Re: [biofuel] Hydrogen hype?

2003-06-28 Thread Greg and April

Sorry about getting back to this issue late, I am an assistant scoutmaster,
and I just got back from a camp out.

The thing about a H2 fuel cell, is that it does not require a reformer, that
will split the Hydrogen atoms off of the other atoms ( Carbon and Oxygen in
the case of methanol and ethanol), this would allow a higher efficiency, and
lower cost ( not to mention that reformers can be poisoned if bad fuel is
used ).  I don't remember the entire process of making ethanol from woody
waste, but, if I remember correctly, you need sulfuric acid and need to cook
it for quite some time before it can be fermented, while it sounds like this
method would shorten the amount of time and may need less energy overall to
produce a fuel.  The H2 and CO2 are prime feed stocks for methanol
production, and I would rather see it used that way than for a H2 fuel cell
myself.

Greg H.

- Original Message - 
From: Hakan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, June 27, 2003 09:53
Subject: Re: [biofuel] Hydrogen hype?



 Greg,

 What do you think?

 I would probably suspect that a more efficient way to use those
 feed stocks would be Ethanol production. Why would you use
 glucose rich feed stock for Hydrogen. Why would you absolutely
 need hydrogen for fuel cells, I do not really understand the goals
 for this. Ethanol and Methanol fuel cells are already on the market.

 It beats me, feel a bit lost because I probably missed something.
 Could also be a new version of the Emperor's new cloth. Could
 collect a lot of research money.



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Re: [biofuel] Hydrogen hype?

2003-06-27 Thread Hakan


Greg,

What do you think?

I would probably suspect that a more efficient way to use those
feed stocks would be Ethanol production. Why would you use
glucose rich feed stock for Hydrogen. Why would you absolutely
need hydrogen for fuel cells, I do not really understand the goals
for this. Ethanol and Methanol fuel cells are already on the market.

It beats me, feel a bit lost because I probably missed something.
Could also be a new version of the Emperor's new cloth. Could
collect a lot of research money.

Hakan


At 10:07 PM 6/26/2003 -0600, you wrote:
Cheaper Way Found to Produce Hydrogen

June 26, 2003 08:03 PM EDT


WASHINGTON - Organic wastes such as paper mill sludge or cheese whey can be
converted into hydrogen using an inexpensive metal catalyst, researchers
say, in a process that could boost efforts to replace oil and gas fuels.

Researchers at the University of Wisconsin tested more than 300 metal
combinations before finding that a mix of nickel, tin and aluminum could
separate hydrogen from a mixture rich in glucose, a sugar common in many
organic wastes. A report on the study appears Friday in the journal Science.

Glenn L. Schrader, a National Science Foundation chemical engineer who
supervises grants for hydrogen research projects, said the catalyst could be
a significant advance in efforts to develop a hydrogen-based energy system.

We really need to develop fuel cells that use metals cheaper than platinum
and this work provides a very promising lead, he said.

Many experts believe that hydrogen eventually will replace oil and gas as
the energy that drives industry and transportation. Hydrogen burns cleanly
and there is an almost unlimited supply. A major technical problem has been
finding a cheap way to separate hydrogen from other compounds and to store
the fuel efficiently and safely.

The most likely immediate application of hydrogen would be in fuel cells,
which combine hydrogen and oxygen to make electricity, heat and water.

James Dumesic, a professor of chemical engineering at the University of
Wisconsin and lead author of the study, said the combination metal catalyst
worked as efficiently in laboratory tests as a much more expense platinum
catalyst, and at a lower temperature and pressure.

Platinum is known to be excellent for chemically separating hydrogen, but
the rare metal cost about $8,000 a pound, many times more than the tin,
nickel and aluminum used in the Wisconsin device, experts said.

Dumesic said the hydrogen catalyst is, in effect, a pressure cooker filled
with pellets made of nickel, tin and aluminum. A stream of raw stock rich in
glucose and heated to 437 degrees is introduced into the device. The glucose
reacts with the metal pellets, and hydrogen and carbon dioxide separate from
the mix.

The hydrogen and carbon dioxide kind of bubble up, said Dumesic.

The gas is piped away and then cooled.

Dumesic said the hydrogen-carbon dioxide mix could be used as a fuel in some
applications or the CO2 could be separated out using a second, simpler
process.

Catalysts made of nickel and aluminum do produce hydrogen, but also methane,
an unwanted pollutant. By adding more tin to the combination, the production
of methane was halted, while the production of hydrogen was increased,
Dumesic said.

Dumesic said the Wisconsin device, using the combination of common metals,
could reduce the catalyst cost by 10 to 100 times.

In theory, the catalyst could use any organic waste flow rich in glucose as
a feed stock. Dumesic said he and his associates are now developing a system
that would produce about one kilowatt of power.

He said if the pilot plant works as expected, then the first application may
be at dairy processing plant, such as a cheese factory, where dairy wastes
could be used as the feed stock. Waste from pulp mill, corn processing
plants, or food processing factories could be a source of hydrogen, said
Dumesic.

The combination metal catalyst has been patented and is controlled by the
Wisconsin Alumni Research Foundation. Dumesic said he is co-founder of a
company that has been licensed to the use the patent in developing energy
systems. He said he has a personal financial interest in the success of the
effort.

---

On the Net:

Science: www.sciencemag.org







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