Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] Sugar 0.100 or 1.0
Hi, On Fri, May 17 2013, Daniel Narvaez wrote: we need to decide if we want the next release to be 1.0 or 0.100. 1.0! It's crazy that we have a project used by millions of people that's still pre-1.0 seven years later. And the extra press from calling it 1.0 will be useful to direct people towards the HTML5 push and get their help with it. Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org http://printf.net/ One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Moving to github
Hi, On Wed, Apr 24 2013, Daniel Narvaez wrote: I suggest that we move to github permanently. +1. I think I opposed this in the past, but it's clear that Github has become the de facto place to collaborate on free software, and I suspect we're losing potential contributors by not being there. I think we should continue to use our own Trac instance rather than Github Issues, though, to avoid depending on their non-free code any more than we will be already (which isn't much, IMO). Thanks for investigating this! - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org http://printf.net/ One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Current Sugar implementation on Android
Hi, On Sat, Apr 13 2013, Daniel Narvaez wrote: I was curious about what it would take to port enough of the GNOME libraries to android to be able to run the current Sugar implementation there. I'm not planning to work on it, but I thought it would be useful to post some notes on what I found. cscott did some work on this a few years ago, and published source code -- see in particular: http://cananian.livejournal.com/62756.html http://cananian.livejournal.com/63595.html It was very slow on the hardware we had available at the time. Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org http://printf.net/ One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Problems starting the XO
Hi, On Sat, Sep 01 2012, Ajay Garg wrote: Therafter, I upgraded the sugar package, via sudo rpm --force --nodeps --upgrade sugar-0.94.1-31.dx3.rpm After that, when I reboot, the sugar-session does not start :-\ Why did you need to use --force and --nodeps? - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org http://printf.net/ One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Wanting to know a bit of (NetworkManager) workflow upon resume-from-suspend
Hi, On Wed, May 02 2012, Ajay Garg wrote: Just wish to remove the mesh-icons from Neighborhood-View. Have you considered just removing the icons directly? diff --git a/src/jarabe/desktop/meshbox.py b/src/jarabe/desktop/meshbox.py index 20dc413..0aa8c7f 100644 --- a/src/jarabe/desktop/meshbox.py +++ b/src/jarabe/desktop/meshbox.py @@ -635,9 +635,9 @@ class MeshBox(gtk.VBox): def enable_olpc_mesh(self, mesh_device): mesh_mgr = OlpcMeshManager(mesh_device) -self._add_olpc_mesh_icon(mesh_mgr, 1) -self._add_olpc_mesh_icon(mesh_mgr, 6) -self._add_olpc_mesh_icon(mesh_mgr, 11) +#self._add_olpc_mesh_icon(mesh_mgr, 1) +#self._add_olpc_mesh_icon(mesh_mgr, 6) +#self._add_olpc_mesh_icon(mesh_mgr, 11) # the OLPC mesh can be recognised as a normal wifi network. remove # any such normal networks if they have been created -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org http://printf.net/ One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] automatic backlight control
Hi, On Mon, Nov 21 2011, Martin Langhoff wrote: Hi folks -- I was one of the early commenters on this. And Paul gave me a, ahem, strong recommendation. All caps. Neon lights, blinking: TRY IT OUT ON AN XO-1.75 And when *pgf* types in all caps, you *know* it's serious. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org http://printf.net/ One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
[Sugar-devel] AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'startswith'
Hi,
I'm seeing an odd bug running Fedora 13 Sugar on ARM. When I launch any
Sugar activity:
Traceback (most recent call last):
File /usr/bin/sugar-activity, line 21, in module
main.main()
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/sugar/activity/main.py, line 101, in
main
locale_path = i18n.get_locale_path(bundle.get_bundle_id())
File /usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/sugar/activity/i18n.py, line 131, in
get_locale_path
bundle_id + '.mo')
File /usr/lib/python2.6/posixpath.py, line 65, in join
if b.startswith('/'):
AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'startswith'
Anyone happen to have dealt with this one, before I go hunting further?
Thanks,
- Chris.
--
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] ANNOUNCE: Moving Sugar to GPLv3+
Hi Bernie, On Fri, Apr 22 2011, Bernie Innocenti wrote: You've expressed some valid concerns and I believe I've responded satisfactorily to all of them. If not, I'm glad to hear a counter-argument from you. I think you've repeatedly ignored Scott's claim that you can't modify COPYING or the source files because that would be *changing* the license, rather than taking advantage of GPLv3 redistribution rights. Can you ask Brett or someone at the FSF what the right thing to do is? - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org http://printf.net/ One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] ANNOUNCE: Moving Sugar to GPLv3+
Hi, On Fri, Apr 22 2011, Chris Ball wrote: I think you've repeatedly ignored Scott's claim that you can't modify COPYING or the source files because that would be *changing* the license, rather than taking advantage of GPLv3 redistribution rights. Can you ask Brett or someone at the FSF what the right thing to do is? I chatted with some FSF staffers on IRC, they agree with Bernie's interpretation that modifying COPYING and the source headers *is* the way that you choose to redistribute under the GPLv3+ instead, and that it's a modification of the license that was explicitly allowed ahead of time by the or later clause. They haven't yet been able to find any documentation that explains this or backs it up, though. - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org http://printf.net/ One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] GPL non-compliance, was Re: [SLOBS] GPLv3
Hi, On Wed, Apr 20 2011, Yamandu Ploskonka wrote: AFAIK (please correct me) Uruguay is not providing code, thus in violation of GNU license, and this situation has not been solved after several years. Which code are you talking about? With GPL 3 will the Uruguay security code be considered a System Library and thus exempt from providing code? That might be an elegant way out from what I believe has been their systematic non-compliance in this respect, and maybe get them to open the rest (which is silly, as the machines would still be blocked...) I don't understand. If you're talking about security code that Ceibal has written then they're the copyright holder, and they're under no obligation to choose to release the source to it. The GPL doesn't compel the original authors of code to do anything unless they are linking their code against a GPL-covered work. I don't think Ceibal's security code is linked to any GPL-covered work, and don't know why anyone would have that intuition. I've never actually seen their code, though. If you're talking about Ceibal modifications to the Sugar core, then they're surely available by virtue of being shipped in Python source form in Ceibal's images, which satisfies the GPL. - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org http://printf.net/ One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] about about my xo
Hi, On Thu, Mar 03 2011, Erik Blankinship wrote: Is there a way for a sugar activity (and gnome) to query the version and build information which is displayed in about my xo in the sugar control panel? The way I'd answer this is by: * finding out where the about my xo code lives * seeing if it exports this data to activities * if not, seeing if activities can get at it themselves And: * The code lives at sugar/extensions/cpsection/aboutcomputer/model.py * It does not obviously export data to activities * But it functions by reading files from the filesystem, and it looks like an activity could read the same ones. - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org http://printf.net/ One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Text-to-speech on the XO 1.5 with 10.1.3
Hi, Chat also has text to speech it might be tapping into some common library? There's a remarkable aversion to looking at source code in this thread. :) Speak.activity/espeak_cmd.py: import espeak ... def speak(self, status, text): subprocess.call([espeak, -w, wavpath, -p, str(status.pitch), -s, str(rate), -v, status.voice.name, text], stdout=subprocess.PIPE) - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Browse-115 stops when pop-up tab closes
Hi, I have been consistently able to reproduce this on my XO-1 running build 353pyg and Browse-115. Seeing that I haven't found a entry on the OLPC and SugarLabs bug trackers nor any discussions here on the list I was wondering whether that webmail system is to blame or if this is indeed a bug. Quitting the entire activity in response to (presumably) a javascript statement can only be a bug, in my opinion. Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Home view activities layout
Hi Christian, I do think that there are opportunities for different views, but would love to first figure out collectively what the functional differences/affordances are that we are designing for... The functional difference I'm interested in is supporting more activities; the ring view was designed when we shipped half as many activities as we do now, and I think it's reached its scalability limit. Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Home view activities layout
Hi Christian, Hi Chris--to address scalability we have a list view from which you can select favorite activities to go in the ring. This is a similar technique to the OSX dock or Windows taskbar. I don't think this is working out. For OLPC (and perhaps SoaS as well?) we're shipping with every activity other than Log and Terminal favorited by default, after receiving reports that kids didn't understand how to launch activities otherwise. Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Home view activities layout
Hi Walter, Here is a tighter spiral of 74 icons for the home view (running in the Sugar emulator at 800x600). I'll upload a version running on the XO soon as I get a chance. http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/images/f/f0/Spiral-home-view.png Looks great! The tight spiral looks similar to the ring view, so I think that helps to make the change feel unintrusive. Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
[Sugar-devel] Home view activities layout
Hi, At the moment Sugar's enabling the freeform and circle layouts, but the code (jarabe/desktop/favoritesview.py) also defines (and then comments out) triangle, box and sunflower layouts. The circle algorithm isn't scaling well as we install more and more activities. Any suggestions on an algorithm to replace circle with? I tried out sunflower, but it's a bit messy and hard to navigate through. Also, should we re-enable the commented out layouts? Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Home view activities layout
Hi, On Thu, Jul 29, 2010 at 03:57:35PM -0400, Walter Bender wrote: See http://en.flossmanuals.net/Sugar/ModifyingSugar (towards the bottom of the page). +1 on the spiral. I like it too. I'm worried that it would scale badly, but Walter suggested just tightening the spiral, and that sounds good to me. Is anyone on the Design Team reading? What would it take to move forward with (a) including spiral, and (b) making it default? Should we ask for input from deployments, too? Also, how would people feel about a patch that: * allows drag and drop when in a non-freeform view * if an icon is moved while in a non-freeform view, the current layout switches to freeform, and the position of all the activities is saved as the base for the new freeform configuration. (So, going to spiral, dragging one icon out of place would enable freeform -- overwriting any previous freeform configuration -- then going back to spiral using the layout menu would put all icons in their spiral place, then manually going back to freeform using the menu would restore you to spiral with the one activity you moved back in the place you moved it to. Hope that made sense.) Thanks! - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Announce: OLPC software strategy.
Hi Sascha, I trust the license will allow me to: 1. Build a new (complete, working) firmware image 2. Install it on my own XO-1.75. 3. Distribute the image (+ source) to other XO-1.75 users so they can install it. We expect this to be no problem, just as building your own OFW+EC binary blob and redistributing them right now is no problem. (The encumbered PS/2 code we're talking about is already present in the XO-1 EC build.) What about the compiler? IIUC currently a commercial compiler is required. If that continues to be the case (as I expect it to), would it be possible for OLPC to provide the (probably very few) users interested in hacking on the EC code access to a machine having this compiler installed? I.e. does the license OLPC has for this compiler allow more than one user (on the same machine) to use it (if necessary sequentially, ensured by using a lock file) and would OLPC be willing to give users access to such a machine? Good news here too: we've moved to the free SDCC compiler, so there should be no problem here. I don't know full details, but there have been some incompatibilities seen between SDCC and the EC code in the past, so staying with SDCC is going to be conditional on being able to find a way around those. SDCC is the plan, though. For more questions, I think we should move to the OLPC devel list, and I'll let Richard Smith answer because this is his project. :) - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
[Sugar-devel] Announce: OLPC software strategy.
/~sayamindu/sugar_vkbd_multi.ogv -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Fwd: Free From Malaria Game
Hi, I don't know the policy for hosting an activity this license on Sugar Labs, and I hope someone who does know will speak up or make a decision. ;-) We do have a policy, and I think it prohibits hosting the activity under this license on activities.sugarlabs.org. The policy is: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Oversight_Board/Meeting_Minutes-2009-12-11 MOTION 1: adopt http://opensource.org/docs/osd as a set of guidelines for what is permitted on ASLO, for both software and content, and http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Licensing#Good_Licenses's opinions on specific licenses where applicable, and always asking the SFC for advice when a particular license is under question. -- Motion passes (6 for; 0 against; 1 abstain) The OSD guidelines: 3. Derived Works The license must allow modifications and derived works, and must allow them to be distributed under the same terms as the license of the original software. You're (WCP team) welcome to ask the Oversight Board for a formal response tailored to this situation, since this is currently just an informal response from me based on my reading of the policy. Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] A Tale of Sugar and Pippy
Hi, I don't want to spoil the party, but what are you going to do if that works and kids from around the world start bombarding sugar-devel with their changes? I should think some kind of party would be in order. :) - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] GNOME and protecting Sugar --
Hi, - How did you solve the problem? There was mention on the list of a .hidden file with hints to the file manager, did you use that? Something else? The .hidden file has its disadvantages: we don't have a way to browse the source code of all the activities in Sugar, but GNOME can provide that by letting you double-click on source files to open them in gedit. Martin, is the deployment also worried about kids deleting activities inside Sugar? If so, it sounds like we want a general undeletable flag set on ~/Activities/ (that the disk-full script can bypass). Doesn't seem to be a way to achieve that, though. - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] GNOME and protecting Sugar --
Hi, Martin, is the deployment also worried about kids deleting activities inside Sugar? If so, it sounds like we want a general undeletable flag set on ~/Activities/ (that the disk-full script can bypass). Doesn't seem to be a way to achieve that, though. If we wanted to do this without caring about an upstreamed solution, I'd probably suggest applying this: http://lwn.net/Articles/211193/ and then doing chattr -R +u /home/olpc/Activities in the build scripts, and chattr -R -u /home/olpc/Activities/$i in the disk space cleanup script, just before deleting an activity when out of space. (As the comments to the patch point out, this is an abuse of the intended +u semantics.) - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Hypothetical sugar-0.90 material, draft 1.
Hi, Why it is just a pipe dream? 1. Python does not have anything like the DALVIK virtual machine so every Python process consumes a lot of memory. Because of this, implementing the above infrastructure would consume all available RAM and so would not work. Linux memory management shares identical pages between processes. - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [PATCH] Record: disable Best quality video on XO-1.5
Hi, I'd rather just remove this option altogether, leaving Low and High. Comments/objections? Fine with me. Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [record] Fixes to the UI
Hi Anish, This patch fixes the Record ui which is broken since versions 0.86 and later. At least for myself, I'd like to see more detail here -- how was it broken? How did you fix it? Did you test the result on older versions of Sugar too? On the XO? Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Please review code
Hi Tim, I am most of the way there, as you can see from lines 91 - 143. The function is attempting to return something that can be read out loud back to a child if they ask the Speak robot a mathematical question. Looks good to me. My biggest question is the best way to import the functionality from the Calculate activity. As per silbe's comments on IRC, I'm leaning towards duplicating the two modules inside of the Speak activity. Yes, duplication seems to be the best idea for now. Thanks! - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Speak answering maths questions
Hi Tim, I'd suggest looking at the parsing logic in the Calculate activity -- it deals with the same problems. - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] ANNOUNCE: Sugar 0.88 for the XO-1
Hi, TBH I don't know what changed between F-12 and F-13. It wasn't the compile flag changes as I checked them so I'm wondering wondering why its suddenly a problem. gcc changed; it started emitting NOPL instructions under i686. - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Sugar Digest 2010-05-25
Hi, On Tue, May 25, 2010 at 07:00:27PM -0400, Walter Bender wrote: 2. Futbol: [...] (A bug is considered fixed when a patch is approved on the Sugar-devel list.) No. A bug is fixed when a user can use the fixed component. Which for components under a release process means after a release. That's certainly true in general, but would it have to follow that a bug couldn't be counted as fixed, for the purposes of conducting the competition when a patch is approved? It doesn't have to mean that the bug on SL Trac should be closed as fixed. - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
[Sugar-devel] [John Maloney] XO Scratch Release (v13) w/ Journal Support
Hi, Here's a Scratch release announcement from John Maloney; his post to the list was rejected. Could someone take care of putting it on ASLO? Thanks, - Chris. ---BeginMessage--- Greetings, all. A new release of Scratch for the XO is now available at: http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Activities I've also updated the XO Scratch page at: http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Scratch This release is based on Scratch 1.4, which includes UI changes, support for creating costumes and backgrounds by capturing photos from the XO camera, and support for nearly 50 languages. This is the first XO Scratch that integrates with the Journal, thanks to the vision and persistence of Claudia and the Squeak expertise of Bert. In addition, Scratch can now use simple resistive sensors plugged into the microphone jack. There are several known issues with Scratch on the XO-1.5: * You must disable power saving when running Scratch to avoid a interaction between sound playback and the power management system leading to a freeze of the Scratch activitiy. * Sound playback is not entirely smooth. * Using the microphone jack for resistive sensor inputs does not work. I believe these are all systems issues, either with the OS/drivers or with Squeak, and they are being investigated. Enjoy! -- John ---End Message--- -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [DESIGN] Pippy shared activity view
Hi, However, on the latest version of Pippy, even if the treeview is kept shown and some users click on it, the sharing isn't broken, rather if one user clicks on an example, it is loaded on everyone's screen. After this happens, there's no way (inside Pippy) to return to the file you were working on before. That's why the treeview's hidden; an accidental click on a treeview example would be extremely frustrating. I think that if we want to make the treeview visible again, there should be a way to undo clicks on example programs and go back to the original shared file. This would be helpful for single-user Pippy, too. Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] OLPC mesh support in Sugar-0.84
Hi, On 19 May 2010 20:45, James Cameron qu...@laptop.org wrote: Why not shift the XO-1 users and deployments onto 0.88? You're talking about a huge amount of work here, with only a small amount of community resources working directly on XO1. And we've already seen a handful of issues on the list which will generate difficulties once 0.88 starts running on XOs. I concur with Martin and Daniel -- large XO-1 deployments simply aren't interested in shifting to the latest Sugar releases. We're lucky if we can get them on one new base release every two years. (And we haven't been particularly lucky so far.) - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] Announcing the Development Team Lead election
Hi Tomeu, I actually stepped down as development team coordinator which is/was an administrative role, I wasn't the development team leader because that position has never existed before in our community. I tried to make it very clear on the email you cite. Sorry about that. I wasn't thinking of a strong distinction between the two; we started talking about electing a new lead in the SLOBS meeting, and the title stuck in my writing. - being a responsive upstream for work we receive from the community: this sounds like a rather big responsibility to me. For example, what will happen with modules that are unmaintained such as hulahop and browse? For this point, we were thinking about someone who makes sure that patches sent in for review are replied to and applied quickly (perhaps via delegation), rather than someone who will single-handedly maintain all the code we've received in the past. In short, we want to make sure that there's no bottleneck on community contributions of patches at the SL end. - appointing a release manager for the next (0.90) release: if you mean just formally appointing whoever the team members choose, then I'm fine with it, but it's not obvious for me as it's expressed. What about the other positions related to development, the team lead also need to appoint those? Until now we have never seen two people competing for a role, nor disagreement on a candidacy. We talked in the SLOBS meeting on Friday about our urgent need to start planning 0.90, and decided that finding a release manager would be a good first task for the new development team lead/coordinator. If the development team is already able to appoint a new release manager, you should certainly go ahead and do that -- we were operating under the assumption that no-one had been found yet. (I think part of the reason I had that assumption is that the wiki page for the development team only lists you and Simon as members.) http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Contacts - coordination with the Design and Deployment Teams on new features: do we really need that the team leads takes this responsibility as well? Or is assumed that the team lead will delegate it on others? I think that team leads should take responsibility for this, but that the responsibility can be satisfied by delegating it to others. May I suggest that both candidates and voters are restricted to development team members? This would encourage interested people to join the team, strengthening it. I think that by giving some autonomy to teams we'll be encouraging them to take ownership of their areas. That sounds fine, if you're saying that standing/voting is still open to anyone, but that they should first sign up to join the team before doing either. I agree is very important to find people interested on leading efforts and taking responsibilities, but I think is equally important to have a team structure that encourage division of work, diversity of opinions and pooling of resources. Makes sense. Sounds like we should defer to the Development Team in defining the role. I'm also not sure we need a full-blown election with selectricity. I'm thinking that open voting on the mailing list may be enough, unless we are expecting that people won't vote freely without anonymity. Okay. Let's continue gathering candidates as we were, and then the team can decide what to do with the result; whether to have an internal election, full election or something else. Thanks to you for taking this important task, I'm very happy to see we are making progresses on this area. Hope the concerns I have raised above aren't seen as push back but as sincere opinions. No problem. - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Announcing the Development Team Lead election
Hi Aleksey, What about not choosing between candidates but about choosing between plans how sugar will grow for next release cycle (6 months). I certainly like the idea of choosing a team lead based on their plans, and of having a lot of information about which plans each candidate would adopt, but for clarity I still want the vote to be for an individual person rather than a plan. So, I propose that platforms should look roughly like this: * Name of candidate * Past experience with Sugar Labs * General statement of future ideas for Sugar * List of wiki page links to potential plans that the candidate would adopt, if elected. Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
[Sugar-devel] Announcing the Development Team Lead election
Hi everyone, Tomeu's stepping down as the Development Team Lead¹, and we'd like to elect a replacement. This is an important position -- the team lead is responsible for setting clear goals for the team, being a responsive upstream for work we receive from the community, appointing a release manager for the next (0.90) release and helping to define its scope, and holding regular Development Team meetings on IRC, including coordination with the Design and Deployment Teams on new features. There are more details on the role and the team here: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team The position is open to anyone; if you're interested in nominating yourself, just add your name and platform to: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Team_Lead_Candidates_2010_05 The platform -- and the election as a whole -- is an opportunity to express your view on development directions that Sugar should take. The nomination period will be open for seven days, closing at 00:00 UTC on May 22nd. Then the election will run for ten days, starting at 00:00 UTC on May 22nd and finishing at 00:00 UTC on June 1st. All Sugar Labs members are eligible to vote, and will receive a token for doing so by e-mail. I've volunteered to run the election. Finally, many thanks to Tomeu Vizoso and Simon Schampijer for their great work as the Development Team Lead and Release Manager! - Chris. ¹: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2010-May/023825.html -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Chil ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] De-yellowing page images?
Hi, I'd like to lighten or remove the yellowing from the pages to make the book more attractive. Maybe leave the text alone and replace everything else with white. I tried different things with GIMP without much luck. Any ideas? Is the book printed in color? If not, you could simply convert to greyscale (and optionally adjust brightness/levels afterwards): % convert -colorspace Gray source.jpg greyscale.jpg - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [PATCH] Pippy: add COPYING file: #1571
Hi, We have a problem here: GPLv2 and GPLv3 are incompatible [1]. We should try to upgrade the GPLv2 parts to GPLv3 to fix this. Thanks for noticing this. 1. Since all Pippy files seem to be GPLv2+, we could just go the automatic upgrade route, assuming this is possible in the countries of all authors (*). I think this is uncontroversial, and we should just do it. Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
[Sugar-devel] Record v67
Hi Aleksey, I noticed Record v67's released. The changelog says: +* Fix 0sugar Cannot find cached 0sugar-launch implementation. isuue but I can't see any commit that could do that between v66 and v67; all I see are i18n commits: http://git.sugarlabs.org/projects/record Did I miss something, maybe? Hm, now I'm especially confused -- similar deal with the Speak repo: http://git.sugarlabs.org/projects/speak I see Bump v15 and Bump v16, but no commits that actually make the changes that the changelog says were made inbetween. Could you explain? Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Keep confusion, yet again
Hi Jorge,
- self.props.tooltip = _('Keep')
+ self.props.tooltip = _('Keep a copy')
I think this will break translations. Not sure what our procedure for
renaming a string is; you might want to make your patch also change
all instances of 'msgid Keep' in po/* to be 'msgid Keep a copy',
which would keep the translations working.
Thanks,
- Chris.
--
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Re: [Sugar-devel] Keep confusion, yet again
Hi, I think that's what we want; this new string will come up as untranslated in pootle, alerting translators to submit translations for the clearer string. Ah, that's fine. (I assumed we'd want to use the old translations in the meantime.) - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Keep confusion, yet again
Hi Eben, I'd lean toward the first option. It's intended purpose was always to be a convenience on top of auto-save, that simply forced a new version. Once Sugar has full version support, and a Journal updated to take advantage of it, restoring the Keep functionality as it exists probably wouldn't cause problems anymore. Until then, I think the auto-save is much friendlier than the usual prompt-on-quit, with the possibility for lost work. Think I'm having trouble following -- are you proposing that we remove the Keep button now, and also remove the prompt-on-quit dialog now? Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
[Sugar-devel] [PATCH] Remove the keep button from the default activity toolbar
Hi, No, sorry. The current prompt-on-quit is fine, as it only occurs when you stop a brand new activity instance. It basically asks do you want me to keep track of this thing in your Journal, and from then on it will auto-save as usual. Since the Keep button is causing so much confusion, I was proposing to remove it for now (until we have more complete version support), but keep the prompt the first time a new instance is stopped. We can still skip the prompt if the instance is manually renamed, under the assumption that naming the item implies a desire to track it in the Journal. Got it, sounds good, thanks. Here's the obvious patch. From 62b3810ddb49ca091e0ac289384ae0b1d8eb9e65 Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001 From: Chris Ball c...@laptop.org Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2010 19:32:12 -0400 Subject: [PATCH] Remove the keep button from the default activity toolbar As suggested by Eben in http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2010-April/023439.html --- src/sugar/activity/widgets.py |6 +- 1 files changed, 1 insertions(+), 5 deletions(-) diff --git a/src/sugar/activity/widgets.py b/src/sugar/activity/widgets.py index 2867666..481f6b1 100644 --- a/src/sugar/activity/widgets.py +++ b/src/sugar/activity/widgets.py @@ -223,7 +223,7 @@ class TitleEntry(gtk.ToolItem): class ActivityToolbar(gtk.Toolbar): The Activity toolbar with the Journal entry title, sharing, - Keep and Stop buttons + and Stop button All activities should have this toolbar. It is easiest to add it to your Activity by using the ActivityToolbox. @@ -251,10 +251,6 @@ class ActivityToolbar(gtk.Toolbar): self.share.show() self.insert(self.share, -1) -self.keep = KeepButton(activity) -self.insert(self.keep, -1) -self.keep.show() - self.stop = StopButton(activity) self.insert(self.stop, -1) self.stop.show() -- 1.7.0.1 ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [PATCH] use ConsoleKit instead of HAL for shutdown/reboot
Hi James/Sascha, Reviewed-by: James Cameron qu...@laptop.org Did you test on XO-1 or XO-1.5? I'm curious how much of a backwards- compatibility break this is. - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] RFC: change to XO sleep behavior
Hi, further, if you choose 'a': are you comfortable having two I think this is if you choose 'b'. laptop states: - dark screen wakeable from keyboard - dark screen _not_ wakeable from keyboard that are visually indistinguishable? is it worth adding yet another LED blink behavior to differentiate these states? I'd be comfortable with it, and it doesn't seem worth adding another blink state. We could also consider just having the touchpad be available for wake-from-idle-sleep, and not the keyboard, since that way you wouldn't have any side effects from the wakeup key. But I think having the side effects isn't a big deal, so I'd go with your proposed (b). Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] Sugar Labs GSoC 2010 Application In
Hi, Sugar Labs application for Google Summer of Code 2010 has been accepted. Wow, that was quick. Many congrats and thanks! Oops -- I assumed this meant that the application had been reviewed and SL is accepted into GSOC, whereas the intended meaning was just that the application itself has been accepted, and will later be reviewed. My mistake! - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [SLOBS] Oversight Board request: Not fully bundled .xo
Hi Aleksey, Can activity bundles on Activity Library [1] be not fully bundled and demand additional (except having .xo) steps (that in most cases will demand network connection) to its launch. Sounds like this should be a Development Team/Deployment Team decision, unless you've already tried hard and failed to reach agreement there. (Do you think that's the case?) Speaking as part of that Devel Team discussion (and not as a SLOB), the current setup of not knowing beforehand whether a .xo bundle is a complete activity or a partial activity is really hard to deal with. I think the current situation is very frustrating for anyone who is downloading activities on a separate machine to the one they run them from, such as XO users who depend on other people to download and bring them activities with sneakernet. I think that these partial activities should not be used until we've found a way to make their dependencies (a) obvious to people who are downloading the activity from ASLO, and (b) easily downloadable at the time as the activity, to enable sneakernet downloading. Thanks! - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Release policy and upgrades of sugar on laptops
Hi Urso, Question: if version 0.84 is shipped with these laptops, is it possible to upgrade the XO to the version of the next release of April? Can someone tell me how this is done or where to get this information? There's some confusion between XO releases and Sugar releases here. Sugar releases happen every six months, and XO (OLPC OS) releases happen less often -- they aren't strictly time-based, but major releases have happened roughly once a year, and minor bugfix releases happen as they're needed. So, it's not the case that Sugar releases are incorporated into OLPC releases immediately. (In fact, for the XO-1.5 we chose to use Sugar 0.84 even though Sugar 0.86 had been released before our final release happened, because we wanted a Sugar release that had seen more time for bugfixes.) You should talk with OLPC directly about how to handle your particular situation, but I expect that you'll need to update the machines with your translations when they arrive; we can give you some pointers on how to do that. - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] Video Chat, Video Editing and VOIP activities for Sugar
Hi Manu, We have been examining a number of open source applications, and believe that it will be easier to port the following applications to Sugar than reinventing the wheel. 1. Video Chat - Pidgin This one's surprising, since the Sugar collaboration stack is based on Telepathy, and Pidgin isn't. Empathy would be a better base. Of course, it would also make sense to look at the Video Chat activity, even though it needs work. The Telepathy folks might be able to advise you on what its next steps should be, if you decide to work on it. http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Video_Chat http://dev.laptop.org/git/projects/video-chat-activity http://lists.laptop.org/pipermail/devel/2008-April/013227.html - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] How to start the Browse activity from my own activity?
Hi, sys.path.append(/home/olpc/Activities/Browse.activity) import webactivity So it works only on the XO ... interesting. Yes, that was curious. Has nobody noticed it not working on SoaS or anything else? For Wikibrowse under Sugar 0.82, we asked the activity registry where Browse was installed and added that path, but in 0.84 that registry was removed without a replacement API being offered, so the only way I could see to get it working was the ugly XO-specific thing. Removing APIs that are in use without fixing up activities that use them is not very cool. :/ - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] [POLL] collab.sugarlabs.org
Hi, What I don't know is if the contents of that message are still valid, e.g. OLPC will not undertake, on its own, another major release of the software package we currently ship with each XO.. No, not still valid. We just finished doing exactly that for 10.1. :) - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
[Sugar-devel] (Please read) Re: Proposed Trac - Launchpad migration
Dear Sugar folks, This mail didn't get any replies, but it's important to know whether people agree with it before going ahead. So, please understand that: * bugs.sugarlabs.org is moving from Trac to Launchpad. * Existing bug data will be imported, but the bug numbers won't be the same. * It will be hosted by Canonical externally, rather than by SL as Trac currently is. If any of these are not to your liking, the time to speak up is now, before it all happens. :) Thanks for reading, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] New activity: Arithmetic.
Hi Caroline, Hi Chris, I had a crazy idea for Arithmetic yesterday. Its a wonderful game for the GPA. Its exactly the kind of practice the students at GPA need. Its collaborative and other people are a huge key to engagement. But as you said it needs a little something more to make it fun. This sounds like a good way to make it more fun, although I suppose it's making the game longer by making the players wait for someone to place a piece in the Physics world before getting a new question; another way would be to replace the numeric scores with icons that race towards a finish line as their owners score points, perhaps. Unfortunately, I don't have any talent for the UI stuff -- the hope was that by getting the collaboration part of the activity out there, someone with UI skills will adopt making a fun UI for it (and better scoring, and better question generation logic, etc). :) Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
[Sugar-devel] Announcing the creation of a SoaS Decision Panel
Hi all, In Friday's SLOBs meeting, we approved the creation of a decision panel, with the following people eligible to join the panel: Sebastian Dziallas Luke Faraone Martin Dengler Bill Bogstad Faisal Khan Benjamin M. Schwartz Samuel Klein Sean Daly Tabitha Roder Caryl Bigenho Daniel Drake Abhishek Indoria (If anyone else had volunteered but is missing from the list, the group is welcome to add them in too.) The approved scope for the Decision Panel is large. We decided to describe it as: Investigate the situation of how SoaS should be treated by Sugar Labs, and related questions, including answers to the following: * Should Sugar Labs be a GNU/Linux distributor, rather than just an upstream producing Sugar releases? * Should SL be neutral about distributions containing Sugar, and refuse to endorse one over another? * Should 'Sugar on a Stick' be a phrase that SL asks its community to avoid using unless they refer to the SoaS-Fedora distribution? * Any other question the Decision Panel deems required to provide an answer to the original question: Is the current SoaS going to be the primary way Sugar Labs distributes a Sugar-centric GNU/Linux distribution? How the panel proceeds to organize themselves and answer these questions is entirely up to them. Once a report is ready, SLOBs will review it and vote on ratifying its suggestions. Thanks, - Chris, for SLOBs. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [SLOBS] Long-term support for Sugar
Hi, If it were on me, I'd just ditch the XO bundle format and use native packages for each distro. Some are already being packaged, and the Python distutils are capable of producing rpms and debs with the same ease of our current setup.py scripts. But then every child in Uruguay (plus other deployments that withhold root from their users) would hate you 'cause they wouldn't be able to install activities anymore. A solution that results in a significant percentage of Sugar's users not being able to download activities anymore is not a solution. If we could switch to .rpm *and* find a good way to install .rpms without being root, though, that would be pretty compelling. Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [SLOBS] SLOBs Position on SoaS
Hi all, Let me rephrase again, to make things clear. I'd love to hear an official answer on this. Soon. Is the current SoaS going to be the primary way Sugar Labs distributes a Sugar-centric GNU/Linux distribution? Martin Dengler has persuaded me that having SLOBs vote on this issue could help us move forward, even though there obviously isn't community consensus on it yet. I'm uncomfortable with the idea of having SLOBs vote on community-wide disagreements, but I have a plan for that, which I'll explain in a moment. First, I'd need to know what the specific questions (with yes/no answers) that people are interested in a vote on at the SLOBs meeting next week would be. Some things I've read that might be those questions go something like: Should Sugar Labs be a Linux distributor, rather than just an upstream producing Sugar releases? Should SL be neutral about distributions containing Sugar, and refuse to endorse one over another? Should 'Sugar on a Stick' be a phrase that SL asks its community to avoid using unless they refer to the SoaS-Fedora distribution? To avoid forcing a vote on questions that shouldn't be answered by SLOBs, I propose that the answers for each vote should be: * Yes * No * We should talk about this question more before voting on it * We shouldn't vote on this question for some reason (e.g. ambiguity in the question, or wanting to abstain) To add a question to the list (I'm not going to add any of them myself), please add to the bullet points at: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/index.php?title=Oversight_Board/Minutes#Friday_18_Sept_2009_-_14:00_UTC If you don't like the idea of this becoming a SLOBs vote, it would be useful to say that too. Thanks, - Chris, wearing SLOB hat. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [SLOBS] SLOBs Position on SoaS
Hi, Chris, I think your strategy for reaching consensus on this issue is a good one, but somewhat at odds with our rules of governance. Thanks. You're right; I'd missed that. The Oversight Board will selecting members for the Decision Panel... A Decision Panel will solicit community input, discuss (in private if they deem it necessary), reach a conclusion internally, and produce a report documenting their conclusion. (Anyone may submit advice to a Decision Panel.) The Oversight Board will review and ratify Decision Panel reports. Perhaps we should ask for volunteers to serve on the Decision Panel now, and then vote on Friday both on whether it should be formed, and who should take positions on it? (I can't think of a way to decide who should be on the panel that doesn't involve SLOBs voting on them, unless we just let anyone who wants to be on it join.) In any case, I think we should meet on Friday of next week. Okay. I'll be at the Linux Plumbers Conference, but I think I can make the meeting anyway. - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
[Sugar-devel] SoaS: Searching for Decision Panel volunteers.
Hi all, Sebastian Dziallas has asked for clarity on how the SoaS distribution he maintains is going to be treated and considered by SL. It doesn't seem that there's consensus, so we suggest forming a Decision Panel: On the rare occasion of a contentious issue on which no general consensus can be reached, the Oversight Board is responsible for convening a Decision Panel. The Oversight Board will be responsible for determining when a Decision Panel is required and for selecting members for the Decision Panel. Members of the Oversight Board are not permitted to serve on a Decision Panel. A Decision Panel will solicit community input, discuss (in private if they deem it necessary), reach a conclusion internally, and produce a report documenting their conclusion. (Anyone may submit advice to a Decision Panel.) The Oversight Board will review and ratify Decision Panel reports. -- http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Sugar_Labs/Governance This mail is to ask for volunteers for the Decision Panel. Volunteers can be anyone with an interest in the outcome, and the Oversight Board will then vote on (a) whether to convene the panel, (b) who should be on the panel, and probably (c) what the decision being paneled is. :) Please volunteer by replying to this mail if you're interested, and please do so by Thursday September 24th so that we can run the vote at the Friday September 25th SLOBs meeting. Thanks! - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [SLOBS] [IAEP] SLOBs Position on SoaS
Hi Sebastian, In my opinion, Sugar Labs has about four options how to act wrt SoaS. (1) SL decides the current SoaS to be *the* SoaS and enforces the brand. (Did you know that you're able to lose a trademark when not enforcing it?) Exceptions could be granted by a trademark committee. I think you're going to get seven different answers from seven different SLOBs, but it's very reasonable to ask. Personally, I would go with (1), establishing that SoaS is a product of SL. I wouldn't make any future-exclusionary statements of the form SoaS is going to be the only way that SL distributes Sugar; it should be a positive statement about how SL feels about SoaS, rather than a negative statement about anyone else's current or future work. I don't think I'm ready to support actually filing a trademark application, because I think that costs at least a thousand dollars per registration per year that we don't have and could be better spent, and it doesn't really change much -- it seems that saying The SL policy on using the following terms is this as a social statement should be almost as effective as making the expensive legal statement for us. FWIW, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org One Laptop Per Child ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] New activity: Arithmetic.
Hi Christoph, * there should be some sort of start button to get the quiz started, I felt quite an adrenaline rush when I started the activity and saw the clock ticking away immediatedly Makes sense. I think this comes under an artwork improvement; there could be some kind of start shared game screen (when the first person chooses to share the activity) where you wait for everyone to join up and then hit the first countdown together. * there seems to be quite an issue with syncing collaboration because initially the activities on both virtual machines were off by maybe half a second or so but after leaving them running for 10 minutes the difference had increased to more than 6 seconds. Oh, that's very interesting. I don't think I have an explanation, but maybe Ben does. I was thinking that it might be the cumulative delay of our gobject timer firing, but we're starting a new question based on *absolute* time passed, not relative, so that doesn't fit after all. I'd be interested to know whether there's been six seconds of clock drift (as measured by date) between the two machines! Bryan also asked me to show the activity to the folks here at the OLE Nepal offices so if I get any feedback from them I'll forward it to you. Great, thanks very much, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Git commit comment mistake
Hi, Is there a way to fix the comment? Sure. git-commit --amend, per http://www.kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-commit.html That's only going to work for commits that haven't been pushed yet; once you've pushed something, GIT won't let you transparently rewrite it later without --force, and that's bad form on a shared repository. (Because it can break subsequent pulls for clients that already have a checkout.) I'd just make a new commit that corrects the comment, if you think that's justified. - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Sugar + OLPC mesh network selection logic
Hi Gary, But, auto attach to any old public AP with no prior user selection? That's just asking for trouble... What trouble is that asking for? A very fair question: I think that Sugar should prioritize what its user might want over what the potential wishes of a potential authority figure might be. I don't think I've ever been in a situation where connecting to an open access point would have displeased me, when it was the only connectivity available. Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Sugar + OLPC mesh network selection logic
Hi Gary, Hmmm, how about when a class of kids first boot up and _automatically_ connect to some random, unfiltered, strangers open/public wifi next to the school, rather than following the teachers instructions to attach to an encrypted school AP running through a firewall? I'd give the same response: you say an authority figure might want something else to happen, but the authority figure hasn't preloaded the encrypted network as a favorite network on the laptop (much more sensible than expecting young children to type in WPA passwords), and so all we have to go on is what we think the will of our user is. In a conflict between what the user might want and what an imagined authority figure might want, I think the user should win. - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] the SoaS term
Hi, I completely disagree. To me, SoaS is a specific distribution coined by Sugar enthusiasts (who happen to also most/all of them also to be Sugar developers). I disagree as well. I'm quite satisfied with SugarLabs' support and usage of the SoaS .ISO as produced by sdz and its team, especially because the largest distributor of Sugar continues to use the same base distro on its laptops. Disagreement thirded. Sugar on a Stick is a reasonable proper noun; it's not like Fedora on a Stick or openSUSE on a Stick are in use, which would be a convincing argument towards the phrase being generic. I think that one of the reasons the name was chosen was due to the pun of a lollipop being sugar on a stick, so the name's specific to Sugar in that way. I think SoaS has been widely understood to refer to a set of popular Fedora builds that Sugar Labs (rather than a distribution) creates itself, as a product. It might have been good to pick a different name in the beginning, but it doesn't seem like it's worth changing that now. - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] ASLO vs. wiki.laptop.org activities
Hi David, The Sugar Labs Activities Portal seems to be holding up pretty well under load. My suggestion would be to start phasing out the activities pages on w.lt.o Are you just talking about http://wiki.laptop.org/go/ActivityName, or the http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Activities/* pages too? My understanding is the software updater stil uses the latter pages because there isn't an equivalent in ASLO. Is that right? (SoaS includes the software updater, so we shouldn't break it by removing those pages before there's an ASLO equivalent.) - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [SoaS] squashfs failure trying to convert SoaS to OLPC XO image format
Hi, Apr 7 17:12:43 localhost kernel: SQUASHFS error: Major/Minor mismatch, trying to mount newer 4.0 filesystem Apr 7 17:12:43 localhost kernel: SQUASHFS error: Please update your kernel so I suspect a mismatch between the squashfs version that my (up-to-date) Fedora 10 box's kernel supports and the squashfs version of LiveOS/squashfs.img . Yes, known. I got the impression that the latest squashfs-tools in F10 was going to be good enough; if not, I think you'll have to find an F11 machine. - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] fixing broken wiki-to-git links
Hi, any volunteers to take this on, and make all those links work again? Or to provide a RewriteRule that converts gitweb-style links to cgit ones, perhaps? .. ah, found one. Let's do this instead. http://www.clearchain.com/blog/posts/cgit-upgrade-gitweb-retired - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] What should we call it? Addons of Activities
Hi, activities.sugarlabs.org +1 to activities here. Makes it clear and straightforward that it's the place to get Sugar activities, which is what it's for. Since an argument against it is that we want the site to host more than activities, could someone enumerate what sort of things we can imagine putting there that shouldn't go under the activities heading? Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] SoaS at FOSDEM
Hi, Well, it's mainly as small as it is due to removals regarding locals and drivers, but if you don't mind, I could also quickly draft up a kickstart file including GNOME and Sugar, wihch is not limited to the XO. Even if Marco wouldn't like this, it was on my list of things we should do for the XO Fedora build, so please do! ;-) Thanks! - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Missing Keyboard input on fresh Jhbuild
Hi Grant, When I run it now using './sugar-jhbuild run' I have mouse input but keyboard input is ignored even after the ctrl-shift capturing command. Since the terminal output is lengthy and repetitive I pasted it all at http://pastebin.be/16352 where it will be available for a week. I don't see any immediately instructive errors but I may be missing something. I pasted a few sample lines below. Any suggestions on what to try next? This isn't the answer you're expecting, but if you aren't planning on hacking bleeding-edge Sugar, I'd just install the Sugar packages in Ubuntu. (apt-get install sugar sugar-activities sugar-emulator, or something). Those packages are recent enough to be fine for developing activities against. Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] SoaS on the XO progress
Hi Marco, Got it working now. livecd-creator should be run on x86_64 as: sudo setarch i386 livecd-creator ... * X doesn't actually crash the system, it's just very broken :) If you switch to vt and back you can also see some parts of the gdm screen. It looks definitely like a regression in the updates. If I build an image with updates disabled X works fine. D'oh, I think OLPC asked Warren to push that X driver update, and it sounds like we didn't test it properly. Is there a good way to select which version of an RPM to use in kickstart, maybe? I tried building Rawhide, and got the error you mentioned, linked below. Running bash-3.2# mount -t jffs2 mtd0 /mnt works, though, so I'm not sure what's up / why it's not creating /dev/root properly. Jeremy, any ideas? http://dev.laptop.org/~cjb/f11-boot Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] SoaS on the XO progress
Hi Marco, Some extra steps: * Clone git://git.fedoraproject.org/spin-kickstarts * If you want F10 apply spin.patch * Apply live.patch in /usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/imgcreate * sudo yum -y install livecd-tools mtd-utils crcimg * If you're building on F10, s/ext4/ext3/ in fedora-live-base.ks * sudo livecd-creator --cache=cache -c fedora-livecd-desktop.ks I'm still not able to get the images I create to boot on the XO -- could you confirm that you're using the Fedora kernel and initrd? I wonder what else could be different between our setups.. Thanks! - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] SoaS on the XO progress
Hi Marco, Hello, I spent some time trying to get Sugar on a stick images (which are basically livecd-tools based Fedora spins) running on the XO from nand. Converting the image to jffs2 and adding cafe_nand and jffs2 to the initrd was enough to make it boot. You're awesome! Thanks! 1 haldaemon fails to start and I couldn't find any error log. Maybe running it directly, rather than via init, will expose the problem? 2 X fades a couple of times and then hangs the system. Happy to look into this. I can reproduce 2 if I write the same image to an usb stick using Fedora XO livecd-iso-to-disk. Could be either a regression in the F10 updates or something wrong in the way SoaS images are built. I have absolutely no idea about 1, but it would seem to be related to jffs2/initrd, since it works fine from the usb stick. It looks like you're making F10 spins, then? I wonder what happens if you try a Rawhide spin instead. Could you share your instructions and code? I'd like to give this technique a try for our F11 rebase. (At which point the difference between OLPC's image and SoaS will be very small. Maybe there'll be no difference at all, even. ;-) Thanks! - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Calling activities
Hi, How can i call an activity from shell ? e.g. sugar-launch Pippy Is possible to call a activity from a html page using the sugar browser activity? How can i do that ? Not from HTML. From activity code, you can insert the new activity's bundle into the Journal and switch to its new Journal page, which is what Browse does when you download a .xo. - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] SoaS on the XO progress
Hi Marco, Same results as yesterday with F10 while F11 fails to /init (both images built from an F10). I gave this a try, and I get a hang after Loading ramdisk image.. in OFW when booting a Rawhide image built on a Rawhide/x86-64 host. Will try with a serial port connected tomorrow. Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Pippy not ready for Sucrose
Hi, I prefer to look at it pragmatically. Until there is some kind of dependency handling for .xo packages, this is the difference between a child at an existing deployment being able to browse to the wiki, download an activity, and use it, or not being able to. It's also the difference between following the license terms and not. Not in the case we're discussing; Box2D and pyBox2D are not licensed under the GPL. While the complaint in general is reasonable, please don't accuse people of breaching software licenses until they actually do so. Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] Flash at Sugar Labs
Hi, This might be of interest: Salasaga is a GTK/Gnome based IDE used to create eLearning for applications. With it, you take screenshots of your applications, add highlights, text and external images, then generate learning objects. Present output is in swf (flash) format. Here's another app that appeared in my RSS reader today, I haven't tried it; it seems to contain some of the ideas Bryan's interested in, though: http://www.blueskyonmars.com/2009/01/05/build-desktop-apps-with-web-ui-and-python/ http://titaniumapp.com/ - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] Flash at Sugar Labs
Hi, When the primary mission - educating the world's least served children - comes into conflict with Software Freedom, which one wins? How do you explain that to the deployments? This is a fine question. Here's my shot at it. First, I think it would be a mistake to think that we're the only group of people, or the only software project, interested in educating these children. It would be helpful for me, then, if we could be more specific about what we in particular are trying to do (although it contains the risk that we won't agree on that). It seems to me that Sugar exists because we claim at least the following failings of most educational software projects: * they don't allow the knowledge they contain to be *appropriated*. For example, translated into other languages or cultures so that it can be useful for the entire world, or modified, commented on and discussed. They might choose to disallow this technically (by not providing a method to perform the appropriation) or socially (by actively disallowing it). * they don't allow children to be *creators*, and not just consumers. We believe, as a consensus, that the best way to learn is by creation and problem-solving rather than by being dictated to. * they don't allow learning to be *collaborated upon*, critiqued, and conducted jointly. I'm sure this is less eloquent than the text that's already been written on our goals, but it's a start. What follows from it is that we should build software that: * is eminently modifiable by all, so that it can be appropriated into areas of the world and use cases that its authors did not consider. * should allow not just the consumption of content, but its outright creation. * should provide for pervasive sharing. Why did I just repeat all of this? It makes it easy for me to see that a system like Flash is not (yet) appropriate software for learning as we envision it, because it would not support our strategy of _how_ to achieve education of the world's children, and that strategy is our reason for not sitting back and letting the rest of the software projects out there solve the problem for us. For this reason, I would support having Sugar Labs advocate against the use of Flash, and think I can do this in an intellectually honest way. This doesn't mean I would stop someone from writing a Flash player wrapper if they want to, and it means I would likely change my mind if free Flash players and editors became more available. Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Request for help packaging activities for Sugar on a Stick
Hi Caroline, But Sugar without activities is boring!! We need you and your activities! Please help us get activities quickly ported to Sugar on a Stick, we have a lot of people pounding on our doors to try it. I don't suggest waiting for activities to be packaged, and no porting should be required: can't you just preinstall a bunch of .xo files? Thanks, - Chris. -- Chris Ball c...@laptop.org ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
