Fwd:

2018-08-10 Thread Michael Ossipoff 
-- Forwarded message --
From: John Davis via sundial 
Date: 2018-08-10 18:16 GMT-04:00
Subject:
To: Michael Ossipoff 
Cc: Sundial List 



Only on flat planes, not inside scaphes
>
> J.
>

Okay, thanks. I didn't know what a scaphe was. I thought it was just a
circle on the flat dial-plate. I didn't realize that it's concave.

...which would give it better hours-coverage for the Babylonian and Italian
hours.

Michael Ossipoff

Dr J Davis
Flowton Dials http://www.flowton-dials.co.uk/
BSS Editor http://sundialsoc.org.uk/publications/the-bss-bulletin/


On 10 Aug 2018, at 22:38, Michael Ossipoff  wrote:

Sara and John--

But it's said that the hour-lines for Babylonian, Italian, and co-Italian
hours are straight lines, as they are on all the other dials that I've seen
that have Babylonian &/or Italian hours.

Michael Ossipoff

On Fri, Aug 10, 2018 at 4:37 PM, Schechner, Sara 
wrote:

> I am camping at Stellafane with little connection, so will keep this brief
> until I return to civilization!
>
> The gnomon is adjustable for different latitudes.  The choice determines
> the correct horizontal scale to use around the compass.  The 2 pin gnomon
> scaphe sundial are for finding Italian and Babylonian (or Nuremberg
> hours).  The instrument with the spinning pointer is a wind vane.
> The instrument is made in Nuremberg in the early 17th century.
>
> Sara
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Aug 10, 2018, at 12:48 PM, Michael Ossipoff 
> wrote:
>
> Yes, the Boy Scouts of America at least used to sell a Compass-Oriented
> Dyptich dial with several concentric rings, each having different
> hour-lines, and with its string-gnomon adjustable for latitude, with
> several attachment-points on the vertical surface. I think it accommodated
> 3 latitudes. The hour-line rings were rectangular, it seems to me.
>
> Someone at this forum designed a universal Horizontal-Dial whose hour
> lines were curved lines originating from the gnomon-string's
> base-attrachment, with latitude-labeled concentric circles telling where to
> read the hour lines for the various latitudes.  ...and of course with the
> string-gnomon slidable in a vertical slot in the vertical surface.
>
> Michael Ossipoff
>
>
>
> On Fri, Aug 10, 2018 at 4:22 AM, Dan-George Uza 
> wrote:
>
>> Dear all,
>>
>> I've recently found this piece in a museum near me and I need your help
>> in dating it.
>>
>> Why are the hour marks offset? I suspect a correction for latitude. And
>> what do the two small circular dials on the bottom measure?
>>
>> Also what would be the purpose of the circular shape containing the
>> alidade? I suspect it has something to do with the winds.
>>
>> Any info will be highly appreciated.
>>
>> Thank you,
>>
>> Dan Uza
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ---
>> https://lists.uni-koeln.de/mailman/listinfo/sundial
>> 
>>
>>
>>
> ---
> https://lists.uni-koeln.de/mailman/listinfo/sundial
>
>
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[no subject]

2018-08-10 Thread John Davis via sundial 
Diese Nachricht wurde eingewickelt um DMARC-kompatibel zu sein. Die
eigentliche Nachricht steht dadurch in einem Anhang.

This message was wrapped to be DMARC compliant. The actual message
text is therefore in an attachment.--- Begin Message ---
Only on flat planes, not inside scaphes

J

Dr J Davis
Flowton Dials http://www.flowton-dials.co.uk/
BSS Editor http://sundialsoc.org.uk/publications/the-bss-bulletin/


> On 10 Aug 2018, at 22:38, Michael Ossipoff  wrote:
> 
> Sara and John--
> 
> But it's said that the hour-lines for Babylonian, Italian, and co-Italian 
> hours are straight lines, as they are on all the other dials that I've seen 
> that have Babylonian &/or Italian hours.
> 
> Michael Ossipoff
> 
>> On Fri, Aug 10, 2018 at 4:37 PM, Schechner, Sara  
>> wrote:
>> I am camping at Stellafane with little connection, so will keep this brief 
>> until I return to civilization!  
>> 
>> The gnomon is adjustable for different latitudes.  The choice determines the 
>> correct horizontal scale to use around the compass.  The 2 pin gnomon scaphe 
>> sundial are for finding Italian and Babylonian (or Nuremberg hours).  The 
>> instrument with the spinning pointer is a wind vane.
>> The instrument is made in Nuremberg in the early 17th century.
>> 
>> Sara
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On Aug 10, 2018, at 12:48 PM, Michael Ossipoff  
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> Yes, the Boy Scouts of America at least used to sell a Compass-Oriented 
>>> Dyptich dial with several concentric rings, each having different 
>>> hour-lines, and with its string-gnomon adjustable for latitude, with 
>>> several attachment-points on the vertical surface. I think it accommodated 
>>> 3 latitudes. The hour-line rings were rectangular, it seems to me.
>>> 
>>> Someone at this forum designed a universal Horizontal-Dial whose hour lines 
>>> were curved lines originating from the gnomon-string's base-attrachment, 
>>> with latitude-labeled concentric circles telling where to read the hour 
>>> lines for the various latitudes.  ...and of course with the string-gnomon 
>>> slidable in a vertical slot in the vertical surface.
>>> 
>>> Michael Ossipoff
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
 On Fri, Aug 10, 2018 at 4:22 AM, Dan-George Uza  
 wrote:
 Dear all,
 
 I've recently found this piece in a museum near me and I need your help in 
 dating it. 
 
 Why are the hour marks offset? I suspect a correction for latitude. And 
 what do the two small circular dials on the bottom measure?
 
 Also what would be the purpose of the circular shape containing the 
 alidade? I suspect it has something to do with the winds. 
 
 Any info will be highly appreciated.
 
 Thank you,
 
 Dan Uza
 
 
 
 
 ---
 https://lists.uni-koeln.de/mailman/listinfo/sundial
 
 
>>> 
>>> ---
>>> https://lists.uni-koeln.de/mailman/listinfo/sundial
>>> 
> 
> ---
> https://lists.uni-koeln.de/mailman/listinfo/sundial
> 
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Re: Dyptich sundial - help!

2018-08-10 Thread Michael Ossipoff 
Sara and John--

But it's said that the hour-lines for Babylonian, Italian, and co-Italian
hours are straight lines, as they are on all the other dials that I've seen
that have Babylonian &/or Italian hours.

Michael Ossipoff

On Fri, Aug 10, 2018 at 4:37 PM, Schechner, Sara 
wrote:

> I am camping at Stellafane with little connection, so will keep this brief
> until I return to civilization!
>
> The gnomon is adjustable for different latitudes.  The choice determines
> the correct horizontal scale to use around the compass.  The 2 pin gnomon
> scaphe sundial are for finding Italian and Babylonian (or Nuremberg
> hours).  The instrument with the spinning pointer is a wind vane.
> The instrument is made in Nuremberg in the early 17th century.
>
> Sara
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Aug 10, 2018, at 12:48 PM, Michael Ossipoff 
> wrote:
>
> Yes, the Boy Scouts of America at least used to sell a Compass-Oriented
> Dyptich dial with several concentric rings, each having different
> hour-lines, and with its string-gnomon adjustable for latitude, with
> several attachment-points on the vertical surface. I think it accommodated
> 3 latitudes. The hour-line rings were rectangular, it seems to me.
>
> Someone at this forum designed a universal Horizontal-Dial whose hour
> lines were curved lines originating from the gnomon-string's
> base-attrachment, with latitude-labeled concentric circles telling where to
> read the hour lines for the various latitudes.  ...and of course with the
> string-gnomon slidable in a vertical slot in the vertical surface.
>
> Michael Ossipoff
>
>
>
> On Fri, Aug 10, 2018 at 4:22 AM, Dan-George Uza 
> wrote:
>
>> Dear all,
>>
>> I've recently found this piece in a museum near me and I need your help
>> in dating it.
>>
>> Why are the hour marks offset? I suspect a correction for latitude. And
>> what do the two small circular dials on the bottom measure?
>>
>> Also what would be the purpose of the circular shape containing the
>> alidade? I suspect it has something to do with the winds.
>>
>> Any info will be highly appreciated.
>>
>> Thank you,
>>
>> Dan Uza
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ---
>> https://lists.uni-koeln.de/mailman/listinfo/sundial
>> 
>>
>>
>>
> ---
> https://lists.uni-koeln.de/mailman/listinfo/sundial
>
>
---
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Re: Dyptich sundial - help!

2018-08-10 Thread Schechner, Sara 
I am camping at Stellafane with little connection, so will keep this brief 
until I return to civilization!

The gnomon is adjustable for different latitudes.  The choice determines the 
correct horizontal scale to use around the compass.  The 2 pin gnomon scaphe 
sundial are for finding Italian and Babylonian (or Nuremberg hours).  The 
instrument with the spinning pointer is a wind vane.
The instrument is made in Nuremberg in the early 17th century.

Sara

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 10, 2018, at 12:48 PM, Michael Ossipoff 
mailto:email9648...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Yes, the Boy Scouts of America at least used to sell a Compass-Oriented Dyptich 
dial with several concentric rings, each having different hour-lines, and with 
its string-gnomon adjustable for latitude, with several attachment-points on 
the vertical surface. I think it accommodated 3 latitudes. The hour-line rings 
were rectangular, it seems to me.

Someone at this forum designed a universal Horizontal-Dial whose hour lines 
were curved lines originating from the gnomon-string's base-attrachment, with 
latitude-labeled concentric circles telling where to read the hour lines for 
the various latitudes.  ...and of course with the string-gnomon slidable in a 
vertical slot in the vertical surface.

Michael Ossipoff



On Fri, Aug 10, 2018 at 4:22 AM, Dan-George Uza 
mailto:cerculdest...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Dear all,

I've recently found this piece in a museum near me and I need your help in 
dating it.

Why are the hour marks offset? I suspect a correction for latitude. And what do 
the two small circular dials on the bottom measure?

Also what would be the purpose of the circular shape containing the alidade? I 
suspect it has something to do with the winds.

Any info will be highly appreciated.

Thank you,

Dan Uza




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Re: Dyptich sundial - help!

2018-08-10 Thread Schechner, Sara 
The diptych was made by Thomas Ducher.

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 10, 2018, at 12:48 PM, Michael Ossipoff 
mailto:email9648...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Yes, the Boy Scouts of America at least used to sell a Compass-Oriented Dyptich 
dial with several concentric rings, each having different hour-lines, and with 
its string-gnomon adjustable for latitude, with several attachment-points on 
the vertical surface. I think it accommodated 3 latitudes. The hour-line rings 
were rectangular, it seems to me.

Someone at this forum designed a universal Horizontal-Dial whose hour lines 
were curved lines originating from the gnomon-string's base-attrachment, with 
latitude-labeled concentric circles telling where to read the hour lines for 
the various latitudes.  ...and of course with the string-gnomon slidable in a 
vertical slot in the vertical surface.

Michael Ossipoff



On Fri, Aug 10, 2018 at 4:22 AM, Dan-George Uza 
mailto:cerculdest...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Dear all,

I've recently found this piece in a museum near me and I need your help in 
dating it.

Why are the hour marks offset? I suspect a correction for latitude. And what do 
the two small circular dials on the bottom measure?

Also what would be the purpose of the circular shape containing the alidade? I 
suspect it has something to do with the winds.

Any info will be highly appreciated.

Thank you,

Dan Uza




---
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Re:

2018-08-10 Thread Michael Ossipoff 
John--

But isn't it saids that Babylonian and Italian hour-lines are straight
lines?

Michael Ossipoff

2018-08-10 4:50 GMT-04:00 John Davis via sundial :

> Diese Nachricht wurde eingewickelt um DMARC-kompatibel zu sein. Die
> eigentliche Nachricht steht dadurch in einem Anhang.
>
> This message was wrapped to be DMARC compliant. The actual message
> text is therefore in an attachment.
>
> -- Forwarded message --
> From: John Davis 
> To: Dan-George Uza , Sundial List <
> sundial@uni-koeln.de>
> Cc:
> Bcc:
> Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2018 08:50:00 + (UTC)
> Subject: Re: Dyptich sundial - help!
> Hi Dan,
>
> This is a fairly typical diptych dial, probably 17th century. Museums such
> as the Whipple in Cambridge have large collections. It would probably be
> possible to date yours more accurately by careful comparisons.
>
> The string gnomon for the horizontal dial is fixed to the wrong point - it
> should come from the intersection of the hour lines on the horizontal dial.
>
> The two scaphe dials normally show Italian and Babylonian hours.
>
> The windrose on the outer surface is for showing wind direction. The small
> hole in the panel allows the compass needle to be observed when the dial is
> closed. The counter-changed rule is not original, I believe, and is an
> inappropriate replacement. There should be a small vertical windvane which
> would fit in the centre of the rose.
>
> I hope this helps.
>
> Regards,
>
> John
> ---
>
> Dr J Davis
> Flowton Dials http://www.flowton-dials.co.uk/
> BSS Editor http://sundialsoc.org.uk/publications/the-bss-bulletin/
> 
>
>
>
> --
> *From:* Dan-George Uza 
> *To:* Sundial List 
> *Sent:* Friday, 10 August 2018, 9:23
> *Subject:* Dyptich sundial - help!
>
> Dear all,
>
> I've recently found this piece in a museum near me and I need your help in
> dating it.
>
> Why are the hour marks offset? I suspect a correction for latitude. And
> what do the two small circular dials on the bottom measure?
>
> Also what would be the purpose of the circular shape containing the
> alidade? I suspect it has something to do with the winds.
>
> Any info will be highly appreciated.
>
> Thank you,
>
> Dan Uza
>
>
>
> ---
> https://lists.uni-koeln.de/mailman/listinfo/sundial
>
>
>
>
> ---
> https://lists.uni-koeln.de/mailman/listinfo/sundial
>
>
>
---
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Re: Dyptich sundial - help!

2018-08-10 Thread Michael Ossipoff 
Yes, the Boy Scouts of America at least used to sell a Compass-Oriented
Dyptich dial with several concentric rings, each having different
hour-lines, and with its string-gnomon adjustable for latitude, with
several attachment-points on the vertical surface. I think it accommodated
3 latitudes. The hour-line rings were rectangular, it seems to me.

Someone at this forum designed a universal Horizontal-Dial whose hour lines
were curved lines originating from the gnomon-string's base-attrachment,
with latitude-labeled concentric circles telling where to read the hour
lines for the various latitudes.  ...and of course with the string-gnomon
slidable in a vertical slot in the vertical surface.

Michael Ossipoff



On Fri, Aug 10, 2018 at 4:22 AM, Dan-George Uza 
wrote:

> Dear all,
>
> I've recently found this piece in a museum near me and I need your help in
> dating it.
>
> Why are the hour marks offset? I suspect a correction for latitude. And
> what do the two small circular dials on the bottom measure?
>
> Also what would be the purpose of the circular shape containing the
> alidade? I suspect it has something to do with the winds.
>
> Any info will be highly appreciated.
>
> Thank you,
>
> Dan Uza
>
>
>
>
> ---
> https://lists.uni-koeln.de/mailman/listinfo/sundial
>
>
>
---
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[no subject]

2018-08-10 Thread John Davis via sundial 
Diese Nachricht wurde eingewickelt um DMARC-kompatibel zu sein. Die
eigentliche Nachricht steht dadurch in einem Anhang.

This message was wrapped to be DMARC compliant. The actual message
text is therefore in an attachment.--- Begin Message ---
Hi Dan,
This is a fairly typical diptych dial, probably 17th century. Museums such as 
the Whipple in Cambridge have large collections. It would probably be possible 
to date yours more accurately by careful comparisons.
The string gnomon for the horizontal dial is fixed to the wrong point - it 
should come from the intersection of the hour lines on the horizontal dial.
The two scaphe dials normally show Italian and Babylonian hours.
The windrose on the outer surface is for showing wind direction. The small hole 
in the panel allows the compass needle to be observed when the dial is closed. 
The counter-changed rule is not original, I believe, and is an inappropriate 
replacement. There should be a small vertical windvane which would fit in the 
centre of the rose.
I hope this helps.
Regards,
John--- Dr J Davis
Flowton Dials http://www.flowton-dials.co.uk/
BSS Editor http://sundialsoc.org.uk/publications/the-bss-bulletin/


  From: Dan-George Uza 
 To: Sundial List  
 Sent: Friday, 10 August 2018, 9:23
 Subject: Dyptich sundial - help!
   
Dear all,
I've recently found this piece in a museum near me and I need your help in 
dating it. 
Why are the hour marks offset? I suspect a correction for latitude. And what do 
the two small circular dials on the bottom measure?
Also what would be the purpose of the circular shape containing the alidade? I 
suspect it has something to do with the winds. 
Any info will be highly appreciated.
Thank you,
Dan Uza


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