments of very nice fit jobs. Coordinating around huge duct work. The foreman called me out to find out what I was on during this design. I just said wait and see. He was amazed when the duct came in and it worked perfectly. More proper coordination instead of prefab. Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 13, 2014, at 11:47 PM, Sharon Alves sal...@lpengineers.com wrote: Back in the day (when the earth was new) we would cut everything to fit. That was our job as designers. Thank you, Sharon Alves Senior Fire Sprinkler Specialist, Project Manager, SET LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. MEP/FS . Sustainability . CxA 1663 Eureka Rd - Roseville, CA 95661 (916) 771-0778 x114 sal...@lpengineers.com www.lpengineers.com This email and its attachments are the sole property of LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. and Copyrighted by LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. 2013. This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication. The sender and its company do not guarantee that this email or its attachments is free of viruses nor does it accept any liability for same. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Aaron Peck Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 9:35 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Cc: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Better men then me can do it. I was hit or miss. More miss than hit. I would even run it by the field super to make sure I was figuring it right. Usually took me actually doing a small mock up in the shop to be 100% sure. There was a guy in my office when I started. He could have the whole job pre-fabbed and he usually had a 97% fit rate. God speed! Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 13, 2014, at 10:41 PM, Brad Casterline bcasterl...@fsc-inc.com wrote: My confidence level is a bit low and I would appreciate a boost: I'm hanging 1 thru 2 pipe at center of 19 below smooth concrete, using drop-in anchors. Elevation-wise this puts me center 5 above finished ceiling. I'm using 2-pc deep escutcheon. For simplicity I'm thinking 3/8x18 A.T.R. and 5 drops should work? Thanks, Brad ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprink l er.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http
Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
I only had to hand calc grids for my NICET test of course with velocity pressures... Never again! Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 14, 2014, at 12:30 AM, Sharon Alves sal...@lpengineers.com wrote: I hate to admit it, but I calculated grids by hand. Thank you, Sharon Alves Senior Fire Sprinkler Specialist, Project Manager, SET LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. MEP/FS . Sustainability . CxA 1663 Eureka Rd - Roseville, CA 95661 (916) 771-0778 x114 sal...@lpengineers.com www.lpengineers.com This email and its attachments are the sole property of LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. and Copyrighted by LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. 2013. This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication. The sender and its company do not guarantee that this email or its attachments is free of viruses nor does it accept any liability for same. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Aaron Peck Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 9:58 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Was that along with punchcard hydraulics? Lol I wish I had been better but I had my moments of very nice fit jobs. Coordinating around huge duct work. The foreman called me out to find out what I was on during this design. I just said wait and see. He was amazed when the duct came in and it worked perfectly. More proper coordination instead of prefab. Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 13, 2014, at 11:47 PM, Sharon Alves sal...@lpengineers.com wrote: Back in the day (when the earth was new) we would cut everything to fit. That was our job as designers. Thank you, Sharon Alves Senior Fire Sprinkler Specialist, Project Manager, SET LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. MEP/FS . Sustainability . CxA 1663 Eureka Rd - Roseville, CA 95661 (916) 771-0778 x114 sal...@lpengineers.com www.lpengineers.com This email and its attachments are the sole property of LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. and Copyrighted by LP Consulting Engineers, Inc. 2013. This communication with its contents may contain confidential and/or legally privileged information. It is solely for the use of the intended recipient(s). Unauthorized interception, review, use or disclosure is prohibited and may violate applicable laws including the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender and destroy all copies of the communication. The sender and its company do not guarantee that this email or its attachments is free of viruses nor does it accept any liability for same. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Aaron Peck Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 9:35 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Cc: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Better men then me can do it. I was hit or miss. More miss than hit. I would even run it by the field super to make sure I was figuring it right. Usually took me actually doing a small mock up in the shop to be 100% sure. There was a guy in my office when I started. He could have the whole job pre-fabbed and he usually had a 97% fit rate. God speed! Sent from my iPhone Aaron M. Peck, SET Fire Protection Skype +1(202)407-9079 Cambodia +855(0)78700407 On Mar 13, 2014, at 10:41 PM, Brad Casterline bcasterl...@fsc-inc.com wrote: My confidence level is a bit low and I would appreciate a boost: I'm hanging 1 thru 2 pipe at center of 19 below smooth concrete, using drop-in anchors. Elevation-wise this puts me center 5 above finished ceiling. I'm using 2-pc deep escutcheon. For simplicity I'm thinking 3/8x18 A.T.R. and 5 drops should work? Thanks, Brad ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprink l er.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkl er.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list
Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
Very Obvious = Target Hell, Brad even I can remember that far back. And no, I'm proud of you as I am all my chillun On 3/13/2014 1:29 PM, Brad Casterline wrote: I want it to be very obvious to the students that their dormitory is sprinklered, and if they get to horsing around too much and break one, they will all go off and flood the place. Once they graduate I will set them straight. Thanks Vince, my mentor*, I knew I could count on you. Brad *i hope you are not ashamed of that-- I am not your fault! :) ! -Original Message- From: Vince Sabolik [mailto:vi...@wtfp.net] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 12:11 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops I think it'll work fine. Why deep plates? Vince ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
True enough! Actually, there are quite a few ceiling height changes and surface mounted lights and other fixtures. Thank you very much Vince. You are one of the few whom did not reply to my Why? why? why? with DONT WORRY ABOUT IT JUST DO IT -Original Message- From: Vince Sabolik [mailto:vi...@wtfp.net] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 12:49 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Very Obvious = Target Hell, Brad even I can remember that far back. And no, I'm proud of you as I am all my chillun On 3/13/2014 1:29 PM, Brad Casterline wrote: I want it to be very obvious to the students that their dormitory is sprinklered, and if they get to horsing around too much and break one, they will all go off and flood the place. Once they graduate I will set them straight. Thanks Vince, my mentor*, I knew I could count on you. Brad *i hope you are not ashamed of that-- I am not your fault! :) ! -Original Message- From: Vince Sabolik [mailto:vi...@wtfp.net] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 12:11 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops I think it'll work fine. Why deep plates? Vince ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
This is not the why group. This is the follow-the-rules group, which includes engineers, educators, AHJs, designers, installers, and manufacturers, because NFPA 13 is a rule book and not an engineering guide. If you want to reach the why group, submit Proposals to the NFPA 13 committee during the Proposal period, or begin sending Comments during the Comment period. By doing this you will get direct feedback in the form of Committee Responses directly addressing your concerns. Send them your good ideas, then challenge them all the way to the Standards Council if you wish. You sound like the kind of person who would enjoy the jousting. Bill Brooks -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brad Casterline Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 2:02 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops True enough! Actually, there are quite a few ceiling height changes and surface mounted lights and other fixtures. Thank you very much Vince. You are one of the few whom did not reply to my Why? why? why? with DONT WORRY ABOUT IT JUST DO IT -Original Message- From: Vince Sabolik [mailto:vi...@wtfp.net] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 12:49 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Very Obvious = Target Hell, Brad even I can remember that far back. And no, I'm proud of you as I am all my chillun On 3/13/2014 1:29 PM, Brad Casterline wrote: I want it to be very obvious to the students that their dormitory is sprinklered, and if they get to horsing around too much and break one, they will all go off and flood the place. Once they graduate I will set them straight. Thanks Vince, my mentor*, I knew I could count on you. Brad *i hope you are not ashamed of that-- I am not your fault! :) ! -Original Message- From: Vince Sabolik [mailto:vi...@wtfp.net] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 12:11 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops I think it'll work fine. Why deep plates? Vince ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
Bill, You mean this isn't the fiction writer want-to-be group? I was always better at making things up than figuring out how things worked. I think designers are a tad bit more unique than the other 5 you mention-- we have to start with a blank page and fill it up. I have always admired and respected the rules and, truth be told, I could not care less if any of them ever change, certainly not to the point of doing battle :). The why comes from a desire for a deeper appreciation. Thanks man! and thanks Sharon and Mike for comments. Brad -Original Message- From: Bill Brooks [mailto:bill.bro...@brooksfpe.com] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 2:09 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops This is not the why group. This is the follow-the-rules group, which includes engineers, educators, AHJs, designers, installers, and manufacturers, because NFPA 13 is a rule book and not an engineering guide. If you want to reach the why group, submit Proposals to the NFPA 13 committee during the Proposal period, or begin sending Comments during the Comment period. By doing this you will get direct feedback in the form of Committee Responses directly addressing your concerns. Send them your good ideas, then challenge them all the way to the Standards Council if you wish. You sound like the kind of person who would enjoy the jousting. Bill Brooks -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brad Casterline Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 2:02 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops True enough! Actually, there are quite a few ceiling height changes and surface mounted lights and other fixtures. Thank you very much Vince. You are one of the few whom did not reply to my Why? why? why? with DONT WORRY ABOUT IT JUST DO IT -Original Message- From: Vince Sabolik [mailto:vi...@wtfp.net] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 12:49 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Very Obvious = Target Hell, Brad even I can remember that far back. And no, I'm proud of you as I am all my chillun On 3/13/2014 1:29 PM, Brad Casterline wrote: I want it to be very obvious to the students that their dormitory is sprinklered, and if they get to horsing around too much and break one, they will all go off and flood the place. Once they graduate I will set them straight. Thanks Vince, my mentor*, I knew I could count on you. Brad *i hope you are not ashamed of that-- I am not your fault! :) ! -Original Message- From: Vince Sabolik [mailto:vi...@wtfp.net] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 12:11 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops I think it'll work fine. Why deep plates? Vince ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
Well said Bill. As AHJ we make every attempt to explain why based on commentary, annexes and records of code hearings. However there comes a point where we simply move beyond the banter and enforce the rule, if someone doesnt agree then take it to the next level thru appeal and or the courts, a new group of people will begin the rule enforcement process. Arguing with us ahjs wouldn't change the rule. As for the standards council, been there and done that once by way of a NITMAM. A year of research work, comments, more comments culminating travelling to Chicago to change one word in a standard that I, and apparently others, felt strongly about. In the time since tens of thousands of words have changed. I've accepted that others have a say. So the next time someone wants to continue beyond the printed why explanation I point in the direction of Chicago. John Drucker - Mobile Email - Original Message - From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Sent: Thu Mar 13 15:08:45 2014 Subject: RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops This is not the why group. This is the follow-the-rules group, which includes engineers, educators, AHJs, designers, installers, and manufacturers, because NFPA 13 is a rule book and not an engineering guide. If you want to reach the why group, submit Proposals to the NFPA 13 committee during the Proposal period, or begin sending Comments during the Comment period. By doing this you will get direct feedback in the form of Committee Responses directly addressing your concerns. Send them your good ideas, then challenge them all the way to the Standards Council if you wish. You sound like the kind of person who would enjoy the jousting. Bill Brooks -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brad Casterline Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 2:02 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops True enough! Actually, there are quite a few ceiling height changes and surface mounted lights and other fixtures. Thank you very much Vince. You are one of the few whom did not reply to my Why? why? why? with DONT WORRY ABOUT IT JUST DO IT -Original Message- From: Vince Sabolik [mailto:vi...@wtfp.net] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 12:49 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Very Obvious = Target Hell, Brad even I can remember that far back. And no, I'm proud of you as I am all my chillun On 3/13/2014 1:29 PM, Brad Casterline wrote: I want it to be very obvious to the students that their dormitory is sprinklered, and if they get to horsing around too much and break one, they will all go off and flood the place. Once they graduate I will set them straight. Thanks Vince, my mentor*, I knew I could count on you. Brad *i hope you are not ashamed of that-- I am not your fault! :) ! -Original Message- From: Vince Sabolik [mailto:vi...@wtfp.net] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 12:11 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops I think it'll work fine. Why deep plates? Vince ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org CONFIDENTIAL AND PROPRIETARY: This email message is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged and confidential, nor is it, unless specifically stated, intended to be relied upon by any person or persons other than the individual or entity named above and no warranties or representations are made or intended to persons or entities not named above. If the reader is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by telephone, return this message to the address above and delete all copies. Thank you. ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
Hey John this is Brad. My first thought was also well said Bill. Then I pictured the commentary in the handbooks, the different color text/fonts after the statements in the Body ALL saying DON'T WORRY ABOUT IT JUST DO IT. It was a depressing image and since this is my thread I decided to get goofy instead. Thanks! On Mar 13, 2014, at 5:58 PM, John Drucker jdruc...@redbanknj.org wrote: Well said Bill. As AHJ we make every attempt to explain why based on commentary, annexes and records of code hearings. However there comes a point where we simply move beyond the banter and enforce the rule, if someone doesnt agree then take it to the next level thru appeal and or the courts, a new group of people will begin the rule enforcement process. Arguing with us ahjs wouldn't change the rule. As for the standards council, been there and done that once by way of a NITMAM. A year of research work, comments, more comments culminating travelling to Chicago to change one word in a standard that I, and apparently others, felt strongly about. In the time since tens of thousands of words have changed. I've accepted that others have a say. So the next time someone wants to continue beyond the printed why explanation I point in the direction of Chicago. John Drucker - Mobile Email - Original Message - From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Sent: Thu Mar 13 15:08:45 2014 Subject: RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops This is not the why group. This is the follow-the-rules group, which includes engineers, educators, AHJs, designers, installers, and manufacturers, because NFPA 13 is a rule book and not an engineering guide. If you want to reach the why group, submit Proposals to the NFPA 13 committee during the Proposal period, or begin sending Comments during the Comment period. By doing this you will get direct feedback in the form of Committee Responses directly addressing your concerns. Send them your good ideas, then challenge them all the way to the Standards Council if you wish. You sound like the kind of person who would enjoy the jousting. Bill Brooks -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brad Casterline Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 2:02 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops True enough! Actually, there are quite a few ceiling height changes and surface mounted lights and other fixtures. Thank you very much Vince. You are one of the few whom did not reply to my Why? why? why? with DONT WORRY ABOUT IT JUST DO IT -Original Message- From: Vince Sabolik [mailto:vi...@wtfp.net] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 12:49 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Very Obvious = Target Hell, Brad even I can remember that far back. And no, I'm proud of you as I am all my chillun On 3/13/2014 1:29 PM, Brad Casterline wrote: I want it to be very obvious to the students that their dormitory is sprinklered, and if they get to horsing around too much and break one, they will all go off and flood the place. Once they graduate I will set them straight. Thanks Vince, my mentor*, I knew I could count on you. Brad *i hope you are not ashamed of that-- I am not your fault! :) ! -Original Message- From: Vince Sabolik [mailto:vi...@wtfp.net] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 12:11 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops I think it'll work fine. Why deep plates? Vince ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org CONFIDENTIAL AND PROPRIETARY: This email message is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged and confidential, nor is it, unless specifically stated, intended to be relied upon by any person or persons other than the individual or entity named above and no warranties or representations are made or intended to persons or entities not named above. If the reader is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying
Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
And I cannot imagine a better why group than this Forum. When I discovered it a few years ago, after having worn friends and family completely out with incessant sprinkler talk, I stood up and shouted my God, I'm home! On Mar 13, 2014, at 6:15 PM, Brad Casterline bcasterl...@fsc-inc.com wrote: Hey John this is Brad. My first thought was also well said Bill. Then I pictured the commentary in the handbooks, the different color text/fonts after the statements in the Body ALL saying DON'T WORRY ABOUT IT JUST DO IT. It was a depressing image and since this is my thread I decided to get goofy instead. Thanks! On Mar 13, 2014, at 5:58 PM, John Drucker jdruc...@redbanknj.org wrote: Well said Bill. As AHJ we make every attempt to explain why based on commentary, annexes and records of code hearings. However there comes a point where we simply move beyond the banter and enforce the rule, if someone doesnt agree then take it to the next level thru appeal and or the courts, a new group of people will begin the rule enforcement process. Arguing with us ahjs wouldn't change the rule. As for the standards council, been there and done that once by way of a NITMAM. A year of research work, comments, more comments culminating travelling to Chicago to change one word in a standard that I, and apparently others, felt strongly about. In the time since tens of thousands of words have changed. I've accepted that others have a say. So the next time someone wants to continue beyond the printed why explanation I point in the direction of Chicago. John Drucker - Mobile Email - Original Message - From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Sent: Thu Mar 13 15:08:45 2014 Subject: RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops This is not the why group. This is the follow-the-rules group, which includes engineers, educators, AHJs, designers, installers, and manufacturers, because NFPA 13 is a rule book and not an engineering guide. If you want to reach the why group, submit Proposals to the NFPA 13 committee during the Proposal period, or begin sending Comments during the Comment period. By doing this you will get direct feedback in the form of Committee Responses directly addressing your concerns. Send them your good ideas, then challenge them all the way to the Standards Council if you wish. You sound like the kind of person who would enjoy the jousting. Bill Brooks -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brad Casterline Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 2:02 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops True enough! Actually, there are quite a few ceiling height changes and surface mounted lights and other fixtures. Thank you very much Vince. You are one of the few whom did not reply to my Why? why? why? with DONT WORRY ABOUT IT JUST DO IT -Original Message- From: Vince Sabolik [mailto:vi...@wtfp.net] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 12:49 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops Very Obvious = Target Hell, Brad even I can remember that far back. And no, I'm proud of you as I am all my chillun On 3/13/2014 1:29 PM, Brad Casterline wrote: I want it to be very obvious to the students that their dormitory is sprinklered, and if they get to horsing around too much and break one, they will all go off and flood the place. Once they graduate I will set them straight. Thanks Vince, my mentor*, I knew I could count on you. Brad *i hope you are not ashamed of that-- I am not your fault! :) ! -Original Message- From: Vince Sabolik [mailto:vi...@wtfp.net] Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 12:11 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops I think it'll work fine. Why deep plates? Vince ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org CONFIDENTIAL AND PROPRIETARY: This email message is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged and confidential, nor is it, unless specifically stated, intended to be relied
Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
Brad, First question, are you running your rod down to the top of pipe? Second have you surveyed the job? More often than not smooth concrete will not be smooth when it is poured due to deflections in the forms. (You might want to leave some play in your hanger length.) Where is the ceiling guy setting up his rotary level? Is he using a datum elevation marked on a column? How level is the concrete floor? Center of tile project? Are there dimensions for the ceiling guy to start his grid border? The list can go on and on. We cut rods and drops on the vast majority of projects, and things work to an extent +/- 80%? The issue is trying to control for factors that are out of your control, and that's where a survey can help a lot. I've worked on too many BIM projects that don't leave an appropriate level of field variation or tolerance (+/- 2) and everything devolves into subs arguing with subs, GC arguing with subs ect. Bottom line, add hanger length for drop-ins, take out for hangers, takeout for fittings/head recess and you should hit 80% plus. Good luck, and good for you trying, because there isn't much of a better feeling than having a foreman say that thing fit like a glove! Sent from my iPhone Jamie Seidl On Mar 13, 2014, at 11:41 AM, Brad Casterline bcasterl...@fsc-inc.com wrote: My confidence level is a bit low and I would appreciate a boost: I'm hanging 1 thru 2 pipe at center of 19 below smooth concrete, using drop-in anchors. Elevation-wise this puts me center 5 above finished ceiling. I'm using 2-pc deep escutcheon. For simplicity I'm thinking 3/8x18 A.T.R. and 5 drops should work? Thanks, Brad ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
Re: Pre-fabbed Hangers and Drops
Rod does not have to be run down to top of pipe. Retrofit, survey, available plans ~20 years behind modifications that were never recorded. 10 story college dormitory. The good news is structure is concrete and steel- hand drawn in an era when we all took the time to do things right. Cut-up, congested, but that's ok. The last one I worked on to a similar level of detail was new with full coordination (revit/navis). Mortenson has really got their $hit together- it is nice to miss even the rod supporting the unistrut supporting the cable trays. On this one, ceiling height varies more than structure- it sags here and there- but I think with the tolerance of ring take-outs and 2-piece deep (401s I used to call them), for 1 thru 2when the length is the same it pulls the 1 at the end up a bit and pushes the 1 1/2 starter down a bit, which is cool, I think, like Vince, it'll be fine. Thanks Jamie, Brad On Mar 13, 2014, at 7:07 PM, Jamie Seidl jamie.se...@gmail.com wrote: Brad, First question, are you running your rod down to the top of pipe? Second have you surveyed the job? More often than not smooth concrete will not be smooth when it is poured due to deflections in the forms. (You might want to leave some play in your hanger length.) Where is the ceiling guy setting up his rotary level? Is he using a datum elevation marked on a column? How level is the concrete floor? Center of tile project? Are there dimensions for the ceiling guy to start his grid border? The list can go on and on. We cut rods and drops on the vast majority of projects, and things work to an extent +/- 80%? The issue is trying to control for factors that are out of your control, and that's where a survey can help a lot. I've worked on too many BIM projects that don't leave an appropriate level of field variation or tolerance (+/- 2) and everything devolves into subs arguing with subs, GC arguing with subs ect. Bottom line, add hanger length for drop-ins, take out for hangers, takeout for fittings/head recess and you should hit 80% plus. Good luck, and good for you trying, because there isn't much of a better feeling than having a foreman say that thing fit like a glove! Sent from my iPhone Jamie Seidl On Mar 13, 2014, at 11:41 AM, Brad Casterline bcasterl...@fsc-inc.com wrote: My confidence level is a bit low and I would appreciate a boost: I'm hanging 1 thru 2 pipe at center of 19 below smooth concrete, using drop-in anchors. Elevation-wise this puts me center 5 above finished ceiling. I'm using 2-pc deep escutcheon. For simplicity I'm thinking 3/8x18 A.T.R. and 5 drops should work? Thanks, Brad ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
