Re: [Sugar-devel] Pippy not ready for Sucrose

2009-02-23 Thread Simon Schampijer
Brian Jordan wrote:
 On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 2:21 PM, Simon Schampijer si...@schampijer.de wrote:
 Simon Schampijer wrote:
 Hi,

 the Sucrose package of Pippy is version 25 - when I last released it
 back in August. Since then there has been some development going into
 Pippy (now version 30)
 http://dev.laptop.org/git?p=projects/pippy-activity;a=shortlog

 But none of the maintainers did follow the Sucrose release cycle, even
 though I sent a reminder
 http://lists.laptop.org/pipermail/sugar/2008-November/010021.html

 Any, specific reason for that? Pippy has not been moved to
 git.sugarlabs.org, as well.

 please indicate clearly:
 * if you still want to be part of Sucrose (including following the
 release cycle)
 * any new maintainer that is willing to do this task if you does not want to
 * any issues/reasons you have to do so

 Best,
 Simon

 To follow up on this, I mainly want to find a maintainer for Pippy for
 Sucrose. If there is no one willing to do that we drop it, which is ok -
 one can still download the xo etc, I just want a clearer situation.

 Hi,
 
 I will maintain Pippy for Sucrose, though I may need a bit of hand holding.
 
 Please let me know if what I did seems correct (esp. step 2):
 
 1. l got the most recent version of Pippy from git
 git-clone git://dev.laptop.org/projects/pippy-activity
 cd pippy-activity
 
 2. ./setup.py gave a bunch of invalid entry in MANIFEST errors about
 different locales, so I ran:
 ./setup.py fix_manifest
 
 3. ./setup.py dist_source
 
 4. I asked a crank sysadmin to add me to the Sugar group,
 And I moved Pippy-30.tar.bz2 to:
 http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/Pippy/Pippy-30.tar.bz2 (805K)
 
 I will move pippy over to git.sugarlabs.org as well.
 
 Thanks,
 Brian

Hi Brian,

where are we with that? Pippy is the only activity of fructose that has 
not been moved to sugarlabs services (trac and git). Are you still 
planning to?

Cheers,
Simon
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Re: [Sugar-devel] Pippy not ready for Sucrose

2009-02-23 Thread Brian Jordan
Hi Simon,

Yup, I will have it completed this week. Apologies for my recent
absence, and thanks for the reminder:

-- Forwarded message --
From: Brian Jordan bcjor...@gmail.com
Date: Mon, Feb 23, 2009 at 3:10 PM
Subject: Re: Migrating activities from OLPC to SL
To: David Farning dfarn...@sugarlabs.org
Cc: Wade Brainerd wad...@gmail.com


Hey David and Wade,

On Mon, Feb 23, 2009 at 2:42 PM, David Farning dfarn...@sugarlabs.org wrote:
 Brian,
 We are handing off development and distribution of Sugar activities
 from OLPC to the SL community.

 Would you please insure that your activities:
 1. Have been migrated to http://git.sugarlabs.org for a source code 
 repository.
 2. Are being tracked via pootle for internationalization.
 3. Are registered in the the Sugar Labs bug tracker at
 http://dev.sugarlabs.org .
 4. Have been uploaded to http://addons.sugarlabs.org for distribution.

 We have you listed as working on or maintaining:

 help
 physics*
 pippy

Will do, I'll have that done this week.  Thanks for the heads up, and
sorry for my radio silence the past couple weeks.  I've been taking
some time off to complete my college transfer applications.

Cheers,
Brian


 I have cced Wade the Sugar Labs activity Team Leader in case you have
 any questions.

 thanks
 david




On Mon, Feb 23, 2009 at 4:41 PM, Simon Schampijer si...@schampijer.de wrote:
 Brian Jordan wrote:
 On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 2:21 PM, Simon Schampijer si...@schampijer.de 
 wrote:
 Simon Schampijer wrote:
 Hi,

 the Sucrose package of Pippy is version 25 - when I last released it
 back in August. Since then there has been some development going into
 Pippy (now version 30)
 http://dev.laptop.org/git?p=projects/pippy-activity;a=shortlog

 But none of the maintainers did follow the Sucrose release cycle, even
 though I sent a reminder
 http://lists.laptop.org/pipermail/sugar/2008-November/010021.html

 Any, specific reason for that? Pippy has not been moved to
 git.sugarlabs.org, as well.

 please indicate clearly:
 * if you still want to be part of Sucrose (including following the
 release cycle)
 * any new maintainer that is willing to do this task if you does not want 
 to
 * any issues/reasons you have to do so

 Best,
 Simon

 To follow up on this, I mainly want to find a maintainer for Pippy for
 Sucrose. If there is no one willing to do that we drop it, which is ok -
 one can still download the xo etc, I just want a clearer situation.

 Hi,

 I will maintain Pippy for Sucrose, though I may need a bit of hand holding.

 Please let me know if what I did seems correct (esp. step 2):

 1. l got the most recent version of Pippy from git
 git-clone git://dev.laptop.org/projects/pippy-activity
 cd pippy-activity

 2. ./setup.py gave a bunch of invalid entry in MANIFEST errors about
 different locales, so I ran:
 ./setup.py fix_manifest

 3. ./setup.py dist_source

 4. I asked a crank sysadmin to add me to the Sugar group,
 And I moved Pippy-30.tar.bz2 to:
 http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/Pippy/Pippy-30.tar.bz2 (805K)

 I will move pippy over to git.sugarlabs.org as well.

 Thanks,
 Brian

 Hi Brian,

 where are we with that? Pippy is the only activity of fructose that has
 not been moved to sugarlabs services (trac and git). Are you still
 planning to?

 Cheers,
Simon
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Re: [Sugar-devel] Pippy not ready for Sucrose

2009-01-27 Thread Simon Schampijer
Brian Jordan wrote:
 On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 2:21 PM, Simon Schampijer si...@schampijer.de wrote:
 Simon Schampijer wrote:
 Hi,

 the Sucrose package of Pippy is version 25 - when I last released it
 back in August. Since then there has been some development going into
 Pippy (now version 30)
 http://dev.laptop.org/git?p=projects/pippy-activity;a=shortlog

 But none of the maintainers did follow the Sucrose release cycle, even
 though I sent a reminder
 http://lists.laptop.org/pipermail/sugar/2008-November/010021.html

 Any, specific reason for that? Pippy has not been moved to
 git.sugarlabs.org, as well.

 please indicate clearly:
 * if you still want to be part of Sucrose (including following the
 release cycle)
 * any new maintainer that is willing to do this task if you does not want to
 * any issues/reasons you have to do so

 Best,
 Simon

 To follow up on this, I mainly want to find a maintainer for Pippy for
 Sucrose. If there is no one willing to do that we drop it, which is ok -
 one can still download the xo etc, I just want a clearer situation.

 Hi,

Hi Brian,

this is awesome!

 I will maintain Pippy for Sucrose, though I may need a bit of hand holding.

Hand holding we provide as a default service, you are always welcome to 
ask if things are unclear.

 Please let me know if what I did seems correct (esp. step 2):
 
 1. l got the most recent version of Pippy from git
 git-clone git://dev.laptop.org/projects/pippy-activity
 cd pippy-activity
 
 2. ./setup.py gave a bunch of invalid entry in MANIFEST errors about
 different locales, so I ran:
 ./setup.py fix_manifest

Did you use 0.82 when doing ./setup.py dist_source?

The dist_source command uses git-ls-files to get the files it will 
package into the tarball. So only files that are in git will get into 
the source tarball.

The dist_xo command uses the manifest as a source to determine the files 
present. Only files in the manifest will be present in the bundle.

There was an error in the activitybundle code in 0.82 that tried to read 
the manifest as well in the source case - which is not needed. Hence, 
the warnings you saw about the incorrect manifest should not be seen 
when packaging the sources. This is fixed in recent code.

Hope to have explained a bit the possible story around this error.

 3. ./setup.py dist_source
 
 4. I asked a crank sysadmin to add me to the Sugar group,
 And I moved Pippy-30.tar.bz2 to:
 http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/Pippy/Pippy-30.tar.bz2 (805K)

The exact release process for the Sucrose release is described here: 
http://sugarlabs.org/go/DevelopmentTeam/Release#Fructose

 I will move pippy over to git.sugarlabs.org as well.

Instructions for that can be found at: 
http://sugarlabs.org/go/DevelopmentTeam/Git#Import_a_module_from_dev.laptop.org

 Thanks,
 Brian

Thank you,
Simon

 Wade, do you have maybe someone in mind?

 Cheers,
Simon

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Re: [Sugar-devel] Pippy not ready for Sucrose

2009-01-26 Thread Brian Jordan
On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 2:21 PM, Simon Schampijer si...@schampijer.de wrote:
 Simon Schampijer wrote:
 Hi,

 the Sucrose package of Pippy is version 25 - when I last released it
 back in August. Since then there has been some development going into
 Pippy (now version 30)
 http://dev.laptop.org/git?p=projects/pippy-activity;a=shortlog

 But none of the maintainers did follow the Sucrose release cycle, even
 though I sent a reminder
 http://lists.laptop.org/pipermail/sugar/2008-November/010021.html

 Any, specific reason for that? Pippy has not been moved to
 git.sugarlabs.org, as well.

 please indicate clearly:
 * if you still want to be part of Sucrose (including following the
 release cycle)
 * any new maintainer that is willing to do this task if you does not want to
 * any issues/reasons you have to do so

 Best,
 Simon


 To follow up on this, I mainly want to find a maintainer for Pippy for
 Sucrose. If there is no one willing to do that we drop it, which is ok -
 one can still download the xo etc, I just want a clearer situation.

Hi,

I will maintain Pippy for Sucrose, though I may need a bit of hand holding.

Please let me know if what I did seems correct (esp. step 2):

1. l got the most recent version of Pippy from git
git-clone git://dev.laptop.org/projects/pippy-activity
cd pippy-activity

2. ./setup.py gave a bunch of invalid entry in MANIFEST errors about
different locales, so I ran:
./setup.py fix_manifest

3. ./setup.py dist_source

4. I asked a crank sysadmin to add me to the Sugar group,
And I moved Pippy-30.tar.bz2 to:
http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/Pippy/Pippy-30.tar.bz2 (805K)

I will move pippy over to git.sugarlabs.org as well.

Thanks,
Brian


 Wade, do you have maybe someone in mind?

 Cheers,
Simon

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Re: [Sugar-devel] Pippy not ready for Sucrose

2009-01-26 Thread Wade Brainerd
Awesome, thank you Brian for stepping up!
Is something additional required in order to make sure the activity runs
properly in SoaS or jhbuild?

-Wade

On Mon, Jan 26, 2009 at 2:14 PM, Brian Jordan br...@laptop.org wrote:

 On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 2:21 PM, Simon Schampijer si...@schampijer.de
 wrote:
  Simon Schampijer wrote:
  Hi,
 
  the Sucrose package of Pippy is version 25 - when I last released it
  back in August. Since then there has been some development going into
  Pippy (now version 30)
  http://dev.laptop.org/git?p=projects/pippy-activity;a=shortlog
 
  But none of the maintainers did follow the Sucrose release cycle, even
  though I sent a reminder
  http://lists.laptop.org/pipermail/sugar/2008-November/010021.html
 
  Any, specific reason for that? Pippy has not been moved to
  git.sugarlabs.org, as well.
 
  please indicate clearly:
  * if you still want to be part of Sucrose (including following the
  release cycle)
  * any new maintainer that is willing to do this task if you does not
 want to
  * any issues/reasons you have to do so
 
  Best,
  Simon
 
 
  To follow up on this, I mainly want to find a maintainer for Pippy for
  Sucrose. If there is no one willing to do that we drop it, which is ok -
  one can still download the xo etc, I just want a clearer situation.
 
 Hi,

 I will maintain Pippy for Sucrose, though I may need a bit of hand holding.

 Please let me know if what I did seems correct (esp. step 2):

 1. l got the most recent version of Pippy from git
 git-clone git://dev.laptop.org/projects/pippy-activity
 cd pippy-activity

 2. ./setup.py gave a bunch of invalid entry in MANIFEST errors about
 different locales, so I ran:
 ./setup.py fix_manifest

 3. ./setup.py dist_source

 4. I asked a crank sysadmin to add me to the Sugar group,
 And I moved Pippy-30.tar.bz2 to:
 http://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/Pippy/Pippy-30.tar.bz2 (805K)

 I will move pippy over to git.sugarlabs.org as well.

 Thanks,
 Brian


  Wade, do you have maybe someone in mind?
 
  Cheers,
 Simon
 
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Re: [Sugar-devel] Pippy not ready for Sucrose

2009-01-23 Thread Wade Brainerd
I don't have anyone in mind immediately who is not reading this list,.  If
anyone is willing to step up to maintain Pippy with the Sucrose release
schedule please contact me or reply to this emaiml.  So far, the
ActivityTeam has a few members but we are not really organized as yet, and
time commitments aren't clear.  I plan to try to get things more organized
next week now that the initial flurry has settled down.

Additionally, the AT needs to decide as a group which activities we want to
invest the extra effort in to maintain for Sucrose.  For now, it's
definitely important to do so, but I forsee that in the future Sucrose will
just have a list of links to .xo files.

Best,
-Wade

On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 2:21 PM, Simon Schampijer si...@schampijer.dewrote:

 Simon Schampijer wrote:
  Hi,
 
  the Sucrose package of Pippy is version 25 - when I last released it
  back in August. Since then there has been some development going into
  Pippy (now version 30)
  http://dev.laptop.org/git?p=projects/pippy-activity;a=shortlog
 
  But none of the maintainers did follow the Sucrose release cycle, even
  though I sent a reminder
  http://lists.laptop.org/pipermail/sugar/2008-November/010021.html
 
  Any, specific reason for that? Pippy has not been moved to
  git.sugarlabs.org, as well.
 
  please indicate clearly:
  * if you still want to be part of Sucrose (including following the
  release cycle)
  * any new maintainer that is willing to do this task if you does not want
 to
  * any issues/reasons you have to do so
 
  Best,
  Simon


 To follow up on this, I mainly want to find a maintainer for Pippy for
 Sucrose. If there is no one willing to do that we drop it, which is ok -
 one can still download the xo etc, I just want a clearer situation.

 Wade, do you have maybe someone in mind?

 Cheers,
 Simon

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Re: [Sugar-devel] Pippy not ready for Sucrose

2009-01-20 Thread Jonas Smedegaard
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 12:27:08PM +0100, Simon Schampijer wrote:
the Sucrose package of Pippy is version 25 - when I last released it 
back in August. Since then there has been some development going into 
Pippy (now version 30) 
http://dev.laptop.org/git?p=projects/pippy-activity;a=shortlog

But none of the maintainers did follow the Sucrose release cycle, even 
though I sent a reminder 
http://lists.laptop.org/pipermail/sugar/2008-November/010021.html

Any, specific reason for that? Pippy has not been moved to 
git.sugarlabs.org, as well.


(this is related, but does not actually answer above)

If I recall correctly, recent releases of Pippy depend on box2d which is 
not yet packaged for Debian. This means newer Pippy releases will not 
work on next official Debian release (codenamed Lenny).

I've tried but have had problems compiling it cleanly using newest gcc 
toolchain (if I recall correctly).


  - Jonas

- -- 
* Jonas Smedegaard - idealist og Internet-arkitekt
* Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/

  [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private
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iEYEARECAAYFAkl15AEACgkQn7DbMsAkQLi8UACfVUE1Qa6T5fltU5oC55v7aOtq
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Re: [Sugar-devel] Pippy not ready for Sucrose

2009-01-20 Thread Nirav Patel
PyBox2D is included locally in the activity, just as it is in Physics,
x2o, Bridge, and other Activities that use physics.  Though, that is
~2.5mB of duplicated libraries for each.

Nirav

On 1/20/09, Jonas Smedegaard d...@jones.dk wrote:
 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1

 On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 12:27:08PM +0100, Simon Schampijer wrote:
the Sucrose package of Pippy is version 25 - when I last released it
back in August. Since then there has been some development going into
Pippy (now version 30)
http://dev.laptop.org/git?p=projects/pippy-activity;a=shortlog

But none of the maintainers did follow the Sucrose release cycle, even
though I sent a reminder
http://lists.laptop.org/pipermail/sugar/2008-November/010021.html

Any, specific reason for that? Pippy has not been moved to
git.sugarlabs.org, as well.


 (this is related, but does not actually answer above)

 If I recall correctly, recent releases of Pippy depend on box2d which is
 not yet packaged for Debian. This means newer Pippy releases will not
 work on next official Debian release (codenamed Lenny).

 I've tried but have had problems compiling it cleanly using newest gcc
 toolchain (if I recall correctly).


   - Jonas

 - --
 * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist og Internet-arkitekt
 * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/

   [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private
 -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
 Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux)

 iEYEARECAAYFAkl15AEACgkQn7DbMsAkQLi8UACfVUE1Qa6T5fltU5oC55v7aOtq
 kMsAoJwujsqw6Y12l50THI+HMWWN331n
 =YX2i
 -END PGP SIGNATURE-
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Re: [Sugar-devel] Pippy not ready for Sucrose

2009-01-20 Thread Jonas Smedegaard
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 01:10:11PM -0500, Nirav Patel wrote:
PyBox2D is included locally in the activity, just as it is in Physics, 
x2o, Bridge, and other Activities that use physics.  Though, that is 
~2.5mB of duplicated libraries for each.

...which causes such .xo packages to *not* be arch-independent!

...and makes bugs in those libraries harder and slower to fix!


Also, distributing such .xo packages violates license if not either the 
full source is included as well or a written statement promising to 
provide sources at no exceptional charge if later requested.

Distributing binary stuff without its sources is not outright bad, but 
more complex and often more cumbersome: It is asking for surprises!



  - Jonas

- -- 
* Jonas Smedegaard - idealist og Internet-arkitekt
* Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/

  [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux)

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Re: [Sugar-devel] Pippy not ready for Sucrose

2009-01-20 Thread Luke Faraone
On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 2:03 PM, Jonas Smedegaard d...@jones.dk wrote:

 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1

 On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 01:10:11PM -0500, Nirav Patel wrote:
 PyBox2D is included locally in the activity, just as it is in Physics,
 x2o, Bridge, and other Activities that use physics.  Though, that is
 ~2.5mB of duplicated libraries for each.

 ...which causes such .xo packages to *not* be arch-independent!

 ...and makes bugs in those libraries harder and slower to fix!


... which reiterates the need for a .xos package a la source debs/rpms so
that I can run xomake to build the binary package, as well as proper dep
handing both on the XO and elsewhere.


-- 
Luke Faraone
http://luke.faraone.cc
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Re: [Sugar-devel] Pippy not ready for Sucrose

2009-01-20 Thread Nirav Patel
I prefer to look at it pragmatically.  Until there is some kind of
dependency handling for .xo packages, this is the difference between a
child at an existing deployment being able to browse to the wiki,
download an activity, and use it, or not being able to.

Nirav

On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 2:03 PM, Jonas Smedegaard d...@jones.dk wrote:
 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1

 On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 01:10:11PM -0500, Nirav Patel wrote:
PyBox2D is included locally in the activity, just as it is in Physics,
x2o, Bridge, and other Activities that use physics.  Though, that is
~2.5mB of duplicated libraries for each.

 ...which causes such .xo packages to *not* be arch-independent!

 ...and makes bugs in those libraries harder and slower to fix!


 Also, distributing such .xo packages violates license if not either the
 full source is included as well or a written statement promising to
 provide sources at no exceptional charge if later requested.

 Distributing binary stuff without its sources is not outright bad, but
 more complex and often more cumbersome: It is asking for surprises!



  - Jonas
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Re: [Sugar-devel] Pippy not ready for Sucrose

2009-01-20 Thread Luke Faraone
On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 5:21 PM, Nirav Patel o...@spongezone.net wrote:

 I prefer to look at it pragmatically.  Until there is some kind of
 dependency handling for .xo packages, this is the difference between a
 child at an existing deployment being able to browse to the wiki,
 download an activity, and use it, or not being able to.


It's also the difference between following the license terms and not.

-- 
Luke Faraone
http://luke.faraone.cc
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Re: [Sugar-devel] Pippy not ready for Sucrose

2009-01-20 Thread Wade Brainerd
It's important to separate the pragmatism from the license concern.
I fully support the pragmatism of shipping libraries with activities as a
temporary solution, if that's what is needed to make the activity work.

If the license *requires* us to include the source code to the compiled
module (is a link sufficient??) in the activity bundle, I guess we have to
do that too.  But that's a separate issue.

Cheers,
Wade

On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 6:18 PM, Luke Faraone l...@faraone.cc wrote:

 On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 5:21 PM, Nirav Patel o...@spongezone.net wrote:

 I prefer to look at it pragmatically.  Until there is some kind of
 dependency handling for .xo packages, this is the difference between a
 child at an existing deployment being able to browse to the wiki,
 download an activity, and use it, or not being able to.


 It's also the difference between following the license terms and not.

 --
 Luke Faraone
 http://luke.faraone.cc

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Re: [Sugar-devel] Pippy not ready for Sucrose

2009-01-20 Thread Chris Ball
Hi,

I prefer to look at it pragmatically. Until there is some kind of
dependency handling for .xo packages, this is the difference
between a child at an existing deployment being able to browse to
the wiki, download an activity, and use it, or not being able to.

It's also the difference between following the license terms and
not.

Not in the case we're discussing; Box2D and pyBox2D are not licensed
under the GPL.  While the complaint in general is reasonable, please
don't accuse people of breaching software licenses until they actually
do so.

Thanks,

- Chris.
-- 
Chris Ball   c...@laptop.org
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Re: [Sugar-devel] Pippy not ready for Sucrose

2009-01-20 Thread Jonas Smedegaard
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On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 06:24:48PM -0500, Chris Ball wrote:
Hi,

I prefer to look at it pragmatically. Until there is some kind of 
dependency handling for .xo packages, this is the difference 
between a child at an existing deployment being able to browse to 
the wiki, download an activity, and use it, or not being able to.

It's also the difference between following the license terms and 
not.

Not in the case we're discussing; Box2D and pyBox2D are not licensed 
under the GPL.  While the complaint in general is reasonable, please 
don't accuse people of breaching software licenses until they actually 
do so.

I did not accuse of licensing breach, and I do not interpret Luke as 
doing so either.

What I did was mention _some_ of the problems _generally_ tied to 
shipping .xo packages stuffed with binary chunks.


  - Jonas

P.S.

And a moment ago I succeeded compiling Box2d on amd64 using GCC 4.3.2. 
Still some way to go to have it properly compiled, but a good step in 
the right direction.

- -- 
* Jonas Smedegaard - idealist og Internet-arkitekt
* Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/

   [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private
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