[biofuels-biz] Re: Castor Bean oil
Hi: Does anyone have any information on castor bean oil for biodiesel? We have an interested client . Any anecdotal information would be appreciated. Best wishes and luck to all. Len Sigma Energy Engineering, Inc. Renewable Energy, Process Engineering Serving Agriculture, Industry Commerce through Symbiotic Recycling tm Ph: 925-254-7633 E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Your own Online Store Selling our Overstock. http://us.click.yahoo.com/rZll0B/4ftFAA/46VHAA/9bTolB/TM -~- Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuels-biz] Patents
Does anyone know anything about patents, related to the process of producing biodiesel? Have patents been issued for any device related to production? Thanks, Mark F. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/9bTolB/TM -~- Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuels-biz] Re: Castor Bean oil
hi, as i know, one mtech student have studied the biofuel properties fo castor oil blending with diesel. Catch all the cricket action. Download Yahoo! Score tracker [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/9bTolB/TM -~- Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuels-biz] Re: Castor Bean oil
hi Len Check out this link http://www.journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_yield.html -Original Message- From: Len Walde [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2003 8:32 AM To: biofuels-biz@yahoogroups.com Subject: [biofuels-biz] Re: Castor Bean oil Hi: Does anyone have any information on castor bean oil for biodiesel? We have an interested client . Any anecdotal information would be appreciated. Best wishes and luck to all. Len Sigma Energy Engineering, Inc. Renewable Energy, Process Engineering Serving Agriculture, Industry Commerce through Symbiotic Recycling tm Ph: 925-254-7633 E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT http://rd.yahoo.com/M=246920.2960106.4328965.2848452/D=egroupweb/S=1705064189:HM/A=1481646/R=0/*http://www.gotomypc.com/u/tr/yh/cpm/grp/300_flake/g22lp?Target=mm/g22lp.tmpl http://us.adserver.yahoo.com/l?M=246920.2960106.4328965.2848452/D=egroupmail/S=:HM/A=1481646/rand=812621482 Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ . [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/9bTolB/TM -~- Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuels-biz] Patents
Dear Mark: In re. to your request, you might wish to look at: United States Patent 4,300,009 Haag , et al. November 10, 1981 Title: Conversion of biological material to liquid fuels Some older ones are: US Patents 1,680,908 1928 Nishida 585/241. 3,936,353 1976 Chen 585/240. 4,102,938 1978 Rao 585/240. With best regards, Luis R. Calzadilla Cali, Colombia [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/9bTolB/TM -~- Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuels-biz] Patents
http://63.140.207.28/patnt01.html Steve Spence Subscribe to the Renewable Energy Newsletter Discussion Boards. Read about Sustainable Technology: http://www.green-trust.org [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Mark D. Farragher [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuels-biz@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2003 10:40 AM Subject: [biofuels-biz] Patents Does anyone know anything about patents, related to the process of producing biodiesel? Have patents been issued for any device related to production? Thanks, Mark F. Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Your own Online Store Selling our Overstock. http://us.click.yahoo.com/rZll0B/4ftFAA/46VHAA/9bTolB/TM -~- Biofuels at Journey to Forever http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel at WebConX http://webconx.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/biofuel.htm List messages are archived at the Info-Archive at NNYTech: http://archive.nnytech.net/ To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] PENTAGON THREATENS TO KILL INDEPENDANT REPORTERS IN IRAQ
Steve, I normally filter out the political crap but just occassionally I have a look at the current diatribes. The journalists who proclaim themselves to be war correspondents are just camp followers and make their living on the backs of other's misery. It is not the oldest profession but they lie in a similar strata. All their protestations of moral integrity count for little. If they were serious they would be in there as combatants defending their chosen side not just bleating about the minor risks that they have to endure in pursuit of their own sort of 'truth' They will tell you that the pen is mightier than the sword, in dollar earnings capacity it probably is. And they are not averse to manipulating situations that can only heighten conflict. Kate Adie, is that war correspondent, par excellence, in the forefront of war reporting in the UK. So much so that her arrival in a place was, perhaps not so jokingly, is said to be the precursor for the start of a war there. We love her dearly despite her profession. Me, I think Tony Blair is on the wrong side. he should be getting the US to invade the UK. I am old enough to remember 'Marshall Aid' after the second world war. As the supposed losers, the Germans and Japanese benefitted enormously from US generousity. Perhaps Saddam has this as his master plan? Is Tony bright enough to cotton on? I don't think so. In the meantime forget the whinging of the so called journalistic professionals. They do a job that I wouldn't be proud of. They earns their money, they takes their chance! Ken B - Original Message - From: Steve Spence [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 1:23 PM Subject: Re: [biofuel] PENTAGON THREATENS TO KILL INDEPENDANT REPORTERS IN IRAQ I understand what a journalists job is. I also understand that in war, if you don't protect your men, they die. If information gets out that is useful to the enemy, your men die. The life of my men is more important than a housewife in Indiana being entertained on the 6 o'clock news. If a journalist is behind enemy lines, they might end up being a casualty of war. The journalist should understand that. Steve Spence Subscribe to the Renewable Energy Newsletter Discussion Boards. Read about Sustainable Technology: http://www.green-trust.org [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Andrew Preston [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 6:49 AM Subject: Re: [biofuel] PENTAGON THREATENS TO KILL INDEPENDANT REPORTERS IN IRAQ You seem to misunderstand what, in truth, a journalist's real job is. On Fri, 14 Mar 2003 09:20:16 -0500, Steve Spence [EMAIL PROTECTED] said: I can understand the pentagons concern for the reasonable possibility that the Iraqi's could use the information being broadcast against us. That does not excuse their reported unconcern for the journalists lives. The journalists should also take into consideration that what they report could be detrimental to our efforts. If their reporting causes additional harm to our servicemen, then yes, the uplink sites need to be taken out. -- Andrew Preston -- http://www.fastmail.fm - One of many happy users: http://www.fastmail.fm/docs/quotes.html Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Land Rover diesel conversion
Josh, you might as well go the L/R Tdi 2.5 litre. Either the Tdi 200 style or the later Tdi300 both are standard fit and extremely robust. Mine has done 200,000 miles and is not even smoking. Expect 110 bhp, good low down torque and about 30mpg around town, autos about 27 mpg.. I always thought the V8 a daft idea in a Landrover. Ken - Original Message - From: Josh Cohen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, March 14, 2003 11:47 PM Subject: [biofuel] Land Rover diesel conversion i am looking to swap the V-8 engine in a '97 landrover defender 90 for a used diesel. does anyone know of this being done, and with what type of engine (are there any out there that would fit the same engine mounts)? I am looking for a balance of efficiency and power, but would sacrifice some power for a gain in efficiency. any leads would be greately appreciated. josh [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Re: Hydrogen from trash
--- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, murdoch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'll interpose a few comments. It's easier that way when dealing with a long message. Harvesting of Methane from landfills (trash dumps) is already in practice. Most assuredly, we can all do better than that, but it's good that it's in place. I think there are a lot of challenging issues with respect to changing how we view trash and how we should see its potentialities rather than it as waste. My initial perception is as an Energy Resource that is NOT being utilized. It can also be viewed as a materials resource as well. How much iron/steel, glass, aluminum etc are recoverable? The Organics can be converted to Ethanol, Methanol, and the other Hydrocarbons (plastics) to Synthetic Diesel fuel+major thermal energy. One that is not oft mentioned is dealing with the many challenges of trash at the source (the original producer, as well as packaging) rather than when it comes time to recycle or throw away or whatever. So, for example, with some items (carpets, etc.) you may have choices that you make at the start as to what chemicals to use which can affect your later-on choices as to whether the used item can be burned or somehow harvested for useable material or energy. I have a personal aversion to the word 'burned'. The material should either be incinerated,(with Heat recovery) or preferably, Gasified. Anyway, I agree entirely that it is of great importance to study how we can make better use of trash and reduce the amount that we simply throw into holes in the Earth. Amen! We spend time, money and Energy to 'dispose' of a viable Energy supply into a hole in the ground, then we spend more time, money and Energy to import a differnet Energy source from overseas! What is the average IQ again? On a tour of Manhattan a couple of years ago (the boat around the island) the tour guide mentioned that the Staten Island Landfill is the first or second biggest man made object on Earth in volume or mass or whatever (Great Wall being the other?). I wonder how much methane could be harvested from it. Along with all the other materials that have been 'stored' over the years. Siphon off the Methane, ferment to Ethanol the organic sugers and starches, gasify the rest to Methanol and/or Fisher/Tropsh Diesel fuel, and process the remaining 'Ore' for Iron , Aluminum, Glass etc. The only remaining disposal problem is figuring out what to do with the resulting Hole in the ground! We know that bio-diesels use trash as their fuel source but it seems like the types of trash that can be converted to hydrogen would be much more extensive than that which can produce bio-diesel, a very large percentage of trash is actually hydrogen. Actually, HydroCarbons. And the oxygen reduction should be a lot simpler process than the bio-diesel process for generating fuels. In practice, this formula can be reconfigured somewhat. Do we really need Oxygen reduction, or will Hydrogen enrichment suffice? It's a fairly simply ratio adjustment. This means that almost all our trash and waste materials can be converted to fuels to power our appliances and transportation systems. If only we could get beyond the Bureaucratic (Corporate Inspired) interference, and proceed, Full Speed Ahead! Not only can we use the trash that we normally pay other people to haul away to generate energy but we could drastically reduce the amount of waste we have to put into landfills. I've gone well into debt attempting to promote that idea, to little avail. I am currently taking a different path, much less traveled. I'm hoping to obliterate a few hurdles for the next guy. Attempting to go around them, or climb over them, has not proven to be fruitful for me. Annihilation of the existing hurdles is my current Project. Maybe someday I can get back to developing and promoting sustainable, renewable alternative Energy Supplies.(Preferably from existing sources of 'waste' or 'by-products') Motie Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Your own Online Store Selling our Overstock. http://us.click.yahoo.com/rZll0B/4ftFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuel] Re: Hydrogen from trash
Along with all the other materials that have been 'stored' over the years. Siphon off the Methane, ferment to Ethanol the organic sugers and starches, gasify the rest to Methanol and/or Fisher/Tropsh Diesel fuel, and process the remaining 'Ore' for Iron , Aluminum, Glass etc. The only remaining disposal problem is figuring out what to do with the resulting Hole in the ground! We use the hole to bury the Oil men, and some politicians, becuase everybody knows that deep deep down politicians are good people. Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ . [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Re: PENTAGON THREATENS TO KILL INDEPENDANT REPORTERS IN IRAQ
--- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, Appal Energy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: More over generalizations and broad assertions in order to achieve a desired spin? As an ex-military man, I agree with Steve. If the Reporter is endangering the lives of our Troops, he needs to be stopped by whatever means necessary. I would sincerely hope that prior warning to NOT transmit from the battlefield would be adequate to prevent the occurence. If not, whatever needs to be done, shall be done. If the Journalist is willing to forfeit his life and his equipment just to entertain Housewives, so be it. Perhaps a Bill for the costs expended to neutralize the threat should be sent to the Employer? Video- tape documentation would probably not be an immediate danger to our Troops and their mission. Real-time radio transmission very likely would be. Motie I'm not sure what 'Spin' I am being accused of. A danger to the safety of our Troops, is a danger to the safety of our Troops, and must be dealt with. Or is 'Live' coverage on the 6 O'Clock News more important than the safety of our Soldiers, and the success of whatever Mission they are on? I have little or no problem with Video taping for Historical/Documentary purposes. Real-time transmissions can be very detrimental to Safety and Mission objectives. Nearly every Soldiers personal goal is to get back home safely. Anything or anyone who endangers that goal will be dealt with as a deadly threat. Motie Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Re: PENTAGON THREATENS TO KILL INDEPENDANT REPORTERS IN IRAQ
--- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm kind of gobsmacked by the fact that not one, but two Americans on this list seem to believe that the purpose of the press and of war correspondents is to entertain housewives. Actually, their real purpose is to get as many potential buyers as possible to view the advertisements presented by the Sponsors. If it is determined that Live Stories from the War Front will attract more viewers, that is what will be shown. A comment on many things I suspect, but perhaps most immediately on the state of the press in America, where 50% of the *news* items in the mainstream press originate in a PR agency's office, and where powerful corporate interests (the type of interests rich enough not only to be PR agency clients but to own PR agencies) have eroded and corrupted the laws to take control of the media for their own ends - ends that have little in common with the purposes of your Constitution, resulting in control of the media by a mere handful of interests with their own agenda. You've got it pretty close, Keith. They'll tell whatever story they think the People need and/or want to hear, and the Facts be damned! And if they can sell some advertising in the process, it's considered to be 'good'. Bread and Circuses, Motie Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Your own Online Store Selling our Overstock. http://us.click.yahoo.com/rZll0B/4ftFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Re: Hydrogen from trash
--- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, Doug Allbright [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Along with all the other materials that have been 'stored' over the years. Siphon off the Methane, ferment to Ethanol the organic sugers and starches, gasify the rest to Methanol and/or Fisher/Tropsh Diesel fuel, and process the remaining 'Ore' for Iron , Aluminum, Glass etc. The only remaining disposal problem is figuring out what to do with the resulting Hole in the ground! We use the hole to bury the Oil men, and some politicians, becuase everybody knows that deep deep down politicians are good people. Ouch! Shall I send you a list of my favorite Candidates? LOL I'd prefer to render them into Biodiesel, and get some practical use out of them, but I'll settle for their status as Bubba's new Girlfriend! I better restraint myself, or I'll be 'disappeared' without a trace under one of the newly usurped 'Authorities'. Motie Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Re: Oh wow...this SO groovy
Hello No Name I'm interested in all those things. I'm just not interested in whether or not things are illegal in repressive regimes. Stuart --- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, Appal Energy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Probably for some of the same reasons why you might or might not be interested in illegal whaling, or ivory poaching or how US beef interests affect British beef interests and vice versa, or how one hand usually tends to wash the other, or maybe even something so sublime as the repercussions of one dictator invading the country of another. Such an attitude is fine if one lives in a vacuum. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuel] Ford Ranger Diesel on eBay
Ed: Thank you. I just wish the Ranger had a extended cab. I only talked with the seller of the Ranger. I had no contact with the gentleman with the other small diesel trucks. Small diesel pickups are had to find. I thought I would pass it along. Harley -Original Message- From: Ed Hall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 11:53 PM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [biofuel] Ford Ranger Diesel on eBay Harley, great catch! You said you talked to the seller, do you have any details on the 3 Toyota PU's?? Thanks, Ed From: harley3 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [biofuel] Ford Ranger Diesel on eBay Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 12:24:12 -0600 Sorry! I live in snow country, and have been looking for a small 4wd Diesel. I was in contact with the sell last night. The truck is only 3 hours from my house, plus I am off next week. Harley -Original Message- From: Frederick E. Finch [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 14, 2003 12:06 PM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [biofuel] Ford Ranger Diesel on eBay Looks like Harley got it!! fred At 12:05 PM 3/14/2003 -0500, you wrote: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=2407022917 For those of you, like me, who would like a _small_ diesel pickup. AP -- Aviation is more than a hobby. It is more than a job. It is more than a career. Aviation is a way of life. A second language for the world: www.esperanto.net Processor cycles are a terrible thing to waste: www.distributed.net Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] _ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] PENTAGON THREATENS TO KILL INDEPENDANT REPORTERS IN IRAQ
Ken Basterfield wrote: Steve, I normally filter out the political crap but just occassionally I have a look at the current diatribes. :-) http://archive.nnytech.net/index.php?view=21839list=BIOFUEL http://archive.nnytech.net/index.php?view=21700list=BIOFUEL The journalists who proclaim themselves to be war correspondents They ARE war correspondents, appointed as war correspondents by their employers. are just camp followers and make their living on the backs of other's misery. The citizenries of the countries fielding the combatants and paying the costs in many ways - including the dependents and families and friends of the combatants - don't have any right to know anything about it, eh? Just believe the Trust us, we're experts from the Pentagon, Whitehall and so on. It is not the oldest profession but they lie in a similar strata. All their protestations of moral integrity count for little. Uh-huh. Your brush wouldn't be just a little bit broad, now would it? The vast majority of war correspondents have great integrity. That is now being chipped away quite grievously since Britain started the trend of accrediting them, controlling them and censoring them in the Falklands War, which the US has continued in the last Gulf War and now in this one. Still most have integrity, though they also suffer from this phenomenon - much exacterbated by the previously illegal concentration ofg medias ownership in the US and elsewhere: http://www.alternet.org/story.html?StoryID=15265 Media Coverage: A View from the Ground One of the basic confusions people like you suffer from - you can't distinguish between journalists and media owners. If they were serious they would be in there as combatants defending their chosen side not just bleating about the minor risks that they have to endure in pursuit of their own sort of 'truth' LOL! ROFL! Hm... Actually that's just about as pathetic as it's funny. They will tell you that the pen is mightier than the sword, in dollar earnings capacity it probably is. See above re confusion. You think war correspondents earn a lot? And they are not averse to manipulating situations that can only heighten conflict. The only instances I know of that are two cases, both involving journalists who were uses their jobs as cover for their other roles as military intelligence operatives. No names, no packdrill. Kate Adie, is that war correspondent, par excellence, in the forefront of war reporting in the UK. So much so that her arrival in a place was, perhaps not so jokingly, is said to be the precursor for the start of a war there. We love her dearly despite her profession. A somewhat opinionated view of the media from Mr Basterfield. Some Britishers excel at knowing more about the media than the media do, it's a sort of conversational gambit among the chattering classes. They fetch a grin, sometimes a sigh, usually they're just ignored. Me, I think Tony Blair is on the wrong side. He'd be on the wrong side whichever side he was on. he should be getting the US to invade the UK. I am old enough to remember 'Marshall Aid' after the second world war. As the supposed losers, the Germans and Japanese benefitted enormously from US generousity. Perhaps Saddam has this as his master plan? Is Tony bright enough to cotton on? I don't think so. In the meantime forget the whinging of the so called journalistic professionals. They do a job that I wouldn't be proud of. Judging from your hilarious view of it, the way you'd do it sure wouldn't be anything to be proud of. Probably wouldn't even entertain any housewives. They earns their money, they takes their chance! Yes, they do, and quite a few of them die for it. The rest accept that. And you? What did you ever lay your head on a chopping block for? Do you even know of anything worth taking a risk for? So easy to sneer, isn't it, Mr Basterfield, from your lofty height of pure superiority. I wonder if there's anything else you're good at. Keith Ken B - Original Message - From: Steve Spence [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 1:23 PM Subject: Re: [biofuel] PENTAGON THREATENS TO KILL INDEPENDANT REPORTERS IN IRAQ I understand what a journalists job is. I also understand that in war, if you don't protect your men, they die. If information gets out that is useful to the enemy, your men die. The life of my men is more important than a housewife in Indiana being entertained on the 6 o'clock news. If a journalist is behind enemy lines, they might end up being a casualty of war. The journalist should understand that. Steve Spence Subscribe to the Renewable Energy Newsletter Discussion Boards. Read about Sustainable Technology: http://www.green-trust.org [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Andrew Preston [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 6:49 AM Subject: Re: [biofuel]
[biofuel] Gobsmacked
Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: snip I'm kind of gobsmacked by the fact that not one, but two Americans on this list seem to believe that the purpose of the press and of war correspondents is to entertain housewives. A comment on many things I suspect, but perhaps most immediately on the state of the press in America, where 50% of the *news* items in the mainstream press originate in a PR agency's office, and where powerful corporate interests (the type of interests rich enough not only to be PR agency clients but to own PR agencies) have eroded and corrupted the laws to take control of the media for their own ends - ends that have little in common with the purposes of your Constitution, resulting in control of the media by a mere handful of interests with their own agenda. Another thing it's a comment on is the effectiveness of the neo-conservative think-tanks funded and supported by these same vested interests and their ilk. Alongside the PR news handout is the pre-packaged sound-bite wisdom of the far-rightwing think-tanks. snip Keith, do you have any evidence for the statement that 50% of the *news* items in the mainstream press originate in a PR agency's office? As a largely involuntary second-hand recipient of the U.S. mainstream press via the Canadian press, I had no idea the ratio was this low. My experiences with the Canadian media generally make me cringe. We have rampant pack journalism, and investigative journalism never really got a foothold here. I have put together media packages for reporters, sorry, journalists, for several environmental events, only to have complete no-shows despite promises from assignment editors for weeks in advance. I once whined about this to a local journalist at a social get-together. He was amused by my naivete. He explained my basic errors in attempting to get media attention. One, our events were held on Saturdays. The local media work Monday to Friday, 9-5. Two, we did not offer a catered meal or any other signficant freebies. Three, we were a good news story. Four, our message involved technology, and the local media don't understand technology (this being Silicon Valley North). Five, our organization is non- profit, so we have no paid PR positions, so no potential job prospects for local journalists, many of whom are working media jobs as a stepping stone to a better- paying corporate or government PR gig. Six, we did not have a budget for paid advertising that really gets the interest of assignment editors (and the oil and automotive industries buy lots of advertising). I no longer agree to interviews about electric cars whenever petroleum prices jump up with those outlets that have reneged on commitments to me (and I tell them why). I must have achieved complete coverage now, because the last jump to 85 cents a litre (regular gasoline) generated no phone calls at all. That's OK, they have plenty of canned footage on fuel cells to show, free of charge, courtesy of the PR departments of the automakers. And the local talking heads happily parrot, er, voice-over that this (40-year-old technology) solution is at least 10 years away from being offered for sale. North American news is no longer about reporting or analysis. It is about entertainment, to draw audience to watch the commercials. TV uses attractive talking heads, because the audience wants to look at someone pretty rather than someone informative or knowledgeable. Darryl McMahon Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Your own Online Store Selling our Overstock. http://us.click.yahoo.com/rZll0B/4ftFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: PENTAGON THREATENS TO KILL INDEPENDANT REPORTERS IN IRAQ
Well as an individual with past military experience, you know all too well that it's protocol and procedure to measure anything up in a worst possible scenario and then play it out in the public in a manner that spins the worst possible into what appears to be highly probable, the norm, a given.or an absolute. Of course, that naturallly makes all journalists not already playing ball and in the military's back pocket the enemy. This approach has become SOP ever since Viet Nam, when the reality of war popped up on the evening news daily and the public became intimately acquainted with the brutality and carnage that is the business of the military at war. Since then the Pentagon's approach relative to war reporting is its sanitization, the attempt to get the desired versions of the military and the politicos out in the public space - the Real TV version in the new millenium - nothing or as little as possible to do with the reality and devastation of war, and almost equally as much nothing to do with protecting the troops. And in the process all those who don't sign on for the sanitized version are declared hostile and the public presentation is made that they may need to be taken out, with the programmed public nodding in vapid agreement without so much as a forethought, doubt, concern or consideration for the truth of the matter - that the attempt to control the press is not so much to protect anyone in the field, but to control the release of information. Present the possible as if it's the inevitable and you have instant justification for doing anything to anyone who doesn't cow tow, as they now become the enemy. And if the reality of war time can somehow be trivialized into the news making the 6:00 dinner hour for soccer moms across America? All the better. Apparently an unfortunate number of people are naive, gullible, stupid and progammed well enough to accept that type of mindless rhetoric. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: motie_d [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2003 3:40 AM Subject: [biofuel] Re: PENTAGON THREATENS TO KILL INDEPENDANT REPORTERS IN IRAQ --- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, Appal Energy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: More over generalizations and broad assertions in order to achieve a desired spin? As an ex-military man, I agree with Steve. If the Reporter is endangering the lives of our Troops, he needs to be stopped by whatever means necessary. I would sincerely hope that prior warning to NOT transmit from the battlefield would be adequate to prevent the occurence. If not, whatever needs to be done, shall be done. If the Journalist is willing to forfeit his life and his equipment just to entertain Housewives, so be it. Perhaps a Bill for the costs expended to neutralize the threat should be sent to the Employer? Video- tape documentation would probably not be an immediate danger to our Troops and their mission. Real-time radio transmission very likely would be. Motie I'm not sure what 'Spin' I am being accused of. A danger to the safety of our Troops, is a danger to the safety of our Troops, and must be dealt with. Or is 'Live' coverage on the 6 O'Clock News more important than the safety of our Soldiers, and the success of whatever Mission they are on? I have little or no problem with Video taping for Historical/Documentary purposes. Real-time transmissions can be very detrimental to Safety and Mission objectives. Nearly every Soldiers personal goal is to get back home safely. Anything or anyone who endangers that goal will be dealt with as a deadly threat. Motie Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Your own Online Store Selling our Overstock. http://us.click.yahoo.com/rZll0B/4ftFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuel] PENTAGON THREATENS TO KILL INDEPENDANT REPORTERS IN IRAQ
Actually I don't think this administration has any money allocated for rebuilding the country after they [we] destroy it. I keep hearing comments like we need to support our soldiers and this war will help stop terrorism Blind/deaf/dumb/sniffing gas? --- Martin Klingensmith infoarchive.net [archive.nnytech.net] nnytech.net Me, I think Tony Blair is on the wrong side. he should be getting the US to invade the UK. I am old enough to remember 'Marshall Aid' after the second world war. As the supposed losers, the Germans and Japanese benefitted enormously from US generousity. Perhaps Saddam has this as his master plan? Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- New Yahoo! Mail Plus. More flexibility. More control. More power. Get POP access, more storage, more filters, and more. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Hcb0iA/P.iFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuel] Re: Oh wow...this SO groovy
Since when is living in the UK less repressive than the US? --- Martin Klingensmith infoarchive.net [archive.nnytech.net] nnytech.net -Original Message- From: canros_uk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2003 4:47 AM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: [biofuel] Re: Oh wow...this SO groovy Hello No Name I'm interested in all those things. I'm just not interested in whether or not things are illegal in repressive regimes. Stuart Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Re: Oh wow...this SO groovy
Hey Martin Did I say it was? Just so you know - I only added the uk to my name because Yahoo told me that canros had gone. That was some time ago. I don't live in the UK and guess that it is probably about the same as the US as far as repression is concerned. I really would not like to make a judgement but if pressed I might say perhaps things are a little worse in the US since the intro of your Homeland Security Measures if that is the correct expession. I think many of us are repressed. Have you followed Motie's experiences with the repressors for example? Repressedly yours Stuart --- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, Martin Klingensmith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Since when is living in the UK less repressive than the US? --- Martin Klingensmith infoarchive.net [archive.nnytech.net] nnytech.net -Original Message- From: canros_uk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2003 4:47 AM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: [biofuel] Re: Oh wow...this SO groovy Hello No Name I'm interested in all those things. I'm just not interested in whether or not things are illegal in repressive regimes. Stuart Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: Oh wow...this SO groovy
we can't grow hemp, they can't have guns. Every country seems oppressive when you can't have something you want. Some actually are. Steve Spence Subscribe to the Renewable Energy Newsletter Discussion Boards. Read about Sustainable Technology: http://www.green-trust.org [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Martin Klingensmith [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2003 1:02 PM Subject: RE: [biofuel] Re: Oh wow...this SO groovy Since when is living in the UK less repressive than the US? --- Martin Klingensmith infoarchive.net [archive.nnytech.net] nnytech.net -Original Message- From: canros_uk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2003 4:47 AM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: [biofuel] Re: Oh wow...this SO groovy Hello No Name I'm interested in all those things. I'm just not interested in whether or not things are illegal in repressive regimes. Stuart Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Avocado oil - was Re: California fruit fly area.... waste could be used as biofuel?
I don't see a reason the avocado can't still be used for pet food (or healthy guacamole) once the oil has been pressed out. Steve Spence Subscribe to the Renewable Energy Newsletter Discussion Boards. Read about Sustainable Technology: http://www.green-trust.org [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Doug Foskey [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2003 3:34 AM Subject: Re: [biofuel] Avocado oil - was Re: California fruit fly area waste could be used as biofuel? Avacado is used in pet (dog) food 'round here. regards Doug (Australia) Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Gobsmacked
Hi Darryl Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: snip I'm kind of gobsmacked by the fact that not one, but two Americans on this list seem to believe that the purpose of the press and of war correspondents is to entertain housewives. A comment on many things I suspect, but perhaps most immediately on the state of the press in America, where 50% of the *news* items in the mainstream press originate in a PR agency's office, and where powerful corporate interests (the type of interests rich enough not only to be PR agency clients but to own PR agencies) have eroded and corrupted the laws to take control of the media for their own ends - ends that have little in common with the purposes of your Constitution, resulting in control of the media by a mere handful of interests with their own agenda. Another thing it's a comment on is the effectiveness of the neo-conservative think-tanks funded and supported by these same vested interests and their ilk. Alongside the PR news handout is the pre-packaged sound-bite wisdom of the far-rightwing think-tanks. snip Keith, do you have any evidence for the statement that 50% of the *news* items in the mainstream press originate in a PR agency's office? Yes I do, but it's really late and there's still stuff to do - I'll get back to you as soon as. As a largely involuntary second-hand recipient of the U.S. mainstream press via the Canadian press, I had no idea the ratio was this low. My experiences with the Canadian media generally make me cringe. We have rampant pack journalism, and investigative journalism never really got a foothold here. I have put together media packages for reporters, sorry, journalists, for several environmental events, only to have complete no-shows despite promises from assignment editors for weeks in advance. I once whined about this to a local journalist at a social get-together. He was amused by my naivete. He explained my basic errors in attempting to get media attention. One, our events were held on Saturdays. The local media work Monday to Friday, 9-5. Two, we did not offer a catered meal or any other signficant freebies. Three, we were a good news story. Four, our message involved technology, and the local media don't understand technology (this being Silicon Valley North). Five, our organization is non- profit, so we have no paid PR positions, so no potential job prospects for local journalists, many of whom are working media jobs as a stepping stone to a better- paying corporate or government PR gig. Six, we did not have a budget for paid advertising that really gets the interest of assignment editors (and the oil and automotive industries buy lots of advertising). I no longer agree to interviews about electric cars whenever petroleum prices jump up with those outlets that have reneged on commitments to me (and I tell them why). I must have achieved complete coverage now, because the last jump to 85 cents a litre (regular gasoline) generated no phone calls at all. That's OK, they have plenty of canned footage on fuel cells to show, free of charge, courtesy of the PR departments of the automakers. And the local talking heads happily parrot, er, voice-over that this (40-year-old technology) solution is at least 10 years away from being offered for sale. North American news is no longer about reporting or analysis. It is about entertainment, to draw audience to watch the commercials. TV uses attractive talking heads, because the audience wants to look at someone pretty rather than someone informative or knowledgeable. Aaarghh! What a desperate tale... well, not really news to me, but usually there's a redeeming factor somewhere. Infotainment, yes, horrible - the further you get from paper towards electronic in the media, the worse that gets. TV's the pits, but usually with honorable exceptions, radio is both good and bad, though seldom as bad as TV. This doesn't help a whole lot though: http://www.alternet.org/story.html?StoryID=15281 AlterNet: Clear Channel's Big, Stinking Deregulation Mess Not that paper is immune. A while back I was working for a newspaper quite widely known as the best newspaper in the world (though that caused a lot of in-house chuckles and puzzlement). One day a page from The Spectator appeared on the notice board, with an article written by someone who'd proposed writing an obituary for our paper's weekly medical page. The man who'd died was a prominent scientist who'd made a significant medical breakthrough, and the one who wanted to write his obit had worked with him at the time and knew him well. The medical editor asked him: Have you been on television? He hadn't - why did she ask? She'd been instructed not to accept contributions from non-journalists who were not media personalities. The Fourth Estate has always been in the strange position of being owned by the very people it's supposed to be defending the public against,
[biofuel] Fwd: Re: [vegoil-diesel] a few calculations on svo and homebrew biodiesel
Cross-post. To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Appal Energy [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 12:40:04 -0500 Subject: Re: [vegoil-diesel] Re: a few calculations on svo and homebrew biodiesel That's a rather high and mighty comparison (or in-comparison) on your part there Jan. May I quote? thrown together by hippies out of junk part I happened to have laying around biodiesel solution. Maria's calculations are not all that far off on a per gallon basis even when throwing in all overhead, insurance, utilities, labor, maintenance, alcohol and glycerin recovery. That bumps yellow grease biodiesel up around the $0.55 a gallon bracket (in the US). And correlating making the best use of what you have available to machined parts or blueprinted designs does absolutely nothing to make one better or more inferior to the other. It doesn't matter if it's a scrap yard mechanic brazing together a condensor or if it's a machine or welding shop at $55 an hour. That's a bit like saying your mother can't bake bread as well as the mass produced crumpet factory down the road. Frankly? I'd rather put $10,000 into a system that is capable of not only generating a very healthy livlihood and meeting the daily fuel demands of 100 people rather than dropping $100,000 that accomplishes the exact same end. Well, almost the exact same end. The biodiesel facility would provide income for a generation. Installing one hundred SVO or WVO kits would only generate income for a few months. In either event it's the end user (the customer) that pays these costs. In the former scenario a driver can get on the road with biofuel in the time it takes to fill the tank. The latter incurs not only down time for installation, but a larger up front cost and adds more moving parts. (To keep it accurately in context, in neither scenario would the driver either produce their own biodiesel or mill their own Elsbett.) And in today's mental makeup (sad but true), something as thought free as handing a credit card to an attendant is, to the vast majority of the public, more desireable and enticing than having to locate the fuel, transport it, fill one's own tank and on think and off think with a SVO or WVO system. (Again, I said sad but true.) Doesn't mean that both shouldn't be accomplished by any party that cares to do either. But what should exist is clear understanding that things aren't always the clear black and white that SVO and WVO are frequently painted as. There are numerous unavoidable inequities in comparing the two fuel and system types. It's these same inequities (coupled with the peculiar variable of personal preference) that gives both their place and application in the working world. Todd Swearingen - Original Message - From: Jan Steinman [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2003 9:26 AM Subject: [vegoil-diesel] Re: a few calculations on svo and homebrew biodiesel From: girl mark [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hey all, here's some pros and cons of the decision to make biodiesel versus getting an svo kit... $1000 cost of PAYING SOMEONE labor and parts to put some kinds of SVO kit into a vehicle... 2,325 gallons of my homemade biodiesel costs me $1000 in chemicals at $.43 a gallon...And it all assumes that you dont' count your labor towards the costs of homebrew. This is a completely unfair and biased comparison. You're comparing the cost of a labor-free solution to a labor-intensive solution. You're comparing a professionally installed SVO/WVO kit to a thrown together by hippies out of junk part I happened to have laying around biodiesel solution. For a better comparison, you should consider that places like biodieselgear.com have nearly doubled their prices since gas prices shot up. If you count $1000 for the cost of getting SVO-ready, you should also count $1300 as the cost of getting biodiesel-ready, since that is what biodieselgear.com is now charging for their ready to process biodiesel kits. On the other hand, if you count $0 as the hippie scavenging parts cost of a biodiesel conversion plant, you should also count $0 as the scavenged-parts cost of an SVO operation, since one can scavenge old heater cores and fuel tanks at a wrecking yard for pennies. Some two-tank kits like Neoteric's solve that problem very effectively. Yea, but Neoteric soaks you on shipping. $20 shipping charge on 25 paper filters? Give me a break! I ordered multiple items from them, and EACH had a $20 shipping charge! Imagine my surprise when I received a 4 pound package in the mail that cost me $60 to ship! I put in the comments field that I expected excess shipping to be refunded, but so far, no credit has appeared on my charge card. Methinks that Mark has an agenda. That's okay -- we all do -- just don't present it as fact, okay? I also suspect that places like Neoteric and Biodieselgear.com see a pot of gold at the end of the high-oil-cost rainbow, and are soaking
[biofuel] Fwd: Re: [vegoil-diesel]a few calculations on svo and homebrew biodiesel
Cross-post. To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Neoteric Biofuels Inc [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 07:09:49 -0800 Subject: Re: [vegoil-diesel] Re: a few calculations on svo and homebrew biodiesel Jan Steinman wrote: Some two-tank kits like Neoteric's solve that problem very effectively. Yea, but Neoteric soaks you on shipping. $20 shipping charge on 25 paper filters? Give me a break! I ordered multiple items from them, and EACH had a $20 shipping charge! Imagine my surprise when I received a 4 pound package in the mail that cost me $60 to ship! I put in the comments field that I expected excess shipping to be refunded, but so far, no credit has appeared on my charge card. If you had asked in advance, we would not have charged you multiple shipping. We do not charge any more than we have to to cover our costs on shipping and handling, Jan. We ship UPS to minimize hassle for customers and for us - the postal service has not been very good, although we may go back to registered mail, insured, for overseas orders since we feel that UPS is charging too much on our overseas orders. It is reasonable to ship UPS to Canada/US, and fast, with very good service, tracking, etc. I did not see your comment, because I do not do the shipping - comments are more for shipping comments than for bitching about the cost of something you just ordered, and entered the shipping amount for. - why were you surprised? You could see what the cost was going to be when you placed your order, couldn't you? Anyway, it's a major PITA to do refunds on KAGI, but we'll send you a pack of 25 cones free if you like, to make it up to you - I wish you'd emailed me directly instead of going to the list with your complaints, I mean it's not like we're some huge faceless corporation here. Got a problem? Send an email directly, or pick up the phone and give us a call. Methinks that Mark has an agenda. That's okay -- we all do -- just don't present it as fact, okay? I also suspect that places like Neoteric and Biodieselgear.com see a pot of gold at the end of the high-oil-cost rainbow, Right. We anticipate we'll be SVO barons any day now - NOT! and are soaking hapless consumers by doubling their prices Soaking hapless consumers? Oh, PLEASE!! WE did not double our prices. Our prices were low, people told us so, a bargain, really, and still are. We recently raised prices some, so that we'd have more room for dealer discounts, and frankly to get a bit more for ourselves on the direct orders - do you know how many hours I spend a week on emails and phone calls? Maybe you work for next to nothing, but I want a little more than that for my time and trouble. and way excessive shipping charges. (Hey, just tell me 25 paper filters will cost me $45 with free shipping, okay?) Sure, if you prefer - fact is, we doubt that anyone will want to order just cones, and will likely ask about multiple-piece order shipping charges in advance of placing an order. Most people do, and at one time we had a note to please ask us about this in advance of ordering - that will be put back on the site, and made clear. We have to show something for shipping, and the $20 is the minimum for us to bother with it by the time we process an order and pay UPS the majority of that. It costs us a bit more to ship from Canada to the US than it would for you to ship within the US on UPS, remember. I think the whole SVO vs. biodiesel debate is just plain silly. As a community, we do ourselves great dishonor when we fight among ourselves. The enemy is Big Oil, NOT SVO or biodiesel! Personally, I plan to use both, as the situation warrants. Agree. -- : Jan Steinman Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Your own Online Store Selling our Overstock. http://us.click.yahoo.com/rZll0B/4ftFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuel] Oh wow...this SO groovy
I'm not the one who tied it to the drug culture. We've got Hearst, DuPont, Mellon and Anslinger to thank for that. My goal is to separate it from the drug culture, and put it back in agriculture where it belongs. In colonial America, it was illegal NOT to grow hemp. It's one of the only crops that doesn't require the use of toxic pesticides, herbicides and fertilizers to cultivate, unlike corn or soy, which need chemical help to survive insect predation and being crowded out by weeds. Monsanto has genetically modified crop seed that is resistant to herbicides, so that farmers can poison the weeds without killing their crops, thus encouraging farmers to use toxic chemicals more freely, without regard to the environment. Will Dwyer, Director HempCycle www.hempcycle.org -Original Message- From: Steve Spence [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 8:37 AM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [biofuel] Oh wow...this SO groovy Growing hemp is illegal in the US. It's not likely to be made legal for many years, if ever. There are plenty of other oil producing plants that are legal, which will get us off petroleum, promote the mission, without tying it to the drug culture in many peoples minds. Steve Spence Subscribe to the Renewable Energy Newsletter Discussion Boards. Read about Sustainable Technology: http://www.green-trust.org [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Randy Scott [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 1:39 AM Subject: [biofuel] Oh wow...this SO groovy Maybe you guys have already seen this, but I just found out about it. http://www.hempcycle.org/ The HempCycle project seeks to end our national addiction to petroleum by educating the public about the advantages of using renewable, biomass fuels and the latest in hybrid vehicle technology to heal the planet. Hemp is a vast untapped renewable resource that could free America from dependence on foreign petroleum, says Dwyer. Through a process called pyrolysis, hemp can produce 1,000 gallons of methanol per acre. Many gas stations are currently selling gasoline blended with up to 20% methanol. With relatively simple modifications to increase the compression of gasoline powered internal combustion engines, it is possible to use 100% methanol. http://www.ecycle.com/powersports/hybrid.htm Employing state-of-the-art mechanical and electrical design technology, eCycle is developing a 180mpg motorcycle. The motorcycle features a 219cc direct injected, multifuel engine (petrodiesel, biodiesel, kerosene) and an 8kW brushless motor drive. The weight is 230lbs, with a top speed of 80mph and acceleration of 0-60 mph in 6 seconds. Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Your own Online Store Selling our Overstock. http://us.click.yahoo.com/rZll0B/4ftFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Land Rover diesel conversion
ken, when you say standard fit, do you mean the tdi will fit the same mounts as the v8 or are there major structural changes that need to be made to the chassis? - Original Message - From: Ken Basterfield To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 12:23 PM Subject: Re: [biofuel] Land Rover diesel conversion Josh, you might as well go the L/R Tdi 2.5 litre. Either the Tdi 200 style or the later Tdi300 both are standard fit and extremely robust. Mine has done 200,000 miles and is not even smoking. Expect 110 bhp, good low down torque and about 30mpg around town, autos about 27 mpg.. I always thought the V8 a daft idea in a Landrover. Ken - Original Message - From: Josh Cohen [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, March 14, 2003 11:47 PM Subject: [biofuel] Land Rover diesel conversion i am looking to swap the V-8 engine in a '97 landrover defender 90 for a used diesel. does anyone know of this being done, and with what type of engine (are there any out there that would fit the same engine mounts)? I am looking for a balance of efficiency and power, but would sacrifice some power for a gain in efficiency. any leads would be greately appreciated. josh [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Your own Online Store Selling our Overstock. http://us.click.yahoo.com/rZll0B/4ftFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Gobsmacked
Ladies and Gentlemen, this is nothing but a lot of hot air that can be explained in four words. Microsoft National Broadcasting Corporation. (MSNBC) Our media has been a great big sellout since long before anyone reading this was born. It is now just more blatant about it. However, I challenge anyone of you to prove to me that their media is any different. Not better, mind you. Just different. The only news that is truly believable, is the news you see with your own two eyes. Our media controls our economy, and our stock market. And on that same note, our government controls our media. Will this blow up in our faces? Of course. Eventually. Long live the Queen. Dave --- Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Darryl Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: snip I'm kind of gobsmacked by the fact that not one, but two Americans on this list seem to believe that the purpose of the press and of war correspondents is to entertain housewives. A comment on many things I suspect, but perhaps most immediately on the state of the press in America, where 50% of the *news* items in the mainstream press originate in a PR agency's office, and where powerful corporate interests (the type of interests rich enough not only to be PR agency clients but to own PR agencies) have eroded and corrupted the laws to take control of the media for their own ends - ends that have little in common with the purposes of your Constitution, resulting in control of the media by a mere handful of interests with their own agenda. Another thing it's a comment on is the effectiveness of the neo-conservative think-tanks funded and supported by these same vested interests and their ilk. Alongside the PR news handout is the pre-packaged sound-bite wisdom of the far-rightwing think-tanks. snip Keith, do you have any evidence for the statement that 50% of the *news* items in the mainstream press originate in a PR agency's office? Yes I do, but it's really late and there's still stuff to do - I'll get back to you as soon as. As a largely involuntary second-hand recipient of the U.S. mainstream press via the Canadian press, I had no idea the ratio was this low. My experiences with the Canadian media generally make me cringe. We have rampant pack journalism, and investigative journalism never really got a foothold here. I have put together media packages for reporters, sorry, journalists, for several environmental events, only to have complete no-shows despite promises from assignment editors for weeks in advance. I once whined about this to a local journalist at a social get-together. He was amused by my naivete. He explained my basic errors in attempting to get media attention. One, our events were held on Saturdays. The local media work Monday to Friday, 9-5. Two, we did not offer a catered meal or any other signficant freebies. Three, we were a good news story. Four, our message involved technology, and the local media don't understand technology (this being Silicon Valley North). Five, our organization is non- profit, so we have no paid PR positions, so no potential job prospects for local journalists, many of whom are working media jobs as a stepping stone to a better- paying corporate or government PR gig. Six, we did not have a budget for paid advertising that really gets the interest of assignment editors (and the oil and automotive industries buy lots of advertising). I no longer agree to interviews about electric cars whenever petroleum prices jump up with those outlets that have reneged on commitments to me (and I tell them why). I must have achieved complete coverage now, because the last jump to 85 cents a litre (regular gasoline) generated no phone calls at all. That's OK, they have plenty of canned footage on fuel cells to show, free of charge, courtesy of the PR departments of the automakers. And the local talking heads happily parrot, er, voice-over that this (40-year-old technology) solution is at least 10 years away from being offered for sale. North American news is no longer about reporting or analysis. It is about entertainment, to draw audience to watch the commercials. TV uses attractive talking heads, because the audience wants to look at someone pretty rather than someone informative or knowledgeable. Aaarghh! What a desperate tale... well, not really news to me, but usually there's a redeeming factor somewhere. Infotainment, yes, horrible - the further you get from paper towards electronic in the media, the worse that gets. TV's the pits, but usually with honorable exceptions, radio is both good and bad, though seldom as bad as TV. This doesn't help a whole lot though: http://www.alternet.org/story.html?StoryID=15281 AlterNet: Clear Channel's Big, Stinking Deregulation Mess Not that
Re: [biofuel] 98% methanol OK for biodiesel?
Hi, You have found nice resourses. 98% OK for this proceses. My experience in batch proces OK. Hariana [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- walkerfox2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, I am new to this. I can get a very cheap source of post-use 98% pure methanol from a nearby chemical-based industry. Does anyone know what would happen with using this to make biodiesel? Would there be too much water or other undesirables or could this be easily dealt with? Thanks. __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - establish your business online http://webhosting.yahoo.com Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Gobsmacked
Keith, you wrote (re: PR agencies as source of 50% of mainstream U.S. media news items) Yes I do, but it's really late and there's still stuff to do - I'll get back to you as soon as. No hurry. Just for my own personal curiosity. snip This doesn't help a whole lot though: http://www.alternet.org/story.html?StoryID=15281 AlterNet: Clear Channel's Big, Stinking Deregulation Mess Yes, I had read about this, I think you posted the link previously. Here we have several radio stations owned by the same company. They don't try to hide it - I think we have 3 or 4 stations that actually use the same newscast, including the originating station's call sign. Darryl Darryl McMahon 48 Tarquin Crescent, Econogics, Inc. Nepean, Ontario K2H 8J8 It's your planet. Voice: (613)784-0655 If you won't look Fax: (613)828-3199 after it, who will?http://www.econogics.com/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuel] Oh wow...this SO groovy
I'm not the one who tied it to the drug culture. We've got Hearst, DuPont, Mellon and Anslinger to thank for that. My goal is to separate it from the drug culture, and put it back in agriculture where it belongs. In colonial America, it was illegal NOT to grow hemp. It's one of the only crops that doesn't require the use of toxic pesticides, herbicides and fertilizers to cultivate, unlike corn or soy, which need chemical help to survive insect predation and being crowded out by weeds. Monsanto has genetically modified crop seed that is resistant to herbicides, so that farmers can poison the weeds without killing their crops, thus encouraging farmers to use toxic chemicals more freely, without regard to the environment. Will Dwyer, Director HempCycle www.hempcycle.org Hello Will No crops require the use of toxic pesticides, herbicides and fertilizers, or need chemical help, not even corn and soy. See for instance: http://archive.nnytech.net/index.php?view=12002list=BIOFUEL http://archive.nnytech.net/index.php?view=12561list=BIOFUEL See also: http://journeytoforever.org/farm.html The so-called Green Revolution so-called High-Yielding Varieties (HYVs) are better named High-Response Varieties, hybrids bred for their ability to respond to high chemical doses, and to survive high pesticide levels. Traditional varieties properly grown with organic management equal or out-perform these freak crops, and the produce has a higher nutritional value - the hybrids are short on protein, so even when you do get more, it's more of less. GMO varieties have so far been little more than a marketing scheme for chemical inputs. Genetic engineering does hold promise (though it's hard to see a need), but done the way it's been done so far, and by these interests, it's at best useless, at worst a disaster. You're right that it's led to increased pesticide applications, not less as promised by Monsanto et al. There is no need for pesticides, herbicides and fertilizers, full-stop. So please, while I support your push for industrial hemp, you have an excellent case without having to resort to such shaky arguments as this one about chemicals. Best wishes Keith Addison Journey to Forever -Original Message- From: Steve Spence [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 8:37 AM To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [biofuel] Oh wow...this SO groovy Growing hemp is illegal in the US. It's not likely to be made legal for many years, if ever. There are plenty of other oil producing plants that are legal, which will get us off petroleum, promote the mission, without tying it to the drug culture in many peoples minds. Steve Spence Subscribe to the Renewable Energy Newsletter Discussion Boards. Read about Sustainable Technology: http://www.green-trust.org [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Randy Scott [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2003 1:39 AM Subject: [biofuel] Oh wow...this SO groovy Maybe you guys have already seen this, but I just found out about it. http://www.hempcycle.org/ The HempCycle project seeks to end our national addiction to petroleum by educating the public about the advantages of using renewable, biomass fuels and the latest in hybrid vehicle technology to heal the planet. Hemp is a vast untapped renewable resource that could free America from dependence on foreign petroleum, says Dwyer. Through a process called pyrolysis, hemp can produce 1,000 gallons of methanol per acre. Many gas stations are currently selling gasoline blended with up to 20% methanol. With relatively simple modifications to increase the compression of gasoline powered internal combustion engines, it is possible to use 100% methanol. http://www.ecycle.com/powersports/hybrid.htm Employing state-of-the-art mechanical and electrical design technology, eCycle is developing a 180mpg motorcycle. The motorcycle features a 219cc direct injected, multifuel engine (petrodiesel, biodiesel, kerosene) and an 8kW brushless motor drive. The weight is 230lbs, with a top speed of 80mph and acceleration of 0-60 mph in 6 seconds. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Your own Online Store Selling our Overstock. http://us.click.yahoo.com/rZll0B/4ftFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Fuel properties
convenient table http://imartinez.etsin.upm.es/dat1/eCombus.htm [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Your own Online Store Selling our Overstock. http://us.click.yahoo.com/rZll0B/4ftFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Quasiturbine Stirling Engine (Sterling) - Rotary Hot Air Motor - Heat Pump
http://quasiturbine.promci.qc.ca/QTStirling.html [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Your own Online Store Selling our Overstock. http://us.click.yahoo.com/rZll0B/4ftFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] Fwd: Re: [vegoil-diesel] a few calculations on svo and homebrew biodiesel
Cross-post. To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Neoteric Biofuels Inc [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 10:53:22 -0800 Subject: Re: [vegoil-diesel] Re: a few calculations on svo and homebrew biodiesel On Sunday, March 16, 2003, at 09:40 AM, Appal Energy wrote: That's a rather high and mighty comparison (or in-comparison) on your part there Jan. May I quote? thrown together by hippies out of junk part I happened to have laying around biodiesel solution. Maria's calculations are not all that far off on a per gallon basis even when throwing in all overhead, insurance, utilities, labor, maintenance, alcohol and glycerin recovery. That bumps yellow grease biodiesel up around the $0.55 a gallon bracket (in the US). A good WVO or even an SVO/WVO 50/50 blend, maximizing available resource of new and used plant oil, supporting farmers and recyclers both, minimizing concerns of acidity and FFA, and FA profile, can be accomplished for less. Quite a bit less. And correlating making the best use of what you have available to machined parts or blueprinted designs does absolutely nothing to make one better or more inferior to the other. It doesn't matter if it's a scrap yard mechanic brazing together a condensor or if it's a machine or welding shop at $55 an hour. That's a bit like saying your mother can't bake bread as well as the mass produced crumpet factory down the road. It does matter for a fair comparison. You have to compare apples to apples, or not bother. An SVO setup runs $300-1000 US, for something that is pretty much complete, all new, reliable, and takes a day to install. A similar biodiesel setup runs about the same - for something delivered to your door or made from some new, reliable, easily obtained (not scrap yard and yard sale) components. Those costs are very similar, when you compare something that is more or less apples to apples. Collecting and filtering costs are similar. The difference is in cost of lye, methanol, and processing time, as well as the avoidance of chemical exposure and avoidance of the need to wash, and do something with water and glycerine. Frankly? I'd rather put $10,000 into a system that is capable of not only generating a very healthy livlihood and meeting the daily fuel demands of 100 people rather than dropping $100,000 that accomplishes the exact same end. Well, almost the exact same end. The biodiesel facility would provide income for a generation. Installing one hundred SVO or WVO kits would only generate income for a few months. Not if you are going into the fuel business. You are comparing equipment supply with the residual of being in the fuel business. If you want to have your customers be dependent on you, you can do so with SVO/WVO supply almost as well as from being a biodiesel baron. Get a press, press oil from seed, blend with collected WVO, sell the presscake. There is your $10,000 investment, good for generations. Sell the service. In either event it's the end user (the customer) that pays these costs. In the former scenario a driver can get on the road with biofuel in the time it takes to fill the tank. Well, except that it is often conveniently ignored that B100 should have new lines and often new seals (Viton) installed, and the owner should be prepared for some filter plugging at first - that's cost and down time. The latter incurs not only down time for installation, but a larger up front cost and adds more moving parts. Both, to do properly, often involve some initial cost and often involve some down time (just the initial filter change on the biodiesel - but this could occur unexpectedly, could be an inconvenience) (To keep it accurately in context, in neither scenario would the driver either produce their own biodiesel or mill their own Elsbett.) And in today's mental makeup (sad but true), something as thought free as handing a credit card to an attendant is, to the vast majority of the public, more desireable and enticing than having to locate the fuel, transport it, fill one's own tank No reason you can't have SVO/WVO at the filling station or delivered to the home -it's already being done. and on think and off think Do you turn headlights on/off? Key? This is not a big deal, and can be buzzered or automated, at least partially, if people really want to - or also, you can go single tank in some cases, with the right arrangements (and more time and cost up-front than two-tank, of course). with a SVO or WVO system. (Again, I said sad but true.) Doesn't mean that both shouldn't be accomplished by any party that cares to do either. But what should exist is clear understanding that things aren't always the clear black and white that SVO and WVO are frequently painted as. There are numerous unavoidable inequities in comparing the two fuel and system types. It's these same inequities
[biofuel] Fwd: Re: [vegoil-diesel] a few calculations on svo and homebrew biodiesel
Cross-post. To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Appal Energy [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2003 23:55:18 -0500 Subject: Re: [vegoil-diesel] Re: a few calculations on svo and homebrew biodiesel Ello Ed, - Original Message - From: Neoteric Biofuels Inc [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, March 16, 2003 1:53 PM Subject: Re: [vegoil-diesel] Re: a few calculations on svo and homebrew biodiesel On Sunday, March 16, 2003, at 09:40 AM, Appal Energy wrote: That's a rather high and mighty comparison (or in-comparison) on your part there Jan. May I quote? thrown together by hippies out of junk part I happened to have laying around biodiesel solution. Maria's calculations are not all that far off on a per gallon basis even when throwing in all overhead, insurance, utilities, labor, maintenance, alcohol and glycerin recovery. That bumps yellow grease biodiesel up around the $0.55 a gallon bracket (in the US). A good WVO or even an SVO/WVO 50/50 blend, maximizing available resource of new and used plant oil, supporting farmers and recyclers both, minimizing concerns of acidity and FFA, and FA profile, can be accomplished for less. Quite a bit less. Well, that could be partly true and both of us would probably hazard to venture towards such a thought process. But before you print up those glossy brochures don't forget to put some fine print on the layout. SVO is going for $0.20 a pound on CBOT at the moment, or at least soy is. That would make your 50/50 blend at least $0.75 a gallon PLUS your costs in collecting and filtering the WVO quotient. All filtered, said and done, that would round out to about $1.00 US. The only way you're going to get that price to drop for a 50/50 blend is to get the oil straight out of the field, a rather expensive capital equipment proposition and not exactly the cup of tea for the shadetree WVO/SVO conversion owner. The only way that would fly is to coop, and probably on a rather large scale. So that kind of takes the comparing apples to apples scenario right out of the affordability range of the WVO/SVO small potatos consumer and pretty much takes the topic of cost over to the 100% WVO side, where you would be somewhat correct in your assertions. (For all practical purposes, considering WVO and yellow grease similar, if not the same?) And correlating making the best use of what you have available to machined parts or blueprinted designs does absolutely nothing to make one better or more inferior to the other. It doesn't matter if it's a scrap yard mechanic brazing together a condensor or if it's a machine or welding shop at $55 an hour. That's a bit like saying your mother can't bake bread as well as the mass produced crumpet factory down the road. It does matter for a fair comparison. You have to compare apples to apples, or not bother. No, that's not exactly a correct presumption. If you're going to speak of a machined Elsbett conversion, there is the incumbent cost of machining. That does not mean that there has to be an equivalent cost ratio of machining or other equivalent overhead on the biodiesel side of the equation. Whether the machinist hooks up a TEFC motor and prop to a vapor tight 55 gallon drum or an explosion proof motor to a machined tight stainless steel tank is not going to change the quality of the finished product nor how well the engine that consumes it runs. One infrastructure and fuel is apples and one infrastructure and fuel is oranges. Neither mirror each other. So there is no point in trying to doll one or the other up in order to compare. And the same can be said about the degree of manufacture/machining. I don't charge $55 an hour to braze, so why should I have to discount what I don't charge (or calculate in the high rate of the professional welder) or inflate what I don't charge so that the apple looks like the orange? It makes no sense. An SVO setup runs $300-1000 US, for something that is pretty much complete, all new, reliable, and takes a day to install. A similar biodiesel setup runs about the same - for something delivered to your door or made from some new, reliable, easily obtained (not scrap yard and yard sale) components. What? We gots a problem with refurbished? When was the last time you bought an OEM starter rather than refurbished? A similar biodiesel setup usually doesn't have to be delivered to one's door, as the width, depth and bredth of equipment needed can usually be found laying around in any handy person's garage, a salvage yard or perhaps (the gods forbid!) a retail hardware outlet. But then again, so could the parts for a WVO conversion. Those costs are very similar, when you compare something that is more or less apples to apples. Actually, if one is going to take the time to manufacture biodiesel in a sound environmental manner and one that is best conducive to safety and
[Biofuel] When Democracy Failed
As I read the story below I kept thinking about recent history -- Published on Sunday, March 16, 2003 by CommonDreams.org When Democracy Failed: The Warnings of History by Thom Hartmann http://www.commondreams.org/views03/0316-08.htm The 70th anniversary wasn't noticed in the United States, and was barely reported in the corporate media. But the Germans remembered well that fateful day seventy years ago - February 27, 1933. They commemorated the anniversary by joining in demonstrations for peace that mobilized citizens all across the world. It started when the government, in the midst of a worldwide economic crisis, received reports of an imminent terrorist attack. A foreign ideologue had launched feeble attacks on a few famous buildings, but the media largely ignored his relatively small efforts. The intelligence services knew, however, that the odds were he would eventually succeed. (Historians are still arguing whether or not rogue elements in the intelligence service helped the terrorist; the most recent research implies they did not.) But the warnings of investigators were ignored at the highest levels, in part because the government was distracted; the man who claimed to be the nation's leader had not been elected by a majority vote and the majority of citizens claimed he had no right to the powers he coveted. He was a simpleton, some said, a cartoon character of a man who saw things in black-and-white terms and didn't have the intellect to understand the subtleties of running a nation in a complex and internationalist world. His coarse use of language - reflecting his political roots in a southernmost state - and his simplistic and often-inflammatory nationalistic rhetoric offended the aristocrats, foreign leaders, and the well-educated elite in the government and media. And, as a young man, he'd joined a secret society with an occult-sounding name and bizarre initiation rituals that involved skulls and human bones. Nonetheless, he knew the terrorist was going to strike (although he didn't know where or when), and he had already considered his response. When an aide brought him word that the nation's most prestigious building was ablaze, he verified it was the terrorist who had struck and then rushed to the scene and called a press conference. You are now witnessing the beginning of a great epoch in history, he proclaimed, standing in front of the burned-out building, surrounded by national media. This fire, he said, his voice trembling with emotion, is the beginning. He used the occasion - a sign from God, he called it - to declare an all-out war on terrorism and its ideological sponsors, a people, he said, who traced their origins to the Middle East and found motivation for their evil deeds in their religion. Two weeks later, the first detention center for terrorists was built in Oranianberg to hold the first suspected allies of the infamous terrorist. In a national outburst of patriotism, the leader's flag was everywhere, even printed large in newspapers suitable for window display. Within four weeks of the terrorist attack, the nation's now-popular leader had pushed through legislation - in the name of combating terrorism and fighting the philosophy he said spawned it - that suspended constitutional guarantees of free speech, privacy, and habeas corpus. Police could now intercept mail and wiretap phones; suspected terrorists could be imprisoned without specific charges and without access to their lawyers; police could sneak into people's homes without warrants if the cases involved terrorism. To get his patriotic Decree on the Protection of People and State passed over the objections of concerned legislators and civil libertarians, he agreed to put a 4-year sunset provision on it: if the national emergency provoked by the terrorist attack was over by then, the freedoms and rights would be returned to the people, and the police agencies would be re-restrained. Legislators would later say they hadn't had time to read the bill before voting on it. Immediately after passage of the anti-terrorism act, his federal police agencies stepped up their program of arresting suspicious persons and holding them without access to lawyers or courts. In the first year only a few hundred were interred, and those who objected were largely ignored by the mainstream press, which was afraid to offend and thus lose access to a leader with such high popularity ratings. Citizens who protested the leader in public - and there were many - quickly found themselves confronting the newly empowered police's batons, gas, and jail cells, or fenced off in protest zones safely out of earshot of the leader's public speeches. (In the meantime, he was taking almost daily lessons in public speaking, learning to control his tonality, gestures, and facial expressions. He became a very competent orator.) Within the
