Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] copy files to/from server
On Mon, 2011-05-23 at 15:32 +1000, Sridhar Dhanapalan wrote: Sadly, we can't use Moodle. One state here in Australia doesn't like it, Doesn't like it? Are you kidding me? -- Donna Benjamin - Executive Director Creative Contingencies - http://cc.com.au ph +61 3 9326 9985 - mob +61 418 310 414 Drupal Downunder 14-15 January 2012 Jasper Hotel, Melbourne ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] copy files to/from server
On 23 May 2011 15:43, fors...@ozonline.com.au wrote: Sadly, we can't use Moodle. One state here in Australia doesn't like it, to the point where we're going to have to disable or remove it. That makes things interesting :( That still leaves Sharepoint and Blackboard? Assuming that a Sharepoint/Blackboard/similar server exists *in the school*. We cannot make that assumption, and we are not going to get into the business of distributing/installing/supporting Sharepoint or Blackboard. I think I like tch's idea of connecting to remote resources through the Sugar UI. Sridhar ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] copy files to/from server
On Mon, May 23, 2011 at 1:41 AM, Sridhar Dhanapalan srid...@laptop.org.au wrote: Interesting. Does WebDAV work as a normal mount, like CIFS or NFS? From the PoV of the user, yes, it looks like a mountpoint. Technically, you can mount it at the linux kernel level, at the gnome IO libraries level, or from Sugar, with a pure python implmentation. What would be the best way to get this working on Sugar? You don't have a lot of time it seems. I'd implement it on top of gnome VFS of in pure Python. In both cases, I'd make it look like another disk from the Journal (as an initial implementation at least). I'd say talk with Martin Abente, he's looking into this problem space. cheers, m -- martin.langh...@gmail.com mar...@laptop.org -- Software Architect - OLPC - ask interesting questions - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] copy files to/from server
On 21 May 2011 03:49, Martin Langhoff martin.langh...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, May 20, 2011 at 2:12 AM, fors...@ozonline.com.au wrote: why not use Moodle or Sharepoint or Blackboard? Yeah - there's an easy-installation Moodle package. That's what I'd go with. Sadly, we can't use Moodle. One state here in Australia doesn't like it, to the point where we're going to have to disable or remove it. That makes things interesting :( Ideally we want to be able to use a resource that is present in the school, rather than requiring a round-trip across the Internet to a server somewhere else. Sridhar ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] copy files to/from server
On 19 May 2011 04:15, Martin Langhoff martin.langh...@gmail.com wrote: For file management, I very strongly recommend using WebDAV. It is a bit less efficient than real network file system protocols, but the benefits are many: - more flexibilty - closer to you and me in the stack - you can easily find WebDAV toolkits in HLLs that allow you to expose your data as files and directories over WebDAV, as well as client implementations - it deals reasonably gracefully with intermittent connectivity (SMB/CIFS, NFS, etc get you nasty system freezes if the server disappears) - wide range of (fairly well behaved) client and server implementations - a good test suite for the server side - On the XS side... Moodle has a WebDAV implementation and Apache has one too. Interesting. Does WebDAV work as a normal mount, like CIFS or NFS? What would be the best way to get this working on Sugar? Thanks, Sridhar ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] copy files to/from server
On Fri, May 20, 2011 at 2:12 AM, fors...@ozonline.com.au wrote: why not use Moodle or Sharepoint or Blackboard? Yeah - there's an easy-installation Moodle package. That's what I'd go with. m -- martin.langh...@gmail.com mar...@laptop.org -- Software Architect - OLPC - ask interesting questions - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] copy files to/from server
On 18 May 2011 02:34, Martin Langhoff martin.langh...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Sridhar, I don't fully understand your scenario. I'll admit that I was vague. Let me clarify... You say an XS is not an option... but I thought you were using XS, with Jerry's help? If you are using XS, you can use Moodle. We are actively engaged in XS development. However, schools and departments of education are not ready for it at this stage. The XS-AU installations that we do have are quite successful. There's a lot I can say on this topic based on the situation in Australian schools, but I'll have to leave that for a later date. For the foreseeable future, we'll have to manage in most schools without XSs. If there is no XS, then any webbased tool that offers a file upload form to post a file to share will work. You can install Moodle (even on Windows servers ;-) ), or Mahara, or WordPad or anything you like. In a pure-MS world, it will probably work with Sharepoint if it has a usable web frontend. Unfortuntely, there's no easy way to do it with CIFS or NFS -- it would be an interesting addition to Sugar (possibly to the Journal) but it's a big project. The schools have Windows-based servers that I know for sure allow CIFS connections. I'll have to investigate if there are alternate means of connecting (maybe a Web interface). Cheers, Sridhar ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] copy files to/from server
Excerpts from Martin Langhoff's message of Tue May 17 18:34:09 +0200 2011: Unfortuntely, there's no easy way to do it with CIFS or NFS -- it would be an interesting addition to Sugar (possibly to the Journal) but it's a big project. NFS mounts do turn up as storage devices in the Journal (at least on Debian Squeeze). They will be treated exactly the same as other storage devices, i.e. USB sticks and SD cards. I would expect CIFS mounts to behave the same way. Don't forget to tweak the mount options to avoid processes from going zombie-like on connection loss. If you had an XS, you could probably use the DataManager activity [1]. A properly configured HTTP server will at least allow you serve a) any kind of content with a proper Content-Type (- mime_type) directly (but without other metadata) and b) Journal Entry Bundles [2] including full metadata. There's currently no way to create a (single-entry) JEB directly from within Sugar. Writing an activity that does so shouldn't be hard; you can copy the bundle generation parts from Backup [3]. Sascha [1] http://activities.sugarlabs.org/en-US/sugar/addon/4208 [2] http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Journal_entry_bundles [3] http://activities.sugarlabs.org/en-US/sugar/addon/4326 -- http://sascha.silbe.org/ http://www.infra-silbe.de/ signature.asc Description: PGP signature ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] copy files to/from server
On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 5:15 PM, Martin Abente martin.abente.lah...@gmail.com wrote: I still didn't make up my mind about which technical approach should I take in order to get this working, but I guess people already started sharing some ideas. And I would appreciate more ideas and discussion before I get to that point. ok - some notes from me on this topic For file management, I very strongly recommend using WebDAV. It is a bit less efficient than real network file system protocols, but the benefits are many: - more flexibilty - closer to you and me in the stack - you can easily find WebDAV toolkits in HLLs that allow you to expose your data as files and directories over WebDAV, as well as client implementations - it deals reasonably gracefully with intermittent connectivity (SMB/CIFS, NFS, etc get you nasty system freezes if the server disappears) - wide range of (fairly well behaved) client and server implementations - a good test suite for the server side - On the XS side... Moodle has a WebDAV implementation and Apache has one too. From the department of optimizations to keep in mind early (but implement late...) -- if ds-backup is working correctly, you'll have most of the content already on the XS. Might be a nice optimisation to skip transferring it -- if you have a msg exchange *before* the WebDAV (or other) file transfer. The very basic requirement is: each children must have its private cloud volume, where they can drop their files in the same way they interact with physical external storage devices. Why would I drop the file there? In my understanding, what you want to do with it is *publish* it. On top of that we can do a lot of things that might be very useful for teachers daily in the classrooms. Yeah - *publish it to my classroom group* -- via Moodle. I've worked for ~10 years with teachers and that's what they want to do 99.9% of the time -- publish it to the group. If we do that nicely, we're golden. cheers, m -- martin.langh...@gmail.com mar...@laptop.org -- Software Architect - OLPC - ask interesting questions - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] copy files to/from server
Hi Sridhar, I don't fully understand your scenario. You say an XS is not an option... but I thought you were using XS, with Jerry's help? If you are using XS, you can use Moodle. If there is no XS, then any webbased tool that offers a file upload form to post a file to share will work. You can install Moodle (even on Windows servers ;-) ), or Mahara, or WordPad or anything you like. In a pure-MS world, it will probably work with Sharepoint if it has a usable web frontend. Unfortuntely, there's no easy way to do it with CIFS or NFS -- it would be an interesting addition to Sugar (possibly to the Journal) but it's a big project. hth, m On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 3:42 AM, Sridhar Dhanapalan srid...@laptop.org.au wrote: How can XOs copy files to/from their Journal with a server? We want the ability for teachers to easily make files available for children, and for children to upload to the server. It's not practical to install another server (so an XS is not an option). Most schools have a Windows-based server, so they could use CIFS files shares. Accessing this is doable through GNOME, but not in Sugar with the Journal. Sridhar Dhanapalan Technical Manager One Laptop per Child Australia M: +61 425 239 701 E: srid...@laptop.org.au A: G.P.O. Box 731 Sydney, NSW 2001 W: www.laptop.org.au ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) i...@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep -- martin.langh...@gmail.com mar...@laptop.org -- Software Architect - OLPC - ask interesting questions - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] copy files to/from server
On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 11:34 AM, Martin Langhoff martin.langh...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Sridhar, I don't fully understand your scenario. You say an XS is not an option... but I thought you were using XS, with Jerry's help? If you are using XS, you can use Moodle. If there is no XS, then any webbased tool that offers a file upload form to post a file to share will work. You can install Moodle (even on Windows servers ;-) ), or Mahara, or WordPad or anything you like. In a pure-MS world, it will probably work with Sharepoint if it has a usable web frontend. Unfortuntely, there's no easy way to do it with CIFS or NFS -- it would be an interesting addition to Sugar (possibly to the Journal) but it's a big project. hth, Not sure if this matches your needs but there is also an activity that you can use or modify. http://activities.sugarlabs.org/en-US/sugar/addon/4266 m On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 3:42 AM, Sridhar Dhanapalan srid...@laptop.org.au wrote: How can XOs copy files to/from their Journal with a server? We want the ability for teachers to easily make files available for children, and for children to upload to the server. It's not practical to install another server (so an XS is not an option). Most schools have a Windows-based server, so they could use CIFS files shares. Accessing this is doable through GNOME, but not in Sugar with the Journal. Sridhar Dhanapalan Technical Manager One Laptop per Child Australia M: +61 425 239 701 E: srid...@laptop.org.au A: G.P.O. Box 731 Sydney, NSW 2001 W: www.laptop.org.au ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) i...@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep -- martin.langh...@gmail.com mar...@laptop.org -- Software Architect - OLPC - ask interesting questions - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] copy files to/from server
On Tue, May 17, 2011 3:42 am, Sridhar Dhanapalan wrote: How can XOs copy files to/from their Journal with a server? We want the ability for teachers to easily make files available for children, and for children to upload to the server. This appears to be a problem for the Devel list. If the server can be made to appear in the frame in much the same way that an inserted USB drive appears, this task will be easy. Or I should say, a shared folder on the server, perhaps one per class or one per child. I would recommend that you file a feature request on Trac. It's not practical to install another server (so an XS is not an option). Most schools have a Windows-based server, so they could use CIFS files shares. Accessing this is doable through GNOME, but not in Sugar with the Journal. Sridhar Dhanapalan Technical Manager One Laptop per Child Australia M: +61 425 239 701 E: srid...@laptop.org.au A: G.P.O. Box 731 Sydney, NSW 2001 W: www.laptop.org.au ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) i...@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep -- Edward Mokurai (#40664;#38647;/#2343;#2352;#2381;#2350;#2350;#2375;#2328;#2358;#2348;#2381;#2342;#2327;#2352;#2381;#2332;/#1583;#1726;#1585;#1605;#1605;#1740;#1711;#1726;#1588;#1576;#1583;#1711;#1585; #1580;) Cherlin Silent Thunder is my name, and Children are my nation. The Cosmos is my dwelling place, the Truth my destination. http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Replacing_Textbooks ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] copy files to/from server
On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 4:47 PM, moku...@earthtreasury.org wrote: On Tue, May 17, 2011 3:42 am, Sridhar Dhanapalan wrote: How can XOs copy files to/from their Journal with a server? We want the ability for teachers to easily make files available for children, and for children to upload to the server. This appears to be a problem for the Devel list. If the server can be made to appear in the frame in much the same way that an inserted USB drive appears, this task will be easy. Or I should say, a shared folder on the server, perhaps one per class or one per child. That is exactly the approach I plan to follow for next backup system in dextrose 3 OS build! In the previous dextrose versions we simply used dsd's scripts to rsync the datastore folder (raw). But we also think that emulating the volumes would work a lot better + multi-selection for journal entries which I plan to start working this week :) I would recommend that you file a feature request on Trac. It's not practical to install another server (so an XS is not an option). Most schools have a Windows-based server, so they could use CIFS files shares. Accessing this is doable through GNOME, but not in Sugar with the Journal. Sridhar Dhanapalan Technical Manager One Laptop per Child Australia M: +61 425 239 701 E: srid...@laptop.org.au A: G.P.O. Box 731 Sydney, NSW 2001 W: www.laptop.org.au ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) i...@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep -- Edward Mokurai (#40664;#38647;/#2343;#2352;#2381;#2350;#2350;#2375;#2328;#2358;#2348;#2381;#2342;#2327;#2352;#2381;#2332;/#1583;#1726;#1585;#1605;#1605;#1740;#1711;#1726;#1588;#1576;#1583;#1711;#1585; #1580;) Cherlin Silent Thunder is my name, and Children are my nation. The Cosmos is my dwelling place, the Truth my destination. http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Replacing_Textbooks ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) i...@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
