Re: [Sugar-devel] [SLOBS] Oversight Board request: Not fully bundled .xo
On Sat, Mar 06, 2010 at 10:36:42AM +0100, Tomeu Vizoso wrote: It may do us good to keep an eye of what Ubuntu is doing about what they call opportunistic developers and Quickly: http://www.jonobacon.org/2009/10/19/ubuntu-and-the-opportunistic-programmer/ Interesting project, even if they evade all the interesting issues we're facing by focussing on a single distro release [1], rebuilding only for a small number of architectures (e.g. not PowerPC [2]). The OpenSuSE build service goes a single step further by enabling uploaders to build for several different RPM-based distros (*), using some template magic. Building spec files for multiple RPM distros is non-trivial. Besides 1. xo bundles without binary blobs and no dependencies outside Sugar Platform and 2. maybe 0install/0sugar (which I still need to give a close look) I have yet to see anything (except for vapourware) that even remotely solves the goal of a) easy sharing of activities b) between any two users (distro and architecture agnostic) c) who can connect to each other, but not to the internet (under the tree scenario) Personally, I won't settle for anything that cannot solve all of a), b) and c) on systems meeting a reasonable baseline (i.e. installed build tools and sufficient storage space). A build service (for multiple distros + architectures) can be quite useful for resource-constrained systems (and is one thing I still intend to provide on our build slaves), but must not be mandatory. [1] https://answers.launchpad.net/soyuz/+question/86040 [2] https://answers.launchpad.net/soyuz/+question/101651 (*) It claims to support Debian as well, but last time I checked it didn't publish Debian _source_ repositories which are mandatory for the service to be useful IMO. CU Sascha -- http://sascha.silbe.org/ http://www.infra-silbe.de/ signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [SLOBS] Oversight Board request: Not fully bundled .xo
On Fri, Mar 05, 2010 at 05:59:24PM -0300, Bernie Innocenti wrote: It supports any target we would ever care for, even some arm targets: http://en.opensuse.org/Build_Service/supported_build_targets I don't see MIPS listed. Don't we care about the Lemote Yeeloong? CU Sascha (just trying to point out another reason why a Build Service must not be mandatory) -- http://sascha.silbe.org/ http://www.infra-silbe.de/ signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [DESIGN] Double clicks
On Sat, Mar 6, 2010 at 6:34 AM, Sascha Silbe sascha-ml-ui-sugar-de...@silbe.org wrote: On Sat, Mar 06, 2010 at 10:27:37AM +, Aleksey Lim wrote: But looks like sugar doesn't use double clicks somewhere, was it done by intention e.g. double clicks are too complicated to reproduce? Please don't require multi-clicks (double, triple) anywhere (or for that matter, any operation where timing is critical). Even I sometimes have trouble doing those, not to mention lots of adults I've watched using Windows. They also don't seem to understand the distinction between single and double clicks, usually doing double or even triple clicks for virtually any operation that doesn't provide instant ( 100ms) response. I'm planing to use double clicks in Library activity e.g. for [1] when [a user] wants to select all entries he needs to double click on checkbox What actions would be sensible to do on all entries? How often would a user want to execute it on all entries? Depending on the answers to those questions a viable option might be to just split up the action into [action] on selected entries and [action] on all entries. Maybe even a submenu [action] - on this entry, on selected entries, on all entries. (can't find better method, Traditional UIs provide Select All and Select None in a menu. So one option would be to add Select all entries to the contextual toolbar in [1]. add toolbar button looks redundant, popup menu requires several clicks (but could be present anyway to have explicit method)). All of those sound much better to me than requiring timing constraints to be met. [1] http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Design_Team/Designs/Journal#06 CU Sascha -- http://sascha.silbe.org/ http://www.infra-silbe.de/ -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) I agree with Sascha that double clicking should be avoided... Perhaps kids can learn it, but we will immediately make the interface unusable for the elderly. We already use modifier keys in the interface to switch to an advanced behavior. Why not the usual shift and ctrl clicks? -walter iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJLkj20AAoJELpz82VMF3DaiC4H/06TUXkgVNTGQBbo9GCbpABB fpnTp6s2bsSikltUXLlhNiNyWFrxPnbW8kdYpVWIasEKY7RxacnRA7eLjjdmDNIm 2XKL0KeP53VVsZe1xk9A1s9OMOJ7errQ2p87c/pXIuHMEhM2bxwtG0cbaC7tnIT1 dkmSiCW3rRXAg8kFJPDa4Yc6T+MoeissRCO1+oa0qqbZq7yhytPrT81X4P7f9m+d Pd74VcSf8j9Y9HrqPmCUVQfn9UYGnBTt2FOrrVkEy2boiebjy4b5QNiCS+HDCSjn BBzzDZCfBraATcykI0/qj0U0rusCRb6oBUg5pUEf+2A5wINiM1RYBWCVAy/1Ibg= =XUwk -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [DESIGN] Double clicks
On Sat, Mar 6, 2010 at 07:39, Walter Bender walter.ben...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Mar 6, 2010 at 6:34 AM, Sascha Silbe sascha-ml-ui-sugar-de...@silbe.org wrote: On Sat, Mar 06, 2010 at 10:27:37AM +, Aleksey Lim wrote: But looks like sugar doesn't use double clicks somewhere, was it done by intention e.g. double clicks are too complicated to reproduce? Please don't require multi-clicks (double, triple) anywhere (or for that matter, any operation where timing is critical). [snip] CU Sascha -- http://sascha.silbe.org/ http://www.infra-silbe.de/ -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) I agree with Sascha that double clicking should be avoided... Perhaps kids can learn it, but we will immediately make the interface unusable for the elderly. Double- and triple-clicking are in a number of Sugar activities now, with no explanation. Triple-click usually selects a whole line or a whole paragraph. Many adults are unaware that this function is available in their word processors or e-mail editors. For more on such issues, see http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/The_Undiscoverable We already use modifier keys in the interface to switch to an advanced behavior. Why not the usual shift and ctrl clicks? I don't mind which mouse behavior you use, as long as you provide a way to discover it. For example, you can put the action in a menu item along with a hint giving the keyboard shortcut. For example, Firefox puts this on the Edit menu along with many others. Undo Ctrl+Z This is not strictly correct, since this notation sometimes means Shift+Ctrl+z. The actual shortcut for Undo in many programs is Ctrl+z. The most common shortcut for Select All is Ctrl+a. -walter iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJLkj20AAoJELpz82VMF3DaiC4H/06TUXkgVNTGQBbo9GCbpABB fpnTp6s2bsSikltUXLlhNiNyWFrxPnbW8kdYpVWIasEKY7RxacnRA7eLjjdmDNIm 2XKL0KeP53VVsZe1xk9A1s9OMOJ7errQ2p87c/pXIuHMEhM2bxwtG0cbaC7tnIT1 dkmSiCW3rRXAg8kFJPDa4Yc6T+MoeissRCO1+oa0qqbZq7yhytPrT81X4P7f9m+d Pd74VcSf8j9Y9HrqPmCUVQfn9UYGnBTt2FOrrVkEy2boiebjy4b5QNiCS+HDCSjn BBzzDZCfBraATcykI0/qj0U0rusCRb6oBUg5pUEf+2A5wINiM1RYBWCVAy/1Ibg= =XUwk -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -- Edward Mokurai (默雷/धर्ममेघशब्दगर्ज/دھرممیگھشبدگر ج) Cherlin Silent Thunder is my name, and Children are my nation. The Cosmos is my dwelling place, the Truth my destination. http://www.earthtreasury.org/ ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] OLPC/Sugar Radio--Sunday 12Noon Boston Time then Brunch--Manu Gupta presenting from India
I'm taking my Mother out for her birthday on Sunday so I will not be able to defend the book if it is discussed, so let me just say that I have corrected a bunch of really embarrassing errors since the PDF was created (chapter titles not matching the table of contents entries, etc.) and the website should have those corrected soon. Thanks, James Simmons Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2010 17:53:56 -0500 From: Holt h...@laptop.org Subject: [IAEP] OLPC/Sugar Radio--Sunday 12Noon Boston Time then Brunch--Manu Gupta presenting from India To: Community Support Volunteers -- who help respond to \help AT laptop.org\ support-g...@lists.laptop.org, olpc_bos...@lists.laptop.org, IAEP i...@lists.sugarlabs.org, sugar-de...@lists.sugarlabs.org, grassro...@lists.laptop.org, olpc-...@lists.laptop.org Message-ID: 4b918b84.9040...@laptop.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Please bring your questions for Manu, and let's also discuss James Simmons hot-off-the-press Make Your Own Sugar Activities! guide here: http://objavi.flossmanuals.net/books/ActivitiesGuideSugar-en-2010.03.05-04.59.13.pdf ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
