Re: [Biofuel] U.S. market doesn't make it
Zeke, The cleaner diesels and gas engines are in reality more dangerous than the old fashion smelling ones. This according to a Swiss and French EU study. I have given links etc. before and they can be found in the archives. The reason why the "clean" cars are more dangerous, was that they gave more particles, smaller than 2.5 micron, for which the body's natural defence does not work well. It is what you do not see or smell, that are most dangerous. Hakan At 16:01 26/09/2005, you wrote: >I don't know the exact numbers, but I think if you are looking at >local pollutants, the diesel is definitely worse. Many SUV's even >meet ULEV emissions standards for CO, HC, NOx, etc However, >remember that CO2 is not defined as a pollutant, but if you are >worried about global warming, that's the one to watch out for. >Honestly, gas engines have become amazingly clean now, compared to 20 >or 30 years ago. But I think this is actually part of the problem, >because we can do much greater damage globally before we kill >ourselves from the smog. > >On 9/26/05, Ken Riznyk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Here in Pennsylvania diesel cars are exempt from > > emission inspections. I was recently bear hunting in > > Maine. The local folks told me that Maine no longer > > permits sales of Jetta TDI's because of diesel > > emissions. My question is this - what pollutes more? A > > cleaner gas powered SUV getting 15 miles a gallon or a > > jetta diesel getting 45 miles per gallon. > > > > --- Zeke Yewdall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > Yeah. I want the 2.5l diesel D-max too. But > > > instead I just bought a > > > 21 year old Mitsubishi pickup because that was the > > > last time they > > > imported the diesel to the US. I can't justify > > > spending any money on > > > a car, new or old, that can't run on renewable > > > fuels. > > > > > > I suspect the problems in importing one will come > > > from two areas -- > > > DOT inspections, if the Thai model doesn't have all > > > the ABS, airbags, > > > etc... that new US cars are required to have. And > > > emissions. If you > > > live in a metro area that does emissions testing, > > > the diesel will > > > likely not pass new gas car emissions, and > > > bureacracies like the DMV > > > hate thinking hard enough to test it as a diesel > > > instead. Because we > > > have such crappy diesel fuel in the US compared to > > > most the rest of > > > the world emissions will be worse too. > > > > > > South africa also has lots of diesels (as with all > > > of africa, but I > > > think many are manufactured in S.A.). What might > > > work better is > > > finding an older diesel (90's) from japan or asia -- > > > if it's not a new > > > car, it could fall under different requirements for > > > importing it. It > > > also might be different to import it as an > > > individual, instead of for > > > resale -- I don't know. > > > > > > Let us know if you get one. > > > > > > > > > > > > On 9/17/05, DB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > I want to buy me a small size pickup truck like > > > the one I have (Nissan > > > > Frontier) BUT I want it to have a DIESEL engine > > > instead of damm gas. All the > > > > following auto makers make what I want, Ford, > > > Toyota, Nissan, Izusu. None of > > > > these are available here in the used to be good > > > ole USA. I called all these > > > > companies. None of them are going to help me...So > > > I'm asking for help from > > > > the forum. Since I live in Hawaii I would think > > > the Phillipines or Thailand > > > > would be the place to get either a Toyota Hilux or > > > Izusu D max. I could make > > > > it a business and pleasure trip. So I'm looking > > > forward to hearing from > > > > you.Sincerely, DB Maloney > > > > ___ > > > > Biofuel mailing list > > > > Biofuel@sustainablelists.org > > > > > > > > > http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org > > > > > > > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > > > > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > > > > > > > > Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list > > > archives (50,000 > > > > messages): > > > > > > > > > http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___ > > > Biofuel mailing list > > > Biofuel@sustainablelists.org > > > > > http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org > > > > > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > > > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > > > > > > Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list > > > archives (50,000 messages): > > > > > http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ > > > > > > > > > > > > __ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > _
Re: [Biofuel] U.S. market doesn't make it
I don't know the exact numbers, but I think if you are looking at local pollutants, the diesel is definitely worse. Many SUV's even meet ULEV emissions standards for CO, HC, NOx, etc However, remember that CO2 is not defined as a pollutant, but if you are worried about global warming, that's the one to watch out for. Honestly, gas engines have become amazingly clean now, compared to 20 or 30 years ago. But I think this is actually part of the problem, because we can do much greater damage globally before we kill ourselves from the smog. On 9/26/05, Ken Riznyk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Here in Pennsylvania diesel cars are exempt from > emission inspections. I was recently bear hunting in > Maine. The local folks told me that Maine no longer > permits sales of Jetta TDI's because of diesel > emissions. My question is this - what pollutes more? A > cleaner gas powered SUV getting 15 miles a gallon or a > jetta diesel getting 45 miles per gallon. > > --- Zeke Yewdall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Yeah. I want the 2.5l diesel D-max too. But > > instead I just bought a > > 21 year old Mitsubishi pickup because that was the > > last time they > > imported the diesel to the US. I can't justify > > spending any money on > > a car, new or old, that can't run on renewable > > fuels. > > > > I suspect the problems in importing one will come > > from two areas -- > > DOT inspections, if the Thai model doesn't have all > > the ABS, airbags, > > etc... that new US cars are required to have. And > > emissions. If you > > live in a metro area that does emissions testing, > > the diesel will > > likely not pass new gas car emissions, and > > bureacracies like the DMV > > hate thinking hard enough to test it as a diesel > > instead. Because we > > have such crappy diesel fuel in the US compared to > > most the rest of > > the world emissions will be worse too. > > > > South africa also has lots of diesels (as with all > > of africa, but I > > think many are manufactured in S.A.). What might > > work better is > > finding an older diesel (90's) from japan or asia -- > > if it's not a new > > car, it could fall under different requirements for > > importing it. It > > also might be different to import it as an > > individual, instead of for > > resale -- I don't know. > > > > Let us know if you get one. > > > > > > > > On 9/17/05, DB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > I want to buy me a small size pickup truck like > > the one I have (Nissan > > > Frontier) BUT I want it to have a DIESEL engine > > instead of damm gas. All the > > > following auto makers make what I want, Ford, > > Toyota, Nissan, Izusu. None of > > > these are available here in the used to be good > > ole USA. I called all these > > > companies. None of them are going to help me...So > > I'm asking for help from > > > the forum. Since I live in Hawaii I would think > > the Phillipines or Thailand > > > would be the place to get either a Toyota Hilux or > > Izusu D max. I could make > > > it a business and pleasure trip. So I'm looking > > forward to hearing from > > > you.Sincerely, DB Maloney > > > ___ > > > Biofuel mailing list > > > Biofuel@sustainablelists.org > > > > > > http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org > > > > > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > > > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > > > > > > Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list > > archives (50,000 > > > messages): > > > > > > http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ___ > > Biofuel mailing list > > Biofuel@sustainablelists.org > > > http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org > > > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > > > > Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list > > archives (50,000 messages): > > > http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ > > > > > > > __ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > ___ > Biofuel mailing list > Biofuel@sustainablelists.org > http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > > Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): > http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ > > ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainabl
Re: [Biofuel] U.S. market doesn't make it
Ken Riznyk wrote: > Here in Pennsylvania diesel cars are exempt from > emission inspections. I was recently bear hunting in > Maine. The local folks told me that Maine no longer > permits sales of Jetta TDI's because of diesel > emissions. My question is this - what pollutes more? A > cleaner gas powered SUV getting 15 miles a gallon or a > jetta diesel getting 45 miles per gallon. > Interesting question, and there are a lot of different answers to it. Obviously getting three times the mileage reduces CO2 emissions by two thirds. But it doesn't mean the car emits less unburned hydrocarbons or NOx per mile than the gas guzzler. On a related note, one might wonder why SUV'x are regulated as trucks and not subject to as stringent pollution standards. Lastly, as a Maine resident I'll point out that we have the California emissions standards which the TDI's don't meet. We can buy a used TDI here, or buy one in neighboring NH and register it here, but we can't buy a new one at the dealer. This is a fairly recent development; I bought my 2000 Jetta TDI new at a Maine dealer. FYI:) --- David ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] U.S. market doesn't make it
Here in Pennsylvania diesel cars are exempt from emission inspections. I was recently bear hunting in Maine. The local folks told me that Maine no longer permits sales of Jetta TDI's because of diesel emissions. My question is this - what pollutes more? A cleaner gas powered SUV getting 15 miles a gallon or a jetta diesel getting 45 miles per gallon. --- Zeke Yewdall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Yeah. I want the 2.5l diesel D-max too. But > instead I just bought a > 21 year old Mitsubishi pickup because that was the > last time they > imported the diesel to the US. I can't justify > spending any money on > a car, new or old, that can't run on renewable > fuels. > > I suspect the problems in importing one will come > from two areas -- > DOT inspections, if the Thai model doesn't have all > the ABS, airbags, > etc... that new US cars are required to have. And > emissions. If you > live in a metro area that does emissions testing, > the diesel will > likely not pass new gas car emissions, and > bureacracies like the DMV > hate thinking hard enough to test it as a diesel > instead. Because we > have such crappy diesel fuel in the US compared to > most the rest of > the world emissions will be worse too. > > South africa also has lots of diesels (as with all > of africa, but I > think many are manufactured in S.A.). What might > work better is > finding an older diesel (90's) from japan or asia -- > if it's not a new > car, it could fall under different requirements for > importing it. It > also might be different to import it as an > individual, instead of for > resale -- I don't know. > > Let us know if you get one. > > > > On 9/17/05, DB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > I want to buy me a small size pickup truck like > the one I have (Nissan > > Frontier) BUT I want it to have a DIESEL engine > instead of damm gas. All the > > following auto makers make what I want, Ford, > Toyota, Nissan, Izusu. None of > > these are available here in the used to be good > ole USA. I called all these > > companies. None of them are going to help me...So > I'm asking for help from > > the forum. Since I live in Hawaii I would think > the Phillipines or Thailand > > would be the place to get either a Toyota Hilux or > Izusu D max. I could make > > it a business and pleasure trip. So I'm looking > forward to hearing from > > you.Sincerely, DB Maloney > > ___ > > Biofuel mailing list > > Biofuel@sustainablelists.org > > > http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org > > > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > > > > Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list > archives (50,000 > > messages): > > > http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ > > > > > > > > > > ___ > Biofuel mailing list > Biofuel@sustainablelists.org > http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > > Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list > archives (50,000 messages): > http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ > > __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] U.S. market doesn't make it
Yeah. I want the 2.5l diesel D-max too. But instead I just bought a 21 year old Mitsubishi pickup because that was the last time they imported the diesel to the US. I can't justify spending any money on a car, new or old, that can't run on renewable fuels. I suspect the problems in importing one will come from two areas -- DOT inspections, if the Thai model doesn't have all the ABS, airbags, etc... that new US cars are required to have. And emissions. If you live in a metro area that does emissions testing, the diesel will likely not pass new gas car emissions, and bureacracies like the DMV hate thinking hard enough to test it as a diesel instead. Because we have such crappy diesel fuel in the US compared to most the rest of the world emissions will be worse too. South africa also has lots of diesels (as with all of africa, but I think many are manufactured in S.A.). What might work better is finding an older diesel (90's) from japan or asia -- if it's not a new car, it could fall under different requirements for importing it. It also might be different to import it as an individual, instead of for resale -- I don't know. Let us know if you get one. On 9/17/05, DB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I want to buy me a small size pickup truck like the one I have (Nissan > Frontier) BUT I want it to have a DIESEL engine instead of damm gas. All the > following auto makers make what I want, Ford, Toyota, Nissan, Izusu. None of > these are available here in the used to be good ole USA. I called all these > companies. None of them are going to help me...So I'm asking for help from > the forum. Since I live in Hawaii I would think the Phillipines or Thailand > would be the place to get either a Toyota Hilux or Izusu D max. I could make > it a business and pleasure trip. So I'm looking forward to hearing from > you.Sincerely, DB Maloney > ___ > Biofuel mailing list > Biofuel@sustainablelists.org > http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org > > Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > > Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 > messages): > http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ > > > > ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] U.S. market doesn't make it
I want to buy me a small size pickup truck like the one I have (Nissan Frontier) BUT I want it to have a DIESEL engine instead of damm gas. All the following auto makers make what I want, Ford, Toyota, Nissan, Izusu. None of these are available here in the used to be good ole USA. I called all these companies. None of them are going to help me...So I'm asking for help from the forum. Since I live in Hawaii I would think the Phillipines or Thailand would be the place to get either a Toyota Hilux or Izusu D max. I could make it a business and pleasure trip. So I'm looking forward to hearing from you.Sincerely, DB Maloney ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
