Re: [Standards] XEP Modernization Roundtable Results
On 2021-06-22 16:51, Sam Whited wrote: > * XEP-0138: Stream Compression, XEP-0229: Stream Compression with LZW > * MattJ: everyone is streaming video on mobile devices so XML > is not a big > resource hog that we need to worry about anymore XML compression is probably not worthwhile for the IM use case and even has privacy issues, but it might be very useful for IoT and similar applications. Some without any privacy needs. ___ Standards mailing list Info: https://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/standards Unsubscribe: standards-unsubscr...@xmpp.org ___
Re: [Standards] XEP Modernization Roundtable Results
On 22 Jun 2021, at 19:05, Sam Whited wrote: > Sorry, my notes were getting rapid right at the end and we didn't > discuss it all that long. The last thing was basically just "maybe we > should have a discussion about bind2; having it would fix the > carbons/mam race condition and it's probably higher priority than a lot > of the other stuff." Thanks for making the notes :) /K > > —Sam > > On Tue, Jun 22, 2021, at 13:23, Kevin Smith wrote: >> On 22 Jun 2021, at 17:51, Sam Whited wrote: >>> * MattJ: bind2 needs new author >> >> I was under the impression no-one had much interest in me driving >> bind2 and the associated bits forward. If I update bind2, are there >> people ready to implement it? Have people implemented what’s there >> already? >> >>> Carbons/MAM race condition >> >> >> What’s the race condition? I thought that enabling carbons >> automatically removed the race condition here. >> >> /K >> >> ___ >> Standards mailing list Info: >> https://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/standards Unsubscribe: Standards- >> unsubscr...@xmpp.org >> ___ >> > > > -- > Sam Whited > ___ > Standards mailing list > Info: https://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/standards > Unsubscribe: standards-unsubscr...@xmpp.org > ___ ___ Standards mailing list Info: https://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/standards Unsubscribe: standards-unsubscr...@xmpp.org ___
Re: [Standards] XEP Modernization Roundtable Results
Sorry, my notes were getting rapid right at the end and we didn't discuss it all that long. The last thing was basically just "maybe we should have a discussion about bind2; having it would fix the carbons/mam race condition and it's probably higher priority than a lot of the other stuff." —Sam On Tue, Jun 22, 2021, at 13:23, Kevin Smith wrote: > On 22 Jun 2021, at 17:51, Sam Whited wrote: > > * MattJ: bind2 needs new author > > I was under the impression no-one had much interest in me driving > bind2 and the associated bits forward. If I update bind2, are there > people ready to implement it? Have people implemented what’s there > already? > > > Carbons/MAM race condition > > > What’s the race condition? I thought that enabling carbons > automatically removed the race condition here. > > /K > > ___ > Standards mailing list Info: > https://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/standards Unsubscribe: Standards- > unsubscr...@xmpp.org > ___ > -- Sam Whited ___ Standards mailing list Info: https://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/standards Unsubscribe: standards-unsubscr...@xmpp.org ___
Re: [Standards] XEP Modernization Roundtable Results
On 22 Jun 2021, at 17:51, Sam Whited wrote: >* MattJ: bind2 needs new author I was under the impression no-one had much interest in me driving bind2 and the associated bits forward. If I update bind2, are there people ready to implement it? Have people implemented what’s there already? > Carbons/MAM race condition What’s the race condition? I thought that enabling carbons automatically removed the race condition here. /K ___ Standards mailing list Info: https://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/standards Unsubscribe: standards-unsubscr...@xmpp.org ___
[Standards] XEP Modernization Roundtable Results
Hi all, A few of us just had a quick chat about some XEPs we think need to be modernized. We came to a rough consensus on what we thought would happen, and they're mostly in line with what's been discussed on list. Here are the notes we took: Present: - Sam - MattJ - moparisthebest * XEP-0138: Stream Compression, XEP-0229: Stream Compression with LZW * MattJ: everyone is streaming video on mobile devices so XML is not a big resource hog that we need to worry about anymore * Sam: for large deployments compression can actually save CPU cycles (fewer TLS packets to encrypt) * Moparisthebest: thinks someone (Zash?) argues that a new thing is needed with better negotiation to avoid the security issues * **Recommendation:** deprecate and replace, there are newer algorithms that will need different negotiation (zstd with fixed dictionary?) * XEP-0114: Jabber Component Protocol, XEP-0225: Component Connections * MattJ: it's been a decade, no progress, no real benefit to moving from 0114 but the new one does SASL and TLS * Sam: SASL would be nice, TLS seems like it could just be done directly or w/o the component and servers knowledge and be fine * Sam: structured my XMPP library differently because I knew I'd want multiple different types of stream handshake, maybe it would have been simpler w/o knowing 0114 would be coming in the future * MattJ: chicken-and-egg problem. Not enough gained when switching but we just need implementations in prosody and ejabberd and the ecosystem will follow * Sam: is namespace delegation easier with 0014 or 0225 or completely orthogonal? * moparisthebest: if a new person implements this how do they know which to do? * MattJ: One has green text, one has red text. * MattJ: which is easier if you're implementing from scratch? 0114 easier from scracth, 0225 easier if you have an existing XMPP handshake library to use * **Recommendation:** not high priority, no action needed for now. * XEP-0072: SOAP Over XMPP * **Recommendation:** Obsolete * XEP-0054: vcard-temp, XEP-0153: vCard-Based Avatars, XEP-0292: vCard4 Over XMPP * moparisthebest: make large stanxa sizes * MattJ: trying to move away from vcard-temp in Prosody, not much interest from anyone else (Gajim maybe has newer stuff), official support deprecated in next Prosody (support provided through a backwards compatibility module) * MattJ: privacy controls are in the new version, that would be a benefit to moving but does not create a compelling need to move forward, but it's one less thing to worry about (everything is PEP) * MattJ: one weird thing from a spec perspective is that it defines an IQ to fetch/set vcard, but it's PEP based so you can just use PEP. Maybe get rid of that? * **Recommendation:** * start LC on vcard4, * bring up why it has an IQ and a PEP access method, * hopefully move vcard4 forward * put it in compliance suites (2022?) * bind2? * Carbons/MAM race condition * Persistent device tracking * MattJ: bind2 needs new author or someone with more time then it should be fairly easy * everyone has to leave around this point Thanks for participating, and we hope the council will consider some of these recommendations if they're not already. There were only three of us, so more discussion on list would be great! —Sam -- Sam Whited ___ Standards mailing list Info: https://mail.jabber.org/mailman/listinfo/standards Unsubscribe: standards-unsubscr...@xmpp.org ___
